Best Of
Re: Campaign duration and faction locks
14 day I think is a very fair compromise. 30 days gets excessive, and by the 2nd week 7 times out of 10 the campaign victor is essentially already decided.
Lord_Hev
3
Re: Official Night Market Feedback Thread
I find the crickets from devs - even from our forum mods - deafening. Not surprising, but illustrative.
Much of this feedback was given on the PTS in advance of the release. It was, of course, apparently largely ignored. Some players are really enjoying the content - and that is honestly great. But a much larger number are apparently not - and that is indicative there is a huge problem ... which may have been at least partially bypassed if the devs listened to initial feedback. "It's too late to change" is not an excuse which holds true if something is in testing mode. And if those tests show bugs or mechanics which don't work or aren't well received, then only hubris stops changes which would elevate a hot mess to a solid new content release.
Personally, I haven't seen more than three people anywhere in the NM. No zone/area/grouping chat. NPCs with names over their head who don't even react when you attempt to speak to them in the staging area. Wave after wave of "trash" foe who respawn practically as they fall. I can block, roll, and sneak just like anybody else, but I also die ... and relative non-stop dying is not what I call challenge nor do I consider it enjoyable. There is no purpose to the factions, no apparent story arc, no reason for the conflict except new content of some sort was needed, and this was one of the fastest things to be put together. (Note: I do not know this for fact, but it stands to reason given my discussions with others and with friends who are indie game devs.)
It's seriously giving me flashbacks to other games I've played in the past trying extremely similar "new event!" stuff ... and failing miserably because players overall did not enjoy or continue to participate. In fact, those game events fizzled and player confidence//trust was broken. And that, dear devs, can be the death knell for a game.
If I had to guess at the outcome of this round of NM, I'd say that a relative few will enjoy the heck out of it (and this is good), a relative few will avoid it altogether (understandable), and the remainder will somehow do as much as they can to reach their own predetermined goal (such as the house). Some of you would argue that is the outcome for all content, but I would caution against accepting this as "normal". If a player does not feel their time and effort is respected - not even rewarded, just respected! - they will eventually go elsewhere. The Solstice fracas was the first major sounding of the warning to the devs, and it was not heeded. Let's hope the Night Market doesn't end up being the second strike.
Much of this feedback was given on the PTS in advance of the release. It was, of course, apparently largely ignored. Some players are really enjoying the content - and that is honestly great. But a much larger number are apparently not - and that is indicative there is a huge problem ... which may have been at least partially bypassed if the devs listened to initial feedback. "It's too late to change" is not an excuse which holds true if something is in testing mode. And if those tests show bugs or mechanics which don't work or aren't well received, then only hubris stops changes which would elevate a hot mess to a solid new content release.
Personally, I haven't seen more than three people anywhere in the NM. No zone/area/grouping chat. NPCs with names over their head who don't even react when you attempt to speak to them in the staging area. Wave after wave of "trash" foe who respawn practically as they fall. I can block, roll, and sneak just like anybody else, but I also die ... and relative non-stop dying is not what I call challenge nor do I consider it enjoyable. There is no purpose to the factions, no apparent story arc, no reason for the conflict except new content of some sort was needed, and this was one of the fastest things to be put together. (Note: I do not know this for fact, but it stands to reason given my discussions with others and with friends who are indie game devs.)
It's seriously giving me flashbacks to other games I've played in the past trying extremely similar "new event!" stuff ... and failing miserably because players overall did not enjoy or continue to participate. In fact, those game events fizzled and player confidence//trust was broken. And that, dear devs, can be the death knell for a game.
If I had to guess at the outcome of this round of NM, I'd say that a relative few will enjoy the heck out of it (and this is good), a relative few will avoid it altogether (understandable), and the remainder will somehow do as much as they can to reach their own predetermined goal (such as the house). Some of you would argue that is the outcome for all content, but I would caution against accepting this as "normal". If a player does not feel their time and effort is respected - not even rewarded, just respected! - they will eventually go elsewhere. The Solstice fracas was the first major sounding of the warning to the devs, and it was not heeded. Let's hope the Night Market doesn't end up being the second strike.
liliub17_ESO
17
Re: Night Market Haikus (5 syllables, 7 syllables, 5 syllables)
Let's go! Let's go! Let's...
I'm dead. Again. And again.
Guess I'm out. See ya~
I'm dead. Again. And again.
Guess I'm out. See ya~
Re: Official Night Market Feedback Thread
tomofhyrule wrote: »I do think the new style of drip-feeding content is also exacerbating the “there’s no content for us” problem.
We have seen that the ESO playerbase tends to grind hard and fast as soon as something is available (the poor horker population on the shores of Wrothgar may never recover). But that also means we as a playerbase have a very “what have you done for me lately” view on things.
With the Chapter model, where everything that’s part of the patch drops with the patch, it then gives everyone a chance to look at what they’re interested in right away… and pretend the things they’re not interested in don’t really exist.
Take Necrom’s drop for example: the trial population had a fresh new trial, the people who like to explore zones had a whole new place (two of them!) to check out. People who enjoy dailies has a bunch of those ready to go. And everyone had a new Class full of new skills to level up for PvE or PvP. There really was something for everyone, and far too much to do at once.
With the drip-feed model, we get more frequent drops of way less. That means that this month’s drop of the Night Market, which is designed for high-level players and groups, is the only thing that dropped. Players who are not in that cohort then feel left out, like ESO has abandoned them… even if the next few drops in Season One are going to be all solo quests in the new TG line, new Sheo line, and all of the Favors, solo players don’t see any of that now so they feel betrayed.
That also means that Season One is going to get griping from group players, since the next group thing to drop won’t be until U51’s High Seas event, which seems to be more like the Writhing Fortress than a standard trial. They will get a full Trial in U51 as well, but then again the solo players will feel left out.
Not all content needs to be for all players. But if players are getting the perception of being left out, that leads to a lot of frustration, as we see now.
As to what I would do to change the Night Market for the return at the end of the year? I would add another daily quest to the central area similar to Cyrodiil scouting quests - an NPC sends you to the districts to put some tracker rune on the rooftops. That would not only teach the jump pad mechanic, but also it should have the NPC specifically suggest sneaking around and using invisibility potions or the Shadow line to get around without being hurt. That would allow players to interact with the zone in a different way, but still get credit.
I might also modify the difficulty of certain things a bit. Currently most basepop (trash) is balanced as normal trial basepop. I would actually reduce the difficulty of specifically the basepop mobs to normal dungeon difficulty - not the bosses, and not even the elite mobs (the big enemy in each pull), but I would pull the handful of trash down a bit. That would really not change much for vet players (unless they are specifically looking for difficulty in being swarmed), but less experienced players could then better focus one dangerous mob in the pull instead of being oneshot by everything.
Yes, you hit the nail on the head very much. I'll die on the hill that chapters were superior but everyone was so happy they were gone without realizing maybe what was in store for them. The rest of us knew.
ESO is now on the seasonal model. This is going to be a big change for some people. No more big content drop with something for everyone. Each season will have some content but small and focused and ESO wants to not release it on the new season but instead double drip feed. Drip feed content throughout the year and drip feed each seasons content throughout the season. People need to get used to the fact that some seasons will just be a busy for them. The battle pass rewards might not interest them, the content may not be for their playstyle. This is what the people that cheered the death of seasons were cheering for. Call it formulaic, but you understood the value of what you were getting. Now Zos is free to experiment, and they have, but we all have to get used to the fact that every season may bring different things and it may not be for us. This seasons offering is an event zone experiment that for many players means you need to get a group. Next season there will be no group content, but ALL solo questing and exploration content. The season after who knows. The ship event maybe and the dynamic Skyrim stuff leading us into the next zone next year probably. This is just what it is now. We're going to have to adapt.
Re: Official Night Market Feedback Thread
Lydawobbles wrote: »Are those numbers per faction across all platforms?
Good question cause it shows a lot of points accumulated, but I can’t find anyone in the night market unless its people just standing around lol people are barely even posting “lfg” in the zone chat.
nb_rich
1
Let's talk about Werewolf Grimoires (Update 50 and onwards)
Update 50 reworked the Werewolf skill line entirely, making the entire toolkit more cohesive and thematic to the roleplay fantasy of being a savage lycanthrope. The aim of this thread is to discuss the implications of this rework on the potential designs for a future Scribing Grimoire for the Werewolf skill line.
This first part is just basic justification for the existence of a Werewolf Grimoire. Feel free to skip over this section.
What should a Werewolf Grimoire actually do, and what should be its theme?
What sort of unique effects would make this Grimoire appealing?
The hope with a Werewolf Grimoire in general is to allow us to expand the ways we build for and play Werewolf. Maybe we want to replace Rending Claws for a different kind of skill which buffs our defense. Maybe a Werewolf Grimoire allows us to buff and heal our packmates. It would be interesting trying to figure out which of the original 5 Werewolf abilities to replace to make room for a Werewolf Scribing ability, should we choose to use it. However such a Werewolf Scribing Grimoire is implemented, it should feel as if it was always part of our toolkit.
@ZOS_Kira @ZOS_Erin @ZOS_BrianWheeler
This first part is just basic justification for the existence of a Werewolf Grimoire. Feel free to skip over this section.
Why should Werewolf get a Grimoire?
- It would give Werewolf players a 6th skill they can pick from, meaning they will have much more build diversity than before.
- It would allow Werewolf players to swap one skill for another, creating an implicit power tradeoff.
- It would source additional effects and ability types into Werewolf's toolkit, mitigating inherent problems with the playstyle's locked-down nature.
- Werewolf is the only playstyle which cannot use Scribing abilities, due to the strict skill limitation while transformed.
- Scribing is described as a way to customize and specialize both spell-craft and skill-craft. This means a Scribing skill does not need to be magical in nature; it can instead be Martial in nature.
- There are several interested parties in the world who would create a Grimoire for werewolves to use. Banner Bearer was created after Scribing was discovered and is recorded as the first new Grimoire. A Werewolf Grimoire could be created some time after Banner Bearer, perhaps by a Reachman or a witch, who would view werewolves in a different light than most.
- The physical Grimoire that we Scribe the Scripts and Luminous Ink onto is never used by our characters to know how to use these skills. A werewolf would have no problem remembering how to perform the action of a Werewolf Grimoire, especially if the skill was more martial and savage in nature.
- The physical Grimoire does not need to be sold by the Scribing merchant if it is deemed a Criminal Act to do so. Instead, the Grimoire can be sourced through another game system like Antiquities, or through another merchant who would supply Criminal Act Grimoires.
What should a Werewolf Grimoire actually do, and what should be its theme?
The Update 50 Werewolf skills have this general theme:
The question is, what theme for a 6th Werewolf skill could we possibly get that would fit in with these existing skills? Here's a few different ideas:
- (Ultimate) A transformation into or out of your werewolf form. If you use enough Werewolf skills, you can go on a rampage.
- A pounce/leap onto your target from a range. In melee range, you slam down with your claws to apply a bleed.
- A howl which heals and buffs you.
- A roar which scares/debuffs enemies and buffs allies.
- A bite attack.
- A claw swipe attack.
The question is, what theme for a 6th Werewolf skill could we possibly get that would fit in with these existing skills? Here's a few different ideas:
- If the Grimoire was more magical in nature, it would logically make sense to be power derived from Hircine. Just like how Hircine's Bounty invokes the Huntsman's blessing, a Werewolf Grimoire that is more magical in nature would similarly involve Hircine.
- My personal favorite idea I've come up with is a ground effect, to play off the name of Hircine's Hunting Grounds. The Scripts used here could do anything from making the area snare enemies, heal/buff allies, deal damage, and so on. The visuals could have flora taken from The Hunting Grounds, with the color changing depending on the focus script used.
- Maybe we could get a Grimoire that functions like Shadow Cloak, since we don't get to properly sneak. Invisibility is one way we can be stealthy hunters. Conversely, a skill which makes it easier to pursue fleeing enemies (like a Movement Speed buff and a snare purge) would be another way to stay thematic to the hunting theme.
- It may be a stretch, but the Werewolf Behemoth is capable of basic elemental magic. Why not something nature themed that functions like Imbue Weapon?
- If the Grimoire was more martial in nature, it would need to be something we'd expect a werewolf to be able to do, without overlapping with any of the themes of the other Werewolf skills.
- Werewolves can use their sense of smell, but what about their hearing? Maybe the Grimoire could be a utility skill that highlights enemies through walls, like the Detect Life effect when using the Totem of the Hunt ability as a werewolf in TES V: Skyrim. You could pair both senses together to be able to sense just about anything nearby.
- We could get a displacement ability (similar to Piercing Javelin or Scatter Shot) which knocks enemies back. This could be themed as us throwing the enemy using our jaws (like that one Slaughter animation) or simply grabbing the enemy and tossing them. Maybe we could just kick the enemy back if we wanted something more inspired by martial arts in the same vein as our "uppercut" bash animation.
- We could go back to the origins of Piercing Howl, before it lost the ability to knock the target down. A Werewolf Grimoire could have us shout at the enemy, knocking them to the ground and immobilizing them.
What sort of unique effects would make this Grimoire appealing?
Here's a few ideas for various Scripts:
Wayfarer's Mastery (improved functionality of skill line passives)
Class Flourish (unique effects based on your base Class)
Note that Banner Bearer has a different implementation of Class Flourish, so this Werewolf Grimoire can, too!
Certain Class Flourish effects would need to be modified to be useful in Werewolf form, such as Arcanist's "generate a Crux", which in this context could be changed entirely to do something with status effects instead. Sorcerer can get pets with Pack Leader or go without pets with Werewolf Berserker, so a description change there may or may not be desired. Templar Werewolf can only get the Sacred Ground needed for their Class Flourish from using their Class Mastery passives. Necromancer Werewolf can proc all relevant corpse-related effects with Insatiable Hunger, which is (literally) a corpse-consuming ability. The rest of the Class Flourish effects don't require Class abilities and should be fine to use in the Werewolf Grimoire as-is.
And here's a list of buffs and other effects which Werewolf may want to source (not exhaustive):
Wayfarer's Mastery (improved functionality of skill line passives)
- Insatiable Hunger also generates Stamina and Magicka per tick while this ability is slotted.
- Blood Rage generates x Ultimate once every y seconds when dealing damage while this ability is slotted.
- (Feral Cruelty) Gain Minor Resolve and gain an additional x% Weapon and Spell Damage while this ability is slotted.
- (Call of the Hunt) Completely negate the cost of remaining transformed while this ability is slotted.
- This ability is x% more effective per stack of Blood Hunger. Consumes all stacks of Blood Hunger.
- This ability generates x stacks of Blood Hunger.
- This ability generates double Fury.
Class Flourish (unique effects based on your base Class)
Note that Banner Bearer has a different implementation of Class Flourish, so this Werewolf Grimoire can, too!
Certain Class Flourish effects would need to be modified to be useful in Werewolf form, such as Arcanist's "generate a Crux", which in this context could be changed entirely to do something with status effects instead. Sorcerer can get pets with Pack Leader or go without pets with Werewolf Berserker, so a description change there may or may not be desired. Templar Werewolf can only get the Sacred Ground needed for their Class Flourish from using their Class Mastery passives. Necromancer Werewolf can proc all relevant corpse-related effects with Insatiable Hunger, which is (literally) a corpse-consuming ability. The rest of the Class Flourish effects don't require Class abilities and should be fine to use in the Werewolf Grimoire as-is.
And here's a list of buffs and other effects which Werewolf may want to source (not exhaustive):
- Some form of crossheal (Healing focus script, preferably on an AoE skill)
- A snare (Hunter's Snare signature script)
- Minor Resolve (Resolve affix script)
- Increased movement speed (Expedition affix script, Thief's Swiftness signature script)
- A snare purge (Crusader's Defiance signature script)
- Disease Damage put back in the kit (Disease Damage focus script)
- Ultimate generation (Generate Ultimate focus script, Heroism affix script)
- A heal over time (Sage's Remedy signature script)
The hope with a Werewolf Grimoire in general is to allow us to expand the ways we build for and play Werewolf. Maybe we want to replace Rending Claws for a different kind of skill which buffs our defense. Maybe a Werewolf Grimoire allows us to buff and heal our packmates. It would be interesting trying to figure out which of the original 5 Werewolf abilities to replace to make room for a Werewolf Scribing ability, should we choose to use it. However such a Werewolf Scribing Grimoire is implemented, it should feel as if it was always part of our toolkit.
@ZOS_Kira @ZOS_Erin @ZOS_BrianWheeler
Re: Night Market Opinion Poll
Spent about 7 hours across the last couple days in there and am currently at 1400 favour. This is while being grouped in a 12-man at around 80% of the time I spent in there. I'm trying my hardest to get the 10k favour for the achievements and titles and merchants before the novelty wears off and the night market becomes considerably less active.
I'm hoping the FOMO of the night market stuff keeps people engaged with it because I can't imagine how impossible it'll be to do the skirmishes if it becomes hard to get a full group going.
I'm hoping the FOMO of the night market stuff keeps people engaged with it because I can't imagine how impossible it'll be to do the skirmishes if it becomes hard to get a full group going.
Re: Official Night Market Feedback Thread
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom just wanted to bring your attention to an image claiming to be from ZOS making the rounds. Obviously you can see its fake but paints ZOS in a bad way
HuciturGuru
27
Re: Now that we can hide all armor...
DarkStrifeYT wrote: »Gloambound skins hide it
Gloambound styles are indeed hidden when stowed! And it is awesome that they return in May.
But if you want to use other weapon styles and still have them be hidden when stowed, that is impossible.
How to Solo Night Market Dailies
Hi, just a helpful post for solo players to let them know you can solo the daily quests in the Night Market pretty easily. There is one faction daily quest, one Blood on the Sands quest, and I think there are five daily fetch quests in each zone.
Here’s how I have been soloing these quests. First, I made a stealth build using the Nightblades Shadowy Disguise to avoid the mobs and finish the zone quests. That’s 200 favor per zone per day. I use Darloc Brae and Mother’s Embrace, so it’s easy to get. Second, there are green bestial potions in the Sorrow’s Friend district that briefly turn you into a werewolf. These are located near the south rooftop east of the werewolf boss. I soloed 75 mobs in a few minutes. It’s fun to mow through these mobs as a giant werewolf.
If you can sneak and use these werewolf potions you can do these dailies. Caveat, I did have to create a 4-person group to do one of the puzzle faction quests. But that was the only grouping required.
Here’s how I have been soloing these quests. First, I made a stealth build using the Nightblades Shadowy Disguise to avoid the mobs and finish the zone quests. That’s 200 favor per zone per day. I use Darloc Brae and Mother’s Embrace, so it’s easy to get. Second, there are green bestial potions in the Sorrow’s Friend district that briefly turn you into a werewolf. These are located near the south rooftop east of the werewolf boss. I soloed 75 mobs in a few minutes. It’s fun to mow through these mobs as a giant werewolf.
If you can sneak and use these werewolf potions you can do these dailies. Caveat, I did have to create a 4-person group to do one of the puzzle faction quests. But that was the only grouping required.
