Which class is the most underpowered?

Cogo

Dragonknight

DKs are way underpowered. I cant kill anything in Cyrodiil

jelliedsoup

Nightblade

Cogo wrote: »

DKs are way underpowered. I cant kill anything in Cyrodiil

Are you kidding? What skills do you use?

Selodaoc

Nightblade

Lynx7386 wrote: »

So in my opinion:
Melee/Stamina Nightblades are, like all stamina focused builds, very weak right now. This isnt so much a class issue as a massive imbalance in stamina vs magicka, however.

A Melee magicka based (class skills) NB is just as crap in dmg as a Melee stamina NB, if not even worse.

altrego9920_ESO

Nightblade

Relatively similar. You just need to make sure your weaving auto attacks with siphoning, catalyst passive, medicinal use passive, and for overkill, argonian. This will make it so you basically have infinite resources, and you can imagine from there how easy it would be to get loads of DPS.[/quote]

You forget that you lose 22% of your dps to do this, so yes you do get a bit more sustain but its worthless when you cant survive long enough to do the extra damage because vet mobs hit like trucks carrying a nuke in the back. You do not get loads of dps... you just sustain your crappy dps longer. Why waste a spot for a NB when a Sorc or DK can blow the area up faster and not worry about the sustain?

Aeratus

Templar

altrego9920_ESO wrote: »

You forget that you lose 22% of your dps to do this

Nope. Your weapon damage is only half of your character damage. The other half is your "power" rating. So siphoning only takes down your dps by 11%.

Selodaoc wrote: »

A Melee magicka based (class skills) NB is just as crap in dmg as a Melee stamina NB, if not even worse.

A magicka based NB almost always outdamages a stamina-based on. In AOE situations, the magicka NB can probably do 2 times the dps.

WilliamTee

Nightblade

I think if this thread proves anything?

It's that circa 18% of forum posters are trolls

Mortosk

Templar

Still not 1 peep from Zenimax in this or any other thread about Templars being under powered and in need of buffs. Guess the 272 people (or 49% of the people who voted - given all 4 classes to choose from) need to just shut up and L2P.

Selodaoc

Nightblade

Aeratus wrote: »

altrego9920_ESO wrote: »

You forget that you lose 22% of your dps to do this

Nope. Your weapon damage is only half of your character damage. The other half is your "power" rating. So siphoning only takes down your dps by 11%.

Selodaoc wrote: »

A Melee magicka based (class skills) NB is just as crap in dmg as a Melee stamina NB, if not even worse.

A magicka based NB almost always outdamages a stamina-based on. In AOE situations, the magicka NB can probably do 2 times the dps.

ST skills wise, a Stamina melee based NB can do more dmg then Magicka melee NB, and thats extremly crap dmg.
AoE a Magicka (destro) Nb wins. Theres pretty much no class skill AoE though.

Selodaoc

Nightblade

double post

altrego9920_ESO

Nightblade

I dont understand how your saying it only drops it by 11% as it drops damage as a whole by 22% both weapon and spell damage, even the tooltips drop in damage by that amount

NordJitsu

Templar

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

Classes in rank of ability overall..

#1=DragonKnight
#2=Sorcerer
#3=Templar
#4=NightBlade

right now, DK and Sorc are pretty much closely enough to be tied.

Overall Nightblade has far less potential than the other 3. people are forgetting NB heals are based on killing generally. Damage wise Templar still can easily trump a NB, as well as support wise.

Alot of the arguments i have so far seen in this topic, are entirely related to how the classses preform in PVP... which is less than 20% of the content in this game. those arguements are further skewed in that most who claim NB to be almost OP are refrencing their abilitys to use stealth, which is only useful primarly in 1v1 situations and has no bearing in group play both in PVP and PVE.

The only real weakness to templar atm is lack of CCs and lower overall damage to Sorc and DK. they still however have significantly higher potential than NB overall.

@Hypertionb14_ESO‌

Prior to them fixing NB bugs, you'd have been almost right with that ordering (probably still have to switch 3 and 4). Now that NBs have been both fixed and buffed, and Sorcs have been repeatedly nerfed, its like this:

#1= Dragon Knight
#2= Night Blade
#3= Sorcerer
#4=
#5= Templar

Yes, Templar's rank 5th out of 4 classes.

Hypertionb14_ESO

Nightblade

The Damage done by Lightning Flood alone is not far off of what Veil of Blades can do.

The overload Ultimate can deal 400+ per enemy each second in a huge area in front of you, easily 12 meters in length.

You can also heal yourself for 65% of all critical damage as a sorcerer, with 50% crit easy to obtain.

The Restraining Prison Morph of Encase applies the up to 15% critical chance boost for spells over its 10 second potential duration.

Rune Prison can last 2x longer than agony and since it doesnt apply a DOT after it wears can be immeditly re-applied.

Yes, Veil of blades can be very powerful. A strong build should have no problem doing 200 per second on each target in its radius while it also gives the user its tremendous damage reduction.

However Spell for spell you are better with a Sorcerer than a NB.

The only Noticeable "nerf" to Sorcerer affected an ability that only had use in PVP as a Gimmicky run-away. The focus on which always baffled me...

Worstluck

Templar

altrego9920_ESO wrote: »

I dont understand how your saying it only drops it by 11% as it drops damage as a whole by 22% both weapon and spell damage, even the tooltips drop in damage by that amount

It lowers spell and weapon damage by 22%, not the damage you are doing by 22%. A 22% decrease in weapon and spell damage does not turn out to be a flat 22% decrease in damage. It turns it out it is about a 11% decrease in DPS.

Aoifesan

Nightblade

crislevin wrote: »

Aoifesan wrote: »

crislevin wrote: »

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

The idea that Sorcs only have 3 good abilities is ridiculous. They have THE best crowd control in the game, which you can then drop wonderful lightning damage down on. Why didn't you mention that? How about Bound Armor for tanking? How about Curse for burst? How about mages fury? Seriously, do you even know the sorcerer class? Sorceror is full of epic win.

best cc? and whats the name of that wonderful skill?

bound armor reduces magicka by 10%. serious, which class doesn't have buff to push armour into orange at the end game? its not that fabulous, its pathetic a sorc has to sacrifice 10% of magicka for that.

mage fury doesn't do a jack until enemy health drop to 20%, get into any pvp and see how useful it is.

Just FYI the nightblade version is for their invis skill Dark Cloak. It costs 1/4 their magicka pool on each cast, AND it only lasts 3 seconds.

I'd gladly give up 10% of the majicka to have that up all the time.

You might want to shut your hole on that one.

if you have a hole to shut, go do it.

you ever heard a gap closer called teleport strike, which every NB spamming like no tomorrow?

I have oh totally confused one. It just so happens it only does good damage opening from stealth. And well after that it is a 400 damage strike at vr10.

It isn't invisibility and like all NB abilities cost way too much mana.

NskDen

Any class with staff

jkbennettb14a_ESO

Dragonknight

I used to be a god, now I just solo them.

dodgehopper_ESO

I can't believe someone who plays Sorc doesn't even know what Encase is. Its a fantastic crowd control, with long duration. Its strong, and can even be morphed to add a strong snare when the control effect ends.

Braidas

Templar

Don't think any one class is as crazily under powered as people may claim, but
I find Templars to be the least useful. People voting for DK and sorc are obviously trolling, but I think a lot of people voting for NB are probably using stam builds (DW/Bow). If so, that is your problem, not the class.

ForTheRealm

Templar

crislevin wrote: »

Ragekniv wrote: »

Sorcs and DKs are still OP FOTM, how the hell do you justify a claim to be the most underpowered?

Balance sustained DPS and resource mechanics of all classes!

Next round of OP nerfs please!

justified by checking the leaderboard.

now how do you justify Temp being the most UP one with you guys crowding leaderboard?

Being on the leaderboard means that someone is effective in gaining Alliance Points and not not necessarily having an overpowered build.
My mate got quickly to top 10 by doing Cyrodill quests, repairing walls and using siege engines - as this was giving him APs faster than trying to kill opponents in a direct fight.

cisadanepajsuxrwb17_ESO

Dragonknight

I voted DK. Because I have a right to choose and I would like to exercise that right!

david271749

Nightblade

cisadanepajsuxrwb17_ESO wrote: »

I voted DK. Because I have a right to choose and I would like to exercise that right!

AngryNord

Nice flag. Especially the colours. This one still looks better though:

david271749

Nightblade

@‌AngryNord
That is beautiful, but can it compete with this?

AngryNord

Nah, we're a lot more peaceful, we make do With an Axe-wielding lion

Singular

Your class.

CaptainSilverbrow

Templar

david271749 wrote: »

@‌AngryNord
That is beautiful, but can it compete with this?

Glorious.Jpeg

I crai er'ry tiem

andreas.rudroffb16_ESO

Sorcerer

that whole Nightblade is to weak thing ...... i assume its only the player and not the class .... all Nightblades i met (and have talked to) said: we are ok.

Some cried and complained .... i talked to them about their strong synergies and guess what was the answer. "I never used that skill, what is it"
They are now also the class with the best escape (cloak) and chase (Refreshing path) skills.

if you dont believe me, try a 1vs1 with two equal skilled players (a sorc and a nb) ... that poor sorc......


Templars are "weak" as DD, maybe, but they are (as nightblades are) stronger than every other class in terms of healing (reminds me of Paladin)

DK is still in "evaluation" ... they havent managed to tune DK as a melee, right now they are underpowered in melee and still OP in firedamage. Give them more single target melee + more CC (without dmg) and take away that AOE
And give them more dmg with 1H/Shield but take away or lower the stun component of shieldbash

Sorc ist extremly weak (damagetaking), yet not that burstmonster you would expect (NB has more burst and better CCs), needs to be tuned for more burst, sustained dot dmg.

... just my thoughts


Final thought (if classes stay ingame, thats the way it should be):

Class, pros, cons:

DK, medium-high single dd - highest survivability - high CC, low AOE,low AOE heal, medium single heal

NB, highest single dd (Physical) - medium survivability - high CC, low AOE,medium-high AOE heal, low single heal

Sorc, high single dd (Magical) - - medium survivability - medium CC, highest AOE, medium-high AOE heal, low single heal

Templar, medium-high single dd - high survivability - low-medium CC, medium AOE, highest AOE heal, highest single heal

Hypertionb14_ESO

Nightblade

andreas.rudroffb16_ESO wrote: »

that whole Nightblade is to weak thing ...... i assume its only the player and not the class .... all Nightblades i met (and have talked to) said: we are ok.

Some cried and complained .... i talked to them about their strong synergies and guess what was the answer. "I never used that skill, what is it"
They ar now also the cass with the best escape and chase skills.


Templars are "weak" as DD, maybe, but they are (as nightblades are) stronger than every other class in terms of healing (reminds me of Paladin)

DK is still in "evaluation" ... they havent managed to tune DK as a melee, right now they are underpowered in melee and still OP in firedamage. Give them more single target melee + more CC (without dmg) and take away that AOE

Sorc ist extremly weak (damagetaking), yet not that burstmonster you would expect (NB has more burst and better CCs), needs to be tuned for more burst, sustained dot dmg

... just my thoughts

You clearly have not used Sorcerer in its full potential... Critical Surge alone is enough healing to keep the sorc up and the CCs NB has are childs play compaired to the Sorcerer.

A good example is Agony Vs Rune Prison.

Agony lasts a shorter duration and applies a DOT on the target after, prevent re-use. a morph removes the DOT in favor of a one shot AOE but it still is a lower duration.

Rune Prison can last almost 20 seconds with passives and can be repeatedly cast on target back to back. A morph adds a stun that doesnt break from damage after the inital Disabling effect wears off and the combined effect is 23-24 second lasting overall.


Healing wise, All of Nightblades decent self heals are entirely based on making a kill, making them worthless in protracted fights like any boss in the game.

Sorcerer can heal themselves with Dark Exchange while also recovering MP, and Critical Surge(Surge Morph) restores 65% of any critical damage done. on a spammable burst damage of 750 crit with crystal shards my sorcerer heals almost 500 from this.. Twilight Matriarch has a massive Heal which can be used any time your hp drops under a certain point, healing for more overall than any one ability in the NB trees.

the Only really REALLY REALLY good NB ability over what Sorcerer has is Veil of Blades. but a sorcerer using Lightning Splash will do comparable damage for a minor magicka cost, with the addition of a highly damaging AOE synergy, Healing themselves on each crit that happens.

By far Sorcerer is no means underpowered..

andreas.rudroffb16_ESO

Sorcerer

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

Healing wise, All of Nightblades decent self heals are entirely based on making a kill, making them worthless in protracted fights like any boss in the game.



Sorcerer can heal themselves with Dark Exchange while also recovering MP, and Critical Surge(Surge Morph) restores 65% of any critical damage done. on a spammable burst damage of 750 crit with crystal shards my sorcerer heals almost 500 from this.. Twilight Matriarch has a massive Heal which can be used any time your hp drops under a certain point, healing for more overall than any one ability in the NB trees.

so, whats the
Swallow Soul
Sap Essence
Soul Siphon
Refreshing Path
Blood Craze
...... just selfheals dependent on a skill (active as applied)
all can be applied at the "same time" using dual wield


Dark exchange (as now) is a 3 sek channel - during that time you are a target dummy, right/leftclick done, stun done, damage through done (and dont tell me you are not able to stun/interrupt me in 3 sek or burst me down)

Critical Surge is only usefull using staff skills (mostly AOE with pulsar) - its a high cost magica skill you have to reapply every 18 sek and takes a skillslot (and just 50% of the skill are usefull)

crystal shards (even with my 55% Crit) take 3 Sec (channel, yes tooltip states 1,2 but that bug is there since beta, stopped the time its 3 Sek)to get a 55% chance to get back around 400 hp
here too: right/leftclick done, stun done, damage through done, dodgeroll done, cloak done
(and dont tell me you are not able to stun/interrupt me in 3 sek or burst me down)

matriarch takes away 10% of my max magica on summon, is a 2 hit and stupid as f.... and just heals 1 time for not much then it has a cd


once a NB is close to you (and you are not the rare Sorc that uses dual wield) YOU ARE DEAD (and yes, sorc dual wield ist atm the only competetive PvP Solo Sorc)


btw, forgot to ask: you know you can interrupt with right mouse + left click ... dont you

play a sorc from V1 to V10 (without Craglorn Grind, without Ini Grind) ... i am sure u delete it at V2-V7

Artis

Nightblade

No idea how templars are doing in general, but my friend in heavy armor deal pretty solid damage.

In turn, my nightblade is suffering so much. Tried both medium armor and heavy armor builds. Dps is low, survivability is low. Strife doesn't help, neither does sap essence. Because, guess what, all the abilities are almost useless without points spent for magicka.