Do not buy Crown Crates!!!

Suter1972

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Your opinion was to tell us to shut up. Mine was to say no.

Every crown protest thread is locked except this one. That's a fact. If you don't like the protesting, don't read the thread. And that's not a demand. It's advise based on common sense logic.

As for protests ruining the game... lol. Btw, telling everyone to shut up is not irrelevant... it's actually just pointless, which is what I said.

@Bryanonymous

Can you clarify or even show in your fancy bold text where I said for everyone to ‘shut up’… (your words)

I can see where I said, ‘move on’…. I can see where I referenced toxcity’, but for the life of me I cant find the words you claim I said.

Or maybe that just you putting words in other mouths again?

Bryanonymous

Suter1972 wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Your opinion was to tell us to shut up. Mine was to say no.

Every crown protest thread is locked except this one. That's a fact. If you don't like the protesting, don't read the thread. And that's not a demand. It's advise based on common sense logic.

As for protests ruining the game... lol. Btw, telling everyone to shut up is not irrelevant... it's actually just pointless, which is what I said.

@Bryanonymous

Can you clarify or even show in your fancy bold text where I said for everyone to ‘shut up’… (your words)

I can see where I said, ‘move on’…. I can see where I referenced toxcity’, but for the life of me I cant find the words you claim I said.

Or maybe that just you putting words in other mouths again?

The intent was obvious. And move on? How long have they been out? All of about 5 days? Smh. How about you accept that you don't decide when enough time has passed for us to move on. You move on... away from one thread protesting the release of a scam only 5 days ago. Again: 1 thread. Only 1. You don't like it, too bad.

JimT722

You can thank Dark Brotherhood and One Tamriel for that. I doubt anyone is buying eso to gamble.

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

I've seen a ton more people come flooding back to ESO recently, I myself quit for about a year since it was a ghost town before even last month was kind of dead, but now its really starting to flourish

petraeus1

Suter1972 wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Your opinion was to tell us to shut up. Mine was to say no.

Every crown protest thread is locked except this one. That's a fact. If you don't like the protesting, don't read the thread. And that's not a demand. It's advise based on common sense logic.

As for protests ruining the game... lol. Btw, telling everyone to shut up is not irrelevant... it's actually just pointless, which is what I said.

@Bryanonymous

Can you clarify or even show in your fancy bold text where I said for everyone to ‘shut up’… (your words)

I can see where I said, ‘move on’…. I can see where I referenced toxcity’, but for the life of me I cant find the words you claim I said.

Or maybe that just you putting words in other mouths again?

If you and @Bryanonymous could keep your fight over who said what out of this public thread that is opened to discuss the concept of Crown Crates, that would be very much beneficial to those who are still interested in joining that discussion.

Cpt_Teemo

Yeah I was thinking about just subbing up to gain access to content not to buy gamble packs like Swtor 2.0

Suter1972

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Your opinion was to tell us to shut up. Mine was to say no.

Every crown protest thread is locked except this one. That's a fact. If you don't like the protesting, don't read the thread. And that's not a demand. It's advise based on common sense logic.

As for protests ruining the game... lol. Btw, telling everyone to shut up is not irrelevant... it's actually just pointless, which is what I said.

@Bryanonymous

Can you clarify or even show in your fancy bold text where I said for everyone to ‘shut up’… (your words)

I can see where I said, ‘move on’…. I can see where I referenced toxcity’, but for the life of me I cant find the words you claim I said.

Or maybe that just you putting words in other mouths again?

The intent was obvious. And move on? How long have they been out? All of about 5 days? Smh. How about you accept that you don't decide when enough time has passed for us to move on. You move on.

@Bryanonymous

ah, right... 'intent'.... you get to decide my 'intent' now... i get it. Its a one way street

but seriously....is this like one of those phone calls where it goes 'you hang up'... 'no you hang up first'.....'no I insist, you hang up'

As much as I love to see you constantly arguing for the sake of it, ive got a life outside of forums (its called REAL life) so on this occasion, I'll take you advice and I will 'move on'....

Bryanonymous

petraeus1 wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Your opinion was to tell us to shut up. Mine was to say no.

Every crown protest thread is locked except this one. That's a fact. If you don't like the protesting, don't read the thread. And that's not a demand. It's advise based on common sense logic.

As for protests ruining the game... lol. Btw, telling everyone to shut up is not irrelevant... it's actually just pointless, which is what I said.

@Bryanonymous

Can you clarify or even show in your fancy bold text where I said for everyone to ‘shut up’… (your words)

I can see where I said, ‘move on’…. I can see where I referenced toxcity’, but for the life of me I cant find the words you claim I said.

Or maybe that just you putting words in other mouths again?

If you and @Bryanonymous could keep your fight over who said what out of this public thread that is opened to discuss the concept of Crown Crates, that would be very much beneficial to those who are still interested in joining that discussion.

The attitude expressed by the person is relevant though. Content comes out that people don't like. One thread is allowed for negative feedback. Heros come in and try to dictate that we all just shut up and move on. Relevant because this is how stuff like this will continue to lower the bar until the game is not worth playing. The one place people tried to voice their opinions, they were mobbed by shills who couldn't stand that just one thread was allowed to remain open.

Suter1972 wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Your opinion was to tell us to shut up. Mine was to say no.

Every crown protest thread is locked except this one. That's a fact. If you don't like the protesting, don't read the thread. And that's not a demand. It's advise based on common sense logic.

As for protests ruining the game... lol. Btw, telling everyone to shut up is not irrelevant... it's actually just pointless, which is what I said.

@Bryanonymous

Can you clarify or even show in your fancy bold text where I said for everyone to ‘shut up’… (your words)

I can see where I said, ‘move on’…. I can see where I referenced toxcity’, but for the life of me I cant find the words you claim I said.

Or maybe that just you putting words in other mouths again?

The intent was obvious. And move on? How long have they been out? All of about 5 days? Smh. How about you accept that you don't decide when enough time has passed for us to move on. You move on.

@Bryanonymous

ah, right... 'intent'.... you get to decide my 'intent' now... i get it. Its a one way street

but seriously....is this like one of those phone calls where it goes 'you hang up'... 'no you hang up first'.....'no I insist, you hang up'

As much as I love to see you constantly arguing for the sake of it, ive got a life outside of forums (its called REAL life) so on this occasion, I'll take you advice and I will 'move on'....

I didn't decide your intent. I interpreted it for what it was. Your words were clear. You want us to just move on because it's ruining your game. Coming into the one complaint thread to complain about complainers. I know you think you're clever, but you're not. And I'm done arguing with you over petty off topic banter.

copito

I spent 3000 Crown points and got literally crap!! Two Soul Shriven costumes and two pets.. the rest lots of pots, one riding lesson and 2 Exp Scrolls... not worth the money... but hey.. try your luck.. ;D

JimT722

Bryanonymous wrote: »

petraeus1 wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Your opinion was to tell us to shut up. Mine was to say no.

Every crown protest thread is locked except this one. That's a fact. If you don't like the protesting, don't read the thread. And that's not a demand. It's advise based on common sense logic.

As for protests ruining the game... lol. Btw, telling everyone to shut up is not irrelevant... it's actually just pointless, which is what I said.

@Bryanonymous

Can you clarify or even show in your fancy bold text where I said for everyone to ‘shut up’… (your words)

I can see where I said, ‘move on’…. I can see where I referenced toxcity’, but for the life of me I cant find the words you claim I said.

Or maybe that just you putting words in other mouths again?

If you and @Bryanonymous could keep your fight over who said what out of this public thread that is opened to discuss the concept of Crown Crates, that would be very much beneficial to those who are still interested in joining that discussion.

The attitude expressed by the person is relevant though. Content comes out that people don't like. One thread is allowed for negative feedback. Heros come in and try to dictate that we all just shut up and move on. Relevant because this is how stuff like this will continue to lower the bar until the game is not worth playing. The one place people tried to voice their opinions, they were mobbed by shills who couldn't stand that just one thread was allowed to remain open.

It doesn't matter they will get their way. There are too many clueless people.

They will defend them to death because the crates are optional.

What they won't do is
1. Provide examples of past games they played that had a similar implementation and got better
2. Do any research on these scams made popular in f2p games
3. Provide any article or other source of information that defends the implementation of these things

User_Name

Everyone is entitled to an informed opinion.

Key word in italics.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Suter1972 wrote: »

I find it ironic that the reason ive turned away from the forums over the last week wasn't because of anything that ZOS has done.

Its because of the toxicity some have to others over their opinions on Crates.

Its almost like the crate haters (I bought some and had good value) need to find any reason possible to spread ill feeling over something they don't agree with. Its not enough that they have free choice if to buy or not (plenty of people in game have by the looks of it), but they need to keep banging on and on about it.

Just move on for christs sake. Its less than 3 weeks to Christmas and some people are getting their knickers in such a twist.

Buy crates - or dont but.....Good will to all men and all that....

I think the "hate towards boxes" expands to "hate towards people who buy boxes".
These crate-haters want some of the stuff that's currently locked behind the RNG-crates. But they don't want to pay the extra price for it (since obviously, in most cases you'll pay more with crates than you would with direct purchase).
But if there was noone to buy them, there would be no crates. Thus the growing "hate" towards crate-buyers, more or less hidden behind or sugarcoated with morals and concern for the future of the game and all that.

I logged into the game on saturday and.... waaaawwww... I was quite stunned. I expected to see a couple a atro mounts and stuff, but I didn't expect that much. I didn't that people would throw themselves at those boxes like bees on honey. I didn't expect people to brag with that kind of stuff. I didn't think real money had so little value in so many people's eyes... Just... wowwww...
My point being : can you really blame ZOS if there are so many consenting victims willing to spend their money on RNG-crates ?

Nyx2

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Nyx2 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Nyx2 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

JimT722 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

KingMagaw wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

National Problem Gambling Helpline Network (1-800-522-4700).

Every ethical gambling company posts the odds of winning AND provides information on how to get help. Las vegas is required by the Nevada Gaming commission to both post odds of every game and provide resources to fight gambling addiction.

Totally agree. I have a friend who had to go to gambling rehab and 8 months and now these gambling cash grab crates have been added to the game is a disgrace, especially without any odds being stated, which clearly reinforces the poor drop rates.

Why are people being subjected and advertised to gamble real money in a game is beyond unethical. It is just another point of why not to sub or support Z0$ and there continued incompetence.

And yet you still play their game, just don't support them and call them unethical?! What a hypocrite. If you feel that strongly about their company why are you still indulging in their product?

All you people that call them unethical, greedy, and incompetent while still playing their game for free disgust me.

You assume these people are playing it for free. The pro-crate attitude disgusts me.

If you read the post that I quoted it's not an assumption. It was clearly stated that he plays without subbing or supporting the company.

I'm not pro-crate, I pro choice.

They are not pro-choice. The very mechanism of hiding new items away in RNG crates removes my ability to choose to purchase what I want.

No it doesn't. You know how to get the item you want. It boils down to if you CHOOSE to spend possibly more than the item is worth to you. Your choice is to either buy the boxes for the CHANCE at the item you want, or don't buy the boxes at all and not get the item at all.

Sometimes in life you don't get everything you want in exactly the way that you want it.

Yet they implement this to bloat prices. In a fashion that is very dishonest. You may be okay with a company that implements a blatant ripoff but many aren't. Most won't know how low a chance they have either. ZOS isn't forthcoming with that information so some will be deceived into thinking they have a much better chance than they actually do.

I have to disagree. They have NOT been dishonest on these crates. They are working EXACTLY as they presented to us. Your personal decision is if they way they work is of value to you or not.

I'm ok with the company presenting these as I do not feel that they are doing anything wrong. I personally don't find enough value to actually BUY into the crate thing, but I can't in good conscience condemn something that I'm not really against.

Yet another person that doesn't actively support crown crates but still thinks he knows best what others should pay / find acceptable. This is getting laughable. If you haven't figured it out: we're well aware that gambling by default doesn't promise anything. That doesn't really answer much of what we're saying other than your nitpicking over terms.

How about you respond to the more important matters? And what do you value then? If you think crown crates aren't worth their money then why just sit by and let them continue with these anti-consumer practices? Or if you're not interested in crown store content at all then why are you participating in a discussion regarding our money? There have been enough of those exact people speaking in favor of crates and it's as nonsensical as a PvE-only player dictating to ZoS how cyrodiil should work.

I don't recall a single post that I have made stating that I think I know what is best for anyone.

What do I value? The exact thing that I have stated time and time again - choice.

The company has the absolute right to take the product in ANY way they choose. It is their right and their gamble to do so.

The consumer has the right to choose to participate or not 100%

I personally have the right to participate in an open forum discussion regarding ANYTHING posted on a public forum. Who in the hell are you to imply otherwise? Just because I don't agree with your doom and gloom, doesn't make me wrong

Oh, you do. Your whole argument is that we should shut up and respect their decision because... because they can. Thank you for giving us the answer we've all been waiting for! Not only does that wipe away all our concerns of ZoS going the same P2W route other MMOs have gone but it makes so much sense now why we as costumers shouldn't oppose being ripped off.

You're not "wrong", you're an egoist that is perfectly fine to deny others what they enjoy as long as it doesn't affect you. You don't even have anything of significance to say, you're just regurgitating the same redundant stuff over and over again. "They can do what they like, you don't have to buy it". It is acknowledged but irrelevant.

We're not discussing whether this is legal or whether they can or can't do this. We point out that this business model does nothing but rip people off and that we as paying costumers aren't willing to support a game like that. In fact any person that even remotely cares about the game would not jump to the defense of such cash grab. But you seem to lack any will of your own and are satisfied as long as everyone can have their freedom even though that isn't what we are discussing in any way.

You not being involved in the process yourself spreads a similar kind of ignorance that people with uninformed opinions have. You either can't comprehend our position as costumers or cowardly support ZoS because it doesn't affect you. Your input is especially useless to ZoS since you're not willing to spend the money anyway.


You again? I think you still have to recover from that severe case of hypocrisy before I waste any more time on that.

Nyx2 wrote: »

If this was done to an aspect of the game you consider worthwhile you admit you would quit the game but as long as it's cosmetics any objection are just whiny "social justice warriors".

Unlike you that would just quit and can't even be consistent with his own logic, we do something in order to prevent it. It's hard to believe any of you even play this game.

So I guess if I don't agree with you, my opinion isn't valid - got it. I'M the egoist. I'll have to remember that in the future - thank you for turning my whole life around.

It doesn't look like you have an opinion. You're robotically telling us what ZoS is allowed to do and that's it. I don't see you engage with anything else. You give no reason as to why these crates aren't bad, no reason why players shouldn't oppose this cash grab, no nothing. But if summing up my post like that makes you feel better about your lack of argumentation go right ahead.

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

EZgoin76 wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

I only bought 4 crates at 400 crowns each. Each crate's contents value on the crown store far exceeded the 400 crowns so I can not call it a rip off or a scam as long as you don't count on getting that one thing you have your heart set on every time. I was lucky and got the mount I wanted in the 4th crate, but was not disappointed in the useful poisons, pets, tattoos, hats and mimic stones I received in the other crates. In other words I more than got my monies worth.

So as long as you don't actually want anything and just feel the need to spend crowns on who-cares-what, they're a great deal, but if you actually want something they're a total scam, got it.

That is the complete and total BS way of understanding what they are. It can't be a scam because YOU ALL KNOW EXACTLY what they are. And ZOS explained how they work. They aren't forced upon anyone. You make the decision if you are going to give it a shot. There is no scam.

The scam is putting this stuff in crates to begin with instead of just selling things outright in the store.

We know what they are but not what we're getting. Huge difference there. Get it?

And from my opinion if this case were to lets say go in front of the Honorable Judge Judy, you guys wouldn't have a case (the case being that you claim ZOS is doing people dirty) and it would be dismissed. And she would tell you to protest all you want.

Nyx2 wrote: »

We're not discussing whether this is legal or whether they can or can't do this. We point out that this business model does nothing but rip people off and that we as paying costumers aren't willing to support a game like that. In fact any person that even remotely cares about the game would not jump to the defense of such cash grab. But you seem to lack any will of your own and are satisfied as long as everyone can have their freedom even though that isn't what we are discussing in any way.

You were just mentioned in this post yet here you go again talking about this exact thing... again. How much more do you need to be spoon fed to understand this?? Instead of looking for fancy pictures you should put some more effort into the thought process that goes into writing this nonsense.

Every post you ramble on about ZoS freedom to make stupid decision but somehow you lack the self respect to have any freedom of your own and oppose their cash grab. And your only reason for that? You're not interested in crates. What kinda moronic way is that to justify crown crates?! Because you don't care it's ok that others pay 100 $ for a mount? A price you yourself wouldn't pay? Where is your freedom? You just let ZoS waltz over you because they have every right to abuse their costumers. What a joke.

You said you would quit the game if they did this to an aspect of the game you consider important which clearly shows you are not in support of it. So why support it just because it doesn't affect you? Why do I even have to explain this, this should be so obvious. You even questioned me for calling it "anti-consumer". If something that makes you quit the game isn't anti-consumer then I don't know what is. You just spindle on like that from one nonsensical argument to the next. And for the most part you make them because you're not involved and keep making double standards which you don't even apply to yourself.

What now? A cheap joke and a picture to distract everyone from the dishonesty I keep pointing out? Whatever it is you do, don't repeat that same garbage of how this is legal, that we don't have to buy it or how casinos work. We know that and it has nothing to do with our arguments.

Suter1972 wrote: »

User_Name wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

text

Making posts combating those who seek to ensure rights for everyone, including you, seems mind-numbingly counter-productive.

Woah..... my rights are fine thanks. I like the crates. I dont need the haters speaking for me or wanting stuff i like removed. I like them. I can afford them and ive not become an addict.

We don't really care whether you "like" them or not, we want to hear why you think these are good. There is already math on the consumables being of less value than if you just bought them off the store. The gem conversion is miserable and you'll constantly end up with content you never wanted. The simple question is why would you as costumer desire such a rip off instead of direct purchases?

They are objectively bad in their value, they're anti-consumer and frankly I don't know how anyone knowing this can still jump to their defense, begging ZoS to take more of their money. It makes no sense and saying you like them gets across nothing.

notimetocare

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

National Problem Gambling Helpline Network (1-800-522-4700).

Every ethical gambling company posts the odds of winning AND provides information on how to get help. Las vegas is required by the Nevada Gaming commission to both post odds of every game and provide resources to fight gambling addiction.

One difference is the win chance for crown crates is 100%. Sure you could win a penny, but you never strictly lose

JimT722

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

I find it ironic that the reason ive turned away from the forums over the last week wasn't because of anything that ZOS has done.

Its because of the toxicity some have to others over their opinions on Crates.

Its almost like the crate haters (I bought some and had good value) need to find any reason possible to spread ill feeling over something they don't agree with. Its not enough that they have free choice if to buy or not (plenty of people in game have by the looks of it), but they need to keep banging on and on about it.

Just move on for christs sake. Its less than 3 weeks to Christmas and some people are getting their knickers in such a twist.

Buy crates - or dont but.....Good will to all men and all that....

I think the "hate towards boxes" expands to "hate towards people who buy boxes".
These crate-haters want some of the stuff that's currently locked behind the RNG-crates. But they don't want to pay the extra price for it (since obviously, in most cases you'll pay more with crates than you would with direct purchase).
But if there was noone to buy them, there would be no crates. Thus the growing "hate" towards crate-buyers, more or less hidden behind or sugarcoated with morals and concern for the future of the game and all that.

I logged into the game on saturday and.... waaaawwww... I was quite stunned. I expected to see a couple a atro mounts and stuff, but I didn't expect that much. I didn't that people would throw themselves at those boxes like bees on honey. I didn't expect people to brag with that kind of stuff. I didn't think real money had so little value in so many people's eyes... Just... wowwww...
My point being : can you really blame ZOS if there are so many consenting victims willing to spend their money on RNG-crates ?

It will work out very well for ZOS. It will end badly for players, regardless if you choose to buy the crates or not. This represents a shift of focus. They will focus from now on primarily on how to further monetize the game.

Bryanonymous

Anyone making the assumption that the complaints are because we want the items in the crates is totally missing every single point being made about these. I've made tons of points on why these things are terrible. None of which were about wanting any of the crap. Quite the contrary. My complaint is that the items are crap and that they are ripping people off by disguising how much the player will end up spending with the illusion of worthless junk prizes and almost worthless gems. And even more to the point, that future content will deteriorate because people consented to these kinds of shady gimmicks. Honestly, I would not use the storm mounts even if they were free. I think they are ugly, and as I said before, the boxes would not be a big deal if they were not purposely removing things you could actually buy with the sub crowns we are entitled to. At the end of the day, you want to pay a hundred dollars for a mount, that is your choice indeed, however I will continue to voice that turning this game into Second Life is a joke which will continue to deteriorate the integrity and quality of the game itself. Why do I care? Meh, because I play this game and have an opinion worth sharing. Maybe next month I won't. Who knows, but I find it highly offensive when white knights try to play the hero for a corporation by attempting to shut down any negative feedback. We're not all just going to blindly enjoy every penny sucking scam they throw at us. I think that needs more acceptance than these crates.

anitajoneb17_ESO

JimT722 wrote: »

It will work out very well for ZOS. It will end badly for players, regardless if you choose to buy the crates or not. This represents a shift of focus. They will focus from now on primarily on how to further monetize the game.

And what do you think they were focused on BEFORE the crates ? They were focused on how to monetize the game !
It's the same for *every* product. Before release, money is a mean to an end, a way to make your product. After release, it's the opposite : your product (the game in this case) is a mean to make money. Prior to launch is called investment, after launch is called return on investment.

How well, how far and how long they're still going to take care of the original product (the game) depends on their management and business approach and decisions. It certainly doesn't depend on a handful of forumers - me included.

EZgoin76

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

EZgoin76 wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

I only bought 4 crates at 400 crowns each. Each crate's contents value on the crown store far exceeded the 400 crowns so I can not call it a rip off or a scam as long as you don't count on getting that one thing you have your heart set on every time. I was lucky and got the mount I wanted in the 4th crate, but was not disappointed in the useful poisons, pets, tattoos, hats and mimic stones I received in the other crates. In other words I more than got my monies worth.

So as long as you don't actually want anything and just feel the need to spend crowns on who-cares-what, they're a great deal, but if you actually want something they're a total scam, got it.

That is the complete and total BS way of understanding what they are. It can't be a scam because YOU ALL KNOW EXACTLY what they are. And ZOS explained how they work. They aren't forced upon anyone. You make the decision if you are going to give it a shot. There is no scam.

The scam is putting this stuff in crates to begin with instead of just selling things outright in the store.

We know what they are but not what we're getting. Huge difference there. Get it?

Yes I get it. It's called paying for a chance to win a mystery prize. Which from the tidal wave of outrage (at least on this thread from about 5-6 of you) seems to tell me you all knew that when you decided to move your mouse around the screen and click whatever it was that you had to click to pay for a shot at a mystery prize.

And from my opinion if this case were to lets say go in front of the Honorable Judge Judy, you guys wouldn't have a case (the case being that you claim ZOS is doing people dirty) and it would be dismissed. And she would tell you to protest all you want.

Lol No apparently you don't get it. You completely disregard the first part to post some nonsense.

ZOS should have never made crown crates and offered everything in store, straight up so people know exactly what they are getting.

Gambling for a chance at something is a scam. I can't make it any clearer than that.

Edit: I have never and will never buy a crown crate. I sub and buy cosmetics when I know what I'm getting.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Nyx2 wrote: »

We don't really care whether you "like" them or not, we want to hear why you think these are good. There is already math on the consumables being of less value than if you just bought them off the store. The gem conversion is miserable and you'll constantly end up with content you never wanted. The simple question is why would you as costumer desire such a rip off instead of direct purchases?

They are objectively bad in their value, they're anti-consumer and frankly I don't know how anyone knowing this can still jump to their defense, begging ZoS to take more of their money. It makes no sense and saying you like them gets across nothing.

If you assume that the items in the crates would be available at a "normal" price (whatever that means) in the Crown store for direct purchase if there were no crates, then yes, the crates are objectively bad.

But if you assume that, without the crates, those items would not be available at all, then the crates are objectively good. That's probably what the crate-lovers or crate-buyers think.

JimT722

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

JimT722 wrote: »

It will work out very well for ZOS. It will end badly for players, regardless if you choose to buy the crates or not. This represents a shift of focus. They will focus from now on primarily on how to further monetize the game.

And what do you think they were focused on BEFORE the crates ? They were focused on how to monetize it.
It's the same for *every* product. Before release, money is a mean to an end, a way to make your product. After release, it's the opposite : your product (the game in this case) is a mean to make money. Prior to launch is called investment, after launch is called return on investment.

No it actually isn't the same with every product. Not even this product through its life.

Eso launched with a subscription. They get a steady stream of money from its subscribers. The developers need to keep their customers happy in order to keep subscribers.

Eso goes buy 2 play. They keep releasing dlc and sell additional cosmetics on the store. They keep this method for over a year. They charge for content and supplement it with additional purchases.

Eso hires new marketing director with background in f2p transitions and micro transactions strategy. This happened during Dark Brotherhood. This brought on craft bags, style parlor, dye stamps and most recently crown crates. They hired an expert at monetizing games. The goal is now to milk us as much as they can. This is the shift to heavily monetize the game as its primary focus.

I know how production works because I work in manufacturing. This company is cashing in its respect to take advantage of people. It's going from offering fair prices to blatantly ripping off their customers. Research these lock boxes. You won't find anything positive. I never played a game that went this route that went anywhere good. I have played too many.

Neirymn

Reading these threads is depressing...

Prof_Bawbag

Nyx2 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Nyx2 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Nyx2 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

JimT722 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

KingMagaw wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

National Problem Gambling Helpline Network (1-800-522-4700).

Every ethical gambling company posts the odds of winning AND provides information on how to get help. Las vegas is required by the Nevada Gaming commission to both post odds of every game and provide resources to fight gambling addiction.

Totally agree. I have a friend who had to go to gambling rehab and 8 months and now these gambling cash grab crates have been added to the game is a disgrace, especially without any odds being stated, which clearly reinforces the poor drop rates.

Why are people being subjected and advertised to gamble real money in a game is beyond unethical. It is just another point of why not to sub or support Z0$ and there continued incompetence.

And yet you still play their game, just don't support them and call them unethical?! What a hypocrite. If you feel that strongly about their company why are you still indulging in their product?

All you people that call them unethical, greedy, and incompetent while still playing their game for free disgust me.

You assume these people are playing it for free. The pro-crate attitude disgusts me.

If you read the post that I quoted it's not an assumption. It was clearly stated that he plays without subbing or supporting the company.

I'm not pro-crate, I pro choice.

They are not pro-choice. The very mechanism of hiding new items away in RNG crates removes my ability to choose to purchase what I want.

No it doesn't. You know how to get the item you want. It boils down to if you CHOOSE to spend possibly more than the item is worth to you. Your choice is to either buy the boxes for the CHANCE at the item you want, or don't buy the boxes at all and not get the item at all.

Sometimes in life you don't get everything you want in exactly the way that you want it.

Yet they implement this to bloat prices. In a fashion that is very dishonest. You may be okay with a company that implements a blatant ripoff but many aren't. Most won't know how low a chance they have either. ZOS isn't forthcoming with that information so some will be deceived into thinking they have a much better chance than they actually do.

I have to disagree. They have NOT been dishonest on these crates. They are working EXACTLY as they presented to us. Your personal decision is if they way they work is of value to you or not.

I'm ok with the company presenting these as I do not feel that they are doing anything wrong. I personally don't find enough value to actually BUY into the crate thing, but I can't in good conscience condemn something that I'm not really against.

Yet another person that doesn't actively support crown crates but still thinks he knows best what others should pay / find acceptable. This is getting laughable. If you haven't figured it out: we're well aware that gambling by default doesn't promise anything. That doesn't really answer much of what we're saying other than your nitpicking over terms.

How about you respond to the more important matters? And what do you value then? If you think crown crates aren't worth their money then why just sit by and let them continue with these anti-consumer practices? Or if you're not interested in crown store content at all then why are you participating in a discussion regarding our money? There have been enough of those exact people speaking in favor of crates and it's as nonsensical as a PvE-only player dictating to ZoS how cyrodiil should work.

I don't recall a single post that I have made stating that I think I know what is best for anyone.

What do I value? The exact thing that I have stated time and time again - choice.

The company has the absolute right to take the product in ANY way they choose. It is their right and their gamble to do so.

The consumer has the right to choose to participate or not 100%

I personally have the right to participate in an open forum discussion regarding ANYTHING posted on a public forum. Who in the hell are you to imply otherwise? Just because I don't agree with your doom and gloom, doesn't make me wrong

Oh, you do. Your whole argument is that we should shut up and respect their decision because... because they can. Thank you for giving us the answer we've all been waiting for! Not only does that wipe away all our concerns of ZoS going the same P2W route other MMOs have gone but it makes so much sense now why we as costumers shouldn't oppose being ripped off.

You're not "wrong", you're an egoist that is perfectly fine to deny others what they enjoy as long as it doesn't affect you. You don't even have anything of significance to say, you're just regurgitating the same redundant stuff over and over again. "They can do what they like, you don't have to buy it". It is acknowledged but irrelevant.

We're not discussing whether this is legal or whether they can or can't do this. We point out that this business model does nothing but rip people off and that we as paying costumers aren't willing to support a game like that. In fact any person that even remotely cares about the game would not jump to the defense of such cash grab. But you seem to lack any will of your own and are satisfied as long as everyone can have their freedom even though that isn't what we are discussing in any way.

You not being involved in the process yourself spreads a similar kind of ignorance that people with uninformed opinions have. You either can't comprehend our position as costumers or cowardly support ZoS because it doesn't affect you. Your input is especially useless to ZoS since you're not willing to spend the money anyway.


You again? I think you still have to recover from that severe case of hypocrisy before I waste any more time on that.

Nyx2 wrote: »

If this was done to an aspect of the game you consider worthwhile you admit you would quit the game but as long as it's cosmetics any objection are just whiny "social justice warriors".

Unlike you that would just quit and can't even be consistent with his own logic, we do something in order to prevent it. It's hard to believe any of you even play this game.

So I guess if I don't agree with you, my opinion isn't valid - got it. I'M the egoist. I'll have to remember that in the future - thank you for turning my whole life around.

It doesn't look like you have an opinion. You're robotically telling us what ZoS is allowed to do and that's it. I don't see you engage with anything else. You give no reason as to why these crates aren't bad, no reason why players shouldn't oppose this cash grab, no nothing. But if summing up my post like that makes you feel better about your lack of argumentation go right ahead.

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

EZgoin76 wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

I only bought 4 crates at 400 crowns each. Each crate's contents value on the crown store far exceeded the 400 crowns so I can not call it a rip off or a scam as long as you don't count on getting that one thing you have your heart set on every time. I was lucky and got the mount I wanted in the 4th crate, but was not disappointed in the useful poisons, pets, tattoos, hats and mimic stones I received in the other crates. In other words I more than got my monies worth.

So as long as you don't actually want anything and just feel the need to spend crowns on who-cares-what, they're a great deal, but if you actually want something they're a total scam, got it.

That is the complete and total BS way of understanding what they are. It can't be a scam because YOU ALL KNOW EXACTLY what they are. And ZOS explained how they work. They aren't forced upon anyone. You make the decision if you are going to give it a shot. There is no scam.

The scam is putting this stuff in crates to begin with instead of just selling things outright in the store.

We know what they are but not what we're getting. Huge difference there. Get it?

And from my opinion if this case were to lets say go in front of the Honorable Judge Judy, you guys wouldn't have a case (the case being that you claim ZOS is doing people dirty) and it would be dismissed. And she would tell you to protest all you want.

Nyx2 wrote: »

We're not discussing whether this is legal or whether they can or can't do this. We point out that this business model does nothing but rip people off and that we as paying costumers aren't willing to support a game like that. In fact any person that even remotely cares about the game would not jump to the defense of such cash grab. But you seem to lack any will of your own and are satisfied as long as everyone can have their freedom even though that isn't what we are discussing in any way.

You were just mentioned in this post yet here you go again talking about this exact thing... again. How much more do you need to be spoon fed to understand this?? Instead of looking for fancy pictures you should put some more effort into the thought process that goes into writing this nonsense.

Every post you ramble on about ZoS freedom to make stupid decision but somehow you lack the self respect to have any freedom of your own and oppose their cash grab. And your only reason for that? You're not interested in crates. What kinda moronic way is that to justify crown crates?! Because you don't care it's ok that others pay 100 $ for a mount? A price you yourself wouldn't pay? Where is your freedom? You just let ZoS waltz over you because they have every right to abuse their costumers. What a joke.

You said you would quit the game if they did this to an aspect of the game you consider important which clearly shows you are not in support of it. So why support it just because it doesn't affect you? Why do I even have to explain this, this should be so obvious. You even questioned me for calling it "anti-consumer". If something that makes you quit the game isn't anti-consumer then I don't know what is. You just spindle on like that from one nonsensical argument to the next. And for the most part you make them because you're not involved and keep making double standards which you don't even apply to yourself.

What now? A cheap joke and a picture to distract everyone from the dishonesty I keep pointing out? Whatever it is you do, don't repeat that same garbage of how this legal, that we don't have to buy it or how casinos work. We ****ing know and it has nothing to do with our arguments.

Suter1972 wrote: »

User_Name wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

text

Making posts combating those who seek to ensure rights for everyone, including you, seems mind-numbingly counter-productive.

Woah..... my rights are fine thanks. I like the crates. I dont need the haters speaking for me or wanting stuff i like removed. I like them. I can afford them and ive not become an addict.

We don't really care whether you "like" them or not, we want to hear why you think these are good. There is already math on the consumables being of less value than if you just bought them off the store. The gem conversion is miserable and you'll constantly end up with content you never wanted. The simple question is why would you as costumer desire such a rip off instead of direct purchases?

They are objectively bad in their value, they're anti-consumer and frankly I don't know how anyone knowing this can still jump to their defense, begging ZoS to take more of their money. It makes no sense and saying you like them gets across nothing.

You really do have a superiority complex the thickness of a rope. You have continuously been rude or maybe patronising is the better term, and continuously attempt to impose your self styled moderation upon others within this thread (you have zero authority to dictate what other people post or what they don't post, yet you continue to act like you do). It's embarrassing in the extreme. Just so we're clear, most of us don't really care what you think either, yet you still continue like your opinion is the be all and end all. If someone who is in a position to dictate to others finds something unacceptable or irrelevant I'm sure they can deal with those posts as and when they crop up. "We" who exactly is "we"? I know you don't speak for me.

I can see both sides of the argument and I agree with some of the views people have expressed which are against the implementation of crates, yet I can see why others haven't got an issue with them. Absolutely no one needs to justify themselves to you and it's staggering that throughout this discussion you seem to think everyone with a differing opinion owes you exactly that. You are nothing special and no doubt I'll be on the thick end of your superiority complex next, but that's how you roll.

anitajoneb17_ESO

JimT722 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

JimT722 wrote: »

It will work out very well for ZOS. It will end badly for players, regardless if you choose to buy the crates or not. This represents a shift of focus. They will focus from now on primarily on how to further monetize the game.

And what do you think they were focused on BEFORE the crates ? They were focused on how to monetize it.
It's the same for *every* product. Before release, money is a mean to an end, a way to make your product. After release, it's the opposite : your product (the game in this case) is a mean to make money. Prior to launch is called investment, after launch is called return on investment.

No it actually isn't the same with every product. Not even this product through its life.

Eso launched with a subscription. They get a steady stream of money from its subscribers. The developers need to keep their customers happy in order to keep subscribers.

Eso goes buy 2 play. They keep releasing dlc and sell additional cosmetics on the store. They keep this method for over a year. They charge for content and supplement it with additional purchases.

Eso hires new marketing director with background in f2p transitions and micro transactions strategy. This happened during Dark Brotherhood. This brought on craft bags, style parlor, dye stamps and most recently crown crates. They hired an expert at monetizing games. The goal is now to milk us as much as they can. This is the shift to heavily monetize the game as its primary focus.

I know how production works because I work in manufacturing. This company is cashing in its respect to take advantage of people. It's going from offering fair prices to blatantly ripping off their customers. Research these lock boxes. You won't find anything positive. I never played a game that went this route that went anywhere good. I have played too many.

- They're not more or less focused on monetization than they used to be. They're just changing/adjusting/expanding their methods of monetization.

- What is a "fair price" ? Objectively, playing the game is cheaper than it was at launch (if you don't sub and purchase DLCs), or it costs the same (if you subscribe). I could even add that the price of the base game has plummeted. Only optional crown store stuff costs more - but that is only if you want it. Then it's up to you to know if the price is fair (then buy) or unfair (then don't buy).

I know that some of you hate it whenever the argument "it's optional + cosmetic" shows, and I understand that to some of you cosmetics are important... but it's really up to you to buy or not to buy after all. ZOS haven't "increased their prices". That is, objectively, not true.

And as to the argument "look what happened to other games", I understand your concern, BUT I've heard it all since the B2P and TU turn... it was all supposed to break down and become hell. We're 1.5 years from that, by now, and none of what doomsayers have forecasted "looking at other games" happened.

Bryanonymous

Something else to consider for all you who would like this thread to die... Earlier tonight I was in zone chat and someone mentioned the crates. Because I had said so much about them in this thread, I felt no desire to continue the discussion in zone chat anymore as I hate repeating the same stuff over and over.

Point is, even though my personal story does not necessarily speak for anyone else, recognize that this one thread is a good place for people to vent and let it out so that they WON'T feel the need to in your zone chat. So instead of hating that so many have a negative view, embrace that they are doing it here and making it less likely that they feel the need to vent in the game. Tension needs to be released, not censored.

Elsonso

JimT722 wrote: »

It will work out very well for ZOS. It will end badly for players, regardless if you choose to buy the crates or not. This represents a shift of focus. They will focus from now on primarily on how to further monetize the game.

They have been doing this since they conceived of the idea of the Crown Store back in 2014. Crown Crates are the latest in the shift in focus that happened back then. The avalanche has already started; it is too late for the pebbles to vote.

Nyx2

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Nyx2 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Nyx2 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Nyx2 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

JimT722 wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

KingMagaw wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

National Problem Gambling Helpline Network (1-800-522-4700).

Every ethical gambling company posts the odds of winning AND provides information on how to get help. Las vegas is required by the Nevada Gaming commission to both post odds of every game and provide resources to fight gambling addiction.

Totally agree. I have a friend who had to go to gambling rehab and 8 months and now these gambling cash grab crates have been added to the game is a disgrace, especially without any odds being stated, which clearly reinforces the poor drop rates.

Why are people being subjected and advertised to gamble real money in a game is beyond unethical. It is just another point of why not to sub or support Z0$ and there continued incompetence.

And yet you still play their game, just don't support them and call them unethical?! What a hypocrite. If you feel that strongly about their company why are you still indulging in their product?

All you people that call them unethical, greedy, and incompetent while still playing their game for free disgust me.

You assume these people are playing it for free. The pro-crate attitude disgusts me.

If you read the post that I quoted it's not an assumption. It was clearly stated that he plays without subbing or supporting the company.

I'm not pro-crate, I pro choice.

They are not pro-choice. The very mechanism of hiding new items away in RNG crates removes my ability to choose to purchase what I want.

No it doesn't. You know how to get the item you want. It boils down to if you CHOOSE to spend possibly more than the item is worth to you. Your choice is to either buy the boxes for the CHANCE at the item you want, or don't buy the boxes at all and not get the item at all.

Sometimes in life you don't get everything you want in exactly the way that you want it.

Yet they implement this to bloat prices. In a fashion that is very dishonest. You may be okay with a company that implements a blatant ripoff but many aren't. Most won't know how low a chance they have either. ZOS isn't forthcoming with that information so some will be deceived into thinking they have a much better chance than they actually do.

I have to disagree. They have NOT been dishonest on these crates. They are working EXACTLY as they presented to us. Your personal decision is if they way they work is of value to you or not.

I'm ok with the company presenting these as I do not feel that they are doing anything wrong. I personally don't find enough value to actually BUY into the crate thing, but I can't in good conscience condemn something that I'm not really against.

Yet another person that doesn't actively support crown crates but still thinks he knows best what others should pay / find acceptable. This is getting laughable. If you haven't figured it out: we're well aware that gambling by default doesn't promise anything. That doesn't really answer much of what we're saying other than your nitpicking over terms.

How about you respond to the more important matters? And what do you value then? If you think crown crates aren't worth their money then why just sit by and let them continue with these anti-consumer practices? Or if you're not interested in crown store content at all then why are you participating in a discussion regarding our money? There have been enough of those exact people speaking in favor of crates and it's as nonsensical as a PvE-only player dictating to ZoS how cyrodiil should work.

I don't recall a single post that I have made stating that I think I know what is best for anyone.

What do I value? The exact thing that I have stated time and time again - choice.

The company has the absolute right to take the product in ANY way they choose. It is their right and their gamble to do so.

The consumer has the right to choose to participate or not 100%

I personally have the right to participate in an open forum discussion regarding ANYTHING posted on a public forum. Who in the hell are you to imply otherwise? Just because I don't agree with your doom and gloom, doesn't make me wrong

Oh, you do. Your whole argument is that we should shut up and respect their decision because... because they can. Thank you for giving us the answer we've all been waiting for! Not only does that wipe away all our concerns of ZoS going the same P2W route other MMOs have gone but it makes so much sense now why we as costumers shouldn't oppose being ripped off.

You're not "wrong", you're an egoist that is perfectly fine to deny others what they enjoy as long as it doesn't affect you. You don't even have anything of significance to say, you're just regurgitating the same redundant stuff over and over again. "They can do what they like, you don't have to buy it". It is acknowledged but irrelevant.

We're not discussing whether this is legal or whether they can or can't do this. We point out that this business model does nothing but rip people off and that we as paying costumers aren't willing to support a game like that. In fact any person that even remotely cares about the game would not jump to the defense of such cash grab. But you seem to lack any will of your own and are satisfied as long as everyone can have their freedom even though that isn't what we are discussing in any way.

You not being involved in the process yourself spreads a similar kind of ignorance that people with uninformed opinions have. You either can't comprehend our position as costumers or cowardly support ZoS because it doesn't affect you. Your input is especially useless to ZoS since you're not willing to spend the money anyway.


You again? I think you still have to recover from that severe case of hypocrisy before I waste any more time on that.

Nyx2 wrote: »

If this was done to an aspect of the game you consider worthwhile you admit you would quit the game but as long as it's cosmetics any objection are just whiny "social justice warriors".

Unlike you that would just quit and can't even be consistent with his own logic, we do something in order to prevent it. It's hard to believe any of you even play this game.

So I guess if I don't agree with you, my opinion isn't valid - got it. I'M the egoist. I'll have to remember that in the future - thank you for turning my whole life around.

It doesn't look like you have an opinion. You're robotically telling us what ZoS is allowed to do and that's it. I don't see you engage with anything else. You give no reason as to why these crates aren't bad, no reason why players shouldn't oppose this cash grab, no nothing. But if summing up my post like that makes you feel better about your lack of argumentation go right ahead.

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

EZgoin76 wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

I only bought 4 crates at 400 crowns each. Each crate's contents value on the crown store far exceeded the 400 crowns so I can not call it a rip off or a scam as long as you don't count on getting that one thing you have your heart set on every time. I was lucky and got the mount I wanted in the 4th crate, but was not disappointed in the useful poisons, pets, tattoos, hats and mimic stones I received in the other crates. In other words I more than got my monies worth.

So as long as you don't actually want anything and just feel the need to spend crowns on who-cares-what, they're a great deal, but if you actually want something they're a total scam, got it.

That is the complete and total BS way of understanding what they are. It can't be a scam because YOU ALL KNOW EXACTLY what they are. And ZOS explained how they work. They aren't forced upon anyone. You make the decision if you are going to give it a shot. There is no scam.

The scam is putting this stuff in crates to begin with instead of just selling things outright in the store.

We know what they are but not what we're getting. Huge difference there. Get it?

And from my opinion if this case were to lets say go in front of the Honorable Judge Judy, you guys wouldn't have a case (the case being that you claim ZOS is doing people dirty) and it would be dismissed. And she would tell you to protest all you want.

Nyx2 wrote: »

We're not discussing whether this is legal or whether they can or can't do this. We point out that this business model does nothing but rip people off and that we as paying costumers aren't willing to support a game like that. In fact any person that even remotely cares about the game would not jump to the defense of such cash grab. But you seem to lack any will of your own and are satisfied as long as everyone can have their freedom even though that isn't what we are discussing in any way.

You were just mentioned in this post yet here you go again talking about this exact thing... again. How much more do you need to be spoon fed to understand this?? Instead of looking for fancy pictures you should put some more effort into the thought process that goes into writing this nonsense.

Every post you ramble on about ZoS freedom to make stupid decision but somehow you lack the self respect to have any freedom of your own and oppose their cash grab. And your only reason for that? You're not interested in crates. What kinda moronic way is that to justify crown crates?! Because you don't care it's ok that others pay 100 $ for a mount? A price you yourself wouldn't pay? Where is your freedom? You just let ZoS waltz over you because they have every right to abuse their costumers. What a joke.

You said you would quit the game if they did this to an aspect of the game you consider important which clearly shows you are not in support of it. So why support it just because it doesn't affect you? Why do I even have to explain this, this should be so obvious. You even questioned me for calling it "anti-consumer". If something that makes you quit the game isn't anti-consumer then I don't know what is. You just spindle on like that from one nonsensical argument to the next. And for the most part you make them because you're not involved and keep making double standards which you don't even apply to yourself.

What now? A cheap joke and a picture to distract everyone from the dishonesty I keep pointing out? Whatever it is you do, don't repeat that same garbage of how this legal, that we don't have to buy it or how casinos work. We ****ing know and it has nothing to do with our arguments.

Suter1972 wrote: »

User_Name wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

text

Making posts combating those who seek to ensure rights for everyone, including you, seems mind-numbingly counter-productive.

Woah..... my rights are fine thanks. I like the crates. I dont need the haters speaking for me or wanting stuff i like removed. I like them. I can afford them and ive not become an addict.

We don't really care whether you "like" them or not, we want to hear why you think these are good. There is already math on the consumables being of less value than if you just bought them off the store. The gem conversion is miserable and you'll constantly end up with content you never wanted. The simple question is why would you as costumer desire such a rip off instead of direct purchases?

They are objectively bad in their value, they're anti-consumer and frankly I don't know how anyone knowing this can still jump to their defense, begging ZoS to take more of their money. It makes no sense and saying you like them gets across nothing.

I can see both sides of the argument

There is nothing to feel superior about when you fail to present any arguments. Without arguments there is no discussion. Apparently you have found them so feel free to tell me all about it. I can only endure so much when this thread consists of nothing but bad reading comprehension, lies and the most obvious hypocrisy I've seen. You want to point out anything incorrect I've said? Don't hesitate and do that instead of talking about how I have a "superiority complex".

They care about what I say or they wouldn't continuously try to engage with it just to then make the same empty statements that address nothing of what I said and just censor others "because they can". I ignored him but that didn't stop him from starting it all again just to bother me with the same weak arguments he made before. But of course I'm the one harassing others. And now you come to defend those poor people that want to shut others up because after pages of the same meaningless arguing I'm being "rude" for directing people to stay on topic.

Your whole post is a personal attack which again contributes nothing to the topic.

Prof_Bawbag

There you go again attempting to dictate what is what. Your endless drivel is boring and you yourself have nothing much to add other than go around telling people what they should or shouldn't be discussing.

driosketch

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

- What is a "fair price" ?

While the absolute amount on that price is subjective, in nearly all cases I think the "fairness" is the customer knowing what the price will be before giving the company money.

Mathematically, over the customer base as a whole, these crates provide less value per crown spent and drain a large amounts of them. They will make a lot of money for ZOS in the short term, but do you honestly believe this model will hold up long term?

These crates released during the holiday season, when many people are in spend mode. They burned through a lot of the stock pile of crowns out there. What happens when the next season hits, during tax season no less? Are players who spent their stockpile from subbing this time around, that they never spend anyways, going to start buying crown packs? Are collecters who spent $300-400 this time to get it all going to be keen to do that again? They will eventually hit burn out.

Nyx2

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

There you go again attempting to dictate what is what. Your endless drivel is boring and you yourself have nothing much to add other than go around telling people what they should or shouldn't be discussing.

"There you go again using arguments to reply to my personal attacks. Saying I don't contribute anything is not contributing anything either even if I'm the one involving you in this pointless talk!"

Really, this is the kind of discussion you were trying to have? I guess I will just let people continue to "argue" against me and not respond because it offends them.

Suter1972

Even after thousands of posts on the subject, trying to navigate through the numerous moves off topic and the various scraps and fights, I still cant understand why these are so bad other than the point that some players in the community think that more and more items will be locked behind crates.

Is that the main issue?

Is there any of the current CC items that people WOULD 100% buy directly if the option was given?

SantieClaws

Suter1972 wrote: »

Even after thousands of posts on the subject, trying to navigate through the numerous moves off topic and the various scraps and fights, I still cant understand why these are so bad other than the point that some players in the community think that more and more items will be locked behind crates.

Is that the main issue?

Is there any of the current CC items that people WOULD 100% buy directly if the option was given?

Yes - khajiit would have bought the wizard hat and the eye.

If they remain crate exclusives then they have lost sales from this one.

As for why they are bad - summary of the feelings of this one as follows:

They encourage gambling. The chances of getting what you wish for without a significant amount of money exchanging paws is very slim. This was shown by all the testing on the PTS.

They take things that would be in the store and make you gamble to purchase them. They are an unfair transaction because you do not know what you buy before you buy it. If items were in the store directly then many of us would have no issue with a purchase - although this one she does object to motifs and dyes being in the store as these have previously only been in the game. Taking content available previously in one form and moving it to the more expensive one is a drip, drip process. First one thing, then another and soon all we love about Tamriel has a significant price tag on it.

They very largely contain consumables that not many people want anyway.

The crown gem exchange system is far too low. You will still need to buy many many crates and exchange many duplicates before getting the item you wish for.

They will probably dictate the future content of the store and the game itself - if they prove popular then all of the best items will be crate exclusive. This is the biggest concern for this one. When the Tamriel becomes nothing but a casino and great shiny shopping mall then many of us will cease to enjoy travelling there.

They took Pacrooti and made him into a crazed, crate junkie monster.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws