Maelstrom post Homestead 50 chests

Beware13

Meld777 wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

People quitting a game over a weapon makes me laugh.

It's not average pugs quitting "over a weapon". It's end-game players going for rank 1 scores. Not rank 100, not rank 50, not rank 2. And if you look at the leaderboards, you'll notice something compared to what they looked like a year ago. There's no competition. There's Hodor with a full team of vMA weapons... and that's pretty much it. All the other competition got filtered out and driven away by ZOS.

A person without a vMA weapon cannot compete with a person that has one on maximum skill-level. Thus, people who have the weapons will always be first, while people like me who don't have them farm a solo arena for over a year (almost 1.5 years by now), 1000+ runs, and eventually quit. I myself ran it 550+ times so far.

Some play for RP, some play for skill and competition. If you play for RP, you won't quit over a weapon. But you probably won't farm a solo arena for 1000+ hours in the first place. Which is the real reason those people quit: demotivation! Not the weapon per se.

Gorath wrote: »

Now that BDO went hardcore p2w

I disagree. BDO isn't more P2W than ESO. What you're referring to is probably the trading system that is more convenient when subscribed. In ESO it's the crafting bag. Both are not needed to play the game and don't help you "win". But they are convenient. If BDO is P2W, how is ESO not?

In all honesty, VMA weapons do not "make or break" your build or your ability to compete. I have never gotten my sharpened inferno staff and while the extra damage would be nice, it's not necessary to do end game content. My raid team was the first NA clear of vMoL and I have been on top of trial leaderboards multiple times, never having a VMA weapon.

Yeah the RNG is boo boo and makes me rage but it's not game breaking. You can still compete without it.

DjMuscleboy02

What do you mean? They clearly reduced the chances. Before the update you would have received well over 50% in resto staves...

In all seriousness, the rng in VMA is quite ridiculous.

Beware13

Also, from yesterday's media release interview with Devs.

"The RNG of loot, like Undaunted chests, are considered a "pain point" that the team is considering ways to solve, with a token system possibly being one such way."

So maybe, JUST MAYBE, the VMA system will be changed.

Izaki

Meld777 wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Maelstrom staves are a back bar weapon.

Umm.... no.... no they aren't.
Any stamina build uses front bar.
MOST mag builds will do double bar... 1 sharpened lightning, 1 sharpened inferno. OR mal on front bar with dual wield swords on back bar.
I know, i know.... there is some meta build that uses only a sharpened lightning or inferno on back bar and does the other with a moondancer on front. That's one build out of many.

That "some meta" build is the one with most potential DPS. A 4pc Moondancer/Aether bonus + spell damage glyph > maelstrom weapon. You aren't running Blockade on both bars, so there's 0 need for having 2 vMA staves.
Btw I did say Staves, Idk why you bring up stamina builds.

That's the reason you're far from being 1st even with your vMA staff. Deltia builds are good for beginners. If you never question builds, buff interactions and playstyles, you'll never be number 1.

Yes, that setup is best if you play like shown in the videos. Every competitive group has their secrets. For Hodor it's the trash pulls. You won't find a single video of them doing that, unless it's their 2nd group, which doesn't know the 1st group's trash tactics either. We, on the other hand, stream most of our raids, but especially those when going for max score. I, however, will never share my build and playstyle outside of my raid group and close friends. Same goes for most of our group. That's my competitive advantage.

Now go enjoy light-weaving Force Pulse. Not saying it's bad.

What's with all the assumptions? Salty you didn't get your weapon? I don't have mine either.
It doesn't matter if you're first at the launch of a patch. What matters are the scores before they are wiped, those are the ones people remember.
How would you know my ranking if you're not on the same platform as me?
How would you know what class I main and what build I use?
You know... I think you've contradicted yourself enough to start to look stupid. If you have that many secrets, why are you complaining about not being competitive? Seems like an excuse for not being good enough

Surgee

Cuz cuz cuz

Preyfar

Beware13 wrote: »

In all honesty, VMA weapons do not "make or break" your build or your ability to compete. I have never gotten my sharpened inferno staff and while the extra damage would be nice, it's not necessary to do end game content. My raid team was the first NA clear of vMoL and I have been on top of trial leaderboards multiple times, never having a VMA weapon.

This might be true of Magicka, but for competitive Stamina, you NEED VMA weapons. Stamina underperforms compared to Magicka builds for end game trials (especially after our recent nerfs). You can get by without them but you're taking a significant damage penalty doing so. ZOS made Maelstrom DW too good for what they are, and because of that they're BIS even with bad traits. Pretty much all end game Stamina builds require them. Since Stamina is mostly relegated to single target and our AOE damage is too low that we need that extra boost to compete.

Magicka builds can benefit from a VMA staff but it's not make or break in most cases. You don't need them. Magicka's default skillsets give them excellent single target, great AOE, ample healing and strong shields. Stamina builds need to grind out in Cyrodiil for a simple heal (Vigor). Stamina can still do great single target damage but their versatility is greatly diminished in any other situation.

If you're running Vet Trials on hard mode, and you're going for score, you're running VMA DW or you're gimping the team. Bow and 2H are not viable in any way for vet Trials leaving only one option, and that option pretty much funnels you into needing VMA gear. It sucks.

And believe it or not most Stamina people hate it. We want to run other builds and have diversity, but we're railroaded into a small niche.

zaria

Stopnaggin wrote: »

POps75p wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

People quitting a game over a weapon makes me laugh.

has nothing to do with the specific weapon, but a total bunch of crap by ESO to BS everyone. again, again and again

same goes for the added gems to the Crown store to buy the good stuff, but have to buy the gambling boxes to get them

total BS

Get over the crown crates already. It's a tired ass old argument. Not needed in every friggin thread.

Yes rng sucks, it is a real pain, I have no idea on how they could fix it at this point. Token system? How many tokens do you need so as not to *** off those who have run it 1000+ times to get their weapons? Drop useless traits? Good but still dependant on rng. Whats the middle ground to keep everyone happy?

Tokens will help, you will probably need a lot as in 25 or more if you also got the drop.
The vendor would need any weapon with any trait. Another option would be an crafting station, this could also allow you to select style but you would need to know the trait unless bypassed. 25 tokens and select weapon+ trait+ style.

They have talked about an token system to solve the rng problems.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

VMA loot is beyond awful, and it certainly has driven and will continue to drive good players away from the game.

As for a VMA staff giving 4k DPS single target, sorry I dont buy it. Saying "trust me on this" without providing anything to back up your claim makes you sound like a politician.

Could they add 4k in a trash pull? Certainly.

jakeedmundson

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

VMA loot is beyond awful, and it certainly has driven and will continue to drive good players away from the game.

As for a VMA staff giving 4k DPS single target, sorry I dont buy it. Saying "trust me on this" without providing anything to back up your claim makes you sound like a politician.

Could they add 4k in a trash pull? Certainly.

I've seen the lightning staff tested on heavy attack builds for single target... Sorry i can't remember exactly where but i've seen the numbers.
You're right i think for the classic frag/force pulse build with an inferno staff... it might add 2k ish? that number sticks in my head for some reason.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

VMA loot is beyond awful, and it certainly has driven and will continue to drive good players away from the game.

As for a VMA staff giving 4k DPS single target, sorry I dont buy it. Saying "trust me on this" without providing anything to back up your claim makes you sound like a politician.

Could they add 4k in a trash pull? Certainly.

I've seen the lightning staff tested on heavy attack builds for single target... Sorry i can't remember exactly where but i've seen the numbers.
You're right i think for the classic frag/force pulse build with an inferno staff... it might add 2k ish? that number sticks in my head for some reason.

I was actually testing a heavy attack build yesterday with a lighting staff, more for fun and perhaps a simpler alternative to the "Meta" rotation. It would certainly require a VMA staff to make it work. I was getting 3-4k less DPS on the target dummy than my normal rotation, but the numbers were still impressive and the rotation could be done by a trained monkey. I was basically using 3 skills in my rotation and the channel. It is certainly possible that you could build a more robust rotation around it to pull some pretty impressive numbers. Maybe that is what he is getting at. Whether that will actually out parse the meta, I guess I dont know.

2k is about what I saw on single target when my inferno dropped a few months ago. The AOE DPS, definitely went up more, as I use a lighting staff channel for AOE.

MakoFore

ZoS needs to do something quick. we re not just losing players- we re losing good players and experienced end game players. i myself havent been able to play since the homestead launch because of poor EU pings, its gotten exponentially worse. Ive been starting over on the NA but its so grindy who knows. point is- there are too many bottlenecks to progression in this game, be it levelling, grinding for gear, farming, RNG loot- too many things that stop u from enjoying the best content- which is pvp and dungeon trials. because in order to enjoy that- u need to spend hours doing other crap.

Izaki

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

VMA loot is beyond awful, and it certainly has driven and will continue to drive good players away from the game.

As for a VMA staff giving 4k DPS single target, sorry I dont buy it. Saying "trust me on this" without providing anything to back up your claim makes you sound like a politician.

Could they add 4k in a trash pull? Certainly.

I've seen the lightning staff tested on heavy attack builds for single target... Sorry i can't remember exactly where but i've seen the numbers.
You're right i think for the classic frag/force pulse build with an inferno staff... it might add 2k ish? that number sticks in my head for some reason.

Somewhere around there yeah, depending on the consistancy and speed of your weaves etc. Typically between 1-2k iirc

Taleof2Cities

#ZOSTASTICRNG

jakeedmundson

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

VMA loot is beyond awful, and it certainly has driven and will continue to drive good players away from the game.

As for a VMA staff giving 4k DPS single target, sorry I dont buy it. Saying "trust me on this" without providing anything to back up your claim makes you sound like a politician.

Could they add 4k in a trash pull? Certainly.

I've seen the lightning staff tested on heavy attack builds for single target... Sorry i can't remember exactly where but i've seen the numbers.
You're right i think for the classic frag/force pulse build with an inferno staff... it might add 2k ish? that number sticks in my head for some reason.

I was actually testing a heavy attack build yesterday with a lighting staff, more for fun and perhaps a simpler alternative to the "Meta" rotation. It would certainly require a VMA staff to make it work. I was getting 3-4k less DPS on the target dummy than my normal rotation, but the numbers were still impressive and the rotation could be done by a trained monkey. I was basically using 3 skills in my rotation and the channel. It is certainly possible that you could build a more robust rotation around it to pull some pretty impressive numbers. Maybe that is what he is getting at. Whether that will actually out parse the meta, I guess I dont know.

2k is about what I saw on single target when my inferno dropped a few months ago. The AOE DPS, definitely went up more, as I use a lighting staff channel for AOE.

Oh i don't think it would beat the meta build... but i REALLY enjoy using it on my sorc.
I just can't find a vma lightning staff to make it stronger... as of right now though, with my build i can hit 25 - 30k dps with only the power surge buff. I actually use that to farm VMA.... too bad it doesn't recognize your class/build and drop items accordingly

Oreyn_Bearclaw

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

VMA loot is beyond awful, and it certainly has driven and will continue to drive good players away from the game.

As for a VMA staff giving 4k DPS single target, sorry I dont buy it. Saying "trust me on this" without providing anything to back up your claim makes you sound like a politician.

Could they add 4k in a trash pull? Certainly.

I've seen the lightning staff tested on heavy attack builds for single target... Sorry i can't remember exactly where but i've seen the numbers.
You're right i think for the classic frag/force pulse build with an inferno staff... it might add 2k ish? that number sticks in my head for some reason.

I was actually testing a heavy attack build yesterday with a lighting staff, more for fun and perhaps a simpler alternative to the "Meta" rotation. It would certainly require a VMA staff to make it work. I was getting 3-4k less DPS on the target dummy than my normal rotation, but the numbers were still impressive and the rotation could be done by a trained monkey. I was basically using 3 skills in my rotation and the channel. It is certainly possible that you could build a more robust rotation around it to pull some pretty impressive numbers. Maybe that is what he is getting at. Whether that will actually out parse the meta, I guess I dont know.

2k is about what I saw on single target when my inferno dropped a few months ago. The AOE DPS, definitely went up more, as I use a lighting staff channel for AOE.

Oh i don't think it would beat the meta build... but i REALLY enjoy using it on my sorc.
I just can't find a vma lightning staff to make it stronger... as of right now though, with my build i can hit 25 - 30k dps with only the power surge buff. I actually use that to farm VMA.... too bad it doesn't recognize your class/build and drop items accordingly

I took that build through VMA the other day. It was @Masel92 that put me on to it. Not saying its the fastest, but it's probably the easiest way to clear, and I have done it on every class, and tried darn near everything.

jakeedmundson

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

VMA loot is beyond awful, and it certainly has driven and will continue to drive good players away from the game.

As for a VMA staff giving 4k DPS single target, sorry I dont buy it. Saying "trust me on this" without providing anything to back up your claim makes you sound like a politician.

Could they add 4k in a trash pull? Certainly.

I've seen the lightning staff tested on heavy attack builds for single target... Sorry i can't remember exactly where but i've seen the numbers.
You're right i think for the classic frag/force pulse build with an inferno staff... it might add 2k ish? that number sticks in my head for some reason.

I was actually testing a heavy attack build yesterday with a lighting staff, more for fun and perhaps a simpler alternative to the "Meta" rotation. It would certainly require a VMA staff to make it work. I was getting 3-4k less DPS on the target dummy than my normal rotation, but the numbers were still impressive and the rotation could be done by a trained monkey. I was basically using 3 skills in my rotation and the channel. It is certainly possible that you could build a more robust rotation around it to pull some pretty impressive numbers. Maybe that is what he is getting at. Whether that will actually out parse the meta, I guess I dont know.

2k is about what I saw on single target when my inferno dropped a few months ago. The AOE DPS, definitely went up more, as I use a lighting staff channel for AOE.

Oh i don't think it would beat the meta build... but i REALLY enjoy using it on my sorc.
I just can't find a vma lightning staff to make it stronger... as of right now though, with my build i can hit 25 - 30k dps with only the power surge buff. I actually use that to farm VMA.... too bad it doesn't recognize your class/build and drop items accordingly

I took that build through VMA the other day. It was @Masel92 that put me on to it. Not saying its the fastest, but it's probably the easiest way to clear, and I have done it on every class, and tried darn near everything.

I just got my fastest run with the HA build and hit the leaderboard (527k) AND it dropped a sharpened lightning staff.... so double lucky that time.

Lets just say i won't be running vMA for a while...

Joy_Division

Stopnaggin wrote: »

POps75p wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

People quitting a game over a weapon makes me laugh.

has nothing to do with the specific weapon, but a total bunch of crap by ESO to BS everyone. again, again and again

same goes for the added gems to the Crown store to buy the good stuff, but have to buy the gambling boxes to get them

total BS

Get over the crown crates already. It's a tired ass old argument. Not needed in every friggin thread.

Yes rng sucks, it is a real pain, I have no idea on how they could fix it at this point. Token system? How many tokens do you need so as not to *** off those who have run it 1000+ times to get their weapons? Drop useless traits? Good but still dependant on rng. Whats the middle ground to keep everyone happy?

What do you mean you don't kbow how they could fix it?

Here is a novel idea: do not make a gear system where there is one item + trait to rule over them all. That way I may not get exactly what I want, but I still get something reasonably competitive that I can use.

Masel

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

VMA loot is beyond awful, and it certainly has driven and will continue to drive good players away from the game.

As for a VMA staff giving 4k DPS single target, sorry I dont buy it. Saying "trust me on this" without providing anything to back up your claim makes you sound like a politician.

Could they add 4k in a trash pull? Certainly.

The vMA lightning staff does add more than 4k DPS. 2 Ticks per second, 1341 More damage, multiplied by CPS etc. Proof:

vMA Staff in a HA Build:


MASTER Staff instead:

Oreyn_Bearclaw

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

VMA loot is beyond awful, and it certainly has driven and will continue to drive good players away from the game.

As for a VMA staff giving 4k DPS single target, sorry I dont buy it. Saying "trust me on this" without providing anything to back up your claim makes you sound like a politician.

Could they add 4k in a trash pull? Certainly.

I've seen the lightning staff tested on heavy attack builds for single target... Sorry i can't remember exactly where but i've seen the numbers.
You're right i think for the classic frag/force pulse build with an inferno staff... it might add 2k ish? that number sticks in my head for some reason.

I was actually testing a heavy attack build yesterday with a lighting staff, more for fun and perhaps a simpler alternative to the "Meta" rotation. It would certainly require a VMA staff to make it work. I was getting 3-4k less DPS on the target dummy than my normal rotation, but the numbers were still impressive and the rotation could be done by a trained monkey. I was basically using 3 skills in my rotation and the channel. It is certainly possible that you could build a more robust rotation around it to pull some pretty impressive numbers. Maybe that is what he is getting at. Whether that will actually out parse the meta, I guess I dont know.

2k is about what I saw on single target when my inferno dropped a few months ago. The AOE DPS, definitely went up more, as I use a lighting staff channel for AOE.

Oh i don't think it would beat the meta build... but i REALLY enjoy using it on my sorc.
I just can't find a vma lightning staff to make it stronger... as of right now though, with my build i can hit 25 - 30k dps with only the power surge buff. I actually use that to farm VMA.... too bad it doesn't recognize your class/build and drop items accordingly

I took that build through VMA the other day. It was @Masel92 that put me on to it. Not saying its the fastest, but it's probably the easiest way to clear, and I have done it on every class, and tried darn near everything.

I just got my fastest run with the HA build and hit the leaderboard (527k) AND it dropped a sharpened lightning staff.... so double lucky that time.

Lets just say i won't be running vMA for a while...

@jakeedmundson
That was me a few months ago. I had all but given up on a VMA inferno. I decided, heck, I am going to stop looking for weapons and just go for some flawless titles on some other toons. My very first run on mDK in about 9 months (usually run on sorcs), bam sharp inferno. Been in their twice since. Haha. Once for a bust, once to try the heavy attack build on my sorc. I will probably make a push here again on my DK, but I have run that place so many times...

Meld777

Currently 3rd place of my class on PC EU with 587505, playing a Magicka Nightblade, slowly approaching 600 runs overall, jack *** in both chests and weeklies. Powered Dagger + Decisive Dagger ftw. At least two gold tempers. Nowhere close to a Sharpened or Precise Inferno.

GawdSB

Lol @ All this resto staves and ZOS said they lowered the drop rate. So before homestead how much were they really dropping?

Gorilla

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

I was actually testing a heavy attack build yesterday with a lighting staff, more for fun and perhaps a simpler alternative to the "Meta" rotation. It would certainly require a VMA staff to make it work. I was getting 3-4k less DPS on the target dummy than my normal rotation, but the numbers were still impressive and the rotation could be done by a trained monkey. I was basically using 3 skills in my rotation and the channel. It is certainly possible that you could build a more robust rotation around it to pull some pretty impressive numbers. Maybe that is what he is getting at. Whether that will actually out parse the meta, I guess I dont know.

2k is about what I saw on single target when my inferno dropped a few months ago. The AOE DPS, definitely went up more, as I use a lighting staff channel for AOE.

Was this the pet build recently posted under Infallible? Fun build if so. It's fun, easy, and pub-proof (i.e., I can play it after a session at the pub with few mistakes)

MLGProPlayer

psychotic13 wrote: »

Although 50 runs seems a lot, overall it isn't a big enough sample to get reliable statistics

Having to run the same, single player content 50+ times blows. Therefore, nothing has changed. The grind is still awful.

Gorilla

Gorilla wrote: »

Was this the pet build recently posted under Infallible? Fun build if so. It's fun, easy, and pub-proof (i.e., I can play it after a session at the pub with few mistakes)

@Oreyn_Bearclaw

Eleusian

Weapons are the current ZOS "grind by design" it doesn't matter if it's VMA , Moondancer , BSW whatever. It's the hook

Remember when it was Running WGT 50X for the bad trait Kena Helm?

Or killing Skoria for the X time for no helm again?

Nothing is changing , just stop paying.

MLGProPlayer

Eleusian wrote: »

Weapons are the current ZOS "grind by design" it doesn't matter if it's VMA , Moondancer , BSW whatever. It's the hook

Remember when it was Running WGT 50X for the bad trait Kena Helm?

Or killing Skoria for the X time for no helm again?

Nothing is changing , just stop paying.

I don't get how they don't realize that a token system provides a carrot on a stick too. Just a much less frustrating one that players won't leave the game over.

You can require 100 tokens for a vMA weapon and you'd actually get more people grinding than you have now.

Insanepirate01

Got sharp inferno recently on my second run through post homestead. Nearly woke everyone up with my muffled screams of joy. RNGeezus has been good to me as of late.

Panda_iMunch

Seems to be about right. RNG works most of the time 10% of the time.

Ep1kMalware

I have to side with OP. I gave up for a couple months when zos announced that they're polluting the waters. Since homestead (ps4) I've gotten alot of shields/maces/resto.

I dont want sharp inferno. I just want my damn bow.

De_Mysteriis

I think the main problem with RNG is that it is truly random. Most players want it to be less random, actually. Like the probability of an item drop must increase with the number of times when it does not drop. Well, personally I wouldn't mind if ZOS would implement such a thing.