Icereach PC NA (Mulaamnir/Kyne/BWB NA PC - Final)

MopeyHat

TipsyDrow wrote: »

Adenoma wrote: »

Some people have been playing longer than you and have repeatedly said that alliance populations and the dominant alliance changes every couple of months.

I've been playing for quite a long time and AD has always had population advantage. Most of that time was spent in AD. Nothing has changed since i came back to the game and rolled DC. Nothing. I don't complain about it, just stating a truth as for some reason people simply to refuse to see truth. Again. Play how ya want. I'm gonna jump in the middle of your zerg and do my thing until I need to respawn. I don't shy away, I don't run into towers, I don't backpedal holding the S key light attacking with a bow. I'm in your face until I'm dead. I just wish all of you would stop trying to justify this population imbalance as ok and good for the game. It isn't. I wish you would stop saying that sending everyone person in your faction at one is skillful or tactical, it isn't.

But...that isn't true.

I have been playing PVP in Blackwater since summer 2015. When I first started, EP was dominant. Between then and Thieves Guild drop, when champion points were removed from the campaign, DC regularly owned the campaign. I recall that AD may have won the campaign twice in a row perhaps once.

Were you there when every day we woke up with trikeeps taken? Do you not remember? Before Thieves Guild, it was rare for the map to not flip completely overnight. If we had the population advantage at all, it was only during NA evening.

But it's not like I wrote down and recorded everything.

If you're displeased with the way ZOS handles player population in campaigns, perhaps you should send a /feedback or make a poll or something. I don't think you're convincing many from this thread.

MopeyHat

Double post :P

Lumsdenml

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

We have been fighting AD for the past 4 hours and have not engaged dc at all today. That's because ad has emp. Remember, you only see a small portion of BwB and make large assumptions on everything else.

I don't make "assumptions", I make observations based on factual events and pasterns I have witnessed over the half a year I've spent in BWB. It was refreshing to log in and see EP doing what they should do for once, most of DC was shocked (in a good way) to see EP trying to dethrone and try to get their scrolls back.

Great work.

Sorry, you do make assumptions. Those assumptions are based off observations, however, they are still assumptions. You can not possibly know what everyone is doing in BWB and why they are doing it.

vamp_emily

MopeyHat wrote: »

If you're displeased with the way ZOS handles player population in campaigns, perhaps you should send a /feedback or make a poll or something. I don't think you're convincing many from this thread.

The ones that are not convinced are the players on AD.

A friend of mine asked me to come to BwB to help Dethrone, this is how it went.

- I say yes
- We make our way to Roe, and EP attacks Ales ( hmmm doesn't that sound familiar )
- I go to Ales and help wipe EP
- I look at the map and it is AD poplocked, DC 2 bars
- I log out

It is pretty sad.. I hope you guys are having a blast but I am not supporting this game play.

TipsyDrow

MopeyHat wrote: »

TipsyDrow wrote: »

Adenoma wrote: »

Some people have been playing longer than you and have repeatedly said that alliance populations and the dominant alliance changes every couple of months.

I've been playing for quite a long time and AD has always had population advantage. Most of that time was spent in AD. Nothing has changed since i came back to the game and rolled DC. Nothing. I don't complain about it, just stating a truth as for some reason people simply to refuse to see truth. Again. Play how ya want. I'm gonna jump in the middle of your zerg and do my thing until I need to respawn. I don't shy away, I don't run into towers, I don't backpedal holding the S key light attacking with a bow. I'm in your face until I'm dead. I just wish all of you would stop trying to justify this population imbalance as ok and good for the game. It isn't. I wish you would stop saying that sending everyone person in your faction at one is skillful or tactical, it isn't.

But...that isn't true.

I have been playing PVP in Blackwater since summer 2015. When I first started, EP was dominant. Between then and Thieves Guild drop, when champion points were removed from the campaign, DC regularly owned the campaign. I recall that AD may have won the campaign twice in a row perhaps once.

Were you there when every day we woke up with trikeeps taken? Do you not remember? Before Thieves Guild, it was rare for the map to not flip completely overnight. If we had the population advantage at all, it was only during NA evening.

But it's not like I wrote down and recorded everything.

If you're displeased with the way ZOS handles player population in campaigns, perhaps you should send a /feedback or make a poll or something. I don't think you're convincing many from this thread.

Not quite how it was Mopey. While it may be true that DC night capped the map back then, I was AD then remember? From 7pm est to 1am est AD simply Zerged the entire map back on most occasions. During that time DC had no chance to hold anything. The only time pvp was good or even close to being healthy was maybe between 3pm est and 7pm when factions were basically evenly populated. That wasn't healthy or good pvp back then and it isn't now. I logged a character into Azuras the other day saw the exact opposite population imbalance and apparently it's DC doing the massive zergs there. That isn't good for pvp on that campaign either. I promptly logged out because I also have little to no desire to be part of of a gargantuan zerg mowing down 6 people vs 50. I'm not saying Cyrodiil isn't for large scale battles. It is!! But not like it currently stands. Eventually what is going to happen to bwb is what has happened to Azuras. You will have 85% AD and the campaign will be a farce like others. Whoever on AD side is organizing these huge zergs is ruining pvp in BWB for everyone, yourself included and ya'll can't even see it coming.

vamp_emily

If you goto the link please remember I was fairly new, but this is my very first post on the forums.

Back then it was EP never ending population. I fought almost every single EP zerge back then during prime time then and it drains the energy right out of you, but I stayed. Now it is AD saying it is ok, but then it was EP telling me I was wrong.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/221031/blackwaters-non-vet-pc-na-ep-zerges-needs-to-be-stopped/p1

Tanneza

vamp_emily wrote: »

Tanneza wrote: »

Aw dang I was hoping we'd hold on our Emp keeps Time to dethrone againnn.... GG AD!

Just curious, did you reach an agreement with AD. Let them have BRK if they promise not to attack EP. Half the time you guys are at Ales fighting when you don't even own BRK.

Honestly I try to tell the pugs that dethrone is always top priority, but I can't control all of them, so sometimes EP will just be EP.... just like today

Lumsdenml

vamp_emily wrote: »

If you goto the link please remember I was fairly new, but this is my very first post on the forums.

Back then it was EP never ending population. I fought almost every single EP zerge back then during prime time then and it drains the energy right out of you, but I stayed. Now it is AD saying it is ok, but then it was EP telling me I was wrong.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/221031/blackwaters-non-vet-pc-na-ep-zerges-needs-to-be-stopped/p1

So you should know that pop fluctuates....

Adenoma

imgur.com/a/TYsyU

Some folks followed us, but we thought they still looked great. We finally returned the scroll to its rightful seat in Bruma. Or is it Burma? That might be more running than 45 minutes can handle.

W0lf_z13

nice... ad at trikeeps again when dc has nothing......

Adenoma

I logged immediately after they recovered the scroll and we took that picture.

Candivino

Lumsdenml wrote: »

vamp_emily wrote: »

If you goto the link please remember I was fairly new, but this is my very first post on the forums.

Back then it was EP never ending population. I fought almost every single EP zerge back then during prime time then and it drains the energy right out of you, but I stayed. Now it is AD saying it is ok, but then it was EP telling me I was wrong.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/221031/blackwaters-non-vet-pc-na-ep-zerges-needs-to-be-stopped/p1

So you should know that pop fluctuates....

You'd think she'd know that by now.

ChapterMasterV

TipsyDrow wrote: »

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

TipsyDrow wrote: »

Setana_Shial wrote: »

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ wrote: »

Setana_Shial wrote: »

More like hunting down lone DC who think they have all the skill in the world. However once you learn to revile them from their stealth they drop like a sack of potatoes.

Would you like to duel right now, I record it, and we post our findings here?

Or did you mean "hunting down lone DC with a zerg backing me up" ?

So my 6 is a zerg? Ok.
I have been having fun with my small group pvp then people cry over getting in small scale pvp with us. Wow ok that is a sane thought. A lone DC nightblade gets spotted so we kill it as the other dc that was nearby hit stealth and left. Dead DC gets t-bagged then a hate whisper is received we ride somewhere else looking for another fight.
So now matter what a AD player does they get called noob or that they have no skill?
Just seems like some can never accept that they died in a pvp environment where anything goes.
*sigh* I guess some think they are superman and get upset when they get killed.
Oh well life goes on, see you all on the battlefield tomorrow.

6v1 and a teabag, you're a legit pvper. Duel Sora. Or if you don't wanna play in the big boy league duel me. Puttin it out there. I will 1v1 anyone in your guild, anytime. Oh...wait, you guys only make *group builds*

I did 1v1 you, up at the rock near Glademaist. You lost. I am in his guild.

You 1v1'd me with the other guy sniping me.
1+1=1
Math is hard.

No, the SECOND time was a 2v1, the first time was 1v1, no assistance.

TipsyDrow

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

TipsyDrow wrote: »

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

TipsyDrow wrote: »

Setana_Shial wrote: »

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ wrote: »

Setana_Shial wrote: »

More like hunting down lone DC who think they have all the skill in the world. However once you learn to revile them from their stealth they drop like a sack of potatoes.

Would you like to duel right now, I record it, and we post our findings here?

Or did you mean "hunting down lone DC with a zerg backing me up" ?

So my 6 is a zerg? Ok.
I have been having fun with my small group pvp then people cry over getting in small scale pvp with us. Wow ok that is a sane thought. A lone DC nightblade gets spotted so we kill it as the other dc that was nearby hit stealth and left. Dead DC gets t-bagged then a hate whisper is received we ride somewhere else looking for another fight.
So now matter what a AD player does they get called noob or that they have no skill?
Just seems like some can never accept that they died in a pvp environment where anything goes.
*sigh* I guess some think they are superman and get upset when they get killed.
Oh well life goes on, see you all on the battlefield tomorrow.

6v1 and a teabag, you're a legit pvper. Duel Sora. Or if you don't wanna play in the big boy league duel me. Puttin it out there. I will 1v1 anyone in your guild, anytime. Oh...wait, you guys only make *group builds*

I did 1v1 you, up at the rock near Glademaist. You lost. I am in his guild.

You 1v1'd me with the other guy sniping me.
1+1=1
Math is hard.

No, the SECOND time was a 2v1, the first time was 1v1, no assistance.

And you are in game?

ChapterMasterV

@TipsyDrow Not atm

TipsyDrow

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

@TipsyDrow Not atm

Your name in game.......I don't know who you are.

ChapterMasterV

TipsyDrow wrote: »

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

@TipsyDrow Not atm

Your name in game.......I don't know who you are.

Cause I just logged on, wasn't when I posted, and doing all my wrtis and such

TipsyDrow

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

TipsyDrow wrote: »

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

@TipsyDrow Not atm

Your name in game.......I don't know who you are.

Cause I just logged on, wasn't when I posted, and doing all my wrtis and such

For the love of god what is your in game name???

ChapterMasterV

TipsyDrow wrote: »

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

TipsyDrow wrote: »

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

@TipsyDrow Not atm

Your name in game.......I don't know who you are.

Cause I just logged on, wasn't when I posted, and doing all my wrtis and such

For the love of god what is your in game name???

Sorry, thought you said I was on, my in game name is Alex, when I killed you, Alex Heir to the Throne.

TipsyDrow

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

TipsyDrow wrote: »

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

TipsyDrow wrote: »

ChapterMasterV wrote: »

@TipsyDrow Not atm

Your name in game.......I don't know who you are.

Cause I just logged on, wasn't when I posted, and doing all my wrtis and such

For the love of god what is your in game name???

Sorry, thought you said I was on, my in game name is Alex, when I killed you, Alex Heir to the Throne.

Oh, ok then. thought you were in Knight Blader I always see you running with the dresses. Kudos to you, you caught me on my siege. No tbaggin, no douchebaggery. Good kill. I will return the decency in game.

Freakquent

Did you guys hear about ZOS having a new edition to the game? ESO Gold edition. $60, comes with ALL of the DLCs and the game.
I paid $80 for the game w/ just imperial edition.

Sreja_Bone

W0lf_z13 wrote: »

nice... ad at trikeeps again when dc has nothing......

Saw that a couple of times yesterday. When you ask why in zone, you get intelligent answers like "Why not?". When you explain it kills pop, so no one to fight, they go quiet and keep right on. At least that was the case when they did it to EP early in the day. In that case the answer was " Better dead than red" which is no more intelligent but made me remember me long lost youth .

So the guys I group with finally took our ball and bat and went to do one of the new dungeons. That second to last boss in Mazzutun is miserable if you go in blind, not knowing the mechanic.

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ

Lumsdenml wrote: »

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

We have been fighting AD for the past 4 hours and have not engaged dc at all today. That's because ad has emp. Remember, you only see a small portion of BwB and make large assumptions on everything else.

I don't make "assumptions", I make observations based on factual events and pasterns I have witnessed over the half a year I've spent in BWB. It was refreshing to log in and see EP doing what they should do for once, most of DC was shocked (in a good way) to see EP trying to dethrone and try to get their scrolls back.

Great work.

Sorry, you do make assumptions. Those assumptions are based off observations, however, they are still assumptions. You can not possibly know what everyone is doing in BWB and why they are doing it.

I'm sorry that you take things out of context. I never claimed to know what EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in BWB is doing & it's silly to claim otherwise. My observations are based on what the bulk of the faction is doing.

Example: DC takes Alessia farm and sieges Alessia from the west side. If EP wanted to help dethrone they take the mine and siege the east side. Instead EP moves around the lumbermill and attacks DC from behind sandwiching us between AD sieging/sniping/spamming radiant destruction and dark flare off of walls and EP fighting our backside outside.

We monitor the map as EP attacks us and notice EP is not attempting to fight AD at any location, only us. Then we notice Chalman is flagged by EP. We continue to attempt to dethrone, no problem Chal is an EP home keep. Then we notice Bleakers is flagged. Yeah sure, take Bleakers np. Then we notice Aleswell is flagged... alright we may have to pull out to defend what we have... but we keep pushing the dethrone fighting EP at our backs and AD on walls.

We get inside of Alessia and notice EP is sieging us from behind on the hill. We lose Aleswell to EP. Okay... then we notice Glade is flagged by EP. Finally we abandon the dethrone attempt, go outside and wipe EP, go past the lumbermill and die in the water to blood port back and defend Glade.

This is what happened earlier this week (2 dethrones ago). I am not "making assumptions". I am speaking from experience on exactly what happens. The dethrone after this we DC did all the work ourselves again, and at the last keep (Roe) EP was outside at our backs again but this time we had the numbers to easily wipe them and press on.

I haven't been on except maybe 30mins during the dethrone attempt last night so I'm not sure if it was pulled off or not, but if it was, it was the first time I've seen EP do anything logical in a long time.

It's not an "assumption" when you are the one leading the charge and monitoring the moves the other factions are making. When you are there seeing for yourself what is going on, you're not "assuming".I didn't claim I knew what every single player is doing. If during the dethrone attempt there was 1 EP sitting at Kingscrest ERPing with an NPC, I wouldn't know. I'm talking about what the bulk of the faction is doing.

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ

Lumsdenml wrote: »

vamp_emily wrote: »

If you goto the link please remember I was fairly new, but this is my very first post on the forums.

Back then it was EP never ending population. I fought almost every single EP zerge back then during prime time then and it drains the energy right out of you, but I stayed. Now it is AD saying it is ok, but then it was EP telling me I was wrong.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/221031/blackwaters-non-vet-pc-na-ep-zerges-needs-to-be-stopped/p1

So you should know that pop fluctuates....

You can't call something "fluctuating" when it changes once in a blue moon.

vamp_emily

Candivino wrote: »

You'd think she'd know that by now.

Maybe you missed my comment earlier.

Do you not get it? It not about EP or AD or DC.. it is about campaign balance

I don't care if EP is overpopulated 1 day, or DC/AD is over populated the next day. It just isn't fair having 2 bars against a poplock.

Lumsdenml

OK, boys, uncle. I'm crying uncle. This thread ceased to be fun about 2 threads ago, but I hung in there hoping the complaining and machismo would die down, but it hasn't. I also found myself being drawn into it, which I will rectify. So, you guys won. Congratulations. You are totally right about everything, as I'm sure you know. So long, and thanks for all the fish.

EdmundTowers

MopeyHat wrote: »

TipsyDrow wrote: »

Adenoma wrote: »

Some people have been playing longer than you and have repeatedly said that alliance populations and the dominant alliance changes every couple of months.

I've been playing for quite a long time and AD has always had population advantage. Most of that time was spent in AD. Nothing has changed since i came back to the game and rolled DC. Nothing. I don't complain about it, just stating a truth as for some reason people simply to refuse to see truth. Again. Play how ya want. I'm gonna jump in the middle of your zerg and do my thing until I need to respawn. I don't shy away, I don't run into towers, I don't backpedal holding the S key light attacking with a bow. I'm in your face until I'm dead. I just wish all of you would stop trying to justify this population imbalance as ok and good for the game. It isn't. I wish you would stop saying that sending everyone person in your faction at one is skillful or tactical, it isn't.

But...that isn't true.

I have been playing PVP in Blackwater since summer 2015. When I first started, EP was dominant. Between then and Thieves Guild drop, when champion points were removed from the campaign, DC regularly owned the campaign. I recall that AD may have won the campaign twice in a row perhaps once.

Were you there when every day we woke up with trikeeps taken? Do you not remember? Before Thieves Guild, it was rare for the map to not flip completely overnight. If we had the population advantage at all, it was only during NA evening.

But it's not like I wrote down and recorded everything.

If you're displeased with the way ZOS handles player population in campaigns, perhaps you should send a /feedback or make a poll or something. I don't think you're convincing many from this thread.

Yup, that's how I remember it too. When AD started winning a few weeks, the same thing happened as is happening now. Whine Whine. "AD zerging down the campaign and killing it". Then summer started and the pop advantage went to DC and they were zerging it up.


You didn't see us whining about that. We just played it out.

The Month of July was pretty good. 3 bars and pop locks all around in prime time. Even EP had pop lock. Scoreboards in campaign were close during those weeks. So DC had their pop then but now they don't. Actually, they do still have their pop, as I have shown in pictures already, it's just they don't stick around anymore. I think some of them have been switching to AD.

Like yesterday, It was 3 bar ad vs 3 bar dc and 2 bar ep. After getting zerged down at Nik and Alessia. We were down to our last emp keep awaiting an epic dethrone fight. Nope. DC and EP came to ROE in small waves instead of bringing their entire factions together. And a group of DC were trying to raid scrolls instead of dethroning. The moment the Scroll raid failed near Brindle, DC loses a pop bar and AD gains one more.

So DC should be figuring out ways to keep their pop, organize it better, and throw them all in one direction, cuz they've done it before easily. And if you want EP to work with you, well here are some EP leaders willing to work with opposing factions. Take advantage of that, talk with them, and work something out.

Dysturbedfan

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

We have been fighting AD for the past 4 hours and have not engaged dc at all today. That's because ad has emp. Remember, you only see a small portion of BwB and make large assumptions on everything else.

I don't make "assumptions", I make observations based on factual events and pasterns I have witnessed over the half a year I've spent in BWB. It was refreshing to log in and see EP doing what they should do for once, most of DC was shocked (in a good way) to see EP trying to dethrone and try to get their scrolls back.

Great work.

Sorry, you do make assumptions. Those assumptions are based off observations, however, they are still assumptions. You can not possibly know what everyone is doing in BWB and why they are doing it.

I'm sorry that you take things out of context. I never claimed to know what EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in BWB is doing & it's silly to claim otherwise. My observations are based on what the bulk of the faction is doing.

Example: DC takes Alessia farm and sieges Alessia from the west side. If EP wanted to help dethrone they take the mine and siege the east side. Instead EP moves around the lumbermill and attacks DC from behind sandwiching us between AD sieging/sniping/spamming radiant destruction and dark flare off of walls and EP fighting our backside outside.

We monitor the map as EP attacks us and notice EP is not attempting to fight AD at any location, only us. Then we notice Chalman is flagged by EP. We continue to attempt to dethrone, no problem Chal is an EP home keep. Then we notice Bleakers is flagged. Yeah sure, take Bleakers np. Then we notice Aleswell is flagged... alright we may have to pull out to defend what we have... but we keep pushing the dethrone fighting EP at our backs and AD on walls.

We get inside of Alessia and notice EP is sieging us from behind on the hill. We lose Aleswell to EP. Okay... then we notice Glade is flagged by EP. Finally we abandon the dethrone attempt, go outside and wipe EP, go past the lumbermill and die in the water to blood port back and defend Glade.

This is what happened earlier this week (2 dethrones ago). I am not "making assumptions". I am speaking from experience on exactly what happens. The dethrone after this we DC did all the work ourselves again, and at the last keep (Roe) EP was outside at our backs again but this time we had the numbers to easily wipe them and press on.

I haven't been on except maybe 30mins during the dethrone attempt last night so I'm not sure if it was pulled off or not, but if it was, it was the first time I've seen EP do anything logical in a long time.

It's not an "assumption" when you are the one leading the charge and monitoring the moves the other factions are making. When you are there seeing for yourself what is going on, you're not "assuming".I didn't claim I knew what every single player is doing. If during the dethrone attempt there was 1 EP sitting at Kingscrest ERPing with an NPC, I wouldn't know. I'm talking about what the bulk of the faction is doing.

That ERPing part gave me a good chuckle lol

Setana_Shial

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

ȽσƦÐŞσƦѦ wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

We have been fighting AD for the past 4 hours and have not engaged dc at all today. That's because ad has emp. Remember, you only see a small portion of BwB and make large assumptions on everything else.

I don't make "assumptions", I make observations based on factual events and pasterns I have witnessed over the half a year I've spent in BWB. It was refreshing to log in and see EP doing what they should do for once, most of DC was shocked (in a good way) to see EP trying to dethrone and try to get their scrolls back.

Great work.

Sorry, you do make assumptions. Those assumptions are based off observations, however, they are still assumptions. You can not possibly know what everyone is doing in BWB and why they are doing it.

I'm sorry that you take things out of context. I never claimed to know what EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in BWB is doing & it's silly to claim otherwise. My observations are based on what the bulk of the faction is doing.

Example: DC takes Alessia farm and sieges Alessia from the west side. If EP wanted to help dethrone they take the mine and siege the east side. Instead EP moves around the lumbermill and attacks DC from behind sandwiching us between AD sieging/sniping/spamming radiant destruction and dark flare off of walls and EP fighting our backside outside.

We monitor the map as EP attacks us and notice EP is not attempting to fight AD at any location, only us. Then we notice Chalman is flagged by EP. We continue to attempt to dethrone, no problem Chal is an EP home keep. Then we notice Bleakers is flagged. Yeah sure, take Bleakers np. Then we notice Aleswell is flagged... alright we may have to pull out to defend what we have... but we keep pushing the dethrone fighting EP at our backs and AD on walls.

We get inside of Alessia and notice EP is sieging us from behind on the hill. We lose Aleswell to EP. Okay... then we notice Glade is flagged by EP. Finally we abandon the dethrone attempt, go outside and wipe EP, go past the lumbermill and die in the water to blood port back and defend Glade.

This is what happened earlier this week (2 dethrones ago). I am not "making assumptions". I am speaking from experience on exactly what happens. The dethrone after this we DC did all the work ourselves again, and at the last keep (Roe) EP was outside at our backs again but this time we had the numbers to easily wipe them and press on.

I haven't been on except maybe 30mins during the dethrone attempt last night so I'm not sure if it was pulled off or not, but if it was, it was the first time I've seen EP do anything logical in a long time.

It's not an "assumption" when you are the one leading the charge and monitoring the moves the other factions are making. When you are there seeing for yourself what is going on, you're not "assuming".I didn't claim I knew what every single player is doing. If during the dethrone attempt there was 1 EP sitting at Kingscrest ERPing with an NPC, I wouldn't know. I'm talking about what the bulk of the faction is doing.

This sound like most de-thrones to be honest. You did explain it well. Alliance #1 pushes alliance #2 for de-throne. alliance #3 proceeds with back dooring alliance #1 then alliance #2 holds out till Alliance #1 backs off. Alliance #2 pushes back out to reclaim lost territory.

Over the past year of playing pvp and watching the map you see this basic pattern occur. I've watched this patter happen to EP, to DC, and AD. Even if you have multiple groups working together to de-throne you always have the chance that a wild card group is running around at that time looking to stir up trouble.

Other group leads out there have gone though the same frustrations of doing a de-throne.

Also it is an "assumption". However assumptions have a degree of truth to them based on that persons knowledge of the situation. Because no one person can know what every person is thinking or doing at all times it can't be anything more then an assumption or prediction. This is a pvp environment after all. With living thinking humans. It is possible to look at a person or group and anticipate their next move but you can never know exactly what they are going to do 100% of the time.

In the end this is a pvp where hundreds of people are on the map. Making it a ever changing battlefield where you are going to get killed by a tactic or group that will *** you off. Other enemy groups will pull a move that can force you off you objective (like a de-throne) and that too can *** you off. Just get back out there into the fight again ladies and gentlemen each day is a new day to improve your skills weather it is person skill, leadership skill, or just working on your gear and build.

Tanneza

Honestly, we all know there will be people who never listen to the group/faction leads/wisemen. I saw in zone they said they were taking Aleswell/Dragon claw for "***** and giggles" and I told them "No, do you want to fight both fronts? Do you want to be zerged to the gates?!" Lo and behold we're at our gates and I'm caps locking zone chat. **Summary of my everyday attempts to dethrone