Have ESO become pay to win ?

Julianos · February 2016

SHADOW2KK wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Jaeysa wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

Refuse2GrowUp wrote: »

So much sense of entitlement; so much whining. What has the world come too?!?!

I was always againts free to play or buy to play method.

So get the subscription? You have three options. Buy the DLCs. Keep up a subscription. These allow you to gain access to the content that rewards the best gear. You're for subscription? Go with that. No one is saying you have to let it lapse.

I think he was saying he was against the crowd that Free to Play and Buy to Play attract.

I do not think a company is gonna develop a AAA game that is free somehow, and nor should they.

Not sure what OP is getting at, however have explained the fundamentals of why earlier.

Maybe gaming is not for you OP

People say eso is not pay to win but it is, thats what im getting at and if we have to pay subs or buy DLCs why they switched to buy to play model then ? To continue grabbing cash and not fixing anything while stall people with false promises ?

EnemyOfDaState · February 2016

SHADOW2KK wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Jaeysa wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

Refuse2GrowUp wrote: »

So much sense of entitlement; so much whining. What has the world come too?!?!

I was always againts free to play or buy to play method.

So get the subscription? You have three options. Buy the DLCs. Keep up a subscription. These allow you to gain access to the content that rewards the best gear. You're for subscription? Go with that. No one is saying you have to let it lapse.

I think he was saying he was against the crowd that Free to Play and Buy to Play attract.

I do not think a company is gonna develop a AAA game that is free somehow, and nor should they.

Not sure what OP is getting at, however have explained the fundamentals of why earlier.

Maybe gaming is not for you OP

The thing I don't get about the B2P or F2P community is how people can play the game for over a year and still complain like they didn't get their monies worth?

Gidorick · February 2016

Acrolas wrote: »

When Gido stoops to Reddit for a user-made flowchart, you know the forum's gone *** *** mad.

I give up. I don't give a *** anymore. *** if you do *** if you don't so I'll see you all in ***.

*throws hands up*
*guard confiscates forum sweetroll*

lol. @Acrolas , Show me a "company made" flow chart of pay-to-win mechanics and I'd be more than happy to discuss that.

Oh... and it wasn't reddit. It was Google Image Search leading to Imgur. Not that that's any better than reddit... I'm just clarifying.

KingYogi415 · February 2016

You guys never played destiny huh?

Without the latest expansion everything you own is useless and you are locked out of everything.

ESO like life is pay to play.

You have everything you paid for.

Nothing less nothing more.

Moderator edit - post edited for insulting language

SHADOW2KK · February 2016

Axorn wrote: »

SHADOW2KK wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Jaeysa wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

Refuse2GrowUp wrote: »

So much sense of entitlement; so much whining. What has the world come too?!?!

I was always againts free to play or buy to play method.

So get the subscription? You have three options. Buy the DLCs. Keep up a subscription. These allow you to gain access to the content that rewards the best gear. You're for subscription? Go with that. No one is saying you have to let it lapse.

I think he was saying he was against the crowd that Free to Play and Buy to Play attract.

I do not think a company is gonna develop a AAA game that is free somehow, and nor should they.

Not sure what OP is getting at, however have explained the fundamentals of why earlier.

Maybe gaming is not for you OP

People say eso is not pay to win but it is, thats what im getting at and if we have to pay subs or buy DLCs why they switched to buy to play model then ? To continue grabbing cash and not fixing anything while stall people with false promises ?

In agreement with ya there, there are a number of issues that are still in game since launch, but there has also been many great improvements made too.

But there is no we having to pay for subs, you have the choice to pay subs or buy DLC or not, it is left competely up to you, back in the old days, we all had to sub to be able to play.

They still need to generate cash, i.e the Crown Store, and upcoming DLCs, plus making the game available to consoles would have generated a lot of revenue too, which is being plowed back into the game, so hopefully the lag will be further addressed and made better, although many confuse fps lag with latency lag, there is a big difference.

IMO the game is getting better, not a fan boy by any means, if they do something right, then I say so, and also constructive critcism when applicable also

Everyone has their own choices in what they wanna do in the game, and some of these choices give Zeni cash, it is what it is.

SHADOW2KK · February 2016

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

SHADOW2KK wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Jaeysa wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

Refuse2GrowUp wrote: »

So much sense of entitlement; so much whining. What has the world come too?!?!

I was always againts free to play or buy to play method.

So get the subscription? You have three options. Buy the DLCs. Keep up a subscription. These allow you to gain access to the content that rewards the best gear. You're for subscription? Go with that. No one is saying you have to let it lapse.

I think he was saying he was against the crowd that Free to Play and Buy to Play attract.

I do not think a company is gonna develop a AAA game that is free somehow, and nor should they.

Not sure what OP is getting at, however have explained the fundamentals of why earlier.

Maybe gaming is not for you OP

The thing I don't get about the B2P or F2P community is how people can play the game for over a year and still complain like they didn't get their monies worth?

That way madness lies, do not think of it, its not your problem lol

Gidorick · February 2016

KingYogi415 wrote: »

You guys never played destiny huh?

Without the latest expansion everything you own is useless and you are locked out of everything.

ESO like life is pay to play.

You have everything you paid for.

Nothing less nothing more.

Each game's pay-to-win status should be judged on their own merit, not on a sliding scale based on the practices of other games.

That's like saying... well... sure he's a murderer but he's only killed like 8 people... at least he not like Ted Bundy.

Moderator edit - post edited to match moderated content

Spottswoode · February 2016

The best example for Pay2Win I can think is Battlefield Play4Free, which is no longer active. Some specific guns where locked behind a paywall and were only obtainable by buying larger store credit packages. What made it Pay2Win was that these guns were substantially better than others you could get by playing the game normally. In a game where most pistols are semi-automatic, a shotgun and burst fire machine pistol are extremely OP. Now the game did have a number of vehicles, but they were pretty easily countered making small guns extremely powerful in a number of situations. Game balance was very clearly skewed with the Nosferatu and 93R, most especially the latter.

Molag Kena is a powerful set, but it's not the only suitable set for high end PVE DPS nor is it so OP in PVP that no other set can effectively counter it.

Duiwel · February 2016

OP I get the feeling this is your first MMO if that is your opinion on DLC expansions...

Are you telling me if you board a plane with an economy class ticket and walk past first class & business class you will make a scene and say you are denied access because you paid for a plane ticket and want the same treatment?

I will explain it in a simplified way:

MMO games work as follow:

There is a base game ( ESO that you purchased ) Then over time DLC's / Expansion packs are released to add content, sometimes these are free ( almost never ), but usually you have to pay for them. I will give you a listed example now: LotROnline base game has about : 6 expansion packs that you need to pay for ( note that you are locked out of the content if you didn't buy it ) This is not a pay to win scenario because you are not losing, you are merely not allowed access to the content OP. There is a big difference... Guild Wars 1 had 3 expansions, some with new classes and skill lines that made your character very OP if you put the work in, is that pay to win for you also? Because of new content being released? OP you need to look at this with a more mature point of view which is : You own the base game, do you have access to every feature of the base game - yes or no ? Do other players who also just have the base game have advantages over you if they use the crown store - yes or no ? Point proven they have no advantages over you, the fact that you are missing out on new content is by no means pay to win. You are choosing not to have access to the new content, no MMO will ever give you every expansion for free because you bought their base game a couple of years ago. This is a business after all. Guild Wars 2 - expansion was only free to people who already owned the game as a promotional thing ( I owned it but missed out on getting it ). WoW - 5 expansions released so far, Legion coming later this year makes it 6. Tell me OP will it be pay to win if everyone who doesn't buy Legion gets locked out of content from it? I hope my examples shed some light onto this and made you realise how flawed your way of thinking is concerning pay to win
A final example: You buy a car, you only buy the base model - no special engine, no special radio, nothing... Your friend doesn't buy the car now, waits a year and buys the newer faster racing model. ( the upgrade ). You have the option to turn in your car but you will have to pay X amount to seal the deal, Is that unfair now? Certainly not. (btw the friend is any person who subs)

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO · February 2016

Breaking news WoW is pay to win because people that bought the expansion can get 10 levels higher then me.

Julianos · February 2016

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Breaking news WoW is pay to win because people that bought the expansion can get 10 levels higher then me.

Everything serves right for such people ^ so im not answer on this post anymore

ComboBreaker88 · February 2016

Let's get rifht down to the point. This isn't 1980. A game of this size requires money to operate. Who cares if you can buy access to the best stuff? Why don't you buy eso plus and support the game instead of complaining that you can't get the best stuff for free.

Gidorick · February 2016

@Duiwel This is why non-subscription MMO's are inherently drawn to pay-to-win type systems. This is why Matt Firor said, when justifying the sub model prior to launch said...

Matt Firor wrote:

Going with any other model meant that we would have to make sacrifices and changes we weren't willing to make.

https://www.primagames.com/games/elder-scrolls-online/news/elder-scrolls-online-will-come-monthly-subscriptio

They eventually went with another model, and they are making those sacrifices they weren't will to make before.

Julianos · February 2016

Gidorick wrote: »

@Duiwel This is why non-subscription MMO's are inherently drawn to pay-to-win type systems. This is why Matt Firor said, when justifying the sub model prior to launch said...

Matt Firor wrote:

Going with any other model meant that we would have to make sacrifices and changes we weren't willing to make.

https://www.primagames.com/games/elder-scrolls-online/news/elder-scrolls-online-will-come-monthly-subscriptio

They eventually went with another model, and they are making those sacrifices they weren't will to make before.

dont waste your breath dude

Prabooo · February 2016

Molag Kena shoulders drop from undaunted chests rewards. They will also be able to be purchased for gold or AP.
You can also subscribe to ESO plus and benefit temporarily from the DLC's without having to buy them.

Julianos · February 2016

Prabooo wrote: »

Molag Kena shoulders drop from undaunted chests rewards. They will also be able to be purchased for gold or AP.
You can also subscribe to ESO plus and benefit temporarily from the DLC's without having to buy them.

obviosuly no one reads my other posts i been subbing since PC launch till last month...

PURPLE245 · February 2016

the main think i dont like if how you have to buy the dlc to do the last 2 vet levels at a reasonable speed

SHADOW2KK · February 2016

Axorn wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

Duiwel wrote: »

OP I get the feeling this is your first MMO if that is your opinion on DLC expansions...

Are you telling me if you board a plane with an economy class ticket and walk past first class & business class you will make a scene and say you are denied access because you paid for a plane ticket and want the same treatment?

I will explain it in a simplified way:

MMO games work as follow:
There is a base game ( ESO that you purchased ) Then over time DLC's / Expansion packs are released to add content, sometimes these are free ( almost never ), but usually you have to pay for them. I will give you a listed example now: LotROnline base game has about : 6 expansion packs that you need to pay for ( note that you are locked out of the content if you didn't buy it ) This is not a pay to win scenario because you are not losing, you are merely not allowed access to the content OP. There is a big difference... Guild Wars 1 had 3 expansions, some with new classes and skill lines that made your character very OP if you put the work in, is that pay to win for you also? Because of new content being released? OP you need to look at this with a more mature point of view which is : You own the base game, do you have access to every feature of the base game - yes or no ? Do other players who also just have the base game have advantages over you if they use the crown store - yes or no ? Point proven they have no advantages over you, the fact that you are missing out on new content is by no means pay to win. You are choosing not to have access to the new content, no MMO will ever give you every expansion for free because you bought their base game a couple of years ago. This is a business after all. Guild Wars 2 - expansion was only free to people who already owned the game as a promotional thing ( I owned it but missed out on getting it ). WoW - 5 expansions released so far, Legion coming later this year makes it 6. Tell me OP will it be pay to win if everyone who doesn't buy Legion gets locked out of content from it? I hope my examples shed some light onto this and made you realise how flawed your way of thinking is concerning pay to win

A final example: You buy a car, you only buy the base model - no special engine, no special radio, nothing... Your friend doesn't buy the car now, waits a year and buys the newer faster racing model. ( the upgrade ). You have the option to turn in your car but you will have to pay X amount to seal the deal, Is that unfair now? Certainly not. (btw the friend is any person who subs)

You obviously didnt understand what im saying also i played all those games you mention but they were honest at least. ZOS always advertising falsely its ESOTU tamriel unlimited ! but everything is limited and if we need to pay to be able to actually play this game then there is no any diffrence with sub model thats what im trying to say..

I dare you to find a single quote from Zenimax saying you would have access to all the dlc items if you didn't buy the dlc. They didn't hide anything you just decided to believe whatever you wanted.

these are cheap tactics and un ethical on my eyes obviously your moralities are diffrent...

So is wanting your cake and eating it too, Zeni does nothing in the way of cheap tactics imo, they promote the DLCs, note, the hint is in the title, DLCs, it is up to the customer to choose whether they want to either buy it or sub to the game to gain access, they are never forcing you to do it.

If you want the super duper weapons from VMA then earn them, that way you will feel as though you have accomplished something and rightly so, if you will not sub or buy the DLC, then its no ones problem but your own.

Not meaning to sound harsh, but you said in your OP regarding the VMA weapons and then unsub due to the lag, fair enough, cannot blame you but its nonsensical moaning about wanting things, but not prepared to `pay` for them.
Zeni like any other gaming company is there to make money, their customer base, i.e us, do not have to pay for some stuff, they know some will buy anyways, or buy at some point, and others wont.

Hardly cheap tactics or un ethical, its business.

And it is a game, play how you want.

it is like the world we all live in, you can go anywhere, but you need the funds to access places, just like certain zones like Orsinium or w/e, same principles apply.

EnemyOfDaState · February 2016

Axorn wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

Duiwel wrote: »

OP I get the feeling this is your first MMO if that is your opinion on DLC expansions...

Are you telling me if you board a plane with an economy class ticket and walk past first class & business class you will make a scene and say you are denied access because you paid for a plane ticket and want the same treatment?

I will explain it in a simplified way:

MMO games work as follow:
There is a base game ( ESO that you purchased ) Then over time DLC's / Expansion packs are released to add content, sometimes these are free ( almost never ), but usually you have to pay for them. I will give you a listed example now: LotROnline base game has about : 6 expansion packs that you need to pay for ( note that you are locked out of the content if you didn't buy it ) This is not a pay to win scenario because you are not losing, you are merely not allowed access to the content OP. There is a big difference... Guild Wars 1 had 3 expansions, some with new classes and skill lines that made your character very OP if you put the work in, is that pay to win for you also? Because of new content being released? OP you need to look at this with a more mature point of view which is : You own the base game, do you have access to every feature of the base game - yes or no ? Do other players who also just have the base game have advantages over you if they use the crown store - yes or no ? Point proven they have no advantages over you, the fact that you are missing out on new content is by no means pay to win. You are choosing not to have access to the new content, no MMO will ever give you every expansion for free because you bought their base game a couple of years ago. This is a business after all. Guild Wars 2 - expansion was only free to people who already owned the game as a promotional thing ( I owned it but missed out on getting it ). WoW - 5 expansions released so far, Legion coming later this year makes it 6. Tell me OP will it be pay to win if everyone who doesn't buy Legion gets locked out of content from it? I hope my examples shed some light onto this and made you realise how flawed your way of thinking is concerning pay to win

A final example: You buy a car, you only buy the base model - no special engine, no special radio, nothing... Your friend doesn't buy the car now, waits a year and buys the newer faster racing model. ( the upgrade ). You have the option to turn in your car but you will have to pay X amount to seal the deal, Is that unfair now? Certainly not. (btw the friend is any person who subs)

You obviously didnt understand what im saying also i played all those games you mention but they were honest at least. ZOS always advertising falsely its ESOTU tamriel unlimited ! but everything is limited and if we need to pay to be able to actually play this game then there is no any diffrence with sub model thats what im trying to say..

I dare you to find a single quote from Zenimax saying you would have access to all the dlc items if you didn't buy the dlc. They didn't hide anything you just decided to believe whatever you wanted.

these are cheap tactics and un ethical on my eyes obviously your moralities are diffrent...

Asking for money to access new content that they have to pay people to make is a cheap tactic? Like did you actually think you were going to pay $60 or however much you spent on the game and have access to every piece of content released for the next 5-10 years or however long this game exists? How would that even work?

PURPLE245 · February 2016

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

Duiwel wrote: »

OP I get the feeling this is your first MMO if that is your opinion on DLC expansions...

Are you telling me if you board a plane with an economy class ticket and walk past first class & business class you will make a scene and say you are denied access because you paid for a plane ticket and want the same treatment?

I will explain it in a simplified way:

MMO games work as follow:
There is a base game ( ESO that you purchased ) Then over time DLC's / Expansion packs are released to add content, sometimes these are free ( almost never ), but usually you have to pay for them. I will give you a listed example now: LotROnline base game has about : 6 expansion packs that you need to pay for ( note that you are locked out of the content if you didn't buy it ) This is not a pay to win scenario because you are not losing, you are merely not allowed access to the content OP. There is a big difference... Guild Wars 1 had 3 expansions, some with new classes and skill lines that made your character very OP if you put the work in, is that pay to win for you also? Because of new content being released? OP you need to look at this with a more mature point of view which is : You own the base game, do you have access to every feature of the base game - yes or no ? Do other players who also just have the base game have advantages over you if they use the crown store - yes or no ? Point proven they have no advantages over you, the fact that you are missing out on new content is by no means pay to win. You are choosing not to have access to the new content, no MMO will ever give you every expansion for free because you bought their base game a couple of years ago. This is a business after all. Guild Wars 2 - expansion was only free to people who already owned the game as a promotional thing ( I owned it but missed out on getting it ). WoW - 5 expansions released so far, Legion coming later this year makes it 6. Tell me OP will it be pay to win if everyone who doesn't buy Legion gets locked out of content from it? I hope my examples shed some light onto this and made you realise how flawed your way of thinking is concerning pay to win

A final example: You buy a car, you only buy the base model - no special engine, no special radio, nothing... Your friend doesn't buy the car now, waits a year and buys the newer faster racing model. ( the upgrade ). You have the option to turn in your car but you will have to pay X amount to seal the deal, Is that unfair now? Certainly not. (btw the friend is any person who subs)

You obviously didnt understand what im saying also i played all those games you mention but they were honest at least. ZOS always advertising falsely its ESOTU tamriel unlimited ! but everything is limited and if we need to pay to be able to actually play this game then there is no any diffrence with sub model thats what im trying to say..

I dare you to find a single quote from Zenimax saying you would have access to all the dlc items if you didn't buy the dlc. They didn't hide anything you just decided to believe whatever you wanted.

these are cheap tactics and un ethical on my eyes obviously your moralities are diffrent...

Asking for money to access new content that they have to pay people to make is a cheap tactic? Like did you actually think you were going to pay $60 or however much you spent on the game and have access to every piece of content released for the next 5-10 years or however long this game exists? How would that even work?

pretty funny how you pay 60 for the base game and like 30 for a damn mounts

Whatzituyah · February 2016

PURPLE245 wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

Duiwel wrote: »

OP I get the feeling this is your first MMO if that is your opinion on DLC expansions...

Are you telling me if you board a plane with an economy class ticket and walk past first class & business class you will make a scene and say you are denied access because you paid for a plane ticket and want the same treatment?

I will explain it in a simplified way:

MMO games work as follow:
There is a base game ( ESO that you purchased ) Then over time DLC's / Expansion packs are released to add content, sometimes these are free ( almost never ), but usually you have to pay for them. I will give you a listed example now: LotROnline base game has about : 6 expansion packs that you need to pay for ( note that you are locked out of the content if you didn't buy it ) This is not a pay to win scenario because you are not losing, you are merely not allowed access to the content OP. There is a big difference... Guild Wars 1 had 3 expansions, some with new classes and skill lines that made your character very OP if you put the work in, is that pay to win for you also? Because of new content being released? OP you need to look at this with a more mature point of view which is : You own the base game, do you have access to every feature of the base game - yes or no ? Do other players who also just have the base game have advantages over you if they use the crown store - yes or no ? Point proven they have no advantages over you, the fact that you are missing out on new content is by no means pay to win. You are choosing not to have access to the new content, no MMO will ever give you every expansion for free because you bought their base game a couple of years ago. This is a business after all. Guild Wars 2 - expansion was only free to people who already owned the game as a promotional thing ( I owned it but missed out on getting it ). WoW - 5 expansions released so far, Legion coming later this year makes it 6. Tell me OP will it be pay to win if everyone who doesn't buy Legion gets locked out of content from it? I hope my examples shed some light onto this and made you realise how flawed your way of thinking is concerning pay to win

A final example: You buy a car, you only buy the base model - no special engine, no special radio, nothing... Your friend doesn't buy the car now, waits a year and buys the newer faster racing model. ( the upgrade ). You have the option to turn in your car but you will have to pay X amount to seal the deal, Is that unfair now? Certainly not. (btw the friend is any person who subs)

You obviously didnt understand what im saying also i played all those games you mention but they were honest at least. ZOS always advertising falsely its ESOTU tamriel unlimited ! but everything is limited and if we need to pay to be able to actually play this game then there is no any diffrence with sub model thats what im trying to say..

I dare you to find a single quote from Zenimax saying you would have access to all the dlc items if you didn't buy the dlc. They didn't hide anything you just decided to believe whatever you wanted.

these are cheap tactics and un ethical on my eyes obviously your moralities are diffrent...

Asking for money to access new content that they have to pay people to make is a cheap tactic? Like did you actually think you were going to pay $60 or however much you spent on the game and have access to every piece of content released for the next 5-10 years or however long this game exists? How would that even work?

pretty funny how you pay 60 for the base game and like 30 for a damn mounts

Ikr? Everything cosmetic is expensive except the ones you can earn.

Marrtha · February 2016

Eh a game can't be free. They have to sell you something. Some content, anything. You can protest all you want by not getting the sub or buying the DLC, but if everyone did that, the game wouldn't run at all. There is a cost for running the servers etc.
Sometimes I wonder how are they still motivated to keep this game going, all people do is give unconstructive feedback, whine and complain. And god forbid you say how you like something, here on the forums, the salty ones will be all over your ass.

And how would it become pay to win? It used to be buy and pay to play. Then it went buy to play; paying monthly is optional, but if you do, we will show are gratitude - here is some content for you.

Duiwel wrote: »

OP I get the feeling this is your first MMO if that is your opinion on DLC expansions...
Are you telling me if you board a plane with an economy class ticket and walk past first class & business class you will make a scene and say you are denied access because you paid for a plane ticket and want the same treatment?

This. Welcome to planet Earth.

JD2013 · February 2016

Given that monster helms including Molag Kena are going to be buyable from Cyrodiil, then at least part of your argument is invalid.

You pay for the base game and nothing else when you buy the game. The devs don't work on DLC for free. Upkeep of the game is not free. If you buy the base game and nothing more, then that is cool. But don't expect new things for free, because you're not entitled to it. You haven't paid for access to it, either by subscribing or by purchasing it. That includes any sets or weapons that they make BOP. If you want them, and the new areas, don't be cheap.

And I do understand that for one reason or another some here may not be able to afford these DLC's for reasons, you still get hundreds of hours of gameplay for your money.

Julianos · February 2016

Majority stop playing this game cuz of bugs lag exploits and such things then they switched to buy to play model to lure people back the reason people quit wasnt economical, reason was a broken game... and they couldnt fix it they still cant the whole buy to play and tamriel unlimited thing is kinda... NVM sometimes silence is the best punishment

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · February 2016

Someone doesnt know what pay to win means. Pay to win means you pay for something that you cannot get any other way. This does not include the purchase price of the game nor DLC price or expansion price. So lets say they sold a weapon better than any you could find or craft. Its only available in the store. THAT is pay to win. Not xp boosts or anything like that.

Nifty2g · February 2016

Zenimax are riding a bike on the thin line of Pay 2 Win, they just wont cross it anytime soon

Duiwel · February 2016

Gidorick wrote: »

@Duiwel This is why non-subscription MMO's are inherently drawn to pay-to-win type systems. This is why Matt Firor said, when justifying the sub model prior to launch said...

Matt Firor wrote:

Going with any other model meant that we would have to make sacrifices and changes we weren't willing to make.

https://www.primagames.com/games/elder-scrolls-online/news/elder-scrolls-online-will-come-monthly-subscriptio

They eventually went with another model, and they are making those sacrifices they weren't will to make before.

I understand that and I know theives guild was suppose to be added to the base game, but this game also wasn't planned to go free to play. Regardless of what their initial intentions/ plans were things happened that were eout of their control and their business department made a call to pull sub and go for cash store in order to keep the ship afloat. Take SWTOR - it was dying as a sub based MMO, yet as a F2P / (with an extremely expensive cash shop) it lives still with a small but healthy population. So while it saddens me that I have to pay for small DLC packs like thieves guild I am an adult and I understand these things happen.

BUT given this information OP do you have a job? Do you do things for free? Since you told Gidorick don't waste his breath, ESO:TU has employees who work and pay for electricity, internet and food. Do you think you buying the game almost 2 years ago is enough to pay for all of that forever?

OP I am curious what country you are from which has such a poor exchange rate that you feel you are being misled by having to pay for DLC to be able to participate in new content... It is not a "cheap tactic" it's called business 101, god

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · February 2016

Duiwel wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

@Duiwel This is why non-subscription MMO's are inherently drawn to pay-to-win type systems. This is why Matt Firor said, when justifying the sub model prior to launch said...

Matt Firor wrote:

Going with any other model meant that we would have to make sacrifices and changes we weren't willing to make.

https://www.primagames.com/games/elder-scrolls-online/news/elder-scrolls-online-will-come-monthly-subscriptio

They eventually went with another model, and they are making those sacrifices they weren't will to make before.

I understand that and I know theives guild was suppose to be added to the base game, but this game also wasn't planned to go free to play. Regardless of what their initial intentions/ plans were things happened that were eout of their control and their business department made a call to pull sub and go for cash store in order to keep the ship afloat. Take SWTOR - it was dying as a sub based MMO, yet as a F2P / (with an extremely expensive cash shop) it lives still with a small but healthy population. So while it saddens me that I have to pay for small DLC packs like thieves guild I am an adult and I understand these things happen.

BUT given this information OP do you have a job? Do you do things for free? Since you told Gidorick don't waste his breath, ESO:TU has employees who work and pay for electricity, internet and food. Do you think you buying the game almost 2 years ago is enough to pay for all of that forever?

OP I am curious what country you are from which has such a poor exchange rate that you feel you are being misled by having to pay for DLC to be able to participate in new content... It is not a "cheap tactic" it's called business 101, god

If they hadnt went buy to play you would be paying $15 a month plus $25 for the DLC. They never said anything about it being free ever.

Also SWTOR doesnt have a small base. Its base is easily double that of ESO. Mainly because it has real pvp.

Julianos · February 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Someone doesnt know what pay to win means. Pay to win means you pay for something that you cannot get any other way. This does not include the purchase price of the game nor DLC price or expansion price. So lets say they sold a weapon better than any you could find or craft. Its only available in the store. THAT is pay to win. Not xp boosts or anything like that.

Yes you are right guys its actually pay to lose in current state just keep buying hoping they will fix someday. Like me since launch

Duiwel · February 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Duiwel wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

@Duiwel This is why non-subscription MMO's are inherently drawn to pay-to-win type systems. This is why Matt Firor said, when justifying the sub model prior to launch said...

Matt Firor wrote:

Going with any other model meant that we would have to make sacrifices and changes we weren't willing to make.

https://www.primagames.com/games/elder-scrolls-online/news/elder-scrolls-online-will-come-monthly-subscriptio

They eventually went with another model, and they are making those sacrifices they weren't will to make before.

I understand that and I know theives guild was suppose to be added to the base game, but this game also wasn't planned to go free to play. Regardless of what their initial intentions/ plans were things happened that were eout of their control and their business department made a call to pull sub and go for cash store in order to keep the ship afloat. Take SWTOR - it was dying as a sub based MMO, yet as a F2P / (with an extremely expensive cash shop) it lives still with a small but healthy population. So while it saddens me that I have to pay for small DLC packs like thieves guild I am an adult and I understand these things happen.

BUT given this information OP do you have a job? Do you do things for free? Since you told Gidorick don't waste his breath, ESO:TU has employees who work and pay for electricity, internet and food. Do you think you buying the game almost 2 years ago is enough to pay for all of that forever?

OP I am curious what country you are from which has such a poor exchange rate that you feel you are being misled by having to pay for DLC to be able to participate in new content... It is not a "cheap tactic" it's called business 101, god

If they hadnt went buy to play you would be paying $15 a month plus $25 for the DLC. They never said anything about it being free ever.

Exactly my point! I sub btw so I don't know these "I can't access this content" feels