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Is there a dominant class in PvP?
Messy1
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Ok, I have seen a majority of people posting that Dragon Knight is an OP dominant class in PvP and even in PvE. Is this true? It seems to me I have seen plenty of other classes field some pretty dominant/ tough to kill characters in Cyrodil with the other classes and other builds. What do you think?
Edited by Messy1 on November 18, 2014 12:59PM Is there a dominant class in PvP? 557 votes
Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvP
56%
317 votes
Templar is the dominant class in PvP
3%
19 votes
Nightblade is the dominant class in PvP
5%
28 votes
Sorcerer is the dominant class in PvP
3%
18 votes
There is no dominant class in PvP
10%
61 votes
A dominant class is situational i.e. DKs are good against in mass melees, Sorcerers are good at kiting/gank, Nightblades are only good at ganking, Templars are the best healers.
20%
114 votes
16
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Govalon✭✭✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPDK is the best for every role but healing. This includes pve and pvp.Edited by Govalon on November 18, 2014 1:40PM27 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭There is no dominant class in PvPThere are no dominant classes, just dominant players.Edited by Armitas on November 18, 2014 2:00PMRetired.
Nord mDK49 -
Messy1✭✭✭✭✭
✭A dominant class is situational i.e. DKs are good against in mass melees, Sorcerers are good at kiting/gank, Nightblades are only good at ganking, Templars are the best healers.It just occurred to me . . . I believe that class dominance would be mitigated if more strategies were employed to coordinate alliance groups. I wonder if it would be useful for a menu to be added to each campaign in which players of an alliance could see all the current groups that their alliance has in Cyrodil. When someone forms a group in Cyrodil they could have the option of designating the particular task that group wants to accomplish with an additional description window detailing strategy. For example say I have a Templar in the EP; I enter Cyrodil on my own and want to siege a keep and be a healer so I ask to join the group titled "Siege" or maybe I'm a nightblade and want to gank so I join the "Gank" group, or perhaps I am a sorcerer and want to assault resources so I join the "Resource Assault" group. This would not just be a useful feature for PUGs, but also for guilds who organize their own groups it would allow guildies to quickly go into Cyrodil, find their group on campaign group menu and then simply ask to join. The only thing I am hesitant about is if ZOS could pull off a GOOD grouping PvP tool in Cyrodil. No offense, but the LFG tool in the rest of Tamriel is kinda hurting . . .2 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭There is no dominant class in PvP
I think that may be due to the fact that DK's are far easier to play making even non dominant players appear dominant. That and we have excellent DK player support that regularly posts builds which help new DKs get better faster.Edited by Armitas on November 18, 2014 1:58PMRetired.
Nord mDK15 -
Messy1✭✭✭✭✭
✭A dominant class is situational i.e. DKs are good against in mass melees, Sorcerers are good at kiting/gank, Nightblades are only good at ganking, Templars are the best healers.Recently I've been seeing some pretty hard to kill and effective sorcerers just kite whole alliance groups and just pull them away from their objectives. Of course groups have to take the bait and the sorcerer needs some support, but it's pretty cool.2 -
Nihili✭✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPThere are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
No, they don't.
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
No, it wouldn't.
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Baiting]
Edited by ZOS_ShannonM on December 3, 2014 12:37AM29 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭There is no dominant class in PvPThere are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.Edited by Armitas on November 18, 2014 2:26PMRetired.
Nord mDK10 -
dharbert✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭There is no dominant class in PvPThere is no dominant class in PvP. It all comes down to L2P. I'm a DK and I've had my butt handed to me by NB's plenty of times.13 -
guybrushtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPThere are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
No, they don't.
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
No, it wouldn't.
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
Pretty much that. Easier to play on all skill levels and in all situations equals being better.
[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]Edited by ZOS_ShannonM on December 3, 2014 12:38AM8 -
Pmarsico9✭✭✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPDK's are digital, every other class is analog.16
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AndropediaSoul ShrivenSorcerer is the dominant class in PvPSo we are reducing the which class is op discussion to the which class has the lowest skill level of entry. We already had that in every other MMORPG in existance. While I would agree that DK is the strongest of the classes because it is really versatile and is the natural pick in pvp, other classes can be dominant too.
*Well templar I have seen strong performance, but lets asume they have the highest level of skill entry to perform well.
Imho the problem we are facing is, that its way to easy to dominate in the "mid tier" (whatever this is supposed to be) of pvp with a dragon knight and the fact that you could teach a monkey do perform mediocre with a dragon knight.6 -
SaibotLiu✭✭✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPAbout half the remaining game population is DK. That's about all the poll results really say.
DK is not even OP. It's just that all the tweens heard how templar got nerfed just before launch and the "in" thing was to roll DK. So we have to keep DK in tip top shape to keep getting that mommy's credit card money.9 -
Hypertionb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPallow me to explain..
DKs have massive close range potential innate to their class as well as the most powerful midigation spell vs ranged attacks, as well as an effective self heal.
with any build, a DK will preform better in PVP than any other class..
Magicka = Relfective Scales for days, Talons spaming or Whipping to death players, and of course one of the most powerful AOE over time ultimates in the game. Lots of magicka also means lots of heals.
Stamina = ability to spam bow attacks against other bow users and thanks to Reflective Scales, counter sniping is 100% ineffective. in Melee, you can still do more than any other class again thanks to Talons and the class self heal is based on Max HP rather than being related to Spell power and magicka so its as effective as on a magicka build, tho less spammable.
Heavy = Natural Tanky Ness coupled with Heavy armor? DKs are the best at pulling off this setup and again, thanks to how their abilitys work, they are no worse off for the most part.
no matter what build they take they are 100% immune to ranged in general thanks to one skill, and their heal is universally effective no matter the build. Even resource management is solved by a passive.
Dragon Knights are a class with No weaknesses and nothing but strengths.
as a result, they are flat out the best in PvP, with only player skill being the only possible advantage a player of another class might have..I play every class in every situation. I love them all.21 -
Nihili✭✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPThere are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.
If I were you I would review what I said and keep my eye out for two straw man fallacies.
Done that? Kay here's my response:
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massiv e gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
This is your first straw man fallacy: You got me wrong - I'm not saying that the easy learning curve of DKs make them OP, I'm saying DKs are OP and because of that they have an easy learning curve. It's easy to good with a class that is already better than everyone else. While I'm on this point, this was in response to what this person said:
I think that may be due to the fact that DK's are far easier to play making even non dominant players appear dominant. That and we have excellent DK player support that regularly posts builds which help new DKs get better faster.
So I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth there
That out of the way though…There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
This is your second straw man fallacy: We're not talking about 1v1s - we're talking about PvP here. And so no matter what happens in one little dueling guild, we don't care because we'll have to look at the facts that represent PvP in its entirety - these being the leader-boards. And if you "can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day" - then I'm assuming you're argument here is based on people are actually doing this and getting to the top of the leader-boards.
Which is ridiculous.
Lastly… the poll really isn't in your favor here, bro.4 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭There is no dominant class in PvPThere are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.
If I were you I would review what I said and keep my eye out for two straw man fallacies.
Done that? Kay here's my response:
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massiv e gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
This is your first straw man fallacy: You got me wrong - I'm not saying that the easy learning curve of DKs make them OP, I'm saying DKs are OP and because of that they have an easy learning curve. It's easy to good with a class that is already better than everyone else. While I'm on this point, this was in response to what this person said:
I think that may be due to the fact that DK's are far easier to play making even non dominant players appear dominant. That and we have excellent DK player support that regularly posts builds which help new DKs get better faster.
So I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth there
That out of the way though…There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
This is your second straw man fallacy: We're not talking about 1v1s - we're talking about PvP here. And so no matter what happens in one little dueling guild, we don't care because we'll have to look at the facts that represent PvP in its entirety - these being the leader-boards. And if you "can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day" - then I'm assuming you're argument here is based on people are actually doing this and getting to the top of the leader-boards.
Which is ridiculous.
Lastly… the poll really isn't in your favor here, bro.
That is not straw manning. When you post a sarcastic troll post with little information expect that people will not understand what you are saying. If you want to make a point people understand don't troll and don't be sarcastic.
Secondly if you are going to use terms like strawman don't also "appeal to the majority" in the same post.
Addressing your points.- Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
- PvP stands for Player vs Player. A 1v1 is a player vs a player. That is actually PvP even though that is not your preferred style of PvP. As evidenced by the bloodporting the leaderboards are not an accurate representation of domination. The leaderboards are a representation of AP earned received.
Edited by Armitas on November 18, 2014 3:47PMRetired.
Nord mDK6 - Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
-
OrangeTheCat✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPIf vampires are a class, then "yes".6 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPI'm pretty sure the majority opinion is clear.:trollin:7 -
Pmarsico9✭✭✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPThere are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.
If I were you I would review what I said and keep my eye out for two straw man fallacies.
Done that? Kay here's my response:
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massiv e gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
This is your first straw man fallacy: You got me wrong - I'm not saying that the easy learning curve of DKs make them OP, I'm saying DKs are OP and because of that they have an easy learning curve. It's easy to good with a class that is already better than everyone else. While I'm on this point, this was in response to what this person said:
I think that may be due to the fact that DK's are far easier to play making even non dominant players appear dominant. That and we have excellent DK player support that regularly posts builds which help new DKs get better faster.
So I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth there
That out of the way though…There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
This is your second straw man fallacy: We're not talking about 1v1s - we're talking about PvP here. And so no matter what happens in one little dueling guild, we don't care because we'll have to look at the facts that represent PvP in its entirety - these being the leader-boards. And if you "can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day" - then I'm assuming you're argument here is based on people are actually doing this and getting to the top of the leader-boards.
Which is ridiculous.
Lastly… the poll really isn't in your favor here, bro.
That is not straw manning. When you post a sarcastic troll post with little information expect that people will not understand what you are saying. If you want to make a point people understand don't troll and don't be sarcastic.
Secondly if you are going to use terms like strawman don't also "appeal to the majority" in the same post.
Addressing your points.- Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
- PvP Stand for Player vs Player. A 1v1 is a player vs a player. That is actually PvP even though that is not your prefered style of PvP. As evidenced by the bloodporting the leaderboards are not an accurate representation of domination. The leaderboards are a representation of AP earned received.
It's a poll, the poll doesn't support you, so you get esoteric in justifying why the poll is wrong.
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Trolling & Baiting]Edited by ZOS_ShannonM on December 3, 2014 12:47AM3 - Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
-
OrangeTheCat✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPAndropedia wrote: »
Yeah, poll participants are self-selected. So hardly representative. Anyone here who appeals to the authority of a forum poll needs to go back to Sampling Theory 101.5 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭There is no dominant class in PvPThere are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.
If I were you I would review what I said and keep my eye out for two straw man fallacies.
Done that? Kay here's my response:
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massiv e gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
This is your first straw man fallacy: You got me wrong - I'm not saying that the easy learning curve of DKs make them OP, I'm saying DKs are OP and because of that they have an easy learning curve. It's easy to good with a class that is already better than everyone else. While I'm on this point, this was in response to what this person said:
I think that may be due to the fact that DK's are far easier to play making even non dominant players appear dominant. That and we have excellent DK player support that regularly posts builds which help new DKs get better faster.
So I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth there
That out of the way though…There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
This is your second straw man fallacy: We're not talking about 1v1s - we're talking about PvP here. And so no matter what happens in one little dueling guild, we don't care because we'll have to look at the facts that represent PvP in its entirety - these being the leader-boards. And if you "can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day" - then I'm assuming you're argument here is based on people are actually doing this and getting to the top of the leader-boards.
Which is ridiculous.
Lastly… the poll really isn't in your favor here, bro.
That is not straw manning. When you post a sarcastic troll post with little information expect that people will not understand what you are saying. If you want to make a point people understand don't troll and don't be sarcastic.
Secondly if you are going to use terms like strawman don't also "appeal to the majority" in the same post.
Addressing your points.- Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
- PvP Stand for Player vs Player. A 1v1 is a player vs a player. That is actually PvP even though that is not your prefered style of PvP. As evidenced by the bloodporting the leaderboards are not an accurate representation of domination. The leaderboards are a representation of AP earned received.
It's a poll, the poll doesn't support you, so you get esoteric in justifying why the poll is wrong.
Esoteric? What have I said that is esoteric? I have not said the poll is wrong. The poll represents the amount of people that believe DKs are dominant. Unless people are mistakenly voting the poll is not wrong.
Now if you think the amount of people that think DKs are dominant means that they are dominant, then... wow. And if you think 50 people is statistically significant then double wow.
[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]Edited by ZOS_ShannonM on December 3, 2014 12:50AMRetired.
Nord mDK4 - Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
-
bosmern_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭There is no dominant class in PvPThe class is only as good as the player.
People say that NB's are only good at ganking, that's false. When I was a NB shadow tank I was able to run into zergs with 50%+ dodge rating and 4618 health (not emp), drop a veil, and spam sap essence and I could kill a decent amount of them.
I've also been a NB healer, which is very useful. Sure I don't have as much burst heal as a templar but I had an unlimited amount of resources due to leeching strikes, so I was able to no stop spam heal.
And I also have a V14 DK that i use for ganking, he's primarily made for fighting 1v1 (i dont use talons or anything).
But there is no one 'best class', every class can be the best class and yes, each class does have their strengths and weaknesses but those changes dependent on your build. For example, with my NB tank, I could take on 20+ people and not go down but I wouldn't really be able to kill much, which was my weakness. When I have my NB made for ganking its very different, I'll be lucky to take on 2 people but there is no doubt I can kill at least one.~Thallen~5 -
OrangeTheCat✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPThere are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.
If I were you I would review what I said and keep my eye out for two straw man fallacies.
Done that? Kay here's my response:
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massiv e gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
This is your first straw man fallacy: You got me wrong - I'm not saying that the easy learning curve of DKs make them OP, I'm saying DKs are OP and because of that they have an easy learning curve. It's easy to good with a class that is already better than everyone else. While I'm on this point, this was in response to what this person said:
I think that may be due to the fact that DK's are far easier to play making even non dominant players appear dominant. That and we have excellent DK player support that regularly posts builds which help new DKs get better faster.
So I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth there
That out of the way though…There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
This is your second straw man fallacy: We're not talking about 1v1s - we're talking about PvP here. And so no matter what happens in one little dueling guild, we don't care because we'll have to look at the facts that represent PvP in its entirety - these being the leader-boards. And if you "can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day" - then I'm assuming you're argument here is based on people are actually doing this and getting to the top of the leader-boards.
Which is ridiculous.
Lastly… the poll really isn't in your favor here, bro.
That is not straw manning. When you post a sarcastic troll post with little information expect that people will not understand what you are saying. If you want to make a point people understand don't troll and don't be sarcastic.
Secondly if you are going to use terms like strawman don't also "appeal to the majority" in the same post.
Addressing your points.- Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
- PvP Stand for Player vs Player. A 1v1 is a player vs a player. That is actually PvP even though that is not your prefered style of PvP. As evidenced by the bloodporting the leaderboards are not an accurate representation of domination. The leaderboards are a representation of AP earned received.
It's a poll, the poll doesn't support you, so you get esoteric in justifying why the poll is wrong.
Hipster obstinate trolling is the worst kind of trolling.
Esoteric? What have I said that is esoteric? I have not said the poll is wrong. The poll represents the amount of people that believe DKs are dominant. Unless people are mistakenly voting the poll is not wrong.
Now if you think the amount of people that think DKs are dominant means that they are dominant, then... wow. And if you think 50 people is statistically significant then double wow.
Sorry, you are wrong about the relevance of this poll. I don't care one whit about your little debate nor the topic of this poll. But the best that you can claim about this poll is that a small sample of self-selected individuals say that DKs are the dominant class in PvP. In no way can you claim the results of the poll can be generalized to the larger population. And using the poll results to support your case is risky at best.Edited by OrangeTheCat on November 18, 2014 3:56PM4 - Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
-
Aeratus✭✭✭✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPI think it's generally accepted that DKs are are the dominant class in PVP in general. This sample is representative of the larger population.3
-
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭There is no dominant class in PvPOrangeTheCat wrote: »There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.
If I were you I would review what I said and keep my eye out for two straw man fallacies.
Done that? Kay here's my response:
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massiv e gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
This is your first straw man fallacy: You got me wrong - I'm not saying that the easy learning curve of DKs make them OP, I'm saying DKs are OP and because of that they have an easy learning curve. It's easy to good with a class that is already better than everyone else. While I'm on this point, this was in response to what this person said:
I think that may be due to the fact that DK's are far easier to play making even non dominant players appear dominant. That and we have excellent DK player support that regularly posts builds which help new DKs get better faster.
So I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth there
That out of the way though…There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
This is your second straw man fallacy: We're not talking about 1v1s - we're talking about PvP here. And so no matter what happens in one little dueling guild, we don't care because we'll have to look at the facts that represent PvP in its entirety - these being the leader-boards. And if you "can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day" - then I'm assuming you're argument here is based on people are actually doing this and getting to the top of the leader-boards.
Which is ridiculous.
Lastly… the poll really isn't in your favor here, bro.
That is not straw manning. When you post a sarcastic troll post with little information expect that people will not understand what you are saying. If you want to make a point people understand don't troll and don't be sarcastic.
Secondly if you are going to use terms like strawman don't also "appeal to the majority" in the same post.
Addressing your points.- Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
- PvP Stand for Player vs Player. A 1v1 is a player vs a player. That is actually PvP even though that is not your prefered style of PvP. As evidenced by the bloodporting the leaderboards are not an accurate representation of domination. The leaderboards are a representation of AP earned received.
It's a poll, the poll doesn't support you, so you get esoteric in justifying why the poll is wrong.
Hipster obstinate trolling is the worst kind of trolling.
Esoteric? What have I said that is esoteric? I have not said the poll is wrong. The poll represents the amount of people that believe DKs are dominant. Unless people are mistakenly voting the poll is not wrong.
Now if you think the amount of people that think DKs are dominant means that they are dominant, then... wow. And if you think 50 people is statistically significant then double wow.
Sorry, you are wrong. I don't care one whit about your little debate. But the best that you can claim about this poll is that a small sample of self-selected individuals say that DKs are the dominant class in PvP. In no way can you claim the results of the poll can be generalized to the larger population. And using the poll results to support your case is risky at best.
I'm confused, are you quoting the right person? I ask because that is exactly what I was trying to convey in my last remark.Edited by Armitas on November 18, 2014 4:03PMRetired.
Nord mDK4 - Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
-
Epsilon_Echo✭✭✭✭There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
No, they don't.
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
No, it wouldn't.
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
Current Chillrend leaderboard (Overall)
DK: 30
Temp: 23
Sorc: 24
NB: 23
Not really as off balance as you were assuming huh?
Thornblade (Overall)
DK: 31
Temp: 21
Sorc: 22
NB: 26
[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]Edited by ZOS_ShannonM on December 3, 2014 12:51AM3 -
SaibotLiu✭✭✭✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPOrangeTheCat wrote: »There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.
If I were you I would review what I said and keep my eye out for two straw man fallacies.
Done that? Kay here's my response:
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massiv e gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
This is your first straw man fallacy: You got me wrong - I'm not saying that the easy learning curve of DKs make them OP, I'm saying DKs are OP and because of that they have an easy learning curve. It's easy to good with a class that is already better than everyone else. While I'm on this point, this was in response to what this person said:
I think that may be due to the fact that DK's are far easier to play making even non dominant players appear dominant. That and we have excellent DK player support that regularly posts builds which help new DKs get better faster.
So I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth there
That out of the way though…There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
This is your second straw man fallacy: We're not talking about 1v1s - we're talking about PvP here. And so no matter what happens in one little dueling guild, we don't care because we'll have to look at the facts that represent PvP in its entirety - these being the leader-boards. And if you "can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day" - then I'm assuming you're argument here is based on people are actually doing this and getting to the top of the leader-boards.
Which is ridiculous.
Lastly… the poll really isn't in your favor here, bro.
That is not straw manning. When you post a sarcastic troll post with little information expect that people will not understand what you are saying. If you want to make a point people understand don't troll and don't be sarcastic.
Secondly if you are going to use terms like strawman don't also "appeal to the majority" in the same post.
Addressing your points.- Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
- PvP Stand for Player vs Player. A 1v1 is a player vs a player. That is actually PvP even though that is not your prefered style of PvP. As evidenced by the bloodporting the leaderboards are not an accurate representation of domination. The leaderboards are a representation of AP earned received.
It's a poll, the poll doesn't support you, so you get esoteric in justifying why the poll is wrong.
Hipster obstinate trolling is the worst kind of trolling.
Esoteric? What have I said that is esoteric? I have not said the poll is wrong. The poll represents the amount of people that believe DKs are dominant. Unless people are mistakenly voting the poll is not wrong.
Now if you think the amount of people that think DKs are dominant means that they are dominant, then... wow. And if you think 50 people is statistically significant then double wow.
And using the poll results to support your case is risky at best.
Risky in what way? Are all the DK nerds are going to shake their fists in our general direction?
How dare you accost me sir.
That said, this isn't really much of a debate.
0 - Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
-
Kvasir Silverpaw✭✭✭There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
No, they don't.
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
No, it wouldn't.
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
lots of fluff. no filler.
[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]
Edited by ZOS_ShannonM on December 3, 2014 12:51AM2 -
OrangeTheCat✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dragon Knight is the dominant class in PvPOrangeTheCat wrote: »There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.
If I were you I would review what I said and keep my eye out for two straw man fallacies.
Done that? Kay here's my response:
The learning curve of a class does not make it OP, it just makes it easier to learn.There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massiv e gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
This is your first straw man fallacy: You got me wrong - I'm not saying that the easy learning curve of DKs make them OP, I'm saying DKs are OP and because of that they have an easy learning curve. It's easy to good with a class that is already better than everyone else. While I'm on this point, this was in response to what this person said:
I think that may be due to the fact that DK's are far easier to play making even non dominant players appear dominant. That and we have excellent DK player support that regularly posts builds which help new DKs get better faster.
So I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth there
That out of the way though…There are no dominant classes, just dominant players.
Of course.
And I'm sure the leader-boards prove what you're saying right?
But I guess if there was a massive gap between DK players' AP and the other classes, that would just be coincidence right?
But I mean, it could just be because DKs are "easy to play", right? That's why there's a difference, bad players find it easy to be good with a DK?
Oh…
Could that be because DK's are OP?
What do you think leaderboards represent? You can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day. If you want a more accurate description of who is 1:1 more dominant look into legends.
This is your second straw man fallacy: We're not talking about 1v1s - we're talking about PvP here. And so no matter what happens in one little dueling guild, we don't care because we'll have to look at the facts that represent PvP in its entirety - these being the leader-boards. And if you "can get to the top of the leader boards sitting in bloodport zone all day" - then I'm assuming you're argument here is based on people are actually doing this and getting to the top of the leader-boards.
Which is ridiculous.
Lastly… the poll really isn't in your favor here, bro.
That is not straw manning. When you post a sarcastic troll post with little information expect that people will not understand what you are saying. If you want to make a point people understand don't troll and don't be sarcastic.
Secondly if you are going to use terms like strawman don't also "appeal to the majority" in the same post.
Addressing your points.- Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
- PvP Stand for Player vs Player. A 1v1 is a player vs a player. That is actually PvP even though that is not your prefered style of PvP. As evidenced by the bloodporting the leaderboards are not an accurate representation of domination. The leaderboards are a representation of AP earned received.
It's a poll, the poll doesn't support you, so you get esoteric in justifying why the poll is wrong.
Hipster obstinate trolling is the worst kind of trolling.
Esoteric? What have I said that is esoteric? I have not said the poll is wrong. The poll represents the amount of people that believe DKs are dominant. Unless people are mistakenly voting the poll is not wrong.
Now if you think the amount of people that think DKs are dominant means that they are dominant, then... wow. And if you think 50 people is statistically significant then double wow.
Sorry, you are wrong. I don't care one whit about your little debate. But the best that you can claim about this poll is that a small sample of self-selected individuals say that DKs are the dominant class in PvP. In no way can you claim the results of the poll can be generalized to the larger population. And using the poll results to support your case is risky at best.
I'm confused, are you quoting the right person?
Maybe not. (blush?) I'm not following the back and forth of this debate very carefully and may have misattributed.
I am objecting to people appealing to the authority of a forum poll on statistical grounds. But I think my point went over some heads despite my edit for clarity.0 - Being OP does not necessitate a high learning curve. That is non sequitur. It's also question begging to say they are OP first, then to say that because they are OP they have an easier learning curve, therefore they are OP.
