spartaxoxo wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

Desiato wrote: »

Haven't you ever noticed a lot of players don't use companions? Why do you think that is?

That's a very different experience than what I've had. I see players using Companions everywhere! Of course, there's usually no room for them in Dungeons/Trials/Arenas and they can't be brought into Cyrodiil/Imperial City/Battlegrounds anyway. They're also forced to be hidden while in towns.

I see them everywhere too. But, I'm sure there's plenty that hate them. There's plenty of people that dislike every activity in the game. I think that it's inevitable. I don't see it as a compelling reason to stop all content from being rewarding though, personally. We wouldn't have any rewards at all if the basis for adding a reward was someone, somewhere might want it but not want to play that activity.

The solution to that is just let all content have a variety of rewards imo. This way it's no big deal if someone missed one.

o_Primate_o wrote: »

There's enough companions already. all the classes are covered except Warden i think.

DeadlySerious wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

As of writing, all but two Grimoires can be obtained by purchasing them with Gold from Chronicler Firandil in the Scholarium. One of them you obtain from completing the Scribing tutorial quest, and the other you obtain from completing the last quest in the Scribing questline, or by purchasing it from Chronicler Firandil on alternate characters once that quest has been completed. I'd really love to see future Grimoires acquired from other sources.

Another thing of note is that each Grimoire is written by some character in-world. The latest Grimoire, Banner Bearer, was written by Battlemage V'erissh.

Now that Scribing is revealed to the world, we can expect any character to try their hand at writing a new Grimoire.

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So why should a Companion character be involved with Scribing, and why should a new Grimoire be granted to the player via them?

Primarily, I think that having this overlap between the Companions and Scribing systems would be a good thing for this game. Players would need to try the Companions system in order to acquire a new ability for use in PvE and PvP. I think it would inspire players to try the Companions system for the first time, the way Zerith-var (one of our latest Companions) introduced many people to Tales of Tribute via his favor achievement.

Secondly, there are many interesting ideas that can be explored if a Companion is somehow involved with Scribing. For instance, maybe this Companion uses a version of some existing Scribing abilities in combat; maybe they even use a version of this brand new ability that they give to players. While it may be infeasible to actually adapt the Scribing system for the Companions system, it would at least be possible to make a few Grimoire configurations into standalone spells that this Companion can cast. Plus, maybe this Companion's Keepsake would give players an increased chance to find Luminous Ink? Regardless, this Companion would be credited as the author of a Grimoire, making them a noteworthy character in the canon of Scribing, and it would be cool to adventure with such an important character who has made an impact on the world outside of their questline.

Finally, there ought to be more ways to acquire Grimoires than just buying them from Chronicler Firandil in the Scholarium. Would the Mages Guild sell Grimoires for "Criminal Act" skills, for skill lines like Werewolf, Vampire, Dark Brotherhood, Thieves Guild, or Legerdemain? I don't think they would, but it makes sense that a Companion who is affiliated with those skill lines might teach that sort of magic to the player. Even Zerith-var's offer to show the player a different approach to necromancy could've been interpreted as a segue into such a feature:

That's not to mention how interesting it would be for Companions of the same Class as the player to teach them new Class Grimoires. There'd be a reason to be a Necromancer traveling with Zerith-var, a Templar traveling with Isobel Veloise, and so on.

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So, in summary, Scribing Grimoires are currently trivial to acquire. I would like to see more interesting ways to acquire them, and I think some level of integration with the Companions system would be an interesting direction to take for both systems. Even if it's just one Companion who is the author of a brand new Grimoire, that Companion would be noteworthy for players who don't usually use Companions at all. What do you think of this approach to introducing a new Grimoire?

How would you feel about grimoirs locked behind, say, achieving the GO achievement? What's the difference between having to achieve max level at PvP and what you're proposing? Or how about having grimoirs available only from crown crates? I mean, what you are proposing is putting these behind a pay wall. At least with the PvP example you can earn it in game instead of buying it, like you are proposing.

Parasaurolophus wrote: »

Companions are pretty useless. The scribing system is 99% useless. Useless + useless?

Taril wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

What's the problem here? Rapport is easily obtained by the Companion's favorite daily quests, some of which are as simple (subjectively) as completing daily Enchanting or Alchemy writs. Multiple Companions gain rapport from Fighters Guild daily quests.

It's a tedious and time consuming grind (In the sense that these daily quests are DAILY locked)

Even more so depending on exactly WHAT the companion's daily quests are. Some like Zerith's ToT daily or Isobel/Sharp's WB daily can be prohibitive to players.

Erickson9610 wrote: »

You don't need maximum rapport to unlock the Companion's final quest

Currently no. But what about your suggestion for things like a Grimoire from Zerith and Isobel? Would you stick the Grimoire in their last quest reward?

Or would they have new quests that DO require 4000 or even 5000 rapport? (If we're giving additional quests, it's possible that they might continue the theme of providing a quest per 1000 rapport)

Erickson9610 wrote: »

Once one of your characters has completed the Companion's main quest and you're given the associated achievement, then I think it's fair that their Grimoire could be purchased from the Chronicler. If the Companion develops it while traveling with your first character, then it could be considered officially published by the time your other characters visit the Scholarium.

Even then, it's still predicated on having to grind up the companion's rapport. Even if it's just once. That's still annoying enough to many people and completely arbitrary in terrms of its existence and still adds nothing at all to either system.

All it does is make a companion and its rapport grind a necessity (Which people are even more concerned about given the nature of how content is changing and the recent Tanlorin and Zerith additions to the crown store separate from the current chapter - Which would essentially mean gating a grimoire behind a paywall. When currently all grimoires are available in the base game meaning the entirety of Scribing is contained within Gold Road alone.)

It doesn't add anything to companions themselves. (Even any lore is quickly broken if a character can be using a Grimoire that Zerith supposedly wrote while still a corpse because that character hadn't yet done the quest where he wakes up). It doesn't add anything to scribing.

All it does is needlessly annoy people who don't like companions as well as those who don't own certain DLC's to access specific companions (Which people are already fed up with in regards to antiquities with leads being shoved in everywhere)

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Yes. But it dramatically less rapport than maximum rapport, which is the specific achievement I said it shouldn't be tied to.

Erickson9610 wrote: »

However, what I've mainly been asking for is a new Companion writing a new Grimoire. It could be as simple as a new character appearing in the Scholarium, requiring the Gold Road Chapter, who joins the player as a Companion and awards them a Grimoire as well as an associated Houseguest version of themselves.

Erickson9610 wrote: »

By contrast, a Companion's quests being locked behind rapport (which itself takes a long time to grind by design) gives the player a chance to connect with that character through real time spent adventuring with them.

Erickson9610 wrote: »

If ZOS were to write a quest character who supposedly creates a new Grimoire, taking inspiration from the player who aids them, they could either:

1. Make the character a regular quest giver, located in the Scholarium, and have them only interact with the player during their quests.
2. Make the character a Companion, located in the Scholarium, and have them interact with the player at all times when summoned, especially during their quests.

Of these two options, #1 would be done the fastest. It'd probably take an evening to complete. At that point, just make the Grimoire available for purchase without the silly quest requirement! It's hard to believe that this character who has seen us for only a few hours is suddenly inspired by us.

On the other hand, #2 means the player has to invest time into this character. It makes sense why this character is inspired by the player when creating their Grimoire — they've seen the player fight, and are inspired from their adventure together. There's a reason to have a quest to unlock such a Grimoire in the first place.

Erickson9610 wrote: »

Yeah, Votary Nahlia can't be made into a Companion because she wasn't introduced as one, and you can't have two copies of the same character in the same scene. Likewise, existing Companions can't show up in the world in future DLC and have additional stories written about them because — once again — that would mean you could have two copies of the same character in the same scene.

Parasaurolophus wrote: »

Companions are pretty useless. The scribing system is 99% useless. Useless + useless?