Does ESO end all hope of a real TES online game?

KenjiJU

R1ckyDaMan wrote: »

Ok for example a TES game with invite or drop in online features, so you can quest with a friend or 2 for example.

Does ESO end any chance of Bethesda adding any drop in/invite online features in future TES. Alot of people only wanted to quest with a friend or 2 and not a full blown mmo because you might struggle with this but there are alot of people who do not like what an mmo brings.

I don't think it would. I don't think Bethesda moves out of its comfort zone very often though in terms of adding new features like that.

Selique

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

I don't really understand what you're asking exactly. If you are asking whether there will be another Elder Scrolls MMO, the answer is maybe. There have been several MMO's that have had sequels. EverQuest, EverQuest 2, and EverQuest Next for instance. Or Guild Wars and Guild Wars II. Or Star Wars: Galaxies and Star Wars: The Old Republic. If there was another MMO with the TES brand it would probably be run by ZOS because that is their online division.

If you're just asking if there will ever be a multiplayer component to a TES game then the answer again is maybe. There were rumors that Skyrim was going to be multiplayer, but so far no single player TES game has had multiplayer so it's just as likely that they won't in the future.

The question doesn't make sense and it relies on pure speculation, but more importantly it's completely irrelevant.

I just want to clear the air here. Star Wars: The Old Republic is NOT NOT NOT a sequel to Star Wars Galaxies. It is NOT. It just happened to come out after SWG. It has 0 relation to SWG in terms of Style, timeline, and gameplay. The only thing it shares in common is that SWTOR and SWG are/were both MMO's in the Star Wars setting.

Ok, I said my two cents.

Gillysan

Ref: Mac gaming
Any company that ignores the Apple users is losing money.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/sharifsakr/2014/04/24/apple-mac-sales-increase/
http://fortune.com/2014/07/23/mac-v-pc-in-3-charts/

That Forbes guy is wrong though, there are decent game capable Macs. However, they cost an arm & a leg. I'm a PC gamer BTW. If you can put your own computer together, the PC is the way to go without question. If your life only involves computer gaming, then an off the shelf PC will save you money. If you have a life and make money in the real world, then you have choice but I'll let the market speak for itself.

OP as someone suggested already, you should go post at the Bethseda forums. Wasting your time here.

R1ckyDaMan

Gillysan wrote: »

OP as someone suggested already, you should go post at the Bethseda forums. Wasting your time here.

I see your point it seems everyone just wants the mmo experience.

Stx

I am one of those long time TES fans that has always dreamed of an MMO TES game.

I am enjoying ESO and I don't plan on cancelling my sub anytime soon. But I have to say that I really don't think ESO is nearly as good as it could be. Well, thats putting it plainly. We all know it could be better from a stability and balance perspective. But what I mean is that all I really ever wanted was an online TES game, and what we got was an ES MMO.

This game only feels like half a TES game, and some might say that is to be expected... But I am of the opinion that if they worked as hard as possible to make this game as close to the single player games as possible, it would be more successful.

Lets be honest, the only thing keeping this game afloat is the ES label. The game has beautiful landscapes, even if they aren't as open and are separated by loading screens. The music is amazing, the voice acting is wonderful. The leveling and questing experience is better than any MMO I have ever played. This game got a lot of things right. But I think this game needs a lot more sandbox, and a lot more polish.

As for your topic question.... I don't think another online TES will ever happen after this... This game may actually be a success financially for ZOS, but I think for most critics and fans, it fell way short of what we were hoping for, and will make another attempt at the same type of game really hard for a company to try and commit to.

To me, ESO is good enough to hold me over until the next single player TES... And you never know! They could end up making it a really good game over time. There are still big balance issues and the performance issues in Cyrodiil.. and a lack of punishment for exploiters, but still, with each major patch, I think this game has gotten better and better. Hopefully the justice system is a success, that should add a lot of fun to the game.

Vahrokh

Stroggnonimus wrote: »

Lots of people hate on ESO, why ? Because they though this will be Skyrim 2 Online. But that just isn't possible. World is too small, crafting system doesnt fit an MMO, quests are single player, no content that could be played as Multiplayer and so on and so forth. Personally, I'm happy with ESO. It deserves having The Elder Scrolls name.

Well, they should have made a larger world, less "predictable" with maps that force you to go from one to the next through 1 door.
Also, what always miffed me about ESO is how, despite its legacy, it can't hold a candle - exploration, hidden places and treasures wise - to a very shallow (PvE speaking) MMO like GW2.
It sort of saddens me a 2003 MMO game I still have has larger, seamlessy mixing regions with so hard to find treasures - some of them giving unique recipes and enchants unavailable anywhere else.

Also, the same 2003 MMO has a stronger crafting system, where you can find items that are made of sub-parts (each requiring different craft schools).

Why do you say a crafting system "doesnt fin an MMO"?
Imo crafting helps making a game take and last longer to players. Fighting against the bank slots shortage should not be the only "end game crafter content" available.

Stx wrote: »

But I think this game needs a lot more sandbox, and a lot more polish.

Yeah. Wish it had a LOT more sandbox features.
Without going back to Middle Age, my grand-grand pas planned and then self built their 2-3 stories houses with their own hands, they even cooked the bricks!

Why can't my character create his own house? Or create his own siege machines to sell on the market for PvPers to use?
Other older MMOs have done this. Including the 2003 one. 2003.

2003.

Zorrashi

My impression of the game:
ESO is predominantly an MMO with a decent amount of TES qualities.
Of those qualities, I appreciate the small UI, the lack of skill restrictions (save for classes) and (decent) implementation of lore into this massive story-rich world.

But to answer the OP, while I myself don't desire anymore MMO features (that I know of), I think Bethesda has already proven themselves willing to add few more MMO typical features. Even if only a little bit (or a lot, depending on who you ask).

R1ckyDaMan

Just to mitigate some posts, I am not saying ESO is a bad MMO, it is a good MMO from the 2 and a half I have played.

The question is why would Bethesda waste time adding any online functionality
at all to any future TES games when this game exists.

So many people did not want an MMO, did not want a sub etc etc, what hope is left for those people now?

Oh and I have played since beta's in september last year and plan to stay subbed for a long time as it is a good MMO, just not the elder scrolls game I was waiting for since marrowind.

Now I just PVP though and try to pretend I am not playing an elder scrolls game.

SantieClaws

I hope that given time ESO will become more "elder scrolls" with more little things to make it feel like a living online world - more cooking and hunting options, more crafting options, small repeatable quests, more clothing options (normal clothing), housing etc. To have a long life an MMO needs both end game and "virtual life" elements and in time I hope to that more of those "virtual life" elements will be added. In Skyrim they were mostly added by mods and by DLC so it should not be any surprise that ESO lacks some of these things to begin with.

Mondo

If you expect something other then this game yes definately yes

Rune_Relic

If I had multiplayer TES with instanced dungeons and client hosting......would I miss ESO ?

TBH Yes.

I would miss the open world on the fly collaboration immensely. It makes the game dynamic and random in a way no NPC AI could ever hope to replicate.

ESO is the future of TES...its just a case of picking a path forward that everyone likes or at the very least doesnt find soul destroying. That path of compromise is the hardest aspect at the moment.

AlexDougherty

Stroggnonimus wrote: »

R1ckyDaMan wrote: »

So I hear all these MMO fans have been waiting years for a MMO with a TES skin to come out.

Well as it happens alot of TES fans have been waiting for a TES game to come out with online features, just not with all the MMO junk.

Do you think this game ends all hope of bethesda ever adding any online features at all to any future TES game?

Author fails to understand 1 very important thing -You can't just take Skyrim and suddenly make it online. No. It just won't workout. Skyrim wasn't designed as Online game (though co-op there would be nice ). Lots of people hate on ESO, why ? Because they though this will be Skyrim 2 Online. But that just isn't possible. World is too small, crafting system doesnt fit an MMO, quests are single player, no content that could be played as Multiplayer and so on and so forth. Personally, I'm happy with ESO. It deserves having The Elder Scrolls name.

I misread what the OP was asking for, ^^This^^ basically covers it, MMOs will never be as detailed as single player games, although a few are coming close.

R1ckyDaMan

I never said I wanted an MMO that was exactly like the single player games, nor did I ask for skyrim 2.0.

Someone nailed it with the Fable referance.

The ability to invite a friend into your world.

All alot of people asked for.

The Op is asking wether or not ESO makes it unlikely Bethesda will ever add any features like that to a TES game in the future.

And the constant Skyrim this Skyrim that is annoying, I enjoyed Marrowind far more than Skyrim, it is not the only game in the series.

BBSooner

ESO will have no bearing on whether Bethesda adds private session multiplayer to future TES. That said, TES has always centered around a single hero which allows the story writers to better give the sense of being the hero to the player, IMO of course. So though I don't think ESO will prevent it, I don't think Bethesda will add it, I think ESO will likely be the only Elder Scrolls multiplayer we'll get. And if not for ESO, I don't think we'd get it at all.

R1ckyDaMan

BBSooner wrote: »

ESO will have no bearing on whether Bethesda adds private session multiplayer to future TES. That said, TES has always centered around a single hero which allows the story writers to better give the sense of being the hero to the player, IMO of course. So though I don't think ESO will prevent it, I don't think Bethesda will add it, I think ESO will likely be the only Elder Scrolls multiplayer we'll get. And if not for ESO, I don't think we'd get it at all.

TBH id rather not have it all.

JessieColt

R1ckyDaMan wrote: »

Ok for example a TES game with invite or drop in online features, so you can quest with a friend or 2 for example.

Does ESO end any chance of Bethesda adding any drop in/invite online features in future TES. Alot of people only wanted to quest with a friend or 2 and not a full blown mmo because you might struggle with this but there are alot of people who do not like what an mmo brings.

What you are asking for is a Co-Op function. The ability to have a friend join you in a single player game for questing, etc.

That is not the same as an MMO.

None of us, who do not directly work for, or with, Bethesda have any idea what their plans are for the future.

Your request for that ability and functionality in a future TES game is better suited to the main Bethesda Forums where discussions occur regarding the offline games.

http://forums.bethsoft.com/

R1ckyDaMan

I know, I am active in a thread there about the issue.

I am asking if ESO will affect any decision.

BBSooner

R1ckyDaMan wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

ESO will have no bearing on whether Bethesda adds private session multiplayer to future TES. That said, TES has always centered around a single hero which allows the story writers to better give the sense of being the hero to the player, IMO of course. So though I don't think ESO will prevent it, I don't think Bethesda will add it, I think ESO will likely be the only Elder Scrolls multiplayer we'll get. And if not for ESO, I don't think we'd get it at all.

TBH id rather not have it all.

You're free to not play.

R1ckyDaMan

BBSooner wrote: »

You're free to not play.

As I said earlier in the thread it is a good MMO.

They could of thrown any skin on the game or called any of the locations anything and it would be a good MMO, it just is not a very good TES game.

BBSooner

R1ckyDaMan wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

You're free to not play.

As I said earlier in the thread it is a good MMO.

They could of thrown any skin on the game or called any of the locations anything and it would be a good MMO, it just is not a very good TES game.

We'll have to disagree, if only considering the lengths ZOS has gone to uphold the lore (which has fewer lore discrepancies than Morrowind upon its release). But to each their own, I'm quite happy with this installment of Elder Scrolls.

JessieColt

R1ckyDaMan wrote: »

I know, I am active in a thread there about the issue.

I am asking if ESO will affect any decision.

We have no idea. I am not sure why you would think we would. We are only users of the product, not the developer/creator. We have no control, nor any say, or any function or feature of some unnamed future game that the developer may release.

Pmarsico9

AlnilamE wrote: »

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

KhajitFurTrader wrote: »

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

If you're just asking if there will ever be a multiplayer component to a TES game then the answer again is maybe. There were rumors that Skyrim was going to be multiplayer, but so far no single player TES game has had multiplayer so it's just as likely that they won't in the future.

Word on the street is that the engine and toolchain Bethesda uses is not multiplayer-capable. Anyone not involved in programming may not immediately see why this is a bummer. If such things aren't built-in from the get-go, it's very, very hard to add them later and have them performing well, if at all. It's usually safer and less of a hassle to rewrite things from scratch. This is also the reason why no TES game has been published for OS X yet.

Okay...but were are not talking about whether Skyrim is ever going to be multiplayer. There will be sequels to Skyrim and if they so choose they can make it multiplayer. Your statement seems to be coming out of nowhere and doesn't really fit into the discussion. As far as OS X....Yeah, why would you get a Mac for gaming? Or for any reason?

Well, studios usually use the same engine as the basis for a series of games, or variations thereof. Morrowind and Oblivion used the same engine. Skyrim had a newer version, but you have to assume that their underlying logic/parametres would still be the same. There is enough code to be written for a new game without having to reinvent the engine every time.

So to include a multi-player co-op option, there would have to be a considerable resesign of game mechanics. Otherwise it would be like adding a second floor to a house whose foundation can only support a bungalow.

I'm not saying it's never going to happen, but it is an investment of additional time and money and Bethesda needs to take into account what the return on investment on that would be.

I have not played many co-op games, but from the ones I remember (Halo, Borderlands), you don't actually have levels like in TES games, so how would a co-op verion of TES handle that in your view?

That's not entirely true.

A rudimentary mod was developed that allowed Co-Op skyrim play but needed major refinement and the author lost interest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PX2W5snxhGc

DarthZimmeris

The OP makes a valid point.

This [ESO] is a fun game and I'm enjoying it thus far but it's not TES, not really. Yes there are Redguards [who are a little too Arab-esque in this rendition in my opinion] and yes there are Daedric weapons but something is slightly off. It might be the graphics which look very Dragon Agey or it might be that I'm just not used to approaching TES as a MMO, I'm really not sure what it is but my first impression after an hour of playtime was "fun but not TES" and that impression has not changed after two days of hard playing.

I am here for the duration so don't take my comment to mean that these failings are game-breakers because they're not but you should be aware, Bethesda, that ESO ain't your best girl -- her name is Morrowind.

Pallmor

If you really want a new single-player ES game (with multiplayer or not), no problem. Just give Bethesda the $200+ million it will cost to develop it. Maybe you could set up a Kickstarter. All you really need are 200+ friends to donate $1 million a piece and you're all set. You could even offer rewards like "Donate $1 million or more, get a free t-shirt." ;-)

eventide03b14a_ESO

AlnilamE wrote: »

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

KhajitFurTrader wrote: »

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

If you're just asking if there will ever be a multiplayer component to a TES game then the answer again is maybe. There were rumors that Skyrim was going to be multiplayer, but so far no single player TES game has had multiplayer so it's just as likely that they won't in the future.

Word on the street is that the engine and toolchain Bethesda uses is not multiplayer-capable. Anyone not involved in programming may not immediately see why this is a bummer. If such things aren't built-in from the get-go, it's very, very hard to add them later and have them performing well, if at all. It's usually safer and less of a hassle to rewrite things from scratch. This is also the reason why no TES game has been published for OS X yet.

Okay...but were are not talking about whether Skyrim is ever going to be multiplayer. There will be sequels to Skyrim and if they so choose they can make it multiplayer. Your statement seems to be coming out of nowhere and doesn't really fit into the discussion. As far as OS X....Yeah, why would you get a Mac for gaming? Or for any reason?

Well, studios usually use the same engine as the basis for a series of games, or variations thereof. Morrowind and Oblivion used the same engine. Skyrim had a newer version, but you have to assume that their underlying logic/parametres would still be the same. There is enough code to be written for a new game without having to reinvent the engine every time.

So to include a multi-player co-op option, there would have to be a considerable resesign of game mechanics. Otherwise it would be like adding a second floor to a house whose foundation can only support a bungalow.

I'm not saying it's never going to happen, but it is an investment of additional time and money and Bethesda needs to take into account what the return on investment on that would be.

I have not played many co-op games, but from the ones I remember (Halo, Borderlands), you don't actually have levels like in TES games, so how would a co-op verion of TES handle that in your view?

look, if you believe the statistics from this site http://www.statisticbrain.com/skyrim-the-elder-scrolls-v-statistics/ then Skyrim made $1,290,000,000 in sales revenue. If they wanted to rewrite the engine to accommodate a multiplayer game I'm pretty sure they can cover the cost. It's reasonable to assume that any sequel to Skyrim will be successful regardless of ESO. The better question to ask would be why you assume they would never redesign the game engine? ESO wrote their own engine and there is no way that anybody at Zenimax expected an MMO even a TES one to reach Skyrim sales. The point is that this game has nothing to do with single player games. Even if ESO flops hard they will not stop making single player games.

eventide03b14a_ESO

Selique wrote: »

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

I don't really understand what you're asking exactly. If you are asking whether there will be another Elder Scrolls MMO, the answer is maybe. There have been several MMO's that have had sequels. EverQuest, EverQuest 2, and EverQuest Next for instance. Or Guild Wars and Guild Wars II. Or Star Wars: Galaxies and Star Wars: The Old Republic. If there was another MMO with the TES brand it would probably be run by ZOS because that is their online division.

If you're just asking if there will ever be a multiplayer component to a TES game then the answer again is maybe. There were rumors that Skyrim was going to be multiplayer, but so far no single player TES game has had multiplayer so it's just as likely that they won't in the future.

The question doesn't make sense and it relies on pure speculation, but more importantly it's completely irrelevant.

I just want to clear the air here. Star Wars: The Old Republic is NOT NOT NOT a sequel to Star Wars Galaxies. It is NOT. It just happened to come out after SWG. It has 0 relation to SWG in terms of Style, timeline, and gameplay. The only thing it shares in common is that SWTOR and SWG are/were both MMO's in the Star Wars setting.

Ok, I said my two cents.

I am sorry if I gave the impression that they were direct sequels. I was illustrating that they belong to the same franchise. The point I was attempting to make is that nobody said "oh we already made a Star Wars MMO, I guess we are done". They made a new one. Sorry if the implication bothered you that much, but I think the point still remains.

eventide03b14a_ESO

Gillysan wrote: »

Ref: Mac gaming
Any company that ignores the Apple users is losing money.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/sharifsakr/2014/04/24/apple-mac-sales-increase/
http://fortune.com/2014/07/23/mac-v-pc-in-3-charts/

That Forbes guy is wrong though, there are decent game capable Macs. However, they cost an arm & a leg. I'm a PC gamer BTW. If you can put your own computer together, the PC is the way to go without question. If your life only involves computer gaming, then an off the shelf PC will save you money. If you have a life and make money in the real world, then you have choice but I'll let the market speak for itself.

OP as someone suggested already, you should go post at the Bethseda forums. Wasting your time here.

Let's be honest here though. People don't typically buy Mac's for gaming. People do however buy PC's specifically for gaming.

eventide03b14a_ESO

R1ckyDaMan wrote: »

Just to mitigate some posts, I am not saying ESO is a bad MMO, it is a good MMO from the 2 and a half I have played.

The question is why would Bethesda waste time adding any online functionality
at all to any future TES games when this game exists.

So many people did not want an MMO, did not want a sub etc etc, what hope is left for those people now?

Oh and I have played since beta's in september last year and plan to stay subbed for a long time as it is a good MMO, just not the elder scrolls game I was waiting for since marrowind.

Now I just PVP though and try to pretend I am not playing an elder scrolls game.

Dude you are giving me a headache. Zenimax owns Bethesda and they are responsible for the single player TES games. Zenimax also owns Zenimax Online Studios, which is responsible for ESO. Other than being owned by the same parent company and using the same franchise they HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH EACH OTHER. I really can't make this any more clear. The success or failure of one has nothing to do with the other. There are probably thousands of co-op fantasy games. Please give me one reason why Bethesda would be prohibited from making a TES co-op game that has nothing to do with ESO or how cost prohibitive it would be for them. If they choose not to it's only because they chose not to. Not because they can't and certainly not because of anything related to ESO. This whole thread is so full of stupid I think I lost IQ points just from participating.

eventide03b14a_ESO

Pallmor wrote: »

If you really want a new single-player ES game (with multiplayer or not), no problem. Just give Bethesda the $200+ million it will cost to develop it. Maybe you could set up a Kickstarter. All you really need are 200+ friends to donate $1 million a piece and you're all set. You could even offer rewards like "Donate $1 million or more, get a free t-shirt." ;-)

Skryim made over 1 billion. I'm pretty sure Bethesda can bankroll themselves.

eventide03b14a_ESO

DarthZimmeris wrote: »

The OP makes a valid point.

This [ESO] is a fun game and I'm enjoying it thus far but it's not TES, not really. Yes there are Redguards [who are a little too Arab-esque in this rendition in my opinion] and yes there are Daedric weapons but something is slightly off. It might be the graphics which look very Dragon Agey or it might be that I'm just not used to approaching TES as a MMO, I'm really not sure what it is but my first impression after an hour of playtime was "fun but not TES" and that impression has not changed after two days of hard playing.

I am here for the duration so don't take my comment to mean that these failings are game-breakers because they're not but you should be aware, Bethesda, that ESO ain't your best girl -- her name is Morrowind.

No he doesn't make a valid point. He is positing that this game will somehow have an impact on single player TES games. They won't.