RaZaddha wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Gaudrath wrote: »

1) Well, you're not standard anymore. You're obsolete. And nobody cares. You're out, the new crowd is in. Way of the world. By the way, I was gaming when MMOs were called MUDs, how about you?

2) Friend, I do have a life, a job and a family, really doubtful I'd draw my inspiration from PvP "pros". Also, as it happens, I do coding for a living, so it is kinda hard for me to be jealous of someone who learned how to press <10 keys on their keyboard. I press them all the time too, but in much more complex combinations, you know.
And don't know about others, but I stopped hating on random internet strangers a long time ago. That's stressful, don't need it.

2.5) If developers only had immature "hardcore" PvPers to sell their games to, the industry would be quickly relocated back to their parents' garages.

3) Oh come on now, you'll get this thread locked, and it's so much fun.

1) and u call me ignorant. game, set and match right here. kkthxbye u wont be missed.

2) so much denial hahah. if what u say was even the slightest bit true this thread wouldnt even exist. btw im a coder too (well atleast uni said i am, not working with that boring crap anymore tho(sys administration > code monkeys)) so im good at gaming and coding. damn i must be amazing. im however not sure how this is relevant.
also ur hating right now, son.

2.5) would still be better off than what it is right now lol. atleast it would still be worth playing the few games there are.

3) dont care, pointless discussion anyways. you kids will never get to the point where your´re good enough to understand.

So, whats your motives for even posting on this forum? All I have seen you do is rant on every post, you have no respect for anyone and you don't care about anything but your own restricted playstyle. Do you have a personal crusade or something to try to put down every single player you "deem casual"? Is your only motive for posting to complain about how this game isn't hardcore enough and how casuals ruin everything? Is this your personality in real life or are you just being a *** in here because you are anonymous? Trash talking everyone you meet that doesn't follow your personal standards? Making assumptions based on no real evidence? You know what they say when you make assumptions?

No, I'm not a zergling, I left GW2 due to how mind numbing boring the combat became not even roaming/scouting satisfied me anymore due to abuse of FOTM builds, I'm also one of the vocal voices against AoE caps on this forum because of how it decreases skill ceiling, how turtle wars is completely unfun. Maybe you should think before you assume something and offend someone, it just makes you look dumb.

Btw, this thread only started because GrandAlliance wears a tinfoil hat.

i thought i made my motives clear already. fine ill try one last time.

CAREFUL very very long post inc.

my motive is to put this game on the right track before its too late. the problem with the game´s pvp is that its fundamentally flawed by design. it will never work and no amount of balance patches can change that. it is flawed cos developers dont listen to ppl that know what they talking about anymore. they listen to what the casual crowd wants because they aim at those as their primary target group.

this is the first major mistake and the root to all other mistakes beeing made throughout the development process. ive said in beta already that the system we have now is bound to fail and only a complete remake of the entire pvp can fix this.

yes believe it or not, it is literally that bad. what baffles me about it is that this exact same thing has happened countless times in the past already. warhammer, swtor, gw2 and now eso just to name a few examples. they all failed for the exact same reason (tho gw2 and eso take the failing to a new level of awful.)

it is very vital that u get the next thing into ur head. u cannot under no circumstances ever design an mmo in a way so it pleases the masses because what u get then is a dumbed down boring simple crap version of combat that is no fun at all to anyone remotely good and only fun for a very short time to everyone else.

now the casuals dont have the experience to realize this (until they are bored and quit themself) thats why u get fanboys defending the game in its current state. they simply arent bored yet cos they can kill something for once cos the game is easy and not challenging but they will get bored very soon for that very same reason.

they had good intentions for the game when they designed it but their solution to important matters is extremely poor. lets go through an example.

it was advertized that it would be possible to win outnumbered in this game and it is true. the problem is the way u win outnumbered in this game is entirely wrong. this is not a personal opinion this is a fact and ill explain why.

how eso does it.

eso is heavily centered around stacking aoes in order to kill big zergs. having no real CC immunity makes it possible to just have a couple of DK´s spam talons while sorcs can just stack aoes on them. add a supernova here and there to make it even easier. yes u can roll out of talons true but since there is no immunity for it u will just get instantly talon´d again. rince repeat until ur out of stamina or dead. this system works beautyfully to kill massive zergs with very little numbers. the problem is, it takes absolutely zero skill whatsoever. there is no challenge in doing that and therefor it gets boring really fast.

how it should be done.

what u want instead is an actual REAL CC system with long duration mezzes/roots and long, and this is very important, SEPERATE immunities for both CC types. this makes good players able to juggle CC´s and also stops ppl from blindly aoeing into huge clumps of ppl cos it would break the CC. it also adds another huge skillfactor cos ur CCer actually needs to land those aoe mezzes before the opponent does. also aoe mezz and aoe root should be on different chars. both have to be ranged spells aswell. also there needs to be some kind of single target cure mezz on ONE class.
in addition to that u want a REAL interupt system. that means EVERY spell/skill/light attack/whatever will cause an interupt on EVERY spell ur trying to cast. there cant be any uninteruptable spells AT ALL. there also has to be a timer of 3-5 secs before u can cast again. best solution would be to make it 3 secs but make it reset if u try casting too early which would make it 5 secs. that way ppl would have to dedicate some attention to actually interupt casts. it would again add a huge skill element cos then ur positioning would actually really matter.
ppl who suck at positioning will just die without getting a single spell off and thats how it should be.

onto the next major flaw in the design.

a total of 12 spells available in combat at a time? 12?! like srsly? and that is only in theory. sometimes ull want the same spell available to you in both weapon sets and lets not even take laggy weapon switch or toggle abilities like leeching strikes into account. there is literally no way to ever make a that heavily limited combat system fun, let alone challenging or god forbid, competitive. that whole concept needs to be thrown into the trashbin and some real quickbars need to be introduced. there is no salvation for the current system.

thats just the most important flaws in the combat system. lets look at cyrodiil itself now.

the whole pvp is objective based. that is absolutely terrible design and bound to bore ppl no matter if hardcore players or casuals very fast. infact its already happening. how they could not forsee this is beyond the world of reason.

now lets remove all objectives and have skirmishes all day u ask? yes could work but no u can have objectives. they cannot be the center of the action tho. look at DAoC if u wanna see a good example on how to introduce objectives into pvp. they should fill a specific role that in no way is relevant to every day business in pvp. the focus MUST be on roaming pvp if u wanna keep ppl entertained for a long time.

next issue - 24 ppl groups

like srsly whoever came up with the idea to have a group cap of 24 - lay down that crack pipe bro. make it 5 or maybe 8 but not more than that. u dont wanna encourage zerging in ANY WAY. reason for that? well, simple, the more ppl u have in ur group the less ur own performance effects the outcome of a fight. this leads to ppl getting bored fast. really not much to add to that. everyone who has played a pvp game for more than an hour should know this.

next flaw - stealth for everyone

thats actually a pretty big one. it encourages camping over roaming. only NB should be able to stealth. really that simple.

another (smaller) issue - mounts

simple, get rid of them. instead introduce a class with an out of combat running speed buff that works for your GROUP. note: GROUP not every frikkin ally in the area.


maybe u can see a pattern. every single of those flawed mechanics are flawed because the developers tried to please the masses. every class is build in a jack of all trades way. proof: every class is viable solo. while this might not be directly related to group play it is a really really bad thing. it means that every class can sort of fill every role which reduces the amount of teamwork needed dramatically. classes need to be more specific to fill one roll in a group. maybe 2 roles heal+CCer in one class works well together f.e. that class however shouldnt be able to do any significant dmg.


i wanna mention one more flaw in the game design (there is many many more but im tired of typing )

synergys

eso has them but they are implemented in a really stupid way. run into an aoe and press x? like cmon, can it be anymore braindead then that? what u wanna do instead for example is debuff nukes. 1 guy has lets say a fire debuff - he calls out a target and debuffs it then the next guy starts nuking it with fire dmg. the difference between a debuffed nuke and an undebuffed nuke has to be significant. like atleast twice the dmg or more. undebuffed nukes shouldnt drop anything in any reasonable time which makes coordinated debuffing a nessecarity.

those are just the flawed core mechanics that will mean doom for this game in the near future. if those were fixed it would guarantee the game to live for a very long time tho cos the potential is all there. the engine is pretty solid. melee feels like ur actually hitting something (this is actually a huge issue in alot of mmos like WoW, warhammer,tera, just to name a few that screwed it up royally), no GCD and therefor spammable nukes. all that makes for a solid base. everything else would just be minor adjustments but with the current flaws ive mentioned above the game wont survive its first year.

Gaudrath wrote: »

Haha, that's your argument? "Ur stoopid"? Come on, I expect more creativity from my trolls, you have to try harder!

ive explained what is wrong with the game. u didnt understand/didnt want to understand/lack the intellect to understand. u can pick one. i have no intentions talking to a brick wall and therefor im done talking to you.