Please.. enough with the DK nerfs/NB buffs

Devlinne

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

"DK is by far most universally the most over powered in every way you can detail, from raw damage, defense, utility, low cost resources of skills compared to other classes and can best take advantage of gear and stats etc to further illuminate this, and on and on."

It seems like most non-DKs think this way. I PvP alot (nearly 4m AP) and I just don't see it. Yes Dragon Blood is a solid self heal and will keep you up for a while, but people need to understand that it is an expensive skill and there is no way you going to have enough mana left for DPS if your casting Dragon Blood multiple times.

I guess it looks different from the outside looking in. Alot of people claim DKs are surviving zeros and tanking them solo, which is completely untrue. Yes, you can absorb loads of damage if you hold block in heavy armor and spam Dragon Blood. But your not doing any damage at that point, and your basically just prolonging your death. It LOOKS overpowered that it takes 10 people a few seconds to kill a DK, but it really just means that the DK has given up on doing anything damage wise. Is it any better that a Sorc and possibly an NB would have just used their escapes to get away?

People also need to understand that DK builds in PvP are very limited. Why? Because DKs have no ranged abilities which is huge in PvP. We also lack any means of an escape. I would trade Dragon Blood for Bolt Escape or Invis in a second. We also lack a proper gap closer which the other 3 classes have.

So we are limited to melee, and melee with no escapes. Think about that for a second. That limits us to pretty much tanking and only tanking. And with the talons/standard nerf, there is no reason to even pay attention to a tank in PvP.
People just kill your group mates and save you for last.

And I can deal with all off this, but if its going to get worse then this, then I feel like I am going to be forced to reroll.

And please people, look at this from an open mind. I know you have probably ran into a Dragon Blood spammer holding block and think they are the worst thing ever, but that is simply untrue.

Well worded and civil.
I'll try to make my response civil too.

What i have observed. DK no need to "spam dragon Blood" What they do is. Run into a group>Hold Block>PressTalons>Press Standard Of Might>Press Stam pot>OOps now hp getting low...>Press dragon Blood>Use last remaining Stam to Shield rush targets that escaped initial death>DIE(after taking out a few ppl with them.)

There comes the problem. What other class can take so many ppl with them before they die?
As you observed too. It doesn't help your case that while they do the above rotation.....they are being beaten on by a GROUP so it makes them seem that much more op.

Noone would be complaining if all a dk did was TANK/SURVIVE without killing ppl....

lao

are you actually taking frikkin pve into balance consideration? how many times have you been dropped on your head recently? no1 gives a flying *** if it takes u 10 or 12 mins to finish your crappy trial rofl. the changes are good for pvp and thats all that matters.

Lysandil

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

dracobains_ESO wrote: »

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

NBs have many skills that support a bow/staff build. .

So I would like to see justification for this on how we have "many skills" which support a bow build. Especially since you are insinuating we make a better bow class... but please explain the basis of you statement.

Personally when I look at the NB skills I see melee not ranged. Also, staffs work equally well for anyone but a bit better for some classes not NBs.

Mark Target, Haste, Strife, Cripple, Master Assassin Passive

Cripple for sure... strife is low dps.
And mark target does not apply the 75% armor reduction, when Haste does not apply the speed boost ! No point to put broken Assassin skills in shortcuts, so you don't get passives... (only Impale suits)

Kililin

The ignorance is strong in here, also at ZOS it seems.

This game has not class problems but skill line problems.
You can't fix broken skill line balance with class skill balancing.

Skirmish840

lao wrote: »

are you actually taking frikkin pve into balance consideration? how many times have you been dropped on your head recently? no1 gives a flying *** if it takes u 10 or 12 mins to finish your crappy trial rofl. the changes are good for pvp and thats all that matters.

What the hell are you going on about, games aren't all about pvp ffs, infact their more about pve, you spend all that time pveing and if you want to (optional) when you've reached a high enough level you can go pvp your ass off. Start balancing for pvp and pve goes to the shitter....

Thank goodness the devs are smarter than that, or atleast I hope so

Stamden

Devlinne wrote: »

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

"DK is by far most universally the most over powered in every way you can detail, from raw damage, defense, utility, low cost resources of skills compared to other classes and can best take advantage of gear and stats etc to further illuminate this, and on and on."

It seems like most non-DKs think this way. I PvP alot (nearly 4m AP) and I just don't see it. Yes Dragon Blood is a solid self heal and will keep you up for a while, but people need to understand that it is an expensive skill and there is no way you going to have enough mana left for DPS if your casting Dragon Blood multiple times.

I guess it looks different from the outside looking in. Alot of people claim DKs are surviving zeros and tanking them solo, which is completely untrue. Yes, you can absorb loads of damage if you hold block in heavy armor and spam Dragon Blood. But your not doing any damage at that point, and your basically just prolonging your death. It LOOKS overpowered that it takes 10 people a few seconds to kill a DK, but it really just means that the DK has given up on doing anything damage wise. Is it any better that a Sorc and possibly an NB would have just used their escapes to get away?

People also need to understand that DK builds in PvP are very limited. Why? Because DKs have no ranged abilities which is huge in PvP. We also lack any means of an escape. I would trade Dragon Blood for Bolt Escape or Invis in a second. We also lack a proper gap closer which the other 3 classes have.

So we are limited to melee, and melee with no escapes. Think about that for a second. That limits us to pretty much tanking and only tanking. And with the talons/standard nerf, there is no reason to even pay attention to a tank in PvP.
People just kill your group mates and save you for last.

And I can deal with all off this, but if its going to get worse then this, then I feel like I am going to be forced to reroll.

And please people, look at this from an open mind. I know you have probably ran into a Dragon Blood spammer holding block and think they are the worst thing ever, but that is simply untrue.

Well worded and civil.
I'll try to make my response civil too.

What i have observed. DK no need to "spam dragon Blood" What they do is. Run into a group>Hold Block>PressTalons>Press Standard Of Might>Press Stam pot>OOps now hp getting low...>Press dragon Blood>Use last remaining Stam to Shield rush targets that escaped initial death>DIE(after taking out a few ppl with them.)

There comes the problem. What other class can take so many ppl with them before they die?
As you observed too. It doesn't help your case that while they do the above rotation.....they are being beaten on by a GROUP so it makes them seem that much more op.

Noone would be complaining if all a dk did was TANK/SURVIVE without killing ppl....

I used to do a similiar thing. Definitely not solo, but with a group, this is generally what I would be doing. You should know that this setup got nerfed very hard. The range nerf to talons means you can't hit a lot of people and thus can't keep that many people in range for long. The next problem is the between the range nerf, and the ult generation nerf, there is no way you can generate enough ult to drop another standard. Spamming Talons is also very expensive, and in heavy armor you are going to run out very fast. And then since pretty much everyone is a caster now, there is usually nobody stupid enough to stay in range of Talons.

So yeah in most situations this doesn't work very well post-1.1.3

dracobains_ESO

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

dracobains_ESO wrote: »

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

NBs have many skills that support a bow/staff build. .

So I would like to see justification for this on how we have "many skills" which support a bow build. Especially since you are insinuating we make a better bow class...

Mark Target, Haste, Strife, Cripple, Master Assassin Passive

Mark Target certainly has good synergy with bows. Haste unless fixed recently was bugged and would not apply to bows. Last I read it still was not working properly and therefore not useable by bow specs. Strife works just fine with anything there is nothing bow centric about it. Cripple is certainly a good bow synergy skill. Master Assassin is fine with anything but works better with a melee Ambush assassin.

So out of 15 class abilities you have listed 2 that have good synergy with bows and a passive that works with everything. I play almost exclusively with a bow and it functions well enough and there are ways to create decent synergy by combining melee abilities to bow when they gap close but that is nowhere near "many".

But I could make a better case for Sorcs using a bow build than NBs. Pets are great for bow builds as they occupy the targets while you kill them from range. Dots work very well with kiting so virtually the entire daedric summoning line would have decent to good synergy with bows. Crystal shards would be amazing with bows; makes me envious even. Daedric mines... Rune prison... you get where I am going.

You can make weapons work for any class if you wanted but that does not equate to great synergy. If Destro wasn't so OP I bet you would see a significant number of Sorc bow users but the two are not competitive. I play a bow nightblade but not because of the synergy. I play it because it is the archetype I love and have always played.

Most of the NB skills lean heavily in favor of melee builds but can work fine with whatever just like the other 3 classes. But NBs are in no way better suited for bow and resto than anyone else and in fact less so in my opinion. If you look at the number of ranged attacks in the Sorc tree versus the NB tree, this becomes more than evident.

Stamden

dracobains_ESO wrote: »

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

dracobains_ESO wrote: »

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

NBs have many skills that support a bow/staff build. .

So I would like to see justification for this on how we have "many skills" which support a bow build. Especially since you are insinuating we make a better bow class...

Mark Target, Haste, Strife, Cripple, Master Assassin Passive

Mark Target certainly has good synergy with bows. Haste unless fixed recently was bugged and would not apply to bows. Last I read it still was not working properly and therefore not useable by bow specs. Strife works just fine with anything there is nothing bow centric about it. Cripple is certainly a good bow synergy skill. Master Assassin is fine with anything but works better with a melee Ambush assassin.

So out of 15 class abilities you have listed 2 that have good synergy with bows and a passive that works with everything. I play almost exclusively with a bow and it functions well enough and there are ways to create decent synergy by combining melee abilities to bow when they gap close but that is nowhere near "many".

But I could make a better case for Sorcs using a bow build than NBs. Pets are great for bow builds as they occupy the targets while you kill them from range. Dots work very well with kiting so virtually the entire daedric summoning line would have decent to good synergy with bows. Crystal shards would be amazing with bows; makes me envious even. Daedric mines... Rune prison... you get where I am going.

You can make weapons work for any class if you wanted but that does not equate to great synergy. If Destro wasn't so OP I bet you would see a significant number of Sorc bow users but the two are not competitive. I play a bow nightblade but not because of the synergy. I play it because it is the archetype I love and have always played.

Most of the NB skills lean heavily in favor of melee builds but can work fine with whatever just like the other 3 classes. But NBs are in no way better suited for bow and resto than anyone else and in fact less so in my opinion. If you look at the number of ranged attacks in the Sorc tree versus the NB tree, this becomes more than evident.

Well you only really need 2 class skills that would work well with bow and the rest would be weapon/other skill lines. I guess I should not have said there is "many", but the point is NBs have something that can atleast support a ranged build. DKs have nothing in that department, meaning that they are pretty much 100% limited to melee.

dracobains_ESO

I do not play DKs (unless you think level 8 qualifies) so I will defer to your expertise there.

arnaldomoraleseb17_ESO

Agreed. Problem ATM is magicka builds > stamina builds, not a classes balance issue. How much time Zenimax need to understand it? Who knows....

monkeymystic

The fact that all DKs are rerolling to NBs in the top worldwide PVE guilds should say something on how screwed up this balancing and nerfhammering on dks is.

Yasha

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

Max NB DPS Pre-patch: ~1k Post-patch: ~1.2k

Max DK DPS Pre-patch: ~1.2k Post-patch: ~900

Where are you getting (pulling?) these numbers from and what was the buff to NB that upped their dps?

Are the complaints about NB that they can't do dps, or that they have limited CC, buggy skills, and comparatively useless skills?

Vuron

Skirmish840 wrote: »

lao wrote: »

are you actually taking frikkin pve into balance consideration? how many times have you been dropped on your head recently? no1 gives a flying *** if it takes u 10 or 12 mins to finish your crappy trial rofl. the changes are good for pvp and thats all that matters.

What the hell are you going on about, games aren't all about pvp ffs, infact their more about pve, you spend all that time pveing and if you want to (optional) when you've reached a high enough level you can go pvp your ass off. Start balancing for pvp and pve goes to the shitter....

Thank goodness the devs are smarter than that, or atleast I hope so

Have you not been paying attention? Where do you think all of these changes/nerfs are coming from? It's quite obvious that many, many of these changes are being driven by an imbalance in PVP and they are trying to balance PvP but the results are doing nothing but screwing up PvE.

Axer

OP is utter and complete nonesense.

DKs on live right now are still BY FAR the best class in the game. DPS and tanking wise.

The trial leader boards continue to proove this.

"Max NB DPS Pre-patch: ~1k Post-patch: ~1.2k"

lol.

Screenshots please, of either.

Completely made up nonsense.

Pre patch they could only dream of maybe 700 dps. Post patch about 800.

Even the best NBs on the trial speedruns could not come up with screenshots of such claims of higher. They could only provide AOE ones at 900.

DKs continue to do 1.2k+ single target on the wisp boss in my guild. And they run on very slow crap laptop that lessens there dps. Optimal is 1.4k. 100% single target.

Zero dk nerfs related to this are in the notes. Maybe their are stealth nerfs? I dont know. But you are mentioning the live build.

-Axer
(I lead a guild with around 30+ extremely skilled V12s of every class who regularly complete the trial)

GreasedLizard

Yasha wrote: »

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

Max NB DPS Pre-patch: ~1k Post-patch: ~1.2k

Max DK DPS Pre-patch: ~1.2k Post-patch: ~900

Where are you getting (pulling?) these numbers from and what was the buff to NB that upped their dps?

Are the complaints about NB that they can't do dps, or that they have limited CC, buggy skills, and comparatively useless skills?

Where the sun rarely shines.

Not even top TF posters claim that, and they would if they could!

~850 in BIS gear with best raid synergies and with all FG passives working ... and that is pure caster build, which is boring as hell. It also hangs out to dry 90% of NB class synergies, as they are very melee orientated

Mehsive

Show me a few NB putting out near to 1k DPS sustained on a single target trial fight right now - not just a screen shot, link us some videos of that, and while you're at it show me this fabled 1.2k current single target number that apparently NB's on PTS are putting out and i will happily accept that i (and many others at this moment) are wrong.

Alot of the people on this thread are admitting that it's not the classes that need to be changed at the moment, but general skill lines and magicka/stamina disparity for the good of the game. Yet the Thread owner and a few other DK stalwarts here are adamant that it is other classes must not become more powerful at all costs!

Just a point, I've had a look at the forums and i haven't found any posts from the thread owner here lamenting the lack of balance when even ZoS admitted that certain DK builds were too strong. i think it's a case of forum users like this not worrying about the good of the game, but instead the good of themselves. If we left decision making to players like this, class design would never become balanced.

Let me reiterate what I'd like to see - viable stamina builds. End game fights where it's more beneficial to be Melee than ranged. an actual Balance of classes where each has it's own niche yet is still competitive with enough toil in all areas. Instead of this current monopoly on live held by two classes. That is what I'd like to see for the good of the game, not for the good of a few individuals.

Jaxom

Mehsive wrote: »

Show me a few NB putting out near to 1k DPS sustained on a single target trial fight right now - not just a screen shot, link us some videos of that, and while you're at it show me this fabled 1.2k current single target number that apparently NB's on PTS are putting out and i will happily accept that i (and many others at this moment) are wrong.

Alot of the people on this thread are admitting that it's not the classes that need to be changed at the moment, but general skill lines and magicka/stamina disparity for the good of the game. Yet the Thread owner and a few other DK stalwarts here are adamant that it is other classes must not become more powerful at all costs!

Just a point, I've had a look at the forums and i haven't found any posts from the thread owner here lamenting the lack of balance when even ZoS admitted that certain DK builds were too strong. i think it's a case of forum users like this not worrying about the good of the game, but instead the good of themselves. If we left decision making to players like this, class design would never become balanced.

Let me reiterate what I'd like to see - viable stamina builds. End game fights where it's more beneficial to be Melee than ranged. an actual Balance of classes where each has it's own niche yet is still competitive with enough toil in all areas. Instead of this current monopoly on live held by two classes. That is what I'd like to see for the good of the game, not for the good of a few individuals.

Yes Yes Yes. You will not see anyone posting a 1.2k ST DPS video of an NB because it cannot possibly happen. I agree with everything you are saying. I have swapped to dual resto staff 7/7 light from my bow/dw medium armor build because the staff 7/7 combo is so far superior, no one in their right mind who wants to do competetive endgame will choose otherwise. Hell, you can barely do solo PvE without a resto staff as a NB.

OkieDokie

Mehsive wrote: »

Show me a few NB putting out near to 1k DPS sustained on a single target trial fight right now - not just a screen shot, link us some videos of that, and while you're at it show me this fabled 1.2k current single target number that apparently NB's on PTS are putting out and i will happily accept that i (and many others at this moment) are wrong.

Even if they could, that would be under really restrict conditions (buffs, ultimate on) that would only apply to trials.

It's the same as the 'nasty' builds people claim to have found. This feedback just confuses devs. Someone pointed out a few days ago and I am convinced it is true, the main reason for poor changes in NB class is wrong feedback.

Skirmish840

Vuron wrote: »

Skirmish840 wrote: »

lao wrote: »

are you actually taking frikkin pve into balance consideration? how many times have you been dropped on your head recently? no1 gives a flying *** if it takes u 10 or 12 mins to finish your crappy trial rofl. the changes are good for pvp and thats all that matters.

What the hell are you going on about, games aren't all about pvp ffs, infact their more about pve, you spend all that time pveing and if you want to (optional) when you've reached a high enough level you can go pvp your ass off. Start balancing for pvp and pve goes to the shitter....

Thank goodness the devs are smarter than that, or atleast I hope so

Have you not been paying attention? Where do you think all of these changes/nerfs are coming from? It's quite obvious that many, many of these changes are being driven by an imbalance in PVP and they are trying to balance PvP but the results are doing nothing but screwing up PvE.

I completely agree with ya, unfortunately ;(

Stamden

OkieDokie wrote: »

Mehsive wrote: »

Show me a few NB putting out near to 1k DPS sustained on a single target trial fight right now - not just a screen shot, link us some videos of that, and while you're at it show me this fabled 1.2k current single target number that apparently NB's on PTS are putting out and i will happily accept that i (and many others at this moment) are wrong.

Even if they could, that would be under really restrict conditions (buffs, ultimate on) that would only apply to trials.

It's the same as the 'nasty' builds people claim to have found. This feedback just confuses devs. Someone pointed out a few days ago and I am convinced it is true, the main reason for poor changes in NB class is wrong feedback.

http://postimg.org/image/npo7j4t37/
That's NB DPS after the Warrior fight. Sorry guys but my guildmate won't go into detail about his build. I'll give you a hint though, it uses typically what would be expensive skills and with siphoning strikes getting back a ton of resources from light attack weaves, you can manage to spam it/them.

Axer wrote: »

OP is utter and complete nonesense.

DKs on live right now are still BY FAR the best class in the game. DPS and tanking wise.

The trial leader boards continue to proove this.

"Max NB DPS Pre-patch: ~1k Post-patch: ~1.2k"

lol.

Screenshots please, of either.

Completely made up nonsense.

Pre patch they could only dream of maybe 700 dps. Post patch about 800.

Even the best NBs on the trial speedruns could not come up with screenshots of such claims of higher. They could only provide AOE ones at 900.

DKs continue to do 1.2k+ single target on the wisp boss in my guild. And they run on very slow crap laptop that lessens there dps. Optimal is 1.4k. 100% single target.

Zero dk nerfs related to this are in the notes. Maybe their are stealth nerfs? I dont know. But you are mentioning the live build.

-Axer
(I lead a guild with around 30+ extremely skilled V12s of every class who regularly complete the trial)

No DK build is getting past 1k sustained. At times you can get 1.2k and possibly even 1.3k IF your standard is up and group has appropriate buffs on. As I mentioned above, NBs can pull much more DPS then 800.

-Neighbor
(of the 11 minute trial run group)

Kililin

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

OkieDokie wrote: »

Mehsive wrote: »

Show me a few NB putting out near to 1k DPS sustained on a single target trial fight right now - not just a screen shot, link us some videos of that, and while you're at it show me this fabled 1.2k current single target number that apparently NB's on PTS are putting out and i will happily accept that i (and many others at this moment) are wrong.

Even if they could, that would be under really restrict conditions (buffs, ultimate on) that would only apply to trials.

It's the same as the 'nasty' builds people claim to have found. This feedback just confuses devs. Someone pointed out a few days ago and I am convinced it is true, the main reason for poor changes in NB class is wrong feedback.

http://postimg.org/image/npo7j4t37/
That's NB DPS after the Warrior fight. Sorry guys but my guildmate won't go into detail about his build. I'll give you a hint though, it uses typically what would be expensive skills and with siphoning strikes getting back a ton of resources from light attack weaves, you can manage to spam it/them.

It is a lost cause, the next posts will demand a video or something.
This game has a higher skill cap than normal mmos, coupled with a severe imbalance of skills (i did not write classes but skills) additionaly it favors non intentional behavior (like weaving skills/animation canelling) these points together are the reason that one person could think of a class as the best in some area, while the next one perceives it as totally gimp.

That this game loses player in masses aggravates the problem because the information about what works and what not is not spread fast by usual channels.

OkieDokie

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

http://postimg.org/image/npo7j4t37/
That's NB DPS after the Warrior fight. Sorry guys but my guildmate won't go into detail about his build. I'll give you a hint though, it uses typically what would be expensive skills and with siphoning strikes getting back a ton of resources from light attack weaves, you can manage to spam it/them.

Hm...where?

That is not his dps for this fight, it is the last recorded damage. It could be against anything, damage against a pack of enemies, a single target killed by concealed blades from shadow, whatever.

Even if we assume it is his last recorded dps for the fight - if he had a bunch of buffs, more damage going on and crit from shadow with killer blade as last hit I think, perhaps, we could get near that. However, that is not his actual dps, it is not what he is reaching during the fight.

Try an actual dps window for the fight.

Kililin wrote: »

It is a lost cause, the next posts will demand a video or something.

Yeah, because it is unreasonable to ask for real evidence if someone asks for a nerf that will affect an entire class.

killedbyping

What are you talking about ? There was NO buffs for NB since start of the game what so ever. And no upcoming patch going to make any buffs as far as i see.

Actualy, i see only some more minor NERFS in every single patch note to alrdy useless class.

khele23eb17_ESO

killedbyping wrote: »

What are you talking about ? There was NO buffs for NB since start of the game what so ever. And no upcoming patch going to make any buffs as far as i see.

Actualy, i see only some more minor NERFS in every single patch note to alrdy useless class.

VoB can crit now. However a) Im not really convinced caster NBs are as strong as the guy claims... I dont play one tho, so who knows... b) I dont really care about Nightsticks. I rolled a NightBLADE and nightBLADES are severely underperforming. Anything without a staff and robe is.

killedbyping

khele23eb17_ESO wrote: »

killedbyping wrote: »

What are you talking about ? There was NO buffs for NB since start of the game what so ever. And no upcoming patch going to make any buffs as far as i see.

Actualy, i see only some more minor NERFS in every single patch note to alrdy useless class.

VoB can crit now. However a) Im not really convinced caster NBs are as strong as the guy claims... I dont play one tho, so who knows... b) I dont really care about Nightsticks. I rolled a NightBLADE and nightBLADES are severely underperforming. Anything without a staff and robe is.

Thats not even buff -.- just a fix.

Kililin

OkieDokie wrote: »

Kililin wrote: »

It is a lost cause, the next posts will demand a video or something.

Yeah, because it is unreasonable to ask for real evidence if someone asks for a nerf that will affect an entire class.

Did he ask for a nerf of NB skills?

Axer

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

No DK build is getting past 1k sustained. At times you can get 1.2k and possibly even 1.3k IF your standard is up and group has appropriate buffs on. As I mentioned above, NBs can pull much more DPS then 800.

-Neighbor
(of the 11 minute trial run group)

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/108439/dk-dps-1k-not-spamming-crit-pots-no-emp-buffs#latest

Video proof from a member of the Condemned guild (EP-NA).

He does 1.1k on the stone atronach, with zero potion use, and a non ideal rotation. They kill it fast enough that it's no aoe.

1102 exact upon the death of the wisp boss. Again, no spell power potion use.

Both sustained, easily maintainable rotations.

I have 3 DKs in my guild that consistently do higher. (We have essentially unlimited spell power potions and access to more buffs) And they don't really do youtube (crappy computers/low interest) though I can provide screenshots if you really must see.

So sorry Neighbor, you guys are fast, but there are faster out there dps wise.

We've downed the storm atronac (about 160k health ) in 19 seconds.

thats 8400 raid dps. We took 3 healers and I tanked, dealing pretty crap dps. So really only 8 dps. 1050 average per member, and I can tell ya now, the vast majority was DKs, some doing a ton more then others. Seen screenhots of 1600+
Post nerf.

thats not really sustained since its basically 100% banner, but you get the picture. DKs are still mega high dps.

We have some pretty sick dps in the guild, we just have to work on our healing/survivability to post a nicer time.

So I posted my proof.

Lets see your 800+ NB single target sustained dps, because even that's hard to believe. I can sort of see it, but i'd still like proof.

OkieDokie

Kililin wrote: »

OkieDokie wrote: »

Kililin wrote: »

It is a lost cause, the next posts will demand a video or something.

Yeah, because it is unreasonable to ask for real evidence if someone asks for a nerf that will affect an entire class.

Did he ask for a nerf of NB skills?

deathpandax_ESO wrote: »

So please, either revert the 1.1.3 ult generation changes, or (and everyone is going to hate me for this) nerf NBs to the appropriate DPS.

How about you explain to me why it is unreasonable to ask for real evidence?

cfriedman71ub17_ESO

Nerfing any abilities only ever leads to one thing.. unsubscribe. The only good way to balance is to buff abilities. That is too much work for most dev teams because then you have to rebalance the whole game. it is just bad business all around.

Shaun98ca2

cfriedman71ub17_ESO wrote: »

Nerfing any abilities only ever leads to one thing.. unsubscribe. The only good way to balance is to buff abilities. That is too much work for most dev teams because then you have to rebalance the whole game. it is just bad business all around.

So ONLY buff abilities to create balance. What do you do when content becomes trivialized?