I implore you, let me change my race!

Victus

I'll try to address a couple points brought up here:
-why make another character of the same class? Well the way I look at it, with 8 character slots that gives me 2 of every class to play with. Since my main ended up being a Redguard Hvy armor DK tank, his points split between Stamina and Health, I'd definitely like to play a magicka focused DK and see the difference. So you could roll one Magicka based and one Stamina based build for each class, if that's how you want to do it (and hoping they make Sta based builds as viable all-around as Mag ones).

-I'm not sure I favor a race respec... yes it does affect me as I'd rather see a pretty good variety of race/class combinations and not just the same three races for Sorcs, etc. The general school of thought was that the racials would provide a negligible effect on the end game based on class, but while this is debatable, it certainly seems pretty terrible to have a racial that has zero benefit to your class/weapon choice. I really don't think in a 1v1 fight an Altmer Sorc would defeat an Orc Sorc consistently, given the same stats/weapons/skill choices... however it would be fun to experiment and see.

I'd just hate for it to become another reason for not "optimizing" your class and getting rejected in groups or trials because you didn't pick the correct race. I believe as long as you gear and stat accordingly it should be fine.

Sighlynce

Erock25 wrote: »

letohatcheeub17_ESO wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

Zorrashi wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

letohatcheeub17_ESO wrote: »

no... next problem

But why? How would it affect you if someone else chose to give ZOS money to change their race? All I see is benefit for everyone.

Part of the reason many people say no is that the suggested race changes include switching/transferring the passives of that race as well. Even if it is in a cash shop, many people feel that it will give an in-game advantage (however slight) simply because the passives give certain bonuses. This ties into people's common cash-shop principle where many believe the cash shop should be for cosmetic purposes only. If it was available with in-game gold then it wouldn't be much better.

The reason after that is mostly based on principle. That choice should matter blah blah blah...

It may be indirect, but it does affect other players in some way imo.

I understand what you are getting at but I don't see how it can be considered pay-to-win when they are options available to us at character creation. The only way I see this being a problem is if all a sudden ZOS changed one race's passives to be much better than the others. Personally, I feel like all racial passives should be a bit more balanced. Especially with the climbing soft caps (on PTS right now) those races with 10% boosts to stam/magicka/hp are looking more and more powerful. I feel like like the best way to balance would be giving each race a 5% primary attribute boost, a 10% regen boost, and a special skill such as argonian potion boost, nord dmg reduction, khajit crit, dark elf fire resist, etc.

letohatcheeub17_ESO wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

letohatcheeub17_ESO wrote: »

no... next problem

But why? How would it affect you if someone else chose to give ZOS money to change their race? All I see is benefit for everyone.

Well, clarify something for me . Lets say I have a Breton templar. I put 200hrs of play time building this character but then decide I want to be an argonian .. I have sunk a dozen skill points into my races skill line (light armor affinity, gift of magnus,
spell resistance and magicka mastery ) but now those choices no longer exist. Do I now demand all the skill points too ? I mean I have put 200hrs of playing time into this character .. And racial motifs.. Does my templar now lose the ability to create in the Breton style unless I have that particular motif available ? Lets say I'm not one of the fortunate players whose characters can belong to any of the major factions... Does my templar now belong in the Ebonheart Pact, because up until now my templar was fighting for the Daggerfall Covenant .. What if I was grouped up with my friends who all are daggerfall people, Now I can no longer group up with them and terrorize daggerfall bosses? Or does my changing races automatically give me perks I didnt have before? Just curious ..

If you swap race all skill points spent in your racial passives are returned to you. You no longer innately know your first race's motif. You can swap race to any race whether you have Imperial edition or not. Imperial additional was increased payment for racial freedom and that is exactly what a race change would do as well. Seems fair to me but I'm just theorizing here.

Then you have to consider, would it be unfair to others if skill points where returned? Whose to say they would be used for racial passives and not toward class,armor,guild or weapon skills etc.. Are others going to demand the ability to purchase skill point redistribution without having to go broke at the Shrine of Stendarr or Stuhn ? And the play any faction with any race bonus was a pre order bonus not an Emperial bonus.. It was part of the “Explorer Pack” bonus . So thats just a kick in the teeth to everyone who shelled out the big bucks for exclusive content, that now some seem to think should be available to anyone with a 20 in their wallet...

All valid concerns but I just don't personally see people being up in arms over 9 skill points returned (hey they can just transfer them to the other races passives if this was an issue anyways) for 20$.

As for the Imperial bonus ... I still think it has value because you can always create any race in any faction. Race change is a one time 20$ thing. If the only thing holding up them giving us race changes was that it would devalue the Imperial Edition, I'm all for only allowing us to change within our faction.

The Imperial Edition bonus allowes you to play in any alliance as an Imperial. The ability to play any race in any alliance was part of the "explorer pack" bonus, which should be exclusive to those who purchased it as part of the pre order deal . I see how your idea of 'allowing us to change within our faction only ' would ensure the exclusivity of the explorer pack for those who purchased it , but thats just going to enrage those people who want to change a breton into an argonian.. Their argument would be the same as yours ,'How would it affect you if someone else chose to give ZOS money to change their race? All I see is benefit for everyone.' Well, everyone except those that purchased that bonus as an exclusive perk for preorder... and that is a problem. Regardless if my argument seems silly or not, everyone was given an opportunity to purchase the pre order bonuses, those that chose not to should not benefit from them..

Tonturri

Wish people would keep in mind that there hasn't been a specific system suggested beyond 'race changes!'. Concerns about people bouncing around the factions could be alleviated by limiting race changes to anything within one's current faction, and so on. I won't pretend to speak for anyone else - I know that racials need a little rebalancing, as do magicka/stam builds/stuff! We're discussing a feature that imo should not and hopefully will not be implemented while these problems still exist.

The only way for racials to be completely balanced is to remove them, unless each racial is made the same. Extra stamina from <x> race is going to be more valuable to some builds than extra magicka from <y> race is.

People are overwhelming not in favor of this. I think everyone has made their point and it's just time to move on from this topic. It's just not going to happen, and it's good that it won't. You do have 8 character slots. I'm sure you could make a Breton sorcerer or whatever combination you want.

Whoa there. It's four pages in a single thread. Geez...

Anyway. So far, I recall two arguments against it.

1) Choices should matter
2) You should've noticed earlier that you didn't like playing your character such and such way, etc etc.

And most seem to be dismissing the idea based on 'Choices should matter, go away min/maxers'.

I agree with #1 to an extent - what it comes down to is which choices should matter? For me, race changes would be where it starts and stops (or racial passive changes**). How many races are there? 10? 3 for each faction, then imperials. There are 4 classes. We have respecs, we have 8 character slots. Respecs take care of all the build options. Double the amount of character slots than there are classes takes care of classes. However...there will be one/two race(s) I either can't play, or have to delete a character to play (depending on if you have imperial edition or not).
I RP. I really enjoy RPing. One day, I might create a khajiit who is a really good swimmer, but not all that good with his/her claws. Thus, I would enjoy the opportunity to switch out 6% crit for argonian swim speed. Maybe for RP/IC reasons my khajiit is now an argonian for the rest of his/her life. It would be nice to have the option to race change via store.

Sort of branching off from race change here, but bare with me. I might have a character who has wonderful rippling biceps. It might've appealed to me at character creation, but that character has since abandoned their sword to be a scholar. <insert story as to why here>. Their rippling biceps are no more. Character customization post-creation would be nice.

I also PvE (the following can be applied to PvP as well, somewhat). I have one character, a khajiit nightblade. At around VR1/lv50, I began branching off into other weapons/trees/armors/costumes I'd saved. By all that is holy and good in the world, I swear her boobs change size depending on what armor/costume she's wearing. Considering it is default for the camera to zoom in when I open my inventory, what armor I'm wearing, it's really noticeable. Also, I found that a certain khajiit hairstyle has a bump in the middle of the forehead that irritates me - I'd pay to race change (on a character I didn't RP) or appearance change (on one I did) to get rid of that damn bump.

Late in the game, say...VR10ish. I might not like the way my bosmer frolics through mobs or other players in medium armor after having spent the past levels entirely in heavy armor - but the way dem...uh. I forget, Aldmeri Dominion is khajiit/wood elves/high elfies? Anyway, but the way dem high elves frolic is so much better (someone correct me if I'm wrong >_>) Purely aesthetic, I don't RP that character. Choices should matter...to a point. Releveling, reacquiring and recompleting everythign a character did just to get a minor chance

In closing - I think some people are focusing too much on telling the min/max crowd that choices should matter, but aren't exactly considering other playstyles. Admittedly, said playstyles might be somewhat absent from the thread...hopefully this post helps point out that race changes aren't only used by/useful for min/maxers.

As a side note...

That Dunmer/Argonian/Khajit freak could indeed be the guy who could change your race.
If so, make it expensive, and make it random

I like the way you think.

Edit: I started writing this when the thread was near the bottom of page four >.>

AlexDougherty

That Dunmer/Argonian/Khajit freak could indeed be the guy who could change your race.
If so, make it expensive, and make it random

No, there are Lore reasons against race changes, so if they do allow you to change race, it can't be done in game. It would have to be done out of game, probably by buying a race change from the cash shop, and the Mods change it while you are offline.

Erock25

letohatcheeub17_ESO wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

letohatcheeub17_ESO wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

Zorrashi wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

letohatcheeub17_ESO wrote: »

no... next problem

But why? How would it affect you if someone else chose to give ZOS money to change their race? All I see is benefit for everyone.

Part of the reason many people say no is that the suggested race changes include switching/transferring the passives of that race as well. Even if it is in a cash shop, many people feel that it will give an in-game advantage (however slight) simply because the passives give certain bonuses. This ties into people's common cash-shop principle where many believe the cash shop should be for cosmetic purposes only. If it was available with in-game gold then it wouldn't be much better.

The reason after that is mostly based on principle. That choice should matter blah blah blah...

It may be indirect, but it does affect other players in some way imo.

I understand what you are getting at but I don't see how it can be considered pay-to-win when they are options available to us at character creation. The only way I see this being a problem is if all a sudden ZOS changed one race's passives to be much better than the others. Personally, I feel like all racial passives should be a bit more balanced. Especially with the climbing soft caps (on PTS right now) those races with 10% boosts to stam/magicka/hp are looking more and more powerful. I feel like like the best way to balance would be giving each race a 5% primary attribute boost, a 10% regen boost, and a special skill such as argonian potion boost, nord dmg reduction, khajit crit, dark elf fire resist, etc.

letohatcheeub17_ESO wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

letohatcheeub17_ESO wrote: »

no... next problem

But why? How would it affect you if someone else chose to give ZOS money to change their race? All I see is benefit for everyone.

Well, clarify something for me . Lets say I have a Breton templar. I put 200hrs of play time building this character but then decide I want to be an argonian .. I have sunk a dozen skill points into my races skill line (light armor affinity, gift of magnus,
spell resistance and magicka mastery ) but now those choices no longer exist. Do I now demand all the skill points too ? I mean I have put 200hrs of playing time into this character .. And racial motifs.. Does my templar now lose the ability to create in the Breton style unless I have that particular motif available ? Lets say I'm not one of the fortunate players whose characters can belong to any of the major factions... Does my templar now belong in the Ebonheart Pact, because up until now my templar was fighting for the Daggerfall Covenant .. What if I was grouped up with my friends who all are daggerfall people, Now I can no longer group up with them and terrorize daggerfall bosses? Or does my changing races automatically give me perks I didnt have before? Just curious ..

If you swap race all skill points spent in your racial passives are returned to you. You no longer innately know your first race's motif. You can swap race to any race whether you have Imperial edition or not. Imperial additional was increased payment for racial freedom and that is exactly what a race change would do as well. Seems fair to me but I'm just theorizing here.

Then you have to consider, would it be unfair to others if skill points where returned? Whose to say they would be used for racial passives and not toward class,armor,guild or weapon skills etc.. Are others going to demand the ability to purchase skill point redistribution without having to go broke at the Shrine of Stendarr or Stuhn ? And the play any faction with any race bonus was a pre order bonus not an Emperial bonus.. It was part of the “Explorer Pack” bonus . So thats just a kick in the teeth to everyone who shelled out the big bucks for exclusive content, that now some seem to think should be available to anyone with a 20 in their wallet...

All valid concerns but I just don't personally see people being up in arms over 9 skill points returned (hey they can just transfer them to the other races passives if this was an issue anyways) for 20$.

As for the Imperial bonus ... I still think it has value because you can always create any race in any faction. Race change is a one time 20$ thing. If the only thing holding up them giving us race changes was that it would devalue the Imperial Edition, I'm all for only allowing us to change within our faction.

The Imperial Edition bonus allowes you to play in any alliance as an Imperial. The ability to play any race in any alliance was part of the "explorer pack" bonus, which should be exclusive to those who purchased it as part of the pre order deal . I see how your idea of 'allowing us to change within our faction only ' would ensure the exclusivity of the explorer pack for those who purchased it , but thats just going to enrage those people who want to change a breton into an argonian.. Their argument would be the same as yours ,'How would it affect you if someone else chose to give ZOS money to change their race? All I see is benefit for everyone.' Well, everyone except those that purchased that bonus as an exclusive perk for preorder... and that is a problem. Regardless if my argument seems silly or not, everyone was given an opportunity to purchase the pre order bonuses, those that chose not to should not benefit from them..

Personally, I think race change should be allowed to any race (maybe except Imperial) regardless of what pre-order bonus you have. Pre-order bonuses routinely become offered elsewhere over the lifespan of a game.

Aeratus

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

People are overwhelming not in favor of this. I think everyone has made their point and it's just time to move on from this topic. It's just not going to happen, and it's good that it won't. You do have 8 character slots. I'm sure you could make a Breton sorcerer or whatever combination you want.

I don't think so. There was a poll on this earlier (http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/117450/race-change-service-how-much-money-do-you-find-acceptable), and only 36% voted that they were against race change.

Choices should matter. But "choices should matter" should be weighted against gameplay balance. When there are some races that are simply much better than others for purposes of gameplay reasons, then ZOS should either (1) give the option to change race; or (2) fix the balance ASAP. Since they have not been able to fix the stamina/magicka balance after four months, they might as well just go with option (1). It's not the players' fault.

Eirikur

Strongly disagree with this. It would be absurdly immersion-breaking for a Khajit character to suddenly transform into a Redguard, etc. People should live with the consequences of their choices when it comes to something as fundamental as race, or create a new character which suits them better.

Akiainavas

I don't see a problem with race change... why not ? If you're not happy with it, but have spent weeks playing, why waste that time and start over ?

I'd be more inclined to have a class change service, especially if at some point they'll decide to add another one...

Kalann_Pander

I'm thinking some people haven't read my previous post, so I'll re-state the important piece, on why race change should not happen :

Kalann_Pander wrote: »

[...] in PvP, allowing this would mean deep-pocketed players could always pay to have the race most supporting of the current best build (i.e. Altmer, Breton, Dunmer right now). As true balance is very hard to implement, there will always be an imbalance one way or another to exploit. That's a form of Pay to Win, so it should not happen.

Bolded for clarity.

inf.toniceb17_ESO

I've created Bosmer on day 1 (or was it day -7? well...during pre-launch) and wanted to make a bow/dw ninja that would use only stamina abilities with 1-2 magicka abilities tops so i've chosen race accordingly. Now when its clear that best knives i'll ever get are bound (NB=)) and use magicka and resto staff in combination with funnel health is way better than a bow in every way...yeah i'd like to change race or at least race passives.

Wizzo91

Eirikur wrote: »

Strongly disagree with this. It would be absurdly immersion-breaking for a Khajit character to suddenly transform into a Redguard, etc. People should live with the consequences of their choices when it comes to something as fundamental as race, or create a new character which suits them better.

This is the worst argument in this discussion. How will my race change be immersion breaking to you?

Not at all.



There is not one valid argument against a race change in a cash shop. Give me one if you think otherwise.

EDIT: And yes I've read the whole discussion and have not seen one.

Zorrashi

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Eirikur wrote: »

Strongly disagree with this. It would be absurdly immersion-breaking for a Khajit character to suddenly transform into a Redguard, etc. People should live with the consequences of their choices when it comes to something as fundamental as race, or create a new character which suits them better.

This is the worst argument in this discussion. How will my race change be immersion breaking to you?

Not at all.



There is not one valid argument against a race change in a cash shop. Give me one if you think otherwise.

EDIT: And yes I've read the whole discussion and have not seen one.

I sort of gave one: if in a cash shop, race changes (with passives) can give what can be interpreted as an in-game advantage. Though it can be disputed weather this matters, I do consider the passives, and the ability to change to them, as an in-game advantage that can be given to another player just because he's willing to pay.

Another concern, which I think is legitimate, are the issues regarding the skill points that were formerly allocated to passives. If passives weren't one advantage, then the ability to gain different abilities into different skill lines is.

Now if the passives and skill points were not involved, then there would be close to no problem (then it would mostly be about principle).

EvilEmpire

This has to be the dumbest thread I've ever read on these forums (and that's saying a lot).
If you don't like the race you picked, then start a new char. You can't really expect to be able to change your race at any given point throughout the game. That's beyond silly. I could see the argument if you were only given one char slot, but that's not the case.

So, with a straight face, anyone here really thinks ppl should be allowed to completely change their entire char on a whim? On a Monday I'll be a Khajiit ninja, but on Tues I'll change to a Brenton sorc, and Wed I'll make an Imperial tank, without having to go through the struggle and time of leveling another char to VR12? People will just bounce to whatever FoTM exploitable char every time something new is discovered. More absurdly, be able to pick and choose their racial passives???


Do I regret making an Orc with hvy armor swinging a 2h axe? Hell yes, I do. We've all seen the issues with light vs hvy armor, and stam vs mag, and my vision of what my char was going to be did not turn out how I expected, but there's no way I can logically see why I should have the ability to change my Orc into an Khajiit or Brenton or whatever. I've got seven other slots to make those chars in, and there's nothing preventing me from building one of those chars up to VR12.

edit -- and now that they've opened up the PTS, I have the chance to test a char build out and see if I even like it before I spend the entire time leveling up a new one.,.

whsprwind

Let's make a quick summary at this point.

OP wants a cash shop feature for racial changes.
Stamina/magicka imbalance is not really relevant to the topic.
OP looking to min/max is also hardly relevant.



Pros:
Direct cash for ZOS
Many people will be happy
Unhappy people are completely unaffected by such a feature
Allow people to really experience more aspects of the game.
Can possibly be packaged with appearance change


Cons:
Group of people who think "it should not happen because I don't like it" might be annoyed. (Really??)



Hmm. Tough decision indeed...

Zorrashi

whsprwind wrote: »

Let's make a quick summary at this point.

OP wants a cash shop feature for racial changes.
Stamina/magicka imbalance is not really relevant to the topic.
OP looking to min/max is also hardly relevant.



Pros:
Direct cash for ZOS
Many people will be happy
Unhappy people are completely unaffected by such a feature
Allow people to really experience more aspects of the game.
Can possibly be packaged with appearance change


Cons:
Group of people who think "it should not happen because I don't like it" might be annoyed. (Really??)



Hmm. Tough decision indeed...

Direct cash for ZOS-Fine

Many people will be happy- Also fine, but many others will be unhappy.

Unhappy people are completely unaffected by such a feature-Perhaps not directly, but as said before; passives and skill point allotment can give an in game advantage. That affects players. Then comes the people who will claim their immersion is ruined because their dark elf friend turned into an altmer one day.

Can possibly be packaged with appearance change--No comment.

Cons: Group of people who think "it should not happen because I don't like it" might be annoyed. (Really??)--Read the thread. There have been many legitimate issues presented.

EvilEmpire

whsprwind wrote: »

Let's make a quick summary at this point.

OP wants a cash shop feature for racial changes.
Stamina/magicka imbalance is not really relevant to the topic.
OP looking to min/max is also hardly relevant.



Pros:
Direct cash for ZOS
Many people will be happy
Unhappy people are completely unaffected by such a feature
Allow people to really experience more aspects of the game.
Can possibly be packaged with appearance change


Cons:
Group of people who think "it should not happen because I don't like it" might be annoyed. (Really??)



Hmm. Tough decision indeed...

Well, since you put it like that, I want to buy 8 new VR12 chars. I work hard and have money to blow, so why not let me pay $1 for each skill point, and I'll go ahead take 300 skill points for each of those new VR12s, because hey, why not? I mean, that won't affect you, so what's it matter?

xaraan

I'm all for name changes and appearance changes (hopefully they add both those in soon), but not at all for race changes. That's a bit much IMO. Make another character if it really effected you that much, though it doesn't actually very much. Even if it did, they are constantly balancing the game, so things will change.

Wizzo91

Zorrashi wrote: »

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Eirikur wrote: »

Strongly disagree with this. It would be absurdly immersion-breaking for a Khajit character to suddenly transform into a Redguard, etc. People should live with the consequences of their choices when it comes to something as fundamental as race, or create a new character which suits them better.

This is the worst argument in this discussion. How will my race change be immersion breaking to you?

Not at all.



There is not one valid argument against a race change in a cash shop. Give me one if you think otherwise.

EDIT: And yes I've read the whole discussion and have not seen one.

I sort of gave one: if in a cash shop, race changes (with passives) can give what can be interpreted as an in-game advantage. Though it can be disputed weather this matters, I do consider the passives, and the ability to change to them, as an in-game advantage that can be given to another player just because he's willing to pay.

Another concern, which I think is legitimate, are the issues regarding the skill points that were formerly allocated to passives. If passives weren't one advantage, then the ability to gain different abilities into different skill lines is.

Now if the passives and skill points were not involved, then there would be close to no problem (then it would mostly be about principle).

Racial passives give a slight advantage if used with the right build. This is very minimal. For Min / maxers it could make a larger difference (a very small percentage of all players).

I don't understand your issues regarding skill points.

We are talking about a race change that gives you the new racial passives (everything else will stay the same)

Zorrashi wrote: »

whsprwind wrote: »

Let's make a quick summary at this point.

OP wants a cash shop feature for racial changes.
Stamina/magicka imbalance is not really relevant to the topic.
OP looking to min/max is also hardly relevant.



Pros:
Direct cash for ZOS
Many people will be happy
Unhappy people are completely unaffected by such a feature
Allow people to really experience more aspects of the game.
Can possibly be packaged with appearance change


Cons:
Group of people who think "it should not happen because I don't like it" might be annoyed. (Really??)



Hmm. Tough decision indeed...

Direct cash for ZOS-Fine

Many people will be happy- Also fine, but many others will be unhappy.

Unhappy people are completely unaffected by such a feature-Perhaps not directly, but as said before; passives and skill point allotment can give an in game advantage. That affects players. Then comes the people who will claim their immersion is ruined because their dark elf friend turned into an altmer one day.

Can possibly be packaged with appearance change--No comment.

Cons: Group of people who think "it should not happen because I don't like it" might be annoyed. (Really??)--Read the thread. There have been many legitimate issues presented.

I doubt many others will be unhappy. Most would not care. (And not even notice, come on do you remember every player you see). And if think it's immersion breaking that a friend changes races - unfriend him it really makes you a sad puppy.


I personally would not want to switch my race - not worth the money.

But I do not care if somebody else decides to do it.

It does not affect me.

The advantage of passives are minimal.

Immersion breaking is no argument.

It would make many people happy (Even prevent them from unsubbing, who knows?

It would give ZoS tons of extra income, which would be an advantage to all.


If they put a CD onto it (let's say 6-12 months) or a restricted amount(2-4 times a year) there should be NO problem. This would prevent players from switch to the "optimal race" for certain builds every time balancing happens.

Players without the explorer's pack should only be able to switch to a race in their faction

Players without Imp edition can't switch to imperial (if people purchase the imperial edition upgrade they get one free race change).



With the circumstances stated above, I think there is no valid argument against racial changes.

There is a very small chance of this coming in the next months / years, but I think it will be added eventually.

Cogo

Kalann_Pander wrote: »

Cogo wrote: »

I am gonna throw around a few questions to different types of players in ESO. You may or may not agree/dont give a damn.
If YOU try what I suggest, please feedback here to what your reaction was.

PvE players, Solo
Have you tried grouping with 1 person? Have explored zones like Cyrodiil?
Even though you may not like other people, just grouping with 1 person, WILL make you able to overcome events you could not alone. You may find a friend also.

Dungeon player
Have you explored a zone without a map? Have you found a wierd skull, inscribed "Wish I didn't attack that bear" on it? Have you found Side Quests you never heard of?

What is your take on this new "hard" level settings on all dungeons? Harder encounter, but better exp and loot.

Explorer
Have you tried a dungeon group, without waiting for a group tool, to put you in one? Have you been in a dungeon group...it sucked, and you never go into one again? Do you bring friends on your explore?

I'm mainly a thorough Solo Explorer type. I try to complete and explore everything that isn't strictly group content
I've occasionally grouped for boss fights, both in dungeons and exploration, on a ad hoc basis, usually after getting my butt handed to me a few too many times. It's always good to test yourself, but there comes a moment when it's either "right, methinks I'll be back in 10 levels" or "Hey ! You there ! Do you want to kill this boss too ?"

I might try seriously grouping later on to get through the group content. Probably when I have nothing else left to do, which isn't going to be soon.

Nice! At least you tried it! Look at it as a lotto....you can get any number. BUT, you gave a good chance and described, if you wanna do X...you will need a group! Nice!!!

Tried Cyrodill, didn't like it.
Zerging + flashy AoEs = the whole screen just becomes a meaningless mess.
I might try stealth/ambush when I get to VR levels, but there's no way I'm going back to a massive zergfest.

I HATE pvp! Always have! Only PVP was waaaaaay back in Anarchy online 2002.

Cyrodiil is soooooo much more then Pvp. Its WARFARE!
Try again, join a BIG group. Who stays in a similar area, with a commander. Most Pugs do have one!!!

Small pvp groups NEEDS skill, cooperation, fast computers, addons etc.

Theres quite alot of fun PvE stuff to do in Cyro. Give it a try....I hated it....now I go every other day!

Erock25 wrote: »

TL;DR

- ZOS should allow us to buy race changes or racial passive changes (whole set, not pick and choose)
- Why I thought melee crit khajit sorc would work
- Why it didn't work
- It is a win-win for everyone. More money for ZOS. More happy players.
- Racial passives are not irrelevant

[...]Not to mention crit builds in PVP are obsolete with the overpowered Impenetrable trait on armor.

Kalann_Pander wrote:

I don't agree about changing races. Again, I see this as encouraging people not to take responsibility for their choices. Also, in PvP, allowing this would mean deep-pocketed players could always pay to have the race most supporting of the current best build (i.e. Altmer, Breton, Dunmer right now). As true balance is very hard to implement, there will always be an imbalance one way or another to exploit. That's a form of Pay to Win, so it should not happen.

... But if it must happen, then it should be coherent with the story.

BAM! Game! Set! Match!

Why can not people see this? There are choices for a reason.
"Pay to win" is not "wrong" in any sense....it just do not belong in ESO!

Great post!!!

Wolfshead

Even if racial passive skills do have impact on class you choose a true mmorpg player would not care much about racial passive skills for you make your char after your imagine not what is best option for class for you start do that then you are just after one thing and thing alone that is best dmg output you can do with class and nothing else.

Take Wood elf there passive skills is focus on archery expertise, vigor, resist affliction and stealthy which make best for NB class but as most people know that have play rpg know that wood elf is good a sorcerer and are good with sword which make good as warrior as well but if you should just go after what the have as passive skills the will suck as sorcerer, DK and templar but as i say early in this post if you are true mmorpg player you would not care for any race and class combo will work if are willing to put in effort to make char come alive.

But i guess if people think the have extra money to spend on race change and so on it is up to them but at the end of i don't think it will make you more happy just for you have choose to change race, factions and so on. I would understand if you have more servers like WoW have and if some server was slowly dieing that people would scream for thing like this but we have 2 mega server which mean only thing that would make since i guess is factions change.

But i don't really care much about for if i'm not happy i would just delete my char and redo them and in all honest if race and class combo don't work out you will notice really fast and not wait until you hit lvl 50 or VR12 thing like that you notice in 1st 20 lvl of your char.

LordEcks

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

No.

You made a choice. Choices should be important. And most importantly, if you didn't pre-order the game to get the any-race-any-alliance bonus, changing your race changes your loyalties and creates a whole mess.

This.

On the whole indifferent to purchased race changes, however leaning towards non-support.

Very few decisions in games these days are permanent. If it bothers you that much re-roll. Got real sick of the race change thing in WoW where everyone wants shifting to FOTM races.

This month I'm a cow.. next month I'm goblin... meh.

Fleymark

Just the fact that people can ask for this stuff with a straight face shows that the plane has pretty much flown into the mountain.

RIP MMO genre. Was fun playing games of consequence while it lasted.

Uisi

... and i want to buy one potion to reset option for quests with choices so i can choose another option without run entire quest again, and i want to buy a book that bring back my weapons or armors that i deconstruct by mistake, ...
... what about NO!
I like this game just for the reason that you live with your choices or with your mistakes (and learn from them).
I wish i can change my main char too, but it was my undocumented choice so i must play the way i wanted, and if i dont like'it i'm free to make another char.

Kalann_Pander wrote:

I don't agree about changing races. Again, I see this as encouraging people not to take responsibility for their choices. Also, in PvP, allowing this would mean deep-pocketed players could always pay to have the race most supporting of the current best build (i.e. Altmer, Breton, Dunmer right now). As true balance is very hard to implement, there will always be an imbalance one way or another to exploit. That's a form of Pay to Win, so it should not happen.

... But if it must happen, then it should be coherent with the story.

Agree!

amm7sb14_ESO

Yea I don't agree with race changes. The reasons why have already been said.

mndfreeze

IMO a player should have to live with this sort of mistake (picking a race that in the END they decide they dont like) or you should reroll and do the work over again. I dont think every way to screw up should have a store/purchase option to get the player out of a hole they dug for themselves with a bad choice. Especially when it comes to something as core as Race decision. It goes against everything RPGish to let someone alter their race but keep all their progress.

The differences between race are pretty minor, so if that small amount of passives REALLY matters that much to you, reroll and earn your way back up.

WyndStryke

mndfreeze wrote: »

IMO a player should have to live with this sort of mistake (picking a race that in the END they decide they dont like) or you should reroll and do the work over again. ...

+1 on this. A hairdresser etc to change appearance in a reasonable way would be fine, but major stuff (race, height, class, gender) should be fixed and unchangeable.

Merlin13KAGL

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Time to reroll. Some did it earlier, now it's your turn. Pay to win is silly, suck it up, admit your mistake, and buy a new horse for your new character.

Bravo.

$15/month will get you 10 race changes the first day and three race changes a day thereafter.

That's seven alts on the first day and three deletes every day.

Your first character is unlikely to be ideal. It's equally unlikely to be unplayable.

I have difficulty believing anyone goes more than 20-30 levels without realizing they dislike their build, race or otherwise. And 20-30 levels is not an unrecoverable time investment. I seriously doubt you get to Vet and have this epiphany.

If you've made it that far in the ranks, your character is playable. There will be benefits and downfall to each build, but it's playable.

If you want to build an "ideal", start over and do so. There are guides that will get you back to where you were quickly, bypassing the point of the game just as much as a race change would allow.

If it were just for appearances sake, I'd say allow a quest that provides a costume that gives a second shot at the character creation screen. But your stats are your stats. They give you 7 other chances to adjust, right there on the character selection screen.

Erock25

I'm shocked at the ignorance of some people that suggest you should know whether or not a build works by low level. It is ridiculous and shows their lack of understanding of game mechanics.

I'm also quite disturbed by the amount of people who treat this as some sort of badge of pride that they do not believe in race change option. Your character is your character! Live with your mistakes! If race changes go through RIP MMO genre! People, this is a form of virtual entertainment. Even if you would not use a race change on the principle of, well I'm not sure what exactly, why would you care if someone else used it and got more enjoyment out of the game?

The only argument that has any merit in my opinion is that people with deeper pockets could continually chase the FOTM build. That is an issue, I concur. It is also a very easy to fix issue allowing only one race change every 3 months. The passives are too minor to really get upset about what someone else is doing. You aren't playing their character.

Merlin13KAGL

Erock25 wrote: »

So here I am, with a VR9 Khajit Sorcerer

Erock25 wrote: »

I'm shocked at the ignorance of some people that suggest you should know whether or not a build works by low level. It is ridiculous and shows their lack of understanding of game mechanics.

@Erock25, low level, you say?

Erock25

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

So here I am, with a VR9 Khajit Sorcerer

Erock25 wrote: »

I'm shocked at the ignorance of some people that suggest you should know whether or not a build works by low level. It is ridiculous and shows their lack of understanding of game mechanics.

@Erock25, low level, you say?

@Merlin13KAGL‌

Yes. I was referring to the person in the post right above mine that said you should know if a build works by 20-30 levels. I was also referring to anyone who suggests that you should know whether a build works before getting at least an epic set of gear, traited and glyphed to the extreme. As I said earlier in the post, I started asking for a race change option around VR5 (already 300 hours in), which is when I had the traits researched to put together an epic set of gear with the proper set bonuses.

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

If you've made it that far in the ranks, your character is playable. There will be benefits and downfall to each build, but it's playable.

Also in regards to this, of course my race/class choice is playable. That doesn't change the fact that two of my three racial passives go completely unused for my build. Sneak detection radius reduction and increased sneak attack damage ..... but I am a spell caster so I do not benefit from sneak attack dmg. Weapon critical rating ... but I am a spell caster and do not use weapon crit.