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Which class is the most underpowered?
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Templarjeradlub17_ESO wrote: »Edit: Just wanted to note haven't gotten to try Temp yet but my guildies seem just fine. They can massively self heal and shouldn't be doing Sorc/NB dps.
Anyone moaning about Sorc' being underpowered doesn't know how to play one. Templars "massively overheal", as you put it, by dumping all of their magicka into three or four Honor The Dead casts and leave none for anything else because lolnomagicka regen., promptly dying thereafter. This isn't WoW, you don't get the "hybrid tax" excuse because every class has some kind of unique healing and magicka regenerating mechanic, and every MMO's three primary build persuasions can be fulfilled by anybody regardless of class; sans Templar, who can only "MaSsIvElY HeAlZoRz" (per your anecdotal evidence), sit down, and die a second time, offering far less resistance than said Templar did beforehand.
You're beating the "b-b-but, m-muh healz!" dead horse while it's been proven by the best players, guilds, and even the developers ingame that just about every other class heals better than Templars do.1 -
crislevin✭✭✭✭✭
✭SorcererCaptainSilverbrow wrote: »jeradlub17_ESO wrote: »Edit: Just wanted to note haven't gotten to try Temp yet but my guildies seem just fine. They can massively self heal and shouldn't be doing Sorc/NB dps.
Anyone moaning about Sorc' being underpowered doesn't know how to play one. Templars "massively overheal", as you put it, by dumping all of their magicka into three or four Honor The Dead casts and leave none for anything else because lolnomagicka regen., promptly dying thereafter. This isn't WoW, you don't get the "hybrid tax" excuse because every class has some kind of unique healing and magicka regenerating mechanic, and every MMO's three primary build persuasions can be fulfilled by anybody regardless of class; sans Templar, who can only "MaSsIvElY HeAlZoRz" (per your anecdotal evidence), sit down, and die a second time, offering far less resistance than said Templar did beforehand.
You're beating the "b-b-but, m-muh healz!" dead horse while it's been proven by the best players, guilds, and even the developers ingame that just about every other class heals better than Templars do.
anyone morning about NB/Temp being underpowered doesn't know how to play one, those NB/Temps on top 10 leaderboard didn't get there by dying a million times.0 -
Mortosk✭✭✭✭TemplarWhen i frist started to play Templar i had several build's to try. I was so exited about my new great hero, what i had just make. I was like OMG i can heal and do solo stuff, thats so great! After getting my great hero to lever VR1 i was confused WTF why i cant kill that group of 3 regular mop. While checking my build some DK killed those mops by just standing middle of them and killing them in seconds. I was confused and really sure that there was something wrong on my great hero's build. But after fixing and fixing i newer got my build work like i would like it to work. I was weak, way to easy to kill just by group of 3 regular mops. Got little help from some mageguild skill after morphing it and turning my self to vampire so i can kill those 3 mops with that ultimate, what i had to morph frist btv. Now my great hero is VR12 Superior healer, no more vampire (hate those). Anyway if i wanna kill 3 mops soloing, that i still cant do! But killing me on battlefield in Cyrodiil is hard now. Templar's have great skills and many ways to use them, but damage what those skills do is to weak. Its eating my will to use my great hero.
So i have tree choice:
1. wait for update that make templar damage better
2. roll DK / Sorcerer
3. stop playing ( what i really don't wanna do) but...
Were these mops like magical fantasia mops with supernatural absorbency?
I bet that's probably why they mopped the floor with you.
Stick to fighting 1 or 2 regular mops next time. Templars weren't designed to fight 3 mops at a time.
Edited by Mortosk on June 13, 2014 10:21PM"Now I stand, the lion before the lambs and they do not fear. They can not fear." --Arthas Menethil (aka, The Lich King)2 -
Ragekniv✭✭✭TemplarSorcs and DKs are still OP FOTM, how the hell do you justify a claim to be the most underpowered?
Balance sustained DPS and resource mechanics of all classes!
Next round of OP nerfs please!Edited by Ragekniv on June 12, 2014 4:54PM0 -
crislevin✭✭✭✭✭
✭SorcererSorcs and DKs are still OP FOTM, how the hell do you justify a claim to be the most underpowered?
Balance sustained DPS and resource mechanics of all classes!
Next round of OP nerfs please!
justified by checking the leaderboard.
now how do you justify Temp being the most UP one with you guys crowding leaderboard?0 -
Mortosk✭✭✭✭TemplarCaptainSilverbrow wrote: »jeradlub17_ESO wrote: »Edit: Just wanted to note haven't gotten to try Temp yet but my guildies seem just fine. They can massively self heal and shouldn't be doing Sorc/NB dps.
Anyone moaning about Sorc' being underpowered doesn't know how to play one. Templars "massively overheal", as you put it, by dumping all of their magicka into three or four Honor The Dead casts and leave none for anything else because lolnomagicka regen., promptly dying thereafter. This isn't WoW, you don't get the "hybrid tax" excuse because every class has some kind of unique healing and magicka regenerating mechanic, and every MMO's three primary build persuasions can be fulfilled by anybody regardless of class; sans Templar, who can only "MaSsIvElY HeAlZoRz" (per your anecdotal evidence), sit down, and die a second time, offering far less resistance than said Templar did beforehand.
You're beating the "b-b-but, m-muh healz!" dead horse while it's been proven by the best players, guilds, and even the developers ingame that just about every other class heals better than Templars do.
anyone morning about NB/Temp being underpowered doesn't know how to play one, those NB/Temps on top 10 leaderboard didn't get there by dying a million times.
The fact that 2 to 1 people are voting templar before they see the poll results would tend to indicate your theory is flawed. Perhaps Templars are better at 1 on 1 pvp battles than they are at pve content, but I don't really pvp that often. Not that I didn't try, but the unplayable lag on the Wabajack server makes pvp for me an undesirable activity. If you really think Sorcerer is the weakest class, I have some Swamp land in Shadowfen to sell you. Prime real estate.Edited by Mortosk on June 12, 2014 5:11PM"Now I stand, the lion before the lambs and they do not fear. They can not fear." --Arthas Menethil (aka, The Lich King)0 -
Aoifesan✭✭✭Nightblade
Just FYI the nightblade version is for their invis skill Dark Cloak. It costs 1/4 their magicka pool on each cast, AND it only lasts 3 seconds.dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »The idea that Sorcs only have 3 good abilities is ridiculous. They have THE best crowd control in the game, which you can then drop wonderful lightning damage down on. Why didn't you mention that? How about Bound Armor for tanking? How about Curse for burst? How about mages fury? Seriously, do you even know the sorcerer class? Sorceror is full of epic win.
best cc? and whats the name of that wonderful skill?
bound armor reduces magicka by 10%. serious, which class doesn't have buff to push armour into orange at the end game? its not that fabulous, its pathetic a sorc has to sacrifice 10% of magicka for that.
mage fury doesn't do a jack until enemy health drop to 20%, get into any pvp and see how useful it is.
I'd gladly give up 10% of the majicka to have that up all the time.
You might want to shut your hole on that one.
0 -
NerfEverything✭✭✭✭✭TemplarNerfEverything wrote: »Anyone voting for nightblade...sorry but I gotta say it...L2P. NBs can be extremely powerful when played certain ways. Check out the guild with top trial times. They use NB extensively and a bunch of their players are actually re-rolling as NBs because they are so powerful. Read for yourself:
http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/27vlu5/alacrity_qa_time_for_the_community/
You said it right there...in certain ways. As a Night Blade, I should be able to play a sneak thief and still be able play. Linking a thread that shows that staff wielding night blades are powerful is just pointing out the broken power of staves not that Night Blades are over powered.
Personally, they need to fix at least 95% of the bugs for all classes prior to trying and have a good discussion about which is weaker.
I agree with you, I was just trying to point out that there is a way to play NB that is extremely powerful.
I think most people that rolled NBs were looking for the sneaky/thief/assassin experience, and that NB role is underpowered, but it has a lot to do with larger problems with the game.
The problem with templars is that there is no way to play the class to compete with Sorcs and DKs. It doesn't matter how you want to play a templar, there is no combination of skills/equipment/exploits that can get a templar up to 700dps. At least NBs have the choice of playing competitively or playing the way they want. Templars may as well play the way they want because they can't play competitively.1 -
Evergnar✭✭✭✭✭
✭NightbladeDK's & Sorc's shouldn't even be allowed in this poll. I had to go w/ NB only because it has had (and has) the most problems and needs the most tweaking.0 -
crislevin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Sorcerer
Just FYI the nightblade version is for their invis skill Dark Cloak. It costs 1/4 their magicka pool on each cast, AND it only lasts 3 seconds.dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »The idea that Sorcs only have 3 good abilities is ridiculous. They have THE best crowd control in the game, which you can then drop wonderful lightning damage down on. Why didn't you mention that? How about Bound Armor for tanking? How about Curse for burst? How about mages fury? Seriously, do you even know the sorcerer class? Sorceror is full of epic win.
best cc? and whats the name of that wonderful skill?
bound armor reduces magicka by 10%. serious, which class doesn't have buff to push armour into orange at the end game? its not that fabulous, its pathetic a sorc has to sacrifice 10% of magicka for that.
mage fury doesn't do a jack until enemy health drop to 20%, get into any pvp and see how useful it is.
I'd gladly give up 10% of the majicka to have that up all the time.
You might want to shut your hole on that one.
if you have a hole to shut, go do it.
you ever heard a gap closer called teleport strike, which every NB spamming like no tomorrow?1 -
Nox_Aeterna✭✭✭✭✭
✭TemplarSorcs and DKs are still OP FOTM, how the hell do you justify a claim to be the most underpowered?
Balance sustained DPS and resource mechanics of all classes!
Next round of OP nerfs please!
justified by checking the leaderboard.
now how do you justify Temp being the most UP one with you guys crowding leaderboard?
It i funny cause you talk like the leader board represented power , which does not.
It represents who farms the most points.Edited by Nox_Aeterna on June 12, 2014 6:23PM"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."
-Hanlon's razor2 -
crislevin✭✭✭✭✭
✭SorcererNox_Aeterna wrote: »Sorcs and DKs are still OP FOTM, how the hell do you justify a claim to be the most underpowered?
Balance sustained DPS and resource mechanics of all classes!
Next round of OP nerfs please!
justified by checking the leaderboard.
now how do you justify Temp being the most UP one with you guys crowding leaderboard?
It i funny cause you talk like the leader board represented power , which does not.
It represents who farms the most points.
and that somehow has nothing to do with power?0 -
NordJitsu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭TemplarCaptainSilverbrow wrote: »jeradlub17_ESO wrote: »Edit: Just wanted to note haven't gotten to try Temp yet but my guildies seem just fine. They can massively self heal and shouldn't be doing Sorc/NB dps.
Anyone moaning about Sorc' being underpowered doesn't know how to play one. Templars "massively overheal", as you put it, by dumping all of their magicka into three or four Honor The Dead casts and leave none for anything else because lolnomagicka regen., promptly dying thereafter. This isn't WoW, you don't get the "hybrid tax" excuse because every class has some kind of unique healing and magicka regenerating mechanic, and every MMO's three primary build persuasions can be fulfilled by anybody regardless of class; sans Templar, who can only "MaSsIvElY HeAlZoRz" (per your anecdotal evidence), sit down, and die a second time, offering far less resistance than said Templar did beforehand.
You're beating the "b-b-but, m-muh healz!" dead horse while it's been proven by the best players, guilds, and even the developers ingame that just about every other class heals better than Templars do.
anyone morning about NB/Temp being underpowered doesn't know how to play one, those NB/Temps on top 10 leaderboard didn't get there by dying a million times.
Actually, they could have.
Leader boards don't mean didly squat in this game. All it tracks is how often you play. And you can even just run up to a keep, die, and then sit there while your Alliance kills things and takes the keep. As long as you're grouped, you still get the AP.
Unless the Leaderboards start using skill based metrics (such as kill death ratio) they're never going to mean anything.
PS.
Templar's are the most under powered class. NBs have hood winked ZOS into making themselves a priority. The problem with NBs was bugged skills. But they're crazy good when they're working properly.
Templar's are mechanically weak, not bugged.
NBs didn't need any buffs. They're borderline OP now. Templar's need buffs.Edited by NordJitsu on June 12, 2014 6:35PM1 -
Nox_Aeterna✭✭✭✭✭
✭TemplarNox_Aeterna wrote: »Sorcs and DKs are still OP FOTM, how the hell do you justify a claim to be the most underpowered?
Balance sustained DPS and resource mechanics of all classes!
Next round of OP nerfs please!
justified by checking the leaderboard.
now how do you justify Temp being the most UP one with you guys crowding leaderboard?
It i funny cause you talk like the leader board represented power , which does not.
It represents who farms the most points.
and that somehow has nothing to do with power?
Nah , it does not.
It has everything with knowing how to get the most points :P."Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."
-Hanlon's razor1 -
crislevin✭✭✭✭✭
✭SorcererNox_Aeterna wrote: »Nox_Aeterna wrote: »Sorcs and DKs are still OP FOTM, how the hell do you justify a claim to be the most underpowered?
Balance sustained DPS and resource mechanics of all classes!
Next round of OP nerfs please!
justified by checking the leaderboard.
now how do you justify Temp being the most UP one with you guys crowding leaderboard?
It i funny cause you talk like the leader board represented power , which does not.
It represents who farms the most points.
and that somehow has nothing to do with power?
Nah , it does not.
It has everything with knowing how to get the most points :P.
how.0 -
Hypertionb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭NightbladeClasses in rank of ability overall..
#1=DragonKnight
#2=Sorcerer
#3=Templar
#4=NightBlade
right now, DK and Sorc are pretty much closely enough to be tied.
Overall Nightblade has far less potential than the other 3. people are forgetting NB heals are based on killing generally. Damage wise Templar still can easily trump a NB, as well as support wise.
Alot of the arguments i have so far seen in this topic, are entirely related to how the classses preform in PVP... which is less than 20% of the content in this game. those arguements are further skewed in that most who claim NB to be almost OP are refrencing their abilitys to use stealth, which is only useful primarly in 1v1 situations and has no bearing in group play both in PVP and PVE.
The only real weakness to templar atm is lack of CCs and lower overall damage to Sorc and DK. they still however have significantly higher potential than NB overall.I play every class in every situation. I love them all.2 -
crislevin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Sorcerer
With DK, Molag Bal would be dead before he was able to run.The other day Molag Bal ran past me screaming "THERE'S A SORCERER BEHIND ME!!!"
With NB, Molag Bal doesn't even know he was attacked before he goes "poof".
With Temp, Molag Bal laughed to death.
So only Sorc actually can't get him death, and now can't run that well neither.0 -
NerfEverything✭✭✭✭✭TemplarHypertionb14_ESO wrote: »Classes in rank of ability overall..
#1=DragonKnight
#2=Sorcerer
#3=Templar
#4=NightBlade
right now, DK and Sorc are pretty much closely enough to be tied.
Overall Nightblade has far less potential than the other 3. people are forgetting NB heals are based on killing generally. Damage wise Templar still can easily trump a NB, as well as support wise.
Alot of the arguments i have so far seen in this topic, are entirely related to how the classses preform in PVP... which is less than 20% of the content in this game. those arguements are further skewed in that most who claim NB to be almost OP are refrencing their abilitys to use stealth, which is only useful primarly in 1v1 situations and has no bearing in group play both in PVP and PVE.
The only real weakness to templar atm is lack of CCs and lower overall damage to Sorc and DK. they still however have significantly higher potential than NB overall.
You must have missed this post earlier... (NB PvE best healer and 1k dps)
NBs can be extremely powerful when played certain ways. Check out the guild with top trial times. They use NB extensively and a bunch of their players are actually re-rolling as NBs because they are so powerful. Read for yourself:
http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/27vlu5/alacrity_qa_time_for_the_community/0 -
Drakoleon✭✭✭✭TemplarNB compering to DK or M is a bit "underpowered" in VR but compering to templar? WTF are you voting gents? Templar is the clown of ESO even potions do better job on healing1
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jelliedsoup✭✭✭✭✭NightbladeAs an archetypal NB, I use Bow, DW, Medium armour. All I hear now is how the NB is OP, this MAY be the case IF someone is using light armour and a staff. I am not. A cookie cutter I may be, but given the game design the it appears the "cookie-cutter" design is using the light and a staff.
So, those who use the class of an NB are presumed to be OP (irrespective of the build) I assure you I am not. I can do ok damage if I sneak. I may beat a Sorc a few levels, higher than me. I won't usually beat a DK the same or higher, depending on what skills they use.
I need to hit hard and fast and shadow cloak and roll my arse out of there. Sometimes I make it sometimes I don't but that's what I enjoy. These generic statements of Classes are OP needs to stop, it's the skills used which are OP. Each class does not use the same weapons and skills (active and passive).www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=Ks8_KGHqmO42 -
NerfEverything✭✭✭✭✭Templarjelliedsoup wrote: »As an archetypal NB, I use Bow, DW, Medium armour. All I hear now is how the NB is OP, this MAY be the case IF someone is using light armour and a staff. I am not. A cookie cutter I may be, but given the game design the it appears the "cookie-cutter" design is using the light and a staff.
So, those who use the class of an NB are presumed to be OP (irrespective of the build) I assure you I am not. I can do ok damage if I sneak. I may beat a Sorc a few levels, higher than me. I won't usually beat a DK the same or higher, depending on what skills they use.
I need to hit hard and fast and shadow cloak and roll my arse out of there. Sometimes I make it sometimes I don't but that's what I enjoy. These generic statements of Classes are OP needs to stop, it's the skills used which are OP. Each class does not use the same weapons and skills (active and passive).
This is the problem with NBs, most people want to play them melee/bow/assassin style and they are underpowered when played like that. But they do have a build that can optimally heal trials and they do have a build that can do 1k dps. Templars do not have this.0 -
jelliedsoup✭✭✭✭✭NightbladeNerfEverything wrote: »jelliedsoup wrote: »As an archetypal NB, I use Bow, DW, Medium armour. All I hear now is how the NB is OP, this MAY be the case IF someone is using light armour and a staff. I am not. A cookie cutter I may be, but given the game design the it appears the "cookie-cutter" design is using the light and a staff.
So, those who use the class of an NB are presumed to be OP (irrespective of the build) I assure you I am not. I can do ok damage if I sneak. I may beat a Sorc a few levels, higher than me. I won't usually beat a DK the same or higher, depending on what skills they use.
I need to hit hard and fast and shadow cloak and roll my arse out of there. Sometimes I make it sometimes I don't but that's what I enjoy. These generic statements of Classes are OP needs to stop, it's the skills used which are OP. Each class does not use the same weapons and skills (active and passive).
This is the problem with NBs, most people want to play them melee/bow/assassin style and they are underpowered when played like that. But they do have a build that can optimally heal trials and they do have a build that can do 1k dps. Templars do not have this.
I understand this, and feel sorry for those Templars who want to, but can't change their build to be viable. It implies Templars need more work than NBs. I want all builds to be competitive, makes for a better game. The Min/Max have it too easy at the moment.
www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=Ks8_KGHqmO43 -
ArRashid✭✭✭✭NightbladeWell, DKs have been nerfed in like every patch since early access, and NONE of it was OUR fault. Blame exploiters abusing animation canceling and other things.
Should DKs suffer just because they have 2 DoTs they can throw in while spamming Force Shock with weapon attacks while abusing animation canceling, while other classes have just one DoT? OOOOOOOOOOOH SO OP!!!0 -
cjmarsh725b14_ESO✭✭✭✭Sorcerer
I die less to Templars as well but I kill less Templars than any other class too. If I ever come across a good Templar in the open I will 1v1 them indefinitely into a stalemate until friends arrive or we decide to move on. I think Templars could use a buff for sure, but they are still very durable as they are now.I die less to Templars than any other class. I have been smashed by DK's, i have been smashed by sorcerers. I even get smashed by Nightblades who know what they are doing. They can be absolutely deadly if they catch you from stealth.
Templars just feel average, maybe it's because there are less of them around in Cyrodiil? I vote Templar.
PS: I voted sorc as a joke because I play one and don't want to get nerfed.1 -
Dymence✭✭✭✭✭
✭TemplarThe poll should be specified to PVP or PVE. I don't think any class excels at both. Except dragon knights.1 -
Mortosk✭✭✭✭TemplarNox_Aeterna wrote: »Sorcs and DKs are still OP FOTM, how the hell do you justify a claim to be the most underpowered?
Balance sustained DPS and resource mechanics of all classes!
Next round of OP nerfs please!
justified by checking the leaderboard.
now how do you justify Temp being the most UP one with you guys crowding leaderboard?
It i funny cause you talk like the leader board represented power , which does not.
It represents who farms the most points.
Perhaps templars are on the PVP leader board because they got tired of getting their arses kicked by every 3-pack PVE encounter, and they'd rather deal with unplayable lag in Cyrodil than deal with constantly dying to PVE trash mobs.Edited by Mortosk on June 13, 2014 4:09AM"Now I stand, the lion before the lambs and they do not fear. They can not fear." --Arthas Menethil (aka, The Lich King)1 -
Mortosk✭✭✭✭Templarcjmarsh725b14_ESO wrote: »
I die less to Templars as well but I kill less Templars than any other class too. If I ever come across a good Templar in the open I will 1v1 them indefinitely into a stalemate until friends arrive or we decide to move on. I think Templars could use a buff for sure, but they are still very durable as they are now.I die less to Templars than any other class. I have been smashed by DK's, i have been smashed by sorcerers. I even get smashed by Nightblades who know what they are doing. They can be absolutely deadly if they catch you from stealth.
Templars just feel average, maybe it's because there are less of them around in Cyrodiil? I vote Templar.
PS: I voted sorc as a joke because I play one and don't want to get nerfed.
Could have to do with templars having way too many utility skills and no DPS abilities."Now I stand, the lion before the lambs and they do not fear. They can not fear." --Arthas Menethil (aka, The Lich King)1