Don't understand why sorcs still use fiery rage over shock...

templesus

The math is simple, fiery rage does 10% more damage while shock lasts 2 seconds longer. However sorcs passives increase shock damage by 5%, and the new destruction staff passive increases aoe damage by 8% equaling out to a total of 13% more damage for 8 seconds vs 10% more damage for 6 seconds...enlighten me

Uriel_Nocturne

Because my Sorcerer is also a Dunmer, so the bonus to fire damage lets me cleanse my enemies with some fire.

templesus

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

Because my Sorcerer is also a Dunmer, so the bonus to fire damage lets me cleanse my enemies with some fire.

Dunmer also gets shock damage though...

NordSwordnBoard

"You will earn the next 1,544,343 experience points at an accelerated rate"

IronCrystal

templesus wrote: »

The math is simple, fiery rage does 10% more damage while shock lasts 2 seconds longer. However sorcs passives increase shock damage by 5%, and the new destruction staff passive increases aoe damage by 8% equaling out to a total of 13% more damage for 8 seconds vs 10% more damage for 6 seconds...enlighten me

You don't stay on your inferno bar after you cast fiery rage. You cast it on inferno bar then swap to shock staff to get the 10% dmg boost from fire type buff and the 8% buff from lightning staff.

JinMori

templesus wrote: »

The math is simple, fiery rage does 10% more damage while shock lasts 2 seconds longer. However sorcs passives increase shock damage by 5%, and the new destruction staff passive increases aoe damage by 8% equaling out to a total of 13% more damage for 8 seconds vs 10% more damage for 6 seconds...enlighten me

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

Because my Sorcerer is also a Dunmer, so the bonus to fire damage lets me cleanse my enemies with some fire.

Not only that, but if you are running with a mag dk, you get an additional 10 % damage if they are running engulfing flames.
And lastly dunmer get a 7% boost to fire, while shock and frost only 2 %
Anyway yes, shock might outperform fire for sorcerer.
And since we are at it, having a healer use blockade of lightning will proc conncussion, which if you have at least 75 points into the ritual cp skilline will increase your damage done by 10%, not only that, but concussion procs minor vulnerability, increasing your damage by another 8%

Splattercat_83

For the amount of damage that the fiery rage does in the short amount of time, it can't be beat if you have a boss that moves around. It beats out shooting star. If you have a boss that is stationary, shooting star will beat out the destro ults every time.

Draconerus

NordSwordnBoard wrote: »

"You will earn the next 1,544,343 experience points at an accelerated rate"

I laughed

Vaoh

Dragonknights increase all Fire Damage dealt to targets by 8% when they debuff them with Engulfing Flames.

On top of this, Fiery Rage also gains more damage from Dunmer passives.

I'm not sure which version is "better" tbh. I often use Fiery Rage because I run Shooting Star on my lightning staff frontbar and the Destro Ult on my fire staff backbar, but would likely use the Lightning version if wanting the BiS sort of version of this skill DPS-wise. There isn't a large disparity in damage between them.

Uriel_Nocturne

And to further my earlier post: I also run an Inferno Staff with a CP160 Flame Rune and Sharpened.

Add all the bonuses together, and Fire damage is the way to go for me and that Destro Ulti.

Browiseth

because eso players are edgelords

s7732425ub17_ESO

Because I don't use a lightning staff.

Kammakazi

Because we all blindly follow the if it's fire damage, it's better, mindset.

But the Lightning form of Elemental Rage on top of the 8% Destruction Passive & Sorc Passive will outdo a Fiery Rage + Engulfing Flames + Destruction Passive.

dpencil

Edited to correct previous error:

Say tooltip is 10k each tick:
Fire tooltip = 70k+7000 (10%) = 77k
Lightning tooltip = 90k
The lightning staff aoe buff could apply to either type, assuming it is being used on the front bar (+7200 on lightning and +6160 on fire)
High Elf gets 5% boost to both (+3850 vs +4500, so also doesn't need to be factored in. Dark Elf would be 5% stronger with fire (+6160 vs +1800)
Sorcerer passive 5% for lightning (+4500)
Engulfing flame 10% for fire (+7700)

Fire: 77000 + 6160(8% lit staff) + 3850(5% high elf) + 7700(10% engulfing) = 94,710

Lightning: 90000 + 7200(8% lit staff) + 4500 (5% high elf) + 4500 (5% sorc passive) = 106,200

So Lightning will perform better in almost every case. Even on a Dark Elf lightning would be 6300 stronger.

There are other trade-offs to consider, though, like whether you front bar or back bar the ulti, and how that effects which Wall of Elements you have.

Uriel_Nocturne

Final thought: There is also a significant percentage of my decision to use Fire over Shock because:

Are you ready for it?

I like the look of the Fire better.

I'm not a huge number cruncher, so squeezing every last 1 and 0 out of the damage never concerned me much. It still does an asinine amount of damage, and I think it looks cool as hell. So that's what I decided to use.

stevepdodson_ESO888

IronCrystal wrote: »

templesus wrote: »

The math is simple, fiery rage does 10% more damage while shock lasts 2 seconds longer. However sorcs passives increase shock damage by 5%, and the new destruction staff passive increases aoe damage by 8% equaling out to a total of 13% more damage for 8 seconds vs 10% more damage for 6 seconds...enlighten me

You don't stay on your inferno bar after you cast fiery rage. You cast it on inferno bar then swap to shock staff to get the 10% dmg boost from fire type buff and the 8% buff from lightning staff.

sad to say it doesn't carry over on bar-swap, so you do no get that extra 8% from it when on your lightning staff

Tomg999

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

Final thought: There is also a significant percentage of my decision to use Fire over Shock because:

Are you ready for it?

I like the look of the Fire better.

I'm not a huge number cruncher, so squeezing every last 1 and 0 out of the damage never concerned me much. It still does an asinine amount of damage, and I think it looks cool as hell. So that's what I decided to use.

I'm with you.
Same thing with Shooting Star. It just looks and sounds so cool.

stevepdodson_ESO888

templesus wrote: »

The math is simple, fiery rage does 10% more damage while shock lasts 2 seconds longer. However sorcs passives increase shock damage by 5%, and the new destruction staff passive increases aoe damage by 8% equaling out to a total of 13% more damage for 8 seconds vs 10% more damage for 6 seconds...enlighten me

as everyone wears BSW the flame wall has a huge chance of proccing it

DRXHarbinger

Vaoh wrote: »

Dragonknights increase all Fire Damage dealt to targets by 8% when they debuff them with Engulfing Flames.

On top of this, Fiery Rage also gains more damage from Dunmer passives.

I'm not sure which version is "better" tbh. I often use Fiery Rage because I run Shooting Star on my lightning staff frontbar and the Destro Ult on my fire staff backbar, but would likely use the Lightning version if wanting the BiS sort of version of this skill DPS-wise. There isn't a large disparity in damage between them.

10% more with engulfing.

JinMori

Tomg999 wrote: »

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

Final thought: There is also a significant percentage of my decision to use Fire over Shock because:

Are you ready for it?

I like the look of the Fire better.

I'm not a huge number cruncher, so squeezing every last 1 and 0 out of the damage never concerned me much. It still does an asinine amount of damage, and I think it looks cool as hell. So that's what I decided to use.

I'm with you.
Same thing with Shooting Star. It just looks and sounds so cool.

No, shooting star deals much more damage then ice comet.
Please, if you don't know how mechanics work, don't speak about it.
Fire gets buffed much more then ice.

JinMori

dpencil wrote: »

The burning status effect can also come into play. Taking 20% additonal damage from fire. OP is right thay just looking at tooltip damage, Lightning is better.

That works only for blockade of fire, burning doesn't add any more damage for any other abilities

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

RoamingRiverElk

One reason is the horrible standing animation when wielding a lightning staff..

code65536

You guys are missing a very important point: the base duration is a mere 7 seconds. The lightning version adds 2 seconds. That's a 28.5% increase in the total damage done from the longer duration.

That 28% alone is enough to outweigh Engulfing, Dunmer, and the 10% fire version bonuses. Then add on top of that the sorc bonus. Plus many sorcs are Altmer, not Dunmer, getting equal racial bonuses to fire and shock.

For sorcs, the only time the fire version makes more sense is if you care about burst DPS more than sustained DPS. Otherwise, lightning wins handily.

DHale

Because extra damage to vampires and most of the pvp players are vamps.

alexkdd99

JinMori wrote: »

Tomg999 wrote: »

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

Final thought: There is also a significant percentage of my decision to use Fire over Shock because:

Are you ready for it?

I like the look of the Fire better.

I'm not a huge number cruncher, so squeezing every last 1 and 0 out of the damage never concerned me much. It still does an asinine amount of damage, and I think it looks cool as hell. So that's what I decided to use.

I'm with you.
Same thing with Shooting Star. It just looks and sounds so cool.

No, shooting star deals much more damage then ice comet.
Please, if you don't know how mechanics work, don't speak about it.
Fire gets buffed much more then ice.

I think he was just saying shooting star looks and sounds cool. I don't think the look and sound has anything to do with the damage. Also the forum is for everyone to speak about whatever they like eso related, within reason.

Kodrac

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

One reason is the horrible standing animation when wielding a lightning staff..

Umm, it's the same animation with a fire staff...

DeadlyPhoenix

Kodrac wrote: »

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

One reason is the horrible standing animation when wielding a lightning staff..

Umm, it's the same animation with a fire staff...

Actually it's not. I use lightning on my front bar and fire on back. Your character holds the lightning staff at slightly a higher angle, making the staff head almost point upwards instead of down like the fire staff does.

luen79rwb17_ESO

Kodrac wrote: »

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

One reason is the horrible standing animation when wielding a lightning staff..

Umm, it's the same animation with a fire staff...

Nope, it is not. Lightning staff has it's own standing animation.

Foxic

On top of fiery getting buffed by dunmer racial, engulfing flames, and proccing burning on every single target it hits(extremely buffing your fire blockade) just about every top sorc runs lightning staff frontbar so when he swaps to front bar his fiery rage will get the aoe buff (because no-one on the forums understands how the destro passive works). Fire blockade is too good to lose so you have to backbar inferno staff meaning that if you wanted to run lightning rage you would need to frontbar it and lose magicka for 80% of the fight because you don't have meteor there.

There's a reason that every top sorc in the game runs the same setup. Because it's the best...

Minalan

DHale wrote: »

Because extra damage to vampires and most of the pvp players are vamps.

This. Because vampires. Vampires everywhere.

It's ridiculous at this point. Fire is the only downside to being one.