NB / Sorc pathetic DPS PvE

Xantaria · September 2015

Dracane wrote: »

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Tankqull wrote: »

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

OP is right, but don't be surprised to see some fools come out of the woodwork to try to convince us that Sorcs really have the best DPS. What a joke!

we have for 30sec with 1000 ulti points ready without that we are miles behind :P

Dracane wrote: »

Both, Sorcerers and Nightblades don't have great dps. Sorcerer pulls the lowest numbers, followed by Nightblades as it seems. Top DPS is Dragonknight, followed by Templar. Even though from I've seen so far, Templar is even stronger.

I agree with OP: I don't understand, why it's so hard to change this already. It's easy to bring Nightblades and especially Sorcerers at the same level with the 2 top dps classes. There's a reason why my Sorcerer wastes his time as a tank and healer now, because I am sick of getting depressed when I see my foolish DPS numbers compared to templars and dks and I don't run trials anymore, because it's making me angry, when Templars and DKs are up in the clouds when posting their DPS and all the Sorcerer post their laughable numbers.

This is so ridiculous and not satisfying ! People, this is about PvE DPS and Sorcerer has the lowest DPS here since the game exists and this never changed since then. The only change is, that Templar changed his position with Nightblade. DK still on the top.

for sorcs its rather easy high DPS + overload is totally overpowered - and as ZOS seems to be unwilling to give sorcs (an) instant class attack(s)/dot(s) at the expense of overload this class will suck forever in pve.

Has nothing to do with Overload. Overload is the only thing preventing Sorcs from sucking totally when it comes to DPS. Even while Overloading, their damage isn't higher or on par other classes that's the ridiculous thing. And Overload is merely a 1 time event. If you die against a strong boss, such as the hard trial bosses, you won't have enough Ultimate to maintain this a 1 2nd time.

Overload is not op, and is only useable against bosses, as you have to safe up all your ultimate. What about the rest of the dungeon ? Where other classes can use their full potential and Sorc can't, because he has to safe all his Ultimate for last boss. Overload is just a sad ability

Who was holding The DPS record on Manti in 1.6? Senaxu with 32k DPS. While DK's had their records at 25k DPS and no other class could even come close.

AoE is the same as all magicka classes. Spamming Elemental Ring + Magicka Bomb is what everybody does. It's even better because you can set up mines where trash will be pulled before the fight even starts.

Boss DPS is crazy. When we are talking about endgame PvE we're talking about perfect runs for the worlds best times. And not some group who is actually wiping / dying to bosses in this game. That makes Overload the best Ultimate you could wish for.

There is only one argument you can have against sorc and that is: Sorcs will not shine in bad groups. But well ... I said it already: git gud.

Alucardo · September 2015

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

I think you're talking about pvp, the dps issues above are pve oriented.

Ah sorry, just noticed. My statement still stands - sorcs have good dps in PVE/P with the right setup.
Deltia got pretty excited over the sorc dps: http://deltiasgaming.com/2015/03/18/ignition-sorcerer-build-for-elder-scrolls-online/

H3Li0S · September 2015

I will be short. L2P.

Xantaria · September 2015

Just leaving this here (PvE Sorc DPS IS SOOOO BAD goddammit!):

This is from 2.0. Remember in comparison to other classes they got the 2nd biggest buffs in 2.1 (after Magicka NBs who got buffed the most)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vN08Xygc39I&feature=player_embedded

Dracane · September 2015

Xantaria wrote: »

Just leaving this here (PvE Sorc DPS IS SOOOO BAD goddammit!):

This is from 2.0. Remember in comparison to other classes they got the 2nd biggest buffs in 2.1 (after Magicka NBs who got buffed the most)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vN08Xygc39I&feature=player_embedded

His dps meter is totally bugged. Look how it says 14kish and then jumps to 30k out of no reason for 0,5 seconds and then back to 13k against the serpent.

xMovingTarget · September 2015

Guedz wrote: »

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Qyrk wrote: »

STEP 1: Write with proper grammar and spelling

STEP 2: You're argument is only valid if you can see "templars and/or dragonknights" in leaderboard spots (we need proof). This is actually not the case which makes your whole argument invalid.

STEP 3: Write with proper grammar and spelling

dk and templar can reach around 30~35k dps... if u do not found one, u play with donkeys.

blablabla grammar blablabla.

So we are all donkeys? I cant reach 30-35k DPS on DK. And I dont know any who can. Yet Sorcs Sorcs reach that number and out dps every other class.

anitajoneb17_ESO · September 2015

Elitists' fight. Popcorn ? Actually no, I'm getting tired of those people shouting at each other from their little cloud above. Giving absolutely no information to anyone as to what the "proper set-up" and "proper rotation" should be.

I for one play a sorc as semi-casual. Been reading threads about "magicka sorc DPS sucks" and "magicka sorc DPS is OP" since 1.6 without understanding a thing of which is which, just some elitist people throwing numbers and names at each other's throat.

I do 9K=> 15K with my sorc depending on circumstances, I have no clue how to reach your out-of-the-clouds numbers such as 25K or 35K, so please either take your fights private or actually tell us something as to how to reach it. And yes, those people who cleverly throw a nice "L2P" in the middle of the "conversation", you too could provide some more info to those who are willing to learn.

EDIT : and yes, the word "elitist" in this post is meant negatively. You're getting annoying.

ThisOnePosts · September 2015

While I don't agree with the OP, it's obvious he/she could use some help in tweaking his/her builds.

However, the grammar-*** parade coming out of grandma's basement to chime in on how he/she forms their sentences is petty and apparently doesn't have much common sense behind it. Why? I'll tell you why. If you try really hard you can tell that there is a good chance English is not their first language.

At least we now know for certain that proper grammar and common sense are not related whatsoever.

Cherryblossom · September 2015

Dracane wrote: »

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Cherryblossom wrote: »

Guedz wrote: »

So what's the problem of Nightblades and Sorcerers DPS in PvE? Why is it so difficult to balance this game once and for all? And do not tell me and show me videos of NBs Magika causing 25k dps, because to achieve this I need to have MANY ChampZ and top equipment, that things Templars and DKs simply do not need!

Must use the golden armor of the twelve zodiac houses if I want to reach the feet of a DK all blue ... absurd!

I do not want to have to create another another class of character just to be able to get in a veteran arena or in one of the new dungeons in Veteran mode, I want my character able to do this, as other classes can ...

Something is wrong in this game, very wrong.

I am speaking for myself, but putting it out what many have told me and also agreed with me.

And I know that some troll will say "but has cloak" ... grab my cloak, shove in your pocket and go away with it, do not care.

That *** is wrong since the beta and no one gets with the excuse that "NBs and sorcs are good at PVP" ... pathetic.

Huh!

What is exactly the problem? it's great to put a post complaining about balance, but if you can't identify the issue no one can help you.

My NB is my main and I love his damage, I swap between 2H & bow, Dual & Resto. Depends on what I'm doing. I'm not Max level with him even though I have been playing since PC Launch.

Sorc, weak! Really, that made me think you were trolling! Was trying Stam on my Vet2 last night and she hit's like a truck, think I enjoy it more than my crystal frag proc fun build.

As people say, this is about engame competition in PvE. It is not of importance, if you have fun while playing your NB or not. This is only about EQUALITY between classes and this equality does not exist, never existed in this game.

If you let a Dragonknight and a Templar with 500 Championpoints and the same damage level DPS let's say the Battlemaster or so. They will always pull higher numbers than Sorcerer and Nightblade having 500 CP and the gap is large. Fun is nice, but equality is just as important, a satisfying feeling when playing your class because you know, each class is playing on the same DPS level in end game. This would be so nice

I simply disagree, most classes are using weapon specific attacks, to produce high numbers.
Whip doesn't hit as hard as Wrecking Blow, Jabs is low DPS. Jesus beam doesn't hit as hard as NB Killers Blade which also heals! Everything is down to how you use your skills in conjunction with your class, Sorc is now without doubt the best class to use Steel Tornado with!
You cannot turn around and say that two classes are bad because you can't get good dps, especially when there are many others who do!

manny254 · September 2015

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Elitists' fight. Popcorn ? Actually no, I'm getting tired of those people shouting at each other from their little cloud above. Giving absolutely no information to anyone as to what the "proper set-up" and "proper rotation" should be.

I for one play a sorc as semi-casual. Been reading threads about "magicka sorc DPS sucks" and "magicka sorc DPS is OP" since 1.6 without understanding a thing of which is which, just some elitist people throwing numbers and names at each other's throat.

I do 9K=> 15K with my sorc depending on circumstances, I have no clue how to reach your out-of-the-clouds numbers such as 25K or 35K, so please either take your fights private or actually tell us something as to how to reach it. And yes, those people who cleverly throw a nice "L2P" in the middle of the "conversation", you too could provide some more info to those who are willing to learn.

EDIT : and yes, the word "elitist" in this post is meant negatively. You're getting annoying.

Keep in mind that this rift is not one way. A lot players get frustrated with people spreading information that they know to be false. From what I can gather these players who have engaged in the threads are not the sorcs pulling these numbers. This does not discredit them. If it is not a build of their own it is not for them to share. I am sure even the players that pull these numbers are still farming to finalize their gear.

Also could you really expect them to on the fly explain to someone how to play the game.

Alucardo · September 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Oh nice Which campaign are you on ? Time, location
(btw, hot guy on the pic)

Thanks. I was a little worried my hair didn't look right in that pic

Ganj · September 2015

Qyrk wrote: »

STEP 1: Write with proper grammar and spelling

STEP 2: You're argument is only valid if you can see "templars and/or dragonknights" in leaderboard spots (we need proof). This is actually not the case which makes your whole argument invalid.

STEP 3: Write with proper grammar and spelling

Me name is Pablo Chachon. You're the grammer.

Dracane · September 2015

Alucardo wrote: »

show previous quotes

Dracane wrote: »

Oh nice Which campaign are you on ? Time, location
(btw, hot guy on the pic)

Thanks. I was a little worried my hair didn't look right in that pic

Oh

maybe we should switch over to private message

hahaa

Alucardo · September 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Oh maybe we should switch over to private message hahaa

You're in luck, too. I still have the gladiator costume lying around

Alucardo · September 2015

Ganj wrote: »

show previous quotes

Qyrk wrote: »

STEP 1: Write with proper grammar and spelling

STEP 2: You're argument is only valid if you can see "templars and/or dragonknights" in leaderboard spots (we need proof). This is actually not the case which makes your whole argument invalid.

STEP 3: Write with proper grammar and spelling

Me name is Pablo Chachon. You're the grammer.

lmao nice find

Bhakura · September 2015

Hmm, my sorc is stamina build.
joined a vr14 group when i was vr7.
Was outdpsing everyone as i got agro from all trashmobs every time ...
Sustained is around 12k, 18 if daedra or undead, so not very top notch, but for stamina sorc, like we all know stamina not a match for magicka, pretty decent.
But then again, im not a numbercruncher and couldnt care less if its not the best or ever will be, im very happy with the toon i build. So in that point of view, theres nothing wrong with sorcs or nbs, use the right items with right skills and right buffs (mundus etc) and you shouldnt have trouble at all to compete.

Xantaria · September 2015

Dracane wrote: »

show previous quotes

Alucardo wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Oh nice Which campaign are you on ? Time, location
(btw, hot guy on the pic)

Thanks. I was a little worried my hair didn't look right in that pic

Oh maybe we should switch over to private message hahaa

My bad, seems you don't know Rust. There are no Campaigns in Rust. This is an internet joke like

'1v1 me in minecraft lolololol' because that's pretty much how you are going at me here.

Also it's funny how you are trying to distract from your horrible defeat in this thread.

Xantaria · September 2015

Dracane wrote: »

@Xantaria Seriously, stop talking about things you know nothing about. You saw a fancy video on YouTube to base all your "knowledge" on, great. People say TV is education.
You are no Sorcerer and know nothing about them. All you do is telling me I'm bad or unexperienced or what not. But any solutions ? No, because you don't know any solutions, because you don't even know this class.

Since pvp is the only place to get rid off people like you, I want to meet you there. So tell me campaign, time and location and I'll come.

Apparantly I know more about sorcs than you

I know how to pull good DPS on them but I'm not the one who has to teach you how to play your class. There is enough Theorycrafting about Sorcerers out there. I recommend checking for Dymence / Senaxu / Asayre.

We're in a discussion about Sorcerer and Nightblade PvE DPS. Yet to proove your point you want to PvP me. I think that is laughable in itself.

Alucardo · September 2015

inb4 comment from ZOS saying they understand people have different opinions, etc

anitajoneb17_ESO · September 2015

Is there a prize for "most useful comment of the year" for @Alucardo ?

Dymence · September 2015

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]

I was there. I saw it with my own eyes. I play a sorcerer. Just because you can't believe the numbers you're seeing, doesn't make them 'impossible' or 'bugged' or anything else.

I really hate saying this, but.. This is a 100% l2p issue.

Sorcerers are good. Really good. And not with overload alone anymore. Once everyone has their gear together, I think sorcerers have the highest damage potential out of all classes, EVEN without overload. We will see in a month or so.

Open your mind. Stop taking your own experience as the whole truth while denying everyone else's. That's not how you get better. That's how you get worse.

Qyrk · September 2015

OP should really do some research before he make these type of claims.

Ever_75 · September 2015

Not sure what to think here, i've been running a DPS DK since the beginning and recently started a sorcerer. For all that i know i love the DPS on my sorcerer, it has a far better burst than my DK. If DK were so strong on the DPS side, then why most of the DPS for dungeons and trials seems to be NB and sorcerer and DK are mainly tanking???

Alucardo · September 2015

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Is there a prize for "most useful comment of the year" for @Alucardo ?

No, but there should be

Septimus_Magna · September 2015

Dracane wrote: »

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Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Alucardo wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Overload is not op, and is only useable against bosses, as you have to safe up all your ultimate. What about the rest of the dungeon ? Where other classes can use their full potential and Sorc can't, because he has to safe all his Ultimate for last boss. Overload is just a sad ability

It's actually quite decent to get shields and health down, then you can hit them with the curse, frags, mages wrath explosion combo. If they stand on your mines, that will drop them even quicker. Sorcs do have pretty decent dps

I think you're talking about pvp, the dps issues above are pve oriented.

And even in pvp, Overload is one, actually THE easiest attack to avoid in the entire game.

You see a big explosion when a Sorcerer activates it and hear a really loud sound, preventing you from getting stealth shotted. Overload has a rather slow frequency thanks to the cooldown and Zenimax adjusted the animation of Overload with this update, making it a big orb, that can't be missed.

Block it, dodge it, reflect it or attack the caster, as he wants to play offensive when using Overload and this makes him vulnerable. Overload is no ability that is frightening in pvp if you aren't blind, it is a very obvious and predictable ability. But this is perfectly valid, because it deals good damage if it hits. I think, Overload is one of the cleverest, well balanced and well designed abilities in this game.

The only problem so far was its animation, it didn't look obvious enough, just like a normal fat lightning bolt. Not it is a giant electrified bolt.

The use of overload in pvp is a different topic Im afraid. I like it for pve dps but I dont use if for pvp because it takes too much time to switch back to the right bar if you need a heal for example.

Alucardo wrote: »

show previous quotes

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

I think you're talking about pvp, the dps issues above are pve oriented.

Ah sorry, just noticed. My statement still stands - sorcs have good dps in PVE/P with the right setup.
Deltia got pretty excited over the sorc dps: http://deltiasgaming.com/2015/03/18/ignition-sorcerer-build-for-elder-scrolls-online/

Its an early 1.6 / 2.0 build, it still works but it wont give you the highest dps possible. To do this you need to use 2 piece Molag Kena's, DW v16 swords with Power Overload to get 3.5-4k spell damage and many CPs into Elemental damage to increase lightning damage.

andy_s · September 2015

Yes, give more dps to sorcs please

Cuyler · September 2015

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Elitists' fight. Popcorn ? Actually no, I'm getting tired of those people shouting at each other from their little cloud above. Giving absolutely no information to anyone as to what the "proper set-up" and "proper rotation" should be.

I for one play a sorc as semi-casual. Been reading threads about "magicka sorc DPS sucks" and "magicka sorc DPS is OP" since 1.6 without understanding a thing of which is which, just some elitist people throwing numbers and names at each other's throat.

I do 9K=> 15K with my sorc depending on circumstances, I have no clue how to reach your out-of-the-clouds numbers such as 25K or 35K, so please either take your fights private or actually tell us something as to how to reach it. And yes, those people who cleverly throw a nice "L2P" in the middle of the "conversation", you too could provide some more info to those who are willing to learn.

EDIT : and yes, the word "elitist" in this post is meant negatively. You're getting annoying.

Right...I think if you do a quick check of Tamriel Foundry you'll see almost all the top end players post their builds. The ones that aren't well they don't because they'd just be doubling the info that others did.

What top players have over mediocre players is one key idea.....you are your own worst enemy. It's natural to point to outside sources for being the problem or the cause of your frustration....trust me I get it...that was me with my sorc in 1.5. But I took a step back researched good info networked with the right sorcs and well you get the idea.

It regards to the forums, where convos are reduced to short spurts of activity, it is often healthy to remind players to move past their own self-fabricated obstacles (self-defeatism) first before diving into details. You'd be surprised how much info is available with a little of your own (not u specifically) research.

ZOS_MaryB · September 2015

Hi, everyone. We understand that people are going to disagree from time to time, but please remember to keep your comments respectful at all times on our forums, even when you disagree with others. Insults or other disruptive behavior do not help further discussion and can move a thread off topic quickly. We encourage sharing opinions, but we ask that they are constructively stated when doing so, as this will help keep the discussion on track. Thank you!

Moved several comments to keep discussion on track.

Have a great day!

Xantaria · September 2015

Dymence wrote: »

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]

I was there. I saw it with my own eyes. I play a sorcerer. Just because you can't believe the numbers you're seeing, doesn't make them 'impossible' or 'bugged' or anything else.

I really hate saying this, but.. This is a 100% l2p issue.

Sorcerers are good. Really good. And not with overload alone anymore. Once everyone has their gear together, I think sorcerers have the highest damage potential out of all classes, EVEN without overload. We will see in a month or so.

Open your mind. Stop taking your own experience as the whole truth while denying everyone else's. That's not how you get better. That's how you get worse.

There we here it again from a player and sorcerer who is (and also his guild) also aiming for top scores in endgame PvE. But wait ... let's hear how @Dracane disagrees

Because everything @Dymence has said prooves nothing :')

Alucardo · September 2015

Alucardo wrote: »

inb4 comment from ZOS saying they understand people have different opinions, etc

ZOS_MaryB wrote: »

Hi, everyone. We understand that people are going to disagree from time to time, but please remember to keep your comments respectful at all times on our forums, even when you disagree with others. Insults or other disruptive behavior do not help further discussion and can move a thread off topic quickly. We encourage sharing opinions, but we ask that they are constructively stated when doing so, as this will help keep the discussion on track. Thank you!

Moved several comments to keep discussion on track.

Have a great day!

Nailed it