why shield stacking damages the whole meta

Oughash

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Potaholics Anonymous?

I run the UK branch of that. We offer 24hr counselling and have a rewards based system (you can get badges for every hour without pot, basically) to give people a sense of achievement. We have TS sessions where people share their horrendous experiences as pot addicts.

It's a strong support system and we encourage anyone with a pot problem to pay us a visit. Check out our website for more details:
www.NoMorePotsForYou.org

Haha! Yes, Potaholics Anonymous.

Back to the thread. To all sorcerors: please stand still and don't cast any defenses while I kill you next time. Just let me snipe you for 15k from stealth with my glass cannon build and home run you when I feel like getting close. Super cereal right now. You can pew pew your staff if you want. OH yeah -- you're not allowed to bolt escape either. And DKs: don't flapy-flap. I sometimes shoot myself when you do that.

DDuke

Morvul wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

the only counter to someone who's stacked up with massive shields is to stack as much burst as possible to burn the shield down and hopefully get them dead before they can stack more shields

this is were you are wrong.
The counter to shield-stacking in ESO is crowd-control

I know it's April Fools Day & all, but is this a joke or a real post?

CC in this game is almost non-existent and serves more as a stamina drain than anything else.

Now, I'm not going to say there aren't ways around damage shields.
Specifically, there is one wombo combo that allows you to instagib pretty much anyone (shields stacked or not).

That said, I disagree that PvP should revolve around stacking shields & instagibbing people. That is not my idea of fun, diverse PvP.

Maulkin

DDuke wrote: »

Morvul wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

the only counter to someone who's stacked up with massive shields is to stack as much burst as possible to burn the shield down and hopefully get them dead before they can stack more shields

this is were you are wrong.
The counter to shield-stacking in ESO is crowd-control

I know it's April Fools Day & all, but is this a joke or a real post?

CC in this game is almost non-existent and serves more as a stamina drain than anything else.

Now, I'm not going to say there aren't ways around damage shields.
Specifically, there is one wombo combo that allows you to instagib pretty much anyone (shields stacked or not).

That said, I disagree that PvP should revolve around stacking shields & instagibbing people. That is not my idea of fun, diverse PvP.

I kindly disagree.

There is a lot of CC. You're a NB, you know this works right? Fear, Fear, Fear.... Fear x 100.

The problem in this game is there's no good large AoE CC. Oil Catas get negated by a simple Purge and Caltrops get negated by Rapid Manoevres. Thus, there's no way to stop masses, but single players? there are plenty.

Anyhow, here's a 3-simple-step suggestion to stop shield stacking (if that's even a problem anymore):

1) Make Healing Ward a direct heal akin to Templar BoL. Great change for PvE healers too
2) Change Harness Magicka moprh to instead shield all damage instead of returning Magicka. So you either get a small shield against all damage or you get a large shield against magicka damage. Now NBs have a shield as well
3) AFTER the above two are done....remove shield stacking. The largest shield will apply only. So if I cast a barrier (largest shield in game) it will remove all previous shields from players. If I cast Hardened Ward, it will not replace my existing Barrier (smaller shield), unless my Barrier has take damage and is less than my HW.

How about that?

cozmon3c_ESO

i dont see how this changes anything, im already spamming Hardened ward hit for hit, ill just do the same purge for purge, and you will be like wtf why you get a chance to attack me after the global attack timer and my shield is already back up. go head an add it, its not going to help you.

if i have 4 people on me i usually dodge roll bolt away so you will still think i have god mode, go head and add this, i dont mind, its already ineffective to what i already do. ill make you chase me down and while your trying to cast you purge thing ill be bursting your healthbar to nothing, and then reapply my shield again.

so in theory you think this will be a good counter, but i will pick it up just to get that damn RS from DK down so i can actually hurt the mofo's. the only thing this skill is going to benefit is the perma dodge rollers that can cast while rolling lol. they will be purge rollers after that, they will just roll through zergs purging everyone lols.

Rylana

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Morvul wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

the only counter to someone who's stacked up with massive shields is to stack as much burst as possible to burn the shield down and hopefully get them dead before they can stack more shields

this is were you are wrong.
The counter to shield-stacking in ESO is crowd-control

I know it's April Fools Day & all, but is this a joke or a real post?

CC in this game is almost non-existent and serves more as a stamina drain than anything else.

Now, I'm not going to say there aren't ways around damage shields.
Specifically, there is one wombo combo that allows you to instagib pretty much anyone (shields stacked or not).

That said, I disagree that PvP should revolve around stacking shields & instagibbing people. That is not my idea of fun, diverse PvP.

I kindly disagree.

There is a lot of CC. You're a NB, you know this works right? Fear, Fear, Fear.... Fear x 100.

The problem in this game is there's no good large AoE CC. Oil Catas get negated by a simple Purge and Caltrops get negated by Rapid Manoevres. Thus, there's no way to stop masses, but single players? there are plenty.

Anyhow, here's a 3-simple-step suggestion to stop shield stacking (if that's even a problem anymore):

1) Make Healing Ward a direct heal like akin to Templar BoL. Great change for PvE healers too
2) Change Harness Magicka moprh to instead shield from all damage. So you either get a small shield against all damage or you get a large shield against magicka damage. Now NBs have a shield as well
3) ONCE the above two are done....remove shield stacking. The largest shield will apply only. So if I cast a barrier (largest shield in game) it will remove all previous shields from players. If I cast Hardened Ward, it will not replace my existing Barrier (smaller shield).

How about that?

I see your group of 20 running rapids and purges

I raise you six fear spamming nightblades on the breach + 14 people coming in to bomb you as you cross.

99 percent of the time, I will win. (Fear is the zerg killer)

Maulkin

Rylana wrote: »

I see your group of 20 running rapids and purges

I raise you six fear spamming nightblades on the breach + 14 people coming in to bomb you as you cross.

99 percent of the time, I will win. (Fear is the zerg killer)

I see you and I raise you one Immovable pot, one Absoption Field (Negate) on the breach, one Barrier and 6 Fire trebs shooting at it while we cross with everyone spamming Healing Springs and Vigor.

Your move little NB.

c0rp

The players cried and moaned until sorcs had their mobility and escape ability destroyed. Now they use shields. Now players will cry and moan until sorcs have their defense destroyed. It wont be long before sorcs are equivalent to 2004-2005 World of Warcraft Warlocks...aka, a free kill.

cozmon3c_ESO

c0rp wrote: »

The players cried and moaned until sorcs had their mobility and escape ability destroyed. Now they use shields. Now players will cry and moan until sorcs have their defense destroyed. It wont be long before sorcs are equivalent to 2004-2005 World of Warcraft Warlocks...aka, a free kill.

fear spam op

c0rp

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

they will be purge rollers after that, they will just roll through zergs purging everyone lols.

This made me lol..."ball of purge"

Oughash

c0rp wrote: »

The players cried and moaned until sorcs had their mobility and escape ability destroyed. Now they use shields. Now players will cry and moan until sorcs have their defense destroyed. It wont be long before sorcs are equivalent to 2004-2005 World of Warcraft Warlocks...aka, a free kill.

God, do you remember Rogues during the first year or so of WoW? (that's all I played)
Reeeediculous invisibility, CC, burst.

frozywozy

If we ever come to incorporating a purge ability to remove enemy buffs, there will be multiple new OPS that will need fixing. All burst classes will get instant kills and it will be ganker paradize. I'm not into this one unless we also nerf the burst wombo combo builds. Dispel into fear into rapid strike into soul harvest on a 7/7 LA = gg.

DDuke

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Morvul wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

the only counter to someone who's stacked up with massive shields is to stack as much burst as possible to burn the shield down and hopefully get them dead before they can stack more shields

this is were you are wrong.
The counter to shield-stacking in ESO is crowd-control

I know it's April Fools Day & all, but is this a joke or a real post?

CC in this game is almost non-existent and serves more as a stamina drain than anything else.

Now, I'm not going to say there aren't ways around damage shields.
Specifically, there is one wombo combo that allows you to instagib pretty much anyone (shields stacked or not).

That said, I disagree that PvP should revolve around stacking shields & instagibbing people. That is not my idea of fun, diverse PvP.

I kindly disagree.

There is a lot of CC. You're a NB, you know this works right? Fear, Fear, Fear.... Fear x 100.

The problem in this game is there's no good large AoE CC. Oil Catas get negated by a simple Purge and Caltrops get negated by Rapid Manoevres. Thus, there's no way to stop masses, but single players? there are plenty.

Anyhow, here's a 3-simple-step suggestion to stop shield stacking (if that's even a problem anymore):

1) Make Healing Ward a direct heal akin to Templar BoL. Great change for PvE healers too
2) Change Harness Magicka moprh to instead shield from all damage. So you either get a small shield against all damage or you get a large shield against magicka damage. Now NBs have a shield as well
3) AFTER the above two are done....remove shield stacking. The largest shield will apply only. So if I cast a barrier (largest shield in game) it will remove all previous shields from players. If I cast Hardened Ward, it will not replace my existing Barrier (smaller shield).

How about that?

Yes, I agree there should be AoE CC, but as long as CC is breakable 99% of the time, you can't really call it "crowd control".
It's more like "stamina drain" when fighting against even moderately good players.

If you want to see how CC actually looks like, take a look at other MMOs like WoW, SWTOR, Rift etc...

You can use the CC to actually tactically control your opponents, instead of just to drain their stamina, which brings a whole another layer of depth & skill to the game.

I'm not saying you should be able to stunlock a target from 100->0, but at the very least CCs that break from damage (like Agony, Rune Prison etc) anyhow should be unbreakable (or cost like 100% stamina to break).

That way you'd atleast somewhat fix the boring "CC (breaks immediately) -> wait until swirly circle disappears while animation canceling attacks -> CC (breaks immediately ) -> wait until swirly circle disappears... ad infinitum" meta.

Sphinx2318

Do you even shield stack bro?

Maulkin

DDuke wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Morvul wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

the only counter to someone who's stacked up with massive shields is to stack as much burst as possible to burn the shield down and hopefully get them dead before they can stack more shields

this is were you are wrong.
The counter to shield-stacking in ESO is crowd-control

I know it's April Fools Day & all, but is this a joke or a real post?

CC in this game is almost non-existent and serves more as a stamina drain than anything else.

Now, I'm not going to say there aren't ways around damage shields.
Specifically, there is one wombo combo that allows you to instagib pretty much anyone (shields stacked or not).

That said, I disagree that PvP should revolve around stacking shields & instagibbing people. That is not my idea of fun, diverse PvP.

I kindly disagree.

There is a lot of CC. You're a NB, you know this works right? Fear, Fear, Fear.... Fear x 100.

The problem in this game is there's no good large AoE CC. Oil Catas get negated by a simple Purge and Caltrops get negated by Rapid Manoevres. Thus, there's no way to stop masses, but single players? there are plenty.

Anyhow, here's a 3-simple-step suggestion to stop shield stacking (if that's even a problem anymore):

1) Make Healing Ward a direct heal akin to Templar BoL. Great change for PvE healers too
2) Change Harness Magicka moprh to instead shield from all damage. So you either get a small shield against all damage or you get a large shield against magicka damage. Now NBs have a shield as well
3) AFTER the above two are done....remove shield stacking. The largest shield will apply only. So if I cast a barrier (largest shield in game) it will remove all previous shields from players. If I cast Hardened Ward, it will not replace my existing Barrier (smaller shield).

How about that?

Yes, I agree there should be AoE CC, but as long as CC is breakable 99% of the time, you can't really call it "crowd control".
It's more like "stamina drain" when fighting against even moderately good players.

If you want to see how CC actually looks like, take a look at other MMOs like WoW, Rift etc...

You can use the CC to actually tactically control your opponents, instead of just to drain their stamina, which brings a whole another layer of depth & skill to the game.

I'm not saying you should be able to stunlock a target from 100->0, but at the very least CCs that break from damage (like Agony, Rune Prison etc) anyhow should be unbreakable (or cost like 100% stamina to break).

That way you'd atleast somewhat fix the boring "CC (breaks immediately) -> wait until swirly circle disappears while animation canceling attacks -> CC (breaks immediately ) -> wait until swirly circle disappears... ad infinitum" meta.

Right, but the above games have cooldowns. You cannot do unbreakable CC or CC that costs 100% of stamina without cooldowns on those abilities. If Agony could not be broken you would just troll people all day long.

In ESO we have a resource system instead of cooldowns and that's unlikely to change, let's be honest. Thus CC is a resource drain. Thus all fights are resource fights. It's how ESO is.

My point was that 1v1 in this game is pretty balanced atm from what I see. I use shields, offensive spells and CC. You use dodge roll, weapons attacks and CC. Whoever runs out of resources first, loses.

The problems only manifest in a Many v Many scenarios.

PS: Also, unusual to me, we have unblockable CC that doesn't break on damage (Fear) which it did in WoW if I recall correctly.
#NerfFear. Just kidding

DDuke

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Morvul wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

the only counter to someone who's stacked up with massive shields is to stack as much burst as possible to burn the shield down and hopefully get them dead before they can stack more shields

this is were you are wrong.
The counter to shield-stacking in ESO is crowd-control

I know it's April Fools Day & all, but is this a joke or a real post?

CC in this game is almost non-existent and serves more as a stamina drain than anything else.

Now, I'm not going to say there aren't ways around damage shields.
Specifically, there is one wombo combo that allows you to instagib pretty much anyone (shields stacked or not).

That said, I disagree that PvP should revolve around stacking shields & instagibbing people. That is not my idea of fun, diverse PvP.

I kindly disagree.

There is a lot of CC. You're a NB, you know this works right? Fear, Fear, Fear.... Fear x 100.

The problem in this game is there's no good large AoE CC. Oil Catas get negated by a simple Purge and Caltrops get negated by Rapid Manoevres. Thus, there's no way to stop masses, but single players? there are plenty.

Anyhow, here's a 3-simple-step suggestion to stop shield stacking (if that's even a problem anymore):

1) Make Healing Ward a direct heal akin to Templar BoL. Great change for PvE healers too
2) Change Harness Magicka moprh to instead shield from all damage. So you either get a small shield against all damage or you get a large shield against magicka damage. Now NBs have a shield as well
3) AFTER the above two are done....remove shield stacking. The largest shield will apply only. So if I cast a barrier (largest shield in game) it will remove all previous shields from players. If I cast Hardened Ward, it will not replace my existing Barrier (smaller shield).

How about that?

Yes, I agree there should be AoE CC, but as long as CC is breakable 99% of the time, you can't really call it "crowd control".
It's more like "stamina drain" when fighting against even moderately good players.

If you want to see how CC actually looks like, take a look at other MMOs like WoW, Rift etc...

You can use the CC to actually tactically control your opponents, instead of just to drain their stamina, which brings a whole another layer of depth & skill to the game.

I'm not saying you should be able to stunlock a target from 100->0, but at the very least CCs that break from damage (like Agony, Rune Prison etc) anyhow should be unbreakable (or cost like 100% stamina to break).

That way you'd atleast somewhat fix the boring "CC (breaks immediately) -> wait until swirly circle disappears while animation canceling attacks -> CC (breaks immediately ) -> wait until swirly circle disappears... ad infinitum" meta.

Right, but the above games have cooldowns. You cannot do unbreakable CC or CC that costs 100% of stamina without cooldowns on those abilities. If Agony could not be broken you would just troll people all day long.

Yes, but they could implement separate cooldowns on either the CC effects, or the CC portion of skills themselves. And sure, you'd be able to take out a target for X seconds from a fight with Agony, but that's kind of the point. Maybe you could troll someone for X seconds, I don't see that as a big deal (this could even be "fixed" by making it breakable, but cost 75-100% stamina).
They could even keep the CC break in game, but implement a 1-2min cooldown on it. There are many options really, but sadly they took the dumbed down one.

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

In ESO we have a resource system instead of cooldowns and that's unlikely to change, let's be honest. Thus CC is a resource drain. Thus all fights are resource fights. It's how ESO is.

Yes, except when you instagib the target. This is actually the biggest problem I personally have with the game's PvP; monotonous fights with little to no tactical elements.
Makes you think whether this game would have got better scores & had better success if they didn't unnecessarily dumb things down.

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

My point was that 1v1 in this game is pretty balanced atm from what I see. I use shields, offensive spells and CC. You use dodge roll, weapons attacks and CC. Whoever runs out of resources first, loses.

Most of the time, yes. That said, dodge roll has multiple serious weaknesses, one being DK Whip which hits you whether you roll dodge or not (also breaks cloak...).

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

The problems only manifest in a Many v Many scenarios.

PS: Also, unusual to me, we have unblockable CC that doesn't break on damage (Fear) which it did in WoW if I recall correctly.
#NerfFear. Just kidding

Well, not sure I agree with that either (sorry, I'm not in agreeable mood today ). In XvX situations you can actually run out of health before you run out of stamina and/or magicka (if you get focused by multiple people), so that's actually where the problems aren't as severe.

Also, FYI you've got unblockable CC in form of Petrify, Rune Prison & Spear Shards as well.
Whether it breaks from damage or not is irrelevant (good opponents break those instantly no matter what).

Maulkin

@DDuke

If they added long immunities on the victim, for certain forms of CC I wouldn't have a problem. For example I get Agony'd for 20" and I can't break it. But when it runs out (or when I get damage) I get a 3 minute immunity to Agony. They would also have to have a maximum on the incoming damage on break and for 1-2" after break though. Because otherwise you go Agony->Meteor->Ambush and just kill everyone. Unbreakable CC is only OK if used strategically to remove people from combat, not for instagibbing people

Which brings us to the damage which I agree has been pretty high in 1.6. Which is why I also laugh when people want nerfs to Sorc wards. Nerfs to wards will require nerfing of damage, no two ways about it. Reduction to overall damage would be a good thing for small encounters but very bad for killing large groups with their ridiculous heals. If for example my frags went from 18k crits to 12k Crits, how do I pick people off a zerg of 20 that is spamming healing springs?

Finally, Petrify and in particular Rune Prison are nowhere near as bad as Fear currently. They both break when you take damage. On top of it, Rune Prison has a 1.5 cast time which is why nobody uses it for PvP, like Agony. Sorcs only use Defensive Rune which is an ad-hoc stun on some random target at the beginning of the encounter. Good spell but not on par with the others, unless you're up for trading Rune Prison with Fear or something?

DDuke

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

@DDuke

If they added long immunities on the victim, for certain forms of CC I wouldn't have a problem. For example I get Agony'd for 20" and I can't break it. But when it runs out (or when I get damage) I get a 3 minute immunity to Agony. They would also have to have a maximum on the incoming damage on hit and for 2" after break though. Because otherwise you go Agony->Meteor->Ambush and just kill everything. Unbreakable CC is only OK if used strategically to remove people from combat, not for instagibbing people

Which brings us to the damage which I agree has been pretty high in 1.6. Which is why I also laugh when people want nerfs to Sorc wards. Nerfs to wards will require nerfing of damage, no two ways about it. Reduction to overall damage would be a good thing for small encounters but very bad for killing large groups with their ridiculous heals. If for example my frags went from 18k crits to 12k Crits, how do I pick people off a zerg of 20 that is spamming healing springs?

Finally, Petrify and in particular Rune Prison are nowhere near as bad as Fear currently. They both break when you take damage. On top of it, Rune Prison has a 1.5 cast time which is why nobody uses it for PvP, like Agony. Sorcs only use Defensive Rune which is an ad-hoc stun on some random target at the beginning of the encounter. Good spell but not on par with the others, unless you're up for trading Rune Prison with Fear or something?

Fair enough.

Another way to adjust TTK is by increasing player health (with necessary adjustments to Blazing Shield, GDB, Igneous Shield & Bone Shield of course). By nerfing both dmg shield strength and damage itself, you only return to square one.

If there was (much) more health & more ways to effectively bypass damage shields, you'd see fights revolving more around health & less around stamina permablock/dodge roll or magicka dmg shield spam, while getting rid of most instagib problems.

As to how to pick off people from a zerg of 20 spamming healing springs... well, you can pick all 20 of them with a siege weapon these days

Maulkin

DDuke wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

@DDuke

If they added long immunities on the victim, for certain forms of CC I wouldn't have a problem. For example I get Agony'd for 20" and I can't break it. But when it runs out (or when I get damage) I get a 3 minute immunity to Agony. They would also have to have a maximum on the incoming damage on hit and for 2" after break though. Because otherwise you go Agony->Meteor->Ambush and just kill everything. Unbreakable CC is only OK if used strategically to remove people from combat, not for instagibbing people

Which brings us to the damage which I agree has been pretty high in 1.6. Which is why I also laugh when people want nerfs to Sorc wards. Nerfs to wards will require nerfing of damage, no two ways about it. Reduction to overall damage would be a good thing for small encounters but very bad for killing large groups with their ridiculous heals. If for example my frags went from 18k crits to 12k Crits, how do I pick people off a zerg of 20 that is spamming healing springs?

Finally, Petrify and in particular Rune Prison are nowhere near as bad as Fear currently. They both break when you take damage. On top of it, Rune Prison has a 1.5 cast time which is why nobody uses it for PvP, like Agony. Sorcs only use Defensive Rune which is an ad-hoc stun on some random target at the beginning of the encounter. Good spell but not on par with the others, unless you're up for trading Rune Prison with Fear or something?

Fair enough.

Another way to adjust TTK is by increasing player health (with necessary adjustments to Blazing Shield, GDB, Igneous Shield & Bone Shield of course). By nerfing both dmg shield strength and damage itself, you only return to square one.

If there was (much) more health & more ways to effectively bypass damage shields, you'd see fights revolving more around health & less around stamina permablock/dodge roll or magicka dmg shield spam, while getting rid of most instagib problems.

As to how to pick off people from a zerg of 20 spamming healing springs... well, you can pick all 20 of them with a siege weapon these days

The problem with the Health suggestion and also with "ways to effectively bypass damage shields" is that it short changes light armor builds massively.

First let's pick off the HP issue. Medium armor offers 3/4 of the mitigation of heavy while light offers 1/4 and that applies to all types of damage. So a medium or heavy build benefit very much from this change while light armor very little. This would upset the current balance.

In my opinion the mitigation should be like this and then they can go about upping health if they want:


Secondly if there was a way to bypass wards, what about my options to bypass dodge roll? They both have their advantages over one another.

Wards can be precasted while dodge roll is reactive so that's the advantage of shields. Dodge roll on the other hand negates the damage from multiple people. You can easily avoid multiple people sniping you by dodge rolling, but i can't tank 2 snipers with wards, let alone many. That's the advantage of dodge roll. Also you can animation cancel skills with dodge roll including skill attacks being both defensive and offensive at the same time. I can only animation cancel light attacks while spamming wards so I can't do that either.

So if there was a way to dispel shields on a Mage build, how do I stop stamina builds from dodge-roll-hitting me, to achieve balance?

frozywozy

I have no idea why this thread changed into the CC subject. Shield stacking has nothing to do with it. Shield stacking should be compared to dodge rolling or any form of damage mitigation. CC breaking, CC immunity or CC diminishing returns is a total new subject that has nothing do do with this.

The only point I can see that has a link is the fact that if you get chain CCed until you run out of shield, you get instagib, and this is why we should have diminishing returns for every category of ccs in this game (fears, stuns, roots, silences, disorients, etc) which would have their own 5seconds cooldown.

Maulkin

frozywozy wrote: »

I have no idea why this thread changed into the CC subject. Shield stacking has nothing to do with it. Shield stacking should be compared to dodge rolling or any form of damage mitigation. CC breaking, CC immunity or CC diminishing returns is a total new subject that has nothing do do with this.

Well it kinda does. Say I get attacked by 2 people and I cast Rune Prison on one of them, which under the proposed changes is unbreakable for 20" unless the target takes damage. Then, I proceed to fight the other guy 1v1. Didn't I just mitigate my incoming damage by 50% for 20"?

Yes, yes I did

Vis

The old: "sorcs can stack one resource for offense and defense" is getting very very very old. For the love of the eight! Have you not read the thousands of responses to this played out whine?

Everyone can stack one resource for offense and defense! DKs can have magicka for both dps and gdb/scales. NB's can become cloak spam tanks with magicka and still dps. Templars dps and heals are tied to magicka. Every stamina player can stack stamina for tons of rolls, minutes of blocking, stronger vigor, and hit like gods.

So before you accuse one class of having the abilities to stack in one resource, ask yourself: do I have a clue about how to play this game?

Germtrocity

People always say "sorcs get to stack everything into magicka with no tradeoffs" without looking at our stamina or HP pools.

Ezareth

Germtrocity wrote: »

People always say "sorcs get to stack everything into magicka with no tradeoffs" without looking at our stamina or HP pools.

This is a nerf-sorc thread. No rational points are allowed.

Didn't you hear? We're "God-mode".

technohic

I just realized that after last nights last couple tweaks on my build; I am now running 4 shields.... It would have to be some pretty perfect conditions for me to have all 4 up, but now I almost want to do it just to see. May let a mob beat on me a while. I am not a sorc, BTW.

Maulkin

Ezareth wrote: »

Germtrocity wrote: »

People always say "sorcs get to stack everything into magicka with no tradeoffs" without looking at our stamina or HP pools.

This is a nerf-sorc thread. No rational points are allowed.

Didn't you hear? We're "God-mode".

I've been holding the fort for the last 8 hours. Can you now take over here while I go PvP a bit?

Tagging you in.....

Maulkin

technohic wrote: »

I just realized that after last nights last couple tweaks on my build; I am now running 4 shields.... It would have to be some pretty perfect conditions for me to have all 4 up, but now I almost want to do it just to see. May let a mob beat on me a while. I am not a sorc, BTW.

Harness Magicka, Blazing Shield, Barrier, Bone Shield. Did I call it right?

You could also have one from Shielded Assault if you play S&B Magicka build.

technohic

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

I just realized that after last nights last couple tweaks on my build; I am now running 4 shields.... It would have to be some pretty perfect conditions for me to have all 4 up, but now I almost want to do it just to see. May let a mob beat on me a while. I am not a sorc, BTW.

Harness Magicka, Blazing Shield, Barrier, Bone Shield. Did I call it right?

You could also have one from Shielded Assault if you play S&B Magicka build.

No harness magicka or bone shield. Shielded assault yes, and healing ward. Thinking of changing blazing to radiant for efficiency.

Maulkin

technohic wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

I just realized that after last nights last couple tweaks on my build; I am now running 4 shields.... It would have to be some pretty perfect conditions for me to have all 4 up, but now I almost want to do it just to see. May let a mob beat on me a while. I am not a sorc, BTW.

Harness Magicka, Blazing Shield, Barrier, Bone Shield. Did I call it right?

You could also have one from Shielded Assault if you play S&B Magicka build.

No harness magicka or bone shield. Shielded assault yes, and healing ward. Thinking of changing blazing to radiant for efficiency.

Ah I never count Healing Ward as a shield cause I count it as a heal. You could add Harness then and make it 5, easily.

Armitas

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

Germtrocity wrote: »

People always say "sorcs get to stack everything into magicka with no tradeoffs" without looking at our stamina or HP pools.

This is a nerf-sorc thread. No rational points are allowed.

Didn't you hear? We're "God-mode".

I've been holding the fort for the last 8 hours. Can you now take over here while I go PvP a bit?

Tagging you in.....

....what is the ref watching?

c0rp

Ishammael wrote: »

c0rp wrote: »

The players cried and moaned until sorcs had their mobility and escape ability destroyed. Now they use shields. Now players will cry and moan until sorcs have their defense destroyed. It wont be long before sorcs are equivalent to 2004-2005 World of Warcraft Warlocks...aka, a free kill.

God, do you remember Rogues during the first year or so of WoW? (that's all I played)
Reeeediculous invisibility, CC, burst.

As a warlock at that time, you didn't even try to fight a rogue, you were usually dead before the "fight" even began actually lol