Gap closer root is increasingly becoming the last straw for me. Can't see a reason to continue.

timidobserver

P

Joy_Division wrote: »

I used gap closers on every class I played since I first entered cyrodiil. I never thought to myself: "Wow, these are crappy skills that never hit people." I never thought they needed to stun-snare-silence a target to function.

no idea why this was considered a problem or who even asked for it to be "fixed".

Really? All the time I used to be like "I wish I could just indefinitely hold this guy in place while people kill him."

willymchilybily

6 pages wow.

retreating maneuvers and other snare and soft CC immunity mechanics like shuffle should also prevent the gap closer snare/root effect. And gap closers other than ambush that states it has this effect shouldn't be doing it at all.

and even i would think ambush/lotus fan needs some review it would be better if it did 1 second of hard CC stun. This coming from a stam NB says something of how powerfuil it is.

On a side note....who's bright idea was it to make all snare/immobilize immunity stam based skills, the players that have stam enough to dodge roll out of it get the immunity too.

Molag_Crow

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

@CrowsDescend just referencing your video again.

https://youtu.be/EY-exbyjme0

This is a classic example of the situation I am talking about. The guy is using CC immunity. That guy has no other option but to escape in that situation. What is he going to do, stand and fight 10 AD? and not just fight, LITERALLY STAND because you can't do anything else!

It is STUPID. If that's honestly how people and @Wrobel think fighting in Cyrodiil should be, I'm done with the game, and I will definitely recommend others not invest time in this game.

I'm not sure I see the problem here. It's a 1v10. Did you expect to escape?

No, you expect to maintain control of your character when you have cc immunity.

Did you know that snare and immobilize don't have anything to do with CC break immunity?

Except that Rapid Maneuver specfically grants immunity to snares and immobilizations and gap closers still mini-stun through this ability. Mist Form is less clear as control effects are purpoosely vague. In the end the entire system needs to be clarified and adjusted.

Exactly...

Joy_Division

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

I used gap closers on every class I played since I first entered cyrodiil. I never thought to myself: "Wow, these are crappy skills that never hit people." I never thought they needed to stun-snare-silence a target to function.

no idea why this was considered a problem or who even asked for it to be "fixed".

Let's be honest, it was probably the same person at ZOS who pushed AoE caps through despite having the poll be overwhelmingly against having them added.

True dat.

@dlepi24 - good times!

timidobserver wrote: »

P

Joy_Division wrote: »

I used gap closers on every class I played since I first entered cyrodiil. I never thought to myself: "Wow, these are crappy skills that never hit people." I never thought they needed to stun-snare-silence a target to function.

no idea why this was considered a problem or who even asked for it to be "fixed".

Really? All the time I used to be like "I wish I could just indefinitely hold this guy in place while people kill him."

Haha

Lore_lai

Yeah this is getting ridiculous now and it seems more and more people are adopting this type of "playstyle"...
The fact that you lose control of your character completely, because of the mini-stun spam, without any way of combating this, is not fun and does not promote skilled gameplay.

How can you improve and get better when you are completely locked out of using anything and magicka classes only have that much stam to roll - please anyone at ZoS, try to play a magicka DK or Templar and have your friends spambush you and see how fun it is. Heck, you don't even need to be severely outnumbered.

Being able to evade and reposition is a chance everyone should have. I'm not saying you should be guaranteed an escape, but at least have a chance. And currently is feels like there is no chance for either skilled players to evade or, for people who are still learning, to improve.

Reverb

I agree with everything OP says. Nothing is more frustrating than having your toon locked down with no ability to counter or break. It's become common to see a death recap of nothing but gap closers.

Also, I'm seeing more and more desyncing of gap closer events. First I'm rooted, then the damage hits my combat log, then the enemy finally enters my hit box. This isnt limited to high latency situations or to pvp, I see it in dungeons with otherwise normal performance.

Cathexis

I've noticed that now I am forced to use a precision strike burst build vs the zerg which surprise surprise plays exactly like a nightblade without cloak.

It's like that's the only play style I'm allowed to use.

NobleNerd

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

This has been around for 2 years...why is this all of a sudden an urgent issue?

Autolycus wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

In ESO, snare and immobilization are considered soft CC. Immobilization is broken by dodge rolling. Stuns are hard CC and are broken by LMB+RMB which grants CC immunity. It's been this way since day one of the game.

I am aware of how it's been since day one, because I've played every day since. But I still believe that being rooted/immobilized/snared after a break-free is flawed. I don't mind having them differentiate between a soft- and hard-CC. I mind being ambush or crit rush spammed to death. There are a variety of things one can do that should enable a skilled person to escape a decisive defeat, but they don't work due to gap close roots.

Edit: I also don't expect to get away every time. I expect that sometimes, when I play well and react quickly, make the right calls, etc. to come out on top, or at the very least get away. It's more of a problem nowadays because so much attention has been brought to this mechanic.

I agree.....

So many mechanics (when it comes to pvp) are not enjoyable and broken. It is very frustrating to break free only to be rooted and stunned consecutively while having the immune buff up. What is worse is when (because of all the ability spam) you can't even react to an opportunity to break free.

I know many do not like the idea of a cool down on these type of abilities (i.e. Ambush, Crit Rush, Toppling Charge, Biting Jabs, etc), but having a short cool down on these type of abilities would help solve the spamming and make it so players would actually have to plan attacks and abilities!

I'd rather see PvP players quit than add cooldowns that affect PvE. There are a lot of mobs to kill and there is no problem with letting people spam their way through trash mobs.

This has to be about the only MMO I have seen that doesn't have cool downs on key abilities to prevent the very issue this thread is addressing. A small cool down would not be an issue when grinding thru mobs. Let's not be "doomsday crying" here.

Cathexis

NobleNerd wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

This has been around for 2 years...why is this all of a sudden an urgent issue?

Autolycus wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

In ESO, snare and immobilization are considered soft CC. Immobilization is broken by dodge rolling. Stuns are hard CC and are broken by LMB+RMB which grants CC immunity. It's been this way since day one of the game.

I am aware of how it's been since day one, because I've played every day since. But I still believe that being rooted/immobilized/snared after a break-free is flawed. I don't mind having them differentiate between a soft- and hard-CC. I mind being ambush or crit rush spammed to death. There are a variety of things one can do that should enable a skilled person to escape a decisive defeat, but they don't work due to gap close roots.

Edit: I also don't expect to get away every time. I expect that sometimes, when I play well and react quickly, make the right calls, etc. to come out on top, or at the very least get away. It's more of a problem nowadays because so much attention has been brought to this mechanic.

I agree.....

So many mechanics (when it comes to pvp) are not enjoyable and broken. It is very frustrating to break free only to be rooted and stunned consecutively while having the immune buff up. What is worse is when (because of all the ability spam) you can't even react to an opportunity to break free.

I know many do not like the idea of a cool down on these type of abilities (i.e. Ambush, Crit Rush, Toppling Charge, Biting Jabs, etc), but having a short cool down on these type of abilities would help solve the spamming and make it so players would actually have to plan attacks and abilities!

I'd rather see PvP players quit than add cooldowns that affect PvE. There are a lot of mobs to kill and there is no problem with letting people spam their way through trash mobs.

This has to be about the only MMO I have seen that doesn't have cool downs on key abilities to prevent the very issue this thread is addressing. A small cool down would not be an issue when grinding thru mobs. Let's not be "doomsday crying" here.

A cooldown doesn't address the issue since getting bombed by 5 people at once would still lock your character down.

I'd like to take a moment here and remind people to read more carefully and understand the specific issue being addressed here. I have edited the first post to put a clear description in the first line to make it easy to understand.

NobleNerd

Cathexis wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

This has been around for 2 years...why is this all of a sudden an urgent issue?

Autolycus wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

In ESO, snare and immobilization are considered soft CC. Immobilization is broken by dodge rolling. Stuns are hard CC and are broken by LMB+RMB which grants CC immunity. It's been this way since day one of the game.

I am aware of how it's been since day one, because I've played every day since. But I still believe that being rooted/immobilized/snared after a break-free is flawed. I don't mind having them differentiate between a soft- and hard-CC. I mind being ambush or crit rush spammed to death. There are a variety of things one can do that should enable a skilled person to escape a decisive defeat, but they don't work due to gap close roots.

Edit: I also don't expect to get away every time. I expect that sometimes, when I play well and react quickly, make the right calls, etc. to come out on top, or at the very least get away. It's more of a problem nowadays because so much attention has been brought to this mechanic.

I agree.....

So many mechanics (when it comes to pvp) are not enjoyable and broken. It is very frustrating to break free only to be rooted and stunned consecutively while having the immune buff up. What is worse is when (because of all the ability spam) you can't even react to an opportunity to break free.

I know many do not like the idea of a cool down on these type of abilities (i.e. Ambush, Crit Rush, Toppling Charge, Biting Jabs, etc), but having a short cool down on these type of abilities would help solve the spamming and make it so players would actually have to plan attacks and abilities!

I'd rather see PvP players quit than add cooldowns that affect PvE. There are a lot of mobs to kill and there is no problem with letting people spam their way through trash mobs.

This has to be about the only MMO I have seen that doesn't have cool downs on key abilities to prevent the very issue this thread is addressing. A small cool down would not be an issue when grinding thru mobs. Let's not be "doomsday crying" here.

A cooldown doesn't address the issue since getting bombed by 5 people at once would still lock your character down.

I'd like to take a moment here and remind people to read more carefully and understand the specific issue being addressed here. I have edited the first post to put a clear description in the first line to make it easy to understand.

I am not saying a cool down is going to completely fix the issue. I am saying it is a step in the right direction to help resolve it.

Hiero_Glyph

NobleNerd wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

This has been around for 2 years...why is this all of a sudden an urgent issue?

Autolycus wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

In ESO, snare and immobilization are considered soft CC. Immobilization is broken by dodge rolling. Stuns are hard CC and are broken by LMB+RMB which grants CC immunity. It's been this way since day one of the game.

I am aware of how it's been since day one, because I've played every day since. But I still believe that being rooted/immobilized/snared after a break-free is flawed. I don't mind having them differentiate between a soft- and hard-CC. I mind being ambush or crit rush spammed to death. There are a variety of things one can do that should enable a skilled person to escape a decisive defeat, but they don't work due to gap close roots.

Edit: I also don't expect to get away every time. I expect that sometimes, when I play well and react quickly, make the right calls, etc. to come out on top, or at the very least get away. It's more of a problem nowadays because so much attention has been brought to this mechanic.

I agree.....

So many mechanics (when it comes to pvp) are not enjoyable and broken. It is very frustrating to break free only to be rooted and stunned consecutively while having the immune buff up. What is worse is when (because of all the ability spam) you can't even react to an opportunity to break free.

I know many do not like the idea of a cool down on these type of abilities (i.e. Ambush, Crit Rush, Toppling Charge, Biting Jabs, etc), but having a short cool down on these type of abilities would help solve the spamming and make it so players would actually have to plan attacks and abilities!

I'd rather see PvP players quit than add cooldowns that affect PvE. There are a lot of mobs to kill and there is no problem with letting people spam their way through trash mobs.

This has to be about the only MMO I have seen that doesn't have cool downs on key abilities to prevent the very issue this thread is addressing. A small cool down would not be an issue when grinding thru mobs. Let's not be "doomsday crying" here.

A cooldown doesn't address the issue since getting bombed by 5 people at once would still lock your character down.

I'd like to take a moment here and remind people to read more carefully and understand the specific issue being addressed here. I have edited the first post to put a clear description in the first line to make it easy to understand.

I am not saying a cool down is going to completely fix the issue. I am saying it is a step in the right direction to help resolve it.

No, a cooldown is a typical ZOS bandaid fix, just as the snare fix will be. Gap closers need a new mechanic to make them always move to the target location but never affect the defending player unless they hit. Let's fix the issue once and for all, not incrementally try and solve it.

bardx86

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Again, the fix is to have all gap closers target an area where the player is when the ability is cast. The area's radius can be adjusted depending on the gap closer's animation. If the target is still in that area then they take damage. If not, then the gap closer misses but the animation still moves the attacking player. This makes mobility counter gap closers, and CC effects counter mobility. Note that WW's Pounce already works in a similar manner.

Agreed, good idea.

Cathexis

NobleNerd wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

This has been around for 2 years...why is this all of a sudden an urgent issue?

Autolycus wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

In ESO, snare and immobilization are considered soft CC. Immobilization is broken by dodge rolling. Stuns are hard CC and are broken by LMB+RMB which grants CC immunity. It's been this way since day one of the game.

I am aware of how it's been since day one, because I've played every day since. But I still believe that being rooted/immobilized/snared after a break-free is flawed. I don't mind having them differentiate between a soft- and hard-CC. I mind being ambush or crit rush spammed to death. There are a variety of things one can do that should enable a skilled person to escape a decisive defeat, but they don't work due to gap close roots.

Edit: I also don't expect to get away every time. I expect that sometimes, when I play well and react quickly, make the right calls, etc. to come out on top, or at the very least get away. It's more of a problem nowadays because so much attention has been brought to this mechanic.

I agree.....

So many mechanics (when it comes to pvp) are not enjoyable and broken. It is very frustrating to break free only to be rooted and stunned consecutively while having the immune buff up. What is worse is when (because of all the ability spam) you can't even react to an opportunity to break free.

I know many do not like the idea of a cool down on these type of abilities (i.e. Ambush, Crit Rush, Toppling Charge, Biting Jabs, etc), but having a short cool down on these type of abilities would help solve the spamming and make it so players would actually have to plan attacks and abilities!

I'd rather see PvP players quit than add cooldowns that affect PvE. There are a lot of mobs to kill and there is no problem with letting people spam their way through trash mobs.

This has to be about the only MMO I have seen that doesn't have cool downs on key abilities to prevent the very issue this thread is addressing. A small cool down would not be an issue when grinding thru mobs. Let's not be "doomsday crying" here.

A cooldown doesn't address the issue since getting bombed by 5 people at once would still lock your character down.

I'd like to take a moment here and remind people to read more carefully and understand the specific issue being addressed here. I have edited the first post to put a clear description in the first line to make it easy to understand.

I am not saying a cool down is going to completely fix the issue. I am saying it is a step in the right direction to help resolve it.

Im afraid @NobleNerd I have to agree with @Hiero_Glyph we need well though out resolutions that achieve meaningful improvement, half baked has been the patch motto of the game and its what has been really holding it down.

I feel like there are two critical things that the developers aren't taking into consideration with skill development:

(A) What is the end result in different group and fight dynamics (1vX, XvX, Small v Large Group, Large v Large group, Keep defense, sewers PvP, open field combat)?

(B) Does this mechanic provide an absolute or excessive advantage?

Every time they make a change these two basic questions seem to be completely overlooked.

NobleNerd

Cathexis wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

This has been around for 2 years...why is this all of a sudden an urgent issue?

Autolycus wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

In ESO, snare and immobilization are considered soft CC. Immobilization is broken by dodge rolling. Stuns are hard CC and are broken by LMB+RMB which grants CC immunity. It's been this way since day one of the game.

I am aware of how it's been since day one, because I've played every day since. But I still believe that being rooted/immobilized/snared after a break-free is flawed. I don't mind having them differentiate between a soft- and hard-CC. I mind being ambush or crit rush spammed to death. There are a variety of things one can do that should enable a skilled person to escape a decisive defeat, but they don't work due to gap close roots.

Edit: I also don't expect to get away every time. I expect that sometimes, when I play well and react quickly, make the right calls, etc. to come out on top, or at the very least get away. It's more of a problem nowadays because so much attention has been brought to this mechanic.

I agree.....

So many mechanics (when it comes to pvp) are not enjoyable and broken. It is very frustrating to break free only to be rooted and stunned consecutively while having the immune buff up. What is worse is when (because of all the ability spam) you can't even react to an opportunity to break free.

I know many do not like the idea of a cool down on these type of abilities (i.e. Ambush, Crit Rush, Toppling Charge, Biting Jabs, etc), but having a short cool down on these type of abilities would help solve the spamming and make it so players would actually have to plan attacks and abilities!

I'd rather see PvP players quit than add cooldowns that affect PvE. There are a lot of mobs to kill and there is no problem with letting people spam their way through trash mobs.

This has to be about the only MMO I have seen that doesn't have cool downs on key abilities to prevent the very issue this thread is addressing. A small cool down would not be an issue when grinding thru mobs. Let's not be "doomsday crying" here.

A cooldown doesn't address the issue since getting bombed by 5 people at once would still lock your character down.

I'd like to take a moment here and remind people to read more carefully and understand the specific issue being addressed here. I have edited the first post to put a clear description in the first line to make it easy to understand.

I am not saying a cool down is going to completely fix the issue. I am saying it is a step in the right direction to help resolve it.

Im afraid @NobleNerd I have to agree with @Hiero_Glyph we need well though out resolutions that achieve meaningful improvement, half baked has been the patch motto of the game and its what has been really holding it down.

I feel like there are two critical things that the developers aren't taking into consideration with skill development:

(A) What is the end result in different group and fight dynamics (1vX, XvX, Small v Large Group, Large v Large group, Keep defense, sewers PvP, open field combat)?

(B) Does this mechanic provide an absolute or excessive advantage?

Every time they make a change these two basic questions seem to be completely overlooked.

These kinds of issues have plagued every MMO, especially with pvp. WoW still suffers from these kinds of issues and people posting the exact same things as in this post. With ESO much of their issue with lock outs and ability freeze ups and lag are due to animations. If you want well thought out fixes... well that is what ZOS has done and why it takes them a long time to implement many of their fixes. What I am saying is the game needs cool downs on abilities. The resource burn to prevent spamming isn't working in this game. To create a deeper and rich combat feel cool downs would be a step in the right direction. I am not saying it is the end all fix to the over all issue.

Cathexis

@NobleNerd I understand what you are trying to suggest with the implementation of cooldowns but one of the critical elements of the game I think is the intuitive response of skills (when combat is responsive). With wow, that was what I found held the game back - cast times and cooldowns reduced the intuitive element.

Hiero_Glyph

NobleNerd wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

This has been around for 2 years...why is this all of a sudden an urgent issue?

Autolycus wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

In ESO, snare and immobilization are considered soft CC. Immobilization is broken by dodge rolling. Stuns are hard CC and are broken by LMB+RMB which grants CC immunity. It's been this way since day one of the game.

I am aware of how it's been since day one, because I've played every day since. But I still believe that being rooted/immobilized/snared after a break-free is flawed. I don't mind having them differentiate between a soft- and hard-CC. I mind being ambush or crit rush spammed to death. There are a variety of things one can do that should enable a skilled person to escape a decisive defeat, but they don't work due to gap close roots.

Edit: I also don't expect to get away every time. I expect that sometimes, when I play well and react quickly, make the right calls, etc. to come out on top, or at the very least get away. It's more of a problem nowadays because so much attention has been brought to this mechanic.

I agree.....

So many mechanics (when it comes to pvp) are not enjoyable and broken. It is very frustrating to break free only to be rooted and stunned consecutively while having the immune buff up. What is worse is when (because of all the ability spam) you can't even react to an opportunity to break free.

I know many do not like the idea of a cool down on these type of abilities (i.e. Ambush, Crit Rush, Toppling Charge, Biting Jabs, etc), but having a short cool down on these type of abilities would help solve the spamming and make it so players would actually have to plan attacks and abilities!

I'd rather see PvP players quit than add cooldowns that affect PvE. There are a lot of mobs to kill and there is no problem with letting people spam their way through trash mobs.

This has to be about the only MMO I have seen that doesn't have cool downs on key abilities to prevent the very issue this thread is addressing. A small cool down would not be an issue when grinding thru mobs. Let's not be "doomsday crying" here.

A cooldown doesn't address the issue since getting bombed by 5 people at once would still lock your character down.

I'd like to take a moment here and remind people to read more carefully and understand the specific issue being addressed here. I have edited the first post to put a clear description in the first line to make it easy to understand.

I am not saying a cool down is going to completely fix the issue. I am saying it is a step in the right direction to help resolve it.

Im afraid @NobleNerd I have to agree with @Hiero_Glyph we need well though out resolutions that achieve meaningful improvement, half baked has been the patch motto of the game and its what has been really holding it down.

I feel like there are two critical things that the developers aren't taking into consideration with skill development:

(A) What is the end result in different group and fight dynamics (1vX, XvX, Small v Large Group, Large v Large group, Keep defense, sewers PvP, open field combat)?

(B) Does this mechanic provide an absolute or excessive advantage?

Every time they make a change these two basic questions seem to be completely overlooked.

These kinds of issues have plagued every MMO, especially with pvp. WoW still suffers from these kinds of issues and people posting the exact same things as in this post. With ESO much of their issue with lock outs and ability freeze ups and lag are due to animations. If you want well thought out fixes... well that is what ZOS has done and why it takes them a long time to implement many of their fixes. What I am saying is the game needs cool downs on abilities. The resource burn to prevent spamming isn't working in this game. To create a deeper and rich combat feel cool downs would be a step in the right direction. I am not saying it is the end all fix to the over all issue.

What's funny is that you know what the problem is but continue to diminish its importance. The problem is excessive resource regeneration as players can spam abilities without needing to use heavy attacks. If you went back before CP were added, resource management was the most important aspect of PvP. Now players are pushing 3k+ weapon/spell damage and 2k+ regen. CC isn't about draining stamina, but about hoping break-free glitches so they can't break it and give you free hits. Also, ESO doesn't use a methodical combat system like WOW or FF so cooldowns would just make combat feel sluggish for no reason. Resource management is how to fix ability spam in ESO and I have no idea why ZOS tried to fix what wasn't broken. Sadly, ESO PvP seems to be getting worse over time and this is a sign of a developer that is out of touch with how their own game plays.

Molag_Crow

Cathexis wrote: »

@NobleNerd I understand what you are trying to suggest with the implementation of cooldowns but one of the critical elements of the game I think is the intuitive response of skills (when combat is responsive). With wow, that was what I found held the game back - cast times and cooldowns reduced the intuitive element.

I hated CDs in WoW, and I mainly played an Unholy DK & Arms warr in arena, relying on burst CDs to try and get a kill... it gets really boring after a while so I'm glad ESO doesn't go down the cooldown path.

NobleNerd

Cathexis wrote: »

@NobleNerd I understand what you are trying to suggest with the implementation of cooldowns but one of the critical elements of the game I think is the intuitive response of skills (when combat is responsive). With wow, that was what I found held the game back - cast times and cooldowns reduced the intuitive element.

Cool downs created an element of planning your attack and timing your abilities. It was strategic and for those who could master it and also keep track of their foes did quite well in pvp and pve. I never felt like the combat was sluggish in any game that had them.

JaJaLuka

JaJaLuka wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

The strangest thing about this change is that NO ONE ASKED FOR IT.

• Where were all the threads complaining about missing gap closers?
• Where were the patch notes that documented this change.

This was an unwanted, uncalled for, and totally unreported ninja change.

Ninja nerfs really hurt the morale of the community. They make it seem like ZOS doesn't care enough about what we think to even notify us when a huge game changing mechanic is added.

This is an example of fixing things that aren't broken. There is plenty that actually is broken that should have been addressed instead.

I got so [snip] fed up with it I now log onto my NB to give them a taste of their own medicine when they do it to me, but I still stand by my thought that first ambush needs to have a min distance and that they should just remove the damn root entirely. I've known about it since it first came in, as a player with [snip] ping rate, it was very noticeable when it was introduced. I mentioned it on the forums and reported/gave feedback on it in game, but of course nothing happened.

As a side note: if I catch anyone spamming ambush in game on PC NA server to me or anyone else, yes I'll log onto my DC NB and ambush spam the [snip] out of you until you quit for the day, it's nothing less than you deserve. I have occasionally widened my sights onto other obvious exploiting and [snip] them off with it if I'm just plain sick of the BS, but it depends on how fed up I am with the sh*t in this game on the day.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

@ZOS_Brett bahaha, you missed one

Necrelios

Cathexis wrote: »

@CrowsDescend just referencing your video again.

https://youtu.be/EY-exbyjme0

This is a classic example of the situation I am talking about. The guy is using CC immunity. That guy has no other option but to escape in that situation. What is he going to do, stand and fight 10 AD? and not just fight, LITERALLY STAND because you can't do anything else!

It is STUPID. If that's honestly how people and @Wrobel think fighting in Cyrodiil should be, I'm done with the game, and I will definitely recommend others not invest time in this game.

That gap closer immunity-immunity-to-immunity is just freaking stupider beyond belief. I don't mean stupid.... sorry I'm just a bit traumatized by it at this point. It is pretty bad though. It is just a huge freaking steaming pile of awful, there I said it. For this reason alone, ESO remains at #2 for my Most Annoying Combat Mechanics for any Games Ever List. Don't even ask me what #1 is, I just prefer to keep my options open.

Stuns, snares, gap closers in general are a bit over the top I think everywhere else in the game as well. It seems like you can't even get from point A to point B anywhere without getting gap closed, snared, or stunned from 20 meters away by either a player or any random NPC that happens to see you from a mile away through some mystical scrying capability. I mean come on, seriously. Let us just enjoy playing the game for once without having to worry about farming ingredients for immovable potions. Holly Sithis.

Brrrofski

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

I think the gap closer root is a bug tbh, for the simple fact that immovability powers don't prevent it.

Has anyone from zos acknowledged the gap closer root?

Btw, bombard from the bow skill line applies the same root. I had it spammed on me yesterday...

I think it's lag. The server is trying to establish where the caster ends up. So it's locking the victim in place to establish a destination for the caster. Since the real bad lag appeared, this gap closer has. I think it's the state the servers are in.

You can physically feel when someone is crit rushing you. Mostly you can dodge roll it, but they'll do it again. Casting a gap closer is a lot cheaper than avoiding it.

riverdragon72

I don't know what is more fun, the DAF ignorance or the rage that the easy button needs to be taken away. Funny how I noticed this wonderful game change just as I dusted my DK off and thought I totally lost it. It took awhile to figure out, after which I complained vehemently about it and of course was told, L2P, loser, git gud, u just suck, and other nerdtabulous paraphrases.

Most certainly in the top 5 sh**tiest changes to pvp ever. It sucks ass, the only people who embrace it use it as their crutch to "win".

Of course this posting will do nothing to get anything changed, and probably another three days off but at this point who cares.

Incrediclint

Cathexis wrote: »

@MikeB Explain to me how it is balanced that one player can be perma-rooted to the ground with an unbreakable root while getting gang beaten on by 10+ players. That isn't balanced at all, the solo player has absolutely 0% chance of survival. BEING IN A GROUP =/= GOD MODE, NOR IS THAT AN ACCEPTABLE STANCE TO TAKE ON BALANCE. This isn't just about "taking on the zerg" man. If you actually go out and fight in cyrodiil you will find that basically any match where you are outnumbered even by a ratio of one extra player is basically a loss for the team with lower numbers between evenly matched players. Why even bother fighting at all when the outcome is fixed??

I have to say, 2 teams that are evenly matched but one team has 1 more player...obviously the larger team should win, because they are evenly matched but have 1 more player. The only way a smaller team will beat a larger one is if the players are NOT evenly matched. 7 Michael Jordan's should be able to beat 6 Michael Jordan's because numbers.

Thelon

Incrediclint wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

@MikeB Explain to me how it is balanced that one player can be perma-rooted to the ground with an unbreakable root while getting gang beaten on by 10+ players. That isn't balanced at all, the solo player has absolutely 0% chance of survival. BEING IN A GROUP =/= GOD MODE, NOR IS THAT AN ACCEPTABLE STANCE TO TAKE ON BALANCE. This isn't just about "taking on the zerg" man. If you actually go out and fight in cyrodiil you will find that basically any match where you are outnumbered even by a ratio of one extra player is basically a loss for the team with lower numbers between evenly matched players. Why even bother fighting at all when the outcome is fixed??

I have to say, 2 teams that are evenly matched but one team has 1 more player...obviously the larger team should win, because they are evenly matched but have 1 more player. The only way a smaller team will beat a larger one is if the players are NOT evenly matched. 7 Michael Jordan's should be able to beat 6 Michael Jordan's because numbers.

What happens if 2 Michael Jordans use spambush?

Cherryblossom

CrowsDescend wrote: »

altemriel wrote: »

wait, what are you talkinga about? what is the meaning of gap closers? is that some new mechanics implemented? serious question.

When you charge an enemy with Ambush, Critical Rush, Toppling Charge, Surprise Attack(?) (even though that's not a charge... it's an attack!) and any ability that I've missed out, which basically closes the gap between you and the target, so you can keep consistent damage on them, well... it's a mini-stun that ignores CC Immunity, basically, so you cannot really escape if there's too many enemies trying to kill you.

They added it because apparently players couldn't keep on their target due to lag. It seems like a cheap fix, in my opinion. If I had the power to, I'd definitely put a cooldown on gap-closers, like... at least every 5-8 seconds.

it's also a bad design for the Lag too, as I've found when lag is bad it also means I'm unable to use any ability when this is done....
Currently on EU as soon as a zerg of 24 is about you will always have 300+ ping, so at this point there is no point even trying to solo people as it's like fighting in treacle.

NobleNerd

Thelon wrote: »

Incrediclint wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

@MikeB Explain to me how it is balanced that one player can be perma-rooted to the ground with an unbreakable root while getting gang beaten on by 10+ players. That isn't balanced at all, the solo player has absolutely 0% chance of survival. BEING IN A GROUP =/= GOD MODE, NOR IS THAT AN ACCEPTABLE STANCE TO TAKE ON BALANCE. This isn't just about "taking on the zerg" man. If you actually go out and fight in cyrodiil you will find that basically any match where you are outnumbered even by a ratio of one extra player is basically a loss for the team with lower numbers between evenly matched players. Why even bother fighting at all when the outcome is fixed??

I have to say, 2 teams that are evenly matched but one team has 1 more player...obviously the larger team should win, because they are evenly matched but have 1 more player. The only way a smaller team will beat a larger one is if the players are NOT evenly matched. 7 Michael Jordan's should be able to beat 6 Michael Jordan's because numbers.

What happens if 2 Michael Jordans use spambush?

LOL

Don't forget the SpamJabs too

Joshuagm1991

That would be cool if gap closers used the (fire rune, spear shards) mechanism of placing where you want to drop.

It would create actual skill based combat.

Also, in my opinion there are too many gap closer abilities.

Cathexis

Incrediclint wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

@MikeB Explain to me how it is balanced that one player can be perma-rooted to the ground with an unbreakable root while getting gang beaten on by 10+ players. That isn't balanced at all, the solo player has absolutely 0% chance of survival. BEING IN A GROUP =/= GOD MODE, NOR IS THAT AN ACCEPTABLE STANCE TO TAKE ON BALANCE. This isn't just about "taking on the zerg" man. If you actually go out and fight in cyrodiil you will find that basically any match where you are outnumbered even by a ratio of one extra player is basically a loss for the team with lower numbers between evenly matched players. Why even bother fighting at all when the outcome is fixed??

I have to say, 2 teams that are evenly matched but one team has 1 more player...obviously the larger team should win, because they are evenly matched but have 1 more player. The only way a smaller team will beat a larger one is if the players are NOT evenly matched. 7 Michael Jordan's should be able to beat 6 Michael Jordan's because numbers.

@Incrediclint
False. This does not take into account environmental variables, which can easily determine the fate of a match. Siege, character placement, terrain to name a few.

Just because you are michael jordan, doesnt mean you wont die to irregular fall damage.

Artjuh90

if you have problems with gap closers just take a look at the mages guild treeline.... there is a good counter to it in that treeline

Lazrael

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

The strangest thing about this change is that NO ONE ASKED FOR IT.

• Where were all the threads complaining about missing gap closers?
• Where were the patch notes that documented this change.

This was an unwanted, uncalled for, and totally unreported ninja change.

Ninja nerfs really hurt the morale of the community. They make it seem like ZOS doesn't care enough about what we think to even notify us when a huge game changing mechanic is added.

This is an example of fixing things that aren't broken. There is plenty that actually is broken that should have been addressed instead.

Well spoken.