Subclassing worse than U35?

valenwood_vegan

I dunno about worse, as u35 was kind of universally detested (or as close as one can get to that in this game), while subclassing seems to have elicited more of a variety of responses.

But as others have said, the likely incoming barrages of nerfs and reworks to much liked, iconic class skills and common builds, could end up being just as bad.

[EDIT: This is more from a pve perspective; I can't say anything too insightful about how this may affect pvp and will leave that to people with more expertise, but I suspect that's going to be quite a mess and could well be worse than u35.]

alpha_synuclein

Twohothardware wrote: »

alpha_synuclein wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

The old Craglorn trials are nothing at all like the newer trials that I was referencing when I said 99% of the general player base have never cleared them. You're not going into VSS and clearing it without experienced players with high rotations no matter how good you were at leading trials groups. That's why guilds are able to charge charge millions of gold for carries and skin unlocks. It's the same thing with a number of the newer Vet DLC dungeons.

Sure, if you take a bunch of new players that never touched group content, you will struggle in a trial like vSS. But if you put together a team of people that are build for their roles (and not necessarily in a strict meta way), willing to cooperate and give it more than one go, you will clear.

Trials might not be the most popular activity in ESO, but saying that 99% of playerbase cannot clear vet is a disservice to the playerbase.

Have you ever joined a PUG for a newer vet trial? I've joined a few and they never got past the first boss after numerous wipes and people just finally starting leaving.

The only way you're going into vSS with ESO players that haven't cleared it before and actually getting through it is you put together a team of mostly players that routinely clear hard vet trials, know the mechanics, and have enough DPS to carry the rest of the group. Basically a paid carry.

Now maybe things are easier on PC where ya'll got a mod that telegraphs the mechanics to you and tells you when to block and everything but not on console.

Admittedly, I haven't pug in a while, but I led vss open runs in a chill social guild and we were getting multiple clears. If you're judging playerbase based solely on pugs you will get a very skewed view.

Also, when it comes to some of the newer fights like dsr twins or bahsei, no amount of extra damage won't help you if you're failing mechanics.

ceruulean

Subclassing itself is fine, and actually cool and exciting, but the powercreep and lack of limitations makes it ridiculous rather than flavorful. And they keep nerfing classes in the wrong areas. Why nerf DK magma shell (best for high-arc IA which almost nobody reaches, and IA has gotten harder since last update) and their sustain? Why nerf non-pet sorcs, who already have inferior cleave and single target? Why buff templars in 4 man content (they are already known for being excellent 4 man class) but nerf them in 12 man trials?

SaintJohnHM

I was hopeful when I heard about "subclassing", it sounds like it could be super fun, but now after seeing it on the pts and the feedback from friends, it feels awful to see the old classes skill lines gutted so hard only to fail at balancing even more wildly than before. Maybe they'll listen to the feedback, but based on past missteps, I doubt it. I don't take it personally, it's a business decision, we are inconsequential.

ApoAlaia

I honestly think the worst decision so far is bringing back target limits.

Felt awful before, it was bliss when it went away.

Guess they could try to implement cast time on shields again before it goes live and that would mean that this wouldn't be the worst decision?

Wereswan

My answer would be "at least as bad as patch 35, but not as immediately," because we've essentially got three camps:

• The pessimists. People who like their characters as is, fear the inevitable play balance issues it'll introduce, etc.
• Those who are hyped about the subclass system ("freedom," a character concept that doesn't quite fit the seven existing classes, the silly damage numbers currently being pulled on PTS, etc.)
• The apathetic, who don't care and may not even know anything's changing.

Some folks in the skeptical camp are going to drop the game immediately if this goes live in its current state. Some (like me) will choose to stick around and ride the first few months out, perhaps only signing in to do writs and logout, until the dust settles and we can see what the final form will be. Of that group, some may grudgingly adapt to whatever new meta shakes out when all the nerfs finally stop raining down from the heavens. Others will reluctantly conclude the situation isn't going to get any better, and quit.

In short, you'll see a bunch of established players quitting in the last weeks before launch day, as it becomes obvious that ZOS won't backtrack, followed by a slow exodus as they get discouraged enough to stop logging in.

Maybe nobody will even notice, thanks to the second group. There's no questioning that some folks are really excited by this announcement. Perhaps even enough that the number of returning players will be greater than the number headed for the door. With that in mind, it's entirely possible that server population might be up if this goes live in its current state.

Or, it might not; that's the wager ZOS would be making. But say it does; say folks have a thrilling couple of months burning through everything in the game on their 170K DPS frankenstein builds. How long does that stay fun fun? Look through the testing threads, and you'll see people saying the trill wore off in a matter of days. So how long does the sugar high last?

So, the population starts dropping again as "ooo, shiny" wears off, and ZOS realizes they have to do something. That "something" is most likely going to be a belated attempt to rein in the massive leap in power they've enabled. How they attempt to do that is anyone's guess—as folks have been pointing out in the many, many discussions on this subject, nerfing individual skills won't help because the real leap in power is coming from mix-and-match class passives. Perhaps they might try rebalancing all the content in the game instead, to make it all ~35% tankier to account for the power leap. Regardless of what they do, it's guaranteed to hit the remaining population of non-meta players the hardest.

Which brings me to that third group on the list; the ones that don't really pay attention to announcements, don't follow PTS, and may be blissfully unaware that anything is even slated to change. Their first indication that patch 46 is bringing some major upheaval to Tamriel will be the sight of players with weird mismatched combinations of spell effects deleting everything in sight. For those who've never experienced something like Fallout 76 where players with legacy weapons were doing this, it's not fun if you're not one of those players. The initial shock of the min-maxers showing up to erase everything in sight will be followed by the inevitable nerfs ZOS will drop in an attempt to mitigate the damage—which again, will hit these players much harder because they're not min-maxers.

The immediate effect of patch 46 might actually be positive. The long-term effects will not be. And it's all tediously predictable.

Zyaneth_Bal

Pr0Skygon wrote: »

Honestly, I kinda understand the knee-jerk reaction statement from Rich, especially now. U35 was no where as bad as we thought, because hey, that's why we have pts to test things out. The first week of U35 was laughably bad, but when it actually comes out, it was fine, not bad at all.

Same thing is going on now. A bunch of knee-jerk reaction, no diversity this, class identity that. But from people who are actually testing it out, the reaction is leaning toward positive much more. Is it balanced? *** no. But is it fun? Hell yes. And for an 11 years old mmorpg with no esport attached, fun should trump balance. That being said, balance should not be thrown out entirely. There are some outlier builds that are insanely strong and should be looked into.

My solution is simple: Nerf main stats when you use subclass. Don't nerf the skill line itself, because it will effect the purest. Just make it like a mythic or vampire curse. You gain some, you lose some. If you wanna get 3 dps skill lines, you should get reduced resources. Make it so when you have 1 subclass active, you lose all your attribute points. If you get 2 subclasses, you get reduced resources even compare to base stats.

It’s actually quite the opposite to what you want to believe. The negative reaction comes mainly from players who care about the game and spent ample time actually testing subclassing, while positive comments come either from role players who treat eso as a single player game and couldn’t care less about balance and combat or from players who instead only care about action but not about the game itself, who want to have their fun using broken builds for a month at most then leave for another game again.

That negative feedback is the exact and sole reason u35 wasn’t a complete disaster by the way.

gc0018

Dalsinthus wrote: »

My raid and dungeon groups are heavily split on this. The people that are just playing to raid and aren't interested in story, lore, characters, etc. are all in for getting new trifectas and perfectas with multi class characters. To them, more power is a good thing even if it takes playing Frankenstein's monster to get there. They are excited for what's coming.

Though ZOS may think give more power to player will make them happy and keep playing. But it is clearly not true or the most popular mod for ES5 should become all sort of one-shot mod, and everyone should be enjoying using one-shot cheat in playing all the game. Obviously, it is not happening.

Players need certain challenge, need some hard. That's why soul-like games are so popular.

SaintJohnHM wrote: »

Maybe they'll listen to the feedback, but based on past missteps, I doubt it. I don't take it personally, it's a business decision, we are inconsequential.

The worst thing may be: it is not a business decision...and will crash the game. Such thing is not uncommon, some the Devs don't listen to the feedback and do what they think is cooool then kill the game which happen to many great games before. For business decision, company at least will listen to the customers.

gorynych_88

Marronsuisse wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

A power squish like U35 is always going to be received more poorly than a power bump.

Was going to say exactly this. I don't think it will be like U35 unless they start nerfing literally everything and everyone in an attempt to balance things.

In general most players enjoy more options and becoming more powerful.

You and dude you quoted both are trying to say that they don't nerf class abilities now or pure classes power or what?
For me as x2 DK (in all variations thou PvE tank and PvP hybrid mostly) mainer whose 2 "main" alts are PvE tank/ PvE frost / PvE/PvP healer Warden and PvP Stamplar there are already enough nerfes and mech-breakers applied to all my beloved classes and builds for the only 1st week of PTS to stop playing if it will go to live caus I don't want to use that multiclass things at all (and to add: I didn't like that tryouts of Vengeance champ too but at least there could be many hopes still for good changes). And it's only a start of their "balance fixes" so the further the more...
And I even try to not speak of Sorcs, thou their nerfes to shield and even all the devs attutiude to non-pet Sorcs are things that made many Sorc players pissed off. At least I don't play Sorcs that much (thou it's sad to know I should stop to play time to time my Sorc alts too then) but my friends do. And I try to not speak that Nightblades and Arcanists (classes I don't like to play at all thou have them leveled and maxed) +skill trees to literally any class now making those classes even in PvE meaning OP anyways.
Don't want tbh to discuss PvP at all, caus it will took a few billions words of my negative thoughts and it will be hard to keep those words in censored form...

For me personally those changes are not only worse then U35 (missed it, caus already took a break from game for different reasons but read and heard alot about it, and after returning anyways got used to new mechanics) but even worse then Murkmire ones which damaged tank's gameplay for all classes hard (and I had all classes tanks out of Nightblade that time and played mostly that builds only), not only tank's with that AoE target limits added, but for tanks there were huge individual nerfes and overall shield nerf. But even that time I didn't stopped to play, and now I exactly will if they won't stop and reroll changes they already made for pure classes skills and won't stop to make that all damned even more, caus these changes are really too much gamekiller and real injustice to all the people that love TESO classes and gamemechs (even if mechs are not so balanced or ideal now).

I can't understand where some people still see "only power bumps" and don't try even to listen to others, caus I personally see only nerf to pure classes I main (and many of my game colleagues main) and I don't want to loose the power I already have for nothing and to be violated to play only frankenstein multiclasses in any case for any content harder then overworld. Same for most of my friends and guildies. As someone said in PTS Feedback topic, "there are 40-45 min-maxer trialists at NA PC that are happy with changes on PTS" but even if only my friends and guildies that exactly want to quit game in the case this all will go to live in nowadays form will quite, they will loose more players only from my cirlce at EU PC that are mostly mid-to-end and particularry endgame players. And here are alot of ppl, as you can see even by these forums, who disappointed and wait of them to at least once listen to players feedback for real. So if nothing will change it will hit game population really hard. Only 1% of PvE minmaxers, 1% of PvP exploiters and bunch of RPers and single-content players will stay it seems from my point of view.

gorynych_88

Zyaneth_Bal wrote: »

It’s actually quite the opposite to what you want to believe. The negative reaction comes mainly from players who care about the game and spent ample time actually testing subclassing, while positive comments come either from role players who treat eso as a single player game and couldn’t care less about balance and combat or from players who instead only care about action but not about the game itself, they want to have their fun using broken builds for a month at most than leave for another game again.

That negative feedback is the exact and sole reason u35 wasn’t a complete disaster by the way.

Killer-shot precise words! Only "I don't care how it broken gimme FUN and more NUMBERS" kids-minmaxers and RPers/sologamers that don't care about combat mechanics in game at all take these changes positively. But they are loud with their hapiness and devs seems to listen only to "positive" feedback this time. So it could be the real last nail for the game as we knew it. Maybe it won't die completely but it became a kinky-style sandbox like some broken fun-server and nothing more.
At least I don't have any positive feedback on this from other player's categories in my ingame environment I mean of persons who cares about balance and lore in this game and its overall future.

Reginald_leBlem

Pr0Skygon wrote: »

Honestly, I kinda understand the knee-jerk reaction statement from Rich, especially now. U35 was no where as bad as we thought, because hey, that's why we have pts to test things out. The first week of U35 was laughably bad, but when it actually comes out, it was fine, not bad at all.

Same thing is going on now. A bunch of knee-jerk reaction, no diversity this, class identity that. But from people who are actually testing it out, the reaction is leaning toward positive much more. Is it balanced? *** no. But is it fun? Hell yes. And for an 11 years old mmorpg with no esport attached, fun should trump balance. That being said, balance should not be thrown out entirely. There are some outlier builds that are insanely strong and should be looked into.

My solution is simple: Nerf main stats when you use subclass. Don't nerf the skill line itself, because it will effect the purest. Just make it like a mythic or vampire curse. You gain some, you lose some. If you wanna get 3 dps skill lines, you should get reduced resources. Make it so when you have 1 subclass active, you lose all your attribute points. If you get 2 subclasses, you get reduced resources even compare to base stats.

Update 35 was every bit as bad as we thought it was going to be. Between that, and AWA, my active raid teams vanished. Less than a month after U35, 20+ people across 3 of my raid teams stopped playing. 5 of them are still on my friend list and haven't logged back in since.

The player base has started to rebuild, and it's not by accident. Many, many people put huge amounts of time and effort into training new players. Hosting runs, writing guides, making addons and maps and new discords to bring raiding numbers up. A lot of those people now have serious concerns about how this will affect the trials population, and dismissing their concerns, or trivializing them isn't fair. People love to hate on end game players, and I think the amount of work those players do to maintain a thriving community is overlooked sometimes. If you've ever read a guide, watched a mechanics video, looked up a specific build or used a graphic, you've benifited from the endgame community.

incite

To OP: Yes, highly probable.

gorynych_88

Reginald_leBlem wrote: »

Update 35 was every bit as bad as we thought it was going to be. Between that, and AWA, my active raid teams vanished. Less than a month after U35, 20+ people across 3 of my raid teams stopped playing. 5 of them are still on my friend list and haven't logged back in since.

~the same thing I see after returning to game. Indeed and this time it will be even worse for playerbase I bet.

CalamityCat

I don't think subclassing is as bad as update 35, though the whole update together has certainly killed my enthusiasm for ESO. I let my plus sub lapse and haven't got plans to spend more on the game until all these changes come in, get patched and I see what the game is like for me. Bleh... It doesn't help with the switch to seasons and this being a transition year, I'm wary in part because I don't know what we're transitioning to next year.

I think it would have made more sense that some changes only applied to skill lines when they were subclassed in. It makes no sense to nerf all our existing pure characters just because some will push the numbers on subclass builds that use those classes.

The_Meathead

It's really the combination of the two that scares me.

U35 really was that bad. That one update and what's followed broke the years of trust and faith I had that ZOS might take a while, but they'd eventually get things right in terms of balance or at least keep the pendulum moving enough to facilitate the same.

U35 was also where I lost any sort of belief that they are listening to us. The outcry on the PTS, when the Update hit, and still continuing to this day for a number of changes (see: animations) made have been completely ignored to a point it feels like animosity.

So, you look at U35 and realize those same folks are going to be in charge of something as LUDICROUSLY massive as Subclassing and do it in a very short period, and it's just hard to believe it's going to be complete, balanced, or anything but game-breaking. It's not that I'm against Subclassing (I'm ambivalent), I just really fear how it's going to be handled.

Cooperharley

Suna_Ye_Sunnabe wrote: »

Is this player base allergic to having fun?

The ESO forums is completely level-headed, positive and supportive, what do you mean?

SaintJohnHM

Cooperharley wrote: »

Suna_Ye_Sunnabe wrote: »

Is this player base allergic to having fun?

The ESO forums is completely level-headed, positive and supportive, what do you mean?

I was naive and hopeful for "subclassing", but the more I test and think about it, the worse it feels. Maybe I was just too optimistic.

Entaro

Not sure how to feel about it after testing a bit. I have already been trial-logging for at least a year with little desire to play outside of Core days. Arena and 4 man content has gotten so extremely devalued with power creep that I no longer engage in it, and the subclassing stuff as currently implemented will have the same effect on the current hardest content.

It's an entire new progression system. It's not simply if you had a max level templar you have access to those skill lines - you need to level up the new subclass skill lines independently again. It's a completely new layer of grind, added to the existing ones like getting your class(es) to 50, getting high enough CP to fill out slottables, grinding out any/all relevant gear sets, and grinding out relevant scribing on each character you plan to play. This stuff is extremely anti-casual and compounds when you combine them all together.

Indeed, your observation that the ESO PvE endgame community is a constantly shrinking pool of players is my experience as well.

On the other hand, ESO has clearly been sunsetting for awhile now, maybe going out in over the top fashion with this wild system is the way to go...

SpiritKitten

Entaro wrote: »

It's an entire new progression system. It's not simply if you had a max level templar you have access to those skill lines - you need to level up the new subclass skill lines independently again.

Is this the way it is right now on the PTS? Did you test that? Because the notes and the live stream said that if you had that maxed out already on another level 50 character than you get immediate access to it.

Entaro

SpiritKitten wrote: »

Entaro wrote: »

It's an entire new progression system. It's not simply if you had a max level templar you have access to those skill lines - you need to level up the new subclass skill lines independently again.

Is this the way it is right now on the PTS? Did you test that? Because the notes and the live stream said that if you had that maxed out already on another level 50 character than you get immediate access to it.

Basically, the subclass skill lines are shared among eachother. If you have an existing Necromancer and maxed out the Grave Lord skill tree, that doesn't count for subclassing.

"Subclass - Grave Lord" is like it's own variant of "Necromancer - Grave Lord". Everyone's account starts at 0/1 "Subclass - Grave Lord". Once it's 50, it's 50 for your entire account. But again, having "Necromancer - Grave Lord" maxed out has no bearing on your access to "Subclass - Grave Lord".

If that make sense.

Wereswan

Entaro wrote: »

SpiritKitten wrote: »

Entaro wrote: »

It's an entire new progression system. It's not simply if you had a max level templar you have access to those skill lines - you need to level up the new subclass skill lines independently again.

Is this the way it is right now on the PTS? Did you test that? Because the notes and the live stream said that if you had that maxed out already on another level 50 character than you get immediate access to it.

Basically, the subclass skill lines are shared among eachother. If you have an existing Necromancer and maxed out the Grave Lord skill tree, that doesn't count for subclassing.

"Subclass - Grave Lord" is like it's own variant of "Necromancer - Grave Lord". Everyone's account starts at 0/1 "Subclass - Grave Lord". Once it's 50, it's 50 for your entire account. But again, having "Necromancer - Grave Lord" maxed out has no bearing on your access to "Subclass - Grave Lord".

If that make sense.

That was how I thought it worked as well, but people in this thread indicated that's not how it works. Apparently there's some weirdness with the templates on PTS where you can still end up at level 1 on subclassed skill lines even if you have the requisite achievement.

SpiritKitten

Entaro wrote: »

SpiritKitten wrote: »

Entaro wrote: »

It's an entire new progression system. It's not simply if you had a max level templar you have access to those skill lines - you need to level up the new subclass skill lines independently again.

Is this the way it is right now on the PTS? Did you test that? Because the notes and the live stream said that if you had that maxed out already on another level 50 character than you get immediate access to it.

Basically, the subclass skill lines are shared among eachother. If you have an existing Necromancer and maxed out the Grave Lord skill tree, that doesn't count for subclassing.

"Subclass - Grave Lord" is like it's own variant of "Necromancer - Grave Lord". Everyone's account starts at 0/1 "Subclass - Grave Lord". Once it's 50, it's 50 for your entire account. But again, having "Necromancer - Grave Lord" maxed out has no bearing on your access to "Subclass - Grave Lord".

If that make sense.

Ahh this is disappointing! Well I guess I don't have to max out my alts for my new build to have access to those skill lines then, and will just level the subclass line when the update goes live. Thank you! You saved me a lot of unnecessary grinding!

Entaro

Wereswan wrote: »

That was how I thought it worked as well, but people in this thread indicated that's not how it works. Apparently there's some weirdness with the templates on PTS where you can still end up at level 1 on subclassed skill lines even if you have the requisite achievement.

Hmm, It's hard to tell currently for sure. It may be that it's intended for existing character's class progression counts for the subclass avaliability, which would cut down the grind massively if that is the case.

The templates are screwed up on PTS yes. When testing be sure to pick the middle "regular" 3600 CP max level etc.. template, and just manually travel to Evermore, etc.. NOT the new subclassing template as that causes you to have level 1 base skill lines...

SpiritKitten

Wereswan wrote: »

Entaro wrote: »

SpiritKitten wrote: »

Entaro wrote: »

It's an entire new progression system. It's not simply if you had a max level templar you have access to those skill lines - you need to level up the new subclass skill lines independently again.

Is this the way it is right now on the PTS? Did you test that? Because the notes and the live stream said that if you had that maxed out already on another level 50 character than you get immediate access to it.

Basically, the subclass skill lines are shared among eachother. If you have an existing Necromancer and maxed out the Grave Lord skill tree, that doesn't count for subclassing.

"Subclass - Grave Lord" is like it's own variant of "Necromancer - Grave Lord". Everyone's account starts at 0/1 "Subclass - Grave Lord". Once it's 50, it's 50 for your entire account. But again, having "Necromancer - Grave Lord" maxed out has no bearing on your access to "Subclass - Grave Lord".

If that make sense.

That was how I thought it worked as well, but people in this thread indicated that's not how it works. Apparently there's some weirdness with the templates on PTS where you can still end up at level 1 on subclassed skill lines even if you have the requisite achievement.

That must be a bug, because they clearly said in the livestream that if you have a (subclassed) skill line at 50, it is shared account-wide.

Entaro

SpiritKitten wrote: »

That must be a bug, because they clearly said in the livestream that if you have a (subclassed) skill line at 50, it is shared account-wide.

So I confirmed with a friend who came on PTS but did not make any new template characters, only their existing ported NA characters. When they logged into other characters they immediately unlocked the collectables for all the skill lines to subclass with.

So based on that, seems like your existing character's progression currently on Live will contribute to unlocking the subclassing, even on Day 1 if you have the grind done already.

Reginald_leBlem

Entaro wrote: »

SpiritKitten wrote: »

That must be a bug, because they clearly said in the livestream that if you have a (subclassed) skill line at 50, it is shared account-wide.

So I confirmed with a friend who came on PTS but did not make any new template characters, only their existing ported NA characters. When they logged into other characters they immediately unlocked the collectables for all the skill lines to subclass with.

So based on that, seems like your existing character's progression currently on Live will contribute to unlocking the subclassing, even on Day 1 if you have the grind done already.

I logged into 1 toon, and did not have access to subclassing.

I logged into all my toons from live, and had access to each skill line, at level 1 for subclassing.

I created a new template fully leveled Arcanist character, and had access to all subclassing lines at level 50, EXCEPT arcanist skills, that were still avaliable but at level 1

I created a second fully leveled template character of a different class, and arcanist skill lines were available for subclassing at level 50.

Worth noting I have 1 dk that didn't have 1 skill line at 50, when I logged into my next toon I had 2 dk lines available, at level 1, but not the skill line my dk didn't have leveled, even though the toon itself was level 50. Each individual skill line needs to be around 50 to unlock it for subclassing.

Entaro

Reginald_leBlem wrote: »

Entaro wrote: »

SpiritKitten wrote: »

That must be a bug, because they clearly said in the livestream that if you have a (subclassed) skill line at 50, it is shared account-wide.

So I confirmed with a friend who came on PTS but did not make any new template characters, only their existing ported NA characters. When they logged into other characters they immediately unlocked the collectables for all the skill lines to subclass with.

So based on that, seems like your existing character's progression currently on Live will contribute to unlocking the subclassing, even on Day 1 if you have the grind done already.

I logged into 1 toon, and did not have access to subclassing.

I logged into all my toons from live, and had access to each skill line, at level 1 for subclassing.

I created a new template fully leveled Arcanist character, and had access to all subclassing lines at level 50, EXCEPT arcanist skills, that were still avaliable but at level 1

I created a second fully leveled template character of a different class, and arcanist skill lines were available for subclassing at level 50.

Ah ok Gotcha.

So mastering the skill line on the base class unlocks the skill line to subclass, starting at level 1 (shared to account).

Buying calls on perfect roe and ambrosia.

SpiritKitten

Okay so after reading other threads, I am powerleveling my Arcanist today to gain access to her skill line.

Cooperharley

So just to confirm here - want to make sure I'm understanding. I mainly play 1 character (my arcanist). In order to have access to the other 6 class's skill lines, I need to have leveled each of them to level 50 (all 3 on my NB, all 3 on my sorc, and so on) in order to use them on my arcanist?

Wereswan

Cooperharley wrote: »

So just to confirm here - want to make sure I'm understanding. I mainly play 1 character (my arcanist). In order to have access to the other 6 class's skill lines, I need to have leveled each of them to level 50 (all 3 on my NB, all 3 on my sorc, and so on) in order to use them on my arcanist?

There's an achievement that unlocks when you reach level 50 in a given class skill line. Once you have the "Herald of the Tome Master" achievement, you can then add that skill line to any other class at level 50. For skill lines where you don't have that achievement, you'll have to progress them as normal. Progress is account-wide, so if you add the same line to two different characters, it'll level up on both. Also, subclass skill lines level at half the rate of your starting class lines, so it's faster to level them on their "native" class.

In other words, you can add any other skill line to your Arcanist one way or the other. If it's at 50 on the other class, the game should pick that up, give you the skill mastery achievement, and it'll start at 50. Otherwise, you'll have to level it as normal (and once it's leveled to 50, you'll get the achievement and never have to do it again.)