Advanced Mounts Overhaul Concept

TX12001rwb17_ESO

So how exactly would you feed treats to those new zombie horses or that horse made of solid ice or any potential skeletal mounts?

Gidorick

You do have a point @DaveMoeDee, and I agree. I actually cover unmounted horses in combat and some other issues in my Tangible Mounts Advanced Concept thread.

Gidorick wrote: »

A mount should run away in fear if a player is ever dismounted or if the player engages in battle. While in battle, a player should not be able to call their mount. Mounts should never be autonomous enough fight alongside their owner.

I use the word "tangible" because the concept is greater than the horse just staying around. It has to do with making the horse feel like a part of the world and a part of the game. But I think "persistent" may still be a better word.

And for sure! Stay mounted while swimming!! You could do this in Skyrim. I tried to find a video but all I found were videos where if you dismounted and remounted while in the water, you could make the horse run in the water as if it's on land.

This video starts off with the "normal" horse swimming.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1BGwjX0gnc

Mcac21

Gidorick wrote: »

The recent change of mount skills leading to riding skills has lead me to have some notions of how Mounts could be expanded in ESO while adhering to the changes that have been made. The overall notion of this concept is to expand on the mount system we currently have to offer a more engaging and immersive experience in terms of an MMO gameplay mechanic and an aspect of an RPG.

Overview:

• Mount Combat
• Additional Riding Skills
• Mount Buffs
• Advanced Mount AI
• First Person Mount Riding
• Mount Tangibility
• Mounted Combat
• Monetization: The Crown Store Additions

Mount Combat
The “Mount Combat” concept is to allow players to attack with their mount. Each mount could have different attack animations. Horses could attack with their hooves, Tigers and Guars could attack with their teeth. Attacks would be activated with a mount specific ability bar that is accessible only while mounted.

• Mount Ability Bar
  • Attack:The mount’s standard attack. Upgradable.
  • Spur : The mount chuffs or growls or stomps. A chance of increasing its attack , defense, and fortitude. Upgradable.
  • Ram: The mount would lean back and butt up against the enemy, with a chance to knockback and stun. Upgradable.
  • Rush: This could be activated from a distance. The mount lunges toward the enemy, pouncing for the attack. Upgradable.
  • Flee: This ability could be used in and out of combat. It is a sprint in which the mount and the player are immune to attacks of any kind, allowing the player to flee from a dangerous situation. It also refills a percentage of the mount’s fortitude. Upgradable.
  • Ultimate: Each mount could have a specific ultimate. NOT directly upgradable. The effectiveness is dependent on overall level of the riding skills.

All upgradable mount abilities would be tied to the Riding Skills, which should remain upgradable in the exact same way they are upgradable now. The abilities are not tied to experience points, skill points, or champion points. They are earned through the Riding Skill mechanic.

• Mount Fortitude: A mount shouldn’t have life, exactly. Below the life bar there should be a fortitude meter. Once that meter runs out, the mount becomes spooked. If a mount is spooked during a fight they will throw the off and flee for their life. They should not able to be recalled until the player is out of combat.

Additional Riding Skills
To accommodate the Mount Ability Bar as well as add additional options to mount skill variety, I suggest the following Riding Skills be ADDED to the riding skills

• Attack: Increate the attack damage of the Attack Ability.
• Defense: Increase the passive defense rating of the Mount.
• Provocation: Increase both the chance and the effectiveness of the Spur Ability.
• Determination: Increase both the chance and the effectiveness of the Ram Ability.
• Inspiration: Increase both the distance and the effectiveness of the Rush Ability.
• Compulsion:Increase the Speed and Duration of the Flee Ability.
• Fortitude: Increases the overall fortitude of the Mount.
• Aquestrian: One point in this skill and mounts are able to swim in the water, upgrades increase its speed in the water. (Get it? Aquestrian... hehe)
• Sovereignty: Upgrading this skill allows the mount to act autonomously for a longer duration, more on that later.

All of these skills would be upgradable once a day for 250 gold each, just as the three skills are upgradable now. This would give players a total of 12 riding skills they can upgrade. A player hoping to max all of their riding skills would have to pay a total of 180,000 gold over a 2 year period. This could be stretched out even further if players are charged more and have to wait longer the higher their skills are.

Mount Buffs
Each mount can be fed snacks and treats that will give them buffs on a specific trait or ability. Each treat has 3 quality variations (Bland/Tasty/Savory) of the treat that will provide a 10% buff for 40 minutes/ 15% buff for 20 minutes / 20% buff for 10 minutes.

These buffs can be for:

• Speed
• Stamina
• Attack (increases damage dealt on all 4 offensive abilities)
• Defense
• Fortitude
• Aquestrian
• Sovereignty

These 7 buff types would be dependent on 7 types of treats for each mount. Again, each treat would have the three quality types of Bland/Tasty/Savory.

Horse

• Grass Bundle
• Fistfull of Hay
• Oat Crumble
• Flax Seed Cookie
• Dried Beets
• Salt mix
• Apple Slices

Guar

• Live Crickets
• Mixed Berries
• Mellon balls
• Fish Guts
• Snake tail
• Skeever jerky
• Mudcrab Chum

Senche

• Whole Squirrel
• Skinned fox
• Dewinged bat
• Chicken breasts
• Goat chop
• Deer loin
• Moon Sugar cane

The two methods of obtaining these treats would be:

• Bought individually through the Stable/Mount Trainers (individual Mount Trainers for each Mount type concept HERE)
• Bought in bulk packs through the Crown Store

Players would simply “Use” the treats as they would be in their inventory. If a player is mounted while using a treat it would be preferable if there were an animation of the player leaning forward, stretching out their arm, the mount looking back and taking the treat from the players hand and the player patting their mount on the head, but that wouldn’t be necessary. Just a nice little touch, if ZOS were so inclined.

The buff would be applied to the player’s riding skill and should be viewable on the character screen and should be mount type specific so a player could have a Horse, Guar, and a Senche buff applied at the same time, but only one buff for each.

Advanced Mount AI
Along with the above additions, mounts should have advanced AI as described in my post: Horse auto-run AI which can be found HERE.

The long and short of this concept is we should be able to set our mount in a direction and press the auto-run key and the mounts should avoid trees and rocks and should be able to find its way forward. Alternately, we should be able to set a marker on the map and have the mount travel to that marker by finding the closest road and following that road.

The duration of the Advanced Mount AI should be dependent on the Sovereignty Skill. The Sovereignty skill determines how well your mount follows a rider’s directions and can act autonomously without direct interaction. The greater the skill, the longer the mount is focused and undistracted. This could be displayed by a Sovereignty meter that appears on screen when the auto-run is pressed while mounted and depletes as a player’s mount acts on its own.

Once the meter is depleted, the mount will ‘dumb down’ and act as mounts currently do, getting caught on trees, rocks, fences, buildings, etc.

NOTE: Although players do have the auto-run option while on foot, Sovereignty shouldn’t apply to this dismounted movement mechanic.

First Person Mount Riding
This one is pretty straight forward. Allow player to ride their mount while in first person. There is a post on it HERE from @mandrakethebard_ESO . Most of us that want this would be willing to PAY for the option in the Crown Store.

Mount Tangibility
The fact that mounts dematerialize once we dismount is unfortunate. I posted a suggestion HERE regarding mounts staying around while we are off of them.

While I would really like for my mount to walk beside me, I would be perfectly content if the mount simply ran away when players dismounted and ran up when a player wanted to ride them. While it would take a few seconds for the mount to arrive from a distance, most of us who want this feature are ok with that. To accommodate those that would NOT want this feature, it should be to toggled on and off in the settings menu. Again, if it had to be, ZOS could sell this feature in the Crown Store.

I expand on this concept in this thread here: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/165659/tangible-mounts-advanced-concept/p1

Mounted Combat
Using many of these mechanics that we mentioned above players could be then given the option to partake in Mounted Combat. This is when the player uses their weapon to attack another player or NPC while staying on their mount.

The player would use the right mouse button to look around while on their mount, functioning like a mouse freelook with limiters where the player character rotates at the hip to look around. Pressing the Weapon Draw button, players would enter mounted combat. If they let go of the right mouse button, they simply attack “forward”.

Then the player would use the left mouse button to attack with their weapon. While on the mount players can attack using either of their weapons but maybe shouldn't have access to a full skill bar. If a player has full access to their abilities they may be dissuaded from dismounting to partake in combat. However, players must be given enough incentive to stay on their mount to make the mechanic interesting. Perhaps allowing players to only assign one or two Mounted Abilities equipped weapon would be sufficient deterrent and support.

Players can also choose to toggle a mount’s autonomy before entering Mounted Combat. If they do so, and they then lock onto a target, the mount will then circle the target, allowing the player to attack the target at will. The mount will instinctively know if you are using a ranged weapon or a close quarter’s weapon and will keep an appropriate distance.

If a player toggles off Mounted Combat by sheathing their weapon and they will return to the mount riding mode.

Monetization: The Crown Store Additions
There are many monetization opportunities that arise through these enhancements.

• 500C – Feed Bag: A single slot inventory item that houses all treats for mounts, no matter how many the player has. Items cannot be placed within or taken out of the feedbag. If a player has treats for their mount, it can be found in the Feedbag, otherwise, one treat type consumes one inventory space.
• 200C – Bland Mount Treat Sampler Pack (21 Bland treats, 1 of each type for your mounts)
• 400C – Tasty Mount Treat Sampler Pack (21 Tasty treats, 1 of each type for your mounts)
• 600C – Savory Mount Treat Sampler Pack (21 Savory treats, 1 of each type for your mounts & one pack for each mount type)
• 200C – Bland Treat Sampler Pack (14 Bland treats for your Mount, 2 of each type & one pack for each mount type)
• 400C – Tasty Treat Sampler Pack (14 Tasty treats for your Mount, 2 of each type & one pack for each mount type)
• 600C – Savory Treat Sampler Pack (14 Savory treats for your Mount, 2 of each type & one pack for each mount type)
• 200C – Bland Treats 10 pack (10 bland treats for your Mount, one type & one pack for each mount type)
• 400C – Tasty Treats 10 Pack (10 tasty treats for your Mount, one type & one pack for each mount type)
• 600C – Savory Treats 10 Pack (14 savory treats for your Mount, one type & one pack for each mount type)
• 500C – Advanced Riding Lessons. This 4 pack of Advanced Riding Lessons allows players to bypass the time and gold requirement for the next riding lesson and upgrade 1 riding skill for each lesson (includes 4 lessons).
• 500 C – First Person Riding Pack: Enables Players to ride their Mount in first person.
• 200C – Mount Tangibility Pack: Mounts run away and run up when dismounting and mounting.

All of these suggestions would add a total of 25 items that could be bought from the Crown Store. 22 of which would be consumable, re-purchasable items.

Overall, these advanced mount features would greatly increase the customizability of the mounts, increase their interactivity, increase PVE and PVE combat options, add to long term return purchase options to the crown store, add gameplay by adding mount progression, and would add to the overall variety of ESO.

Thoughts?

I Agree tooooooooo this 100%. I think this is a brilliant idea... Why are we not funding this.

altemriel

great ideas, as usual!!

F7sus4

Gidorick wrote: »

Thoughts?

Yeah, your ideas are really fappable. GJ!

Artheiron

I briefly read it. I always like @Gidorick 's ideas anyway. But this is eso sir. They haven't fixed dragonknights' fiery chain ability yet. it's been 1.5 years since they broke it. You should gather all these posts and create your own game dev company . Hire my small design team I'm a good 3d modeller with 12 years of experience :P jk jk...

Anyway, why I'm saying this, because every single idea we share here, with all these deep details like how our ideas fit in the crown store factor etc... making no sense.

Making no sense when no one from the dev team actually showing their face here and discuss these beautifully detailed ideas with you. They don't even say "thanks". I started to think that all your valued hard work you're doing on this forum for free should be made real by a company that willing to take it seriously. At least most of them.

Anyway, I hope you understand my frustiation I tried to support this game's future developement with my ideas too because I love elder scrolls. But for now, I'll just play this game like I'm playing a repetetive fps game where racist, 12 yo kids killing each other and scream in a circular map. I mean... just like call of duty. And giving no ideas for free for a game I pay to play.

ItsGlaive

Your idea sounds great, but I'd settle for better looking horse models

Digiman

Out of all the MMO's I have played this has the best mount system ever. The mounts aren't 150% speed spells with an animation.

Even so while some of this seems like great ideas I would just settle for simple mount combat.

Gidorick

@KoshkaMurka, I'm curious your thoughts on this concept of mine, which includes mount combat and mounted combat. Would you view it to be unfair in similar ways to the useful pet concepts?

LadyNalcarya

Gidorick wrote: »

@KoshkaMurka, I'm curious your thoughts on this concept of mine, which includes mount combat and mounted combat. Would you view it to be unfair in similar ways to the useful pet concepts?

I actually like this idea more than you pet idea. Mostly because it expands current mount system.
But still, some of the options don't seem very convenient and player-friendly.

All of these skills would be upgradable once a day for 250 gold each, just as the three skills are upgradable now. This would give players a total of 12 riding skills they can upgrade. A player hoping to max all of their riding skills would have to pay a total of 180,000 gold over a 2 year period. This could be stretched out even further if players are charged more and have to wait longer the higher their skills are.

2 years is too much imo. Even the current system gives some advantages in pvp for those who have 60/60/60 horses. You can move really fast, you wont be dismounted that easily...
And 2 years of leveling (or buying upgrades in crown store) would be really disheartening for new players. Also, it will greatly discourage leveling alts, since riding stats are not account wide.
Speaking of unfairness, I think that any boosts to battle-related abilities mustnt be sold in crown store. Current system is not exacty pay2win - a max level horse might get you out of troble and give you some advantages, but it doesnt make your character stronger in any way. A possibility to level battle stats with real money is the very definition of pay2win. Especially when new players would have to either pay or level stats for 2 years on every char.
So I think that for this system any "riding lessons and upgrades must be permanently removed from the crown store and the duration of leveling should be reduced. Maybe, allow to level multiple stats at once, so the total time to level up a horse would be around 1-2 months or so?
Also, I gotta say I really like the idea of horse food. It is almost painful to start a new alt without any riding stats. A small buff would be really nice.
But I would just separate all food in 2 categories: 1 for carnivorous mounts and 1 for herbivores. Simply because there's already more mount types than horse, guar and senche.
Mounted combat system a-la Mount and Blade would be also really interesting, and after all it is a bit weird that we cannot draw out weapons while mounted.

Sausage

If they are gonna add mounted combat, I want some lance charge stuff. Btw, Black Desert has mounted combat and its coming next year I believe, it looks awesome.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPEEKeNV19c

I think Zen should add it too! I personally think ESO isnt going to last without sea-combat and mounted combat etc. They are coming for sure and sea-combat is already done many times before. I hope we get one adventure zone for both. Why not some flying stuff too.

tinythinker

I dunno, I would just like to have 60 be the max base for all three current mount stats, and then depending on the type of mount have the cap for one or more stats extended. Sample numbers are offered below. These could vary by type, such as pack horses which might have more carrying capacity verses horses built for speed or endurance. Ranges below in parentheses indicate potential examples of the variance in the new caps if there are such differences included:

Horse
speed 90 (70-90)
stamina 90 (70-90)
carrying capacity 90 (70-90)


Senche

speed 100 (80-100)
stamina 70
carrying capacity 90 (70-90)


Guar

speed 70
stamina 90 (70-90)
carrying capacity 100 (80-100)


Bear

speed 70
stamina 100 (80-100)
carrying capacity 90 (70-90)

Horses are the best "all around" mounts, but can't get, whereas Senche are built for speed but not stamina (consistent with great cats), Guar are built for carrying capacity but not speed, and Bears are built for stamina but not speed.

Gidorick

In light of some of the conversations happening on the forum I thought it would be a good idea to revisit this topic. I made a change to the OP that I think would make many players happy. Previously I suggested adding 9 Riding Skills to the system but I changed that to suggest adding 3 Riding Skills and 6 Mount Skills to the Mount system. This way, characters would have their riding skills, but individual mounts would have upgradeable skills also.

Here is the edit:

gidorick wrote:

Additional Skills
To accommodate the Mount Ability Bar as well as add additional options to the mount skill variety, I suggest the following Skills be added to the riding skills.

• Riding Skills: These are additional Riding Skills that are attached to the Character. These skills are attached to the Rider to highlight the skill the rider has at handling mounts. Mounts listen to a character the higher these skills and the character has a better command over their bestial companions. These would still be upgradeable once per day, per character.
  • Compulsion:Increase the Speed and Duration of the Flee Ability.
  • Fortitude: Increases the overall fortitude of the Mount.
  • Sovereignty: Upgrading this skill allows the mount to act autonomously for a longer duration, more on that later.
• Mount Skills: These skills would be Mount Skills that are attached to the mount. These skills are attached to the mount because each mount would have different skills and abilities. These skills would be upgradeable once per day, per mount.
  • Attack: Increate the attack damage of the Attack Ability.
  • Defense: Increase the passive defense rating of the Mount.
  • Provocation: Increase both the chance and the effectiveness of the Spur Ability.
  • Determination: Increase both the chance and the effectiveness of the Ram Ability.
  • Inspiration: Increase both the distance and the effectiveness of the Rush Ability.
  • Aquestrian: One point in this skill and mounts are able to swim in the water, upgrades increase its speed in the water. (Get it? Aquestrian... hehe)

All of these skills would be upgradable once a day for 250 gold each, just as the three skills are upgradable now. This would give players a total of 12 riding skills they can upgrade, and one character could upgrade the mount skills of all mounts each day.

Daz_dingoeb17_ESO

For First person view i agree but all the other stuff i dont think are aiming on a reasonable scale given the nature of the game. maybe mounted combat can be implemented on an instanced battleground where players can fight on theur mounts but i dont see it happening on the rest of the game and im not sure i would like to see it tbh

Gidorick

Lol. Well, no one has ever accused me of being reasonable @Daz_dingoeb17_ESO .

I think mounted and mount combat coupled with on foot combat would work because players wouldn't (and shouldn't) be able to use their skills while mounted. Only weapon attacks would be available. So fast players using swords, bows, and staffs and mount attacks would be against players using all sorts of magical attacks.

Is it perfect? Of course not... but it would be fun and interesting.