Furniture Crafting : Completely Inaccessible

Zenzuki

Yer funny!

Caroloces

I think you're confused. First of all, Epic quality doesn't need Tempering Alloy. It only needs Honing Stones, Dwarven Oil and Grain Solvent. It's Legendary which requires gold tempers.

Secondly, Master Writs are not how you get ordinary furniture recipes. Those are obtained by looting or stealing from cupboards, chests and backpacks like food and drink recipes.

Writ Vouchers from Master Writs allow you to craft special, very expensive furniture like target skeletons. They also allow you to buy the Ebony armor Motif.

Thanks for the clarification, @baratron, I was hasty (and confused) in my initial impressions and over the last couple of days I've had glimmerings of my misconceptions. I knew I should have spent more time exploring before I rushed to judgment!

Much appreciated!

THEDKEXPERIENCE

BlackSparrow wrote: »

THEDKEXPERIENCE wrote: »

Glad I thought years ago that having crafting all on one toon, who also happens to be my main, would be a good idea eventually. I kinda laugh at everyone who didn't think something like this could happen.

It's clear that reading patch notes isn't something most people do. Were you really not preparing for this? I have over 50 writ rewards and treasure maps just sitting on my main. We've known about this for a month.

And I've been preparing for it for a month, which is why my newly designated "all-in-one" furniture crafter is as capable as she is... and feeling skill point starved because of it.

Before the Homestead crafting announcement, why would we have thought it would happen? That sounds like hindsight talking more than anything, and I hardly think "laughter" is an admirable reaction to having flipped a coin and won.

Because it's an MMO. Things always change in an MMO. It was a totally reasonable assumption to think that at some point down the line ZOS would reward crafters who are a master at everything.

Asardes

I see some people complaining they have not enough skill points to make a char master crafter in all 6 trades. That's plainly false. I've been able to get enough skill points on my main to fully spec all 6 crafting trades, spec all useful passives and also fully spec class skills, 4 weapon skills, 2 armor skills (and most passives in the 3rd), undaunted, fighters guild most skills in alliance war lines, and even some passives in ledgermain and thieves guild. Splitting is also bad because you need to relearn all motifs on all your chars, instead of just one. And they are quite pricey. I've spent more than 2.5M getting them all. Research can also proceed in parallel on the same char. Splitting the research in the same trade on multiple chars is even less efficient.

azoriangaming

the whole system pushes you to crown store which is a shame, i don't mind spending crowns on the game when it's of my own choice but to feel like I've got to do it then the rebel inside me comes out and that's where i refuse to do so.

hmsdragonfly

In 3 months people will sell green blueprints to NPC vendors.

BlackSparrow

Asardes wrote: »

I see some people complaining they have not enough skill points to make a char master crafter in all 6 trades. That's plainly false. I've been able to get enough skill points on my main to fully spec all 6 crafting trades, spec all useful passives and also fully spec class skills, 4 weapon skills, 2 armor skills (and most passives in the 3rd), undaunted, fighters guild most skills in alliance war lines, and even some passives in ledgermain and thieves guild. Splitting is also bad because you need to relearn all motifs on all your chars, instead of just one. And they are quite pricey. I've spent more than 2.5M getting them all. Research can also proceed in parallel on the same char. Splitting the research in the same trade on multiple chars is even less efficient.

At endgame, yes, there are plenty of skill points..

My primary crafter is level 31. I had to respec her to give her barely enough skills to fight, just to get the primary skill of each crafting line up. So, right now, she feels skill point starved.

I now have newfound respect for anyone who actually leveled their alts as crafting alts.

THEDKEXPERIENCE wrote: »

BlackSparrow wrote: »

THEDKEXPERIENCE wrote: »

Glad I thought years ago that having crafting all on one toon, who also happens to be my main, would be a good idea eventually. I kinda laugh at everyone who didn't think something like this could happen.

It's clear that reading patch notes isn't something most people do. Were you really not preparing for this? I have over 50 writ rewards and treasure maps just sitting on my main. We've known about this for a month.

And I've been preparing for it for a month, which is why my newly designated "all-in-one" furniture crafter is as capable as she is... and feeling skill point starved because of it.

Before the Homestead crafting announcement, why would we have thought it would happen? That sounds like hindsight talking more than anything, and I hardly think "laughter" is an admirable reaction to having flipped a coin and won.

Because it's an MMO. Things always change in an MMO. It was a totally reasonable assumption to think that at some point down the line ZOS would reward crafters who are a master at everything.

Nope. That's hindsight logic.

Yes, MMOs do change. And every time a change rolls out, someone is going to be inconvenienced. This is just my turn on the chopping block, and that's why I'm not really upset by this so much as rolling-my-eyes annoyed. "Welp, guess it's time to train my crafters in other crafts." I can deal with that, with a little skill grinding. Not the end of the world.

What I take umbrage with here is people who are like "lol You should have known better, losers" because we couldn't see the future when setting up our crafters. You know, kicking us while we're down and all that.

Recremen

SunfireKnight86 wrote: »

or bought from an achievement vendor.

@SunfireKnight86

Yeah it's real easy to fill up when you're buying 290 books from an achievement vendor. That's more than a third of the 700 cap. Way to move the goalposts on this, stellar argumentative strategy. I'm talking about farming up your own materials to craft your own furniture to fill all, or close to all, 700 slots. Maybe if you do nothing but farm materials for 12 hours a day, or if you settle for low-tier furniture, I could see getting most of those slots filled, but if you want to play any other aspect of the game then your proposition is completely untenable.

SunfireKnight86

Recremen wrote: »

SunfireKnight86 wrote: »

or bought from an achievement vendor.

@SunfireKnight86

Yeah it's real easy to fill up when you're buying 290 books from an achievement vendor. That's more than a third of the 700 cap. Way to move the goalposts on this, stellar argumentative strategy. I'm talking about farming up your own materials to craft your own furniture to fill all, or close to all, 700 slots. Maybe if you do nothing but farm materials for 12 hours a day, or if you settle for low-tier furniture, I could see getting most of those slots filled, but if you want to play any other aspect of the game then your proposition is completely untenable.

Way to ignore everything else I said and twist one thing in a paragraph into something it's not to try and continue an "argument" that is really just you being mad you can't have everything the day it comes out.

Recremen

SunfireKnight86 wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

SunfireKnight86 wrote: »

or bought from an achievement vendor.

@SunfireKnight86

Yeah it's real easy to fill up when you're buying 290 books from an achievement vendor. That's more than a third of the 700 cap. Way to move the goalposts on this, stellar argumentative strategy. I'm talking about farming up your own materials to craft your own furniture to fill all, or close to all, 700 slots. Maybe if you do nothing but farm materials for 12 hours a day, or if you settle for low-tier furniture, I could see getting most of those slots filled, but if you want to play any other aspect of the game then your proposition is completely untenable.

Way to ignore everything else I said and twist one thing in a paragraph into something it's not to try and continue an "argument" that is really just you being mad you can't have everything the day it comes out.

@SunfireKnight86

It's really not about having everything the day it comes out, that's an assumption you came in with because you don't understand the difference between a reasonable grind and an unreasonable one, and so you assume anyone complaining just doesn't want to put in an effort.

Sylvis

A lot of people are debating how long it will take to get one's house fully furnished, but that doesn't necessarily mean you're 'done' afterwards. I imagine many others are like me...I plan to have multiple homes and will probably continue to change up their looks regularly. I had access to basically all the furniture I desired on the PTS, and I spent many hours just playing with different looks and configurations. It's just fun. So I don't think it would be too detrimental to have the mats a little easier to obtain. It's pretty exciting to come across a pattern that I've wanted, but seeing that I'll have to farm for the mats for possibly a few hours just to make the item a couple times is disheartening. (Plus I'm generous and I like to give people things!)

So for me I'm mostly happy with the way housing works, but I agree with those that say the drop rates on furniture mats is much too low. And I'm still hoping surveys will eventually drop them; that would certainly give me more incentive to complete my daily writs.

MarrazzMist

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

In 3 months people will sell green blueprints to NPC vendors.

Blueprints are not the problem. They drop in good pace and will be yours for ever.

Recremen

MarrazzMist wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

In 3 months people will sell green blueprints to NPC vendors.

Blueprints are not the problem. They drop in good pace and will be yours for ever.

Yeah I even said in the original post that this is completely tolerable. The only problem with it is that it is combined with incredibly rare material drop chances.

Shardaxx

I have all crafting maxed, all the skills I need plus a few I only swap in occasionally, and have 18 spare skill points. The key is collecting all the sky shards and doing all the quests that award a skill point for completion.

Recremen

Shardaxx wrote: »

I have all crafting maxed, all the skills I need plus a few I only swap in occasionally, and have 18 spare skill points. The key is collecting all the sky shards and doing all the quests that award a skill point for completion.

@Shardaxx

I also have all crafting skills maxed, that was not the issue! This is about how scarce the materials to make furniture are, not about the skill points needed. Anyone who had the foresight to make a master crafter is in the same boat, I'm sure.

ZurinArctus

Homestead is a disappointment in accessibility given the nature of the content.

I sincerely hope we see some of the suggested changes in this thread sooner than later!

Recremen

ZurinArctus wrote: »

Homestead is a disappointment in accessibility given the nature of the content.

I sincerely hope we see some of the suggested changes in this thread sooner than later!

Did you see the ESO Live? They were like "uuuuuuh so the SPARTAN look sure seems to be in right now! " They seemed very aware that something is not quite working as planned, and it gives me hope that there may be some adjustments on the way.

Chirru

Recremen wrote: »

We've known this would be the case since it first appeared on PTS, but I'll say it here now that it's live.

Furniture crafting is really cool in theory but completely impractical to get into. You cannot realistic furnish a home with this method.

The problem centers around a few major issues, only one of which is reasonable.

1. Crafting furniture requires a "plan/blueprint/etc." This could have gone either way in the design, with the end result looking either more like armor crafting or more like provisioning, and I don't consider it a major loss that it ended up looking like provisioning. Yes, it's a long grind and a long search for all the recipes, but as it compares to other systems in game it's pretty reasonable. Higher drop rates for blueprints could fix any undue strain, at the very least.
2. The plans require enormous amounts of materials. Even simple objects require a comparatively large amount of resources. Never mind that the resources make zero sense sometimes (as a friend asked, "why am I putting runestones IN MY BREAD??"). Even worse, objects require huge amounts of material regardless of their size or aesthetic impact. You need nearly as much material to make a tiny cup as you do a large brazier. I can't see this being fixed because it would require a lot of work going back through each recipe and fixing the bad decisions.
3. This one is the worst aspect. Furniture crafting base materials are scarce. VERY. SCARCE. I spent many hours last night farming materials and Ra Gada motif chapters and I would up with more motif chapters (3) than certain furniture crafting materials like Decorative Wax (0). SERIOUSLY, how did anyone think that was a good idea? I can make a full set of CP 160 gear of all armor types with the crafting materials I got, but I can't even make a green-quality table? Awful! This is the part that is not only easiest to change, but which would also have the most impact. Please, make furniture materials drop from every node, and make Decorative Wax drop literally ever, because right now it doesn't.

This is holding back what should a fun and engaging system. If I need to spend hours a day farming just to make a single furniture item then I won't even have a fully furnished large home by this time next year. That is not fun or engaging, it is debilitating.

You are right on all accounts. They want you to buy the stuff with real credits in the Store.
Online games today are all about money. real money. we are paying to have fun.

my thought. if something is not fun... i do not buy it at all; for real coin is the ONLY WAY
to get developers to provide a good product. stop buying rotten eggs.

SunfireKnight86

Recremen wrote: »

ZurinArctus wrote: »

Homestead is a disappointment in accessibility given the nature of the content.

I sincerely hope we see some of the suggested changes in this thread sooner than later!

Did you see the ESO Live? They were like "uuuuuuh so the SPARTAN look sure seems to be in right now! " They seemed very aware that something is not quite working as planned, and it gives me hope that there may be some adjustments on the way.

I think they assumed more people would drop crowns than have, if anything. The drops rates are working as intended, I have no doubt.

STEVIL

Asardes wrote: »

I see some people complaining they have not enough skill points to make a char master crafter in all 6 trades. That's plainly false. I've been able to get enough skill points on my main to fully spec all 6 crafting trades, spec all useful passives and also fully spec class skills, 4 weapon skills, 2 armor skills (and most passives in the 3rd), undaunted, fighters guild most skills in alliance war lines, and even some passives in ledgermain and thieves guild. Splitting is also bad because you need to relearn all motifs on all your chars, instead of just one. And they are quite pricey. I've spent more than 2.5M getting them all. Research can also proceed in parallel on the same char. Splitting the research in the same trade on multiple chars is even less efficient.

Agree but it may be a sign of the times.

My original mains went thru every zone doing all quests and shards etc and so have like 300+ skill points.

The ones who were at say vet 1-4 when vet levels went bye-bye and the ones leveled since - never did gold and silver content and so have less than 150 sp normally.

with legerdem, db, tg, wolf/vamp, etc it is extremely easy for characters who do not go the full monty anyhmore to not be able to see a road to all-six mastered.

Me, for my mains, it was no problem. i run 35 tier-10 writs a day but every character with six maxed or even more than three maxed crafts came to 160 before vet levels were dropped. Everyone else its 2-3 crafts maxed and not a lot of room left over after the outfitted skills for adventuring and what not.

STEVIL

SunfireKnight86 wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

ZurinArctus wrote: »

Homestead is a disappointment in accessibility given the nature of the content.

I sincerely hope we see some of the suggested changes in this thread sooner than later!

Did you see the ESO Live? They were like "uuuuuuh so the SPARTAN look sure seems to be in right now! " They seemed very aware that something is not quite working as planned, and it gives me hope that there may be some adjustments on the way.

I think they assumed more people would drop crowns than have, if anything. The drops rates are working as intended, I have no doubt.

i saw the same ESO live and i did not see confirmation of conspiracy theory armageddon in their comments, but skulduggery is in the eye of the beholder. I saw that as a slight bit of humor. they seemed more surprised at the over-the-top better ones - which happened really quick all things considered.

Where do i find those crystals BTW?


HINT: If they were trying to promote crown sale that ESo live would have focused on how cool things looked not including the spartan look joke. You don't promote crown sales by saying "see lotsa folks are not ahead of you."

Please think it thru.

I think it is going exactly as intended, bugs aside, in that they see the housing as a long term thing - not something where typical or even above average folks would be "done" with a marvelous furnished home by a massive whopping FIVE FRIGGIN DAYS after the release.

This was not, it seems obvious to me, intended as another wrothgar or tg or db where the main content would be done or could be done in-game in just a week.

They said it was putting the building blocks for the housing system in place for the future... and that it did... with a real obvious "this is not short term content" vibe running thru it.

I am sure a lot of folks are upset its not like alchemy or provisioning where in a few hours you can be top dog.

But on these very forums it is not uncommon to have threads which boil down to "whay can we get thru so quick? Why not more long time to solve content?"

So what they have done is put in place housing as a long term in-game content system and also added a crown store convenience/speed option for those who choose to make that decision.

The face of evil... no doubt.

bguile

Recremen wrote: »

Shardaxx wrote: »

I have all crafting maxed, all the skills I need plus a few I only swap in occasionally, and have 18 spare skill points. The key is collecting all the sky shards and doing all the quests that award a skill point for completion.

@Shardaxx

I also have all crafting skills maxed, that was not the issue! This is about how scarce the materials to make furniture are, not about the skill points needed. Anyone who had the foresight to make a master crafter is in the same boat, I'm sure.

Agree, especially in regards in to Heartwood. The rest I haven't had too many issues finding, but heartwood is frustrating. That and alot of the stuff I want to make requires it.

MrGorv

It would be great, if these materials started to drop in crates from usual crafting wrints instead of completely useless low-level materials. Would really help a lot.

Oronell

Question: Are there layers to furniture crafting? For example can I start the crafting process then pass the unfinished product off to another craftsman to complete?

Example: An Upholstered Chair requires Woodworking, Blacksmithing and Clothier. I use my woodworking and blacksmithing to complete the piece 2/3 of the way then hire or ask a friend with the required clothier skill to complete it for me.

It would be more interesting if the "best" items required some level of cooperation imo. I haven't touched furniture crafting yet so I'm truly interested in understanding how it works.

Asardes

STEVIL wrote: »

Asardes wrote: »

I see some people complaining they have not enough skill points to make a char master crafter in all 6 trades. That's plainly false. I've been able to get enough skill points on my main to fully spec all 6 crafting trades, spec all useful passives and also fully spec class skills, 4 weapon skills, 2 armor skills (and most passives in the 3rd), undaunted, fighters guild most skills in alliance war lines, and even some passives in ledgermain and thieves guild. Splitting is also bad because you need to relearn all motifs on all your chars, instead of just one. And they are quite pricey. I've spent more than 2.5M getting them all. Research can also proceed in parallel on the same char. Splitting the research in the same trade on multiple chars is even less efficient.

Agree but it may be a sign of the times.

My original mains went thru every zone doing all quests and shards etc and so have like 300+ skill points.

The ones who were at say vet 1-4 when vet levels went bye-bye and the ones leveled since - never did gold and silver content and so have less than 150 sp normally.

with legerdem, db, tg, wolf/vamp, etc it is extremely easy for characters who do not go the full monty anyhmore to not be able to see a road to all-six mastered.

Me, for my mains, it was no problem. i run 35 tier-10 writs a day but every character with six maxed or even more than three maxed crafts came to 160 before vet levels were dropped. Everyone else its 2-3 crafts maxed and not a lot of room left over after the outfitted skills for adventuring and what not.

No pain, no gain. I only run the writs on 3 chars and have plenty of gold tempers, kutas and 10-15K gold a day. Lately even extra consumable master writs from the alts which I pass on and complete on my main. I will now drive a 4th char trough the zones to finish his build and spec his crafting skills. I view my account as a well coordinated assembly line

BlackSparrow

Oronell wrote: »

Question: Are there layers to furniture crafting? For example can I start the crafting process then pass the unfinished product off to another craftsman to complete?

Example: An Upholstered Chair requires Woodworking, Blacksmithing and Clothier. I use my woodworking and blacksmithing to complete the piece 2/3 of the way then hire or ask a friend with the required clothier skill to complete it for me.

It would be more interesting if the "best" items required some level of cooperation imo. I haven't touched furniture crafting yet so I'm truly interested in understanding how it works.

Nope.

This is something I was hoping, and something I requested while it was in PTS, but like many such requests it went unheard.

Basically, how it works is that a blueprint/pattern/etc has a set of requirements in a crafting trait's primary leveling passive (Woodworking, Recipe Improvement, Solvent Proficiency, etc.), and some have multiple requirements (e.g., a fancy lamp may require 4 Metalworking, 8 Potency Improvement, and 6 Solvent Proficiency). If the character crafting the item doesn't meet all requirements, they can't craft it.

Krainor1974

It should just use regular wood , bars , etc , cloth combos to craft items. I was hoping to see furniture take the color of the wood such as oak, pine, oak even ruby ash could been modeled after red wood trees.

Wreuntzylla

Chirru wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

We've known this would be the case since it first appeared on PTS, but I'll say it here now that it's live.

Furniture crafting is really cool in theory but completely impractical to get into. You cannot realistic furnish a home with this method.

The problem centers around a few major issues, only one of which is reasonable.

1. Crafting furniture requires a "plan/blueprint/etc." This could have gone either way in the design, with the end result looking either more like armor crafting or more like provisioning, and I don't consider it a major loss that it ended up looking like provisioning. Yes, it's a long grind and a long search for all the recipes, but as it compares to other systems in game it's pretty reasonable. Higher drop rates for blueprints could fix any undue strain, at the very least.
2. The plans require enormous amounts of materials. Even simple objects require a comparatively large amount of resources. Never mind that the resources make zero sense sometimes (as a friend asked, "why am I putting runestones IN MY BREAD??"). Even worse, objects require huge amounts of material regardless of their size or aesthetic impact. You need nearly as much material to make a tiny cup as you do a large brazier. I can't see this being fixed because it would require a lot of work going back through each recipe and fixing the bad decisions.
3. This one is the worst aspect. Furniture crafting base materials are scarce. VERY. SCARCE. I spent many hours last night farming materials and Ra Gada motif chapters and I would up with more motif chapters (3) than certain furniture crafting materials like Decorative Wax (0). SERIOUSLY, how did anyone think that was a good idea? I can make a full set of CP 160 gear of all armor types with the crafting materials I got, but I can't even make a green-quality table? Awful! This is the part that is not only easiest to change, but which would also have the most impact. Please, make furniture materials drop from every node, and make Decorative Wax drop literally ever, because right now it doesn't.

This is holding back what should a fun and engaging system. If I need to spend hours a day farming just to make a single furniture item then I won't even have a fully furnished large home by this time next year. That is not fun or engaging, it is debilitating.

You are right on all accounts. They want you to buy the stuff with real credits in the Store.
Online games today are all about money. real money. we are paying to have fun.

my thought. if something is not fun... i do not buy it at all; for real coin is the ONLY WAY
to get developers to provide a good product. stop buying rotten eggs.

Crown store exclusives is how they should make money. The exclusives should be convenience and not a furniture limit.

For example, a target dummy upgrade that gives you a parse in the chat window when you kill it. Or upgrades to your furnishings to make them actually work, like 10 slot upgrades to wardrobes, and 50 slot upgrades to chests. That sort of thing is purely convenience and doesn't stop anyone from furnishing their home the way they like.

Oronell

BlackSparrow wrote: »

Oronell wrote: »

Question: Are there layers to furniture crafting? For example can I start the crafting process then pass the unfinished product off to another craftsman to complete?

Example: An Upholstered Chair requires Woodworking, Blacksmithing and Clothier. I use my woodworking and blacksmithing to complete the piece 2/3 of the way then hire or ask a friend with the required clothier skill to complete it for me.

It would be more interesting if the "best" items required some level of cooperation imo. I haven't touched furniture crafting yet so I'm truly interested in understanding how it works.

Nope.

This is something I was hoping, and something I requested while it was in PTS, but like many such requests it went unheard.

Basically, how it works is that a blueprint/pattern/etc has a set of requirements in a crafting trait's primary leveling passive (Woodworking, Recipe Improvement, Solvent Proficiency, etc.), and some have multiple requirements (e.g., a fancy lamp may require 4 Metalworking, 8 Potency Improvement, and 6 Solvent Proficiency). If the character crafting the item doesn't meet all requirements, they can't craft it.

Well that sucks.

Iarao

M0bi wrote: »

it would logically take more skill and materials to craft a cuirass than a table........

of course we wouldnt be making stuff with others; all done on OUR own toons. we would start on one toon, then pass the item to the next, and etc until the pc was done. this would allow those who split their crafting to make items right now. but i agree that we did have to suffer some to get all our crafts on one toon. i died. alot. why? cuz i had to carefully balance fighting and crafting. of course NOW you can go anywhere you want to get those shards. back in the day? you had to creep around much higher level deadly things cuz if you got caught, you were dead. and waiting for someone to show up at delves to help fight. i spent a lot of time getting shards to get those points to spend. and then you got stuck at coldharbor. no going there if you were too low. so now no more extra points to spend until you got there cuz you got all the skyshards in your faction. oh yeah, no hopping to other factions for those shards, either. not until after you got cadwell's silver quest after coldharbour. it is MUCH MUCH MUCH easier to craft all on one now. so quit bitching and get to leveling another toon already.