Azureblight is Way Too OP – BG Update Will Make It Worse

Synapsis123 · September 18

Lets try to keep the thread on topic. The issue is the set is too strong in pvp. Do you disagree with that?

ForumSavant · September 18

Synapsis123 wrote: »

Lets try to keep the thread on topic. The issue is the set is too strong in pvp. Do you disagree with that?

Not one bit. This set is entirely too strong in PvP,, with the major problem being that it hurts smaller groups much more than it should.

CrashTest · September 18

No, leave Azure alone. It's easy to counter. The only blight in PvP are those who hard stack and steamroll over everything in their path. The irony is amusing.

Synapsis123 · September 18

CrashTest wrote: »

No, leave Azure alone. It's easy to counter. The only blight in PvP are those who hard stack and steamroll over everything in their path. The irony is amusing.

What is the counter? If the counter is "spread out", explain how you coordinate random players who aren't grouped to spread out in a pvp game where people are supposed to be in large fights.

sarahthes · September 18

Synapsis123 wrote: »

CrashTest wrote: »

No, leave Azure alone. It's easy to counter. The only blight in PvP are those who hard stack and steamroll over everything in their path. The irony is amusing.

What is the counter? If the counter is "spread out", explain how you coordinate random players who aren't grouped to spread out in a pvp game where people are supposed to be in large fights.

Surely azure isn't the only risk to being in a group with clumped up randoms. How do you handle the random pug clumps when azure isn't in the mix?

Synapsis123 · September 18

sarahthes wrote: »

Synapsis123 wrote: »

CrashTest wrote: »

No, leave Azure alone. It's easy to counter. The only blight in PvP are those who hard stack and steamroll over everything in their path. The irony is amusing.

What is the counter? If the counter is "spread out", explain how you coordinate random players who aren't grouped to spread out in a pvp game where people are supposed to be in large fights.

Surely azure isn't the only risk to being in a group with clumped up randoms.

Except the topic is about azure. Please stop changing the topic.

sarahthes · September 18

Synapsis123 wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

Synapsis123 wrote: »

CrashTest wrote: »

No, leave Azure alone. It's easy to counter. The only blight in PvP are those who hard stack and steamroll over everything in their path. The irony is amusing.

What is the counter? If the counter is "spread out", explain how you coordinate random players who aren't grouped to spread out in a pvp game where people are supposed to be in large fights.

Surely azure isn't the only risk to being in a group with clumped up randoms.

Except the topic is about azure. Please stop changing the topic.

Except it's relevant. If a strat doesn't work against azure then surely it also doesn't work against getting bombed by the 18K health PvEers. Y'all die every time, right?

Synapsis123 · September 18

sarahthes wrote: »

Synapsis123 wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

Synapsis123 wrote: »

CrashTest wrote: »

No, leave Azure alone. It's easy to counter. The only blight in PvP are those who hard stack and steamroll over everything in their path. The irony is amusing.

What is the counter? If the counter is "spread out", explain how you coordinate random players who aren't grouped to spread out in a pvp game where people are supposed to be in large fights.

Surely azure isn't the only risk to being in a group with clumped up randoms.

Except the topic is about azure. Please stop changing the topic.

Except it's relevant. If a strat doesn't work against azure then surely it also doesn't work against getting bombed by the 18K health PvEers. Y'all die every time, right?

You can block a single bomb. You can't block being constantly bombarded by 9k explosions.

sarahthes · September 18

Synapsis123 wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

Synapsis123 wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

Synapsis123 wrote: »

CrashTest wrote: »

No, leave Azure alone. It's easy to counter. The only blight in PvP are those who hard stack and steamroll over everything in their path. The irony is amusing.

What is the counter? If the counter is "spread out", explain how you coordinate random players who aren't grouped to spread out in a pvp game where people are supposed to be in large fights.

Surely azure isn't the only risk to being in a group with clumped up randoms.

Except the topic is about azure. Please stop changing the topic.

Except it's relevant. If a strat doesn't work against azure then surely it also doesn't work against getting bombed by the 18K health PvEers. Y'all die every time, right?

You can block a single bomb. You can't block being constantly bombarded by 9k explosions.

Thank you for answering why it's different.

sarahthes · September 18

[Quoted post has been removed]

My conclusion based on all the back and forth is that azureblight is fine for PvE and thus should be removed from PvP, and perhaps a new set designed specifically for ball group busting should be released in the near future, that scales or ramps more in groups of 8+ than it does on packs of targets smaller than 8.

Synapsis123 · September 18

sarahthes wrote: »

[Quoted post has been removed]

My conclusion based on all the back and forth is that azureblight is fine for PvE and thus should be removed from PvP, and perhaps a new set designed specifically for ball group busting should be released in the near future, that scales or ramps more in groups of 8+ than it does on packs of targets smaller than 8.

Just like all other "ball busting" sets, this one seems to only be getting utilized by large groups of 6+ players. The results when stacking this set far out perform the expected level of performance given the low level of coordination between these players.

TLDR: The set is way too strong without any skill or coordination.

Step 1. Stack dots
Step 2. Profit

sarahthes · September 18

One additional note: PvE balancing shouldn't be around the score pushing groups in the first place. They often use and utilize techniques and strategies that very few other players can even hope to pull off, so a set over performing in that kind of niche scenario (for example, a triple mini skip Oax which is the only time you'd run azure on that boss) is completely irrelevant to actual game balance.

ZOS_GregoryV · September 18

Greetings all!

After reviewing this thread, and removing a handful of posts, we would like to remind everyone that all posts are to be kept within the guidelines of the Community Rules. Abusive Language and Disruptive Behavior, Flaming, Rude and Insulting Comments, as well as Trolling or Baiting, are all violations of the rules. We understand that members of the community are rather passionate, and would like to voice their opinions and concerns, but we still ask that all posts/comments stay within the rules.

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg

forum_gpt · September 19

ZOS_GregoryV wrote: »

Greetings all!

After reviewing this thread, and removing a handful of posts, we would like to remind everyone that all posts are to be kept within the guidelines of the Community Rules. Abusive Language and Disruptive Behavior, Flaming, Rude and Insulting Comments, as well as Trolling or Baiting, are all violations of the rules. We understand that members of the community are rather passionate, and would like to voice their opinions and concerns, but we still ask that all posts/comments stay within the rules.

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg

Thanks but lets not deviate from azureblight being the strongest set in the game.

sarahthes · September 19

forum_gpt wrote: »

ZOS_GregoryV wrote: »

Greetings all!

After reviewing this thread, and removing a handful of posts, we would like to remind everyone that all posts are to be kept within the guidelines of the Community Rules. Abusive Language and Disruptive Behavior, Flaming, Rude and Insulting Comments, as well as Trolling or Baiting, are all violations of the rules. We understand that members of the community are rather passionate, and would like to voice their opinions and concerns, but we still ask that all posts/comments stay within the rules.

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg

Thanks but lets not deviate from azureblight being the strongest set in the game.

I have to admit, I laughed.

Synapsis123 · September 19

forum_gpt wrote: »

ZOS_GregoryV wrote: »

Greetings all!

After reviewing this thread, and removing a handful of posts, we would like to remind everyone that all posts are to be kept within the guidelines of the Community Rules. Abusive Language and Disruptive Behavior, Flaming, Rude and Insulting Comments, as well as Trolling or Baiting, are all violations of the rules. We understand that members of the community are rather passionate, and would like to voice their opinions and concerns, but we still ask that all posts/comments stay within the rules.

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg

Thanks but lets not deviate from azureblight being the strongest set in the game.

Specifically it is strong in pvp though. You are the original poster so please don't derail the conversation into pve.

ForumSavant · September 20

Synapsis123 wrote: »

forum_gpt wrote: »

ZOS_GregoryV wrote: »

Greetings all!

After reviewing this thread, and removing a handful of posts, we would like to remind everyone that all posts are to be kept within the guidelines of the Community Rules. Abusive Language and Disruptive Behavior, Flaming, Rude and Insulting Comments, as well as Trolling or Baiting, are all violations of the rules. We understand that members of the community are rather passionate, and would like to voice their opinions and concerns, but we still ask that all posts/comments stay within the rules.

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg

Thanks but lets not deviate from azureblight being the strongest set in the game.

Specifically it is strong in pvp though. You are the original poster so please don't derail the conversation into pve.

Specifically in groups of 4+.

Mathius_Mordred · September 20

I mostly do Vet and normal dungeons and a few trials on normal. I have found that Azure hardly ever procs as everything dies way too fast for it to build up 20 stacks, I deconstructed it and got half my transmutes back, massively overhyped set.

Renato90085 · September 20

Mathius_Mordred wrote: »

I mostly do Vet and normal dungeons and a few trials on normal. I have found that Azure hardly ever procs as everything dies way too fast for it to build up 20 stacks, I deconstructed it and got half my transmutes back, massively overhyped set.

Yes...this set in pve is mainly used in trial vet or trial hm...vet dlc and normal trial too easy so this set cant do good work

YandereGirlfriend · September 20

The sort of elephant in the room here is that in open-world PvP this is an Xv1 set.

So the tales of the noble Azureblight user busting the dreaded ballgroup or opposing zerg is, generally speaking, complete nonsense. There's a reason why each of the faction zergs in Cyrodiil all use this set.

Zergs use this set to swarm-down groups smaller than themselves because Azureblight's power continues to scale upward the more people that you have running it. So if you have 8-10 players in a 40-man zerg running this set, as is often the case, the procs are firing off every 2-3 seconds on everyone being targeted for insane tooltips.

This set became extremely problematic once sticky DOTs were randomly extended to 20-seconds and beyond because the ease of use of the set vs. its damage output became completely inverted. People using this set simply spam Oblivion's Foe + Soul-Splitting Trap double sticky DOTs and Acid Spray on anything that moves... and then at that point their job is basically done. Just sit back and wait for the blue mist and your AP.

My suggestion for reigning-in this set would be to no longer aggregate all Azureblight stacks into a single stack on a target. This would remove much of the Xv1 potential of the set, as each wearer would have to build their own stacks rather than combining to build a single stack on a target. Extending the post-proc immunity period would also be beneficial. Also making the stacks Purge-able, which currently they are not for whatever strange reason. Failing all of that simply nerf the tooltip to something more reflective of the effort required to proc it.

There are also issues with Azureblight not being properly mitigated by AOE-reduction buffs/CP/etc. as well as proccing more often than it should but those are more bugs with the set than intentional design.

Pevey · September 20

Two things I can agree with above: (1) The stacks themselves should be able to be purged in addition to the sticky dots, and (2) AOE mitigation should properly apply when someone near you has AB go off.

Synapsis123 · September 20

Pevey wrote: »

Two things I can agree with above: (1) The stacks themselves should be able to be purged in addition to the sticky dots, and (2) AOE mitigation should properly apply when someone near you has AB go off.

Purge as a solution to any problem in cyrodiil isn't good. Plaguebreak completely removes the use of purge. The person who suggested different stacks of azureblight for each person is an okay solution, but creates another problem in the solution. The new problem is that you could potentially create an even bigger burst when the individual stacks line up. Right now with single stacks the burst is too large and you instantly die, but with individual stacks you could potentially receive 100k damage in .1 seconds.

There are now ball groups building their entire group around this set. It isn't a good sign when the supposed ball buster sets are being utilized by ball groups.

The reality is this set is just too strong when stacked no matter how you slice it. At least in pvp, an individual player needs to become immune to azureblight damage for a couple seconds after receiving azureblight damage. Every other proc set has a cooldown in this game, but azureblight doesn't and when stacked you have a ton of explosions going off every second.

xylena_lazarow · September 20

Synapsis123 wrote: »

Lets try to keep the thread on topic. The issue is the set is too strong in pvp. Do you disagree with that?

Azure is perfect in its anti ball niche and balanced because it's a blank line into mobile solos and smallscale groups.

Synapsis123 · September 20

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Synapsis123 wrote: »

Lets try to keep the thread on topic. The issue is the set is too strong in pvp. Do you disagree with that?

Azure is perfect in its anti ball niche and balanced because it's a blank line into mobile solos and smallscale groups.

I don't know what game you're playing, but this set is incredibly strong against smallscale groups. If you're solo you're likely going to get zerged down by the people using it anyway. Also if you're solo and you don't want to get hit by the set you basically have to play off by yourself. You won't be able to contribute at all to the faction and capture any keeps.

MidniteOwl1913 · September 21

Sirona_Starr wrote: »

ForumSavant wrote: »

Sirona_Starr wrote: »

Here's a thought. Instead of there constantly being "something" that someone wants nerfed a call to raise sets to a better standard so there is a wider range of options of sets to be used, rather than the very "limited" run of the mill recommended sets. Let's raise up, rather than bring down

If a set does 500k damage instantly to everyone in an area and other sets are all below a baseline, why would you bring all other sets up rather than just fixing the one overperforming set? Not logical at all.

BECAUSE every time they nerf a set it effs is up for PVE because they do not balance separately. EVERY TIME. PVP whines, they nerf it and mess up PVE who are NOT whining and enjoy using the set. There have been other suggestions in this thread of alternatives instead of nerfing yet again. OR START ASKING ZOS to balance sets separately or there are sets for PVP only and PVE only. Then if you want a pvp set nerfed it doesn't impact PVE and vice versa.

Sometimes it seems that PVP is why PVE can't have nice things. It gets old.

Iriidius · September 21

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

The sort of elephant in the room here is that in open-world PvP this is an Xv1 set.

So the tales of the noble Azureblight user busting the dreaded ballgroup or opposing zerg is, generally speaking, complete nonsense. There's a reason why each of the faction zergs in Cyrodiil all use this set.

Zergs use this set to swarm-down groups smaller than themselves because Azureblight's power continues to scale upward the more people that you have running it. So if you have 8-10 players in a 40-man zerg running this set, as is often the case, the procs are firing off every 2-3 seconds on everyone being targeted for insane tooltips.

This set became extremely problematic once sticky DOTs were randomly extended to 20-seconds and beyond because the ease of use of the set vs. its damage output became completely inverted. People using this set simply spam Oblivion's Foe + Soul-Splitting Trap double sticky DOTs and Acid Spray on anything that moves... and then at that point their job is basically done. Just sit back and wait for the blue mist and your AP.

My suggestion for reigning-in this set would be to no longer aggregate all Azureblight stacks into a single stack on a target. This would remove much of the Xv1 potential of the set, as each wearer would have to build their own stacks rather than combining to build a single stack on a target. Extending the post-proc immunity period would also be beneficial. Also making the stacks Purge-able, which currently they are not for whatever strange reason. Failing all of that simply nerf the tooltip to something more reflective of the effort required to proc it.

There are also issues with Azureblight not being properly mitigated by AOE-reduction buffs/CP/etc. as well as proccing more often than it should but those are more bugs with the set than intentional design.

As a solo player I cant remember ever beeing killed by azureblight. Maybe using it with multiple players in a group on multiple players will proc explosions faster but using multiple tarnished, master dw or other proc sets will also proc dmg more often. Still would prefer if it would be reverted to not stackable by multiple players AND NO HALF SECOND COOLDOWN ON EXPLOSIONS PER USER as it prevents solo players from oneshotting ballgroups so they just heal up again. And it would not be OP that a solo player can kill ballgroup as he is build to counter ballgroups and still cant do it alone as the ballgroup will Xv1 bomb him immediately if he attacks solo and can do not need to stack against a low single target dmg solo player, he can only do it when the ballgroup is already busy fighting a faction stack still with a very low probability(need apply multiple dots and let them tick before they decide to Xv1 bomb you(despite faction stack).

As a solo player i still get hit by only 1 explosion rather than 12 explosions from 11 groupmates+myself all buffed by 180% resulting in 3240 % the dmg received of a solo player.
Often it seems like ballgroup players pretend to be solo/smallscale players getting defeated by ballgroup counters to ask for ballgroup counter removal and defend ballgroup tools.

Iriidius · September 21

MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »

Sirona_Starr wrote: »

ForumSavant wrote: »

Sirona_Starr wrote: »

Here's a thought. Instead of there constantly being "something" that someone wants nerfed a call to raise sets to a better standard so there is a wider range of options of sets to be used, rather than the very "limited" run of the mill recommended sets. Let's raise up, rather than bring down

If a set does 500k damage instantly to everyone in an area and other sets are all below a baseline, why would you bring all other sets up rather than just fixing the one overperforming set? Not logical at all.

BECAUSE every time they nerf a set it effs is up for PVE because they do not balance separately. EVERY TIME. PVP whines, they nerf it and mess up PVE who are NOT whining and enjoy using the set. There have been other suggestions in this thread of alternatives instead of nerfing yet again. OR START ASKING ZOS to balance sets separately or there are sets for PVP only and PVE only. Then if you want a pvp set nerfed it doesn't impact PVE and vice versa.

Sometimes it seems that PVP is why PVE can't have nice things. It gets old.

PvE players love to blame PvP players for bad balance changes althought ZoS made most of these bad changes without PvPers asking for them or only a minority and often there would be ways to keep PvP balance that ZoS not used. Even for nerfs to PvP sets or the battlespirit nerf to hp regen (despite beein only in PvP fights) PvErs blamed the PvPers.
ZoS also regulary creates overperforming PvP Sets in new PvE dlcs/chapters to make PvPers buy them despiteno PvP content and later nerfs them when everyone did to make them buy next chapter/dlc for overperforming in PvP sets which is not PvPers faul or only indirectly for existing and getting milked.

Wycks · September 21

Very evident that hot/dot heavy ballsgroups are killing performance in Cyrodil.

Once again, poor combat design by the ZOS. AzureBlight is what?...the 4-5th time this has happened in the game. ZOS introduces a set to fight ball group...ball groups proceed to use the very set to destroy everything in their path like mindless bots.

At least 8x8 will shine a light on what's been an issue in Cyrodil for years. What is truly mind-boggling is that not only does this make for an extremely poor player experiences, it also crushes the server performance. There an opportunity here to kill 2 birds with one stone

ForumSavant · September 21

Yeah whatever "ballgroup killing" sets are introduced are always just used by ballgroups in the end. VD, Plaguebreak, azure. The sad part about azure is it also works too well on smaller groups and makes small scaling feel miserable. A lot of proc on death sets cause a bit of lag when huge groups get bombed, but that's at the moment they have already died so it's not a huge concern, whereas azureblight causes strain on the server constantly, and on top of that, the proc condition for azure is dots, so it incentives even more dots to be used, so it's twofold as bad on performance,. When you go against a group of 6+ people all using azure, the game is noticeably worse.

Theist_VII · September 23

Nice.

They might as well force you into an active group whenever you head into Cyrodiil now that the set no longer works AT ALL in PvP.