How to reward Tanks for doing dungeons...

doggie

The queue times in the dungeon finder in ESO is the worst I have ever seen in any game. I see players complainin in guilds and on forums that the pledge dungeons can take from 30 min - 1 hour to queue, and a specific non pledge dungeon for sets or helm can take several hours. Many people just get 1 invite per day playing, and if that one run is a fail, I can understand that some people get angry and rage quit etc.

The reason Tanks don't run dungeons in this game are complex, it costs money to respec champion points into tanking if you have them in dps atm. There is very little gear for tanks in dungeons. Tanks need lots of skillpoints to put into passives and to have a solo dps setup, and some crafting. Collecting 400 Skyshards isn't done in 5 min. Tanks need money to upgrade several sets and dungeons don't provide much of a income.

If we look at the gear incentives. Many starting CP 160 Tanks wear Blood Spawn, Tava and Dragonguard. In order to wear that setup you have to wear Dragonguard jewlery and they only come in Healthy trait.(Exept that one blue ring noone seems to wear). If Robust purple jewlery would drom from the daily premium bag(maybe as BOP), that could get some beginning tanks up and running.

With the armor setup above(BS,Tava,DG), you only need 5 DragonGuard items on the Backbar, so the frontbar weaponslot is actually not used for any real set. Most tanks use Agility set, but you could also use +magicka regen for example.

Adding a really nice 2 item set for tanks in Sword&Board, would get some tanks doing dungeons for it. Tbe reason noone uses Master weapons, is #1 It dosen't have Crusher Enchant, #2 it dosen't come as a set.

If we look at Trial gear, Many wear Blood spawn, Ebon,Alkosh,Powerful Assault. Belive it or not the Blood Spawn set is actually not that good. The First bonus is Stamina Regen, which is a useless stat for Tanks, and the Resistance is so,so too. Some Tanks wear 2xmagicka regen 1 set instead. Creating another ultimate set for Tanks with Magicka Regen instead + something more usefull would get many trial tanks intrested. If there is no resources to create a new monster set, just add a item to upgrade Blood Spawn to give Magica Regen as #1 and you're done. That would be a great for many Tanks.

Finally adding single items to a single dungeon isn't going to do wonders. You'll have to add some upgrade for Tanks to the dungeon finder.

Many trial Tanks choose to wear Infused instead of Defending on their swords, to improve the Crusher enchant, if there was a way to add Defending onto the weapon as
a second trait, then I think many Tanks would be into getting that.

Just add a BOP item to the reward bags for doing random dungeons, and when you have 100 you can add a second defending trait to a infused weapon,
to prevent DPS to use it, it could come at a cost of -10% DPS.

raj72616a

tanks' reward is zero queue time with group finder.

Turelus

raj72616a wrote: »

tanks' reward is zero queue time with group finder.

This.

The reward is fast groups and the ability to beat the dungeon. Try queuing as DPS and see how long it takes.

LordGavus

raj72616a wrote: »

tanks' reward is zero queue time with group finder.

Agreed.
When the population is low I only play my tank or healer so I don't have to wait for an hour.

RouDeR

Longest BS i have read ever xD

Dr_Rektar

RouDeR wrote: »

Longest BS i have read ever xD

Thanks for telling. You saved my time )

ScooberSteve

Tanking is easy. People just dont like to lead. You dont have to respec attribute points or cp just have health enchants and sturdy on all gear as long as you have point into stamina

Flameheart

raj72616a wrote: »

tanks' reward is zero queue time with group finder.

This.

Btw, it's not a major issue at all to play a magicka build char as a really good tank in 4-man-content by just doing a gear and skill bar swap in Dressing Room, without ever changing any CP distribution, morphs, mundus or anything else. I play all all my 4 magicka build chars usually as DD, but I am able to play them as tank with just clicking a Dressing Room hot key....and those are solid tank support and ultireg builds (Ebon + Tavas + Heroic Slash + Evade buff + War Horn + DK chains or Swarm Mother or Bloodspawn, just over 30k health, 28k+ magicka, 17k+ Stamina, ~1400 magicka reg with Tristatfood, 28k+ resistances selfbuffed -> getting to the cap at ~ 33500 will add less then 5% damage mitigation -> not worth it). You don't even have to have the tank gear in legendary like me, purple is totally enough for 4-men-stuff.

You might need to change additional things when going for vet trials as a tank, but not for 4-men-stuff and normal trials.

PS: You can reward your tank by

- doing good dps, so that my frequently cast War Horns and the standard tank ultireg build actually make sense and show some effect. You might get the hint, when your tank quits using War Horn, but uses damage ultimates instead...
- tanks appreciate it, when people know mechanics and do not die that often. It is already very usefull if you don't stand on 28m as a DD or healer during boss encounters where bosses have annoying and scripted mechanics to jump at and/or attack far away standing players, so that, the whole group has to move or the boss moves out of ground dots and you will lose dps. Btw, I am a fan of Stormreeve Neidir in Tempest Islands. You cannot imagine how much I enjoy this Nemesis of all ranged builds when she does her Chuck Norris round house kick with one hit guarantee on those stupid bow/bow build players on hm.
- tanks are pleased, when they realize, that using Swarm Mother or chains as a tank to serve trash mobs on the silver platter, actually benefits the group, because the group is able to deal awesome AoE dps (there are people out there who haven't slotted a single AoE damage skill and think doing 20k AoE dps on groups of 6+ mobs is a value worth to post in group chat, while I do almost the same as a tank with a real tank build just with synergies and Sap Essence...).
- you can further reward your tank by using skills that give useful synergies (I use them all, tanks are synergy addicts, some synergies like liquid lightning do really good damage and with undaunted passives I get the most important out of them -> ressources) and support him by thowing spears and bubbles as a templar healer and at least bubbles as a non-templar-healer.

I am doing instances in PUGs since weeks to get the slayer achievements done for my main char and you can't imagine how less groups out there fullfill the just mentioned basic standards.

ScooberSteve

With frost staff even magika can tank now

LordGavus

Flameheart wrote: »

raj72616a wrote: »

tanks' reward is zero queue time with group finder.

PS: You can reward your tank by

- doing good dps, so that my frequently cast War Horns and the standard tank ultireg build actually makes sense and show some effect.
- tanks appreciate it, when people know mechanics and do not die that often.
- tanks are pleased, when they realize, that using Swarm Mother or chains as a tank to serve trash mobs on the silver platter, actually makes sense, because the group is able to deal awesome AoE dps (there are people out there who haven't slotted a single AoE damage skill...).
- you can further reward your tank by using skills that give useful synergies and support him by thowing spears and bubbles as a templar healer and at least bubbles as a non-templar-healer.

I approve this message.

Shad0wfire99

ScooberSteve wrote: »

With frost staff even magika can tank now

Meanwhile, people using frost staves is the number one reason I don't PUG dungeons on my tank.

timb16_ESO85

doggie wrote: »

The reason Tanks don't run dungeons in this game are complex, it costs money to respec champion points into tanking if you have them in dps atm. There is very little gear for tanks in dungeons. Tanks need lots of skillpoints to put into passives and to have a solo dps setup, and some crafting. Collecting 400 Skyshards isn't done in 5 min. Tanks need money to upgrade several sets and dungeons don't provide much of a income.

Solving this issue, by means of making it possible to have several pre-saved gear sets and skill setups (attribute, skill points and champion points) and allowing to switch between these without a charge (while still having a cost for resetting one of the skill setups), and anywhere on the fly as long as you're not in combat would greatly increase the incentives to queue as multiple roles (dps and tank/healer). This would allow you to be in your max dps/solo setup with all champion points focused on that (for fast questing/gathering/pvp etc) while still being able to queue as a tank and be an efficient tank when you enter the dungeon, simply click switch setup and switch gear and you're ready to go.

I know some addons already allow for this, but for the skill points, these still require you to move to a capital city and pay a fine, and for gear a build in function (similar to weapon swapping) would be nicer, since it would reduce the inventory spaces consumed by your other equipment set.

ifDoubtNerfIt

doggie wrote: »

The queue times in the dungeon finder in ESO is the worst I have ever seen in any game. I see players complainin in guilds and on forums that the pledge dungeons can take from 30 min - 1 hour to queue, and a specific non pledge dungeon for sets or helm can take several hours. Many people just get 1 invite per day playing, and if that one run is a fail, I can understand that some people get angry and rage quit etc.

What about this?
Go in any major city, press ENTER and type "LFM 2xDD 1xHealer for vPledges". You would be amazed how easy and fast that actually is. I do it almost everyday and I get a group in less than 3 minutes.

The reason Tanks don't run dungeons in this game are complex, it costs money to respec champion points into tanking if you have them in dps atm.

If you want to be a dedicated tank you would have a dedicated tank and a dedicated dps character. Poof the problem of respecing is gone.

There is very little gear for tanks in dungeons.

Not that much gear for tanks ? Ebon, Tava's, Alkosh, Powerful Assault, Bloodspawn monster set, Akaviri.........
(sidenote: those sets are META BiS sets, there are even more off-meta sets out there)

Tanks need lots of skillpoints to put into passives and to have a solo dps setup, and some crafting. Collecting 400 Skyshards isn't done in 5 min. Tanks need money to upgrade several sets and dungeons don't provide much of a income.

Alot of skillpoints? You really need 120-130 skillpoints IN TOTAL for a META magDK tank.
And the cost of upgrading? Every class has those issues.

If we look at the gear incentives. Many starting CP 160 Tanks wear Blood Spawn, Tava and Dragonguard. In order to wear that setup you have to wear Dragonguard jewlery and they only come in Healthy trait.(Exept that one blue ring noone seems to wear). If Robust purple jewlery would drom from the daily premium bag(maybe as BOP), that could get some beginning tanks up and running.

For starter tanks, you want to have more HP than 30k that experienced tanks wear.

With the armor setup above(BS,Tava,DG), you only need 5 DragonGuard items on the Backbar, so the frontbar weaponslot is actually not used for any real set.

That's not how the game works. If you have something on the backbar, when you switch to the mainbar the backbar doesn't count to the itemcount anymore. So you have to slot Akaviri on both bars.

Most tanks use Agility set, but you could also use +magicka regen for example.

Not a single tank uses Agility...................

Adding a really nice 2 item set for tanks in Sword&Board, would get some tanks doing dungeons for it. Tbe reason noone uses Master weapons, is #1 It dosen't have Crusher Enchant, #2 it dosen't come as a set.

No, just no, I see that you don't have a tank, so your arguments are invalid.

If we look at Trial gear, Many wear Blood spawn, Ebon,Alkosh,Powerful Assault. Belive it or not the Blood Spawn set is actually not that good. The First bonus is Stamina Regen, which is a useless stat for Tanks, and the Resistance is so,so too. Some Tanks wear 2xmagicka regen 1 set instead. Creating another ultimate set for Tanks with Magicka Regen instead + something more usefull would get many trial tanks intrested. If there is no resources to create a new monster set, just add a item to upgrade Blood Spawn to give Magica Regen as #1 and you're done. That would be a great for many Tanks.

Main reason people use Blood Spawn is because of the fast ulti regen. Try to use that set on a tank and you'll see why people prefer that set. Yeah, the first item passive doesn't work on a tank, but the 2nd is really worth the 2 slots.

Many trial Tanks choose to wear Infused instead of Defending on their swords, to improve the Crusher enchant, if there was a way to add Defending onto the weapon as a second trait, then I think many Tanks would be into getting that.

Defending? If a tank uses defending, that trait does literally nothing. A tank already has hard capped both resistances without that trait. So infused crusher is a better option.

Just add a BOP item to the reward bags for doing random dungeons, and when you have 100 you can add a second defending trait to a infused weapon,
to prevent DPS to use it, it could come at a cost of -10% DPS.

Just no, no.

Shad0wfire99

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

doggie wrote: »

The queue times in the dungeon finder in ESO is the worst I have ever seen in any game. I see players complainin in guilds and on forums that the pledge dungeons can take from 30 min - 1 hour to queue, and a specific non pledge dungeon for sets or helm can take several hours. Many people just get 1 invite per day playing, and if that one run is a fail, I can understand that some people get angry and rage quit etc.

What about this?
Go in any major city, press ENTER and type "LFM 2xDD 1xHealer for vPledges". You would be amazed how easy and fast that actually is. I do it almost everyday and I get a group in less than 3 minutes.

The reason Tanks don't run dungeons in this game are complex, it costs money to respec champion points into tanking if you have them in dps atm.[/qoute]

If you want to be a dedicated tank you would have a dedicated tank and a dedicated dps character. Poof the problem of respecing is gone.

There is very little gear for tanks in dungeons.

Not that much gear for tanks ? Ebon, Tava's, Alkosh, Powerful Assault, Bloodspawn monster set, Akaviri.........
(sidenote: those sets are META BiS sets, there are even more off-meta sets out there)

Tanks need lots of skillpoints to put into passives and to have a solo dps setup, and some crafting. Collecting 400 Skyshards isn't done in 5 min. Tanks need money to upgrade several sets and dungeons don't provide much of a income.

Alot of skillpoints? You really need 120-130 skillpoints IN TOTAL for a META magDK tank.
And the cost of upgrading? Every class has those issues.

If we look at the gear incentives. Many starting CP 160 Tanks wear Blood Spawn, Tava and Dragonguard. In order to wear that setup you have to wear Dragonguard jewlery and they only come in Healthy trait.(Exept that one blue ring noone seems to wear). If Robust purple jewlery would drom from the daily premium bag(maybe as BOP), that could get some beginning tanks up and running.

For starter tanks, you want to have more HP than 30k that experienced tanks wear.

With the armor setup above(BS,Tava,DG), you only need 5 DragonGuard items on the Backbar, so the frontbar weaponslot is actually not used for any real set.

That's not how the game works. If you have something on the backbar, when you switch to the mainbar the backbar doesn't count to the itemcount anymore. So you have to slot Akaviri on both bars.

[qoute] Most tanks use Agility set, but you could also use +magicka regen for example.

Not a single tank uses Agility...................

Adding a really nice 2 item set for tanks in Sword&Board, would get some tanks doing dungeons for it. Tbe reason noone uses Master weapons, is #1 It dosen't have Crusher Enchant, #2 it dosen't come as a set.

No, just no, I see that you don't have a tank, so your arguments are invalid.

If we look at Trial gear, Many wear Blood spawn, Ebon,Alkosh,Powerful Assault. Belive it or not the Blood Spawn set is actually not that good. The First bonus is Stamina Regen, which is a useless stat for Tanks, and the Resistance is so,so too. Some Tanks wear 2xmagicka regen 1 set instead. Creating another ultimate set for Tanks with Magicka Regen instead + something more usefull would get many trial tanks intrested. If there is no resources to create a new monster set, just add a item to upgrade Blood Spawn to give Magica Regen as #1 and you're done. That would be a great for many Tanks.

Main reason people use Blood Spawn is because of the fast ulti regen. Try to use that set on a tank and you'll see why people prefer that set. Yeah, the first item passive doesn't work on a tank, but the 2nd is really worth the 2 slots.

Many trial Tanks choose to wear Infused instead of Defending on their swords, to improve the Crusher enchant, if there was a way to add Defending onto the weapon as a second trait, then I think many Tanks would be into getting that.

Defending? If a tank uses defending, that trait does literally nothing. A tank already has hard capped both resistances without that trait. So infused crusher is a better option.

Just add a BOP item to the reward bags for doing random dungeons, and when you have 100 you can add a second defending trait to a infused weapon,
to prevent DPS to use it, it could come at a cost of -10% DPS.

Just no, no.

And this. I was just too lazy to say it.

xblackroxe

Bloodspwan not a good set.

Just lol

ifDoubtNerfIt

xblackroxe wrote: »

Bloodspwan not a good set.

Just lol

Half an hour waiting for your reply #worthIt

djdc1234

lolz my healer Q times are like 5 seconds .... 30 mins is super rare for it, my dps is almost 40 Minutes Minimum its gross. tanks are pretty fast compared with my healer

Flameheart

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

doggie wrote: »

The queue times in the dungeon finder in ESO is the worst I have ever seen in any game. I see players complainin in guilds and on forums that the pledge dungeons can take from 30 min - 1 hour to queue, and a specific non pledge dungeon for sets or helm can take several hours. Many people just get 1 invite per day playing, and if that one run is a fail, I can understand that some people get angry and rage quit etc.

What about this?
Go in any major city, press ENTER and type "LFM 2xDD 1xHealer for vPledges". You would be amazed how easy and fast that actually is. I do it almost everyday and I get a group in less than 3 minutes.

The reason Tanks don't run dungeons in this game are complex, it costs money to respec champion points into tanking if you have them in dps atm.

If you want to be a dedicated tank you would have a dedicated tank and a dedicated dps character. Poof the problem of respecing is gone.

There is very little gear for tanks in dungeons.

Not that much gear for tanks ? Ebon, Tava's, Alkosh, Powerful Assault, Bloodspawn monster set, Akaviri.........
(sidenote: those sets are META BiS sets, there are even more off-meta sets out there)

Tanks need lots of skillpoints to put into passives and to have a solo dps setup, and some crafting. Collecting 400 Skyshards isn't done in 5 min. Tanks need money to upgrade several sets and dungeons don't provide much of a income.

Alot of skillpoints? You really need 120-130 skillpoints IN TOTAL for a META magDK tank.
And the cost of upgrading? Every class has those issues.

If we look at the gear incentives. Many starting CP 160 Tanks wear Blood Spawn, Tava and Dragonguard. In order to wear that setup you have to wear Dragonguard jewlery and they only come in Healthy trait.(Exept that one blue ring noone seems to wear). If Robust purple jewlery would drom from the daily premium bag(maybe as BOP), that could get some beginning tanks up and running.

For starter tanks, you want to have more HP than 30k that experienced tanks wear.

With the armor setup above(BS,Tava,DG), you only need 5 DragonGuard items on the Backbar, so the frontbar weaponslot is actually not used for any real set.

That's not how the game works. If you have something on the backbar, when you switch to the mainbar the backbar doesn't count to the itemcount anymore. So you have to slot Akaviri on both bars.

Most tanks use Agility set, but you could also use +magicka regen for example.

Not a single tank uses Agility...................

Adding a really nice 2 item set for tanks in Sword&Board, would get some tanks doing dungeons for it. Tbe reason noone uses Master weapons, is #1 It dosen't have Crusher Enchant, #2 it dosen't come as a set.

No, just no, I see that you don't have a tank, so your arguments are invalid.

If we look at Trial gear, Many wear Blood spawn, Ebon,Alkosh,Powerful Assault. Belive it or not the Blood Spawn set is actually not that good. The First bonus is Stamina Regen, which is a useless stat for Tanks, and the Resistance is so,so too. Some Tanks wear 2xmagicka regen 1 set instead. Creating another ultimate set for Tanks with Magicka Regen instead + something more usefull would get many trial tanks intrested. If there is no resources to create a new monster set, just add a item to upgrade Blood Spawn to give Magica Regen as #1 and you're done. That would be a great for many Tanks.

Main reason people use Blood Spawn is because of the fast ulti regen. Try to use that set on a tank and you'll see why people prefer that set. Yeah, the first item passive doesn't work on a tank, but the 2nd is really worth the 2 slots.

Many trial Tanks choose to wear Infused instead of Defending on their swords, to improve the Crusher enchant, if there was a way to add Defending onto the weapon as a second trait, then I think many Tanks would be into getting that.

Defending? If a tank uses defending, that trait does literally nothing. A tank already has hard capped both resistances without that trait. So infused crusher is a better option.

Just add a BOP item to the reward bags for doing random dungeons, and when you have 100 you can add a second defending trait to a infused weapon,
to prevent DPS to use it, it could come at a cost of -10% DPS.

Just no, no.

Great, someone said it already. The opening post is just a prove that many people do not know or understand current meta tank builds and why those builds are directed to either mob resistance decrease (Alkosh) or ulti reg (War Horn) or both...but ok, you need to have some dps first to make use of that at all...You don't need a meta raid tank build btw, starting with Tavas + Hist Bark + any jewelry is a damned good starting option and absolutely sufficient for 4-men-content. While experiencing tanking you can then farm Ebon and monster sets like Bloodspawn, Swarm Mother, Engine Guardian, Lord Warden.

Those tank builds + good dps + SPC healers with war horn slotted are the main reasons why some groups cut through vet dungeons like a hot knife through butter. I may add that playing a tank in such groups is really fun and if there were more such groups out there, there would be more people who play tanks.

Ep1kMalware

doggie wrote: »

The queue times in the dungeon finder in ESO is the worst I have ever seen in any game. I see players complainin in guilds and on forums that the pledge dungeons can take from 30 min - 1 hour to queue, and a specific non pledge dungeon for sets or helm can take several hours. Many people just get 1 invite per day playing, and if that one run is a fail, I can understand that some people get angry and rage quit etc.

The reason Tanks don't run dungeons in this game are complex, it costs money to respec champion points into tanking if you have them in dps atm. There is very little gear for tanks in dungeons. Tanks need lots of skillpoints to put into passives and to have a solo dps setup, and some crafting. Collecting 400 Skyshards isn't done in 5 min. Tanks need money to upgrade several sets and dungeons don't provide much of a income.

If we look at the gear incentives. Many starting CP 160 Tanks wear Blood Spawn, Tava and Dragonguard. In order to wear that setup you have to wear Dragonguard jewlery and they only come in Healthy trait.(Exept that one blue ring noone seems to wear). If Robust purple jewlery would drom from the daily premium bag(maybe as BOP), that could get some beginning tanks up and running.

With the armor setup above(BS,Tava,DG), you only need 5 DragonGuard items on the Backbar, so the frontbar weaponslot is actually not used for any real set. Most tanks use Agility set, but you could also use +magicka regen for example.

Adding a really nice 2 item set for tanks in Sword&Board, would get some tanks doing dungeons for it. Tbe reason noone uses Master weapons, is #1 It dosen't have Crusher Enchant, #2 it dosen't come as a set.

If we look at Trial gear, Many wear Blood spawn, Ebon,Alkosh,Powerful Assault. Belive it or not the Blood Spawn set is actually not that good. The First bonus is Stamina Regen, which is a useless stat for Tanks, and the Resistance is so,so too. Some Tanks wear 2xmagicka regen 1 set instead. Creating another ultimate set for Tanks with Magicka Regen instead + something more usefull would get many trial tanks intrested. If there is no resources to create a new monster set, just add a item to upgrade Blood Spawn to give Magica Regen as #1 and you're done. That would be a great for many Tanks.

Finally adding single items to a single dungeon isn't going to do wonders. You'll have to add some upgrade for Tanks to the dungeon finder.

Many trial Tanks choose to wear Infused instead of Defending on their swords, to improve the Crusher enchant, if there was a way to add Defending onto the weapon as
a second trait, then I think many Tanks would be into getting that.

Just add a BOP item to the reward bags for doing random dungeons, and when you have 100 you can add a second defending trait to a infused weapon,
to prevent DPS to use it, it could come at a cost of -10% DPS.

Tanks don't need rewards, they have so many viable gear combinations its nuts. Most tanks just hold the block button, and now you want to throw a parade for that? Not getting kicked from a group fkr kiting bosses all over the place and away from aoes is thanks enough. ltfp will ya?

ifDoubtNerfIt

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Tanks don't need rewards, they have so many viable gear combinations its nuts. Most tanks just hold the block button, and now you want to throw a parade for that? Not getting kicked from a group fkr kiting bosses is tha ks enough, ltfp.

Can tell you how much I hate to see a dd kiting trash out of all the DoT AoE's and not trusting their healer and/or tank......

doggie

Thx, for reply guys, everyone is entitled to their own opinion and I don't have a problem with that.

raj72616a wrote: »

tanks' reward is zero queue time with group finder.

I don't see how that's going to reduce the current queue time for DPS, or reduce the hostility ingame, when not optimal players are put togheter for a dungeon. If queue times had been shorter then you could just requeue.

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

ot that much gear for tanks ? Ebon, Tava's, Alkosh, Powerful Assault, Bloodspawn monster set, Akaviri.........

Just one of those sets+Bloodspawn helm drop in a dungeon.

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

Alot of skillpoints? You really need 120-130 skillpoints IN TOTAL for a META magDK tank.
And the cost of upgrading? Every class has those issues.

If tanks need 2x lvl 50 chars, how will that increase recruitment?

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

That's not how the game works. If you have something on the backbar, when you switch to the mainbar the backbar doesn't count to the itemcount anymore. So you have to slot Akaviri on both bars.

Just have warhorn on the backbar and you get the cost reduction on warhorn, and you can wear whatever on frontbar. Not that many setups. Agility 2 set gives 1500 stamina. That's why I suggest a Sword+Board gear reward for pre-trial tanks, it's one of the few slots in the game not really filled by anything.

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

If a tank uses defending, that trait does literally nothing. A tank already has hard capped both resistances without that trait. So infused crusher is a better option.

Trial Tanks in that setup probably run around 25k Resistances(not counting Blood spawn buff) You need Footman or Armor master or similar to reach 33k.

Sometimes Trial tanks need to put on more restistances, if it dosen't break the game to allow Tanks some more restistance, so they don't have to gear switch so much it could be a nice way to reward tanks, some might not want it, other might run dungeons for it.

timb16_ESO85

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Tanks don't need rewards, they have so many viable gear combinations its nuts. Most tanks just hold the block button, and now you want to throw a parade for that? Not getting kicked from a group fkr kiting bosses is tha ks enough, ltfp.

Well, the queue times for the group finder would indicate otherwise. Either there are not enough incentives to queue as tank or as healer, or there are not enough people tanking and healing because when they do, they get told to get the top end gear for the current meta or stop being a tank (which, for trials I understand, but for LFG pugs, is complete nonsense)

Your right, and tanks don't need more rewards. However, people queueing as the role currently most in need for the dungeon finder to help the queue move faster for everyone, they DO need extra rewards to promote playing as different roles resulting in a more even distribution of tanks,healers and dps queueing. Either reward them for fulfilling these roles (always max undaunted rewards instead of once a day for example) or make it easier for people to switch to these roles when needed by introducing features to save equipment and skills.

Dubhliam

.

ifDoubtNerfIt

doggie wrote: »

I don't see how that's going to reduce the current queue time for DPS, or reduce the hostility ingame, when not optimal players are put togheter for a dungeon. If queue times had been shorter then you could just requeue.

Solution for queue time for dd's ? Make a healer or a tank. There are way to many dd's in the game.

Just one of those sets+Bloodspawn helm drop in a dungeon.

Tava's is a crafted set, and Powerful Assault and Akaviri are buyable.

If tanks need 2x lvl 50 chars, how will that increase recruitment?

No, a tanks doesn't need 2x lvl 50 chars, I'm saying if you want to play as a dedicated dd and as a dedicated tank you need seperate charachers for end-game content.

Just have warhorn on the backbar and you get the cost reduction on warhorn, and you can wear whatever on frontbar. Not that many setups. Agility 2 set gives 1500 stamina. That's why I suggest a Sword+Board gear reward for pre-trial tanks, it's one of the few slots in the game not really filled by anything.

Cost reduction is not worth it on a dk tank, as a dk gets resources back from Helping Hands passive.

Trial Tanks in that setup probably run around 25k Resistances(not counting Blood spawn buff) You need Footman or Armor master or similar to reach 33k.

Why would you go with 33k resistance w/o Blood Spawn buff ? It's a waste of resistance, you can have an additional ability on your bar for example if you don't overcap (w/o BS).

EDIT:
A tank should never wear Armor Master or Footman, as Armor Master doesn't contribute to the group and it overcaps the resistance, and Footman gives you mitigation which you don't really need as you get 36% IIRC already as a tank.

And to quote one of the best tanks in the game Woeler: "You can tank any non-Trial content with full medium armor".

Ep1kMalware

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Tanks don't need rewards, they have so many viable gear combinations its nuts. Most tanks just hold the block button, and now you want to throw a parade for that? Not getting kicked from a group fkr kiting bosses is tha ks enough, ltfp.

Can tell you how much I hate to see a dd kiting trash out of all the DoT AoE's and not trusting their healer and/or tank......

Yup. I see tanks do it more. Sometimes they'll chainpull adds well put of the aoes when they're already half dead. I can't help but to sheath my weapons, walk over there, and use the drimk from flagon emote. I hate making common sense reminders on this game, people freak the hell out. This usually fixes the issue right away. Tanks often forget that they're not the ones killing adds, taking add aggro, etc.

The new ice staff tanks are the worst at this, you don't even get major fracture out of the deal. They often heavy attack the boss amd run like hell so everyone is doing 15% of their overall dps and throwing resources out the window. I have sympathy for the lower level players (most the time, some are just pricks) but sometimes I'll instruct the group to stop dps, let the 'tank' die so we can kill it finally. No need to kick, it gets the msg across.

Meh, that's what happens when you play a console mmo that uses walmarts 'anything is welcome' marketing strategy though.

ifDoubtNerfIt

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Tanks don't need rewards, they have so many viable gear combinations its nuts. Most tanks just hold the block button, and now you want to throw a parade for that? Not getting kicked from a group fkr kiting bosses is tha ks enough, ltfp.

Can tell you how much I hate to see a dd kiting trash out of all the DoT AoE's and not trusting their healer and/or tank......

Yup. I see tanks do it more. Sometimes they'll chainpull adds well put of the aoes when they're already half dead. I can't help but to sheath my weapons, walk over there, and use the drimk from flagon emote. I hate making common sense reminders on this game, people freak the hell out. This usually fixes the issue right away. Tanks often forget that they're not the ones killing adds, taking add aggro, etc.

Haha Ikr, and also when a tank decides to chainpull an add 10s after he spawn, but as there are magSorcs in the group, they ofcourse crystal frag the adds and then the tank yells "don't CC the adds jerks". Can't tell you how many times I LOL at the tank for that. I personaly wait 3s after the add spawn and then crystal frag it.

Rev Rielle

Personally it's got nothing to do with any lack of tanks. That is not the problem. Nor much of anything that is talked about in this thread. The main problem are the parasites (rude players) that populate such things. There is 'no way in hell' (their words) some of my friends would join the dungeon finder because of this, and it's honestly really unfortunate. And caustic threads that appear by the bigoted players on this forum complaining about 'non elite' and 'non meta' players ruining things does not help matters either.

If the community was more welcoming there would never be a problem. For there are plenty of players out there, tanks and otherwise.

Sadly, we have no one to blame but ourselves for this situation.

lolo_01b16_ESO

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

ifDoubtNerfIt wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Tanks don't need rewards, they have so many viable gear combinations its nuts. Most tanks just hold the block button, and now you want to throw a parade for that? Not getting kicked from a group fkr kiting bosses is tha ks enough, ltfp.

Can tell you how much I hate to see a dd kiting trash out of all the DoT AoE's and not trusting their healer and/or tank......

Yup. I see tanks do it more. Sometimes they'll chainpull adds well put of the aoes when they're already half dead. I can't help but to sheath my weapons, walk over there, and use the drimk from flagon emote. I hate making common sense reminders on this game, people freak the hell out. This usually fixes the issue right away. Tanks often forget that they're not the ones killing adds, taking add aggro, etc.

Haha Ikr, and also when a tank decides to chainpull an add 10s after he spawn, but as there are magSorcs in the group, they ofcourse crystal frag the adds and then the tank yells "don't CC the adds jerks". Can't tell you how many times I LOL at the tank for that. I personaly wait 3s after the add spawn and then crystal frag it.

The issue is that chains often bug in some dungeons and the best way to solve that is if the tank does a heavy attack. So as tank it's usually:
taunt bad guys => try to chain => cast shield (to not die when you drop block) => do heavy attack => finally chains work
So chaining all adds together within 3sec often is close to impossible.

But I don't think this is the reason why you see so few tanks. I guess the major reasons are:
- most humans like to compete with each other and showing off high dps numbers is much easier than showing of tanking skills
- non vet dungeons (and even some vet ones) are often done without a tank if you have some experienced player in your group. So for new players it might seem that tanks are useless.

Sharee

The reason why there are so few tanks is not that the rewards are bad. Most tanks in there are doing it for the undaunted keys anyway. No, the reason is that people do not like responsibility, and being tank means being responsible for leading the group, knowing the mechanics, keeping everyone safe by drawing enemy attention. Most casual players do not want to deal with that kind of pressure (not judging there, its their free time) so they play DPS which is much more relaxed (still talking about pledges here remember, not trials).

The good news is that you do not really need a real tank for this kind of content. If your other equipment is decent, all you need is to swap jewelry for something with healthy trait to bring your HP in the 25K-30K range, strap on a shield, and you're good to go. Last time i queued as DPS i actually ended up tanking the last boss on a light armor mDK. So next time you face a 1h queue, try the tanking role yourself.

xblackroxe

Rev Rielle wrote: »

Personally it's got nothing to do with any lack of tanks. That is not the problem. Nor much of anything that is talked about in this thread. The main problem are the parasites (rude players) that populate such things. There is 'no way in hell' (their words) some of my friends would join the dungeon finder because of this, and it's honestly really unfortunate. And caustic threads that appear by the bigoted players on this forum complaining about 'non elite' and 'non meta' players ruining things does not help matters either.

If the community was more welcoming there would never be a problem. For there are plenty of players out there, tanks and otherwise.

Sadly, we have no one to blame but ourselves for this situation.

I'm curious which forum you are talking about because it sure as hell ain't this one.

All I ever see here is people complaining how elitist this game is and how everybody is bashing new players, constantly kicking everyone below cp cap and generally is rude to other people. In the almost 2 years I'm playing now I maybe left the group 5-10 times because I couldn't be bothered anymore. And even less times I have seen someone act the way the forums describe us.

Khenarthi

I love tanking, so that is the role I pick (with the adequate skills and gear) when using the group finder. I may jump in as dd to help some guildies complete content too, but I would much rather tank.

These last few months I have been doing other things in game (mostly questing, some fishing, etc) because my main purpose in ESO is not running dungeons. I don't think it's a matter of lack of incentive to run as a tank, it's just that there are many fun activities in this game and only so many hours a person can dedicate to playing. Many people queue as dd because theyperceive it to be easier, when that is not necessarily true: sure it's easy to be a bad/average dd, but being a good one is actually quite hard. There is less responsabily toward the group as you are not the one keeping others alive or buffing them or keeping the fight under your control, but a dd can make or break a group.