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Official Discussion Thread for Dueling

  • Schemering
    Schemering
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    i like the dueling idea but the guards dont attack dueling people in cities. It doesnt look like a policed city when there are people dueling but a petty theft will draw guards attention and killing an npc citizen makes them really angry.

    And like stated by @Ayantir make arenas for dueling that woul be much much more realistic
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  • kaithuzar
    kaithuzar
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    @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler

    We love the fact that we can now duel; thank you.
    With that being said, there is an interesting issue we would like your assistance with tackling.

    Players will attempt to organize their own dueling tournaments now & with that there will indeed be prizes in game by those hosting the tournament.
    There is a state of "un-fairness" that certain players will know whether the person they are up next against will re-spec their champion points to defend specifically against their next opponent. They may even swap skills or gear to specifically counter the person they will be fighting next in the tournament.
    It is impossible for others to determine whether or not a player is doing this & therefore we would ask for an instanced area where gear, champion points, & possibly even skills are locked from being changed upon entering.

    There is no point or skill involved with coming up with different builds to specifically counter other players/classes. The goal of most of us, has been to create a unique build that we can successfully play in any scenario & allow us to win based on skill rather than "hard counters of specific builds".
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  • altemriel
    altemriel
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    kaithuzar wrote: »
    @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler

    We love the fact that we can now duel; thank you.
    With that being said, there is an interesting issue we would like your assistance with tackling.

    Players will attempt to organize their own dueling tournaments now & with that there will indeed be prizes in game by those hosting the tournament.
    There is a state of "un-fairness" that certain players will know whether the person they are up next against will re-spec their champion points to defend specifically against their next opponent. They may even swap skills or gear to specifically counter the person they will be fighting next in the tournament.
    It is impossible for others to determine whether or not a player is doing this & therefore we would ask for an instanced area where gear, champion points, & possibly even skills are locked from being changed upon entering.

    There is no point or skill involved with coming up with different builds to specifically counter other players/classes. The goal of most of us, has been to create a unique build that we can successfully play in any scenario & allow us to win based on skill rather than "hard counters of specific builds".



    that would be nice, "once you enter, you can not swap anything", I agree!!
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  • Tandor
    Tandor
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    The desire to create a level playing field in duels, whether by disabling CPs or preventing participants from swapping skills or gear etc, is a good reason to restrict dueling to purpose-made arenas. That way a ring-fence can be put around the arena within which such rules can be more easily implemented.
  • bikerangelo
    bikerangelo
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    Tandor wrote: »
    The desire to create a level playing field in duels, whether by disabling CPs or preventing participants from swapping skills or gear etc, is a good reason to restrict dueling to purpose-made arenas. That way a ring-fence can be put around the arena within which such rules can be more easily implemented.

    The idea of a level playing field stops at the imbalance between the classes and magic vs. stamina. I appreciate the freedom the devs are giving the players with regards to duels. Most of my time in game is spent crafting gear for other people and helping them understand their builds and playstyles. Thanks to one tamriel and dueling, now I can do this anywhere, regardless of faction or player level.

    The super competitive dueling guilds will host their events in the Hammerdeath arena and other places with the least amount of lag. As for "immersion," what's to stop any two players from interrupting an RP session or run around spamming skills in a city already? This is a multiplayer game after all. Plus, it's hard to read past your distaste for pvp in general with your multiple excuses for why dueling should be restricted to cage fights on the outskirts of the least populated zones.
    kaithuzar wrote: »
    @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler

    We love the fact that we can now duel; thank you.
    With that being said, there is an interesting issue we would like your assistance with tackling.

    Players will attempt to organize their own dueling tournaments now & with that there will indeed be prizes in game by those hosting the tournament.
    There is a state of "un-fairness" that certain players will know whether the person they are up next against will re-spec their champion points to defend specifically against their next opponent. They may even swap skills or gear to specifically counter the person they will be fighting next in the tournament.
    It is impossible for others to determine whether or not a player is doing this & therefore we would ask for an instanced area where gear, champion points, & possibly even skills are locked from being changed upon entering.

    There is no point or skill involved with coming up with different builds to specifically counter other players/classes. The goal of most of us, has been to create a unique build that we can successfully play in any scenario & allow us to win based on skill rather than "hard counters of specific builds".

    This was brought up during the PAX West conference, where Wheeler said that they wanted to give the players and the fight clubs as much freedom as possible, allowing those fight clubs to set up their own rule sets and regulations. You've got to give them credit for respecting the already established systems created by the player base.
  • Daraugh
    Daraugh
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    Please no duels in towns. Outside the city gates is close to wayshrines and merchants. I understand duelists want to be seen, but I want to be able to see the guild kiosks, merchants, crafting areas, quest givers and dye stations.
    May all beings have happiness
    May they be free from suffering
    May they find the joy that has never known suffering
    May they be free from attachment and hatred
  • CromulentForumID
    CromulentForumID
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    Mojmir wrote: »
    Tandor wrote: »
    With the discussion over dueling in towns, it didn't take long for this thread to turn into yet another illustration of why PvP and PvE should be kept separate. The two playstyles really are very different and with arenas now set up for those wanting to duel there is simply no need for dueling to be enabled in towns where it will cause lag and immersion problems for everyone else.

    Dueling is immersive.

    Dueling is immersive in towns if the people dueling are arrested as soon as they are done. I mean, two people in open combat in a city? And when you are done you just shrug and go about your day?

    I am not sure you can argue for how immersive dueling is unless you are standing in some kind of arena.

    I think you mean to say dueling makes things more lively, or active, or busy. Immersive? I need to be convinced :)
  • scorpiodog
    scorpiodog
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    BRogueNZ wrote: »
    Morbash wrote: »

    I disagree. Disallowing certain player interactions based on because "there's 'better' places to duel" or because "you don't need to duel where you want to duel" hardly counts as an argument.

    I personally like the ability to duel anywhere in the game. It adds a whole new level of liveliness to the game and makes my game much more immersive.

    Agree.

    This is One Tamriel. This is not "One Tamriel Except You Can't Duel in Towns Because Other Players Want To Be At Peace When At The Crafting Station".

    Your talking about paying customers though, I could run around in both your faces the entire duel is that ok too?

    You could also just drop an ultimate or spam other visual skills, or even the cute achievements visual effects. If you have three people doing that the duelers might get confused as heck.
  • Daraugh
    Daraugh
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    scorpiodog wrote: »
    BRogueNZ wrote: »
    Morbash wrote: »

    I disagree. Disallowing certain player interactions based on because "there's 'better' places to duel" or because "you don't need to duel where you want to duel" hardly counts as an argument.

    I personally like the ability to duel anywhere in the game. It adds a whole new level of liveliness to the game and makes my game much more immersive.

    Agree.

    This is One Tamriel. This is not "One Tamriel Except You Can't Duel in Towns Because Other Players Want To Be At Peace When At The Crafting Station".

    Your talking about paying customers though, I could run around in both your faces the entire duel is that ok too?

    You could also just drop an ultimate or spam other visual skills, or even the cute achievements visual effects. If you have three people doing that the duelers might get confused as heck.

    And I have no doubt that will happen. Sorc pets, vanity pets, mounts, skill spamming, all of the things that any player can do to troll a duel and people still want them in towns? It's lose-lose for everyone.
    May all beings have happiness
    May they be free from suffering
    May they find the joy that has never known suffering
    May they be free from attachment and hatred
  • Seri
    Seri
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    Mojmir wrote: »
    Tandor wrote: »
    With the discussion over dueling in towns, it didn't take long for this thread to turn into yet another illustration of why PvP and PvE should be kept separate. The two playstyles really are very different and with arenas now set up for those wanting to duel there is simply no need for dueling to be enabled in towns where it will cause lag and immersion problems for everyone else.

    Dueling is immersive.

    Dueling is immersive in towns if the people dueling are arrested as soon as they are done. I mean, two people in open combat in a city? And when you are done you just shrug and go about your day?

    I am not sure you can argue for how immersive dueling is unless you are standing in some kind of arena.

    I think you mean to say dueling makes things more lively, or active, or busy. Immersive? I need to be convinced :)

    FYI, NPCs fist-fight near the center of Anvil outside a pub. I'm sure they would have used spells too but they were drunk. Also there's the NPCs bullying other NPCs in Stormhaven. Some NPCs full-on duel with spells n things out in the open overworld areas as well - definitely not in an arena.
    Edited by Seri on September 7, 2016 12:09AM
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    DC CP160+ Templar, Sorc, DK
  • VaxtinTheWolf
    VaxtinTheWolf
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    I'm not on the PTS, but I believe City/Town dueling should be disabled around the area, and when a duel starts you are provided maximum ultimate, and when the duel is over, all ultimate progression is wiped.
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  • arkansas_ESO
    arkansas_ESO
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    k9mouse wrote: »
    PVP'ers duel outside the city gates
    OR
    In Town Dueling = I do not want any type of dueling game.

    The choice is simple.

    Do I have to start reporting players for hassling people who are trying to do questing, RP'ing, or go shopping in towns?

    Are you seriously threatening to start reporting players for having the gall to duel in the same area that you're RPing in? Calm down, people already spam skills in towns already, your immersion can take the hit.


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  • Tarrin
    Tarrin
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    Dueling in cities is a crime? Yeah, i agree.

    I`ll fight you, Athos, at 12 o`clock behind the chapel (abbey)!
    mucsket6.jpg
    Edited by Tarrin on September 7, 2016 8:17AM
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  • Alpharos7
    Alpharos7
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    I am not on the PTS, and although I am excited by the prospect of dueling, I have a major concern:

    Is dueling allowed in major cities? And if so, is it having any effect on lag in these zones? I am concerned that dueling in major cities would cause even more lag. Perhaps those on the PTS can shed some light on this, although I am sure a lot of people, like me do not use the PTS (I am on console), and as such, testing may not be accurate. Besides, is dueling really safe inside a large tree?
  • Tandor
    Tandor
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    Interesting that this thread has gone quiet in terms of feedback to actual dueling on the PTS. After dueling was asked for by so many for so long it makes me question now it's happening whether it will turn out to be a seven day wonder.
  • barrrt
    barrrt
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    I agree that dueling in towns will get annoying, but there is a flip side to it… towns are some of the best locales for dueling with a lot of obstacles, etc. to deal with (try fighting on Stros M’Kai docks, for example, so much fun!).

    I wonder if it would be possible to have a setting in the client not to render duelers and their abilities in the cities? This should help with FPS, immersion, etc. for those who’d rather ignore dueling in towns (I'd probably have that turned on most of the time myself, except when I want to duel).
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  • dimensional
    dimensional
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    Leogon wrote: »
    Dominoid wrote: »
    Dueling in towns should not be allowed or illegal incurring a high bounty and making guards attack you instantly.

    This doesn't make much sense to me. Dueling is most likely to take place where multiple players congregrate... which is in towns. I just spent 15 minutes dueling in Rawlkha, and the only reason it was possible is because there were lots of players standing around waiting to duel.
    That's one of the reasons why they need to make duel arenas. Duel arenas would also prevent conflicts between PvErs and PvPers. Last night, I saw someone trolling someone else just because he/she didn't wanna duel. I knew this kinda stuff would happen and it's not even live yet. The last reason why they should keep dueling in duel arenas is because you can already see duels pretty much everywhere you go on the PTS so imagine when it's gonna go live. I enjoy dueling but when I wanna PvE, I wanna PvE, I don't wanna see duels everywhere I go. Yes, it's immersion breaking.

    To me it's immersion breaking to not have the ability to duel people anytime I want in the wilderness. I'm all for this.
  • ManDraKE
    ManDraKE
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    You should be able to duel in open word, if i want to duel someone outside the arenas that will be really crowded, i should be able to do it. Just restrict towns, so we don't have a all scale war going on in the middle of the stormheaven market, but don't limit duels just to the arenas.
    Edited by ManDraKE on September 9, 2016 8:18PM
  • WhiteMage
    WhiteMage
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    I'll just put this here because it doesn't seem like many people have been talking about it enough: I would like there to be some way to duel without CP. I am of the mind that CP is very disruptive to the overall game, especially PvP, and...

    Well, point is, I spent my CP from a PvE perspective and PvP in Azura's so that I don't have to respec CP all the time. As such, when introduced to a CP environment, the build has more regen than necessary and less damage and defenses relative to PvP CP spec players. That and I find PvP without CP much more fun.

    As long as it is possible , somehow or somewhere, I will be satisfied. Please and thank you.
    The generally amicable yet sporadically salty magplar that may or may not have 1vXed you in Sotha Sil. Who knows?
  • Tandor
    Tandor
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    ManDraKE wrote: »
    You should be able to duel in open word, if i want to duel someone outside the arenas that will be really crowded, i should be able to do it. Just restrict towns, so we don't have a all scale war going on in the middle of the stormheaven market, but don't limit duels just to the arenas.

    The problem is that people would then duel around wayshrines which would hit performance and be as intrusive as it would be in towns.

    The number of people who want to go off to some quiet spot to duel in private is very small, most want to do it in full view of the world. They will therefore always choose the most populated places which is why it needs to be restricted to those places specifically designed for it, namely arenas.
  • Osteos
    Osteos
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    Alpharos7 wrote: »
    I am not on the PTS, and although I am excited by the prospect of dueling, I have a major concern:

    Is dueling allowed in major cities? And if so, is it having any effect on lag in these zones? I am concerned that dueling in major cities would cause even more lag. Perhaps those on the PTS can shed some light on this, although I am sure a lot of people, like me do not use the PTS (I am on console), and as such, testing may not be accurate. Besides, is dueling really safe inside a large tree?

    I haven't noticed any lag in Wayrest near the wayshrine with multiple duels occurring at the same time.

    Also the first day on the pts duels were very prominent, but they have tapered off. Most likely the first week of One Tamriel there will be a lot of duels going on just like in DB people were murdering npcs like crazy and now its less common.
    Edited by Osteos on September 12, 2016 12:18AM
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  • sladen_eos
    sladen_eos
    Soul Shriven
    The dueling system is a great feature and after many hours on PTS my only suggestions are at the start of a duel:
    • Ultimate should reset to 0
    • Resource pools should fill up to maximum

    Also a few ideas of possible additions:
    • Group fights could be a great addition to the duel system, party leaders would have the option to challenge other party leaders to a group fight. Criteria would of course be that parties are the same size and perhaps limited to 2v2 or 3v3.
    • Daily quests at the Hammerdeath arena, for example 'Win X amount of duels'.
    Edited by sladen_eos on September 24, 2016 2:49AM
  • Strider_Roshin
    Strider_Roshin
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    WhiteMage wrote: »
    I'll just put this here because it doesn't seem like many people have been talking about it enough: I would like there to be some way to duel without CP. I am of the mind that CP is very disruptive to the overall game, especially PvP, and...

    Well, point is, I spent my CP from a PvE perspective and PvP in Azura's so that I don't have to respec CP all the time. As such, when introduced to a CP environment, the build has more regen than necessary and less damage and defenses relative to PvP CP spec players. That and I find PvP without CP much more fun.

    As long as it is possible , somehow or somewhere, I will be satisfied. Please and thank you.
    sladen_eos wrote: »
    The dueling system is a great feature and after many hours on PTS my only suggestions are at the start of a duel:
    • Ultimate should reset to 0
    • Resource pools should fill up to maximum

    Also a few ideas of possible additions:
    • Group fights could be a great addition to the duel system, party leaders would have the option to challenge other party leaders to a group fight. Criteria would of course be that parties are the same size and perhaps limited to 2v2 or 3v3.
    • Daily quests at the Hammerdeath arena, for example 'Win X amount of duels'.

    This please!
    And when I vest my flashing sword, and my hand takes hold in judgement, I will take vengeance upon mine enemies, and I will repay those who hase me. O Lord, raise me to Thy right hand and count me among Thy saints.
  • leepalmer95
    leepalmer95
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    I like the way they've brought dueling at a time when dueling is at it's worst.
    PS4 EU DC

    Current CP : 756+

    I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.


    RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...
  • Rilmarshim
    Rilmarshim
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    Still duels inside the towns?
  • Darlon
    Darlon
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    I'd rather see ultimate set to 1000 than to 0. (And then set to 0 when the duel ends )

    That way everyone would have their ulti ready, and it wouldn't be an extra advantage for the person with the cheapest ultimate.
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