ESO Hates Stamina Builds Please Fix this ZOS

hmsdragonfly · February 2017

Billzihang123 wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Billzihang123 wrote: »

To me this is a ridiculous system that not only over-complicates balance, but only results in pigeon holing players to being a Stamina ONLY build, or a magicka ONLY build.

This would negate the need to have my suggestion of morphs for every class skill that change the resource.

This is an Elder Scrolls game, and if people want to use a two handed sword along with fireballs they should be free to do so. The passives in the specific trees should increase the damage of the spells within it, not simply putting points in Stamina or magicka.

Think about it, a pure magicka build would have twice as much magicka, so they still have just as large a pool of resources. Same the other way round ofc.

Stop hamstringing your game with these silly MMO conventions.

I beg to differ.

The thing is that, even in Skyrim, if people choose to use two-handed sword along with fireballs they will be far weaker than a lot of other combinations. Yes, there are builds in Skyrim, there are absurbly OP builds and there are builds that are so weak you cannot play the game in normal difficulty. Because Skyrim is an offline game, you can simply lower your difficulty, here you cannot ask the player who is attacking you "pls lower your damage and i am using two handed sword along with fireballs". If you choose to theorycraft your own "play as you like" build, you will have to be somewhat decent in game knowledge and you have to be creative, your suggestion shows us that you lack both, so that's why so far you haven't been successful with your "two handed sword along with fireballs" build, and ask the devs to change the game to accommodate your own personal need, but as you see, i have successfully built with my "two handed sword along with fireballs" character. Well, actually not two handed, sword and shield.

I don't have a 'two handed and fireballs' build, isn't it obvious that was an example?

Why is it that everywhere you look hybridisation is said to be sub-optimal, very much so. Maybe you have some special knowledge, but when I see everywhere else tell me otherwise...

There's also a question of specialising in a few things - I'm not talking about wanting to be good at everything - one can be very good with swords and very good with conjuring demons for example, but that is the choice. I'm only talking about two handed swords and fireballs, not conjuration, healing, bows and making marzipan.

Skyrim worked fine as long as you didn't try and be decent at lots of things, and builds with one hand doing magic and the other with a 1 hander worked quite fine.

What exactly would be the harm of doing away with ability scaling through magicka and stamina? Can't you see how it would simplify things, but also have players consider them from a more intuitive view of resource pools. "Hmmmm... I'd like to have 75% in stamina and 25% in magicka because that's how I roughly spend by my bar layout."

After all you can still only have 5 abilities on your bar at once, so what difference does it make if it's a fireball rather than a cleave?

Yes of course, I also used 'two handed and fireballs' as an example.

"Sub-optimal" if you don't know what you are doing, like splitting points in both stam and mag then use both stam and mag dps abilities. Hybrid is decent (not the best, but decent), if you know what you are doing. If you ask me I will also suggest you not going hybrid, it's so complicated, and expensive, and very hard to play/to theorycraft, and will never be the best build in the meta, especially newer players, new players shouldn't go hybrid at all, so it's normal that people tell you not to go hybrid.

Yes, there's already a choice, for example, my hybrid DK is decent with sword and very effective at flame magic. The choice is there. You can make a lot of interesting build: hybrid nightblade specialized in alteration magic (cloak) and disease damage, hybrid templar in heavy armour, good at sword and shield and healing magic, the choice is there, but in order to make those builds decent and not sub-optimal, you need game knowledge.

Yeah, every sub-optimal build in Skyrim worked fine as long as you play the game in normal mode, "builds with one hand doing magic and the other with a 1 hander" is weaker if you compared to other OP builds. Are you trying to argue against the fact that in Skyrim there are builds which are absurdly OP and things like 'two handed and fireballs' aren't among them? As I have said, Skyrim is a single player game, you can lower difficulty, here you cannot ask the player who is attacking you "pls lower your damage and i am using two handed sword along with fireballs". Nope, that's not how it works.

Umm nope, it will complicate the balancing, not streamlining it. A lot of balancing issues will come into play: now you will have to balance things like uppercut then jesus beam the immobilized target. It takes 10x more time to balance the game, because there are so many new variables come into play. Uppercut + jesusbeam? Hmm, what about destro ult + spin-to-win? And power creep. Balancing issues will lead to power creep. Who knows what the cancerous meta next month will be. Secondly, immersion. As a hybrid, you will either sacrifice a bit of magic or a bit of swordplay. If you invest more into magic, your swordplay will be weaker. That's why hybrids are always rare. But, if the game is scaled your way, you will have things like a dude uppercuts people then jesus-beams them, both do an insane amount of damage now because jesus beam has a stam morph. Thirdly, resource pool is not that important if it's not for the damage boost. Like, what's the point of having 35k mag instead of 20k mag? Nope, it's better to just be fully unimmersive and uppercut then jesus beam people. Everyone will be a hybrid and super effective in both uppercut and jesus beam. Though I would love to see some Redguards beaming people and summoning Daedra. Redguards hate magic so I don't see something like that very often.

I honestly cannot imagine playing this game with more than 5 abilities. Combat is so fast paced, I am not sure if my finger can reach the button "8" while holding WASD to move around constantly and dodging and combo attacks like crazy. Nope, I cannot.

DragonBound · February 2017

Zuboko wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Yet when I mentioned this in October I got attacked by many and trolled, I tried to suggest there needs to be more class stam morphs.

Well I don't mind being attacked and maybe my post will back up yours enough that it will get the right people thinking.

The point is they are hypocrites.

kargen27 · February 2017

skiptomyluau wrote: »

The thing is with mag dodge rolling and blocking don't impact your ability to use skills but with stam it's a double whammy

Sure it impacts your ability. Magic users usually dump everything into magicka. That means they get one maybe two roll dodges and they are out of stam. Breaking one fear again out of stam. So the next one comes along and the magic user being out of stam will just have to wait for the stun or whatever to dissipate. You need to be really picky about what and when you block or when the evil red happens you will be unable to roll away.

You might still have all your magicka but it won't do you any good if you're stunned.

Emmagoldman · February 2017

[/quote]

Um, nope. With my setup, red mountain has 10k tool tip, in cyrodiil it's a half right?

It procs like crazy with rending slash and bloodthirst. [/quote]

8400, 10% chance only off of weapon damage. I use the set on my stam dk because a vast majority of magic users are vamp stage 4, so you add 20% additional dmg. I also use dawnbreaker for that reason.

Tbh, not sure how often if would proc with two weapon abilities, especially as you are probably using other abilities in between weapon attacks. If bloodthirst procs per hit, not ler channel, then it may proc more often. Anyone know for sure? Does bloodthirst proc per hit or per full channel?

I do think there are much better mag dk sets and wouldnt go medium myself. If you are seeing success though, its because mag users love vamp and you are countering that.

t3hdubzy · February 2017

Kneighbors wrote: »

t3hdubzy wrote: »

Kneighbors wrote: »

SHADOW2KK wrote: »

The way things are now is as good as it has ever been for stam builds, from early access on pc for bloody ages was the meta dress wearing magicka players.

Still agree with you though on some things.

Looks like you are talking about PvP.

There's a big conflict right now. In PvP stamina classes are very good right now. While in PvE they are really bad. If you will compare NB with Sorc starting from lvl 4 till cp600 you will discover

U make it sound like magika is struggling in pvp. I disagree. This update has increase my ability to die in 2 shots by magika users if im not super careful.

And u also make it sound like stamina is bad in pve, they may not have the top dps, but honestly ive never hd trouble completing any dungeon or trial on my stam dk or stam dps.

There may be a gap when it comes to 40 to 50k dps, but when i do trials, i typically dont die unless its a full wipe, and i can res in sticky situations where a magika player cannot. Just because some guilds dont allow stam players in their trials doesnt mean all are the same.

Trials aside, theres no dungeon stam players cant complete with ease, and the whole myth about no stam players in trials just isnt true. They add more survivability in my opinion.

Man, what is your point in telling stamina build can complete any dungeon? Did I say they can't? So my healer templar can solo many vet dungeons, how is it connected to me comparing stamina NB to others and saying that it has lower survivability and lower DPS in PvE than sorc (actually than any class)? Do you want me to give you a candy because you can survive in a vet dungeon? I'm sure there's a guy who can solo vet dungeon with naked mag DK with only one skill bar, it's really cool to speculate over this but it has nothing to do with my point.

My point is simple, if you choose the best team for your trial you will try to have as less stamina NB as possible. One is more than enough. You said it youself about guilds.

The point I made was I disagree with you which is what your reply tells me you understand. It also tells me you arent open to different opinions... thanks anyways.

Callous2208 · February 2017

I am told that stam is worthless in trials for any progression guild worth a damn. Can't confirm though, I'm not on that level.

TheShadowScout · February 2017

thomas.k.grayb14_ESO wrote: »

TheShadowScout wrote: »

Stamina builds are the warriors and knights, barbarians and amazons - Conan, Hercules, Galahad, Aragorn, Sturm, Kull, Xena, Boromir, Brienne, Wulfgar, Lancelot, Sandor, Achilles, Gimli, Sigfried, Arthur, Caramon, Goliath, Red Sonja, Fafhrd, Kitiara, Bruenor...
Stamina builds are the rangers and rouges, thieves and assassins - Legolas, Arya, Drizzt, Frodo, Grey Mouser, Odysseus, Tasslehoff, Bilbo, Sinbad, David, Tyrion...
Magica builds on the other hand are the wizards and priestesses, shamans and witches - Merlin, Raistlin, Melisande, Gandalf, Circe, Elminster, Saruman, Koschei, Dalamar, Morgan leFey, and so on...

I have a feeling our personal libraries are very similar.

Quite possibly! Mine is pretty much standard... if you are a fantasy loving bookworm who spent a while grabbing all the classic stories. I could mention a LOT of lesser known names, from Thraxas (who actually is a bad example, being a hybrid) to Achmend the snake, from Dragonbait to Lusiphur, from Shaundra to Rand, from Seregil to Jeanelle, from Gerin the Fox to Skywise, from... well, you get the idea, I have a LOT of books!

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

I honestly cannot imagine playing this game with more than 5 abilities. Combat is so fast paced, I am not sure if my finger can reach the button "8" while holding WASD to move around constantly and dodging and combo attacks like crazy. Nope, I cannot.

I for one would not want to.
I love how ESO avoids the usual "stare at a dozend cooldown timers while you do your 'perfect rotation' and call it combat" annoyance I had in other games, and instead has fast paced mobile combat with a ,imited skill selection you actually have to think carefully about before dashing into the fray...
Sometimes, less is more!

Tornaad · February 2017

notimetocare wrote: »

Zuboko wrote: »

I say that based on the classes. Every last ability for every single class (save the ultimate abilities) all start as Magic based abilities.
There are a few abilities that can be turned into stamina based abilities but they are a minority.
So if I want to build a stamina based character (which I do) then I have to almost ignore the abilities my class gives me and find things in other areas to support my character.
Yes it can be done, and yes it can be done successfully, but if they actually fully supported stamina based builds then there would be some class abilities that at least started as stamina based.

Please give us some stamina based classes.

If you look at basically every skill in the game, class wise, they all resemble spells. That's why they're all Magicka. The initial design of the game put stamina into weapon and Magicka in the class. Even staves damage used to scale off stamina (not the skills though)

There is a reason I did not simply request they change which stat the class abilities work off of. You're right many of those abilities would not make sense to be based off of stamina. And Yes there are passives between the different classes that can work for a stamina based character, but that still does not change the fact that for any class I have to work it into my stamina based build. It does not just fit.

And why should I have to wait until I am morph my few selected abilities before I can have them be effective for my abilities? Yes that only affects initial game plan not the end game stuff, but it still represents a mentality they have (or had) with the building of the game.

And in the end we still have this one question "If I am going to build a stamina based character, why can't I have a class that perfectly fits my chosen build?"

Tornaad · February 2017

TheShadowScout wrote: »

Zuboko wrote: »

I say that based on the classes. Every last ability for every single class (save the ultimate abilities) all start as Magic based abilities.
There are a few abilities that can be turned into stamina based abilities but they are a minority...

True.
But working as intended.

"Stamina builds" are supposed to be the warriors who favor brawn over brain.
"Magica builds" are supposed to be the wizards who favor brains over brawn.

Now, considering this, look at the class skills again... breathing fire, turning invisible, calling down lightning, throwing balls of holy fire, conjuring a flame whip, teleporting, summoning daedra, healing prayers, creating ash clouds, stealing lifeforce, curses, et cetera...

So, tell me again how those ought to be "brawn-based"?

The point is, stamina builds are -supposed- to depend more on weapon skills, while magica builds are -supposed- to have a wide range of all the nifty magical effects.
Stamina builds are the warriors and knights, barbarians and amazons - Conan, Hercules, Galahad, Aragorn, Sturm, Kull, Xena, Boromir, Brienne, Wulfgar, Lancelot, Sandor, Achilles, Gimli, Sigfried, Arthur, Caramon, Goliath, Red Sonja, Fafhrd, Kitiara, Bruenor...
Stamina builds are the rangers and rouges, thieves and assassins - Legolas, Arya, Drizzt, Frodo, Grey Mouser, Odysseus, Tasslehoff, Bilbo, Sinbad, David, Tyrion...
Magica builds on the other hand are the wizards and priestesses, shamans and witches - Merlin, Raistlin, Melisande, Gandalf, Circe, Elminster, Saruman, Koschei, Dalamar, Morgan leFey, and so on...

So, stamina builds are supposed to get by their skill at weapons and strength of arm.
And they are supposed to like it!
They are not supposed to whine about how it is unfair that the wizard over there can cast curses all day long and they cannot...

I agree that the class abilities as they are designed in most cases do not make sense to be based off of stamina. I very much understand your reasoning, but whether I launch a hail of arrows into the air pelting a specific radius for a certain about of time or whether I set it on fire by a conjured spell the end result is the same the people in there who are my enemies are hurt. And with that in mind there is an almost magical level to the things that can be done by stamina based characters. If it was not magically based and based totally in the realms of physics and science then it really would not be all that much fun to play.

And with that in mind they were able to conceive of a set of magical based abilities and a bunch of non class based stamina abilities. Why can't they think of a few stamina based classes and perhaps add a few magical based non class skill sets?

Tornaad · February 2017

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Billzihang123 wrote: »

I fail to understand why class abilities all start as magicka-based.

A solution would be to have class abilities work differently, and have a special morph initially when you learn them where you choose if it cost stamina or magicka. I mean, why not? Magicka seems rather advantaged by default, and aren't all classes supposed to support stamina and magicka builds?

Give choice.

2 Mag-Based Weapon Skill lines.
4 Stam-Based Weapon Skill lines.
3 Class Skill lines, with around 4-5 stam morphs in total.
Seems fair to me.

All classes support both stamina and magicka builds.

You have a **** tons of choices, what are you talking about?

You have to choose a class.
You don't have to choose a skill line.
A class is supposed to represent part of your character. If I am going to try to role play then with the current class options I have to come up with a reason why my character started in a particular skill line and then mostly abandoned it.

TheShadowScout · February 2017

Zuboko wrote: »

I agree that the class abilities as they are designed in most cases do not make sense to be based off of stamina. I very much understand your reasoning, but whether I launch a hail of arrows into the air pelting a specific radius for a certain about of time or whether I set it on fire by a conjured spell the end result is the same the people in there who are my enemies are hurt. And with that in mind there is an almost magical level to the things that can be done by stamina based characters. If it was not magically based and based totally in the realms of physics and science then it really would not be all that much fun to play.

Agreed. But then, the stamina stuff is at least -mostly- based on brawn. With a few "on the edge of believability" abilities mixed in, like... firing an arrow appearently made of arrows to rain down in an attack similar to some conjured spells (Didn't I once see Hawkeye do that in one of the comics? Anyways, that kind of... stuff)
It does make sense that brawny characters faced with nerdy mages doing grand magicks would talk to tinkerer guys to get something special of their own, be it poison for their arrows, throwing daggers, special magic-nomming shields, bags of caltrops or arrows... uhm... made of arrows?

Zuboko wrote: »

And with that in mind they were able to conceive of a set of magical based abilities and a bunch of non class based stamina abilities. Why can't they think of a few stamina based classes and perhaps add a few magical based non class skill sets?

As I mentioned... the class skills are -all- magica-ish.
A "stamina based class" is -any- class that uses physical weapon skills (and, fighter guild skills because they are all about the brawn) rather then class skills of magical weapon skills.

So, logically... if you want more stamina fun... it should not come in form of additional classes, but more like in form of new weapon skills. Like, for example... https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/259011/additional-weapon-skill-ideas/p1

altemriel · February 2017

wait was it not few months ago when everyone was whining on the forums, that eso hates magicka classes and that stamina characters are way much stronger than magicka classes??? now the opposite? WTH??

Tryxus · February 2017

altemriel wrote: »

wait was it not few months ago when everyone was whining on the forums, that eso hates magicka classes and that stamina characters are way much stronger than magicka classes??? now the opposite? WTH??

I think the OP doesn't like the design of Mag and Stam builds: that classes are Magicka based, and that Stamina builds don't get to use many of their abilities

However, I think the devs did a good job on it. Let's take the Nightblade for example, who in former games was a sneaky Spellcaster. So it would make sense that their class skills are Magicka based. Same goes for the other 4 classes: DKs use Akaviri magicks, Sorcerers and Templars are obviously Magicka, Warden uses nature and frost magic,...

And for Stamina builds, they get to choose from 4 different weapons and use the Stamina morphs of their class skills to complement that. Add in the utility and buff skills that still require Magicka and presto: Stam builds with a class flavor

Tornaad · February 2017

TheShadowScout wrote: »

Zuboko wrote: »

I agree that the class abilities as they are designed in most cases do not make sense to be based off of stamina. I very much understand your reasoning, but whether I launch a hail of arrows into the air pelting a specific radius for a certain about of time or whether I set it on fire by a conjured spell the end result is the same the people in there who are my enemies are hurt. And with that in mind there is an almost magical level to the things that can be done by stamina based characters. If it was not magically based and based totally in the realms of physics and science then it really would not be all that much fun to play.

Agreed. But then, the stamina stuff is at least -mostly- based on brawn. With a few "on the edge of believability" abilities mixed in, like... firing an arrow appearently made of arrows to rain down in an attack similar to some conjured spells (Didn't I once see Hawkeye do that in one of the comics? Anyways, that kind of... stuff)
It does make sense that brawny characters faced with nerdy mages doing grand magicks would talk to tinkerer guys to get something special of their own, be it poison for their arrows, throwing daggers, special magic-nomming shields, bags of caltrops or arrows... uhm... made of arrows?

Zuboko wrote: »

And with that in mind they were able to conceive of a set of magical based abilities and a bunch of non class based stamina abilities. Why can't they think of a few stamina based classes and perhaps add a few magical based non class skill sets?

As I mentioned... the class skills are -all- magica-ish.
A "stamina based class" is -any- class that uses physical weapon skills (and, fighter guild skills because they are all about the brawn) rather then class skills of magical weapon skills.

So, logically... if you want more stamina fun... it should not come in form of additional classes, but more like in form of new weapon skills. Like, for example... https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/259011/additional-weapon-skill-ideas/p1

Really as someone who plays stamina builds, specifically focused around Bows, I honestly do not feel I am lacking choices. I always like the idea of more choices, but the thing I don't like is that there are no stamina based classes.

hmsdragonfly · February 2017

Emmagoldman wrote: »

8400, 10% chance only off of weapon damage. I use the set on my stam dk because a vast majority of magic users are vamp stage 4, so you add 20% additional dmg. I also use dawnbreaker for that reason.

Tbh, not sure how often if would proc with two weapon abilities, especially as you are probably using other abilities in between weapon attacks. If bloodthirst procs per hit, not ler channel, then it may proc more often. Anyone know for sure? Does bloodthirst proc per hit or per full channel?

I do think there are much better mag dk sets and wouldnt go medium myself. If you are seeing success though, its because mag users love vamp and you are countering that.

It procs with the DOT of Rending Slashes. I find out that if I run red mountain on my stamplar, it procs as often as viper if I use rending slash + bloodthirst. There's a downside, since it's RNG, sometimes it procs a lot and sometimes it refuses to proc at all, while with viper it's a guaranteed proc every 6 seconds.

I do have a MagDK setup with Seducer and Sun. I am less effective with that setup, though. I am not recommending anyone to wear medium, I wear medium just because I duo with a buddy and he is already tanky af so I don't have to care a lot about being tanky, I just need to kill people.

Yes, that's totally correct, you see a lot of vampires in cyrodiil that's why I see a lot of success.

hmsdragonfly · February 2017

kargen27 wrote: »

skiptomyluau wrote: »

The thing is with mag dodge rolling and blocking don't impact your ability to use skills but with stam it's a double whammy

Sure it impacts your ability. Magic users usually dump everything into magicka. That means they get one maybe two roll dodges and they are out of stam. Breaking one fear again out of stam. So the next one comes along and the magic user being out of stam will just have to wait for the stun or whatever to dissipate. You need to be really picky about what and when you block or when the evil red happens you will be unable to roll away.

You might still have all your magicka but it won't do you any good if you're stunned.

So can stam users have wards please?

And mist form. Oh, and cloak. Sorry, did I forget streak? And cleanse, damn, how can I forget cleanse! Stam cleanse, we need it!

Zuboko wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Billzihang123 wrote: »

I fail to understand why class abilities all start as magicka-based.

A solution would be to have class abilities work differently, and have a special morph initially when you learn them where you choose if it cost stamina or magicka. I mean, why not? Magicka seems rather advantaged by default, and aren't all classes supposed to support stamina and magicka builds?

Give choice.

2 Mag-Based Weapon Skill lines.
4 Stam-Based Weapon Skill lines.
3 Class Skill lines, with around 4-5 stam morphs in total.
Seems fair to me.

All classes support both stamina and magicka builds.

You have a **** tons of choices, what are you talking about?

You have to choose a class.
You don't have to choose a skill line.
A class is supposed to represent part of your character. If I am going to try to role play then with the current class options I have to come up with a reason why my character started in a particular skill line and then mostly abandoned it.

What are you talking about? You have more than enough stam abilities to build your character.

hmsdragonfly · February 2017

Zuboko wrote: »

And in the end we still have this one question "If I am going to build a stamina based character, why can't I have a class that perfectly fits my chosen build?"

All classes perfectly fit for building stam characters.

Please name a class that you cannot build a stam character with.

Magic_Doogies · February 2017

Man I remember just a few months ago the only people crying about stam builds directly related to sorcs and everyone else was whining about how BROKEN stam builds were. Now we are back to complaining about stam builds being hated?

No wonder staff never knows what to do. 180 complaints faster than they can even code and test the damn things.

Anhedonie · February 2017

Stamina is better than magicka in every aspect except for aoe.
The only downsides are: you need to have good situation awareness (l2p guys), skill set is fairly the same, you need vMA weapons on this patch for Trials.

Also, stamina has:
-Bow
-DW
-2handed
-1h and shield
-Stamina class morphs
-Better sustain
-Better single target damage
-Immunity to silence effects like negate

julianlookhrwb17_ESO · February 2017

They can deny or *** when you see majority of the players are magicka based and what picture is it showing?
They are hard to play? *** that, means it is easier to play but there are players who loves to fight a good close range.
Been playing this game for 3 years non-stop and I've tried many stam build for good sustaining fight without rolling like mad, going invisible, bat-*** escaping cause those actions are usually medium armor players and I finally found a good setup using the heavies.
Forget about those troll tanks, they cant do *** in dps but noobs love to hit them and then complaining OP. With heavy armour and my *** latency of 250-400 ping I am able to 1 v 1 with those very good players with 50% ratio of winning or escaping. Must be when they found their burst build cant do much impact on heavies and I presume there is where the complaints started.

From my understanding
Light setup: Pew pew from far, support with magic skills
Med setup: Ganking with high dmg and able to escape when things get overheated
Heavy setup: Rush into the battle to interrupt the enemies momentum, able to withstand punishment and dies during the process.

Ubsub for almost 3 weeks and shall see the Warden how it will work out in June.

We are all Vega

BrassRazoo · February 2017

I guess you don't PvP much. If you are not stam in PvP you may as well hide or stand on a wall well out of harms way.

kyle.wilson · February 2017

I guess we are starting to see how many players were getting significant amounts of DPS from proc sets. Cause that's the only major change in this update.
Plus some people are finally learning how to kill the do nothing block tanks in pvp.

Ep1kMalware · February 2017

Stam classes still pull wicked high dps. The whole thing about magica is now they can pull high dps and havd better survivability. With the exception of hardmode aa/vmol both classes perform very well

Where did op get his info?

SnubbS · February 2017

ESO only hates the Stam builds that don't come equipped with a class spammable.

LorDrek · February 2017

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Zuboko wrote: »

And in the end we still have this one question "If I am going to build a stamina based character, why can't I have a class that perfectly fits my chosen build?"

All classes perfectly fit for building stam characters.

Please name a class that you cannot build a stam character with.

Stam dk, i use only 1 skill, 1 ultimate. Other is crap.

LorDrek · February 2017

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Stam classes still pull wicked high dps. The whole thing about magica is now they can pull high dps and havd better survivability. With the exception of hardmode aa/vmol both classes perform very well

Where did op get his info?

Last path, magicka is better.

LadyLavina · February 2017

oh hey another one of these threads.

"ZOS hates X and buffs Y, please fix."

Ep1kMalware · February 2017

LorDrek wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Stam classes still pull wicked high dps. The whole thing about magica is now they can pull high dps and havd better survivability. With the exception of hardmode aa/vmol both classes perform very well

Where did op get his info?

Last path, magicka is better.

Only in the hands of good player. Most players pull weak dpsno matter what they play.

I dont do competative trial scores anymore. No reason for me to switch

hmsdragonfly · February 2017

LorDrek wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Zuboko wrote: »

And in the end we still have this one question "If I am going to build a stamina based character, why can't I have a class that perfectly fits my chosen build?"

All classes perfectly fit for building stam characters.

Please name a class that you cannot build a stam character with.

Stam dk, i use only 1 skill, 1 ultimate. Other is crap.

Next time you are wrecking blown, or viper'd in the face by a stamdk, remind yourself that you get rekt by the worst stam class in the game.

L2stamdk.

Edziu · February 2017

SnubbS wrote: »

ESO only hates the Stam builds that don't come equipped with a class spammable.

stablade and stamplar with class spammable stamina skill, worst dps ever in game, stam dk and stam sorc without class spammable, only some dots - the best stam dps

kyle.wilson wrote: »

I guess we are starting to see how many players were getting significant amounts of DPS from proc sets. Cause that's the only major change in this update.
Plus some people are finally learning how to kill the do nothing block tanks in pvp.

so overall nerf to stamina dps very significant by beast trap nerf, overal huge buff to magica build by staves

nerf to dk standard which will feel this nerf stam dk, mag dk got buff in other skill for recompensate this nerf

nb got cost increase for incap strike which was very nice spammable ulti, especially on finishers, now I cant spam enought often with this, before finishers its now much less usable, better to keep ulti for just dawnbreaker in mostly sitations and on finishers on trial fights you will spam maybe 2-3x this ult instead of 5 which is again dps loss (this is also nerf to magblade ofc)

stamplar? ehh next patch still not existing dead class

sstamsorc..I dont know, I never played this but people complaining hurricane got nerf ot atleast in dps is without changes while mag sorc got haunting curse to easier rotation, buff to pets to buff dps

and now I dont see any adventage in stamina in pve

I as stambled, playing on this nonstop while I pulling 40-45k dps on triall boss pure single target then mag dk is pulling over 55k pure single target dps, mag sorc 50k single target and add to this aoe, I as stmina will get with 2 adds maybe just 2-3k additional aoe by only endless hail? while mag builds have 3+ and more aoe skill which can add more than 6k+ additional dps with just 1-2 adds