Not sure this is the right place considering it has nothing to do with implemented changes on the PTS and is more about the Necro refresh which won't happen till late 2027.

That said, I agree somewhat. Personally I'm hoping for the following:

1. Abandon the Elementalist and DOT fantasy.
2. Reinforce the Debuff and Summoner fantasy.

The Elementalist aspect they implemented by trying to stack 1~2 of each element on their class skills in addition to the overly generic Rapid Rot passive is just lacking from top to bottom. It doesn't even really fit on a Necromancer in any RPG and I'd hate to see them force it in with the upcomming refresh.

Of all the classes, it's clear that Arcanist is the closest to an Elementalist with recent developements. They have a unique passive and class set that improves all status effects which easily combines well with the new Signet mythic. To me, they're being positioned as what I see as the game's "Chaos Mage", it's unruly, wild, and random due to deriving from Hermaeus Mora and the tomes. Arcanists don't need all the elements built in to be an Elementalist, they could be 100% Magic damage with a passive that allows Magic damage and the Overcharged status effect to have a chance to deal 1 of the other 7 elements.

So with the Elementalist shifting to Arcanist, Necromancer is freed up to highly specialize in the parts it already does well like debuffing, rotting, and summoning. All their abilities can be changed to Disease damage, but since debuffing and effects like Defile aren't useful in PvE, Necro could have unique ways to improve and build off of them further similar to how Warden's make Frost damage competitive.

For example; Rapid Rot could be changed to no longer improve DOTs by +10% (DK does this so well already). Instead, it improves the Diseased status effect by +25% damage. Additionally, Diseased applies a 4s dot which increases in damage done by +10% based on the number of debuffs applied. Think the Maarselok monster set basically. With this type of implementation, debuffs could be something you build for in all content instead of being hit or miss. Mangle, Timdity, Lifesteal, Overcharged, all useful now regardless of content.

For the Summoner aspect, abilities like Skeletal Mage could be adjusted to be more engaging. For example, they apply a debuff and can be stacked up to 3 times, but the 2nd and 3rd summon require a corpse. Blighted Blastbones could remain the same, but now applies a corpse to your target allowing a targetted tether that is only broken by distance or line of sight. A Boneyard morph could summon floating skulls every few seconds that extend beyond the radius and pew/pew or tackle enemies.

Also, I've seen people suggest Bleed/Poison for Necro and I'd have to disagree. I'm of the notion that classes become more interesting when they're hyperfocussed on a given area to allow for sets and passives to truely shine.

If I had to pick only 1 home for each of the 8 elements it would look something like this:

1. DK = Flame
2. Warden = Frost + Poison
3. Sorc = Shock
4. Templar = Phys + Mag
5. NB = Bleed
6. Necro = Disease
7. Arcanist = Mag where Overcharged procs every status effect randomly OR all abilities randomly pick from 1/8 elements for every damage tick.

Poison was removed from DK, it's coming back in a better way. Warden has animals and nature which easily makes sense for Poison and helps promote a Summer/Spring fantasy that Flame would be too extreme for. Frost isn't going anywhere, so I think this is a fair balance.

NB is an Assassin class, they have a Blood Magic line that should deal Bleed damage, they could really use any justification for the 4 martial elements, but this makes things fit neatly and cleanly.

Disease, Defile, Defoul, all feel very "Necro" coded. Enough said. Again, they could use Bleed and Poison, but those fit better on NB and Warden.

Sorc enough said. Templar, there is no holy magic in the game, Mag/Phys already shares this generic, fits all approach which matches Templar's purposes very well. I'd be happy if Phys stayed on Sorc too, but I think it's obviously more tuned for Shock, so go all in then. Gives more identity for Templar.

Arcanist I covered in depth. Chaos mage.

Wuuffyy wrote: »

hoangdz wrote: »

This is possibly one of the rare cases where not all opinions are valid. If you know you know

I absolutely agree on the matter! That and more can once again be discussed in the thread mentioned over and over and over (info below however). You can also read what is quoted under the spoiler if you need it before you head over (inside is the tag to ~the discussion~)

Wuuffyy wrote: »

Overbowed wrote: »

Please post the CMX's, videos, and math you are using to come to this conclusion.

I have- check here

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691083/u50-feedback-thread-for-combat-refresh-werewolf

and here

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691541/ww-is-too-op-debate-from-ww-feedback-thread.

I’m constantly and consistently providing proof throughout those posts. I actually went back to check through my own posts and I my requests indeed remain the same through and through (and have yet to be met). I even made an attempt at providing genuine feedback for class mastery in relation to werewolf (going on good faith and assuming there is/was any validity in the ‘nerf werewolf’ claim) after seeing sorc-with-masteries parsing a whopping ~220k on the atro dummy.

Someone said it best in that the 1 video supplied shows nothing but a hodgepodge of Riften duels with players of various skill levels (some literally die after 10 seconds using 2 skills or less) providing no info on opponent gear or even the challenger’s gear/abilities (skills lines,etc.). Add to this the CMXs were parsing with Relequen, Huntsman (super damage 1 v 1 mythic), and the ilk (once again CMX being incapable of relaying opponent info or ‘challenger’ gear/abilities).

I use parses (which show possible maximums and are replica-table) to ‘prove’ my numbers and reasoning in discussion. I also draw from tooltips and provide evidence of gear, etc. when I post my own personal info.

Overbowed wrote: »

Wuuffy it's pretty clear you aren't acting in good faith, but I will engage once, and only once.

(how dare thee misspell my name, jk)

I actually do believe it’s incredibly disingenuous to ‘enter’ a conversation by name dropping, accusing someone of acting in bad faith, while providing no substantive evidence of any kind from ‘your side’. This in and of itself is about as disingenuous as saying ‘nerf x’ because ‘I ran Relequen and Hunstman in a 1v1’ and ‘here’s what I pulled’… all while providing literally no information or proof of your opponent gear/ abilities for protection values, etc.

But HEY, that’s just a fil—- I meant if you wish to discuss more please enter the second thread listed above and I’d be happy to go at the roundabout should you choose (I request substantive proof, you provide none as described very clearly in threads+above, rinse-repeat).

Buddy, I can't tell if you're a master ragebaiter or you are genuinely serious in your conviction. Regardless, I cannot be bothered going through another 5+ pages of arguing in circles with the WW community, so I'll just state these 3 facts (yes, they are facts, not opinions):

1) WW is currently overperforming on PTS, with or without class masteries. This has been repeatedly demonstrated multiple times by good players utilizing a PROPER build against good opponents. If, for whatever reason, you doubt the competency of those opponents, I STRONGLY suggest you prove it by taking their place instead.

2) WW is currently performing best with proc sets. Nobody here can claim that slapping them on WW falsifies data when it has already happened on the live server (i.e Pyrebrand/Relequen/Vateshran DK, Relequen Bowsorc, Null Arca builds, Gorethief builds, etc.). All of these iterations exist on the live server and are still popular in all facets of PvP. People aren't wearing those sets to "win duels and skew data". They're wearing them because their specs have the best synergy with those sets.

3) Whether you like it or not, 1v1 is one of the best methods to gauge PvP balance. It's not 100% accurate, but it's currently the best way to give balance feedback because everything is controlled.

Why not make Vampiric Drain a 4.5 Second channel like Fatecarver, Engulfing Firebreath and Fury Claws.

xylena wrote: »

Faltasë wrote: »

Have you even touched the Sorc with anecdotal gameplay in actual content or are you still disillusioned based ONLY on PTS parse numbers/ number statistics? Sorc is still way underbaked, Idk what kind of stuff you're seeing but Sorc passives still need alot of work.

I've touched Sorc lots. It has been underbaked as a class for 12 years now, but the Mastery is undeniably strong. If you guys are referring to relatively underpowered MagSorc builds, there have been 0 metas where "stack max mag to do everything (from range)" has been balanced, either busted op or useless garbage, here's hoping the upcoming rework resolves this.

This is the crux of the issue and a lot of it stems from the fact there seems to be no real "Sorc Dev" on the team and hasn't been since probably Vvardenfell (or maybe even earlier) given how the Sorcerer changes have been handled over the years.
Keeping these flaws in the Sorcerers class kit has meant that the only way to make Sorcerer competitive (in any setting) is to bump the numbers up so stupidly high (see U41 ward changes, class sets and class masteries as proof) that there's no way to truly balance them.

These design fallacies ZOS has with Sorc really need to be addressed or the Sorc refresh will flop just as bad as everything else ZOS has tried with Sorc.

When doing Sorcs refresh, ZOS needs to:
Also, now that DK is giving the entire group major berserk when casting an ultimate (any ultimate) from the DK mastery as well as major heroism to the group (that also allows the caster to cast that ultimate much more frequently), on top of being a superior parse DD thanks to the abundance of cleave access DK has that Sorcerer does not have, Sorcerer needs it's own unique reason to bring it to groups since DK is taking the existing only reason to bring Sorcerers into end-game PvE group content at all (that being atro on a support for group major berserk).

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Exactly.

DK has the (awesome) "problem" where they have SO many great skills that you just want to slot them all and get severe FOMO when you are constrained by your scarce bar space.

Meanwhile, over in Sorc-Land, you could delete 75% of total Sorc skills and nobody would care - or even notice - because they are such collective dogwater that they haven't been slotted by serious players since the age of Elsweyr.

I will say, though, that when every class has as stacked skills as DK... the game will be absolutely cooking again. And it will be glorious.

Also, probably closer to 85% of sorcs abilities could be removed and nobody would notice. The only ones people would notice enough to complain about would be the pets (and only pet mains would complain), hurricane (this specific morph only) and Streak (PvP) (wow a whopping 6 out of 36 morphs of the entire kit would have people notice/complain if they got removed). Everything else is just too niche, completely redundant or just simply outclassed by better alternatives.

p.s. not counting atro anymore since it's redundant with DK mastery passive, also not counting ward anymore because U46 nerf completely killed it to the point that shield soul is a better shield than ward due to secondary effects + utility beyond just being a shield.

This is possibly one of the rare cases where not all opinions are valid. If you know you know