Higher sorcerer healer, am I as good as a Templar heal wise?

Tankqull

Thraben wrote: »

Chieve wrote: »

I actually have one more question I'm confused about.

So I'm hearing almost equal about both...

I'm hearing some people say templar have good strong heals but bad at resource managerment. But then I hear people argue they actually do have good resource management.

Then I hear people say sorcers are good at resource management but not as strong heals. But then I hear people argue they can be strong.

In all honesty, my main idea (or at least to amke myself feel good about being a healing sorcerer) Is that template have strong heals but sorcery have good resources to last longer.

So it's almost like, in my eyes, since sorcerers last longer they go around healing a lot and then templar use their heals in emergencies or when people start getting low almost.

Is this idea correct? Or should injaut accept the fact that there is no benefit with picking a sorcerer over a templar.

1. In the next patch the rank requirement for the skill vigor goes down from 8 months or so farming to 3 weeks farming
2. Using a templar as emergency/ secondary healer works very well, though it is unusual since random groups are normally unable to employ a dps/ secondary healer
3. restoration staff is about AoE heals over time and raising the group's damage while the templar healing is more about flexible and powerful burst healing which is more expansive.

In short, if you plan to heal random groups, you are dependent on the willingness of the group to use emergency skills and to stay close to each other.

1. its more close to 3-days you´ll need 326.400 ap then, instead of the former 6.918.400
3. thats garbage healing ward is by far the most effective "burst" heal by either covering up the traget with an extreme powerful shield while your hots are still ticking or a heal of

newtinmpls

Rakshat wrote: »

Templars can heal in every situation meanwhile all the other classes, including sorcs, might struggle whenever your allies are too spread out.

Depends on the Templar; our dedicated Templar/Healer usually picks a spot to "set up shop" (by which she means to set up a blood altar), and she prefers that we not get too separated from each other. Especially in higher level areas (with greater 'damage at a time') she can't afford to just heal us one at a time.

You DON'T want to *** off the healer.

As a sorc healer, I love the rapid regen from the resto staff. Doesn't really matter where my peeps are - the two most wounded folks will get the healing. So when I see someone's bar drop, I cast a few, while .... verbally reminding them to get out of the d--- red ('cause likely that's what is happening - and - well - you can't heal stupid).

Francis_Toliver

Chieve wrote: »

So I know Templar have a healnline...only reason I didn't choose them is because I never cared for a templar/paladin like class and I always loved mages, so I made a sorcerer.

However I am just wondering if the templar heals me will be better healers then me because they have more skills.

I see two trees, a healing staff tree and support tree on my guy...so I think if I ever need, I can make a mix of these abilities to become a good healer...

I put all my Stat points in magic too...

Am I weak compared to a templar?

While you can be perfectly viable as a healer with a resto staff, you are correct that Templars are the most powerful healers in the game. Doesn't mean you can't be a great healer, just that Templars, if they are dedicated healers are going to have some more powerful options available to them. Their Restoring Light skill tree (and its powerful passives) along with Aedric Spear's "Luminous Shards" put them at the top of the heap when it comes to healers.

Examples of Templar benefits as a healer are having all the resto staff skills plus the additional buffs of;
up to +10% to Templar heals depending on how damaged your allies are
+30% to Templar heals inside the area of effect of a cleansing ritual, etc.
+20% speed to resurrections on allies + they revive with 100% more health.
the addition of "Repentance" which offers a free heal spell in mob situations.
the only "burst" heal spell in the game, which is readily available at low levels.

So yeah, no real comparison. However, even with all that said you can still be an effective healer with just a Resto staff. Plenty of great healing spells and passives in that skill line and for most of the games situations enough healing to get a party through. In most cases. If something goes wrong, if someone does something stupid (and we all do), if the laws of chance go against you, that's when having a Templar along helps.

There is a saying I've heard amongst healers. It goes like this; "You can heal a lot of things, but you can't heal stupid" or more simply "you can't heal stupid" for short. The player that hares off into a mob far away from his healer, before his party is set to go, or the guy who continues to stand in a red zone beating on a boss as his health bar steaks to zero...these are acts of stupidity (in game terms) that no amount of healing is going to save a character from. A healer shouldn't even try because it will wipe out her resources to the detriment of the rest of the party. I usually offer a few warnings and if the behavior continues I just stop protecting them from the consequences of their own actions.

However, in a some cases your locked in a small room or hallway and everything turns red or your party needs time to adapt to survive when things are going to hell and that's when having all those "buffs" can mean the difference between success and a team wipe.

I have played a Sorc that could heal and he did fine. I have also played a Dedicated Templar Healer and that was fun as well. If I am going to go hard core as a healer I prefer the Templar. The fun in doing a Sorc healer was being able to do Sorc DPS as well and having Familiar/Pets for role play and of course Hardened Ward didn't hurt and...well you get the idea.

Hope that answers your question.

Chieve

okay. i guess my last question is with dungeon and raids....

i like the idea of being able to do damage and heal.

What should I que as though? Healer or dungeon?

or just que as both?

I mean i dont mind queing as dps...but ya know...longer que times and why not just que as healer if id do just fine anyways?

DschiPeunt

Chieve wrote: »

okay. i guess my last question is with dungeon and raids....

i like the idea of being able to do damage and heal.

What should I que as though? Healer or dungeon?

or just que as both?

I mean i dont mind queing as dps...but ya know...longer que times and why not just que as healer if id do just fine anyways?

The only players that actively heal are the healers. If you are going to do damage, queue als DD. If you want to heal, queue as healer. You might run into problems with unexperienced players when getting into random groups, because some think that only templar can be good healers. As a sorc healer an experienced group that plays together on a regular basis is something I would look out for.

And as I have stated before: every healer is an off-DD too. If no healing is required, you do damage. Anyway try not to waste all your magicka for that. Your damage output depends a lot on the groups skill level.
With good groups I sometimes do 17k DPS on dungeon bosses (burst damage ofc).

Flameheart

DschiPeunt wrote: »

Rjthakid wrote: »

Please disregard the false information in this thread.

Templars are the best healers in the game. Hands down. The only advantage to being a Sorc healer is their superior resource management. If you're using food, potions, Heavy Attacks to get back Magicka, and Channeled Focus, management isn't really that tough if you're spec'd and geared properly.

Every class can be a DPS, Healer or Tank, but let's not engage our Reality Distortion fields.

Templars are the best healers. They have access to every single Resto skill that Sorc healers have, AND Breathe of Life.

Oh, and REMEMBRANCE. My God, Remembrance is the best heal in the entire game.

Remembrance is a skill only noob healers use. If you are healing a raid with me and cast it, I'll make sure you are never healing with me again.
If you are talking about repentance, yes it's a good skill, but only 1 has to use it. Looking at the rising numbers of stamina templar DDs, it's not a must-have for healers and in a raid, you only need one templar to cast. The other healer can be a sorc or dk or nb, doesn't matter.

And good healers are also DDs, which makes the ressource management a bigger problem as for someone who only casts when someone doesn't have full health and is doing nothing the rest of the time. That makes sorcs an interesting choice for healing.

Good thing someone said it. I was actually irritated by the fact somebody would use Remembrance...and yes, a good healer keeps the group alive, a great healer keeps the group alive and supports by using Repentance / Spears or Mystic Orb, an awesome healer keeps the group alive, supports with repentance / Spears / Mystic Orb and adds dps (even only 3k dps add up for a close fight).

My NB Healer has the same amount of magicka as my templar (~34k), but because of NB passives I don't need to slot Structured Entropy to get my 20k health buffed. I don't have BoL, but I have Combat Prayer + HS + RapidReg and three awesome skills with loads of synergy that let me dps and heal simultanously (Refreshing Path + Funnel Health + Sap Essence). My Veil of Blades is able to replace Nova / Solar prison.

---

Short story concerning NB healers:

Random Group for Gold, Crypt of Hearts:

Random dd 1: "You have balls to heal Crypt gold as a NB healer"
Me: "There won't be any issues"

Instance finished, boss downed, 1 death because we weren't able to down his damage shield in the sacrifice scene fast enough, although he grabbed the tank and there were 2 DDs and I did around 5k dps as a healer alone in that stage....

....never heard anybody mention something about NB healers again. Actually the balls touched the ground me seems.

To not badmouth the DDs, those guys made a lot of damage to trash and it wasn't just good dps, but good damage avoidance too (as a healer you just love guys where an area is full of fire and red circles, but you won't notice even a major tic on someone's health bar). Maybe just the single target dps lacked somewhat and especially in this department can be a pretty big gap between classes and builds. AoE damage isn't everything in this game.

---

BoL is a nice reactive "oh ***" heal, but if it comes to spamming heals because of severe inc damage, HS spam + damage mitigation ultimates are the way to go. If you are able as a raid/group to crowd together in one spot HS spam + an occasional Combat Prayer is the most effective healing (and buffing), the HS spam will cost next to nothing with some proper allocated CPs.

newtinmpls

So .... what I hear @Flameheart and @DschiPeunt saying seems to boil down to:

"My unique, excellent and well thought out build for a healer is super fabulous and because it works for me, it is totally beyond critique .... anyone who runs a healer using a particular skill that hasn't worked well for me must be inferior"

Bah.

If you find a combo that rocks for you - go for it.

If you find that a particular skill doesn't work for you - it might work fantastically for someone else.

And in my experience (YMMV) is that the longer any given group works together, the more synergies they will come up with. So be prepared for thought-provoking suggestions from your group.

DschiPeunt

newtinmpls wrote: »

So .... what I hear @Flameheart and @DschiPeunt saying seems to boil down to:

"My unique, excellent and well thought out build for a healer is super fabulous and because it works for me, it is totally beyond critique .... anyone who runs a healer using a particular skill that hasn't worked well for me must be inferior"

Bah.

If you find a combo that rocks for you - go for it.

If you find that a particular skill doesn't work for you - it might work fantastically for someone else.

And in my experience (YMMV) is that the longer any given group works together, the more synergies they will come up with. So be prepared for thought-provoking suggestions from your group.

There is a difference between skills/sets/cp-allocations/etc that I personally dislike and skills/sets/cp-allocations/etc that are just not as good as others.
Example: I don't use rapid regeneration/mutagen, others do. I won't tell anyone not to use it, because it's a good skill, but as said: I don't use it.

On the other hand there are skills or combination of skills that work better than others and I usually tell people how and why they should remorph a special skill or what other skill they might want to check out.

And my build is totally open to any critique. I constantly ask other healers what sets they use, what skills and morphs they choose, where they spent their CP. I don't even like the term "build" since my setup is changing on a weekly basis.
If someone criticizes my setup, I will check out their suggestions as soon as possible. But I am also experienced enough to criticize someone else's setup.

Oh and I play with my group for half a year now and had the pleasure to play with some of the best healers in the game. I also helped out upcoming raid groups from other guilds than my main guild. I have teached some people the very basics of healing and learned a lot from others.
Soon the other healer in my raid group and me are going to use a "templar + other class"-healer-combo for our raid to synergize even better, so yeah I know about the power of using synergies with a well attuned group.

newtinmpls

DschiPeunt wrote: »

The only players that actively heal are the healers.

@Chieve You have to watch out for the above attitude. There are plenty of other MMOs out there where any halfway decent healer can keep even the most single-minded unwise (i.e. standing in the red constantly) tanks alive. ESO is not set up that way. This is the kind of group where folks will stand in stupid (i.e. overlapping circles of red) get killed and then blame the healer.

Anyway most of the time when I group, there is a primary healer and also a back-up healer. This is a discussion that needs to happen before you get started into the dungeon/delve whatever.

Think about things like who is going to rez folks; and throw out ideas. The healer could be the primary 'rezzer'; though this is not always a good idea; for that matter who will rez the healer? Does everyone have soul gems?

Who has healing potions (the answer here should be 'everyone' - and that is the same answer to 'who should be using them').

Yes, by all means throw out a DPS if you have time/magicka. Even better is if you throw something with a synergy, aiming it near where folks are who can synergize it. "Liquid lighting coming up" or some such is good communication.

Flaminir

There are a lot of really 'interesting' views here...a s somebody who has played both Sorc & Templar as heals at V14 extensively....

Both can do the job for the majority of content. - So if you enjoy it then play it! Thats the most important thing!

Templars can always be stronger healers due to the dedicated skill line, passives... and breath of life which is quite literally a life saver in extreme situations.

Templars do NOT have magicka management issues unless they are poorly played.

The only benefit sorcs have over templars is a 10% magicka regen bonus. That's it. People in the thread talking about spell power are misleading... that's only with sorc skills slotted... and when healing you will only be using resto staff skills as Sorcs have exactly zero class skills that will help a healer on their main bar (Sadly every class other than a sorc has some skills useful to a healer... Sorc is the only one with nothing, which basically leaves them in last place).

Spell power, magicka management, other healing buffs are mainly down to the gear you wear, which is available to any class.

Where you may be at a major disadvantage is in the next patch if ZoS continue down the route of having zero stamina regen while blocking. Tanks are going to need stamina... and the only class who has any skills to give this to them is the Templar. Unless there are changes to other skills ZoS haven't told us about yet then this will be a HUGE nail in the coffin of any non-Templar healer.

rb2001

Whatever you believe is real, is real. Randy Marsh.

rb2001

The benefit of a sorc healer is to not be like everyone else, and to be able to perhaps dish out more damage at the same time, in certain situations, and to have other situational synergies with healing.

Also, who cares about what Templars are doing.

Flameheart

DschiPeunt wrote: »

newtinmpls wrote: »

So .... what I hear @Flameheart and @DschiPeunt saying seems to boil down to:

"My unique, excellent and well thought out build for a healer is super fabulous and because it works for me, it is totally beyond critique .... anyone who runs a healer using a particular skill that hasn't worked well for me must be inferior"

Bah.

If you find a combo that rocks for you - go for it.

If you find that a particular skill doesn't work for you - it might work fantastically for someone else.

And in my experience (YMMV) is that the longer any given group works together, the more synergies they will come up with. So be prepared for thought-provoking suggestions from your group.

There is a difference between skills/sets/cp-allocations/etc that I personally dislike and skills/sets/cp-allocations/etc that are just not as good as others.
Example: I don't use rapid regeneration/mutagen, others do. I won't tell anyone not to use it, because it's a good skill, but as said: I don't use it.

On the other hand there are skills or combination of skills that work better than others and I usually tell people how and why they should remorph a special skill or what other skill they might want to check out.

And my build is totally open to any critique. I constantly ask other healers what sets they use, what skills and morphs they choose, where they spent their CP. I don't even like the term "build" since my setup is changing on a weekly basis.
If someone criticizes my setup, I will check out their suggestions as soon as possible. But I am also experienced enough to criticize someone else's setup.

Oh and I play with my group for half a year now and had the pleasure to play with some of the best healers in the game. I also helped out upcoming raid groups from other guilds than my main guild. I have teached some people the very basics of healing and learned a lot from others.
Soon the other healer in my raid group and me are going to use a "templar + other class"-healer-combo for our raid to synergize even better, so yeah I know about the power of using synergies with a well attuned group.

Same opinion here, it would be utter stupid to rely only on templer healers in a raid. Every class/build has unique synergies you might miss.

...but to go back onto the Remembrance thing....besides the nice 20% damage reduction, it has some big disadvantages.

It's channeled and as a channeled heal no way to cancel animations and stack up other heals or add support stuff or dps in that time and the most important thing...you can't move or block (especially permablocking) while channeling (you can, but you cancel the skill therefore) as a healer, which leads to the most important task for a healer: Don't die.

In addition Remembrance blocks an ultimate slot, which is much better used for Nova and its morphs or even Ice Comet. For some instances Nova is even essential.

My guess is that people who use Remembrance have never seen instances like DSA Veteran, Archives, Hel Ra etc., but I would not slot Remembrance even in a daily silver pledge.

Thraben

3. thats garbage healing ward is by far the most effective "burst" heal by either covering up the traget with an extreme powerful shield while your hots are still ticking or a heal of
[/quote]

Allowing the target to be in execute range just to make the bubble powerful enough is more a sign of courage than of flexibility. A templar can decide if it should be dared, every other healer can´t.

Chieve

Thanks everyone for your helpful info

Ibe been repeating dungeons on my healer and been doing great as a sorcerer.

Only tricky part is I run out of mana most of the time so I gotta carefully time my cool downs good..IIake sure to use my Aman pots early in boss fights and every time my ultimate pops up (I for get the skill tree but it's the one that summons a giant lightening rock that kills people with lightening) I always use...it's actually very helpful since he can take some damage away from my teammates lol

Biggest difficulty is boss fights near hall ways. A boss that uses red in the hall way makes everyone take so much damage which is difficult to heal...just because it's hard to avoid...

Nahz

Chieve wrote: »

Thanks everyone for your helpful info

Ibe been repeating dungeons on my healer and been doing great as a sorcerer.

Only tricky part is I run out of mana most of the time so I gotta carefully time my cool downs good..IIake sure to use my Aman pots early in boss fights and every time my ultimate pops up (I for get the skill tree but it's the one that summons a giant lightening rock that kills people with lightening) I always use...it's actually very helpful since he can take some damage away from my teammates lol

Biggest difficulty is boss fights near hall ways. A boss that uses red in the hall way makes everyone take so much damage which is difficult to heal...just because it's hard to avoid...

I don't know if you PVP, but I always run barrier on my primary bar when I'm healing as my sorcerer; it's my version of a "big heal" except I can use it proactively instead of reactively. If I know a big damage skill is coming, I can pop a nice 30k+ shield on all my party members to soften the blow. In addition, the magicka aid passive in that same skill tree increases your magicka regeneration by up to 10% for each support tree skill on your bar. I don't run out of magicka often, but if I were concerned with sustainability, I could easily put purge on my primary bar as well to give me 20% more magicka regen.

This is how I set up my bars when I'm main healing as a sorcerer. This may seem like overkill, but it works for me.

---Primary bar---
1. Blessing of Protection -> Combat Prayer:
A nice burst heal that also increases your group members' damage and defense. If you don't anticipate being in range of your group members during a fight, this could be switched out for purge, a DPS skill, the healing morph of necrotic orb, etc.

2. Regeneration -> Mutagen:
A heal over time than can do a small amount of burst healing if your group members have low health, plus it removes a debuff when that effect triggers (rapid regeneration is also an excellent morph because it heals faster over time; I've just always preferred mutagen) I can switch out this skill for crystal fragments, liquid lightning, mage's fury, etc. if I want a little more DPS. If you got the nightflame helmet and should piece set from the undaunted pledges, rapid regeneration may be the better morph because there are more frequent healing ticks which means more opportunities for the set bonus to proc.

3. Grand Healing -> Healing Springs:
A must-have for a sorcerer healer. I know some people who use illustrious healing because it lasts longer. I prefer springs because it helps with sustainability. Keep in mind, you don't have to cast this skill and wait for it to end before casting it again. If you spam this skill over and over, you don't have to wait the 1 second between ticks; which is very useful when you're taking a lot of damage over time. This is another reason why the springs morph is better in my opinion.

4. Steadfast Ward -> Healing Ward:
Another must-have in my opinion. I have enough cost reduction and magicka regen than I can spam this skill for a long time if my group is taking a lot of damage and is too spread out for healing springs. I use the healing morph because I PVP a lot, but Ward Ally isn't bad in my opinion. It gives you a guaranteed shield on yourself and an ally, and mutagen/springs can heal whomever is being shielded since the ward won't heal them when it expires.

5. Magelight -> Inner Light:
An extremely useful toggle that I keep on both bars when I'm main healing. The increase to critical chance means that your healing spells (including each tick from a HoT spell) have a chance to heal more. In addition, the magicka controller passive in the mage's guild skill tree gives you up to 2% more magicka and magicka regen for each mage's guild ability that you have slotted. That 2% stacks with the 2% magicka increase you already receive from the inner light morph.

U. Barrier -> Reviving Barrier:
As I mentioned above, this is my form of a "big heal." I use the reviving morph because the shield is actually a little stronger than the other morph, and the HoT effect it has means I can use dark conversion to recover magicka without having to worry about healing my group members for a few seconds; but both morphs of this skill are great. Once I fully upgrade the reviving morph to rank 4, I will probably go back to replenishing barrier. The shield is a little weaker, but it gives you back magicka and ultimate when it expires off over whomever received it. More ultimate means you have access to it more often.

If you don't PVP, any sorcerer ultimate could go here to get extra spell power from the expert mage passive. Meteor from the mage's guild tree is also an option for extra magicka and magicka regen from the mage's guild passives.

---Secondary bar---

1. Surge -> Power Surge:
This morph increases your spell power, which increases the amount of health restored by your heals. This skill could be substituted for entropy from the mage's guild tree, but I prefer surge because I can apply it outside of combat, and it's more effective in trash monster pulls because you don't constantly have to look for a target in order to reapply the effect. Entropy (and my preferred morph, degeneration) is useful during boss fights or against enemies that don't die after only a few seconds.

2. Circle of Protection -> Ring of Preservation:
This is a nice buff to apply to your group; it reduces the damage they take by 8% and gives them 20% more health regen. In addition, it gives the group members more incentive to stay close together so that the tank can easily taunt enemies, and everyone can get the healing from springs/combat prayer. Keep in mind that this skill costs stamina, and you drop the circle under your feet; so you'll have to run into the middle of battle to apply it, then run back out. I swap this skill out a lot depending on the situation. If I'm in a fight which requires frequent CC breaks, I don't use this skill because I already have limited stamina.

I can replace it with a DPS skill, annulment -> harness magicka from the light armor tree for another damage shield, bolt escape for added mobility, mutagen/combat prayer if I swapped them off my primary bar, necrotic orb or its morph, purge if the enemy has anything purgeable, encase to help keep enemies bundled together, etc.

If you swapped something off your primary bar as well, you could potentially put winged twilight -> restoring twilight in this slot for added DPS, plus that morph increases magicka regen for you and nearby group members. Weakness to elements and force siphon are also options depending on which staff you have equipped for this bar.

3. Dark Exchange -> Dark Conversion:
My emergency magicka supply when my potions are on cool down. If you're comfortable with your magicka sustain, or stamina/CC breaking is a concern for a fight, this can easily be swapped out for something else. A nice combo is to swap this out for bolt escape while ring of preservation is on your bar. You can then bolt escape into battle (potentially stunning some enemies as you go), put down a ring, then bolt escape to a safe distance.

4. Conjured Ward -> Empowered Ward:
I personally use the empowered ward morph because of reasons stated in my signature, but I imagine most people go with hardened ward for a stronger shield. If you like using the restoring twilight for DPS and magicka regen, empowering ward can increase her damage. If you swap both ring of preservation and dark exchange off your secondary bar, and a skill off your primary bar, you would have slots for twilight and daedric curse -> daedric prey which would increase her damage further. Empowered ward and daedric prey would also increase the damage of your atronach if you chose to use it on this bar.

5. Magelight -> Inner Light:
Because toggles.

U. Meteor:
This ultimate slot changes frequently too. If I'm lagging really hard, I may put barrier on this bar so that I won't have to worry about my bar swap failing in an emergency (yes this is a major concern; lag is a mechanic which has to be taken into consideration). Negate is also an option for added utility. I use the suppression field morph because it reduces damage taken by 8% (does not stack with ring of preservation). The atronach is nice for an AOE stun, and the it's better than meteor for DPSing bosses which move around a lot. I typically keep meteor in this slot though because the extra magicka I get from the mage's guild passives increases the damage the shields on this bar can absorb.

Overload would give you access to a third bar for utility skills. I've only put overload on this bar a few times, and that was just to provide rapid maneuvers to the group so we could move through the dungeon faster. It may be worthwhile to put dark exchange on this bar if you don't anticipate using it much. I personally don't benefit much from having a third bar as my healer.

cschwingeb14_ESO

So much BS in this thread. Templars are far and away better healer/support than any other class. DW all by itself is 400 more spell damage (including extra set bonus), and templars are the only class that can use that weapon for primary healing. The disparity is so large that I'm willing to bet that a Templar not using resto staff at all can heal as well other classes that are required to use one.

Other classes need to have significant healing/support abilities added before they can come close. ie, NB funnel health. But that's still not enough.

Ditto for emergency healing. Healing ward is OK, but it's not nearly as good as BoL. Ults cannot be counted here.

I'm not saying that content can't be completed the way balance is right now, because it obviously can. Plenty of content can be completed by having a tank/healer and 3 DPS. Or even 3-manned by a decent group

I'm saying that in a group with mediocre/undergeared DPS and/or tanks, a Templar healer has much more ability to help that group complete content than any other class.

Chieve

Nahz wrote: »

Chieve wrote: »

Thanks everyone for your helpful info

Ibe been repeating dungeons on my healer and been doing great as a sorcerer.

Only tricky part is I run out of mana most of the time so I gotta carefully time my cool downs good..IIake sure to use my Aman pots early in boss fights and every time my ultimate pops up (I for get the skill tree but it's the one that summons a giant lightening rock that kills people with lightening) I always use...it's actually very helpful since he can take some damage away from my teammates lol

Biggest difficulty is boss fights near hall ways. A boss that uses red in the hall way makes everyone take so much damage which is difficult to heal...just because it's hard to avoid...

I don't know if you PVP, but I always run barrier on my primary bar when I'm healing as my sorcerer; it's my version of a "big heal" except I can use it proactively instead of reactively. If I know a big damage skill is coming, I can pop a nice 30k+ shield on all my party members to soften the blow. In addition, the magicka aid passive in that same skill tree increases your magicka regeneration by up to 10% for each support tree skill on your bar. I don't run out of magicka often, but if I were concerned with sustainability, I could easily put purge on my primary bar as well to give me 20% more magicka regen.

This is how I set up my bars when I'm main healing as a sorcerer. This may seem like overkill, but it works for me.

---Primary bar---
1. Blessing of Protection -> Combat Prayer:
A nice burst heal that also increases your group members' damage and defense. If you don't anticipate being in range of your group members during a fight, this could be switched out for purge, a DPS skill, the healing morph of necrotic orb, etc.

2. Regeneration -> Mutagen:
A heal over time than can do a small amount of burst healing if your group members have low health, plus it removes a debuff when that effect triggers (rapid regeneration is also an excellent morph because it heals faster over time; I've just always preferred mutagen) I can switch out this skill for crystal fragments, liquid lightning, mage's fury, etc. if I want a little more DPS. If you got the nightflame helmet and should piece set from the undaunted pledges, rapid regeneration may be the better morph because there are more frequent healing ticks which means more opportunities for the set bonus to proc.

3. Grand Healing -> Healing Springs:
A must-have for a sorcerer healer. I know some people who use illustrious healing because it lasts longer. I prefer springs because it helps with sustainability. Keep in mind, you don't have to cast this skill and wait for it to end before casting it again. If you spam this skill over and over, you don't have to wait the 1 second between ticks; which is very useful when you're taking a lot of damage over time. This is another reason why the springs morph is better in my opinion.

4. Steadfast Ward -> Healing Ward:
Another must-have in my opinion. I have enough cost reduction and magicka regen than I can spam this skill for a long time if my group is taking a lot of damage and is too spread out for healing springs. I use the healing morph because I PVP a lot, but Ward Ally isn't bad in my opinion. It gives you a guaranteed shield on yourself and an ally, and mutagen/springs can heal whomever is being shielded since the ward won't heal them when it expires.

5. Magelight -> Inner Light:
An extremely useful toggle that I keep on both bars when I'm main healing. The increase to critical chance means that your healing spells (including each tick from a HoT spell) have a chance to heal more. In addition, the magicka controller passive in the mage's guild skill tree gives you up to 2% more magicka and magicka regen for each mage's guild ability that you have slotted. That 2% stacks with the 2% magicka increase you already receive from the inner light morph.

U. Barrier -> Reviving Barrier:
As I mentioned above, this is my form of a "big heal." I use the reviving morph because the shield is actually a little stronger than the other morph, and the HoT effect it has means I can use dark conversion to recover magicka without having to worry about healing my group members for a few seconds; but both morphs of this skill are great. Once I fully upgrade the reviving morph to rank 4, I will probably go back to replenishing barrier. The shield is a little weaker, but it gives you back magicka and ultimate when it expires off over whomever received it. More ultimate means you have access to it more often.

If you don't PVP, any sorcerer ultimate could go here to get extra spell power from the expert mage passive. Meteor from the mage's guild tree is also an option for extra magicka and magicka regen from the mage's guild passives.

---Secondary bar---

1. Surge -> Power Surge:
This morph increases your spell power, which increases the amount of health restored by your heals. This skill could be substituted for entropy from the mage's guild tree, but I prefer surge because I can apply it outside of combat, and it's more effective in trash monster pulls because you don't constantly have to look for a target in order to reapply the effect. Entropy (and my preferred morph, degeneration) is useful during boss fights or against enemies that don't die after only a few seconds.

2. Circle of Protection -> Ring of Preservation:
This is a nice buff to apply to your group; it reduces the damage they take by 8% and gives them 20% more health regen. In addition, it gives the group members more incentive to stay close together so that the tank can easily taunt enemies, and everyone can get the healing from springs/combat prayer. Keep in mind that this skill costs stamina, and you drop the circle under your feet; so you'll have to run into the middle of battle to apply it, then run back out. I swap this skill out a lot depending on the situation. If I'm in a fight which requires frequent CC breaks, I don't use this skill because I already have limited stamina.

I can replace it with a DPS skill, annulment -> harness magicka from the light armor tree for another damage shield, bolt escape for added mobility, mutagen/combat prayer if I swapped them off my primary bar, necrotic orb or its morph, purge if the enemy has anything purgeable, encase to help keep enemies bundled together, etc.

If you swapped something off your primary bar as well, you could potentially put winged twilight -> restoring twilight in this slot for added DPS, plus that morph increases magicka regen for you and nearby group members. Weakness to elements and force siphon are also options depending on which staff you have equipped for this bar.

3. Dark Exchange -> Dark Conversion:
My emergency magicka supply when my potions are on cool down. If you're comfortable with your magicka sustain, or stamina/CC breaking is a concern for a fight, this can easily be swapped out for something else. A nice combo is to swap this out for bolt escape while ring of preservation is on your bar. You can then bolt escape into battle (potentially stunning some enemies as you go), put down a ring, then bolt escape to a safe distance.

4. Conjured Ward -> Empowered Ward:
I personally use the empowered ward morph because of reasons stated in my signature, but I imagine most people go with hardened ward for a stronger shield. If you like using the restoring twilight for DPS and magicka regen, empowering ward can increase her damage. If you swap both ring of preservation and dark exchange off your secondary bar, and a skill off your primary bar, you would have slots for twilight and daedric curse -> daedric prey which would increase her damage further. Empowered ward and daedric prey would also increase the damage of your atronach if you chose to use it on this bar.

5. Magelight -> Inner Light:
Because toggles.

U. Meteor:
This ultimate slot changes frequently too. If I'm lagging really hard, I may put barrier on this bar so that I won't have to worry about my bar swap failing in an emergency (yes this is a major concern; lag is a mechanic which has to be taken into consideration). Negate is also an option for added utility. I use the suppression field morph because it reduces damage taken by 8% (does not stack with ring of preservation). The atronach is nice for an AOE stun, and the it's better than meteor for DPSing bosses which move around a lot. I typically keep meteor in this slot though because the extra magicka I get from the mage's guild passives increases the damage the shields on this bar can absorb.

Overload would give you access to a third bar for utility skills. I've only put overload on this bar a few times, and that was just to provide rapid maneuvers to the group so we could move through the dungeon faster. It may be worthwhile to put dark exchange on this bar if you don't anticipate using it much. I personally don't benefit much from having a third bar as my healer.

Do console players have a 2nd bar?

Nahz

Chieve wrote: »

Nahz wrote: »

Chieve wrote: »

Thanks everyone for your helpful info

Ibe been repeating dungeons on my healer and been doing great as a sorcerer.

Only tricky part is I run out of mana most of the time so I gotta carefully time my cool downs good..IIake sure to use my Aman pots early in boss fights and every time my ultimate pops up (I for get the skill tree but it's the one that summons a giant lightening rock that kills people with lightening) I always use...it's actually very helpful since he can take some damage away from my teammates lol

Biggest difficulty is boss fights near hall ways. A boss that uses red in the hall way makes everyone take so much damage which is difficult to heal...just because it's hard to avoid...

I don't know if you PVP, but I always run barrier on my primary bar when I'm healing as my sorcerer; it's my version of a "big heal" except I can use it proactively instead of reactively. If I know a big damage skill is coming, I can pop a nice 30k+ shield on all my party members to soften the blow. In addition, the magicka aid passive in that same skill tree increases your magicka regeneration by up to 10% for each support tree skill on your bar. I don't run out of magicka often, but if I were concerned with sustainability, I could easily put purge on my primary bar as well to give me 20% more magicka regen.

This is how I set up my bars when I'm main healing as a sorcerer. This may seem like overkill, but it works for me.

---Primary bar---
1. Blessing of Protection -> Combat Prayer:
A nice burst heal that also increases your group members' damage and defense. If you don't anticipate being in range of your group members during a fight, this could be switched out for purge, a DPS skill, the healing morph of necrotic orb, etc.

2. Regeneration -> Mutagen:
A heal over time than can do a small amount of burst healing if your group members have low health, plus it removes a debuff when that effect triggers (rapid regeneration is also an excellent morph because it heals faster over time; I've just always preferred mutagen) I can switch out this skill for crystal fragments, liquid lightning, mage's fury, etc. if I want a little more DPS. If you got the nightflame helmet and should piece set from the undaunted pledges, rapid regeneration may be the better morph because there are more frequent healing ticks which means more opportunities for the set bonus to proc.

3. Grand Healing -> Healing Springs:
A must-have for a sorcerer healer. I know some people who use illustrious healing because it lasts longer. I prefer springs because it helps with sustainability. Keep in mind, you don't have to cast this skill and wait for it to end before casting it again. If you spam this skill over and over, you don't have to wait the 1 second between ticks; which is very useful when you're taking a lot of damage over time. This is another reason why the springs morph is better in my opinion.

4. Steadfast Ward -> Healing Ward:
Another must-have in my opinion. I have enough cost reduction and magicka regen than I can spam this skill for a long time if my group is taking a lot of damage and is too spread out for healing springs. I use the healing morph because I PVP a lot, but Ward Ally isn't bad in my opinion. It gives you a guaranteed shield on yourself and an ally, and mutagen/springs can heal whomever is being shielded since the ward won't heal them when it expires.

5. Magelight -> Inner Light:
An extremely useful toggle that I keep on both bars when I'm main healing. The increase to critical chance means that your healing spells (including each tick from a HoT spell) have a chance to heal more. In addition, the magicka controller passive in the mage's guild skill tree gives you up to 2% more magicka and magicka regen for each mage's guild ability that you have slotted. That 2% stacks with the 2% magicka increase you already receive from the inner light morph.

U. Barrier -> Reviving Barrier:
As I mentioned above, this is my form of a "big heal." I use the reviving morph because the shield is actually a little stronger than the other morph, and the HoT effect it has means I can use dark conversion to recover magicka without having to worry about healing my group members for a few seconds; but both morphs of this skill are great. Once I fully upgrade the reviving morph to rank 4, I will probably go back to replenishing barrier. The shield is a little weaker, but it gives you back magicka and ultimate when it expires off over whomever received it. More ultimate means you have access to it more often.

If you don't PVP, any sorcerer ultimate could go here to get extra spell power from the expert mage passive. Meteor from the mage's guild tree is also an option for extra magicka and magicka regen from the mage's guild passives.

---Secondary bar---

1. Surge -> Power Surge:
This morph increases your spell power, which increases the amount of health restored by your heals. This skill could be substituted for entropy from the mage's guild tree, but I prefer surge because I can apply it outside of combat, and it's more effective in trash monster pulls because you don't constantly have to look for a target in order to reapply the effect. Entropy (and my preferred morph, degeneration) is useful during boss fights or against enemies that don't die after only a few seconds.

2. Circle of Protection -> Ring of Preservation:
This is a nice buff to apply to your group; it reduces the damage they take by 8% and gives them 20% more health regen. In addition, it gives the group members more incentive to stay close together so that the tank can easily taunt enemies, and everyone can get the healing from springs/combat prayer. Keep in mind that this skill costs stamina, and you drop the circle under your feet; so you'll have to run into the middle of battle to apply it, then run back out. I swap this skill out a lot depending on the situation. If I'm in a fight which requires frequent CC breaks, I don't use this skill because I already have limited stamina.

I can replace it with a DPS skill, annulment -> harness magicka from the light armor tree for another damage shield, bolt escape for added mobility, mutagen/combat prayer if I swapped them off my primary bar, necrotic orb or its morph, purge if the enemy has anything purgeable, encase to help keep enemies bundled together, etc.

If you swapped something off your primary bar as well, you could potentially put winged twilight -> restoring twilight in this slot for added DPS, plus that morph increases magicka regen for you and nearby group members. Weakness to elements and force siphon are also options depending on which staff you have equipped for this bar.

3. Dark Exchange -> Dark Conversion:
My emergency magicka supply when my potions are on cool down. If you're comfortable with your magicka sustain, or stamina/CC breaking is a concern for a fight, this can easily be swapped out for something else. A nice combo is to swap this out for bolt escape while ring of preservation is on your bar. You can then bolt escape into battle (potentially stunning some enemies as you go), put down a ring, then bolt escape to a safe distance.

4. Conjured Ward -> Empowered Ward:
I personally use the empowered ward morph because of reasons stated in my signature, but I imagine most people go with hardened ward for a stronger shield. If you like using the restoring twilight for DPS and magicka regen, empowering ward can increase her damage. If you swap both ring of preservation and dark exchange off your secondary bar, and a skill off your primary bar, you would have slots for twilight and daedric curse -> daedric prey which would increase her damage further. Empowered ward and daedric prey would also increase the damage of your atronach if you chose to use it on this bar.

5. Magelight -> Inner Light:
Because toggles.

U. Meteor:
This ultimate slot changes frequently too. If I'm lagging really hard, I may put barrier on this bar so that I won't have to worry about my bar swap failing in an emergency (yes this is a major concern; lag is a mechanic which has to be taken into consideration). Negate is also an option for added utility. I use the suppression field morph because it reduces damage taken by 8% (does not stack with ring of preservation). The atronach is nice for an AOE stun, and the it's better than meteor for DPSing bosses which move around a lot. I typically keep meteor in this slot though because the extra magicka I get from the mage's guild passives increases the damage the shields on this bar can absorb.

Overload would give you access to a third bar for utility skills. I've only put overload on this bar a few times, and that was just to provide rapid maneuvers to the group so we could move through the dungeon faster. It may be worthwhile to put dark exchange on this bar if you don't anticipate using it much. I personally don't benefit much from having a third bar as my healer.

Do console players have a 2nd bar?

Yes. I don't play on console, so I can't tell you which button it is; but the second bar is unlocked at level 15.

Chieve

Oh okay thanks me and my friend just got level 14, so it's something to look forward too

Tankqull

Thraben wrote: »

3. thats garbage healing ward is by far the most effective "burst" heal by either covering up the traget with an extreme powerful shield while your hots are still ticking or a heal of

Allowing the target to be in execute range just to make the bubble powerful enough is more a sign of courage than of flexibility. A templar can decide if it should be dared, every other healer can´t.

i only do need a burst heal if someone droped down significantly otherwise hots are more than enough to handle the incoming dmg, so if the target is droping larger chunks of life temp burst heals are enpair with healing ward not better but in some rare situation even weaker. thus burst healing anyone not droping signifcantly is a waste in itself regardless if it is BoL/HtD or HW.

Zsymon

Imo Sorcs are better PvE healers and especially far better PvP healers. A templar healer in PvP won't last more than a second once focused, while a Sorc just keeps on going, and in PvE BoL is just about convenience, not healing power, with Sorc having far superior spamming ability.

Flaminir

Zsymon wrote: »

Imo Sorcs are better PvE healers and especially far better PvP healers. A templar healer in PvP won't last more than a second once focused, while a Sorc just keeps on going, and in PvE BoL is just about convenience, not healing power, with Sorc having far superior spamming ability.

Far superior spamming ability?

This is another example of poor info & people believing the hype....

Everything that's in the resto tree & racials are available to anybody no matter what class.... so do you know that the difference between Sorcs & Templars is?

10% magicka regen.... that's it!

That's the only difference. & there are Templar skills that will help with magicka regen too.

I'll repeat what I said earlier.... the myth that Sorcs can spam forever & never run out of magicka, and that Templars always run out is just that.... a myth. 10% regen is good but doesn't make the build. If you are not able to spam and spam resto heals as a Templar then it's purely down to the gear & build.... nothing to do with the class.

P.S. As a Templar healer in PvP... they last just fine & not 1 second! ;o) In fact... with the high spike damage in PvP and such a low time to kill... Templars breath of life is regularly a life saver... and not something that's easy to replicate using resto skills only a la Sorc.

Sorcs can complete most content as a healer just fine & it's the player that makes the class..... but they can never be as powerful as a pure healer than a Templar as they have no skills or passives to help with this.

OrphanHelgen

sure you can spam springs.. who cant?

But to answer: no, you cant

newtinmpls

I'm thinking that if you are just spamming things, that's not a very thoughtful proactive type of play.

Halke

cschwingeb14_ESO wrote: »

So much BS in this thread. Templars are far and away better healer/support than any other class. DW all by itself is 400 more spell damage (including extra set bonus), and templars are the only class that can use that weapon for primary healing. The disparity is so large that I'm willing to bet that a Templar not using resto staff at all can heal as well other classes that are required to use one.

Other classes need to have significant healing/support abilities added before they can come close. ie, NB funnel health. But that's still not enough.

Ditto for emergency healing. Healing ward is OK, but it's not nearly as good as BoL. Ults cannot be counted here.

I'm not saying that content can't be completed the way balance is right now, because it obviously can. Plenty of content can be completed by having a tank/healer and 3 DPS. Or even 3-manned by a decent group

I'm saying that in a group with mediocre/undergeared DPS and/or tanks, a Templar healer has much more ability to help that group complete content than any other class.

So uh, ...no. We run vCOA without a healer. I slot a destro staff and my master daggers. My siphoning is more than enough to keep the group up. If I need to be healing hard I will run a resto/destro. We run low DPS all the time, that is how you see who needs help and where. Haven't had an issue yet.

Chieve

Why do people say "most" dungeons...why not all?

Francescolg

I'll not write as long as every other guy :-)
1. Just try putting Crystal Fragments on both your heal bars and look how many times you will have a 10k+ Crystal Fragments skill up as a sorc healer. Than we'll talk again, who is the best PvP-healer of them...
2. Do not believe people who flame others, their arguments are worth nothing. In this thread it's mostly the pro-templar guys. Make your own conclusions! (a flame is also to say: "this post is full of b.lls.it")
3. I'll not mention anything else, as escapeability, class absorb shield, etc (although they matter very much in PvP)
4. "Static healing" + too many channeled/slow animated skills < High damage + survivability + healing



@TE GET the atronach mundus stone for ~300 magicka regen! very important!

failkiwib16_ESO

felinith66 wrote: »

On a side note, I discovered that Blessing of Restoration from the Resto staff, is significantly faster and heals as much as BOL

Blessing of protection is good, specially if you morph it to combat prayer, unfortunately the dps and tank never lines up. I removed it from my healing bar and slotted Healing Springs instead

My BoL crits for 13k-14k, is instant and heals in a 360 degree radius of 28 meters around me. I've never seen Blessing of Protection heal that much.

---

OP making a sorcerer healer is viable, but it is making things for yourself harder. You will in some situations be better than a templar, but overall, if all things were equal, then you will never beat a templar. You will also not be as trusted as a templar, if you choose to join random groups for dungeons.

-All your passives are egoistic. None of them goes to support your team mates.

-You will often have to remind your group to gather and stack in situations, where templar healers can let their team place themselves whereever they please.

-Take for instance the Lich boss in Wayrest Sewers, it will leech you and your teams health unless you are organized, and the team places themselvesi within the range of your healing springs, then they will wipe - also to mention that the boss spawns adds that will snare you and your team, so moving around can become difficult. - it seems is a difficult fight for a non templar healer, but fairly easy for a templar.

-The Ash Titan and Valkyn Skoria will be difficult bosses to handle, if you are sorcerer healer, because the group will split and you'll have to put healing on different areas - while being on plane level, which means you have to deal with targeting your healing springs at a moving target, while you and your whole team takes heavy damage. Targeting different areas can be difficult if you are on plane grounds.

-In cases where your team have taken significant damage, are split up and about to recieve more damage- you will not be able to heal them in all directions with 1-2 spells instantly casted - Templars can do this.

-In cases where your team have taken significant damage, are split up and about to recieve more damage- you will not be able to heal them in all directions with 1-2 spells instantly casted - Templars can do this.

-In the upcomming patches, blocking will prohibid stamina regen. You will not be able to provide stamina, stamina regen, magicka regen or buff your dps with minor sorcerery. Templars can do this.

-In case someone on your team dies and you need to ressurrect them, templars will be able to ressurect them significantly faster, and provide them with a bit more health, magicka and stamina upon the ressurection.

---

You can play as you want in this game, but your options limit how good you will become at the role you choose.

kupacmac

Halke wrote: »

cschwingeb14_ESO wrote: »

So much BS in this thread. Templars are far and away better healer/support than any other class. DW all by itself is 400 more spell damage (including extra set bonus), and templars are the only class that can use that weapon for primary healing. The disparity is so large that I'm willing to bet that a Templar not using resto staff at all can heal as well other classes that are required to use one.

Other classes need to have significant healing/support abilities added before they can come close. ie, NB funnel health. But that's still not enough.

Ditto for emergency healing. Healing ward is OK, but it's not nearly as good as BoL. Ults cannot be counted here.

I'm not saying that content can't be completed the way balance is right now, because it obviously can. Plenty of content can be completed by having a tank/healer and 3 DPS. Or even 3-manned by a decent group

I'm saying that in a group with mediocre/undergeared DPS and/or tanks, a Templar healer has much more ability to help that group complete content than any other class.

So uh, ...no. We run vCOA without a healer. I slot a destro staff and my master daggers. My siphoning is more than enough to keep the group up. If I need to be healing hard I will run a resto/destro. We run low DPS all the time, that is how you see who needs help and where. Haven't had an issue yet.

You're refuting and confirming what @cschwingeb14_ESO said all in one post. By your own admission you sometimes have to use a resto staff. Problem is, you can't switch to a different weapon set mid fight, so if you made the wrong decision you're SOL. Templars don't ever have to use a resto staff if they don't want to, even when they need to be healing hard. Their weapon choices never have to change at all and they'll be just as effective.