Cheat Engine and VMA and You

Idinuse

Wollust wrote: »

Good times when everyone who is good at the game is being accused of cheating

Ya. They should blame the cheaters, and even engage in fighting them as it would be in their interest, if that is the case.

MEBengalsFan2001

Sharee wrote: »

FrostFallFox wrote: »

Maybe they're just that good at VMA?

I look at it this way. History has shown that anytime it is possible for people(in general) to cheat at something, they will. It also has been proven that it is possible to cheat in ESO (that meteor spam video is still out there somewhere).

Thus, it is a given that cheaters do exist in ESO. And if they do, chances are they are the ones with exceptional VMA scores (since they cheat, obviously). That does not mean everyone with an exceptional VMA score is a cheater, but there is a high probability the cheaters will be found on that top-performer list.

I agree with this 100% People tend to find means to achieve what they want, legal or illegal. If you are unskilled or not as skilled as top players you will do whatever it takes to get better. In some MMOs this includes using more money up front to get best gear. Other games, it is cheating. In ESO I would state cheating happens but why monitor solo content, seriously?

danno8

Wollust wrote: »

Good times when everyone who is good at the game is being accused of cheating

I mentioned in a thread a couple weeks ago that I soloed Veteran Direfrost Keep, and even that was called "suspicious" by some.

In regards to vMSA, yes OP, some people really are that much better/faster than you are. They have done it hundreds and hundreds of times.

FriedEggSandwich

I like to think the vast majority on the leader-boards would have too much to lose to risk possibly getting banned. Besides, unless you're actually in a position where you believe you could be in the number one spot but are being held back by cheaters why should it worry you? I find it hard to believe there could be any more than one or two that cheat. I'm lucky if I stay on the weekly leader-board, so the fact I'm not number one has nothing to do with people cheating. Maybe I'm just naive and un-competitive.

I think zos are quite proud of their trials, they haven't been afraid to reset leader-boards in the past. Personally I trust they have their eye on things.

StackonClown

ok so what im hearing is from some people:

- noone really uses cheat engine or other 3rd party tool any more or ever, in particular 'good' players in VMA
- cheat engine is only ever used in PVP, if at all
- ZOS probably doesnt need any type of cheat detection any more
- somehow the previous plague of cheat engine in particular in PVP has now completely been self-resolved and no longer a problem

im not really convinced, but that is just my opinion..

kevlarto_ESO

I know the cheat engine is alive and well in this game or some other cheat, seen a guy in craglorn jumping way up in the air and back down and when he seen me he stopped, like other have pointed out seems like zos does not want to spend the money or the effort to get rid of cheaters, I guess they do not understand how this hurts the game and the bad reputation they get from letting cheaters have free reign in the game.

Other companies go to great lengths to get rid of cheaters and exploiters not zos all are welcome here it seems, this place is turning to a wretched hive of scum and villainy

In pvp when I am encountering known cheaters I just move some where else, to me denying the cheaters a chance to get easy AP is a win to me. It's a shame they at exploiting the leaderboard in pve.

I remember the day the cheat engine was exposed in pvp, all those, god like players died like everyone else, maybe a little easier because they had been using that cheat crutch for so long, we had a week of great pvp and it even felt balanced, with the cheat engine does not matter what zos does when it comes to balance can't have balance with cheater programs running. Now lets throw in that intrusive add on I wonder if zos will ever adjust the API to cancel that out.

There are good players in this game even a few pro players, but they are over shadowed by the cheaters that run rampant in this game.

FriedEggSandwich

StackonClown wrote: »

ok so what im hearing is from some people:

- noone really uses cheat engine or other 3rd party tool any more or ever, in particular 'good' players in VMA
- cheat engine is only ever used in PVP, if at all
- ZOS probably doesnt need any type of cheat detection any more
- somehow the previous plague of cheat engine in particular in PVP has now completely been self-resolved and no longer a problem

im not really convinced, but that is just my opinion..

Nobody knows, it's all speculation, it just depends on whether your glass is half full or half empty. The only thing you can be certain of is that it's in the interest of zos to know. But then things have come out of the blue before and taken them by surprise, or so it seemed. So who knows.

zyk

This topic was a debacle months ago. ZOS shuts down all threads on the subject and funnels them into stickies.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/272833/cheating-and-exploits

ESO is extremely vulnerable to memory hacking. The client appears to be far more trusted than is necessary. There are no apparent security mechanisms akin to VAC. The most ZOS seems to do is attempt to obfuscate memory addresses which, of course, only helps for a short time.

When widespread memory hacking was proven to exist, ZOS management chose to sweep the issue under the rug instead of having a come-to-jesus moment.

This game has no competitive integrity. It should not be taken seriously at a competitive level.

Trottz

StackonClown wrote: »

ok so what im hearing is from some people:

- noone really uses cheat engine or other 3rd party tool any more or ever, in particular 'good' players in VMA
- cheat engine is only ever used in PVP, if at all
- ZOS probably doesnt need any type of cheat detection any more
- somehow the previous plague of cheat engine in particular in PVP has now completely been self-resolved and no longer a problem

im not really convinced, but that is just my opinion..

such a smart Alias and that's all you hear/read? c'mon

there are serious Pros out there, making serious money.

edit: I mean. this is not just some subliminal Ad, right? lol

StackonClown

Trottz wrote: »

such a smart Alias and that's all you hear/read? c'mon ==> thanks, i guess

there are serious Pros out there, making serious money.

Making 'serious money' from what?

EnviousStruggle

shhhhh

not here pls

rfennell_ESO

StackonClown wrote: »

Maybe Lance Armstrong was that good at the Tour de France?

For every 2 or 3 people that were wearing "live strong" bracelets and cheering at Lance... there were some of us that were suspicious or just flat out knew he was doping.

It's a hard line to define, many reasonable people will fall for amazing performance above others as natural...

DurzoBlint13

vMA is all some solo players do. I could believe that some are just that good at it. However, when Text Chat first came to console there were a lot of people advertising their services to take people through vMA. You give them your account info and they beat it for you, getting you a weapon. I saw it for 100K gold for them to do the run and another 50K if they get you leaderboards. I even saw people asking real money for it too. If they can cheat, they will cheat. Very little will be done about it even if they are caught cheating. Probably the same consequences as the a-holes that abused the banker/survey glitch and made millions off it- a slap on the wrist and no real punishment

GreenhaloX

All I can say is speculation and highly suspicious.. when anyone can breeze through all stages of vMA without getting a scratch off their health bar. There are quite a few of these youtube clips showing such. However, they are also a few that seem quite legitimate; particularly the no-death runs showing DKs with 2H. You can actually see their health depleting when being pommeled and seeing them using vigor or something to regen; whereas, the other suspicious ones just showing the toons breezing through and dpsing the adds and bosses down like hot knife on butter, and rarely do you see any health regen skill being used. Certain clips even show the shield are (seemingly) continuously active on the toon or lasting much longer than what is the norm.

Anyways, not hating. It is just a video game. If they are cheating or using CE, it is interesting to watch someone so easily breezed through vMA; versus when I go through it, I'm being pommeled left and right and having to constantly spam my shield and vigor.

StackonClown

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

StackonClown wrote: »

Maybe Lance Armstrong was that good at the Tour de France?

For every 2 or 3 people that were wearing "live strong" bracelets and cheering at Lance... there were some of us that were suspicious or just flat out knew he was doping.

It's a hard line to define, many reasonable people will fall for amazing performance above others as natural...

I remember I was suspicious of Lance and the Tour de France way before he was exposed - and had curiously similar discussions with Lance believers at the time... 'He just has amazing VO2 max', 'his heart is unusally large', 'he has an amazing mix of genes' etc etc... of course I was only speculating, but let's get real - in elite sport there STILL is 'cheating' out there, and that IS 'serious money'

captainwolfos

SanSan wrote: »

I don't get why these cheat/hacking programs aren't illegal or taken down.

Because not everyone uses them to actually cheat.

For example, back when Dragon Age Inquisition was released, Cheat Engine was one of the few ways to change your Skyhold pyjamas (the default outfit when wandering the hub, which was later revealed to be a bug).

Not all who use Cheat Engine are cheaters, despite the unfortunate name. Though anyone who uses it in a multiplayer game, and therefore bringing the experience down for everyone else, deserves anything they get. Keep it to single player, folks.

danno8

StackonClown wrote: »

ok so what im hearing is from some people:

- noone really uses cheat engine or other 3rd party tool any more or ever, in particular 'good' players in VMA
- cheat engine is only ever used in PVP, if at all
- ZOS probably doesnt need any type of cheat detection any more
- somehow the previous plague of cheat engine in particular in PVP has now completely been self-resolved and no longer a problem

im not really convinced, but that is just my opinion..

Well from reading your OP and response what I am hearing is:

-everyone better than me needs to somehow prove they are not cheating or I suspect they are;
-the onus is on everyone to prove a negative (something that is impossible to do);
-a straw man argument that people are saying things are 100% ok, when that is not what anyone is saying at all

People are cheating, there is no doubt about that. Someone will always find a way. But throwing around the term at the general population as a whole is too much. And directing it at individuals at the top of the leaderboards without proof is not only bad, it's possibly actionable against you if you get too specific.

danno8

Oh and yes ZoS does actively monitor for some cheats in game. I know this because there was anit-cheat software added to the game back during the now infamous "Lighting Patch" (1.3 in or around). The game had a horrible fps drop on that day (1-2fps in Cyrodiil) and recovered after two more patches to a less than stellar frame rate.

It has never been quite the same. That is how we know that piece of anti-cheat software is still running at least.

timidobserver

Most of the time, I don't take any scores of anyone that has ever been permabanned seriously. Everyone else gets the benefit of the doubt.

ArchMikem

danno8 wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

Good times when everyone who is good at the game is being accused of cheating

I mentioned in a thread a couple weeks ago that I soloed Veteran Direfrost Keep, and even that was called "suspicious" by some.

In regards to vMSA, yes OP, some people really are that much better/faster than you are. They have done it hundreds and hundreds of times.

Isnt Direfrost one of the dungeons that require multiple players or else you cant progress? So yeah, the suspicion is legit.

DRXHarbinger

WTB cheat engine for XB. Plz add to crown store.

SirAndy

bitels wrote: »

There are videos of whole runs where ppl are getting best scores, which is quite strong evidence that you can achieve it without cheating. If they use CE on any point someone would notice.

No you wouldn't. That's not how CE and similar programs work ...

Gladium

Here is how I see it:

ESO has a skill ceiling. There are a few players who have reached it, and they sit at the top of the leaderboards.

If a cheat that would benefit you in vMA exists, then someone is bound to use it. If someone who have reached the skill ceiling uses the cheat, they will become number one.

EDIT: Here is an example of someone at the competitive level in a different game called SMITE seeing through walls using a cheat:

https://youtu.be/p4JpCmaexWw

Someone being great at the game does not mean they will never cheat if that can make them even better.

arena25

Mate, I do appreciate the occasional reminder to be on the lookout for people who are cheating, but I think this thread will be shut down soon with a link to the sticky at the top of these forums.

Kodrac

I don't think it's too far out reach for someone to be that good at it. it's scripted. Once you learn it on one, apply to your other runs. Learn your character, learn the strats. It's not that inconceivable.

Karius_Imalthar

I suppose there are people out there who enjoy memorizing minutiae and repeating something endlessly who can master vMA legitimately.

DRXHarbinger

SirAndy wrote: »

bitels wrote: »

There are videos of whole runs where ppl are getting best scores, which is quite strong evidence that you can achieve it without cheating. If they use CE on any point someone would notice.

No you wouldn't. That's not how CE and similar programs work ...

I've seen YT vids...everything's looks perfectly fine. ...but that ulti gain seems a little high. Not stupid by way way way faster than my exact same build generates it. Subtle mods like that will always go unnoticed to 99% of us.

Juhasow

Lets ban everyone. Problem solved thread closed

DHale

You are delusional to think the best players are cheating. A lot of the best one do it on twitch stream and get great scores while you are watching them. Many have you tube videos doing the best scores on different toons. You can see the buffs the ult gen, the damage. They just really don't need to cheat they have run it over 100 times. Some have run it three hundred plus times.

danno8

ArchMikem wrote: »

danno8 wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

Good times when everyone who is good at the game is being accused of cheating

I mentioned in a thread a couple weeks ago that I soloed Veteran Direfrost Keep, and even that was called "suspicious" by some.

In regards to vMSA, yes OP, some people really are that much better/faster than you are. They have done it hundreds and hundreds of times.

Isnt Direfrost one of the dungeons that require multiple players or else you cant progress? So yeah, the suspicion is legit.

@ArchMikem Nope I explained exactly how I got through the gates, and was quoted directly. It was the actual fight the person had troubles with.