Crypt of Hearts Veteran Pledge - some bosses are too powerful & too many adds

Milf_Hero

I think they said they would put some sort of system where after a certain number of tries the would make it the dungeon boss easier. I have yet to see that happen. I think something like that should happen. If they have to balance that, they should make it so that the drops are a lower rarity or the percentage for the rare drop to drop some what but not by a drastic amount. This way the hardcore players get to go hardcore and have better chance for their precious little drops and the regular Joe Smoe can feel good for completing a dungeon and still be able to get the drops like the super uber players. Who are usually just 4 people that have great stuff, help each other out, and reject every one else for not being like them.

So basically what im saying is Joe Smoe group goes in a vet vr14 dungeon or whatever level it scaled to. Vr14 tho is usually the impossible difficulty for Joe Smoe group. They wipe like 7 times. Then an option pops up for the group to vote on ask if they want to have a difficulty adjustment. It will also show what happens for doing so. enemy damage out put lowered by this much. Boss skill cycle slowed by this much. Number of adds lowered by this much. percentage for rare drop lowered by this much. rarity of rare drop changed to this. etc. There is still a chance for these items which could then in turn make joe some group a vet group. Allowing them to use the lower level gear they obtained to get the better versions.

Vet group goes in the same dungeon. Wipes a few times. Vet group gets the option to have difficulty adjustment. They vote no and keep going at it till they complete it. Same percentage for drops. Same purple rare drops. Same old same old.

= EVERY BODY IS HAPPY.

hellkrasher

Wow so its true... ppl is actually complaining about dungeons dificulty even after the nerf... a friend told me that there was a post about Crypt Of Hearts been to hard... i was like Really? Amazed what i just found xD.

Come on ppl... what are you looking for? We do this dungeon in 15min with pugs every day... How is that to HARD?

Instead of taking the time to complain and whin about it, what about taking the time to learn the mechanics and learn how to play your character?...

I ll simplify it for you, its not hard, its not even moderate, its EASY. If you still find it difficult, then the problem is obviously yourself, not the dungeon.

Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO

Joy_Division wrote: »

You go beyond this and lie.

Have you been there with my group? Nope, you haven't been there.
But you claim that I am making stuff up here?

Really... for a troll you are not really creative. Insulting yes, but creative... nah.

MrGhosty

Just to be clear for those who quoted my post, I'm not demanding the content be nerfed or reduced. All I suggested was that maybe it needed to be looked at because there feels like something is off. When I say that I'm entitled to the right to state what I think, it is no different than your right. I am not better or greater than a factor than you. Thank you for those that posted helpful tips about this particular boss. To those that talk about nerfing content would drive away the hardcores, firstly I'm not asking for a nerf, I simply expressed the OPINION that something felt off about it and that it would bear some looking into.

Second, the statement that driving the hardcores away would kill the game? The exact same is true about driving those of us who may not have the same time to invest but still want to complete everything. That doesn't mean I expect everything be given to the "lowest common denominator" or anything. What I do expect, and in fact deserve through the concept of this being a commercial service, is that I am free to voice my concerns and look for some sort of resolution.

Cheers for the info though, I wonder though. What AOEs and builds are those of you who have no problem with the dungeon using? what armor sets, stats are you pushing? And do you have your build specced for PvE dungeons and trials or is this build also viable across all of the content. Thanks in advance for the further information

Hoodster92_ESO

Alright, I am trying to be nice about these types of posts but its starting to get hard to listen to crying.....

If you cant complete this dungeon after hours of wiping and learning fights, its because you have a bad group or you are not a "normal player" you're a bad one.

Normal players complete the new content at the expectations of the game developers, vet players will complete it faster than what the game developers predicted.

Normal players are expected to progress through the game at a pace to where it takes them longer than vet players in the idea that while they do the content they get better at the game. So when game developers make new content, if a player has completed all the content before hand they think that you are ready for the new content, which you should be (unless you got carried through everything).

THAT is what a 'normal player" is, not crying babies who cry nerf at the first site of a challenge. Learn your classes, learn the mechanics, or go play some pay to play game where you can pay them 10 bucks to see "challenge completed" pop up on your screen.

Kraven

Just to throw in a point here, other the ones I already have. We have done this at V12 with a V4 healer, just saying. Granted Nerien'Eth can sometimes give her trouble but she knows the movement is something she needs to work on. Still get HM done just not always on the first shot with her.

A V4 NB Healer and the only trouble she has is the final boss on hard mode in a V12 dungeon. My wife is a self proclaimed casual player, hence the V4 main, who died on each and every boss the first time she went into CoH (at V2 because some group wanted to scale it down to her level in order to complete it, silly pugs). She took the time to learn the fights and adjust to the mechanics. Asked her today after reading this post if she found this dungeon too difficult, after some thought her response was:
"Nerien'Eth is the only fight I wish I was a Templar healer for their emergency heal (Breath of Life). The rest of the dungeon isn't too bad."

Armitas

Kraven wrote: »

"Nerien'Eth is the only fight I wish I was a Templar healer for their emergency heal (Breath of Life). The rest of the dungeon isn't too bad."

^same experience. Except for the final boss I had no trouble healing a pug group that had never been there before. All I had to do is explain the fight before each pull. Healing ward and breath of life are ridiculously disproportionate. Temps should always be better at it but healing ward is simply insufficient for the way the average player behaves. Players don't worry about standing in cone range of a healer, they only worry about standing in the smart healing range of breath of life. It's a fire and forget burst heal while healing ward comes with some serious conditions. 1 player per cast, 0 mitigation bubble that takes 6 seconds to turn into a heal. You pop it for everyone that gets spiked and hope to get in range of the randomly positioned character for a cone shaped blessing. Then turn and chase down the other guy for a blessing.

I love healing more than tanking or dpsing, but they will always want a "real healer" instead because breath of life covers a multitude of sins and healing ward barely covers one.

Nestor

***_Hero wrote: »

I think they said they would put some sort of system where after a certain number of tries the would make it the dungeon boss easier. I have yet to see that happen.

FYI, that is only for the Forced Solo Dungeons like in the Main Quest or Fighters/Mages Guild quest line. Problem with that is, your armor is getting degraded on each kill. After about 6 kills I am at a 4 figure repair bill and my armor is about gone.

Group dungeons are supposed to scale to the leader upon entry, so perhaps they could take in a VR1 character and make them a group leader. That might make this easier to chew on.

Kraven

Armitas wrote: »

Kraven wrote: »

"Nerien'Eth is the only fight I wish I was a Templar healer for their emergency heal (Breath of Life). The rest of the dungeon isn't too bad."

^same experience. Except for the final boss I had no trouble healing a pug group that had never been there before. All I had to do is explain the fight before each pull. Healing ward and breath of life are ridiculously disproportionate. Temps should always be better at it but healing ward is simply insufficient for the way the average player behaves. Players don't worry about standing in cone range of a healer, they only worry about standing in the smart healing range of breath of life. It's a fire and forget burst heal while healing ward comes with some serious conditions. 1 player per cast, 0 mitigation bubble that takes 6 seconds to turn into a heal. You pop it for everyone that gets spiked and hope to get in range of the randomly positioned character for a cone shaped blessing. Then turn and chase down the other guy for a blessing.

I love healing more than tanking or dpsing, but they will always want a "real healer" instead because breath of life covers a multitude of sins and healing ward barely covers one.

She relies on Blessing of Restoration as her 'big' heal but being a frontal it requires perfect positioning versus Breath being a fire and forget spell. Unfortunately the Ward could be great but it doesn't scale proportionately, it doesn't negate even 1 hit worth of damage from a trash mob. Add to that the healing ward morph requires that it lasts the full six seconds without the person taking any damage in order to get the heal. As dps if my health is lower than the tanks so that the ward hits me instead of them then the chances of me going the following 6 seconds without taking a hit are pretty slim.

Aeratus

I've done COH several times without a templar healer. It's just harder on the last boss, since it requires the group members to be pretty good.

It depends on the group composition of course. If your group consists of DKs, sorcs, and funnel health NBs that can self-heal or offheal, there shouldn't be any problem if the group knows what they're doing. But if you're in a pug with 2 stamina dps and a tank with no self-healing abilities, I'd think twice if the healer isn't templar.

NB healers can use funnel health, to basically have two rapid regen ticks going on at the same time. This helps in spread out fights because funnel has a pretty long auto-target range.

ArcaneBlue

just throwing this out here_ just because something is extremely easy for you, it doesn't mean it's easy for everyone else too.
I'm not going to say if I'm having trouble beating vet dungeons or absolutely smashing them, but looking at some of the posts here made me want to say the above.

same goes for "difficult" I suppose, and it's pretty clear some are struggling to beat vet dungeons and some are just roflstomping them, and this shouldn't be happening. (sure some people might just have a "bad" build but come on)
and I'm not sure if it's purely because of "bad build" or "inexperienced pugs".
something with the scaling may or may not be off and might need to be looked at by the devs.

regards

yodased

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMPKDr05DoY&noredirect=1

Iduyenn

-

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO

Its not to hard by a long shot. If you don't use ts and communicate with your group then you need to start, that's the best advice if you don't already.

Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO

Okee, where do I start.
Yesterday I found a nice PuG - we did Elden Hollow VR 14 Vet Pledge.

No Teamspeak (I asked, everyone was like - no sorry).
Well, what can I say. I was first-timer in that dungeon. Only one knew what would come. The rest never got to the end before.

We only wiped once at Bogdan, because one of the team accidentally clicked the wrong button. *** happens.
It wasn't easy, but compared to that spider daedra experience - that was a friggin walk in the park. No bugged zerg-frenzy adds.

That showed me that my build cannot be that wrong and that i actually know my class well enough ... nor that a PuG is a bad thing or that TS is always needed.
As I said. We only had one with us who knew that quest. But even all his knowledge could not have prevented us from failing, if we all were oh so terrible builds or player.

Another thing,
some people claiming that me and people who have a similar view are just lazy gits who want good loot free house...(I summarized here)

Merely because some of us request "balanced" peldges or the choice to finish them at a different difficulty, doesn't mean that we want things for free.
We do not complain about dying sometimes, or dying when we really play like dumb fools. We complain when something is out of balance and just one annoying freetime and mood killer.

What is it with some of you people of accusing us that we want to get stuff handed down to us for "nothing"?

We want fun and get some teamwork done - loot is for some of us only secondary. It's the fun of exploring, experiencing a story and being with other people in a team.

I rather spend 12 hours in a game, exploring and doing quests than wasting 2 hours on a middle-boss that either got pimped too good or was simply bugged.

And I give a rats ass, if someone gets his stuff easier or faster than me. It doesn't change anything about the fun or frustration I had with that quest/dungeon. If I had fun then I had fun, no matter if someone else does that so called face-roll in there.

If I want to achieve something, I do that in the real world. Let it be artistic, social, sports, at work and so on. That what I achieved remains, it won't go offline one day... game-achievements just go *poof* the day the game goes offline or I decide to switch to another game.

I feel honestly (without being sarcastic) sorry for people who only can define themselves by what they achieve in some MMORPG. And I feel even more sorry for them, when I experience their aggressive and desperate need to defend their "leet status" in a Game, by demanding that quests are not doable by normal players and need to be so hard, that most normal people with a life don't even bother.
It only shows how very little they must probably have in their real world life. Otherwise they would not cling so desperately to their status-quo inside a game.

Now let's see how many trolls come by and want a chunk ;-)

Joy_Division

Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

You go beyond this and lie.

Have you been there with my group? Nope, you haven't been there.
But you claim that I am making stuff up here?

Really... for a troll you are not really creative. Insulting yes, but creative... nah.

I don't have to be in your group.

The Spider boss does *NOT* web multiple people at once. It does not happen. Yet you said:

The problem I see here is, that she kept webbing more than one player at the same time.

That simply is not the truth. Yes, you a making stuff up here to make a point.

I am not a troll for pointing out your dishonesty.

And this does not even get to this comment:

At the same time she spawned a huge zerg of spiders

That is NOT a huge zerg of spiders. It is like 4 or 5 spawns of weak adds that simply need to be AoEd down that is a common mechanic in boss fights.

If you plead with ZoS to change the game and your feedback to ZoS is describing game elements that are not true, then I will call you out on it.

Milf_Hero

Its not just COH. Its dungeons like BC the second in the ple

yodased wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMPKDr05DoY&noredirect=1

yeah your guy is right about you guys using magic and not weapon based attacks. lol Also im guessing you have top notch gear based of that guy having a deadra fighting next to him. it probably took you a little slower since your overall dps was clicked by whatever weapon damage you would have been using in-between spell cast. hats off to your group though, you finished the dungeon, proved people wrong. *thumbs up* It doesn't really matter though. You get 100 people saying something is difficult, then zos will probably nerf it. Just like how they recently adjusted dungeons to make them slightly weaker.

also you didn't do the gold key challenge for COH vet difficulty. That might have been slightly more impressive.

now I should prolly put some useful input in. Unfortunately, @Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO‌ skybladeb16_ESO Thesse vet dungeons, pvp, craglorn, etc. all need dedicated vr14 groups/guilds. You can sometimes group with some good groups but some good players have higher standards on what randoms they pick up. One of the only ways to have a good time at end game is to find a group that is there for fun and will try as many times with in any activity or to find an elitist group that A. will carry you, B. values what you bring to a 4 man group, or C. all of the above. Just like yodased in the video didn't have randoms in his vid. he brought skilled people in and even though it looked like they were effin around, they actually had to pay some attention so that each roll did what they needed to do. Healer did his healing. tank did his tanking, and dps did their deeps. I think they should have presented it better. It came off rude to me. Especially when one of the member said they bet people who couldn't get it done would be so mad when they saw that video.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments]

Sublime

I think the problem with COH is, that many people forget that it is not one of the original dungeons (nevertheless I agree there are some bosses that are surprisingly difficult, much harder than the rest, in the original ones), but got added later on. So if I understood the devs correctly when they released it it was meant to be a bit harder than the ones already existing. It's the same with COA today, it is like COA is COH next level. I don't know however why ZOS decided to create a COH pledge, maybe they wanted to give players an incentive to explore new difficulties.

Jacques Berge

I still stand firm in my opinion: none of the vet dungeons are too hard. Vet CoA is certainly challenging. PuGs should not be able do this content. Get better gear, make a better team, L2P please. These QQ forums are ludicrous.

pppontus

Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO wrote: »

Okee, where do I start.
Yesterday I found a nice PuG - we did Elden Hollow VR 14 Vet Pledge.

No Teamspeak (I asked, everyone was like - no sorry).
Well, what can I say. I was first-timer in that dungeon. Only one knew what would come. The rest never got to the end before.

We only wiped once at Bogdan, because one of the team accidentally clicked the wrong button. *** happens.
It wasn't easy, but compared to that spider daedra experience - that was a friggin walk in the park. No bugged zerg-frenzy adds.

That showed me that my build cannot be that wrong and that i actually know my class well enough ... nor that a PuG is a bad thing or that TS is always needed.
As I said. We only had one with us who knew that quest. But even all his knowledge could not have prevented us from failing, if we all were oh so terrible builds or player.

Sorry, but Elden can be 3-manned blindfolded

I just don't understand why you feel the need to be so defensive. As you can clearly see there are a lot of people who don't have any trouble with CoH, the spider doesn't web multiple people at the same time (if you don't untie them maybe you can eventually have 2 webbed players), and the "spider zerg" is like 5 spiders with 5K health or something. Should take no more than a few seconds to kill them.

If you can't do this you should look at your build, your team and your skills. That's just the way it is. If you defend yourself by saying "but I can do this so I must be great" you won't improve. If you don't want to improve, that's fine, but don't go around asking for nerfs to content that can already quite easily be speedrun deathless by a large part of the playerbase.

G0ku

Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO wrote: »

Another thing,
some people claiming that me and people who have a similar view are just lazy gits who want good loot free house...(I summarized here)

Merely because some of us request "balanced" peldges or the choice to finish them at a different difficulty, doesn't mean that we want things for free.
We do not complain about dying sometimes, or dying when we really play like dumb fools. We complain when something is out of balance and just one annoying freetime and mood killer.

What is it with some of you people of accusing us that we want to get stuff handed down to us for "nothing"?

We want fun and get some teamwork done - loot is for some of us only secondary. It's the fun of exploring, experiencing a story and being with other people in a team.

I rather spend 12 hours in a game, exploring and doing quests than wasting 2 hours on a middle-boss that either got pimped too good or was simply bugged.

And I give a rats ass, if someone gets his stuff easier or faster than me. It doesn't change anything about the fun or frustration I had with that quest/dungeon. If I had fun then I had fun, no matter if someone else does that so called face-roll in there.

If I want to achieve something, I do that in the real world. Let it be artistic, social, sports, at work and so on. That what I achieved remains, it won't go offline one day... game-achievements just go *poof* the day the game goes offline or I decide to switch to another game.

I feel honestly (without being sarcastic) sorry for people who only can define themselves by what they achieve in some MMORPG. And I feel even more sorry for them, when I experience their aggressive and desperate need to defend their "leet status" in a Game, by demanding that quests are not doable by normal players and need to be so hard, that most normal people with a life don't even bother.
It only shows how very little they must probably have in their real world life. Otherwise they would not cling so desperately to their status-quo inside a game.

Now let's see how many trolls come by and want a chunk ;-)

You say you want fun and get teamwork done, now I tell you the same from the other end of the line.

As DSA came out me and my 3 mates finished the normal mode in first run and started Vetmode as soon as we get VR14.

We refused to look at guides or ask for advice as we wanted to achieve it for ourselves (admittedly we had to ask for advice for round 9 later). It took us nearly three weeks to finish DSA Veteran Mode. By that time we knew nearly every place and time of mob spawns, etc.

With some following patch they made it far easier with less mobs, they don´t hit that hard any more.

On one hand it doesn´t bother me that others can now do it, I am not that kind of a person you described. But on the other hand we feel cheated because all our efforts are now completely useless, it feels like (I know it´s still hard to do it) every other cheap dungeon out there. It´s not much of a challenge.

Also talking to other groups which made it to stage 9 before they nerfed everything, they also feel cheated. By the nerf they took away the possibility for them to prove they also can do it on what I call now hard-hardmode.

There is a separate tab called "achievements". Your brain won´t differ between achieving something in real life or online. It just kicks out endorphins for achieving something, it just differs from person to person where they get their kick from.

Just because people they have achieved something in TESO doesn´t mean they haven´t achieved something in real life. And as in real life it causes you a bitter feeling when someone gets something handed free for which you had to work your a$$ off.

And it´s not that things haven´t been nerfed before. For the people who play since start of the game and can compare the state of difficulty back then and now, well it´s just laughable.

But I never would want to exclude anybody from specific content, that´s just egoistic bs. IMO best option would be the possibilty to adjust difficulty of the vet dungeons like in every single player game. Same loot, same undaunted exp, every thing should be the same so it would not put you at a disadvantage.

But the one thing where my E-Pen kicks in: Hardmode Achievements and titles. Boethia´s Scythe is nothing more than legionary in my eyes now, and that hurts me - because we spent so much time on beating the real deal. If they would grant a separate title for that I would be fine with that.

You can pity me for that attitude but don´t think my e-pen thingy is a result of a failed real-life, I can guarantee you this isn´t the cause.

Iduyenn

Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO wrote: »

Okee, where do I start.
Yesterday I found a nice PuG - we did Elden Hollow VR 14 Vet Pledge.

No Teamspeak (I asked, everyone was like - no sorry).
Well, what can I say. I was first-timer in that dungeon. Only one knew what would come. The rest never got to the end before.

We only wiped once at Bogdan, because one of the team accidentally clicked the wrong button. *** happens.
It wasn't easy, but compared to that spider daedra experience - that was a friggin walk in the park. No bugged zerg-frenzy adds.

That showed me that my build cannot be that wrong and that i actually know my class well enough ... nor that a PuG is a bad thing or that TS is always needed.
As I said. We only had one with us who knew that quest. But even all his knowledge could not have prevented us from failing, if we all were oh so terrible builds or player.

Another thing,
some people claiming that me and people who have a similar view are just lazy gits who want good loot free house...(I summarized here)

Merely because some of us request "balanced" peldges or the choice to finish them at a different difficulty, doesn't mean that we want things for free.
We do not complain about dying sometimes, or dying when we really play like dumb fools. We complain when something is out of balance and just one annoying freetime and mood killer.

What is it with some of you people of accusing us that we want to get stuff handed down to us for "nothing"?

We want fun and get some teamwork done - loot is for some of us only secondary. It's the fun of exploring, experiencing a story and being with other people in a team.

I rather spend 12 hours in a game, exploring and doing quests than wasting 2 hours on a middle-boss that either got pimped too good or was simply bugged.

And I give a rats ass, if someone gets his stuff easier or faster than me. It doesn't change anything about the fun or frustration I had with that quest/dungeon. If I had fun then I had fun, no matter if someone else does that so called face-roll in there.

If I want to achieve something, I do that in the real world. Let it be artistic, social, sports, at work and so on. That what I achieved remains, it won't go offline one day... game-achievements just go *poof* the day the game goes offline or I decide to switch to another game.

I feel honestly (without being sarcastic) sorry for people who only can define themselves by what they achieve in some MMORPG. And I feel even more sorry for them, when I experience their aggressive and desperate need to defend their "leet status" in a Game, by demanding that quests are not doable by normal players and need to be so hard, that most normal people with a life don't even bother.
It only shows how very little they must probably have in their real world life. Otherwise they would not cling so desperately to their status-quo inside a game.

Now let's see how many trolls come by and want a chunk ;-)

Sorry, but i think we all now about the trolls...

Especially ppl ignoring the numbers...

If your group suceeded, it isnt automatically the approval of your playstile. If you are a dd and do 500dps (because you are running around, hitting the black and white mobs... if you are doing hardmode at all..) you do even less dmg).
Then there is your second DD doing 3 to 4 times the dmg you do... you see the math? There is the possibility, that one person can outdo you by the factor of three to four. Be four times you... imagine that.
And with 500 dps there is a chance, that the Tank and healer does the same amount of dmg.

What do you want? That everyone who plays his character with 25% of it`s potential can faceroll through every instance?

Dalglish

Can I ask what faction and region you play this game? I'd like to come along and see what you are doing wrong; there is no nerf needed for me. I dpsed CoH in tank gear and still managed to do enough dps to complete.

In my normal dps gear i can hit 2k+ dps with evil hunter procs, even with the running around.

Only thing that needs changing is like someone said, certain bosses are ignoring blocking and hitting for full damage on all attacks.

Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO

Let's quote what I wrote...

Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO wrote: »

I feel honestly (without being sarcastic) sorry for people who only can define themselves by what they achieve in some MMORPG. And I feel even more sorry for them, when I experience their aggressive and desperate need to defend their "leet status" in a Game, by demanding that quests are not doable by normal players and need to be so hard, that most normal people with a life don't even bother.
It only shows how very little they must probably have in their real world life. Otherwise they would not cling so desperately to their status-quo inside a game.

Let's have a look at what you wrote...

G0ku wrote: »

Just because people they have achieved something in TESO doesn´t mean they haven´t achieved something in real life.

Well, I never wrote/said that someone who achieves something in a game has nothing achieved in his real life. If I did, please, I am serious here, point out where I wrote that?!

G0ku wrote: »

And as in real life it causes you a bitter feeling when someone gets something handed free for which you had to work your a$$ off.

Let's agree that you and I do not agree here.
Some people may feel about it like that, some people don't.

For me, and that is my own humble opinion, it is really a sad thing, if people define themselves over any achievement inside of a game and take it as serious as a real-world achievement. And on top of that get aggressive, rude and demeaning about it towards others. (not implying that you were rude, I mean that in general)

"working your arse off" That's not the point of a game. It's not some job, unless that person really makes a living with this.

Hortator Mopa

Jacques Berge wrote: »

I still stand firm in my opinion: none of the vet dungeons are too hard. Vet CoA is certainly challenging. PuGs should not be able do this content. Get better gear, make a better team, L2P please. These QQ forums are ludicrous.

I agree.
Even COA Vet on HM becomes simple after a few runs... After the second run I was doing it with my team with no sound, no voice chat and while watching game streams on my second screen lol.