PTS Discussion: AP needed to get Alliance War skills to 10

CatchMeTrolling

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Sanct16 wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

Well an average player without a guildgroup won't make much AP. And thats the majority of players.

I would be completely baffled if someone couldn't make 10k ap in a day is what I'm saying. I know not everyone is good at getting ap, though every emp push I did was solo & I know a few other people that do the same thing.

I don't think it's about the number of people with you, it's still more so learning the best ways to get ap and what campaigns to play in. You can run in a 24 man group everyday but have that one guy owning you in ap gains every campaign.

It's an average. Average player maybe doesn't pvp every day. Average player probably dies alot and needs to waste time traveling. A lot might not join a group but still follow the zerg around and get 9 AP off a kill. Many might not know about d-ticks, have resorces for wall repairs or rezs, or might not even know about the bounty quests. A player like this is lucky to make 5k an hour. And maybe, there are alot of these players out there.

They said average pvp player , that's different than saying average player, that's like adding me to the results of a pve survey which I rarely play. But my point still stands, I refuse to believe anyone is getting 10k in a day. You can't really consider those numbers when making significant changes, that doesn't sound like a PVP player or someone that plays pvp for over an hr.

This change really seems like it was made because of the pve players that rarely play pvp but want pvp skills lol

You're basically into a "no true Scotsman" fallacy here. "No true PvPer would make less than 10k AP a day because true PvPers make more than that." I mayself am barely up to 20k a day on average, it is not out of the relm of possibilities.

You're not going to sit here and convince me you're making 10k or 20k ap a day seriously playing or casually playing. How long do you play an hr?

2-3 hours PvP most days, longer on my days off, but not all days. (Those 0s factor into my average by the way.) As do the final days of the last campaign when the other alliances gave up and I couldn't find any fights. Azura's Star NA PC, I had just shy of 600k AP across 4 characters last cycle. That factors out to 20k a day, does it not?

My main is VR16, been in PvP since lvl 10 on 8 characters, my main's undaunted rank is 4, and his alliance skill rank is 8. I haven't even completed the main quest, and have been playing since launch. My main has over 42 days of play time, combine with my alts, I average about 3 hours of play a day since launch.

I am regularly in the top 10% rewards at the end of a campaign. I made 100k in a week on a level 20 who fights without a weapon using punches. I can do that because I am better than most pvpers.

I've played with multiple characters during a campaign and got more than that casually. Though you're just deflecting & bringing extra stuff into play, pretty sure I was talking about one character not 7 alts.

And you don't have a better idea, you have a better idea of how it is on PC na, which is a lower population than the platform I play on. If you were to join the one I play on you definitely wouldn't be in the top 10 percent with just 600k ap, I'm sure that's a 30 day as well on na PC?

Even if what you say is true between those characters you still should have more than 10k-20k ap in 3hrs, if you want to switch between alts that's on you but only making 20k ap overall is terrible.

And since ZOS didn't bring up alts I wouldn't even bring that up but even if they did through 3hrs you should have more than 20k ap.

Not deflecting, you were assuming I don't PvP much. But you seem intent on ignoring facts that don't support your narrative.

AS is the pop-locked campaign on NA PC, you can't fit more players on a campaign no matter what platform you play. Second, it's 10%. AS NA PC leader boards have about 10,000+ characters homed there. That means the top 10% is roughly the top 1000 characters. Do you know what a larger player base translates into, more than 1000 characters in the top 10%. That means you probably need less to cross that threshold because there are more spots.

I have a challenge for you. Take two alts. Have one earn 600k, not a problem for you, I'm sure. I don't even care how you do it, get a bunch of friends to let you kill them, just as long as you hit 600,000 AP in a 30 day campaign. Take a second alt into the same campaign and do one single wall repair. Post a screen shot of the leader board positions for both a day before the end of the campaign.

No I didn't assume anything, I simply asked do you play an hr. I don't think you get what I'm saying here either, so I'll say it differently.

After 2-3 hrs of play time with alts or just one character do you accumulate more than 20k ap overall? Can't see how anyone is getting 10k ap or just 20k ap in that time, especially in a pop locked server. But I guess so

[Edited to remove quote]

driosketch

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Sanct16 wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

Well an average player without a guildgroup won't make much AP. And thats the majority of players.

I would be completely baffled if someone couldn't make 10k ap in a day is what I'm saying. I know not everyone is good at getting ap, though every emp push I did was solo & I know a few other people that do the same thing.

I don't think it's about the number of people with you, it's still more so learning the best ways to get ap and what campaigns to play in. You can run in a 24 man group everyday but have that one guy owning you in ap gains every campaign.

It's an average. Average player maybe doesn't pvp every day. Average player probably dies alot and needs to waste time traveling. A lot might not join a group but still follow the zerg around and get 9 AP off a kill. Many might not know about d-ticks, have resorces for wall repairs or rezs, or might not even know about the bounty quests. A player like this is lucky to make 5k an hour. And maybe, there are alot of these players out there.

They said average pvp player , that's different than saying average player, that's like adding me to the results of a pve survey which I rarely play. But my point still stands, I refuse to believe anyone is getting 10k in a day. You can't really consider those numbers when making significant changes, that doesn't sound like a PVP player or someone that plays pvp for over an hr.

This change really seems like it was made because of the pve players that rarely play pvp but want pvp skills lol

You're basically into a "no true Scotsman" fallacy here. "No true PvPer would make less than 10k AP a day because true PvPers make more than that." I mayself am barely up to 20k a day on average, it is not out of the relm of possibilities.

You're not going to sit here and convince me you're making 10k or 20k ap a day seriously playing or casually playing. How long do you play an hr?

2-3 hours PvP most days, longer on my days off, but not all days. (Those 0s factor into my average by the way.) As do the final days of the last campaign when the other alliances gave up and I couldn't find any fights. Azura's Star NA PC, I had just shy of 600k AP across 4 characters last cycle. That factors out to 20k a day, does it not?

My main is VR16, been in PvP since lvl 10 on 8 characters, my main's undaunted rank is 4, and his alliance skill rank is 8. I haven't even completed the main quest, and have been playing since launch. My main has over 42 days of play time, combine with my alts, I average about 3 hours of play a day since launch.

I am regularly in the top 10% rewards at the end of a campaign. I made 100k in a week on a level 20 who fights without a weapon using punches. I can do that because I am better than most pvpers.

I've played with multiple characters during a campaign and got more than that casually. Though you're just deflecting & bringing extra stuff into play, pretty sure I was talking about one character not 7 alts.

And you don't have a better idea, you have a better idea of how it is on PC na, which is a lower population than the platform I play on. If you were to join the one I play on you definitely wouldn't be in the top 10 percent with just 600k ap, I'm sure that's a 30 day as well on na PC?

Even if what you say is true between those characters you still should have more than 10k-20k ap in 3hrs, if you want to switch between alts that's on you but only making 20k ap overall is terrible.

And since ZOS didn't bring up alts I wouldn't even bring that up but even if they did through 3hrs you should have more than 20k ap.

Not deflecting, you were assuming I don't PvP much. But you seem intent on ignoring facts that don't support your narrative.

AS is the pop-locked campaign on NA PC, you can't fit more players on a campaign no matter what platform you play. Second, it's 10%. AS NA PC leader boards have about 10,000+ characters homed there. That means the top 10% is roughly the top 1000 characters. Do you know what a larger player base translates into, more than 1000 characters in the top 10%. That means you probably need less to cross that threshold because there are more spots.

I have a challenge for you. Take two alts. Have one earn 600k, not a problem for you, I'm sure. I don't even care how you do it, get a bunch of friends to let you kill them, just as long as you hit 600,000 AP in a 30 day campaign. Take a second alt into the same campaign and do one single wall repair. Post a screen shot of the leader board positions for both a day before the end of the campaign.

No I didn't assume anything, I simply asked do you play an hr. I don't think you get what I'm saying here either, so I'll say it differently.

After 2-3 hrs of play time with alts or just one character do you accumulate more than 20k ap overall?

After, 2 hours tonight, I got about 20-25k AP


[Edited to remove quote]

bowmanz607

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Jura23 wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

I find it hard to believe the top 5 ap farmers are only getting 30k+ an hr when you very well can get 100k in an hr farming in a buff server. So where are these numbers coming from? You can get a 20k plus gate tick within a second and on top of that you'll already be fighting behind your gate getting double ap for each kill. So what type of players are you looking at?

I think this Rich's post pretty much proves half of these number thrown around are jsut bragging and the other half is compensated by lots o time afk or TS chatting instead of playing etc.

Something is off about them to me lol wish I had the time to prove these numbers wrong

Ya sure during prime time or when you catch some good fighting in the off hours a team can farm 100,000ap an hour. That is bit sustained though. That is a burst of an hour or two. Spread out over many hours of plating it tends to even back out. Those 100k hours are the exception not the norm.

That said, it is always good to be skeptical about numbers when you never know the parameters they used for testing.

CatchMeTrolling

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Sanct16 wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

Well an average player without a guildgroup won't make much AP. And thats the majority of players.

I would be completely baffled if someone couldn't make 10k ap in a day is what I'm saying. I know not everyone is good at getting ap, though every emp push I did was solo & I know a few other people that do the same thing.

I don't think it's about the number of people with you, it's still more so learning the best ways to get ap and what campaigns to play in. You can run in a 24 man group everyday but have that one guy owning you in ap gains every campaign.

It's an average. Average player maybe doesn't pvp every day. Average player probably dies alot and needs to waste time traveling. A lot might not join a group but still follow the zerg around and get 9 AP off a kill. Many might not know about d-ticks, have resorces for wall repairs or rezs, or might not even know about the bounty quests. A player like this is lucky to make 5k an hour. And maybe, there are alot of these players out there.

They said average pvp player , that's different than saying average player, that's like adding me to the results of a pve survey which I rarely play. But my point still stands, I refuse to believe anyone is getting 10k in a day. You can't really consider those numbers when making significant changes, that doesn't sound like a PVP player or someone that plays pvp for over an hr.

This change really seems like it was made because of the pve players that rarely play pvp but want pvp skills lol

You're basically into a "no true Scotsman" fallacy here. "No true PvPer would make less than 10k AP a day because true PvPers make more than that." I mayself am barely up to 20k a day on average, it is not out of the relm of possibilities.

You're not going to sit here and convince me you're making 10k or 20k ap a day seriously playing or casually playing. How long do you play an hr?

2-3 hours PvP most days, longer on my days off, but not all days. (Those 0s factor into my average by the way.) As do the final days of the last campaign when the other alliances gave up and I couldn't find any fights. Azura's Star NA PC, I had just shy of 600k AP across 4 characters last cycle. That factors out to 20k a day, does it not?

My main is VR16, been in PvP since lvl 10 on 8 characters, my main's undaunted rank is 4, and his alliance skill rank is 8. I haven't even completed the main quest, and have been playing since launch. My main has over 42 days of play time, combine with my alts, I average about 3 hours of play a day since launch.

I am regularly in the top 10% rewards at the end of a campaign. I made 100k in a week on a level 20 who fights without a weapon using punches. I can do that because I am better than most pvpers.

I've played with multiple characters during a campaign and got more than that casually. Though you're just deflecting & bringing extra stuff into play, pretty sure I was talking about one character not 7 alts.

And you don't have a better idea, you have a better idea of how it is on PC na, which is a lower population than the platform I play on. If you were to join the one I play on you definitely wouldn't be in the top 10 percent with just 600k ap, I'm sure that's a 30 day as well on na PC?

Even if what you say is true between those characters you still should have more than 10k-20k ap in 3hrs, if you want to switch between alts that's on you but only making 20k ap overall is terrible.

And since ZOS didn't bring up alts I wouldn't even bring that up but even if they did through 3hrs you should have more than 20k ap.

Not deflecting, you were assuming I don't PvP much. But you seem intent on ignoring facts that don't support your narrative.

AS is the pop-locked campaign on NA PC, you can't fit more players on a campaign no matter what platform you play. Second, it's 10%. AS NA PC leader boards have about 10,000+ characters homed there. That means the top 10% is roughly the top 1000 characters. Do you know what a larger player base translates into, more than 1000 characters in the top 10%. That means you probably need less to cross that threshold because there are more spots.

I have a challenge for you. Take two alts. Have one earn 600k, not a problem for you, I'm sure. I don't even care how you do it, get a bunch of friends to let you kill them, just as long as you hit 600,000 AP in a 30 day campaign. Take a second alt into the same campaign and do one single wall repair. Post a screen shot of the leader board positions for both a day before the end of the campaign.

No I didn't assume anything, I simply asked do you play an hr. I don't think you get what I'm saying here either, so I'll say it differently.

After 2-3 hrs of play time with alts or just one character do you accumulate more than 20k ap overall?

After, 2 hours tonight, I got about 20-25k AP

What do you do to get these numbers? I had someone tell me they no life the game & only play pvp but barely make over 300k ap after a 7 day campaign. With that being said they didn't understand how people made millions.

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.


[Edited to remove quote]

bowmanz607

I don't understand what so many people's issue with this change is. Now all skills and passive will be equal to all to get making fights more intereating. Adds more skill to the game when people are placed on a more leveled playing field. Even if it is a small change in that regard.

I expect that many players who hate on this change are players that have been around for a long time and earned what they got over a long period of time. Listen I hear you. I have been since beta. But who cares? So other players have something you already have. How does this hurt you? Heck this helps long term players with at leveling. Idk about you but I hate leveling that crap every time. I assume many haters on this are long term because it doesn't make sense for a new player to hate changes that help them catch up quicker.

This may also help break up farm groups to a small extent perhaps minimal but still some. People may be less inclined to farm to get skills. At a minimum it doesn't reward ap farmers with anything more than a title.

Jura23

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Sanct16 wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

Well an average player without a guildgroup won't make much AP. And thats the majority of players.

I would be completely baffled if someone couldn't make 10k ap in a day is what I'm saying. I know not everyone is good at getting ap, though every emp push I did was solo & I know a few other people that do the same thing.

I don't think it's about the number of people with you, it's still more so learning the best ways to get ap and what campaigns to play in. You can run in a 24 man group everyday but have that one guy owning you in ap gains every campaign.

It's an average. Average player maybe doesn't pvp every day. Average player probably dies alot and needs to waste time traveling. A lot might not join a group but still follow the zerg around and get 9 AP off a kill. Many might not know about d-ticks, have resorces for wall repairs or rezs, or might not even know about the bounty quests. A player like this is lucky to make 5k an hour. And maybe, there are alot of these players out there.

They said average pvp player , that's different than saying average player, that's like adding me to the results of a pve survey which I rarely play. But my point still stands, I refuse to believe anyone is getting 10k in a day. You can't really consider those numbers when making significant changes, that doesn't sound like a PVP player or someone that plays pvp for over an hr.

This change really seems like it was made because of the pve players that rarely play pvp but want pvp skills lol

You're basically into a "no true Scotsman" fallacy here. "No true PvPer would make less than 10k AP a day because true PvPers make more than that." I mayself am barely up to 20k a day on average, it is not out of the relm of possibilities.

You're not going to sit here and convince me you're making 10k or 20k ap a day seriously playing or casually playing. How long do you play an hr?

2-3 hours PvP most days, longer on my days off, but not all days. (Those 0s factor into my average by the way.) As do the final days of the last campaign when the other alliances gave up and I couldn't find any fights. Azura's Star NA PC, I had just shy of 600k AP across 4 characters last cycle. That factors out to 20k a day, does it not?

My main is VR16, been in PvP since lvl 10 on 8 characters, my main's undaunted rank is 4, and his alliance skill rank is 8. I haven't even completed the main quest, and have been playing since launch. My main has over 42 days of play time, combine with my alts, I average about 3 hours of play a day since launch.

I am regularly in the top 10% rewards at the end of a campaign. I made 100k in a week on a level 20 who fights without a weapon using punches. I can do that because I am better than most pvpers, and I have a better idea of the average PvP player than you do.

/dropsmic

I'll just say that's terrible, I've played with multiple characters during a campaign and got more than that casually. Though you're just deflecting & bringing extra stuff into play, pretty sure I was talking about one character not 7 alts but okay.

And you don't have a better idea, you have a better idea of how it is on PC na, which is a lower population than the platform I play on. If you were to join the one I play on you definitely wouldn't be in the top 10 percent with just 600k ap, I'm sure that's a 30 day as well on na PC? Yeah I would love to see you finish in the top percent with that.

Even if what you say is true between those characters you still should have more than 10k-20k ap in 3hrs, if you want to switch between alts that's on you but only making 20k ap overall is terrible.

And since ZOS didn't bring up alts I wouldn't even bring that up but even if they did through 3hrs you should have more than 20k ap. You're really going to defend this huh?

Not deflecting, you were assuming I don't PvP much, admit it. But you seem intent on ignoring facts that don't support your narrative.

AS is the pop-locked campaign on NA PC, you can't fit more players on a campaign no matter what platform you play. Second, it's 10%. AS NA PC leader boards have about 10,000+ characters homed there. That means the top 10% is roughly the top 1000 characters. Do you know what a larger player base translates into, more than 1000 players in the top 10%. That means you probably need less to cross that threshold because there are more spots.

Do you even know where the 10% boarder is on your campaign? Well I have a challenge for you. Take two alts. Have one earn 600k, not a problem for you, I'm sure. I don't even care how you do it, get a bunch of friends to let you kill them, just as long as you hit 600,000 AP in a 30 day campaign. Take a second alt into the same campaign and do one single wall repair. Post a screen shot of the leader board positions for both a day before the end of the campaign. We'll see if you learn anything.

No I didn't assume anything, I simply asked do you play an hr. I don't think you get what I'm saying here either, so I'll say it differently.

After 2-3 hrs of play time with alts or just one character do you accumulate more than 20k ap overall?

After, 2 hours tonight, I got about 20-25k AP

What do you do to get these numbers? I had someone tell me they no life the game & only play pvp but barely make over 300k ap after a 7 day campaign. With that being said they didn't understand how people made millions.

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.

Well I suspect the purpose of average players in Cyrodiil is not making AP or learning how to make more of it.

But that doesn't make them less PvP players.

driosketch

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Sanct16 wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

Well an average player without a guildgroup won't make much AP. And thats the majority of players.

I would be completely baffled if someone couldn't make 10k ap in a day is what I'm saying. I know not everyone is good at getting ap, though every emp push I did was solo & I know a few other people that do the same thing.

I don't think it's about the number of people with you, it's still more so learning the best ways to get ap and what campaigns to play in. You can run in a 24 man group everyday but have that one guy owning you in ap gains every campaign.

It's an average. Average player maybe doesn't pvp every day. Average player probably dies alot and needs to waste time traveling. A lot might not join a group but still follow the zerg around and get 9 AP off a kill. Many might not know about d-ticks, have resorces for wall repairs or rezs, or might not even know about the bounty quests. A player like this is lucky to make 5k an hour. And maybe, there are alot of these players out there.

They said average pvp player , that's different than saying average player, that's like adding me to the results of a pve survey which I rarely play. But my point still stands, I refuse to believe anyone is getting 10k in a day. You can't really consider those numbers when making significant changes, that doesn't sound like a PVP player or someone that plays pvp for over an hr.

This change really seems like it was made because of the pve players that rarely play pvp but want pvp skills lol

You're basically into a "no true Scotsman" fallacy here. "No true PvPer would make less than 10k AP a day because true PvPers make more than that." I mayself am barely up to 20k a day on average, it is not out of the relm of possibilities.

You're not going to sit here and convince me you're making 10k or 20k ap a day seriously playing or casually playing. How long do you play an hr?

2-3 hours PvP most days, longer on my days off, but not all days. (Those 0s factor into my average by the way.) As do the final days of the last campaign when the other alliances gave up and I couldn't find any fights. Azura's Star NA PC, I had just shy of 600k AP across 4 characters last cycle. That factors out to 20k a day, does it not?

My main is VR16, been in PvP since lvl 10 on 8 characters, my main's undaunted rank is 4, and his alliance skill rank is 8. I haven't even completed the main quest, and have been playing since launch. My main has over 42 days of play time, combine with my alts, I average about 3 hours of play a day since launch.

I am regularly in the top 10% rewards at the end of a campaign. I made 100k in a week on a level 20 who fights without a weapon using punches. I can do that because I am better than most pvpers, and I have a better idea of the average PvP player than you do.

/dropsmic

I'll just say that's terrible, I've played with multiple characters during a campaign and got more than that casually. Though you're just deflecting & bringing extra stuff into play, pretty sure I was talking about one character not 7 alts but okay.

And you don't have a better idea, you have a better idea of how it is on PC na, which is a lower population than the platform I play on. If you were to join the one I play on you definitely wouldn't be in the top 10 percent with just 600k ap, I'm sure that's a 30 day as well on na PC? Yeah I would love to see you finish in the top percent with that.

Even if what you say is true between those characters you still should have more than 10k-20k ap in 3hrs, if you want to switch between alts that's on you but only making 20k ap overall is terrible.

And since ZOS didn't bring up alts I wouldn't even bring that up but even if they did through 3hrs you should have more than 20k ap. You're really going to defend this huh?

Not deflecting, you were assuming I don't PvP much, admit it. But you seem intent on ignoring facts that don't support your narrative.

AS is the pop-locked campaign on NA PC, you can't fit more players on a campaign no matter what platform you play. Second, it's 10%. AS NA PC leader boards have about 10,000+ characters homed there. That means the top 10% is roughly the top 1000 characters. Do you know what a larger player base translates into, more than 1000 players in the top 10%. That means you probably need less to cross that threshold because there are more spots.

Do you even know where the 10% boarder is on your campaign? Well I have a challenge for you. Take two alts. Have one earn 600k, not a problem for you, I'm sure. I don't even care how you do it, get a bunch of friends to let you kill them, just as long as you hit 600,000 AP in a 30 day campaign. Take a second alt into the same campaign and do one single wall repair. Post a screen shot of the leader board positions for both a day before the end of the campaign. We'll see if you learn anything.

No I didn't assume anything, I simply asked do you play an hr. I don't think you get what I'm saying here either, so I'll say it differently.

After 2-3 hrs of play time with alts or just one character do you accumulate more than 20k ap overall?

After, 2 hours tonight, I got about 20-25k AP

What do you do to get these numbers? I had someone tell me they no life the game & only play pvp but barely make over 300k ap after a 7 day campaign. With that being said they didn't understand how people made millions.

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.

To start tonight, DC had 6 home keeps, one scroll, and Chal. I have the DK bounty quest half filled. Chal and Bleaks UA. I transit to Ales and ride out to Bleaks just as it goes Red. I tried to stealth as an EP rider comes the other way, a bit of lag and I die to like 4 WBs in a row. Return this time crawling along in stealth. There is this nonvet near by who isn't in stealth. I stick by, he gets jumped by a NB. I top charge in, EP NB and a sorc run away. This repeats a couple times, where I keep this nonvet alive, until 2 more DC show up. I get a fraction of the AP credit for the NB kill. We chased a sorc back to the outpost, I think I got 300AP on that kill.

By now more DC have showed up and are sieging the front of Bleaks. I swap into healer mode, with the occasional fireball at defenders on the top floor. EP makes a push on the north side to wipe the siege, I flank, there is one DK among them that I get bounty credit for. We take back Bleaks, A-Tick is 800.

I hang around deciding if I should go to Ash to fight AD, or push Chal. Since I have a DK bounty, I stick to fighting EP. I notice an EP cloak near Chal gate, so I stealth and watch out as allies ride through. I search and find the NB, get feared twice in a row and die. Ally resurrects me, I continue through the gate, get a few kills with other players. I continue to Chal mine and stay there healing and attacking till we are overrun. I guess that was good for a few k AP.

I revive at Ash because they were under attack, arrived in time for a 200 AP d-tick. Continue to Ash gate, AD has already been pushed back to Nik, like 50 AD there, but they aren't really making a strong push on Ash. Spend a while there til I die.

Bleaks is under attack, arrive for a 3-400 AP tick and defend for another 799 AP tick. Continue to Chal gate, complete my bounty, and die to an EP group at the top of the gate. Turn in quest, get sorc quest. I head back to Nik, again the AD at Ash gate have been stopped before I got there. Brindle and Roe are burst, so AD at Nik have bled off. They end up saving Brindle but lose Roe. Fight at Nik til we take the Outpost. A-tick is 1,800 AP. (About15k-20k earned at this point.)

I decide to ride back to Ash, port to Bleaks and return to zerg v zerg fight at Chal and Chal Mine. Obviously I was back and forth all night, I may not have remembered the order of events perfectly. I probably scored 5k off healing alone for the night. After 2 hours, I call it a night. 20-25k AP is my estimate, it takes a while for the leader board to update.

ZunaRoath

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:

• The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.
• Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:

• Rank 2 – 700
• Rank 3 – 8,000
• Rank 4 – 38,000
• Rank 5 – 98,000
• Rank 6 – 188,000
• Rank 7 – 308,000
• Rank 8 – 488,000
• Rank 9 – 758,000
• Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

These are awesome news. Thanks for telling us, Rich! Now I got a question. I hope I can explain it in a way you can understand.

My main hasn't reached Rank 10 yet, but it is almost there. (I spent last year roleplaying, so I left PvP aside..) My secondary character is Rank 4, almost 5. With these changes, and the AP gain they had, my main would be Rank 10 already (I will probably get to it before the patch, making enough AP/H.), and my secondary character would have Vigor already. Will you give the characters, that gained enough AP already and would have reached Rank 10 if these changes were made before, directly Rank 10, or will we have to still reach it? If you don't understand this question, my secondary in Rank 4, no Vigor yet, these changes come, my character has enough AP to have reached Rank 5 or 6 of the new changes, would he get the rank automatically or would I need to get more AP?

I hope you understand what I mean.

Thank you!

Jules

Ghostbane wrote: »

Crown wrote: »

@Ghostbane AP is being doubled for groups up to 6. See my previous post (#3) above.

I know. I just think its silly on where AP value is being increased, they are reducing the milestones to do with AP in the first place.

this.

SirDopey

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

The population of PVP is split between cyrodil and IC, 10K AP a day would be more than what the average person spending 3 or 4 hours in the sewers/IC is likely to be logging off with

Again making significant changes based on people sitting around or playing for an hr is terrible. Why would you make changes based on people that rarely pvp or farm the imp city? I wouldn't be surprised if those numbers included people afking as well

Can we really say someone farming imp city is a pvp player & should be included in these numbers? With that logic you could include me into pve just for stepping into mournhold.

[snip]

Why shouldn't it be included? I tend to spend more time in the sewers now than open world, still finish in the top 10% of azura campaign most months, I know I could get more AP upstairs but it doesn't faze me, so why is my gaming experience less important???

And really, why does anyone even care if it's easier to get the alliance skills??


[Edited for baiting comment]

Darnathian

Not a fan how low this is changing too. This seems like another cater towards PVErs. Pvp will be more of a ghost town. I dont care what your numbers say i can get this is two nights of group play. Your looking at good solo players. Need to make this like 5 million at least.

fastolfv_ESO

I find the numbers posted by zenimax to be shady at best, is it counting all the people who step foot in cyro just for the welcome to cyro skillpoint and leave? how about the pve players who only go to the delves and imperial city? hell they could be averaging ap earned with the total population of the entire game to come up with this 10k a day nonsense. Theyre gonna need to give a little more info how they came up with 10k a day for "pvp players" cause i can pull 10-15k an hour running a pug group of people lvls 20-vr16 so i just dont buy it. I can only assume it took the total people who even zoned into cyro and did absolutely nothing with total ap earned to pull such a low daily average, it really doesnt justify giving away skills people have had to earn the last 2 years

olsborg

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

Undaunted should be reduced. This alliance skill line change is purely because pve players cry.

First time for everything, I agree with exile.

CatchMeTrolling

SirDopey wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

The population of PVP is split between cyrodil and IC, 10K AP a day would be more than what the average person spending 3 or 4 hours in the sewers/IC is likely to be logging off with

Again making significant changes based on people sitting around or playing for an hr is terrible. Why would you make changes based on people that rarely pvp or farm the imp city? I wouldn't be surprised if those numbers included people afking as well

Can we really say someone farming imp city is a pvp player & should be included in these numbers? With that logic you could include me into pve just for stepping into mournhold.

Why shouldn't it be included? I tend to spend more time in the sewers now than open world, still finish in the top 10% of azura campaign most months, I know I could get more AP upstairs but it doesn't faze me, so why is my gaming experience less important???

And really, why does anyone even care if it's easier to get the alliance skills??

For one imp city shouldn't even be included with cyrodiil, that's no more than a farming and dueling area at best.

And what makes you think people care about the skills , it's the fact that the ap to unlock it is easy mode , getting those skills doesn't suddenly make you better or good. Most people don't even care about the skills more so the passives and the fact they had to put in time for those unlocks while zenimax is reducing it by a significant amount.

You know catering to the casuals like usual.

[Snip]

[Edited to remove flamming commentary]

driosketch

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.

Also, and this doesn't raise a flag? To start half way through a campaign and make it into the top 10, this doesn't tell you that you are atypical?

The best thing players like you can do in these discussions is not to make suggestions. I'm serious here, you're more likely to make them nerf AP gains if anything. And just be glad no one is talking about an AP cap.

CatchMeTrolling

Jura23 wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Sanct16 wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

Well an average player without a guildgroup won't make much AP. And thats the majority of players.

I would be completely baffled if someone couldn't make 10k ap in a day is what I'm saying. I know not everyone is good at getting ap, though every emp push I did was solo & I know a few other people that do the same thing.

I don't think it's about the number of people with you, it's still more so learning the best ways to get ap and what campaigns to play in. You can run in a 24 man group everyday but have that one guy owning you in ap gains every campaign.

It's an average. Average player maybe doesn't pvp every day. Average player probably dies alot and needs to waste time traveling. A lot might not join a group but still follow the zerg around and get 9 AP off a kill. Many might not know about d-ticks, have resorces for wall repairs or rezs, or might not even know about the bounty quests. A player like this is lucky to make 5k an hour. And maybe, there are alot of these players out there.

They said average pvp player , that's different than saying average player, that's like adding me to the results of a pve survey which I rarely play. But my point still stands, I refuse to believe anyone is getting 10k in a day. You can't really consider those numbers when making significant changes, that doesn't sound like a PVP player or someone that plays pvp for over an hr.

This change really seems like it was made because of the pve players that rarely play pvp but want pvp skills lol

You're basically into a "no true Scotsman" fallacy here. "No true PvPer would make less than 10k AP a day because true PvPers make more than that." I mayself am barely up to 20k a day on average, it is not out of the relm of possibilities.

You're not going to sit here and convince me you're making 10k or 20k ap a day seriously playing or casually playing. How long do you play an hr?

2-3 hours PvP most days, longer on my days off, but not all days. (Those 0s factor into my average by the way.) As do the final days of the last campaign when the other alliances gave up and I couldn't find any fights. Azura's Star NA PC, I had just shy of 600k AP across 4 characters last cycle. That factors out to 20k a day, does it not?

My main is VR16, been in PvP since lvl 10 on 8 characters, my main's undaunted rank is 4, and his alliance skill rank is 8. I haven't even completed the main quest, and have been playing since launch. My main has over 42 days of play time, combine with my alts, I average about 3 hours of play a day since launch.

I am regularly in the top 10% rewards at the end of a campaign. I made 100k in a week on a level 20 who fights without a weapon using punches. I can do that because I am better than most pvpers, and I have a better idea of the average PvP player than you do.

/dropsmic

I'll just say that's terrible, I've played with multiple characters during a campaign and got more than that casually. Though you're just deflecting & bringing extra stuff into play, pretty sure I was talking about one character not 7 alts but okay.

And you don't have a better idea, you have a better idea of how it is on PC na, which is a lower population than the platform I play on. If you were to join the one I play on you definitely wouldn't be in the top 10 percent with just 600k ap, I'm sure that's a 30 day as well on na PC? Yeah I would love to see you finish in the top percent with that.

Even if what you say is true between those characters you still should have more than 10k-20k ap in 3hrs, if you want to switch between alts that's on you but only making 20k ap overall is terrible.

And since ZOS didn't bring up alts I wouldn't even bring that up but even if they did through 3hrs you should have more than 20k ap. You're really going to defend this huh?

Not deflecting, you were assuming I don't PvP much, admit it. But you seem intent on ignoring facts that don't support your narrative.

AS is the pop-locked campaign on NA PC, you can't fit more players on a campaign no matter what platform you play. Second, it's 10%. AS NA PC leader boards have about 10,000+ characters homed there. That means the top 10% is roughly the top 1000 characters. Do you know what a larger player base translates into, more than 1000 players in the top 10%. That means you probably need less to cross that threshold because there are more spots.

Do you even know where the 10% boarder is on your campaign? Well I have a challenge for you. Take two alts. Have one earn 600k, not a problem for you, I'm sure. I don't even care how you do it, get a bunch of friends to let you kill them, just as long as you hit 600,000 AP in a 30 day campaign. Take a second alt into the same campaign and do one single wall repair. Post a screen shot of the leader board positions for both a day before the end of the campaign. We'll see if you learn anything.

No I didn't assume anything, I simply asked do you play an hr. I don't think you get what I'm saying here either, so I'll say it differently.

After 2-3 hrs of play time with alts or just one character do you accumulate more than 20k ap overall?

After, 2 hours tonight, I got about 20-25k AP

What do you do to get these numbers? I had someone tell me they no life the game & only play pvp but barely make over 300k ap after a 7 day campaign. With that being said they didn't understand how people made millions.

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.

Well I suspect the purpose of average players in Cyrodiil is not making AP or learning how to make more of it.

But that doesn't make them less PvP players.

Yeah but did you read what I said one is a farmer that's bad at it and the other one is trying to learn how to get more ap?

And not even sure why you added that last part either because I didn't even mention that in the statement you replied to

Docmandu

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

jcasini222ub17_ESO wrote: »

Maybe in vet but its much more difficult to pull a 10k tick in nonvet. The largest tick i received nonvet was 6k, and if your thinking 'hey did everyone run off' yes, yes they did. Also lower ranks award less ap I believe. So there will be a difference in accumlation between vet and nonvet.

I had Krog in nonvet from 10 to level 43, played most nights, then had to stop to accumlate skillpoints. Literally wasnt out of Daggerfall at 43. He's now vr9 finishing silver/gold (maybe) before he healbots/meatshields again.

Yeah the gains are lower but in a day you're only getting 10k ap? I highly doubt that , that sounds like someone jumping on for 30mins and getting off

Your "average" player most likely doesn't spend 5 hours a day playing either... just sayin'

CatchMeTrolling

Docmandu wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

jcasini222ub17_ESO wrote: »

Maybe in vet but its much more difficult to pull a 10k tick in nonvet. The largest tick i received nonvet was 6k, and if your thinking 'hey did everyone run off' yes, yes they did. Also lower ranks award less ap I believe. So there will be a difference in accumlation between vet and nonvet.

I had Krog in nonvet from 10 to level 43, played most nights, then had to stop to accumlate skillpoints. Literally wasnt out of Daggerfall at 43. He's now vr9 finishing silver/gold (maybe) before he healbots/meatshields again.

Yeah the gains are lower but in a day you're only getting 10k ap? I highly doubt that , that sounds like someone jumping on for 30mins and getting off

Your "average" player most likely doesn't spend 5 hours a day playing either... just sayin'

You don't even have to play an hour to get 10kap, that's nothing lol the fact you guys are trying to make it seem like a lot is hilarious

CatchMeTrolling

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.

Also, and this doesn't raise a flag? To start half way through a campaign and make it into the top 10, this doesn't tell you that you are atypical?

The best thing players like you can do in these discussions is not to make suggestions. I'm serious here, you're more likely to make them nerf AP gains if anything. And just be glad no one is talking about an AP cap.

No it indicates I know what I'm doing more than most and I'm not the only one to do this. My gains shows how much you can actually get & play time means little when you don't know how to get ap.

It's other long time players on PC I seen get almost 700k during a bet so yeah lol and guess what they're doubling ap now so I'm sure it's possible to get a million in one day but that's another story. Does that mean ap should be nerfed? No because according to ZOS the average player is getting 10kap lol and the top are only getting 32k ap an hr, which I really doubt. If the top ap farmers got together for just one week & worked with ZOS those numbers would be very different.

driosketch

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.

Also, and this doesn't raise a flag? To start half way through a campaign and make it into the top 10, this doesn't tell you that you are atypical?

The best thing players like you can do in these discussions is not to make suggestions. I'm serious here, you're more likely to make them nerf AP gains if anything. And just be glad no one is talking about an AP cap.

No it indicates I know what I'm doing more than most and I'm not the only one to do this.

And "more than most" is different than what is average. [snip]

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

If the top ap farmers got together for just one week & worked with ZOS those numbers would be very different.

OK. To what purpose I'm wondering? So they could halve AP gains instead?

Got any killer grind spots you what call to their attention while you're at it?


[Edited for baiting comment]

CatchMeTrolling

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.

Also, and this doesn't raise a flag? To start half way through a campaign and make it into the top 10, this doesn't tell you that you are atypical?

The best thing players like you can do in these discussions is not to make suggestions. I'm serious here, you're more likely to make them nerf AP gains if anything. And just be glad no one is talking about an AP cap.

No it indicates I know what I'm doing more than most and I'm not the only one to do this.

And "more than most" is different than what is average.

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

If the top ap farmers got together for just one week & worked with ZOS those numbers would be very different.

OK. To what purpose I'm wondering? So they could halve AP gains instead?

Got any killer grind spots you what call to their attention while you're at it?

You said should it raise a red flag , I gave you a reason why it doesn't. I'm not the average PVP player, nor did I say I was. I'm still not going to act like getting 10k ap is the norm, you can.

And the purpose would be to show more accurate numbers. For all we know the top ap farmers aren't even the top based on those numbers and it's very hard to believe someone struggles to get 10k ap, very hard. 10kap just let that sink in, I honestly don't see how you guys are trying to defend those numbers.

[Edited to remove quote]

driosketch

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.

Also, and this doesn't raise a flag? To start half way through a campaign and make it into the top 10, this doesn't tell you that you are atypical?

The best thing players like you can do in these discussions is not to make suggestions. I'm serious here, you're more likely to make them nerf AP gains if anything. And just be glad no one is talking about an AP cap.

No it indicates I know what I'm doing more than most and I'm not the only one to do this.

And "more than most" is different than what is average. How have we gotten this far into it without grasping this?

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

If the top ap farmers got together for just one week & worked with ZOS those numbers would be very different.

OK. To what purpose I'm wondering? So they could halve AP gains instead?

Got any killer grind spots you what call to their attention while you're at it?

You said should it raise a red flag , I gave you a reason why it doesn't. I'm not the average PVP player, nor did I say I was. I'm still not going to act like getting 10k ap is the norm, you can.

And the purpose would be to show more accurate numbers. For all we know the top ap farmers aren't even the top based on those numbers and it's very hard to believe someone struggles to get 10k ap, very hard. 10kap just let that sink in, I honestly don't see how you guys are trying to defend those numbers.

I didn't say red flag, as in something wrong. I said flag, as in a notice. In this case that your play style is out of touch with most/average players.

It's actually very believable if they took the total of players' AP gain over the 8 week period and divided that by 56 days. I'm actually at 8,800 per day average so far for the campaign. I didn't pvp at all Monday or Sunday, Superbowl, and ran dungeons with my guild Saturday. And yet I'm probably still in the top 15% on the leader board. The average player is making less AP than I am, as hard as that is for you to believe.

And don't tell me they shouldn't factor in days off from PvP. Time and real life does not stop for the game, and they obviously thought 2 years for Alliance Skill Rank 10 was too long for the average player. I don't see how reducing that grind harms you at all.

Finally, looking at just the top AP earners does not give you accurate numbers, it skews the results the other way.

Manoekin

Let me stop the arguing.

In order to get to an "average" of 10k a DAY you have to have people who make less than that and presumably some or many who make zero. That is what your average is. Your average are the people who don't participate in almost any way in PvP.

driosketch

Manoekin wrote: »

Let me stop the arguing.

In order to get to an "average" of 10k a DAY you have to have people who make less than that and presumably some or many who make zero. That is what your average is. Your average are the people who don't participate in almost any way in PvP.

10k per day is high, if they were counting 0s. In fact 10k still looks high considering where I'm ranked right now. They probably factored out the bare minimums, but there are likely a lot of weekend only players.

Skinzz

Pvpers can easily earn 35k+ an hour. I think zos is gettng their info from casual/pvers that attempt to play pvp. How the eff does someone earn 10k ap a day? Thats ridiculous and scrubbish.

SirDopey

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

The population of PVP is split between cyrodil and IC, 10K AP a day would be more than what the average person spending 3 or 4 hours in the sewers/IC is likely to be logging off with

Again making significant changes based on people sitting around or playing for an hr is terrible. Why would you make changes based on people that rarely pvp or farm the imp city? I wouldn't be surprised if those numbers included people afking as well

Can we really say someone farming imp city is a pvp player & should be included in these numbers? With that logic you could include me into pve just for stepping into mournhold.

[snip]

Why shouldn't it be included? I tend to spend more time in the sewers now than open world, still finish in the top 10% of azura campaign most months, I know I could get more AP upstairs but it doesn't faze me, so why is my gaming experience less important??

And really, why does anyone even care if it's easier to get the alliance skills??

For one imp city shouldn't even be included with cyrodiil, that's no more than a farming and dueling area at best.

And what makes you think people care about the skills , it's the fact that the ap to unlock it is easy mode , getting those skills doesn't suddenly make you better or good. Most people don't even care about the skills more so the passives and the fact they had to put in time for those unlocks while zenimax is reducing it by a significant amount.

You know catering to the casuals like usual.

[snip]

[snip]. Like I said, I tend to spend more time in IC than I do in cyrodil and I'm not farming, I just like the close quarter fights more so than the open world keep bashing. Sure I get a hell of a lot less AP/hour but I enjoy it more. But according to you, I'm not a PVPer because I'm not farming AP?

[snip]

[edited to remove quote and baiting comment]

Cody

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

RIP servers when literally everyone is using caltrops and proxy det.

Yeah using these skills is only ok when the elite do it /s

I will laugh my face off when the hardcore guilds and players start calling for nerfs or removal of caltrops and prox det.


"It was OK when only a select few of my high rank AP-rich farming buddies use it but now that every pug can use it, its terrible for the game and the servers. Remove it nowwwwww!"

this is the truth of the matter. Vigor is a VITAL ability for ANY stam build, whether they be PvPer or PvEr, vigor alone has allowed my VR16 stam build to finally be able to run vet dungeons without having to rely on the healer for all of my heals. there is nothing wrong with making it available for everyone, it will actually be beneficial.

and vigor is by NO means OP. it is powerful, but still an HoT, consistent damage being dealt negates most of the healing done, and will not save someone from an execute.

Manoekin

driosketch wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

Let me stop the arguing.

In order to get to an "average" of 10k a DAY you have to have people who make less than that and presumably some or many who make zero. That is what your average is. Your average are the people who don't participate in almost any way in PvP.

10k per day is high, if they were counting 0s. In fact 10k still looks high considering where I'm ranked right now. They probably factored out the bare minimums, but there are likely a lot of weekend only players.

With those people I have no problem. To simply say that they deserve the same rewards as others who play more often and put in much more effort is what I have a problem with.

CatchMeTrolling

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Could the problem with most people be a learn to get ap issue? For an example I joined azuras star with 16 days left managed to get to number 5 or 6 after 10 days by putting up 3.3mill the player that no life's the campaign only had close to 5 mill the last time I played which was Sunday & has been playing since the start.

Also, and this doesn't raise a flag? To start half way through a campaign and make it into the top 10, this doesn't tell you that you are atypical?

The best thing players like you can do in these discussions is not to make suggestions. I'm serious here, you're more likely to make them nerf AP gains if anything. And just be glad no one is talking about an AP cap.

No it indicates I know what I'm doing more than most and I'm not the only one to do this.

And "more than most" is different than what is average. How have we gotten this far into it without grasping this?

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

If the top ap farmers got together for just one week & worked with ZOS those numbers would be very different.

OK. To what purpose I'm wondering? So they could halve AP gains instead?

Got any killer grind spots you what call to their attention while you're at it?

You said should it raise a red flag , I gave you a reason why it doesn't. I'm not the average PVP player, nor did I say I was. I'm still not going to act like getting 10k ap is the norm, you can.

And the purpose would be to show more accurate numbers. For all we know the top ap farmers aren't even the top based on those numbers and it's very hard to believe someone struggles to get 10k ap, very hard. 10kap just let that sink in, I honestly don't see how you guys are trying to defend those numbers.

I didn't say red flag, as in something wrong. I said flag, as in a notice. In this case that your play style is out of touch with most/average players.

It's actually very believable if they took the total of players' AP gain over the 8 week period and divided that by 56 days. I'm actually at 8,800 per day average so far for the campaign. I didn't pvp at all Monday or Sunday, Superbowl, and ran dungeons with my guild Saturday. And yet I'm probably still in the top 15% on the leader board. The average player is making less AP than I am, as hard as that is for you to believe.

And don't tell me they shouldn't factor in days off from PvP. Time and real life does not stop for the game, and they obviously thought 2 years for Alliance Skill Rank 10 was too long for the average player. I don't see how reducing that grind harms you at all.

Finally, looking at just the top AP earners does not give you accurate numbers, it skews the results the other way.

Okay good luck with your 8.8 gains .

Tankqull

Jaronking wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

Totally called this is what the average is two months ago.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2525433#Comment_2525433

I wouldn't call anyone getting 10k ap a day a pvp player lol you can get that from one keep battle, come on now

Man I have to agree with you on this if you only making 10k ap in a day your doing something completely wrong.If your only making 10K AP a hour your doing something completely wrong.I have to say their data has to be completely tainted with PVErs and consoles players who didn't know what they were doing.This just doesn't seem even close to right.

well i´m netting 10k a day quite often...

after enduring the lag for 15mins i start playing tetris on my game boy thats more entertaining and thrilling...