Is there a way to *NOT* accumulate Tel Var stones?

wraith808

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

Selique wrote: »

What does collecting them matter if you don't care about using them? Just ignore them. People will kill you no matter how many TV stones you have.

0 or 1000... You're still going to die the same. If you ignore having them, there's no hassle.

I don't have a problem with getting killed, because it's just a minor inconvenience due to the proximity of respawn points. What I detest is the feeling that some ganker profited by my death and is happily counting my loot while I try to figure out what the heck just happened!

There is still plenty to do in the Imperial City that doesn't revolve around Tel Var stones. I would like a chance to enjoy that content without feeling like a chump.

Ah, the days of oblivion when you could just pull something from your inventory and drop it on the ground to despawn.

I see what you're going for here, and I understand it. They should have to be looted, same as any other gear.

You'd then have the option to simply not pick them up.

Ahem.

Stikato

Do you walk off the basketball court when your opponent is at game point, so he/she can't technically beat you?

Do you hide your Monopoly money so if you land on a house, they other guy can't take your virtual cash?

These aren't new concepts here in the Imperial City. Sometimes, in games, we lose. We lose pride, we lose virtual currency, etc.

And so now you want the option to turn a "not able to win (tv stones)" flag on, so you can also be unable to lose? The risk of losing makes the game more fun. Or at least, it used to. I HATED getting beat by my friends in basketball or monopoly or Axis and Allies. But it made winning SOOO much better.

I guess this attitude is why video games have gone the way they have. Unlimited "lives" and "continues" in every shooter. Consequence-free MMO play. If all I had to do to play a game was to keep playing it, and eventually I would just win.. ugh.

Emma_Overload

If a Basketball game turned out to be 1 vs. 20, then yeah... I would walk off the court because playing would be pointless.

Please stop trying to make excuses for this dumb looting mechanic that feeds off the misery of other players. All I'm asking for is an option to turn off MY OWN TOON'S auto-looting of TV stones, an option that already exists for other loot:

NateAssassin

Stikato wrote: »

Do you walk off the basketball court when your opponent is at game point, so he/she can't technically beat you?

Do you hide your Monopoly money so if you land on a house, they other guy can't take your virtual cash?

These aren't new concepts here in the Imperial City. Sometimes, in games, we lose. We lose pride, we lose virtual currency, etc.

And so now you want the option to turn a "not able to win (tv stones)" flag on, so you can also be unable to lose? The risk of losing makes the game more fun. Or at least, it used to. I HATED getting beat by my friends in basketball or monopoly or Axis and Allies. But it made winning SOOO much better.

I guess this attitude is why video games have gone the way they have. Unlimited "lives" and "continues" in every shooter. Consequence-free MMO play. If all I had to do to play a game was to keep playing it, and eventually I would just win.. ugh.

If you found 100 dollars on the side of the street, picked it up, and five minutes later a gang of thugs shoots you and takes the money you found, you wouldn't be very happy either. Those thugs then boast to their friends how they shot you and took your money.

The same thing applies to TV stones, you find some, and then a ganker kills you instantly, walks off with the stones you found, and talk up how they killed you and took all your stones.

If I had a choice of picking up 5 millionTV stones instantly and getting ganked right after it, only for the ganker to boast about it, or pick none up and get killed, and disappoint a ganker because he didn't get anything to talk smack about, I'd choose the latter.

Selique

The OP's basic concern is that they don't want people to be rewarded for PvPing them.

I think that's a load of bull, because now, you want to deny a feature to players who enjoy that feature because you get bumhurt over the fact they GAIN something from killing you.

That's AS selfish as the gankers. And guess what... You'll STILL get ganked, and made fun of even if you DON'T have TV stones. Its the internet.

So it solves nothing to enable any option to not pick them up. Its a spiteful suggestion.

eggnogman

I had 6 TV stones last night and banked them.... I didn't trust myself to make it any longer without dying....

Rikal

Selique wrote: »

The OP's basic concern is that they don't want people to be rewarded for PvPing them.

I think that's a load of bull, because now, you want to deny a feature to players who enjoy that feature because you get bumhurt over the fact they GAIN something from killing you.

That's AS selfish as the gankers. And guess what... You'll STILL get ganked, and made fun of even if you DON'T have TV stones. Its the internet.

So it solves nothing to enable any option to not pick them up. Its a spiteful suggestion.

Gank all you want, make fun all you want. The idea anyone should be forced to carry loot they don't want is asinine. Just because you feel entitled to it. And that makes them selfish and spiteful? Get real Pinocchio.

Selique

Rikal wrote: »

Selique wrote: »

The OP's basic concern is that they don't want people to be rewarded for PvPing them.

I think that's a load of bull, because now, you want to deny a feature to players who enjoy that feature because you get bumhurt over the fact they GAIN something from killing you.

That's AS selfish as the gankers. And guess what... You'll STILL get ganked, and made fun of even if you DON'T have TV stones. Its the internet.

So it solves nothing to enable any option to not pick them up. Its a spiteful suggestion.

Gank all you want, make fun all you want. The idea anyone should be forced to carry loot they don't want is asinine. Just because you feel entitled to it. And that makes them selfish and spiteful? Get real Pinocchio.

The simple solution is: No one is forcing anyone to carry them. You don't HAVE to participate in IC.

If you don't want to carry them, don't do things to collect them. Just like, you don't want to carry gold? Spend it all, trade it all. Don't want TV stones? Spend them or just ignore them. What are they doing to *you*? Nothing. They aren't doing anything. They don't take up inventory space, they don't weigh your character down. Hell, you can go through IC collecting TV all day and not even notice if you wanted. They have 0 impact on your gameplay experience.

We've already stated that (And I do believe you agreed from the way your post sounds) that ganking and insulting will always be there. No matter what you've got or drop. What's the problem?

I see a problem with denying other people who go to IC for TV stones being denied them in a way that it was intended to be because some people get bumhurt that the PvPers are getting rewarded for PvPing...

Or do you not see that logic?

NateAssassin

Selique wrote: »

Rikal wrote: »

Selique wrote: »

The OP's basic concern is that they don't want people to be rewarded for PvPing them.

I think that's a load of bull, because now, you want to deny a feature to players who enjoy that feature because you get bumhurt over the fact they GAIN something from killing you.

That's AS selfish as the gankers. And guess what... You'll STILL get ganked, and made fun of even if you DON'T have TV stones. Its the internet.

So it solves nothing to enable any option to not pick them up. Its a spiteful suggestion.

Gank all you want, make fun all you want. The idea anyone should be forced to carry loot they don't want is asinine. Just because you feel entitled to it. And that makes them selfish and spiteful? Get real Pinocchio.

The simple solution is: No one is forcing anyone to carry them. You don't HAVE to participate in IC.

If you don't want to carry them, don't do things to collect them. Just like, you don't want to carry gold? Spend it all, trade it all. Don't want TV stones? Spend them or just ignore them. What are they doing to *you*? Nothing. They aren't doing anything. They don't take up inventory space, they don't weigh your character down. Hell, you can go through IC collecting TV all day and not even notice if you wanted. They have 0 impact on your gameplay experience.

We've already stated that (And I do believe you agreed from the way your post sounds) that ganking and insulting will always be there. No matter what you've got or drop. What's the problem?

I see a problem with denying other people who go to IC for TV stones being denied them in a way that it was intended to be because some people get bumhurt that gankers are getting rewarded for ganking...

Or do you not see that logic?

fix'd

zornyan

Might as well say "I don't like people getting ap from killing me, so give me an option to deny ap upon my death"

It's not going to happen, zos have a huge huge list of things far far more important to the playerbase than 5 people moaning on a forum. You entered a pvp zone, you killed enemies to give you a currency, if you die then your attacker shouldnt be denied any rewards, as that's ya know, why they pvp?

It would make the pvp nearly irrelevant, as everyone would turn it off, and only a couple huge zergs would have it on, everyone would be too afraid to collect the stones, whilst small pvp would die as it would mean rewards would be unlikely.

I don't go into cyrodlil thinking "I wonder if this kill will net me ap" and I certainly wouldn't want to go into ic thinking "damm I hope he looted tel var stones to make this worthwhile"

Athas24

Rikal wrote: »

Sure there is a reason to have 0. So those who kill you get 0. Won't stop anyone from killing you, but it should definitely be an option to not take them or not carry any on you. If you want to gank me fine, but the game should not force me to take the loot and guarantee you get a reward for ganking me.

It's like they actually designed it intentionally to maximize "gank" and "zerg" behavior. Hilarious.

If you listened to their little video dealio they did design it with that concept in mind. It's rather clear based on how things operate. I for one think it's a neat incentive though.

Emma_Overload

zornyan wrote: »

Might as well say "I don't like people getting ap from killing me, so give me an option to deny ap upon my death"

It's not going to happen, zos have a huge huge list of things far far more important to the playerbase than 5 people moaning on a forum. You entered a pvp zone, you killed enemies to give you a currency, if you die then your attacker shouldnt be denied any rewards, as that's ya know, why they pvp?

It would make the pvp nearly irrelevant, as everyone would turn it off, and only a couple huge zergs would have it on, everyone would be too afraid to collect the stones, whilst small pvp would die as it would mean rewards would be unlikely.

I don't go into cyrodlil thinking "I wonder if this kill will net me ap" and I certainly wouldn't want to go into ic thinking "damm I hope he looted tel var stones to make this worthwhile"

LOL, I actually AGREE with you, because your statement actually demonstrates how dumb this looting mechanic is!

Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, it was a BAD IDEA to include a mechanic that EVERYBODY other than "a couple huge zergs" (YOUR WORDS) would TURN OFF if they were allowed to do so?!!! Why should a solo PvEer like me work as a SLAVE to earn TV stones for the sole benefit of "a couple huge zergs"?

Slurg

The option to not force people to loot things (TV stones) they don't want to loot would make some PVE-ers happy. Sounds like a reasonable option to have.

But this will never happen, because the PVE content in IC is not there for the enjoyment of pure PVE players. It is there to lure these players in so they can get killed by PVP-ers who want to take their stones.

Please don't forget that according to ZOS, this is primarily a PVP update.

Athas24

Stikato wrote: »

Do you walk off the basketball court when your opponent is at game point, so he/she can't technically beat you?

Do you hide your Monopoly money so if you land on a house, they other guy can't take your virtual cash?

These aren't new concepts here in the Imperial City. Sometimes, in games, we lose. We lose pride, we lose virtual currency, etc.

And so now you want the option to turn a "not able to win (tv stones)" flag on, so you can also be unable to lose? The risk of losing makes the game more fun. Or at least, it used to. I HATED getting beat by my friends in basketball or monopoly or Axis and Allies. But it made winning SOOO much better.

I guess this attitude is why video games have gone the way they have. Unlimited "lives" and "continues" in every shooter. Consequence-free MMO play. If all I had to do to play a game was to keep playing it, and eventually I would just win.. ugh.

I Love everything in this post. Agree x 1000

Selique

zornyan wrote: »

Might as well say "I don't like people getting ap from killing me, so give me an option to deny ap upon my death"

It's not going to happen, zos have a huge huge list of things far far more important to the playerbase than 5 people moaning on a forum. You entered a pvp zone, you killed enemies to give you a currency, if you die then your attacker shouldnt be denied any rewards, as that's ya know, why they pvp?

It would make the pvp nearly irrelevant, as everyone would turn it off, and only a couple huge zergs would have it on, everyone would be too afraid to collect the stones, whilst small pvp would die as it would mean rewards would be unlikely.

I don't go into cyrodlil thinking "I wonder if this kill will net me ap" and I certainly wouldn't want to go into ic thinking "damm I hope he looted tel var stones to make this worthwhile"

I agree with the AP comparison.

However, it wouldn't be just huge zergs that opt to have AP on. The difference here is, the Risk vs Reward multiplier. People who (Such as myself) like to gamble, walk around with some amount of TV on us to GET MORE from killing players and Monsters.

Now, take away the % of PvErs who would turn off TV (Assuming there is an amount), leaves the PvPers with LESS ways to gain TV.

The system as is works. No need to fix something that isn't broken.

The heart of the problem "Gankers getting rewarded" is not a real problem. Ganking is a playstyle. Why deny people that style, to benefit your own ego? Stay out of IC if you don't want the RISK involved with the REWARDS...

zornyan

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

Might as well say "I don't like people getting ap from killing me, so give me an option to deny ap upon my death"

It's not going to happen, zos have a huge huge list of things far far more important to the playerbase than 5 people moaning on a forum. You entered a pvp zone, you killed enemies to give you a currency, if you die then your attacker shouldnt be denied any rewards, as that's ya know, why they pvp?

It would make the pvp nearly irrelevant, as everyone would turn it off, and only a couple huge zergs would have it on, everyone would be too afraid to collect the stones, whilst small pvp would die as it would mean rewards would be unlikely.

I don't go into cyrodlil thinking "I wonder if this kill will net me ap" and I certainly wouldn't want to go into ic thinking "damm I hope he looted tel var stones to make this worthwhile"

LOL, I actually AGREE with you, because your statement actually demonstrates how dumb this looting mechanic is!

Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, it was a BAD IDEA to include a mechanic that EVERYBODY other than "a couple huge zergs" (YOUR WORDS) would TURN OFF if they were allowed to do so?!!! Why should a solo PvEer like me work as a SLAVE to earn TV stones for the sole benefit of "a couple huge zergs"?

Because zergs get bugger all stones as they are distributed between the players. Zergs will die down in a couple weeks, because once people realise that an entire day of zerging gets them a quarter (or even less/ than a few hours solo/small group they'll go do that.

Besides the more tel var stones that get handed out, the more endgame stuff will be around, which will help lower the prices in coming months.

If the only way to get tel var stones was 20+ zergs, then there would be such a small market amount prices would never drop.

PBpsy

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

Might as well say "I don't like people getting ap from killing me, so give me an option to deny ap upon my death"

It's not going to happen, zos have a huge huge list of things far far more important to the playerbase than 5 people moaning on a forum. You entered a pvp zone, you killed enemies to give you a currency, if you die then your attacker shouldnt be denied any rewards, as that's ya know, why they pvp?

It would make the pvp nearly irrelevant, as everyone would turn it off, and only a couple huge zergs would have it on, everyone would be too afraid to collect the stones, whilst small pvp would die as it would mean rewards would be unlikely.

I don't go into cyrodlil thinking "I wonder if this kill will net me ap" and I certainly wouldn't want to go into ic thinking "damm I hope he looted tel var stones to make this worthwhile"

LOL, I actually AGREE with you, because your statement actually demonstrates how dumb this looting mechanic is!

Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, it was a BAD IDEA to include a mechanic that EVERYBODY other than "a couple huge zergs" (YOUR WORDS) would TURN OFF if they were allowed to do so?!!! Why should a solo PvEer like me work as a SLAVE to earn TV stones for the sole benefit of "a couple huge zergs"?

This is even more funny since the same anti-natural selection argument is used against small scale organized.PVP. "If they added arenas who would play The Elder Heart of the Swarm 2014?" .No [snip] ... probably not many but if it can't stand on its own maybe it should just perish.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Get an addon that blocks the stone counter. you will win stones, lose stones but you wont even see it so its out of sight out of mind.

Even though I am a PvPer I support this thread entirely because I now wholesale reject every IC mechanic as grindy time sink garbage and not good for the game as a whole.

Down with Tel Var!

Down with the extended grinds and the v16 gear grab. Make more real content and less grind.

zornyan

Selique wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

Might as well say "I don't like people getting ap from killing me, so give me an option to deny ap upon my death"

It's not going to happen, zos have a huge huge list of things far far more important to the playerbase than 5 people moaning on a forum. You entered a pvp zone, you killed enemies to give you a currency, if you die then your attacker shouldnt be denied any rewards, as that's ya know, why they pvp?

It would make the pvp nearly irrelevant, as everyone would turn it off, and only a couple huge zergs would have it on, everyone would be too afraid to collect the stones, whilst small pvp would die as it would mean rewards would be unlikely.

I don't go into cyrodlil thinking "I wonder if this kill will net me ap" and I certainly wouldn't want to go into ic thinking "damm I hope he looted tel var stones to make this worthwhile"

I agree with the AP comparison.

However, it wouldn't be just huge zergs that opt to have AP on. The difference here is, the Risk vs Reward multiplier. People who (Such as myself) like to gamble, walk around with some amount of TV on us to GET MORE from killing players and Monsters.

Now, take away the % of PvErs who would turn off TV (Assuming there is an amount), leaves the PvPers with LESS ways to gain TV.

The system as is works. No need to fix something that isn't broken.

The heart of the problem "Gankers getting rewarded" is not a real problem. Ganking is a playstyle. Why deny people that style, to benefit your own ego? Stay out of IC if you don't want the RISK involved with the REWARDS...

Agreed I don't mind ganking. I use a templar and a dk tank in pvp and have been ganked many times, I can also run into the middle of a warzone, put Shields/heals up and stand right at the front of the battle hacking away with my swords.

My Nb is an assassin, if I tried that *** with him he'd be dead in a couple seconds flat, hell half of my passives are all bonus damage from stealth!

It's a playstyle, an assassin is a perfectly acceptable way of killing people, so is wearing heavy armor and healing any damage you receive whilst smashing their faces in with a 2h mace...

But truly ganking is hilarious and fun, I must admit I get hate mails, and I think it's bloody funny, especially when I target the same person 10x in a row just because they sent me hate mails, it's a thrill, I sit patiently, waiting for that right moment, I fire my snipe, I rush in with ambush and give it everything I've got! If they don't die then, I'm pretty screwed.

Merlight

Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »

You don't earn any stones, and they can't take any from you either. It's not the same as not wanting to earn gold or AP, as those cannot be taken from you.

I won't be surprised if these people request that next: allow me to turn off all my AP gains, and while I have it off, nobody gets AP for killing me. Same nonsense.

Rikal wrote: »

Won't stop anyone from killing you, but it should definitely be an option to not take them or not carry any on you. If you want to gank me fine, but the game should not force me to take the loot and guarantee you get a reward for ganking me.

The funny part is the OP previously lobbied for guaranteed reward for killing you, aka <100% TVS loot

Emma_Overload

PBpsy wrote: »

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

Might as well say "I don't like people getting ap from killing me, so give me an option to deny ap upon my death"

It's not going to happen, zos have a huge huge list of things far far more important to the playerbase than 5 people moaning on a forum. You entered a pvp zone, you killed enemies to give you a currency, if you die then your attacker shouldnt be denied any rewards, as that's ya know, why they pvp?

It would make the pvp nearly irrelevant, as everyone would turn it off, and only a couple huge zergs would have it on, everyone would be too afraid to collect the stones, whilst small pvp would die as it would mean rewards would be unlikely.

I don't go into cyrodlil thinking "I wonder if this kill will net me ap" and I certainly wouldn't want to go into ic thinking "damm I hope he looted tel var stones to make this worthwhile"

LOL, I actually AGREE with you, because your statement actually demonstrates how dumb this looting mechanic is!

Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, it was a BAD IDEA to include a mechanic that EVERYBODY other than "a couple huge zergs" (YOUR WORDS) would TURN OFF if they were allowed to do so?!!! Why should a solo PvEer like me work as a SLAVE to earn TV stones for the sole benefit of "a couple huge zergs"?

This is even more funny since the same anti-natural selection argument is used against small scale organized.PVP. "If they added arenas who would play The Elder Heart of the Swarm 2014?" .No [snip] ... probably not many but if it can't stand on its own maybe it should just perish.

You're right about arenas, and I've seen this same silly argument employed by certain snobby PvEers when the topic of Bind-on-Pickup loot comes up. They say stuff like "yeah, but if Trial loot was Bind-on-Equip, nobody would do Trials anymore blah blah blah". LOL, if BoP loot is the ONLY reason these gear snobs do Trials, maybe it's time to admit that Trials are broken and unfun.

jnjdun_ESO

This thread amuses me.

I wish there was a way that players could turn off stones and that this would be information that the potential ganker could see when targeting said player.

Let the games begin. You want to ruin our fun...we will ruin yours.

You deliberately turn off TV stones, then we deliberately turn off you.

See how that wouldn’t work? It becomes no fun for anyone.

Emma_Overload

Merlight wrote: »

Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »

You don't earn any stones, and they can't take any from you either. It's not the same as not wanting to earn gold or AP, as those cannot be taken from you.

I won't be surprised if these people request that next: allow me to turn off all my AP gains, and while I have it off, nobody gets AP for killing me. Same nonsense.

Rikal wrote: »

Won't stop anyone from killing you, but it should definitely be an option to not take them or not carry any on you. If you want to gank me fine, but the game should not force me to take the loot and guarantee you get a reward for ganking me.

The funny part is the OP previously lobbied for guaranteed reward for killing you, aka <100% TVS loot

Say what? I think you've got me confused with someone else. The percentage of loot doesn't matter much to me... it could be 100% or 50% or 10%. The fact that ANY of my loot is being stolen from me by other players is enough to make me unhappy.

zornyan

jnjdun_ESO wrote: »

This thread amuses me.

I wish there was a way that players could turn off stones and that this would be information that the potential ganker could see when targeting said player.

Let the games begin. You want to ruin our fun...we will ruin yours.

You deliberately turn off TV stones, then we deliberately turn off you.

See how that wouldn’t work? It becomes no fun for anyone.

I (and many others) would make sure to gank you then, for a couple reasons.

1. It means you don't want to pvp, aren't setup for it and probably not very experienced. Meaning an easy kill.

2. It means you're inconvenienced by dying, which makes it even more fun for us.

3. You wouldn't spoil our fun, pvp is just that, we have fun by killing other players, don't like it? Don't come into cyrodlil.

Darlgon

c00lmon wrote: »

I'd like to be able to not collect them also. Then if I am killed no one gets them so no reason to kill my character trying to PVE.

Your death would still give them XP and AP.

Rikal

If you robbed and killed someone in real life are you guaranteed you will get a significant reward or any at all? No. Why in a game do people feel entitled to that? When I travel overseas or go to a "dangerous" area IRL I don't carry significant cash and valuables with me. And the government doesn't force me to. I could if I wanted to, but it's a choice.

I know it's a game (not RL). But wouldn't it actually make sense for my character whose travelling through an area to want to make himself the smallest target possible? To minimize his losses if attacked and robbed? It's perfectly legit. Forcing people to carry the stones is what's hokey.

It's not like ganking is honorable combat. Your target is taking a risk that they might get ganked, why shouldn't you be running the risk that ganking them is a waste of your time?

Merlight

My apologies then, I think I saw you in one of the "reduce the loot" topics and made a wrong connection.

jnjdun_ESO

zornyan wrote: »

jnjdun_ESO wrote: »

This thread amuses me.

I wish there was a way that players could turn off stones and that this would be information that the potential ganker could see when targeting said player.

Let the games begin. You want to ruin our fun...we will ruin yours.

You deliberately turn off TV stones, then we deliberately turn off you.

See how that wouldn’t work? It becomes no fun for anyone.

I (and many others) would make sure to gank you then, for a couple reasons.

1. It means you don't want to pvp, aren't setup for it and probably not very experienced. Meaning an easy kill.

2. It means you're inconvenienced by dying, which makes it even more fun for us.

3. You wouldn't spoil our fun, pvp is just that, we have fun by killing other players, don't like it? Don't come into cyrodlil.

I think you misunderstood what I was trying to say.
I agree with you. If a player turned off TV stones my little group of gankers would kill that person over and over again until they left.

It is a PvP update and I feel they don’t deserve to be in there PvE'ing and feeling like they have nothing to lose.

PvP is all about risk.

Selique

Rikal wrote: »

If you robbed and killed someone in real life are you guaranteed you will get a significant reward or any at all? No. [/b

I'll just stop you right there: This isn't real life.

Rikal

Selique wrote: »

Rikal wrote: »

If you robbed and killed someone in real life are you guaranteed you will get a significant reward or any at all? No. [/b

I'll just stop you right there: This isn't real life.

My 1st instinct is to ask if you read my whole post, but you probably did. And deliberately chose to only quote that part.

Just because it's a game and not RL doesn't mean it has to be totally contrived either.