Official Discussion Thread for One Tamriel Itemization Changes

Contraptions

Certain delve bosses and containers in delves/instances in Craglorn still drop v14 materials and items. Please update them ASAP. Got Star Dew from a backpack in Loth'Na.

wildbear247

Overall I think all the new item sets being added to the game are really great. The main weakness I see is the BoP gear issues that were previously restricted mostly to the IC dungeons and Orsinium will spread throughout the game in Update 12.

In forum post after forum post by many players, it's pretty clear at this point that most of the player base does not like BoP gear. Granted the forum users only represent a small percentage of the player base, but from my own experience interacting with players in the game (friends, guildies, zone chat, etc.) the majority of players don't like BoP gear.

Please reconsider your stance on BoP. I think the only BoP gear should be the elite drops (vMA weapons, DSA weapons, monster sets, etc.). Everything else, including sets like Hunt Leader (vMA) and Sheer Venom (vICP) should be BoE.

Greatly reducing BoP gear in this manner will result in two benefits:
1) It will stimulate the economy and allow more players access to many of the cool sets out there.
2) Players can play the content they enjoy most and still have access to most of the sets the game offers (except for elite gear as previously stated).

I feel very strongly about benefit 2. I've gravitated to PvP since reaching end game. My time is limited and I mostly play on the weekends. Normally I like to hook up with my guild mates and go have some fun in Cyrodiil or the IC. That is fun for me. Fun IS NOT running a dungeon 30+ times trying to get a complete set of Leviathan gear in desirable traits. Some players might like grinding dungeons, which is fine with me....if they grind dungeons and find the gear I'm looking for, I'll gladly buy the gear from the PvE dungeon warriors so I can continue to focus on the content I enjoy. And it should work the reverse direction in that there should be great gear PvP'rs can obtain which they can then sell to PvE'rs. This keeps a strong circulation of goods and gold flowing among players, and allows players to focus on content they enjoy.

Considering the amount of feedback players have provided on the BoP issue, it would be nice to see ZOS provide some feedback on BoP.

potirondb16_ESO

Hi, I was wondering if you guys were going to give us some feedback about Trial Itemization and if you were thinking about some adjustment in order to increase the replayability of that content ?

See : https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/3346663#Comment_3346663

silvereyes

Does anyone know if vDSA weekly rewards still drop in BoE gold jewelry?

Artis

Mojmir wrote: »

nothing in this game should be BoP

Why? Then gold buyers/sellers, farmers etc will get the best gear faster than some good players who can't afford to buy.

silvereyes

The golden vendor in Cyrodiil is listing the exact same monster masks (infernal) and golden jewelry (necropotence, ebon armory) as last week.

Additionally, there is a text problem with the menu title for the golden vendor when you first interact with her. It says "The Golden^".

Dubhliam

Artis wrote: »

Mojmir wrote: »

nothing in this game should be BoP

Why? Then gold buyers/sellers, farmers etc will get the best gear faster than some good players who can't afford to buy.

I have to agree.
I'd rather players worked for their gear through playing the corresponding content than run around in circles killing mudcrabs and then buying BiS gear.
This kind of behavior shouldn't be the way to play the game (and be successful).

Since the same gear drops in normal versions of dungeons as it does in veteran, I don't see why anyone would complain.
Except maybe PvPers, but hey... if you can't be bothered to exit Cyrodiil for a minute to farm a set, it is your own choice.

That being said, the incentive to run veteran versions of instances is somewhat diminished.
At least veteran dungeons provide helmets, and give double keys for Hard Mode.
But trials don't provide enough incentive to run them on veteran. Golden BoP gear is nice and all, but it is a limited incentive, similar to achievements. Once you get it, you have no reason to run veteran anymore.

Please make the new Motifs drop from veteran trials only.

silvereyes

Itemization: what I like so far

1. Overall, I love the whole new system.
2. Knowing exactly which sets will drop where is really great
3. Purple items seem to be dropping about 10-15% of the time, so not too bad
4. I also love that all sets come with jewelry now. Very cool. It's so much easier to complete a 5+5+1 or 5+5+2 setup with a lot more sets.

Itemization: what I think needs work

• I really only have one complaint, and it's that gold jewelry for most sets will only come from the PvP golden vendor
• They will be really expensive (250k gold or 500k AP).
• That's okay for sets like Warlock and Silks of the Sun that sell for 400k+ gold right now on PC / NA
• That's not so okay for sets like Sithis' Touch, which nobody in their right mind would even buy gold jewels for, making those wasted weeks.
• For really popular BoE sets, those with deep pockets will probably stockpile and then try to flip for 500k gold to the poor saps that missed the weekend they were available.
• With the number of BoP sets and BoE sets to rotate through, it's gonna take a loooooooong time (possibly up to 2 years!) for your desired sets to come up for both rings and necklace. Being able to mix and match rings to one set and neck to another will help, but it's still gonna take a long time.

Suggestions

• I think there should be a way to get gold jewelry from running overworld and dungeon content.
• Maybe as a reward for a new vet hard-mode for world bosses?
• Maybe as an extra reward for perfect vet hard-mode dungeon runs with no wipes? (or maybe no-deaths at all o.O?)

RoyJade

silvereyes wrote: »

Suggestions

• I think there should be a way to get gold jewelry from running overworld and dungeon content.
• Maybe as a reward for a new vet hard-mode for world bosses?
• Maybe as an extra reward for perfect vet hard-mode dungeon runs with no wipes? (or maybe no-deaths at all o.O?)

I like this idea. Gold jewelries should be given by chest with the treasure hunter's passive, and/or treasures maps. You may also find them on a dungeon if you've done all the success previously or if you do a flawless run (no death, all boss, timer).
And of course, a rare item given on pvp leaderboard and vet trial who can upgrade a jewelry's color may be an idea too.

silvereyes

RoyJade wrote: »

Gold jewelries should be given by chest with the treasure hunter's passive, and/or treasures maps

I don't think I'd like gold jewelry to be a normal treasure chest or treasure map drop, for several reasons:

• I don't want farmers to have the ability to earn 200-500k gold just for opening treasure chests.
• For overworld drops, only dolmens drop jewelry. Making normal chests drop them would be inconsistent.
• Treasure maps only point to overworld zones, so they wouldn't work for BoP dungeon jewelry.
• I don't want treasure chests perpetually emptied by farmers looking for a big score.
• For "elite" gear like monster helms, the philosophy this release is to avoid situations where you work for hours and hours and then get shafted by RNG. Making gold jewelry an RNG based drop is inconsistent with that philosophy. (I'm also looking at you vMA drops _._)
• IMO, people shouldn't be unable to receive gold jewelry just because they decide not to put CP into treasure hunter. It's kind of a wasted tree unless you are an active farmer, and I'd much prefer that gold jewels were a reward for doing content, not farming.

shrb

The problem with the boe jewelry on The Golden is availability and flipping.

Take any new player, p.e. me:
I won't initially be able to acquire X set jewelry that I want for my set because I'm not yet at this point (money/gear/etc wise)
But if all sets have their golden jewellery only available through that, that means that a full rotation may take more than a year.

So, when I eventually reach that point in the game, My only access to the jewellery would be to buy them from a flipper for absurd amounts of money, or wait a full year till they return, IF they return, to the rotation.

So, an accessible, non random, way to acquire those (farming, boss drops, etc) NEEDS to exist.

The alternative is people with enough cash to buy Y sets and then flip them over for double+ profits because they will be sure that they are the only source of X item for at least a year...

redspecter23

Orsinium set drops are STILL bind on pickup. Can you please make them bind on equip?

I opened the treasure vault in White Gold Tower and noticed that all 6 of the current live sets were dropping instead of what should be just the 3 sets that will still be dropping there after the update.

Dubhliam

shrb wrote: »

The problem with the boe jewelry on The Golden is availability and flipping.

Take any new player, p.e. me:
I won't initially be able to acquire X set jewelry that I want for my set because I'm not yet at this point (money/gear/etc wise)
But if all sets have their golden jewellery only available through that, that means that a full rotation may take more than a year.

So, when I eventually reach that point in the game, My only access to the jewellery would be to buy them from a flipper for absurd amounts of money, or wait a full year till they return, IF they return, to the rotation.

So, an accessible, non random, way to acquire those (farming, boss drops, etc) NEEDS to exist.

The alternative is people with enough cash to buy Y sets and then flip them over for double+ profits because they will be sure that they are the only source of X item for at least a year...

Explain to me why a new player should have instant access to Legendary gear?
I mean, the difference from epic to legendary is 3,7%.
3,7%!
Instant gratification was never and will never be a winning combination for gameplay.

shrb

Dubhliam wrote: »

shrb wrote: »

The problem with the boe jewelry on The Golden is availability and flipping.

Take any new player, p.e. me:
I won't initially be able to acquire X set jewelry that I want for my set because I'm not yet at this point (money/gear/etc wise)
But if all sets have their golden jewellery only available through that, that means that a full rotation may take more than a year.

So, when I eventually reach that point in the game, My only access to the jewellery would be to buy them from a flipper for absurd amounts of money, or wait a full year till they return, IF they return, to the rotation.

So, an accessible, non random, way to acquire those (farming, boss drops, etc) NEEDS to exist.

The alternative is people with enough cash to buy Y sets and then flip them over for double+ profits because they will be sure that they are the only source of X item for at least a year...

Explain to me why a new player should have instant access to Legendary gear?
I mean, the difference from epic to legendary is 3,7%.
3,7%!
Instant gratification was never and will never be a winning combination for gameplay.

I never said instant.

if anything, I said that it could be in any way: i.e. from a vet boss
the thing is, it NEEDS to be accessible from somewhere outside players who happenned to to buy them when they became available.

as long as players know that they have something "that no one can find it outside them in no way, shape, or form" for 1year+ (judging by the amount of sets that exist and that only 1 boe set in merchant) then that basically translates to massive flipping.

simply imagine that they gave a tradeable bonus that only CB players have p.e. Would you be ok with it?
because that's 100% the same
because for a new player that's the system now: items accessible ONLY for old players and in no way accessible for new

for gear progression, 1 year real time, with patches, changes, expansions and etc, it basically means "forever"

runagate

olsborg wrote: »

Idea for @Wrobel : a new monster set.

>Gladiators mask<

1 set: 400 critical resistance.
2 set: Whenever you are hit by a monster mask set (like velidreth, selene or valkyn) you take no dmg from it and you gain 10 ultimate.

It would be really weird to play a character wearing a mask that looked like Will "Gladiator Helmet Face" Sasso.




I'd wear a BKJ mask, though. It would make you look ssss'ol n clo' t'dea'

evedgebah

I was very dissapointed that most of the heavy armor sets only have Healthy jewelry, even for ones that previously had Arcane or Robust. For example the set that made me most excited to have back was Soulshine. I had full arcane Jewelry back when it was the highest level gear available. Now, the rings and necklace are Healthy only ( or my hours of farming it on the test server were VERy unlucky). I didn't test farm other sets, but I fear the result is the same.

Please consider having jewelry that is healthy also drop with Arcane/Robust as would best match the sets' primary association.

Dubhliam

evedgebah wrote: »

I was very dissapointed that most of the heavy armor sets only have Healthy jewelry, even for ones that previously had Arcane or Robust. For example the set that made me most excited to have back was Soulshine. I had full arcane Jewelry back when it was the highest level gear available. Now, the rings and necklace are Healthy only ( or my hours of farming it on the test server were VERy unlucky). I didn't test farm other sets, but I fear the result is the same.

Please consider having jewelry that is healthy also drop with Arcane/Robust as would best match the sets' primary association.

I second this.
With 8 available traits for every other piece of gear, I don't get why jewelry is locked into one.
As if having 3 traits would somehow pollute the loot tables.
...riiiight.

STEVIL

evedgebah wrote: »

I was very dissapointed that most of the heavy armor sets only have Healthy jewelry, even for ones that previously had Arcane or Robust. For example the set that made me most excited to have back was Soulshine. I had full arcane Jewelry back when it was the highest level gear available. Now, the rings and necklace are Healthy only ( or my hours of farming it on the test server were VERy unlucky). I didn't test farm other sets, but I fear the result is the same.

Please consider having jewelry that is healthy also drop with Arcane/Robust as would best match the sets' primary association.

Should all sets get the ssme treatment? All sets jewelry appear in arcane, robust and healthy?

arkansas_ESO

Reposting here:



These are my stats with 5 Black Rose, 5 Draugr Hulk, 1pc Selene, 1pc Tremor Scale. No Battle Spirit (so add 5k health for PVP), no War Horn, not in WW form, no potion buff. With 5 heavy and Black Rose, you can sustain perfectly well with 1.1k regen.

For comparison, these are my stats on my magic NB with 5pc Clever Alchemist, 5pc Necropotence, 3pc Willpower. No Battle Spirit buff, no War Horn, not a vampire, with a magic potion buff and Clever Alchemist procced. I only have 50k magic on my DW bar, with 45k on my resto bar.



Even with 1800 recovery, I myself struggling to maintain my resources in prolonged fights. Unlike my stam sorc, who can exchange all of his magicka for stamina with Dark Deal, I have no "trash stat" that I can exchange for more magicka. Even if given the option to trade stamina for magicka, I wouldn't do it, as that means I'd likely die the next time I got CCed.

Basically, what I'm getting at is this: the Draugr Hulk set drastically widens the gap between magicka and stamina. I'm using strong, short-duration buffs like Clever Alchemist and sacrificing both tankiness and sustain to get high stats on magic NB, and stamina is still able to get superior stats without sacrificing much of anything. I strongly, strongly urge ZOS to completely rework this set or remove it before One Tamriel launches, as it will only further imbalance the game.

WuffyCerulei

STEVIL wrote: »

arkansas_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for the itemization changes in One Tamriel. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Did you receive an item that changes or impacts your current build/abilities?

[*] The 2pc set that pulls people to you lo
[*] Are you happier with the new quest objective rewards?
[*] Which of the new sets are you most looking forward to, and why?
[*] Are there any new sets you would like to see changed?
[*] Do you have any other general feedback?
[/list]

wolfninja101b14_ESO wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno Please change the horrible 5-piece bonus for the Light Singer set to extra spell damage to magic damage abilites:

Restoration staff abilities DO NO DAMAGE WHATSOEVER. That set is possible the mos usless I've seen in the game so far. Changing the bonus to magic damage will also combat the overpowered Automaton set:

For stamina builds, the Automaton jack is amazing, as a 4 weapon skill lines and several class skills deal a lot of physical damage. However, with magicka builds, you'd have to use special kind of damage to be half decent. The new sets are more so for stamina builds, which are already the meta. Please, just change the bonus to be more useful. PLEASE.

FYI spell damage increases how much damage OR healing your spells do, that means that Light Singer set increases your resto staff heals. That being said, I'd be all for making it a generic "Add 386 spell damage to your Magic damage abilities", as that would make it very useful for magic Templar and magic NB.

Uhh
If you change it to only add in for abilities that do magic damage you lose the healing bonus.

There is the Healer's Habit set that already increases healing done.

silvereyes

I have several unbound formerly bind-on-equip set pieces in my guild bank from the NA account copy that should now be bind-on-pickup (Warlock, Lich, etc). However, the tooltip says they are still BoE, and they stay that way when I withdraw the pieces from the bank. I can then re-deposit them to the guild bank with no issues, so they are definitely still BoE.

I suspected that the BoP drops are actually new base item ids in the loot tables, so I compared the item links from live and PTS for the Ebon Necklace that appears on the PvP golden vendor on PTS right now.

The two neck pieces are identical in every way except for BoE vs BoP. And they have completely different base item ids.

Does this mean that any BoE items currently in player inventory will remain BoE, even after update 12 goes live? Those specific item ids just won't drop anymore?

Live Ebon Necklace CP160 Legendary Healthy Bind-on-Equip
|H1:item:73154:364:50:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0|h|h


PTS Ebon Necklace CP160 Legendary Healthy Bind-on-Equip
|H1:item:106148:364:50:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:30:0:0:0:0:0|h|h

static_recharge

Do you have any other general feedback?

• Key Fragments (previously known as Bone Shards)
• Monsters in Imperial City will now drop Key Fragments by default, and have had their drop rates adjusted.

This is not true. Bone Shards still drop and are not renamed to Key Fragments.

Katinas

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for the itemization changes in One Tamriel. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Are there any new sets you would like to see changed?
• Do you have any other general feedback?

I will post my feedback on healing sets.

Monster Sets.

Nightflame: The "buff" from 2% proc chance to 3% is the ultimate joke of the only healing monster set we had for ages. I'm sorry ZOS, this is absolutely unacceptable. I know of many fellow players who can confirm while healing content using this set: it barely ever procs during a whole dungeon run and it makes it completely nonviable in trials.
Proposed change: Please, 2% and 3% are in no way anywhere near good enough. Buff it to 20% or even more and increase the healing done to make up for it being the most useless monster set for such a long time!

Chokethorn: Healing yourself or an ally one every 10 sec with a 15% chance is extremely low.
Proposed change: It either has to be an AOE heal that heals up to 6 friendly targets, or much higher proc chance.

Rkugamz: 2% Healing Done from one piece is lackluster. The equivalent set piece bonus of Healing Received from one part is always 4% as many sets have this bonus.
Proposed change: Please adjust it so that Healing Done is also 4% and not 2%. 15 seconds cooldown is extremely long. Even 10 sec is not acceptable for a healing set. I would stronly suggest to lower it to 6 or maximum 8 seconds.

Troll King: Again, 2% Healing Done from one piece is discriminating healers, please buff it to 4%. Health Recovery is one of the least useful effects.
Proposed change: I would suggest to change it to Major Vitality: if they are still below 60% Health, grant them Major Vitality, increasing their Healing Taken by 30% for 10 seconds. This would be a lore friendly change in that trolls in Tamriel are known to be tough to kill.

5 piece sets.

Lamia's Song: This is a nice set but I fear that it will proc on toggle ultimate that Sorcerers have: Overload.
Proposed change: Leave it as it is just make sure it does not proc on Overload activation (it can proc on actually shooting Overload attacks, but not on simply toggling into and out of the Overload).

Light Speaker: Max Health is a bad bonus to have on a healing set.
Proposed change: Please change the first bonus from Max Health to either Max Magicka or Magicka Recovery.

Healing Mage: It is great to have this set back at CP160!
Proposed change: If anything, two piece set bonus could be the Healing Done 4% to be a more lore friendly bonus fitting the name of the set.

Combat Physician: I like this set as it is.
Proposed change: 8k damage shield is a little too weak on the other hand, closer to 10k would be more desirable.

Prayer Shawl: Lowish proc chance and a very low damage shield. 2.5k over 6 seconds is just unnoticeable. When we're talking about damage shields anything that is in the region of 10-20% of player's health over 6 seconds is just not worth five gear slots and not using in your build.
Proposed change: Significantly increase the damage shield and a small buff to proc chance would be great too.

Stendarr's Embrace: 30 seconds cooldown is for sets that grant you something extremely powerful, not for a one chance in two to cleanse negative effects. I don't see this set being seriously considered as a set one would use.
Proposed change: Cut the cooldown to 10-12 seconds.

Worm's Raiment: Great to see the Healing Taken bonus being changed to Magicka Recovery!
Proposed change: Leave it as it is, it is again a very viable set for healers.

Other observations regarding healing sets.

With the changes to named items (non set items with unique names) now becoming a part of sets I would urge you guys to make sure that the purpose of a set that favors healing, or tanking, or dealing magicka damage, or dealing stamina damage would reflect in traits that the items have. For example, if in White-Gold Tower we can now loot a Restoration Staff of Spell Power Cure and it has a Defending trait then that staff is worth next to nothing. Similarly if we get a One Hand Sword of Wrath of Imperium with a Charged trait then again that sword is worthless in a tanking build. Please, make a smart system for traits. Precise/Powered for healing weapons, Defending/Decisive for tanking, Sharpened/Precise for damage weapons and so on. I don't mind looting a bad trait weapon every once in a while, but I would like a significantly increased drop chance of a "good" trait weapon. ZOS devs, use this chance to show that you guys understand what playerbase wants and buff the good trait drop chances now that you are making big changes in drop system!

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Finn @ZOS_RichLambert

HeroOfNone

Just to note, some of the unique named item drops in vet city of ash 2 dI'd not drop as a set item. Fire maw fang, the ash titan's cleaver, urtha's (sp?) All dropped without set bonuses. This seems off compared to how most other pieces are dropping for players.

Also, embershield and sunder flame's values need to be increased significantly at the CP 160 level with theur 5 piece bonus. Maybe from the 3k to around 5k or 6k, respectively.

Rykmaar

@ZOS_GinaBruno @Wrobel

I'm usually very critical of this game as a TES fanboy and 20+year mmo dude, but I'm going to go out here and support the theme of the changes you guys are making here.

Making dungeon set drops BoP is good. Making trial drops BoP is good. I believe this because I think ZoS has to start designing PvE from a progression perspective. In my opinion, ZoS needs to take a page from other MMOs' books and make tiered PvE content and then make the BoP PvE sets tilted towards being very strong for (if not required for) each progressive tier of content. Make these progressive sets of items have specific buffs in PvE content, and make them stronger in each iteration as you progress -- much like the current BoP trial sets are.

This makes the crafted sets/farmable sets very strong entry level options for a player entering the PvE fray, but it doesn't let crafted sets outperform almost all dedicated PvE sets locked behind content as TBS does now and this is critically important if you want people to play the content you create.

Each tier should have unique sets that support the player's role in the next tier of content. That gives people a reason to trudge through trial content. That will inspire people to stay invested in progressive PvE.

.02

However, this decision is completely killing the PvE focused player who makes money off of selling BoE gear. In fact, it's not only removing their income, but forcing them to spend money on gold necklaces from PvP vendors. I don't think that is fair either. In principle, you're robbing PvE players of income, and that doesn't leave a very good taste in their mouths. Some intermediate option should be implemented like a token system or something.

The latter effect sounds like a gold sink, to be honest. I think gold sinks are needed in this game -- badly. But it's gotta be a good sink, not arbitrary ones like this.

Rykmaar

Also, @ZOS_GinaBruno @Wrobel

One thing I forgot to mention that is a problem is that the upgrade system guts progression and the reason to do things.

If I can get a blue from normal, and upgrade it to gold myself, what incentive do I have to do vet hardmode? Honestly, none.

That is a problem.

Maybe you should make the trial sets stronger at their intended purpose and make them un upgradable.

.02

Jaronking

Can anyone tell me if impen drops in any of the dungeons sets?

silvereyes

Rykmaar wrote: »

If I can get a blue from normal, and upgrade it to gold myself, what incentive do I have to do vet hardmode? Honestly, none.

Vet hard mode trials drop legendary jewelry. You can't upgrade jewelry.

Rykmaar

silvereyes wrote: »

Rykmaar wrote: »

If I can get a blue from normal, and upgrade it to gold myself, what incentive do I have to do vet hardmode? Honestly, none.

Vet hard mode trials drop legendary jewelry. You can't upgrade jewelry.

I know. Legendary jewels are the only thing locked behind vet mode. I don't think that's enough to encourage progression -- especially when the stat differences are as small as they are.

Wolfchild07

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Do you have any other general feedback?

Salvation set + werewolf

Weapon damage bonus needs to be higher than Hunding's Rage or it's just not worth using. 33% reduction in werewolf ult cost doesn't justify it. The 150 extra weapon damage is not enough. And no, Hunding's + Salvation is not a good combination, there are better sets to use with Hunding's.