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New meta strat for Non-HM vMoL
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Kippesnikke✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »I definitely can't think of a way for a none Sorc tank to do this. The only other vague possibility is a werewolf tank if werewolves can even use eyes of jode? Even if possible it would probably still be less effective.
i did backyard as a full tank.PC-EU-EP
Northborn DK tank
Hodor
Pandora's Promise
vMoL cleared on VR16 #World1st
Worlds #1 vMoL speed run [VR16]0 -
code65536✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kippesnikke wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »I definitely can't think of a way for a none Sorc tank to do this. The only other vague possibility is a werewolf tank if werewolves can even use eyes of jode? Even if possible it would probably still be less effective.
i did backyard as a full tank.
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s7732425ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭The tank not taunting the hulk is equivalent to not immediately taunting an axe in AA. Sometimes, when the axes first spawn, they will be attacking a DPS for a few seconds before the tank is able to grab agro. Does the DPS die because of this? No, you just hold block for two seconds and then resume your normal rotation. It's the same thing here.0 -
hedna123b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭s7732425ub17_ESO wrote: »The tank not taunting the hulk is equivalent to not immediately taunting an axe in AA. Sometimes, when the axes first spawn, they will be attacking a DPS for a few seconds before the tank is able to grab agro. Does the DPS die because of this? No, you just hold block for two seconds and then resume your normal rotation. It's the same thing here.
AA is an easy trial since you can just stand and block until the axes are taunted and nothing will happen to you...in the case of vMoL there are additional mechanics that can kill you such as Meteors, tether orbs, beach balls and etc...but none of it really matters. The post is about a strat that let's the fight be finished faster than with the current meta. This strat is unique. The purpose of this is to help groups that want to clear that fight faster and in a more interesting way. Whether you want to taunt or not taunt the hulk is your choice we didn't even mention it in our description. The goal of the post is to showcase a better way of doing Rakhhat and of giving the sorc tanks and opportunity to shine. Keep in mind that sorcs have reduction. To ulti cost so the uptime on warhorn is higher on other fights than with a DK or Templar, which offers additional benefit.
I am at a loss for why several people seem to be zeroing in on something completely irrelevant to the purpose of the thread...2 -
iam117✭✭✭hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »s7732425ub17_ESO wrote: »The tank not taunting the hulk is equivalent to not immediately taunting an axe in AA. Sometimes, when the axes first spawn, they will be attacking a DPS for a few seconds before the tank is able to grab agro. Does the DPS die because of this? No, you just hold block for two seconds and then resume your normal rotation. It's the same thing here.
AA is an easy trial since you can just stand and block until the axes are taunted and nothing will happen to you...in the case of vMoL there are additional mechanics that can kill you such as Meteors, tether orbs, beach balls and etc...but none of it really matters. The post is about a strat that let's the fight be finished faster than with the current meta. This strat is unique. The purpose of this is to help groups that want to clear that fight faster and in a more interesting way. Whether you want to taunt or not taunt the hulk is your choice we didn't even mention it in our description. The goal of the post is to showcase a better way of doing Rakhhat and of giving the sorc tanks and opportunity to shine. Keep in mind that sorcs have reduction. To ulti cost so the uptime on warhorn is higher on other fights than with a DK or Templar, which offers additional benefit.
I am at a loss for why several people seem to be zeroing in on something completely irrelevant to the purpose of the thread...
post something that might be somewhat informative and give sorc tanks a very viable advantage and...............
?????? Edited by iam117 on September 8, 2016 7:17PM<Liv3mind><PC/NA - Legion Of The Bloodworks>Snowflake Patrol1 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »Why do you call a strategy that assumes the group having not enough dps new meta? I mean it is nice to give tips to less experienced groups, but your title makes it sound as if it is better to take an offtank instead of an additional stam dd.
Has anyone cleared this place without an offtank? This is not a choice about whether or not to have an off tank or a DPS. It is based on the premise that an offtank is required, and thus what is the best way to utilize them during the fight.
As always, way to think outside the box. I am going home to delete all my sorcs, just in case I draw the short straw if we decide to try this. Haha.
@paulsimonps You got that sorc leveled yet, buddy?
Edit: Our last good clear on monday, which I believe was #2 on PC/NA, had one stamina DPS.Edited by Oreyn_Bearclaw on September 8, 2016 8:17PM0 -
hedna123b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »Why do you call a strategy that assumes the group having not enough dps new meta? I mean it is nice to give tips to less experienced groups, but your title makes it sound as if it is better to take an offtank instead of an additional stam dd.
Has anyone cleared this place without an offtank? This is not a choice about whether or not to have an off tank or a DPS. It is based on the premise that an offtank is required, and thus what is the best way to utilize them during the fight.
As always, way to think outside the box. I am going home to delete all my sorcs, just in case I draw the short straw if we decide to try this. Haha.
@paulsimonps You got that sorc leveled yet, buddy?
Lol:)0 -
hedna123b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Oreyn_Bearclaw you don't even know what we will show next week...it's even better!0 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »@Oreyn_Bearclaw you don't even know what we will show next week...it's even better!
Can't wait. I just started learning back team on this fight, so if I can talk the off tank into doing it, all the better. haha
Funny thing is, I am starting to think this is the easiest fight in the whole place. When we dont mess up, we are getting him down well before middle phase now. Honestly, I think the first boss is the hardest one to go death free.Edited by Oreyn_Bearclaw on September 8, 2016 8:49PM0 -
hedna123b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »@Oreyn_Bearclaw you don't even know what we will show next week...it's even better!
Can't wait. I just started learning back team on this fight, so if I can talk the off tank into doing it, all the better. haha
Funny thing is, I am starting to think this is the easiest fight in the whole place. When we dont mess up, we are getting him down well before middle phase now. Honestly, I think the first boss is the hardest one to go death free.
Yup deaths are a biggie...practice practice and more practice...we just changed up our strats completely and we will need time to adjust to them considering we only raid once a week with core atm...0 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »@Oreyn_Bearclaw you don't even know what we will show next week...it's even better!
Can't wait. I just started learning back team on this fight, so if I can talk the off tank into doing it, all the better. haha
Funny thing is, I am starting to think this is the easiest fight in the whole place. When we dont mess up, we are getting him down well before middle phase now. Honestly, I think the first boss is the hardest one to go death free.
Yup deaths are a biggie...practice practice and more practice...we just changed up our strats completely and we will need time to adjust to them considering we only raid once a week with core atm...
Deaths are everything!!! We moved into the #2 to spot because we had this crazy thing called vitality at the end. Almost positive it was not our fastest run but best score by a long shot. Funny thing was that it was my first time in there on a sorc and I died twice to that damn curse. Haha.0 -
hedna123b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »@Oreyn_Bearclaw you don't even know what we will show next week...it's even better!
Can't wait. I just started learning back team on this fight, so if I can talk the off tank into doing it, all the better. haha
Funny thing is, I am starting to think this is the easiest fight in the whole place. When we dont mess up, we are getting him down well before middle phase now. Honestly, I think the first boss is the hardest one to go death free.
Yup deaths are a biggie...practice practice and more practice...we just changed up our strats completely and we will need time to adjust to them considering we only raid once a week with core atm...
Deaths are everything!!! We moved into the #2 to spot because we had this crazy thing called vitality at the end. Almost positive it was not our fastest run but best score by a long shot. Funny thing was that it was my first time in there on a sorc and I died twice to that damn curse. Haha.
Hehe yeah once we get a second night going and a consistent team it should be easier for us to place as well...0 -
iam117✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »
As always, way to think outside the box. I am going home to delete all my sorcs, just in case I draw the short straw if we decide to try this. Haha.
@paulsimonps You got that sorc leveled yet, buddy?
AHHHH dont delete, embrace the outside of the box, the inside is so square :P @Oreyn_Bearclaw you should try it, its easily the most stressfull fun (is that a real thing?) i have had in game in a long while.........<Liv3mind><PC/NA - Legion Of The Bloodworks>Snowflake Patrol0 -
hedna123b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭What @Woeler is saying is that there is ways to do this without an off tank at all meaning you don't require your offtank to be a Sorcerer, sounds as if they do that now
I get it, but they have that other perrson who tanks the twins for them swap to dps gear and stay up front..thats a DPS loss overr sending that offtank in the back and keeping the backroom DPS in the front....unless their tank in DPS gear can outdps the backroom DPS...which would be a problem in itself...0 -
Nifty2g✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Xantaria is a stam dragonknight, highly doubt it would be a dps loss. And with race change around, Xantaria is probably an Imperial now, that would mean there would be no respecing required for attributes only his CP and a quick gear swap addon (can do all that during rakkhats speech at the end)hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »What @Woeler is saying is that there is ways to do this without an off tank at all meaning you don't require your offtank to be a Sorcerer, sounds as if they do that now
I get it, but they have that other perrson who tanks the twins for them swap to dps gear and stay up front..thats a DPS loss overr sending that offtank in the back and keeping the backroom DPS in the front....unless their tank in DPS gear can outdps the backroom DPS...which would be a problem in itself...
Edited by Nifty2g on September 9, 2016 2:06AM#MOREORBS0 -
hedna123b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Xantaria is a stam dragonknight, highly doubt it would be a dps loss. And with race change around, Xantaria is probably an Imperial now, that would mean there would be no respecing required for attributes only his CP and a quick gear swap addon (can do all that during rakkhats speech at the end)hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »What @Woeler is saying is that there is ways to do this without an off tank at all meaning you don't require your offtank to be a Sorcerer, sounds as if they do that now
I get it, but they have that other perrson who tanks the twins for them swap to dps gear and stay up front..thats a DPS loss overr sending that offtank in the back and keeping the backroom DPS in the front....unless their tank in DPS gear can outdps the backroom DPS...which would be a problem in itself...
Id like to see that DPS then:)0 -
Nifty2g✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Wait you don't know Xanti? He was one of the few to bring the stam dk alive ages ago, back in like last Septemberhedna123b14_ESO wrote: »
Xantaria is a stam dragonknight, highly doubt it would be a dps loss. And with race change around, Xantaria is probably an Imperial now, that would mean there would be no respecing required for attributes only his CP and a quick gear swap addon (can do all that during rakkhats speech at the end)hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »What @Woeler is saying is that there is ways to do this without an off tank at all meaning you don't require your offtank to be a Sorcerer, sounds as if they do that now
I get it, but they have that other perrson who tanks the twins for them swap to dps gear and stay up front..thats a DPS loss overr sending that offtank in the back and keeping the backroom DPS in the front....unless their tank in DPS gear can outdps the backroom DPS...which would be a problem in itself...
Id like to see that DPS then:)
An offtank that is able to have an understanding and do competitive DPS is a very nice thing, lets you do some good stuff on certain bosses#MOREORBS0 -
Woeler✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Xanti pulls 50k+ on AA and Hel Ra bosses like varlariel, foundation stone atronarch and rakotu. He just switches CP and is a complete full DD. On rakkhat he is also on level with our other stam DK's (khajiit getting a little more).
Your role is not written in stone. At least not for the off-tank.
Xantaria OP.Edited by Woeler on September 9, 2016 2:41AM0 -
iam117✭✭✭@Nifty2g and @Woeler you both forget the point. Most groups will not be playing on that level. Nor will they NOT need an off tank, so while yes it can be done without it, that's irrelevant. Just because your groups do without does not mean others do. There are 40 ways to skin a cat, or a baboon.<Liv3mind><PC/NA - Legion Of The Bloodworks>Snowflake Patrol0
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hedna123b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Wait you don't know Xanti? He was one of the few to bring the stam dk alive ages ago, back in like last Septemberhedna123b14_ESO wrote: »
Xantaria is a stam dragonknight, highly doubt it would be a dps loss. And with race change around, Xantaria is probably an Imperial now, that would mean there would be no respecing required for attributes only his CP and a quick gear swap addon (can do all that during rakkhats speech at the end)hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »What @Woeler is saying is that there is ways to do this without an off tank at all meaning you don't require your offtank to be a Sorcerer, sounds as if they do that now
I get it, but they have that other perrson who tanks the twins for them swap to dps gear and stay up front..thats a DPS loss overr sending that offtank in the back and keeping the backroom DPS in the front....unless their tank in DPS gear can outdps the backroom DPS...which would be a problem in itself...
Id like to see that DPS then:)
An offtank that is able to have an understanding and do competitive DPS is a very nice thing, lets you do some good stuff on certain bossesXanti pulls 50k+ on AA and Hel Ra bosses like varlariel, foundation stone atronarch and rakotu. He just switches CP and is a complete full DD. On rakkhat he is also on level with our other stam DK's (khajiit getting a little more).
Your role is not written in stone. At least not for the off-tank.
Xantaria OP.
Ooh...Thats a pretty great idea, we will try that next:)0 -
Woeler✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »Why do you call a strategy that assumes the group having not enough dps new meta? I mean it is nice to give tips to less experienced groups, but your title makes it sound as if it is better to take an offtank instead of an additional stam dd.
Has anyone cleared this place without an offtank? This is not a choice about whether or not to have an off tank or a DPS. It is based on the premise that an offtank is required, and thus what is the best way to utilize them during the fight.
As always, way to think outside the box. I am going home to delete all my sorcs, just in case I draw the short straw if we decide to try this. Haha.
@paulsimonps You got that sorc leveled yet, buddy?
Edit: Our last good clear on monday, which I believe was #2 on PC/NA, had one stamina DPS.
Yea, multiple times without an offtank, excluding boss 2 of course. The premise that a pure offtank player is required is false. That is the whole point. Also the weird belief that an offtank player can't somehow switch to a decent dps setup is also false. If that person is a stamina DK you will gain dps by letting him stay at rakkhat. Also, especially with onetamriel where powerfull assault will drop with jewels and weapons and WITHOUT cooldown you want to keep your offtank in the room even if he assumes a tanky role.
Offtank is a funny role. It can be such an insane addition to a group.Edited by Woeler on September 9, 2016 3:03AM0 -
Nifty2g✭✭✭✭✭
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Not to be the party pooper but you guys are the ones doing that, what group other than your own is going to have a Sorcerer off tank, and named the thread with new meta strategy, most groups if all but yours do not have a Sorcerer off tank
If you are capable of skipping the 3rd backroom (which you are), you are capable of burning the hulk and doing what Woeler said (just be mindful of your shields, I am sure they are all on that level), swapping your off tank to DD and sending your 2 fastest sorcerer DD's or 1 Sorcerer 1 Nightblade will let them clear it as fast as possible to get more overall DPS on Rakkhat
I'm not shutting your idea down, but if you get that Stamina Sorcerer to put on support gear for Rakkhat instead of staying in tank gear, you might get some pretty nice results, negates are pretty sweet#MOREORBS2 -
hedna123b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Not to be the party pooper but you guys are the ones doing that, what group other than your own is going to have a Sorcerer off tank, and named the thread with new meta strategy, most groups if all but yours do not have a Sorcerer off tank
If you are capable of skipping the 3rd backroom (which you are), you are capable of burning the hulk and doing what Woeler said (just be mindful of your shields, I am sure they are all on that level), swapping your off tank to DD and sending your 2 fastest sorcerer DD's or 1 Sorcerer 1 Nightblade will let them clear it as fast as possible to get more overall DPS on Rakkhat
I'm not shutting your idea down, but if you get that Stamina Sorcerer to put on support gear for Rakkhat instead of staying in tank gear, you might get some pretty nice results, negates are pretty sweet
I would argue with you that it is much easier to find an amazing tank who can learn to sorc tank then it is to find a good tank who is a great DPS..If you both have that person for your group, thats amazing, but I would wager not many will have someone like that.0 -
iam117✭✭✭
Not to be the party pooper but you guys are the ones doing that, what group other than your own is going to have a Sorcerer off tank, and named the thread with new meta strategy, most groups if all but yours do not have a Sorcerer off tank
If you are capable of skipping the 3rd backroom (which you are), you are capable of burning the hulk and doing what Woeler said (just be mindful of your shields, I am sure they are all on that level), swapping your off tank to DD and sending your 2 fastest sorcerer DD's or 1 Sorcerer 1 Nightblade will let them clear it as fast as possible to get more overall DPS on Rakkhat
I'm not shutting your idea down, but if you get that Stamina Sorcerer to put on support gear for Rakkhat instead of staying in tank gear, you might get some pretty nice results, negates are pretty sweet
Thanks for the words, i give you an insight cause i feel its well thought out and you have a point. You usually do. But again this time not the one i have. the idea was mine to try it out and see if it was viable. It worked. Your not a party pooper. I mean obviously no one else is doing it, we came up with it. It was a theory to test, and it got tested, it worked very well. I'm not saying it's a must needed strat for every team to do. I frankly dont care if they do it or not, that's their choice. but if the idea helps some people then its a positive one. What I did say was not every group will have the dps to do it without an off tank, I know that every group used one when they were starting and clearing. Plenty of groups still do. Also not all tabks can swap into full dps gear a be completely viable, or they may not even have dps gear of any sort. And I know that there are plenty of people in game that play sorcs as tanks. There is alot of room for a sorc tank to shine, in lots of places, this is one possiblity. There are currently 6 gulds on n/a that have cleared akaik. That's (likely) less than a % of the games population (although who knows what the population really is). I'm sure there are sorc tanks around itching for a place to belong. This is a very viable option for them.
Also my sorc tank is magicka based, I do well as mag dps, but if I took my stam sorc as dps it would do the group more harm than good. Regardless of wether our group can or can't burn through it without an offtank is irrelevant. Running a sorc tank in the back room is about as anti what everyone else is doing right now as possible, and that alone is a good thing. Getting others another option to try if they are stuck is another, giving sorc tanks a viable place in end game is another, just because some dont find it valuable or insightfull does not meant others feel the same.Edited by iam117 on September 9, 2016 3:36AM<Liv3mind><PC/NA - Legion Of The Bloodworks>Snowflake Patrol0 -
SublimeSparo✭✭✭✭✭I'm starting to think you could probably get away with a shield stacking/spamming dps sorc to be off tank for vMoL, just need to be able to hold first for 15s while tank cleanses, could probably tank the black second boss fairly easily, just shield before negates, n might even be able to streak out of it with good timing. Coyld hold the savages in trash packs, armour shattered doesn't affect shields afaik. And just go full dd for rakkhat and use woelers single taunt strat, hulk should melt with extra full dd.Edited by SublimeSparo on September 9, 2016 4:38AMPS4 EU CP900. PS4 NA CP600,
vAA HM ☆ vHRC HM ☆ vSO HM ☆ vMOL
4th Console vMOL clear,
vMA cleared on all classes stam & magic
My TribeEU
High Sparo - Altmer - mSo DD.
Wood Sparo - Bosmer - sNB DD
Nord Sparo - Nord -sDK DD/Tank.
Bubble Girl - Imperial -sTe DD
Succubus Sue - Breton - mNB Tank.
Andrana Stormlock - Altmer - mTe Healer/ DD
Elvali Marvani - Dunmer - mDK DD.
Venemus Draconem - Redguard - sDK DD
Jayri Leki - Redguard - sSo DD.
Miss Jabsalot - Altmer - mTe PvP DD/ Tank
Mireli Hlaano - Dunmer - mNB DD.
Ms Shanks - Redguard - sNB DD/ le bank
NA
Dilemma Dame - Altmer - mDK DD
Stamsorc Kitty - Redguard - sSor DD
Aia Draconis - Imperial - sDK Tank
Decides-Who-Lives - Argonian - mTe Healer
You wont stop me - Altmer - mSo DD
Stab in the dark - Khajiit - sNB DD
Jabjabjab Beambeambeam - Dunmer - mTe DD
Spatium Auxiliarus - Imperial - hTe Tank&bank
Spectre - Altmer - mNB DD
Can't-Main-Tank -Argonian - sDK offTank0 -
SublimeSparo✭✭✭✭✭On another note does anyone have any good strats for beating the screen freezes/ disconnectsPS4 EU CP900. PS4 NA CP600,
vAA HM ☆ vHRC HM ☆ vSO HM ☆ vMOL
4th Console vMOL clear,
vMA cleared on all classes stam & magic
My TribeEU
High Sparo - Altmer - mSo DD.
Wood Sparo - Bosmer - sNB DD
Nord Sparo - Nord -sDK DD/Tank.
Bubble Girl - Imperial -sTe DD
Succubus Sue - Breton - mNB Tank.
Andrana Stormlock - Altmer - mTe Healer/ DD
Elvali Marvani - Dunmer - mDK DD.
Venemus Draconem - Redguard - sDK DD
Jayri Leki - Redguard - sSo DD.
Miss Jabsalot - Altmer - mTe PvP DD/ Tank
Mireli Hlaano - Dunmer - mNB DD.
Ms Shanks - Redguard - sNB DD/ le bank
NA
Dilemma Dame - Altmer - mDK DD
Stamsorc Kitty - Redguard - sSor DD
Aia Draconis - Imperial - sDK Tank
Decides-Who-Lives - Argonian - mTe Healer
You wont stop me - Altmer - mSo DD
Stab in the dark - Khajiit - sNB DD
Jabjabjab Beambeambeam - Dunmer - mTe DD
Spatium Auxiliarus - Imperial - hTe Tank&bank
Spectre - Altmer - mNB DD
Can't-Main-Tank -Argonian - sDK offTank0 -
iam117✭✭✭SublimeSparo wrote: »I'm starting to think you could probably get away with a shield stacking/spamming dps sorc to be off tank for vMoL, just need to be able to hold first for 15s while tank cleanses, could probably tank the black second boss fairly easily, just shield before negates, n might even be able to streak out of it with good timing. Coyld hold the savages in trash packs, armour shattered doesn't affect shields afaik. And just go full dd for rakkhat and use woelers single taunt strat, hulk should melt with extra full dd.
Would be really cool to see it done for sure, not sure it's viable tho.<Liv3mind><PC/NA - Legion Of The Bloodworks>Snowflake Patrol0 -
iam117✭✭✭SublimeSparo wrote: »On another note does anyone have any good strats for beating the screen freezes/ disconnects
It's not hardware, I hate that my cpu/gpu usage is like under 30% and I still get 30fps and dc. Best strat is probaby another game :P<Liv3mind><PC/NA - Legion Of The Bloodworks>Snowflake Patrol0