[Permabans being lifted] ZOS how are we as a community dealing with exploits/hacking?

Palidon

To all you cheaters out there your actions have finally backfired. I have to salute ZOS for in the last 24 hours they have perma banned over 40 players and have announced they are still investigating more. Really gotta laugh. Cheating never gets you anywhere in the end.

Eggzie

I "Pulled a Zazeer" in another mmo game about 3 years ago, Pirates of the Burning Sea. Wanted to "prove" to the devs that their game was broken and had access to GM ships that did MASSIVE damage. My buddy and I took our GM boats to a 24v24 port battle and was filmed, reported and perma banned. We didn't mean to, but we killed effectively killed the game. The majority of the PvP player base got fed up and left. Now, my example is way more small scale than this, but there were so many better ways to do it then a 'salt the earth' type show-off scenario.

Cheaters never win, and I hope he feels remorse for a a game he reportedly loves.

Dang, I miss PotBS.

Universe

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Just a quick update for everyone regarding the recent influx of those using third party tools to cheat in ESO. We've adjusted our automatic anti-cheat systems to focus specifically on the cheats we've seen in the last few days, in addition to launching investigations on specific players. We've permanently banned 43 players in the last 24 hours who were found to be cheating. We don't take cheating lightly, and will continue to ban those who are found to be cheating. We'll be going back through game logs to identify players who were violating our anti-cheating policies in the hours before we performed the automatic cheat detection adjustment.

In addition, we're working on a number of fixes and improvements to prevent this kind of behavior from happening in ESO in the future. We'll provide more specific details about this tomorrow.

We want to thank everyone who has helped us identify those who would ruin your game experience by cheating, and the means by which they were doing so.

ausmack2014

zerosingularity wrote: »

show previous quotes

ZOS_DaryaK wrote: »

Thank you for raising this issue, we are investigating this issue. In the meantime, please continue to use the in-game report function to report players who are using any kind of exploit and refrain from posting names or videos showing names on these forums.

Sorry, but until the players see proof that such things as exploiting and hacking are dealt with appropriately (no 3-day ban crap but perma-ban/character deletion) then naming and shaming of exploiters/hackers will and should still happen.


Remember, exploiters/hackers have no rights, only the innocent do.

Looks like we will need a leaderboard reset this next DLC, at this rate.

Problem is, people who do this sort of thing do it for the fame. They probably get a kick to see people talking about them.

PainfulFAFA

ZOS removes smooth, lagless, massive multiplayer in order to implement anti cheat system.
2 years later.... we still have lag and cheats.

Bad bad baaaad deal. Plz go back to subscription model. It was such a nice game back then, its trash now.

Duiwel

I like what I am hearing, let the purge begin!

GTA Online gave out 1000 year bans that's a millennium haha glad to see ZoS is perma banning these guys.

Instead of Ban hammer (Thor) this is an ESO game.

Ysgrammor's Axe will cut off their heads...

Ysbanmore them!

Faulgor

Duiwel wrote: »

I like what I am hearing, let the purge begin!

GTA Online gave out 1000 year bans that's a millennium haha glad to see ZoS is perma banning these guys.

Instead of Ban hammer (Thor) this is an ESO game.

Ysgrammor's Axe will cut off their heads...

Ysbanmore them!

Bandu Olo?

Arthg

As everybody here I'm eagerly waiting for today's announcement.
Although yesterday's came as a pleasant surprise, I'm still highly sceptical and somewhat defiant.
Here is why:

1. NONE of this would have happened if a few players hadn't decided to fly off the handle and make the cheats BLATANT. It looks as if ZOS would never have taken any steps but for those players.
2. Relying on video evidence spoon-fed by players will not address the issue of subtler cheats.
3. I'm calling bovine faeces on those supposed "automatic cheat detection adjustments". The community has been consistently and repeatedly reporting cheats for a long time. To the best of my knowledge, the cheats went on, and are most likely still going on.

In my view, all of this calls for a change in policy and, I guess, net code and resource management.

1. ZOS needs to respond to accusations of cheats in a timely and public manner. It is their lack of communication and responsiveness that let the situation fester. I suggest making announcements in the launcher, not in some cryptic subforum.
2. ZOS needs to announce that more human, financial and technological resources are going to be dedicated to fighting cheats, especially those that video evidence can't detect. It is shocking that a trite cheating platform, mostly used by spoilt and bored 15-year-olds, works on a game with the scope and budget of ESO. Give us cheat protection, game masters, better server-client architecture.

I won't be expecting massive changes overnight.
But ZOS policy as it is now needs to change.
Sugar-coating the truth with PR messages just won't cut it no more.

forgottengd

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom, are you will ban ppl who use cheats at maelstrom arena too? or just ppl who playing in cyr?

remedios17

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Just a quick update for everyone regarding the recent influx of those using third party tools to cheat in ESO. We've adjusted our automatic anti-cheat systems to focus specifically on the cheats we've seen in the last few days, in addition to launching investigations on specific players. We've permanently banned 43 players in the last 24 hours who were found to be cheating. We don't take cheating lightly, and will continue to ban those who are found to be cheating. We'll be going back through game logs to identify players who were violating our anti-cheating policies in the hours before we performed the automatic cheat detection adjustment.

In addition, we're working on a number of fixes and improvements to prevent this kind of behavior from happening in ESO in the future. We'll provide more specific details about this tomorrow.

We want to thank everyone who has helped us identify those who would ruin your game experience by cheating, and the means by which they were doing so.

This is great, but what about people who got banned for no reason? Because there is at least 1 person I know who never cheated and you kicked him out without any evidence whatsoever. (I personally heard him tell people in his raid that if anyone uses any cheat, he will kick them from raid/guild...) He filed a complaint/appeal, so will you really go through game logs to check if he cheated or not?

This just goes to show how toxic the whole PVP community is. Reporting each other because cannot handle being defeated in a fight, or not understanding how emperors and their ultis work.

Everyone is really happy about kicking cheaters, until you happen to be on the wrong end and some other player reports you out of anger or spite and you get kicked for no reason whatsoever, becoming 'collateral damage", losing your character and everything you've built in PVP for yourself.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom I would appreciate it if you could look into this matter because as happy as I am for getting rid of legit cheaters, I am not so happy about innocent people who have been here since beta getting kicked. We both know that if you REALLY went through all game logs, you couldn't have found anything in some cases. Blocking based on screen shots or just plain reports is not too fair...

Mettaricana

The part that bugs me is after they respond we respond to them and they go silent its like are you really sure your listening zos?

Tavore1138

This is a step in the right direction although it is important to realise that the endless ulti spam was not the only format this took so I hope these cheat detection have some way of server side checking and ESO client code checking so anyone actually hacking the game can be spotted.

Equally, anticipating those saying they were unfairly banned, it should not be something blunt like scanning the client PC for the existence of a cheat tool - you might capture those who hack their offline games which hurts no-one but them.

At this stage, as I am sure ZOS are realising, it is vital to get this right and not err in either direction so that confidence and trust can be regained.

I look forward to the announcement later which I shall hopefully read while exploring Anvil and Kvatch...

DartRain

Yes,also I would like to know about bans for no reason.Can you view the logs in case of suspected unfair ban(at the request of the person of course).And if the player was actually banned for a reason,can you clarify the reason for it(if the person is conscious then he can say what not to do ).
Thanks in advance for your response.

Tower_Of_Shame

I was emperor on azura (eu) this weekend and on monday evening I got permanently banned for using this cheat engine. They did not provide me any proof of cheating just ban. I know at least one more guy who got banned without any reason.

Probably in my case someone was running in a zerg and got meteored, since we all know the ultiregen is ridicilous as emperor. In bigger fight u drop one meteor and u got one again up.

In my opinion they banning people according to death recap pictures and they do not have any backround check on logs.

Ahh and death recap is so accurate that even VIcious death is on the recap if u 1v1 with a VD user.

Kind regards,

@Joetka (Daryn Ralvani)

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno

Tavore1138

Tower_Of_Shame wrote: »

I was emperor on azura (eu) this weekend and on monday evening I got permanently banned for using this cheat engine. They did not provide me any proof of cheating just ban. I know at least one more guy who got banned without any reason.

Probably in my case someone was running in a zerg and got meteored, since we all know the ultiregen is ridicilous as emperor. In bigger fight u drop one meteor and u got one again up.

In my opinion they banning people according to death recap pictures and they do not have any backround check on logs.

Ahh and death recap is so accurate that even VIcious death is on the recap if u 1v1 with a VD user.

Kind regards,

@Joetka (Daryn Ralvani)

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno

In before everyone says you are just cheating and taking you at face value (because this stuff seems to have been less prevalent on the EU servers anyway) - my concern is that there is no 'Tool' that they are using for this and that because they are just doing a blunt check of some kind with no nuance people may well get unfairly caught up in this.

If they are open to appeals and deal with them fairly then hopefully players who do get caught up will get unbanned on proper review.

I hope I speak for more than just myself when I say that just banning a bunch of people based on some quickly hacked together log parsing tool is not what the community want - it is important that the right people get banned in the right way for actually cheating otherwise the whole effort is devalued.

Quick action is welcome but it has to be accurate too.

remedios17

Tavore1138 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Tower_Of_Shame wrote: »

I was emperor on azura (eu) this weekend and on monday evening I got permanently banned for using this cheat engine. They did not provide me any proof of cheating just ban. I know at least one more guy who got banned without any reason.

Probably in my case someone was running in a zerg and got meteored, since we all know the ultiregen is ridicilous as emperor. In bigger fight u drop one meteor and u got one again up.

In my opinion they banning people according to death recap pictures and they do not have any backround check on logs.

Ahh and death recap is so accurate that even VIcious death is on the recap if u 1v1 with a VD user.

Kind regards,

@Joetka (Daryn Ralvani)

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno

In before everyone says you are just cheating and taking you at face value (because this stuff seems to have been less prevalent on the EU servers anyway) - my concern is that there is no 'Tool' that they are using for this and that because they are just doing a blunt check of some kind with no nuance people may well get unfairly caught up in this.

If they are open to appeals and deal with them fairly then hopefully players who do get caught up will get unbanned on proper review.

I hope I speak for more than just myself when I say that just banning a bunch of people based on some quickly hacked together log parsing tool is not what the community want - it is important that the right people get banned in the right way for actually cheating otherwise the whole effort is devalued.

Quick action is welcome but it has to be accurate too.

Amen!!!

Tower_Of_Shame

Tavore1138 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Tower_Of_Shame wrote: »

I was emperor on azura (eu) this weekend and on monday evening I got permanently banned for using this cheat engine. They did not provide me any proof of cheating just ban. I know at least one more guy who got banned without any reason.

Probably in my case someone was running in a zerg and got meteored, since we all know the ultiregen is ridicilous as emperor. In bigger fight u drop one meteor and u got one again up.

In my opinion they banning people according to death recap pictures and they do not have any backround check on logs.

Ahh and death recap is so accurate that even VIcious death is on the recap if u 1v1 with a VD user.

Kind regards,

@Joetka (Daryn Ralvani)

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno

In before everyone says you are just cheating and taking you at face value (because this stuff seems to have been less prevalent on the EU servers anyway) - my concern is that there is no 'Tool' that they are using for this and that because they are just doing a blunt check of some kind with no nuance people may well get unfairly caught up in this.

If they are open to appeals and deal with them fairly then hopefully players who do get caught up will get unbanned on proper review.

I hope I speak for more than just myself when I say that just banning a bunch of people based on some quickly hacked together log parsing tool is not what the community want - it is important that the right people get banned in the right way for actually cheating otherwise the whole effort is devalued.

Quick action is welcome but it has to be accurate too.

I aggre with you! But if they do have logs which I hihgly doubt it would have shown normal gameplay. The problem is the eso community is too toxicated.

Plus I think we should not fool our selves we have seen their programming capeabilities, just look at the latest gap closer design @Jaybe_Mawfaka

GCVDJ11T

remedios17 wrote: »

show previous quotes

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Just a quick update for everyone regarding the recent influx of those using third party tools to cheat in ESO. We've adjusted our automatic anti-cheat systems to focus specifically on the cheats we've seen in the last few days, in addition to launching investigations on specific players. We've permanently banned 43 players in the last 24 hours who were found to be cheating. We don't take cheating lightly, and will continue to ban those who are found to be cheating. We'll be going back through game logs to identify players who were violating our anti-cheating policies in the hours before we performed the automatic cheat detection adjustment.

In addition, we're working on a number of fixes and improvements to prevent this kind of behavior from happening in ESO in the future. We'll provide more specific details about this tomorrow.

We want to thank everyone who has helped us identify those who would ruin your game experience by cheating, and the means by which they were doing so.

This is great, but what about people who got banned for no reason? Because there is at least 1 person I know who never cheated and you kicked him out without any evidence whatsoever. (I personally heard him tell people in his raid that if anyone uses any cheat, he will kick them from raid/guild...) He filed a complaint/appeal, so will you really go through game logs to check if he cheated or not?

This just goes to show how toxic the whole PVP community is. Reporting each other because cannot handle being defeated in a fight, or not understanding how emperors and their ultis work.

Everyone is really happy about kicking cheaters, until you happen to be on the wrong end and some other player reports you out of anger or spite and you get kicked for no reason whatsoever, becoming 'collateral damage", losing your character and everything you've built in PVP for yourself.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom I would appreciate it if you could look into this matter because as happy as I am for getting rid of legit cheaters, I am not so happy about innocent people who have been here since beta getting kicked. We both know that if you REALLY went through all game logs, you couldn't have found anything in some cases. Blocking based on screen shots or just plain reports is not too fair...

....banned for no reason?..... lol.. dude stop .... people that get banned deserve it... Let me guess, you are taking his word for it and he is collateral damage?

For the first time ZOS did what was right and I for one stand up and applaude

Rune_Relic

SienneYviete wrote: »

I think some people in this thread are very misunderstanding of the issue that affected @Nifty2g & all the other groups at the time.

Coming form a competitive fps background all tournaments and rule sets were controlled either by the governing body or a consortium of the top teams. In eso's case there is no governing body hence the top teams would have had to make the decision that all their runs would have to be recorded which is something they wouldn't do as this would just give the other teams their strats or openly allow the double mundus exploit as there would be no way of telling who did and did not have it active.

While an exploit is an exploit and is generally frowned upon, in this case the competition was so unregulated that I don't believe in the interests of all teams that were competing there was another choice that would remain fair to all.

EDIT: Just to be clear here there is a massive difference between using an openly known game exploit to provide a level playing field and using third party software to hack the game.

Blatantly using bugged code that you KNOW is not working as intended is cheating.
Once a cheat always a cheat.
What your saying is petty theft is fine as robbing a bank is the bad thing.
No! Theft is the bad thing. Petty or not.
Otherwise you just have people OPINIONs on what constitutes acceptable

Cherryblossom

I now wonder how long this has actually been going on for!

I noticed a few weeks ago being hit by the same people with ulti twice in the death log and just thought it was a mistake on the log.

How many people really pay attention to death recap and even when they do see something unusual think it's not due to a bug!

It's my belief that this has been ripe for weeks, but only recently have a few people been using it so blatantly that it's become visible. In some way we should thank these people for highlighting it, in their own special way. (still ban them though )

Docmandu

Wonder how many will succeed in getting the perma ban revoked, ie.

"I didn't know it wasn't allowed"
"My kid was playing on my PC"
"I got hacked"
"I was just trying it once"

remedios17

GCVDJ11T wrote: »

show previous quotes

remedios17 wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Just a quick update for everyone regarding the recent influx of those using third party tools to cheat in ESO. We've adjusted our automatic anti-cheat systems to focus specifically on the cheats we've seen in the last few days, in addition to launching investigations on specific players. We've permanently banned 43 players in the last 24 hours who were found to be cheating. We don't take cheating lightly, and will continue to ban those who are found to be cheating. We'll be going back through game logs to identify players who were violating our anti-cheating policies in the hours before we performed the automatic cheat detection adjustment.

In addition, we're working on a number of fixes and improvements to prevent this kind of behavior from happening in ESO in the future. We'll provide more specific details about this tomorrow.

We want to thank everyone who has helped us identify those who would ruin your game experience by cheating, and the means by which they were doing so.

This is great, but what about people who got banned for no reason? Because there is at least 1 person I know who never cheated and you kicked him out without any evidence whatsoever. (I personally heard him tell people in his raid that if anyone uses any cheat, he will kick them from raid/guild...) He filed a complaint/appeal, so will you really go through game logs to check if he cheated or not?

This just goes to show how toxic the whole PVP community is. Reporting each other because cannot handle being defeated in a fight, or not understanding how emperors and their ultis work.

Everyone is really happy about kicking cheaters, until you happen to be on the wrong end and some other player reports you out of anger or spite and you get kicked for no reason whatsoever, becoming 'collateral damage", losing your character and everything you've built in PVP for yourself.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom I would appreciate it if you could look into this matter because as happy as I am for getting rid of legit cheaters, I am not so happy about innocent people who have been here since beta getting kicked. We both know that if you REALLY went through all game logs, you couldn't have found anything in some cases. Blocking based on screen shots or just plain reports is not too fair...

....banned for no reason?..... lol.. dude stop .... people that get banned deserve it... Let me guess, you are taking his word for it and he is collateral damage?

For the first time ZOS did what was right and I for one stand up and applaude

GCVDJ11T wrote: »

show previous quotes

remedios17 wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Just a quick update for everyone regarding the recent influx of those using third party tools to cheat in ESO. We've adjusted our automatic anti-cheat systems to focus specifically on the cheats we've seen in the last few days, in addition to launching investigations on specific players. We've permanently banned 43 players in the last 24 hours who were found to be cheating. We don't take cheating lightly, and will continue to ban those who are found to be cheating. We'll be going back through game logs to identify players who were violating our anti-cheating policies in the hours before we performed the automatic cheat detection adjustment.

In addition, we're working on a number of fixes and improvements to prevent this kind of behavior from happening in ESO in the future. We'll provide more specific details about this tomorrow.

We want to thank everyone who has helped us identify those who would ruin your game experience by cheating, and the means by which they were doing so.

This is great, but what about people who got banned for no reason? Because there is at least 1 person I know who never cheated and you kicked him out without any evidence whatsoever. (I personally heard him tell people in his raid that if anyone uses any cheat, he will kick them from raid/guild...) He filed a complaint/appeal, so will you really go through game logs to check if he cheated or not?

This just goes to show how toxic the whole PVP community is. Reporting each other because cannot handle being defeated in a fight, or not understanding how emperors and their ultis work.

Everyone is really happy about kicking cheaters, until you happen to be on the wrong end and some other player reports you out of anger or spite and you get kicked for no reason whatsoever, becoming 'collateral damage", losing your character and everything you've built in PVP for yourself.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom I would appreciate it if you could look into this matter because as happy as I am for getting rid of legit cheaters, I am not so happy about innocent people who have been here since beta getting kicked. We both know that if you REALLY went through all game logs, you couldn't have found anything in some cases. Blocking based on screen shots or just plain reports is not too fair...

....banned for no reason?..... lol.. dude stop .... people that get banned deserve it... Let me guess, you are taking his word for it and he is collateral damage?

For the first time ZOS did what was right and I for one stand up and applaude

Yeah maybe u should sit down. I am not taking only his word for it, we live under the same roof, think I have a good insight into if he is cheating in eso or not, since I hear him play and talk about it all the time.

Lets hope one day u get banned too so I can stand up and applaud.

Skayaq

Docmandu wrote: »

Wonder how many will succeed in getting the perma ban revoked, ie.

"I didn't know it wasn't allowed"
"My kid was playing on my PC"
"I got hacked"
"I was just trying it once"

In this particular case, none of these excuses should be grounds for appeal.

Tryxus

Cherryblossom wrote: »

I now wonder how long this has actually been going on for!

GCVDJ11T

[/q

Rune_Relic wrote: »

show previous quotes

SienneYviete wrote: »

I think some people in this thread are very misunderstanding of the issue that affected @Nifty2g & all the other groups at the time.

Coming form a competitive fps background all tournaments and rule sets were controlled either by the governing body or a consortium of the top teams. In eso's case there is no governing body hence the top teams would have had to make the decision that all their runs would have to be recorded which is something they wouldn't do as this would just give the other teams their strats or openly allow the double mundus exploit as there would be no way of telling who did and did not have it active.

While an exploit is an exploit and is generally frowned upon, in this case the competition was so unregulated that I don't believe in the interests of all teams that were competing there was another choice that would remain fair to all.

EDIT: Just to be clear here there is a massive difference between using an openly known game exploit to provide a level playing field and using third party software to hack the game.

Blatantly using bugged code that you KNOW is not working as intended is cheating.
Once a cheat always a cheat.
What your saying is petty theft is fine as robbing a bank is the bad thing.
No! Theft is the bad thing. Petty or not.
Otherwise you just have people OPINIONs on what constitutes acceptable

AMEN....

What he should have done was the right thing.. refuse to use the cheat. I remember training on an SO run back in the day when a dude said... "hey can I port out really quick and rebuild my evil hunter?" How about we kicked him from the raid and replaced his sorry A$$ because we do not abide by cheaters.

How many other "game exploits" have they used to get number one scores? How about Akatosh set that blinded even Z'ahassa (and yes it was me that turned it in to Jessica IMMEDIATELY after it was shown to me), evil hunter, bear trap, rearming trap... the list goes on and on.

I hope they now realize that now no one is taking them serious on their clears because we now know that they conspire together to "use game exploits" because.... you know they are so "competitive".

All of those number one scores mean nothing.

Tower_Of_Shame

GCVDJ11T wrote: »

show previous quotes

remedios17 wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Just a quick update for everyone regarding the recent influx of those using third party tools to cheat in ESO. We've adjusted our automatic anti-cheat systems to focus specifically on the cheats we've seen in the last few days, in addition to launching investigations on specific players. We've permanently banned 43 players in the last 24 hours who were found to be cheating. We don't take cheating lightly, and will continue to ban those who are found to be cheating. We'll be going back through game logs to identify players who were violating our anti-cheating policies in the hours before we performed the automatic cheat detection adjustment.

In addition, we're working on a number of fixes and improvements to prevent this kind of behavior from happening in ESO in the future. We'll provide more specific details about this tomorrow.

We want to thank everyone who has helped us identify those who would ruin your game experience by cheating, and the means by which they were doing so.

This is great, but what about people who got banned for no reason? Because there is at least 1 person I know who never cheated and you kicked him out without any evidence whatsoever. (I personally heard him tell people in his raid that if anyone uses any cheat, he will kick them from raid/guild...) He filed a complaint/appeal, so will you really go through game logs to check if he cheated or not?

This just goes to show how toxic the whole PVP community is. Reporting each other because cannot handle being defeated in a fight, or not understanding how emperors and their ultis work.

Everyone is really happy about kicking cheaters, until you happen to be on the wrong end and some other player reports you out of anger or spite and you get kicked for no reason whatsoever, becoming 'collateral damage", losing your character and everything you've built in PVP for yourself.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom I would appreciate it if you could look into this matter because as happy as I am for getting rid of legit cheaters, I am not so happy about innocent people who have been here since beta getting kicked. We both know that if you REALLY went through all game logs, you couldn't have found anything in some cases. Blocking based on screen shots or just plain reports is not too fair...

....banned for no reason?..... lol.. dude stop .... people that get banned deserve it... Let me guess, you are taking his word for it and he is collateral damage?

For the first time ZOS did what was right and I for one stand up and applaude

Noone need take my world but I still have not received ANY proof that I used any cheats, but the poor thing is most of the players cry for cheats if they got rekt in cyro:

- he must be using macros
- He must be usibg mitigation explpit etc etc
Plus it is quietr funny I got reported while emp: ohhh he must be cheating

And tbh according to your writing style you are a guy with a bow spamming snipes on dks and wonder why they die.

So yeah nice response!

Tandor

Nifty2g wrote: »

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FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Taruha wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

BenLocoDete wrote: »

FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Rakkul wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Chori wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Junkogen wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

stevepdodson_ESO888 wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Buffler wrote: »

Repost vids, send in vids via tickets and dont name players then the thread wont get locked

I think when players are hacking, then videos are fine, I don't see why we can't name and shame. We don't want to hide the toxic players in the community, why are we protecting them. Get rid of them once and for all.

As for the Maelstrom Arena before that gets out of hand, I've been seeing players all day getting high scores who are mainly unnamed/unknown in the realms of PvE.
But honestly the players who held #1 are my friends and my guild mates, they have put countless hours of effort into keeping that spot, to have someone come in and ruin it is just disgusting behavior because they know nothing will happen to them. If I was #1 I would be completely pissed that I would be unable to grab a screenshot to show the achievement before Dark Brotherhood goes live because someone had hacked and gotten a seemingly impossible score. (which is actually a 29 Minute clear.)

As for PvP, I know it has less of a direct impact like PvE leaderboards do, but players should also get punished thinking how they can get away with such *** I don't understand how time after time you allow players to exploit, no more 3 day ban, stand handing out permanent bans, especially to those who have received one before and decided to come back and disrespect the company outright.

It's sad to say, but this now becomes another problem...you say that you and all your friends with high scores are legit, but who will believe they are now?
And who will believe that Hodor (EU) are always first to complete trials due to being good or because speculation and hearsay may also point to it being a guild of cheaters?

Once the poison of cheating sets in and the finger pointing starts then where does it go from here? There will be a witch hunt.

I enjoy playing this game and basically have given up on large parts of it due to all the cheating...the spoilers are spoiling it for the rest of us.

Good luck with trying to keep your name and the that of your friends untarnished by this. If I were you, I would no longer put your "World Best" scores in your signature as no one will believe it anymore.

I have videos online of my all my scores, so do hodor. theres no cheating like that, please dont say that kind of stuff when guilds/players go through a lot to prove their stuff is legitimate

Funny story about Major Update 6, because we had such a close compeititon with HODOR we had to both agree that we're allowed ot use the double mundus exploit so that we can keep a fair competition. Sucks when that happens, but when an exploit like double mundus goes viral you have to all agree to do it so no one is on the upper hand.

You went on and on about how legit your scores are and then outright admitted to cheating and how the lot of you colluded together. You guys are like all the cyclists using PEDs. You embrace the cheating because "everyone is doing it." Well, sorry, Lance Armstrong, it's still not okay.

Link me somewhere I said they were legit, pretty sure in the massive thread we had we said it had to resort to that.
Stop bringing this up lol, I gave an explanation about it. If there are 5+ teams all going for #1 and an exploit like so which mind you was so damn easy to do goes public then doesn't get fixed until AFTER the leaderboard reset, then yes all the teams to be on equal playing field agreed to do it so no one could be a whining loser and call out other teams with stupid accusations. I don't think it's right and I blame ZOS for not fixing it ASAP but leaving it in the game for months, what do you expect?

You can have your opinion and I think it's wrong, I'm not embracing it but in this instance it is necessary to do so. No one is flat out saying it's cheating and shameful in the conditions that were forced.

Put it this way, I'd rather everyone be cheating and on equal grounds with all the other teams (there were about 5 at the time, and I was in contact with them all), and they all agreed. We would rather all be using the same exploit rather than someone disrespecting our efforts put in and beating us while we weren't doing it.

Btw your analogy doesn't exactly apply during this whole thing, I agree it's cheating I'm not defending it, don't know what makes you think I am I've never said anything about that other than we all agreed we had to do it. And lastly, I really do blame ZOS for this but on the other hand it also avoided comments like "you only got that cause you exploited double mundus" when we hadn't. So either way, I don't think it devalues the score at all we were all on equal playing fields and I don't think you should spurt out your opinion and make attacks on peoples hard work when I've already explained the situation.

No offense Nifty but your image as a clean player on this thread just went to the drain with that whole statement and your previous ones. No one cares if you agreed upon having an exploit on your team or others team's setup, people cares if you guys allowed it and didn't condemn it the way you should have and people cares if you were not the better player standind up for what you believe lol.

How about you guys decided to be responsible enough to either not compete or agree upon not allowing any exploit on a team's setup huh? Would have been smarter, more honorable, and you wouldnt even have to be discussing what happened or bringing up this controversial subject on this whole thread.

How about the exploit getting fixed ASAP and not being left in the damn game for months? And still in the game for another 6 months after the fix was out.
Im a clean playing when it comes to playing on equal grounds as the competition, people often tend to do dirty things for #1 as much as they can.
You can say what you want to and call us all cheaters and exploiters I mean we are and it had to be done because the issue was ignored. This wasnt 3rd party software all you had to do was put on twice born star, die and remove it. You kept your second mundus stone.

Anyway, stop bring the conversation up, we have all admitted it a year ago, no one really cares about it, and I dont know why you are showing offense to the subject when you werent apart of the 5 groups, and honestly if you werent apart of the 5 groups I dont really think it matters of your opinion as long as all of the people involved agreed it was necessary, then it was

What do you mean it doesn't matter.....
You agreed to the T&C when you signed up for the game.
You then decided that the T&C somehow didn't apply to you.
Then deliberately hacked the game.
...and now you come along as though it's somehow ok just for your group of hackers?

I really don't think you understand the meaning of terms and conditions.

Hack? I didn't hack. This was an exploit with TBS set a year ago.
Huge diff between hack and in game exploit

You knowingly used an exploit though which is still breaking the Terms and Conditions. It shouldn't matter if it was fixed or not. Just because it is in the game doesn't make it okay to use it.

But it does make that that exploit must be immediately dealt with by the people who designed it in the first place.

Not true, said exploit was being used for a total of 8 months by Im going to say 20% of the population. Threads were made it was a known exploit and largely used, zos acknowledged it but didn't do anything about it, guides were all over the place on how to do it.

Though I think this is a different situation and a lot more alarming, should I be banned, I dont know I said it a year ago as did many others, they didn't do anything. I don't think they banned because of how easy it was to do and how you could do it by mistake, I knew someone who had mundus stones stacking every time he picked one up.

Stop making excuses for people. It's never ok to use an exploit. And it makes you a bad player.

Do you see me making excuses, where are you grabbing that from, honestly, can you read what I am writing?

Ive already said it is exploiting and its not okay to do so, but theyre not going to go ahead and ban a group of 20 people because they are trying to have a fair group competition between each other. That just doesnt make sense

If those 20 people have been caught hacking then yes they should be banned. They cant just stop and say "oh well they were just trying to make it fair for themselves" that will cause even more outrage.

Nobody deserves special treatment. We have already seen the outrage when a streamer got special treatment. I don't care if they are the president of the US. Everyone should be treated equally.

No one is hacking it was an ingame exploit, and I personally think if those people are doing it to keep competition fair between them then yes, it should be allowed as it doesnt affect anyone outside, is it an exploit yes it is, is it wrong to do yes it is. not much you can do about it if its not getting fixed for months on end and you want to compete against other groups with an easy accessible exploit out there

If I went into cyrodill and got an unfair advantage against someone, then yes it affects other people, if I went and did maelstrom then yes it affects other people.

See the difference?

Nope. Both are cheating, against the rules and bannable offenses. The fact that you all agreed to cheat makes no difference whatsoever. When you break the rules of a game just like the laws of the land, you don't get to choose when it's ok and when it isn't.

Thornen

It's ok guiz they installed the latest update for windows defender, no more hacks...

ToRelax

It's nothing new that players get banned unjustly. So unless you have seen anything suspicious, how about you just don't judge those that say they didn't.

Tandor wrote: »

show previous quotes

Nifty2g wrote: »

FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Taruha wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

BenLocoDete wrote: »

FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Rakkul wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Chori wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Junkogen wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

stevepdodson_ESO888 wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Buffler wrote: »

Repost vids, send in vids via tickets and dont name players then the thread wont get locked

I think when players are hacking, then videos are fine, I don't see why we can't name and shame. We don't want to hide the toxic players in the community, why are we protecting them. Get rid of them once and for all.

As for the Maelstrom Arena before that gets out of hand, I've been seeing players all day getting high scores who are mainly unnamed/unknown in the realms of PvE.
But honestly the players who held #1 are my friends and my guild mates, they have put countless hours of effort into keeping that spot, to have someone come in and ruin it is just disgusting behavior because they know nothing will happen to them. If I was #1 I would be completely pissed that I would be unable to grab a screenshot to show the achievement before Dark Brotherhood goes live because someone had hacked and gotten a seemingly impossible score. (which is actually a 29 Minute clear.)

As for PvP, I know it has less of a direct impact like PvE leaderboards do, but players should also get punished thinking how they can get away with such *** I don't understand how time after time you allow players to exploit, no more 3 day ban, stand handing out permanent bans, especially to those who have received one before and decided to come back and disrespect the company outright.

It's sad to say, but this now becomes another problem...you say that you and all your friends with high scores are legit, but who will believe they are now?
And who will believe that Hodor (EU) are always first to complete trials due to being good or because speculation and hearsay may also point to it being a guild of cheaters?

Once the poison of cheating sets in and the finger pointing starts then where does it go from here? There will be a witch hunt.

I enjoy playing this game and basically have given up on large parts of it due to all the cheating...the spoilers are spoiling it for the rest of us.

Good luck with trying to keep your name and the that of your friends untarnished by this. If I were you, I would no longer put your "World Best" scores in your signature as no one will believe it anymore.

I have videos online of my all my scores, so do hodor. theres no cheating like that, please dont say that kind of stuff when guilds/players go through a lot to prove their stuff is legitimate

Funny story about Major Update 6, because we had such a close compeititon with HODOR we had to both agree that we're allowed ot use the double mundus exploit so that we can keep a fair competition. Sucks when that happens, but when an exploit like double mundus goes viral you have to all agree to do it so no one is on the upper hand.

You went on and on about how legit your scores are and then outright admitted to cheating and how the lot of you colluded together. You guys are like all the cyclists using PEDs. You embrace the cheating because "everyone is doing it." Well, sorry, Lance Armstrong, it's still not okay.

Link me somewhere I said they were legit, pretty sure in the massive thread we had we said it had to resort to that.
Stop bringing this up lol, I gave an explanation about it. If there are 5+ teams all going for #1 and an exploit like so which mind you was so damn easy to do goes public then doesn't get fixed until AFTER the leaderboard reset, then yes all the teams to be on equal playing field agreed to do it so no one could be a whining loser and call out other teams with stupid accusations. I don't think it's right and I blame ZOS for not fixing it ASAP but leaving it in the game for months, what do you expect?

You can have your opinion and I think it's wrong, I'm not embracing it but in this instance it is necessary to do so. No one is flat out saying it's cheating and shameful in the conditions that were forced.

Put it this way, I'd rather everyone be cheating and on equal grounds with all the other teams (there were about 5 at the time, and I was in contact with them all), and they all agreed. We would rather all be using the same exploit rather than someone disrespecting our efforts put in and beating us while we weren't doing it.

Btw your analogy doesn't exactly apply during this whole thing, I agree it's cheating I'm not defending it, don't know what makes you think I am I've never said anything about that other than we all agreed we had to do it. And lastly, I really do blame ZOS for this but on the other hand it also avoided comments like "you only got that cause you exploited double mundus" when we hadn't. So either way, I don't think it devalues the score at all we were all on equal playing fields and I don't think you should spurt out your opinion and make attacks on peoples hard work when I've already explained the situation.

No offense Nifty but your image as a clean player on this thread just went to the drain with that whole statement and your previous ones. No one cares if you agreed upon having an exploit on your team or others team's setup, people cares if you guys allowed it and didn't condemn it the way you should have and people cares if you were not the better player standind up for what you believe lol.

How about you guys decided to be responsible enough to either not compete or agree upon not allowing any exploit on a team's setup huh? Would have been smarter, more honorable, and you wouldnt even have to be discussing what happened or bringing up this controversial subject on this whole thread.

How about the exploit getting fixed ASAP and not being left in the damn game for months? And still in the game for another 6 months after the fix was out.
Im a clean playing when it comes to playing on equal grounds as the competition, people often tend to do dirty things for #1 as much as they can.
You can say what you want to and call us all cheaters and exploiters I mean we are and it had to be done because the issue was ignored. This wasnt 3rd party software all you had to do was put on twice born star, die and remove it. You kept your second mundus stone.

Anyway, stop bring the conversation up, we have all admitted it a year ago, no one really cares about it, and I dont know why you are showing offense to the subject when you werent apart of the 5 groups, and honestly if you werent apart of the 5 groups I dont really think it matters of your opinion as long as all of the people involved agreed it was necessary, then it was

What do you mean it doesn't matter.....
You agreed to the T&C when you signed up for the game.
You then decided that the T&C somehow didn't apply to you.
Then deliberately hacked the game.
...and now you come along as though it's somehow ok just for your group of hackers?

I really don't think you understand the meaning of terms and conditions.

Hack? I didn't hack. This was an exploit with TBS set a year ago.
Huge diff between hack and in game exploit

You knowingly used an exploit though which is still breaking the Terms and Conditions. It shouldn't matter if it was fixed or not. Just because it is in the game doesn't make it okay to use it.

But it does make that that exploit must be immediately dealt with by the people who designed it in the first place.

Not true, said exploit was being used for a total of 8 months by Im going to say 20% of the population. Threads were made it was a known exploit and largely used, zos acknowledged it but didn't do anything about it, guides were all over the place on how to do it.

Though I think this is a different situation and a lot more alarming, should I be banned, I dont know I said it a year ago as did many others, they didn't do anything. I don't think they banned because of how easy it was to do and how you could do it by mistake, I knew someone who had mundus stones stacking every time he picked one up.

Stop making excuses for people. It's never ok to use an exploit. And it makes you a bad player.

Do you see me making excuses, where are you grabbing that from, honestly, can you read what I am writing?

Ive already said it is exploiting and its not okay to do so, but theyre not going to go ahead and ban a group of 20 people because they are trying to have a fair group competition between each other. That just doesnt make sense

If those 20 people have been caught hacking then yes they should be banned. They cant just stop and say "oh well they were just trying to make it fair for themselves" that will cause even more outrage.

Nobody deserves special treatment. We have already seen the outrage when a streamer got special treatment. I don't care if they are the president of the US. Everyone should be treated equally.

No one is hacking it was an ingame exploit, and I personally think if those people are doing it to keep competition fair between them then yes, it should be allowed as it doesnt affect anyone outside, is it an exploit yes it is, is it wrong to do yes it is. not much you can do about it if its not getting fixed for months on end and you want to compete against other groups with an easy accessible exploit out there

If I went into cyrodill and got an unfair advantage against someone, then yes it affects other people, if I went and did maelstrom then yes it affects other people.

See the difference?

Nope. Both are cheating, against the rules and bannable offenses. The fact that you all agreed to cheat makes no difference whatsoever. When you break the rules of a game just like the laws of the land, you don't get to choose when it's ok and when it isn't.

What a load of ***. Ingame exploits have been handled very differently from third party programs by ZOS, as we can see here very well. Their reluctance to deal with exploiters has led many players to believe no action will be taken against them if they do, so you don't have any guarantee that no team will exploit in such a competition, but you can be pretty sure everyone will have the same chances if you specifically allow it.

vyndral13preub18_ESO

Tandor wrote: »

show previous quotes

Nifty2g wrote: »

FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Taruha wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

BenLocoDete wrote: »

FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Rakkul wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Chori wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Junkogen wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

stevepdodson_ESO888 wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Buffler wrote: »

Repost vids, send in vids via tickets and dont name players then the thread wont get locked

I think when players are hacking, then videos are fine, I don't see why we can't name and shame. We don't want to hide the toxic players in the community, why are we protecting them. Get rid of them once and for all.

As for the Maelstrom Arena before that gets out of hand, I've been seeing players all day getting high scores who are mainly unnamed/unknown in the realms of PvE.
But honestly the players who held #1 are my friends and my guild mates, they have put countless hours of effort into keeping that spot, to have someone come in and ruin it is just disgusting behavior because they know nothing will happen to them. If I was #1 I would be completely pissed that I would be unable to grab a screenshot to show the achievement before Dark Brotherhood goes live because someone had hacked and gotten a seemingly impossible score. (which is actually a 29 Minute clear.)

As for PvP, I know it has less of a direct impact like PvE leaderboards do, but players should also get punished thinking how they can get away with such *** I don't understand how time after time you allow players to exploit, no more 3 day ban, stand handing out permanent bans, especially to those who have received one before and decided to come back and disrespect the company outright.

It's sad to say, but this now becomes another problem...you say that you and all your friends with high scores are legit, but who will believe they are now?
And who will believe that Hodor (EU) are always first to complete trials due to being good or because speculation and hearsay may also point to it being a guild of cheaters?

Once the poison of cheating sets in and the finger pointing starts then where does it go from here? There will be a witch hunt.

I enjoy playing this game and basically have given up on large parts of it due to all the cheating...the spoilers are spoiling it for the rest of us.

Good luck with trying to keep your name and the that of your friends untarnished by this. If I were you, I would no longer put your "World Best" scores in your signature as no one will believe it anymore.

I have videos online of my all my scores, so do hodor. theres no cheating like that, please dont say that kind of stuff when guilds/players go through a lot to prove their stuff is legitimate

Funny story about Major Update 6, because we had such a close compeititon with HODOR we had to both agree that we're allowed ot use the double mundus exploit so that we can keep a fair competition. Sucks when that happens, but when an exploit like double mundus goes viral you have to all agree to do it so no one is on the upper hand.

You went on and on about how legit your scores are and then outright admitted to cheating and how the lot of you colluded together. You guys are like all the cyclists using PEDs. You embrace the cheating because "everyone is doing it." Well, sorry, Lance Armstrong, it's still not okay.

Link me somewhere I said they were legit, pretty sure in the massive thread we had we said it had to resort to that.
Stop bringing this up lol, I gave an explanation about it. If there are 5+ teams all going for #1 and an exploit like so which mind you was so damn easy to do goes public then doesn't get fixed until AFTER the leaderboard reset, then yes all the teams to be on equal playing field agreed to do it so no one could be a whining loser and call out other teams with stupid accusations. I don't think it's right and I blame ZOS for not fixing it ASAP but leaving it in the game for months, what do you expect?

You can have your opinion and I think it's wrong, I'm not embracing it but in this instance it is necessary to do so. No one is flat out saying it's cheating and shameful in the conditions that were forced.

Put it this way, I'd rather everyone be cheating and on equal grounds with all the other teams (there were about 5 at the time, and I was in contact with them all), and they all agreed. We would rather all be using the same exploit rather than someone disrespecting our efforts put in and beating us while we weren't doing it.

Btw your analogy doesn't exactly apply during this whole thing, I agree it's cheating I'm not defending it, don't know what makes you think I am I've never said anything about that other than we all agreed we had to do it. And lastly, I really do blame ZOS for this but on the other hand it also avoided comments like "you only got that cause you exploited double mundus" when we hadn't. So either way, I don't think it devalues the score at all we were all on equal playing fields and I don't think you should spurt out your opinion and make attacks on peoples hard work when I've already explained the situation.

No offense Nifty but your image as a clean player on this thread just went to the drain with that whole statement and your previous ones. No one cares if you agreed upon having an exploit on your team or others team's setup, people cares if you guys allowed it and didn't condemn it the way you should have and people cares if you were not the better player standind up for what you believe lol.

How about you guys decided to be responsible enough to either not compete or agree upon not allowing any exploit on a team's setup huh? Would have been smarter, more honorable, and you wouldnt even have to be discussing what happened or bringing up this controversial subject on this whole thread.

How about the exploit getting fixed ASAP and not being left in the damn game for months? And still in the game for another 6 months after the fix was out.
Im a clean playing when it comes to playing on equal grounds as the competition, people often tend to do dirty things for #1 as much as they can.
You can say what you want to and call us all cheaters and exploiters I mean we are and it had to be done because the issue was ignored. This wasnt 3rd party software all you had to do was put on twice born star, die and remove it. You kept your second mundus stone.

Anyway, stop bring the conversation up, we have all admitted it a year ago, no one really cares about it, and I dont know why you are showing offense to the subject when you werent apart of the 5 groups, and honestly if you werent apart of the 5 groups I dont really think it matters of your opinion as long as all of the people involved agreed it was necessary, then it was

What do you mean it doesn't matter.....
You agreed to the T&C when you signed up for the game.
You then decided that the T&C somehow didn't apply to you.
Then deliberately hacked the game.
...and now you come along as though it's somehow ok just for your group of hackers?

I really don't think you understand the meaning of terms and conditions.

Hack? I didn't hack. This was an exploit with TBS set a year ago.
Huge diff between hack and in game exploit

You knowingly used an exploit though which is still breaking the Terms and Conditions. It shouldn't matter if it was fixed or not. Just because it is in the game doesn't make it okay to use it.

But it does make that that exploit must be immediately dealt with by the people who designed it in the first place.

Not true, said exploit was being used for a total of 8 months by Im going to say 20% of the population. Threads were made it was a known exploit and largely used, zos acknowledged it but didn't do anything about it, guides were all over the place on how to do it.

Though I think this is a different situation and a lot more alarming, should I be banned, I dont know I said it a year ago as did many others, they didn't do anything. I don't think they banned because of how easy it was to do and how you could do it by mistake, I knew someone who had mundus stones stacking every time he picked one up.

Stop making excuses for people. It's never ok to use an exploit. And it makes you a bad player.

Do you see me making excuses, where are you grabbing that from, honestly, can you read what I am writing?

Ive already said it is exploiting and its not okay to do so, but theyre not going to go ahead and ban a group of 20 people because they are trying to have a fair group competition between each other. That just doesnt make sense

If those 20 people have been caught hacking then yes they should be banned. They cant just stop and say "oh well they were just trying to make it fair for themselves" that will cause even more outrage.

Nobody deserves special treatment. We have already seen the outrage when a streamer got special treatment. I don't care if they are the president of the US. Everyone should be treated equally.

No one is hacking it was an ingame exploit, and I personally think if those people are doing it to keep competition fair between them then yes, it should be allowed as it doesnt affect anyone outside, is it an exploit yes it is, is it wrong to do yes it is. not much you can do about it if its not getting fixed for months on end and you want to compete against other groups with an easy accessible exploit out there

If I went into cyrodill and got an unfair advantage against someone, then yes it affects other people, if I went and did maelstrom then yes it affects other people.

See the difference?

Nope. Both are cheating, against the rules and bannable offenses. The fact that you all agreed to cheat makes no difference whatsoever. When you break the rules of a game just like the laws of the land, you don't get to choose when it's ok and when it isn't.

But who does? You? Not so much. How many people were banned for the tbs exploit? Seems like the people who actually matter when it comes to rule making didnt think it was that bad either.