1.6.1 Change to Ultimate - Good or Bad?

Asgari

Please discuss the changes to Ulti in 1.6.1 and how you feel this will affect the incentive to zerg more and other issue that may arise.


Combat & Gameplay
General

• PVP kills no longer grant Ultimate.

Alliance War
Assault

• Combat Frenzy: Reduced the Ultimate gain to 10/20 from 13/25.

Item Sets

• Blood Spawn: Reduced the ultimate gain from this item set to 15 from 25.

*Haven't logged in to confirm but was told has a cool down added to it as well of 6 seconds.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

johan.danielsson1994b16_ESO wrote: »

PVP kills no longer grant Ultimate.

is this combat frenzy or kills in general?

This is for PVP kills, in general. The Ultimate Combat Frenzy grants was reduced from 25 to 20 at Rank II.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Shuichi wrote: »

Does this mean Death Stroke is essentially useless in PvP now? The skill increases the ultimate you gain from kills, so if there is no ultimate to gain (apart from NPCs) why would anyone use this? (Like I have been for months)

The Death Stroke morph Soul Harvest still grants bonus Ultimate from kills.

DezIsDead

But.... But.... I already hated the ulti gain in 1.6.

AhPook_Is_Here

Honestly, I hardly notice a difference.

DezIsDead

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Honestly, I hardly notice a difference.

I do, mostly because I am still used to 1.5, where I tried not to light weave due to reflective scales. Now, I have to adjust to working in light attacks, which isn't an issue. I just am not fond of it.

aco5712

not having combat frenzy maxed, not killing people (coz i tank) and not having bloodspawn, i still felt like my ulti was genning way too quickly in live. On the PTS, we are only dueling but i felt like my ulti was there everytime i needed it. Will be different when its group play though. However i dont see the reason for no ulti when you kill someone in general. That more punishes you for killing someone.

If they reverted the change to negate and let one well placed negate cancel out any stacked negates, then i think that would help reduce zerging. Negates are PvP essentially and being out numbered is alot harder now that one negate is useless against multiple.

Suru

There was always a 6 second CD, just not in the tooltip I believe. Strong set still strong, just not as strong.

Asgari

aco5712 wrote: »

not having combat frenzy maxed, not killing people (coz i tank) and not having bloodspawn, i still felt like my ulti was genning way too quickly in live. On the PTS, we are only dueling but i felt like my ulti was there everytime i needed it. Will be different when its group play though. However i dont see the reason for no ulti when you kill someone in general. That more punishes you for killing someone.

If they reverted the change to negate and let one well placed negate cancel out any stacked negates, then i think that would help reduce zerging. Negates are PvP essentially and being out numbered is alot harder now that one negate is useless against multiple.

Negate will now remove any AoE on the negates cast. After that you can cast into it or in it. It's worse imo.

saintmurray

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

Asgari

saintmurray wrote: »

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

My question is how does an Alliance war passive no longer count towards ....


The alliance war

Galalin

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

My question is how does an Alliance war passive no longer count towards ....


The alliance war

But that would be the logical way to think

Saint_JiubB14_ESO

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

My question is how does an Alliance war passive no longer count towards ....


The alliance war

What? Combat frenzy generates ult, it is in your op. Which passive are you talking about then?

DisgracefulMind

I'm not fond of the change to Combat Frenzy. I actually this it's complete [snip] [snip] as it takes quite a long time to gain those two passives. Just another way that ZoS is saying [snip] you to their PvP players.

As for Bloodspawn, though I really love it, I agree it needed a small reduction.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

Asgari

Saint_JiubB14_ESO wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

My question is how does an Alliance war passive no longer count towards ....


The alliance war

What? Combat frenzy generates ult, it is in your op. Which passive are you talking about then?

saintmurray

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

My question is how does an Alliance war passive no longer count towards ....


The alliance war

I would say its a stop us (well leveled pvpers) from melting the hoards of 1st graders that are about to join us. I can already imagine it "this game sucks they already have too much of a head start! I'll never catch those guys! That ultimate gen is wayy OP!!"

WRX

The change to negate is really bad.

lostavalon

[quote= Negate will now remove any AoE on the negates cast. After that you can cast into it or in it. It's worse imo.[/quote]

This, what the *** point of the skill if u can just cast into straight away, ffs do use ever think b4 implementing stuff? if this is working how i think its going to work, (waiting for the pts to DL so i can test) sorcs pretty much imo will have 3 useless ults, negate^ , atro which u just need to walk out of range from it, and overload is just meh maybe in a 1v1 to finish someone off but thtas bout it

Asgari

saintmurray wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

My question is how does an Alliance war passive no longer count towards ....


The alliance war

I would say its a stop us (well leveled pvpers) from melting the hoards of 1st graders that are about to join us. I can already imagine it "this game sucks they already have too much of a head start! I'll never catch those guys! That ultimate gen is wayy OP!!"

That's the only thing that makes sense. Pretty much remove all ties to pre 1.6 so post 1.6 players can be even. Which in all honesty is a bs cop out and ruins any reason to PvP for an advantage over others.

saintmurray

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

My question is how does an Alliance war passive no longer count towards ....


The alliance war

I would say its a stop us (well leveled pvpers) from melting the hoards of 1st graders that are about to join us. I can already imagine it "this game sucks they already have too much of a head start! I'll never catch those guys! That ultimate gen is wayy OP!!"

That's the only thing that makes sense. Pretty much remove all ties to pre 1.6 so post 1.6 players can be even. Which in all honesty is a bs cop out and ruins any reason to PvP for an advantage over others.

Its still an advantage but I mean really why change it?? Why annoy us even more. Why not change it down the track in 4 or 5 months to even things out then?

Also just sore the negate change HAHAHAHAH REKT!!!

Ezareth

lostavalon wrote: »

This, what the *** point of the skill if u can just cast into straight away, ffs do use ever think b4 implementing stuff? if this is working how i think its going to work, (waiting for the pts to DL so i can test) sorcs pretty much imo will have 3 useless ults, negate^ , atro which u just need to walk out of range from it, and overload is just meh maybe in a 1v1 to finish someone off but thtas bout it

/boggle.

Asgari

saintmurray wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

My question is how does an Alliance war passive no longer count towards ....


The alliance war

I would say its a stop us (well leveled pvpers) from melting the hoards of 1st graders that are about to join us. I can already imagine it "this game sucks they already have too much of a head start! I'll never catch those guys! That ultimate gen is wayy OP!!"

That's the only thing that makes sense. Pretty much remove all ties to pre 1.6 so post 1.6 players can be even. Which in all honesty is a bs cop out and ruins any reason to PvP for an advantage over others.

Its still an advantage but I mean really why change it?? Why annoy us even more. Why not change it down the track in 4 or 5 months to even things out then?

Also just sore the negate change HAHAHAHAH REKT!!!

I don't use negate and just roll out of them anyways. Rarely die to one as well. I do however love the buff to overload. GL people, you can set that ulti up to rek face.

DezIsDead

didnt they reduce the cost to 50 to activate it as well?

Juraigr

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Mmmm I haven't played on pts yet. 1month into live we will really know..

My question is how does an Alliance war passive no longer count towards ....


The alliance war

I would say its a stop us (well leveled pvpers) from melting the hoards of 1st graders that are about to join us. I can already imagine it "this game sucks they already have too much of a head start! I'll never catch those guys! That ultimate gen is wayy OP!!"

That's the only thing that makes sense. Pretty much remove all ties to pre 1.6 so post 1.6 players can be even. Which in all honesty is a bs cop out and ruins any reason to PvP for an advantage over others.

To true, alliance rank 33 yet imma be as efficient as a v14 volunteer yeah ok zos......................

Tripwyr

I love how everybody is crying about the Negate nerf. This is a change that needed to happen. Sorcerers were far too strong, and a group of 16 Sorcerers was far strong than a balanced group of players. Anytime you could sacrifice another class for a Sorcerer, your group became stronger.

This change means that while still strong (Negate removes other ultimates), Negate is no longer mandatory and fights will no longer dramatically shift toward the team with more Negates.

The Combat Frenzy and Blood Spawn changes were equally vital in the new ultimate meta. Combat Frenzy is arguably still OP in an area where the only other way to generate ultimate is through the new mechanic. Combat Frenzy means that new players or players leveling new characters are at a severe disadvantage compared to existing players, increasing an already very steep power curve.

Overall I am very happy with this new patch.

WRX

Tripwyr wrote: »

I love how everybody is crying about the Negate nerf. This is a change that needed to happen. Sorcerers were far too strong, and a group of 16 Sorcerers was far strong than a balanced group of players. Anytime you could sacrifice another class for a Sorcerer, your group became stronger.

This change means that while still strong (Negate removes other ultimates), Negate is no longer mandatory and fights will no longer dramatically shift toward the team with more Negates.

The Combat Frenzy and Blood Spawn changes were equally vital in the new ultimate meta. Combat Frenzy is arguably still OP in an area where the only other way to generate ultimate is through the new mechanic. Combat Frenzy means that new players or players leveling new characters are at a severe disadvantage compared to existing players, increasing an already very steep power curve.

Overall I am very happy with this new patch.

I mean you didn't really play with us with the lag last night, but it was very clear last night that negate was not a game changing ability anymore.

It helped control a part of the ground in the fight or give your heals a chance to catch up. I agree they needed to remove the absorption part of it, but now its just a weak ulti. In 1.6 negate teams were going to get rolled regardless of this change.

Teargrants

As long as I can pew pew ppl w/ overload for 10k+ it's all good. Gotta get through dat shield stack.

Asgari

Teargrants wrote: »

As long as I can pew pew ppl w/ overload for 10k+ it's all good. Gotta get through dat shield stack.

We may have to team up on some AD I tested it before this patch and 3 shot someone .. Now if they were a vamp it would have been even worse. I'm so excited!

Ps. Glad I didn't grind for the blood spawn set lol

Asgari

Tripwyr wrote: »

I love how everybody is crying about the Negate nerf. This is a change that needed to happen. Sorcerers were far too strong, and a group of 16 Sorcerers was far strong than a balanced group of players. Anytime you could sacrifice another class for a Sorcerer, your group became stronger.

This change means that while still strong (Negate removes other ultimates), Negate is no longer mandatory and fights will no longer dramatically shift toward the team with more Negates.

The Combat Frenzy and Blood Spawn changes were equally vital in the new ultimate meta. Combat Frenzy is arguably still OP in an area where the only other way to generate ultimate is through the new mechanic. Combat Frenzy means that new players or players leveling new characters are at a severe disadvantage compared to existing players, increasing an already very steep power curve.

Overall I am very happy with this new patch.

I understand the change to blood spawn more than anyone seeing as I had the set first on NA PvP. Got them both the first week in one run haha. Used it ever since on the DK and it showed how op it is. However, removing the combat frenzy passive from alliance war is unacceptable.

Why even have it as an alliance war passive? Just make it a passive in undaunted or something so people are aware it has nothing to do with pvp anymore.

Galalin

Tripwyr wrote: »

I love how everybody is crying about the Negate nerf. This is a change that needed to happen. Sorcerers were far too strong, and a group of 16 Sorcerers was far strong than a balanced group of players. Anytime you could sacrifice another class for a Sorcerer, your group became stronger.

This change means that while still strong (Negate removes other ultimates), Negate is no longer mandatory and fights will no longer dramatically shift toward the team with more Negates.

The Combat Frenzy and Blood Spawn changes were equally vital in the new ultimate meta. Combat Frenzy is arguably still OP in an area where the only other way to generate ultimate is through the new mechanic. Combat Frenzy means that new players or players leveling new characters are at a severe disadvantage compared to existing players, increasing an already very steep power curve.

Overall I am very happy with this new patch.

How is combat frenzy OP in PvE? The ppl who have it also have gear already and 99% are vet14. No new gear or content. Whats the use of it now... nevemind the fact it was a PvP earned passive. Possibly to grind the new skills? Hardly OP

Ezareth

Teargrants wrote: »

As long as I can pew pew ppl w/ overload for 10k+ it's all good. Gotta get through dat shield stack.

A shame my balls don't need shields. You can pew pew 'em all you want. I know to stay away from your balls.

My new Template character on PTS is Ezarethe (and I'm DC evidently, Derp)

Bouvin

Galalin wrote: »

Tripwyr wrote: »

I love how everybody is crying about the Negate nerf. This is a change that needed to happen. Sorcerers were far too strong, and a group of 16 Sorcerers was far strong than a balanced group of players. Anytime you could sacrifice another class for a Sorcerer, your group became stronger.

This change means that while still strong (Negate removes other ultimates), Negate is no longer mandatory and fights will no longer dramatically shift toward the team with more Negates.

The Combat Frenzy and Blood Spawn changes were equally vital in the new ultimate meta. Combat Frenzy is arguably still OP in an area where the only other way to generate ultimate is through the new mechanic. Combat Frenzy means that new players or players leveling new characters are at a severe disadvantage compared to existing players, increasing an already very steep power curve.

Overall I am very happy with this new patch.

How is combat frenzy OP in PvE? The ppl who have it also have gear already and 99% are vet14. No new gear or content. Whats the use of it now... nevemind the fact it was a PvP earned passive. Possibly to grind the new skills? Hardly OP

The bigger question is why would a PvP passive not be useful in PvP?

Some major shortsightedness on the dev's part there...

Joy_Division

While they have this idiotic method of generating ultimate in 1.6, they have to be consistent and bring Blood Spawn and Combat Frenzy in line. Blood Spawn was *already* a top 2 Undaunted set in 1.5 where ultimates are a dime a dozen, there was no way that set would be remotely balanced in 1.6.

As for Negate, I did feel it was too strong in 1.5, but if I am reading the abiltiy correctly, someone would be able to cast a effect in a negated area...doesn't that defeat the purpose? That does not sound very "ultimate" to me.