What the Hell is all the different trading guilds? It should be all one spot to trade everything lik

FlopsyPrince · September 2

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

I do not understand your logic. Someone created a guild and set the rules for membership. Their guild - their rules. If someone does not like to pay the membership fee, they can join another guild or start their own.
Same for guilds that say they are for RP only or for vampires/WW only.

Note, that I do not defend the practice. I would not join a guild with a fee.

I accept most of that.
I don't agree that I should have to pay in-game funds or engage in slavery to be a guild member.

Slavery? All guilds are voluntary.

And just join one without dues then

Even trade guilds with no dues will spam you with notifications about their lotteries/raffles and literally beg for donations. Aside from the fact that some people avoid any and all gambling for personal reasons, some of us just find it all really distasteful. Trading should not be locked behind this nonsense.

I'm not at all against guilds. I'm in five PVE guilds, and none of them do this (thankfully!). Two of them happen to have a trader, one in a pretty bad location and one in a decent one. So I am lucky. But the system is absurd. There is a ton of room for improvement.

Then may be start you own trading guild that does not require any fees and does not do raffles/does not beg for donations?

Again, I'm not defending the practice (and I'm not a member of any guild), but it seems that it's a lot of effort/money to support a trading guild and get a trader.

That is unreasonable unless you want to grind for gold yourself for the weekly trader bids. I would be most who complain about dues and/or begging for donations don't have any idea how much it costs for those.

spartaxoxo · September 2

I am fortunate that I found a nice guild with helpful people with free dues. They do auctions and stuff. I don't see the problem. The alternative is dues or just the officers overwork themselves.

I don't see the big issue with a group of people that want to do an activity that has a cost, helping one another split that cost.

Pevey · September 2

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Again, I'm not defending the practice (and I'm not a member of any guild), but it seems that it's a lot of effort/money to support a trading guild and get a trader.

That's very much the point. It's the system itself that is terrible. There needs to be an alternative way to sell. Many people see this as "auction house vs guild traders," but that doesn't have to be the case. You can think the guild trader system is totally bonkers (I do) without necessarily thinking an auction house is the way to go. There are other ways to improve the system to provide alternative ways to sell.

ESO_player123 · September 2

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Again, I'm not defending the practice (and I'm not a member of any guild), but it seems that it's a lot of effort/money to support a trading guild and get a trader.

That's very much the point. It's the system itself that is terrible. There needs to be an alternative way to sell. Many people see this as "auction house vs guild traders," but that doesn't have to be the case. You can think the guild trader system is totally bonkers (I do) without necessarily thinking an auction house is the way to go. There are other ways to improve the system to provide alternative ways to sell.

What those ways would be? Do you have any suggestions?

gamma71 · September 2

The current trader system only brings frustration and guild drama to those who compete for trying to get the best locations. Being different for the sake of being different is stupid.

Pevey · September 2

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Again, I'm not defending the practice (and I'm not a member of any guild), but it seems that it's a lot of effort/money to support a trading guild and get a trader.

That's very much the point. It's the system itself that is terrible. There needs to be an alternative way to sell. Many people see this as "auction house vs guild traders," but that doesn't have to be the case. You can think the guild trader system is totally bonkers (I do) without necessarily thinking an auction house is the way to go. There are other ways to improve the system to provide alternative ways to sell.

What those ways would be? Do you have any suggestions?

Yes, I listed some in this thread.

spartaxoxo · September 2

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Imagine buying your groceries and clothes using the guild trader model in real life. It would be much more costly! Why would someone think that prices are kept down in a game in the same type of model?

Assuming the ability to source goods and cost to receive those goods are the same for all businesses....

You will have lower prices if there's a bunch of competing stores than a single store in town.

Edit:
Evidence has been presented.

The factually lower prices of console vs PC, that inflation is true across all games with a centralized system, the general MMO practice of "buy low and sell high" being harder on console, while it's significantly easier on PC or those other games, and the basic economic idea of competition leading to lower prices.

You've rejected that evidence as compelling to you, which fair enough, but it was asked for and given.

It is not just competition that pushes prices down, it is scale and the ability to participate in that competition. You do not have that true competition in ESO because you (as a player) cannot truly price things comparatively without a LOT of time NOT DOING other things that are likely a higher priority.

Speak for yourself. Many players manage to price things comparatively without a lot of effort. I don't need to have the best price on the server, I just need to have the best price in my location because I'm in a good spot. And I just need to beat the capital prices significantly when I'm in a bad one.

It doesn't take me long to price things at all and I am NOT a high end trader nor do I use add-ons as a console player. It's very easy.

It's easy for me to know the generally good prices. It's hard for me to buy things for flipping without a lot of effort. Which is why I don't do it. I have previously known people who have though and they are far richer than me. I still make enough coin though that I can buy all my needs and all but the most expensive, luxurious of wants. And that is good enough for me as a casual trader.

Name 1 MMO that has the primary/base feature of "run from trader to trader for great gameplay. I bet you can't name one, at least one that truly fits.

You may do well enough with your pricing, but you are still guessing and most of us still do not find that part interesting. I guess (on console) based on how much the same item is being sold by my 5 guilds, but that is not a good measure and may or may not sell things nor get me a reasonable price if they do sell. It is a crap shoot. I may win sometimes, but I am much more likely to use, just like playing dice.

This goes back to the hidden information I noted much earlier on. It is not completely hidden, but it takes a lot of effort to really find the reasonable value (either to buy or sell) for anything not in the norm.

There is no set price or hidden information that ZOS is withholding from anyone. The market is what people in your area is selling it for. If nobody is buying then you just lower it til they do. That's not any different with an AH either. Except for instead of the traders next to you, it's the listings on the same page. It's a one button click difference.

The reason that guild stores give more competition is because different locations can have different pricing. Not because it's somehow difficult to see that everyone in Elden Root is selling Temps for 2k.

kargen27 · September 2

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Imagine buying your groceries and clothes using the guild trader model in real life. It would be much more costly! Why would someone think that prices are kept down in a game in the same type of model?

Assuming the ability to source goods and cost to receive those goods are the same for all businesses....

You will have lower prices if there's a bunch of competing stores than a single store in town.

Edit:
Evidence has been presented.

The factually lower prices of console vs PC, that inflation is true across all games with a centralized system, the general MMO practice of "buy low and sell high" being harder on console, while it's significantly easier on PC or those other games, and the basic economic idea of competition leading to lower prices.

You've rejected that evidence as compelling to you, which fair enough, but it was asked for and given.

It is not just competition that pushes prices down, it is scale and the ability to participate in that competition. You do not have that true competition in ESO because you (as a player) cannot truly price things comparatively without a LOT of time NOT DOING other things that are likely a higher priority.

Speak for yourself. Many players manage to price things comparatively without a lot of effort. I don't need to have the best price on the server, I just need to have the best price in my location because I'm in a good spot. And I just need to beat the capital prices significantly when I'm in a bad one.

It doesn't take me long to price things at all and I am NOT a high end trader nor do I use add-ons as a console player. It's very easy.

It's easy for me to know the generally good prices. It's hard for me to buy things for flipping without a lot of effort. Which is why I don't do it. I have previously known people who have though and they are far richer than me. I still make enough coin though that I can buy all my needs and all but the most expensive, luxurious of wants. And that is good enough for me as a casual trader.

Name 1 MMO that has the primary/base feature of "run from trader to trader for great gameplay. I bet you can't name one, at least one that truly fits.

You may do well enough with your pricing, but you are still guessing and most of us still do not find that part interesting. I guess (on console) based on how much the same item is being sold by my 5 guilds, but that is not a good measure and may or may not sell things nor get me a reasonable price if they do sell. It is a crap shoot. I may win sometimes, but I am much more likely to use, just like playing dice.

This goes back to the hidden information I noted much earlier on. It is not completely hidden, but it takes a lot of effort to really find the reasonable value (either to buy or sell) for anything not in the norm.

You are the only one mentioning trading as the primary feature. It is only one aspect of the game just like PvP or trials. And there still is no hidden information. Trading works like anything else in the game. You spend more time you get more benefit. Trading has several tiers. Selling in zone chat would be maybe like running Fungal Grotto 1 with a pug group. Becoming a flipper in a top tier guild would be more along the lines of doing hard mode DLCs. Nobody steps into the hard mode runs day one. They build to it. The best thing about the trade system is everybody can participate at the level they wish.

ESO_player123 · September 2

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Again, I'm not defending the practice (and I'm not a member of any guild), but it seems that it's a lot of effort/money to support a trading guild and get a trader.

That's very much the point. It's the system itself that is terrible. There needs to be an alternative way to sell. Many people see this as "auction house vs guild traders," but that doesn't have to be the case. You can think the guild trader system is totally bonkers (I do) without necessarily thinking an auction house is the way to go. There are other ways to improve the system to provide alternative ways to sell.

What those ways would be? Do you have any suggestions?

Yes, I listed some in this thread.

I read your suggestion about unlocking trading locations in various places through questing. It might have been an interesting trading system for a new game. But for a 10 year old game removing the guild trading and making everyone start questing just to be able to sell items again does not make much sense.

Thoriorz · September 2

gamma71 wrote: »

Running around for hours to different traders just to find something is stupid. The people that like it so much don't have anything better to do so they don't mind.

As I've written before, without the TTC website I wouldn't trade at all (or only minimally). The TTC website can practically show you where the item you're looking for is being sold, the price of the item, the time, etc. but if there wasn't a TTC website then the current trading system would be *** (ofc only my opinion).
And I really admire console gamers...

Northwold · September 2

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Again, I'm not defending the practice (and I'm not a member of any guild), but it seems that it's a lot of effort/money to support a trading guild and get a trader.

That's very much the point. It's the system itself that is terrible. There needs to be an alternative way to sell. Many people see this as "auction house vs guild traders," but that doesn't have to be the case. You can think the guild trader system is totally bonkers (I do) without necessarily thinking an auction house is the way to go. There are other ways to improve the system to provide alternative ways to sell.

What those ways would be? Do you have any suggestions?

I've already made suggestions, so has Pevey. Others have made suggestions in previous threads on the same topic.

notyuu · September 2

Yeah, sure, put all the guild stores into one place or a central AH, it'll make it so much easier for me, or somebody like me to buy out and control the supply of a certain good, let's say....draught wax, how would you feel about having to pay 50,000 drakes a unit?

In a less sarcastic tone, having guild traders be scattered about like they currently are adds a layer of protection to stop one or two very very rich players getting a literal monopoly on a certain item, so sure the system sucks, but the alternative would be faaaar worse

MJallday · September 2

whatever is implemented has to work for both console and pc - you wouldn't want two different systems (and it would be a major departure for ZOS if they did that - so actually its a "cant")

an AH certainly sorts a lot of problems for consoles - but then again it also presents a lot of technical challenges - i honestly think ZOS will look at this and say "if it aint broken, dont fix it"

and lets not kid ourselves, it isnt broken. its just a few people jacking up the prices. if you want to sell something, you're free to do so at as lower price as you want.

Aurielle · September 2

As an alternative to a centralized AH, I’d love it if TTC could be integrated into the game. LIVE listings. You’d still have to travel to each guild trader, still have to join trading guilds, but no more alt tabbing to search a website littered with ads, no more rolling the dice on whether or not someone has already snatched the good deal listed six hours ago that you found on TTC, etc.

xilfxlegion · September 2

Twohothardware wrote: »

The guild trader system we have now is nothing more than a large gold sink and it’s the same handful of guilds that control the prime trader locations.

A central auction house would work much better for the general player base. It would eliminate the running around searching dozens of traders to locate an item or compare prices, everything would be priced more competitively, your items would sell much faster, and no more weekly guild fees.

show us any sort of proof that the market is controlled by a handful of guilds.

even in the prime trading spots guilds lose their bids often and other guilds are in place.

and a central auction house would have the opposite effect - there would be no competition because central auction houses are easy to control if you have enough gold.

xilfxlegion · September 2

ESO_player123 wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

I do not understand your logic. Someone created a guild and set the rules for membership. Their guild - their rules. If someone does not like to pay the membership fee, they can join another guild or start their own.
Same for guilds that say they are for RP only or for vampires/WW only.

Note, that I do not defend the practice. I would not join a guild with a fee.

I accept most of that.
I don't agree that I should have to pay in-game funds or engage in slavery to be a guild member.

But you should not have to do it. Just join a guild that does not require a fee.

or sell in open chat.

you do not have to join a guild to buy or sell anything.

LaintalAy · September 2

xilfxlegion wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

I don't agree that I should have to pay in-game funds or engage in slavery to be a guild member.

[snip]

Thanks for your constructive response.

[edited to remove quote]

shadyjane62 · September 2

No Auction House is why I look for other games.

Pevey · September 2

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Again, I'm not defending the practice (and I'm not a member of any guild), but it seems that it's a lot of effort/money to support a trading guild and get a trader.

That's very much the point. It's the system itself that is terrible. There needs to be an alternative way to sell. Many people see this as "auction house vs guild traders," but that doesn't have to be the case. You can think the guild trader system is totally bonkers (I do) without necessarily thinking an auction house is the way to go. There are other ways to improve the system to provide alternative ways to sell.

What those ways would be? Do you have any suggestions?

Yes, I listed some in this thread.

I read your suggestion about unlocking trading locations in various places through questing. It might have been an interesting trading system for a new game. But for a 10 year old game removing the guild trading and making everyone start questing just to be able to sell items again does not make much sense.

There would be no need to remove the guild traders.

People always try to derail criticism of the system into “it’s too late in the game to kill guild traders” or “AH is bad.” The whole point is that there are ways to improve the system to make is much more useful and palatable to a large section of ESO players who hate the guild trader system. Reading comprehension helps.

katanagirl1 · September 2

Thoriorz wrote: »

gamma71 wrote: »

Running around for hours to different traders just to find something is stupid. The people that like it so much don't have anything better to do so they don't mind.

As I've written before, without the TTC website I wouldn't trade at all (or only minimally). The TTC website can practically show you where the item you're looking for is being sold, the price of the item, the time, etc. but if there wasn't a TTC website then the current trading system would be *** (ofc only my opinion).
And I really admire console gamers...

It’s not as bad on console as many have let on. I can get a price check in about 5 minutes for items to sell and I have 4-5 different categories of items I search for regularly to buy and can hit all the capital traders in Elden Root, Wayrest, Mournhold, Alinor, Rimmen, Leyawiin, and Vivec City in under an hour.

The biggest improvement as far as a time saver would be if I could fine tune the search to known or unknown items.

As for finding an item, if it isn’t in those locations listed above, it’s not likely to be anywhere else.

EDIT: clarification

Kappachi · September 2

This is one of the few games that still forces social interactions, sometimes you'll even have a better time just hawking stuff off in zone chat, no other game would do this because of a unified auction house. Tons of choices like these are made to keep the social spirit of the game alive and I wouldn't want it any other way.

I_killed_Vivec · September 2

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Again, I'm not defending the practice (and I'm not a member of any guild), but it seems that it's a lot of effort/money to support a trading guild and get a trader.

That's very much the point. It's the system itself that is terrible. There needs to be an alternative way to sell. Many people see this as "auction house vs guild traders," but that doesn't have to be the case. You can think the guild trader system is totally bonkers (I do) without necessarily thinking an auction house is the way to go. There are other ways to improve the system to provide alternative ways to sell.

What those ways would be? Do you have any suggestions?

Yes, I listed some in this thread.

I read your suggestion about unlocking trading locations in various places through questing. It might have been an interesting trading system for a new game. But for a 10 year old game removing the guild trading and making everyone start questing just to be able to sell items again does not make much sense.

There would be no need to remove the guild traders.

People always try to derail criticism of the system into “it’s too late in the game to kill guild traders” or “AH is bad.” The whole point is that there are ways to improve the system to make is much more useful and palatable to a large section of ESO players who hate the guild trader system. Reading comprehension helps.

A bit disingenuous... if any proposed alternative system really would satisfy the "trading wishes of the masses" then wouldn't it be responsible for the demise of guild traders?

Apparently everyone would want it except for the greedy traders who are only interested in price gouging those poor honest players who have no time or inclination to farm... but believe that "anyone can get everything for free in the game in any case" is a sensible rationale for them determining the price, rather than the people who invest time in farming.

And be careful what you wish for, there might be unintended consequences. The assumption is always that prices will level down... they might also go up if people understand the value of what they are selling better.

Pevey · September 2

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Again, I'm not defending the practice (and I'm not a member of any guild), but it seems that it's a lot of effort/money to support a trading guild and get a trader.

That's very much the point. It's the system itself that is terrible. There needs to be an alternative way to sell. Many people see this as "auction house vs guild traders," but that doesn't have to be the case. You can think the guild trader system is totally bonkers (I do) without necessarily thinking an auction house is the way to go. There are other ways to improve the system to provide alternative ways to sell.

What those ways would be? Do you have any suggestions?

Yes, I listed some in this thread.

I read your suggestion about unlocking trading locations in various places through questing. It might have been an interesting trading system for a new game. But for a 10 year old game removing the guild trading and making everyone start questing just to be able to sell items again does not make much sense.

There would be no need to remove the guild traders.

People always try to derail criticism of the system into “it’s too late in the game to kill guild traders” or “AH is bad.” The whole point is that there are ways to improve the system to make is much more useful and palatable to a large section of ESO players who hate the guild trader system. Reading comprehension helps.

A bit disingenuous... if any proposed alternative system really would satisfy the "trading wishes of the masses" then wouldn't it be responsible for the demise of guild traders?

Apparently everyone would want it except for the greedy traders who are only interested in price gouging those poor honest players who have no time or inclination to farm... but believe that "anyone can get everything for free in the game in any case" is a sensible rationale for them determining the price, rather than the people who invest time in farming.

And be careful what you wish for, there might be unintended consequences. The assumption is always that prices will level down... they might also go up if people understand the value of what they are selling better.

It disingenuous to conflate the wish to be able to list some items to sell outside of the guild trader system with a desire to kill that system or.. all the other stuff you mentioned. You're conflating a lot of different things that different people have said about trading in ESO. There are lots of different topics and views on those topics, and you've jumbled them all together and assigned them to people they don't belong to.

Allowing people to list a few items through some alternative system (either like the one I described or by allowing people to sell from a trader in their player homes like others have suggested over the years) would not necessarily kill the guild trader system, and it would not necessarily be any more centralized (or auction house-like) than what we have now. If it did kill guild traders, it would be because they really are extremely unpopular. But they can coexist, and people who really like the system can keep right on using it and ignore any other kiosks.

LaintalAy · September 2

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Thoriorz wrote: »

gamma71 wrote: »

Running around for hours to different traders just to find something is stupid. The people that like it so much don't have anything better to do so they don't mind.

As I've written before, without the TTC website I wouldn't trade at all (or only minimally). The TTC website can practically show you where the item you're looking for is being sold, the price of the item, the time, etc. but if there wasn't a TTC website then the current trading system would be *** (ofc only my opinion).
And I really admire console gamers...

It’s not as bad on console as many have let on. I can get a price check in about 5 minutes for items to sell and I have 4-5 different categories of items I search for regularly to buy and can hit all the capital traders in Elden Root, Wayrest, Mournhold, Alinor, Rimmen, Leyawiin, and Vivec City in under an hour.

The biggest improvement as far as a time saver would be if I could fine tune the search to known or unknown items.

As for finding an item, if it isn’t in those locations listed above, it’s not likely to be anywhere else.

EDIT: clarification

After returning to game play, I spent some time (on PC EU) without addons installed, just to remind myself of the many genuine complaints that players using the default banking interface have.

As for finding an item, if it isn’t in those locations listed above, it’s not likely to be anywhere else.

This is possibly because flippers have used TTC to locate these items, buy them and relist them at a Vivec or Mournhold trader at a much higher price. That way they can meet their guild sales target, in turn, in order for guilds to retain these locations.

The biggest improvement as far as a time saver would be if I could fine tune the search to known or unknown items.

This is a feature of Awesome Guild Store addon and is just one of many useful features that this addon provides to PC users.

It’s not as bad on console as many have let on. I can get a price check in about 5 minutes for items to sell and I have 4-5 different categories of items I search for regularly to buy and can hit all the capital traders in Elden Root, Wayrest, Mournhold, Alinor, Rimmen, Leyawiin, and Vivec City in under an hour.

Trading to make money, requires some effort and investment in time. If you have a strategy, you can minimise that effort.

Running around for hours to different traders just to find something is stupid. The people that like it so much don't have anything better to do so they don't mind.

If you can't find what you're looking for inside an hour, it likely isn't for sale.

As I've written before, without the TTC website I wouldn't trade at all (or only minimally). The TTC website can practically show you where the item you're looking for is being sold, the price of the item, the time, etc.

Often we see other TTC users that complain that when they arrive to buy the item they want; it has been sold.

So, where then to waste time? Searching in TTC for something that may not actually be there? Or running from guild to guild and taking what you find at the time?

Additionally, there seems to be a view that everything is available at guild traders all of the time. This is simply not true.

Aurielle wrote: »

As an alternative to a centralized AH, I’d love it if TTC could be integrated into the game. LIVE listings. You’d still have to travel to each guild trader, still have to join trading guilds, but no more alt tabbing to search a website littered with ads, no more rolling the dice on whether or not someone has already snatched the good deal listed six hours ago that you found on TTC, etc.

Live listings of every item currently available.
Live updates of every new listing.
Live updates of every sold listing.

The performance impact would be huge. Anyone that has loaded 'lib.historie' data from a new and large guild will already know the impact that this has, as a once-off event.

You’d still have to travel to each guild trader, still have to join trading guilds

Even with an incorporated TTC; or a new AH?

no more rolling the dice on whether or not someone has already snatched the good deal listed six hours ago

If you still have to travel to the trader, then you still risk it not being there. Maybe I missed something subtle?

Also this 'good deal' is likely to be someone that didn't know what a 'reasonable price' was and simply listed it at a price that was 'acceptable' to them, otherwise they would have listed it at some other price...no?
TTC allows for flippers to 'snatch' 'good deals' like this and inflate the price for their own reasons.

For me, the biggest and simplest change would be to include the features currently available in Awesome Guild Store.
The ability to refine the search features will provide some real time savings. If you are simply looking for one item, it is literally 5 seconds at every trader.
AGS will retain your search settings and start as soon as you open the trader window. You know almost instantly, if that trader has what you are looking for.

This makes the concept of traveling 'from trader to trader' way more practical.

Twohothardware · September 2

xilfxlegion wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

The guild trader system we have now is nothing more than a large gold sink and it’s the same handful of guilds that control the prime trader locations.

A central auction house would work much better for the general player base. It would eliminate the running around searching dozens of traders to locate an item or compare prices, everything would be priced more competitively, your items would sell much faster, and no more weekly guild fees.

show us any sort of proof that the market is controlled by a handful of guilds.

even in the prime trading spots guilds lose their bids often and other guilds are in place.

and a central auction house would have the opposite effect - there would be no competition because central auction houses are easy to control if you have enough gold.

On PlayStation it's the same handful of guilds every week that take the trader locations in Deshaan which is the #1 spot followed by Grahtwood and Stormhaven. Those guilds do not lose their bids often. That's why those guilds are able to charge weekly dues of like 25,000 gold.

And what are you talking about no competition in a central auction house? If someone with a bunch of gold wants to buy up an item to list it for a higher price they can do that right now.

kargen27 · September 3

Twohothardware wrote: »

xilfxlegion wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

The guild trader system we have now is nothing more than a large gold sink and it’s the same handful of guilds that control the prime trader locations.

A central auction house would work much better for the general player base. It would eliminate the running around searching dozens of traders to locate an item or compare prices, everything would be priced more competitively, your items would sell much faster, and no more weekly guild fees.

show us any sort of proof that the market is controlled by a handful of guilds.

even in the prime trading spots guilds lose their bids often and other guilds are in place.

and a central auction house would have the opposite effect - there would be no competition because central auction houses are easy to control if you have enough gold.

On PlayStation it's the same handful of guilds every week that take the trader locations in Deshaan which is the #1 spot followed by Grahtwood and Stormhaven. Those guilds do not lose their bids often. That's why those guilds are able to charge weekly dues of like 25,000 gold.

And what are you talking about no competition in a central auction house? If someone with a bunch of gold wants to buy up an item to list it for a higher price they can do that right now.

How is someone going to visit over 200 locations to buy up enough of one item that they will be able to control price?

Twohothardware · September 3

kargen27 wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

xilfxlegion wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

The guild trader system we have now is nothing more than a large gold sink and it’s the same handful of guilds that control the prime trader locations.

A central auction house would work much better for the general player base. It would eliminate the running around searching dozens of traders to locate an item or compare prices, everything would be priced more competitively, your items would sell much faster, and no more weekly guild fees.

show us any sort of proof that the market is controlled by a handful of guilds.

even in the prime trading spots guilds lose their bids often and other guilds are in place.

and a central auction house would have the opposite effect - there would be no competition because central auction houses are easy to control if you have enough gold.

On PlayStation it's the same handful of guilds every week that take the trader locations in Deshaan which is the #1 spot followed by Grahtwood and Stormhaven. Those guilds do not lose their bids often. That's why those guilds are able to charge weekly dues of like 25,000 gold.

And what are you talking about no competition in a central auction house? If someone with a bunch of gold wants to buy up an item to list it for a higher price they can do that right now.

How is someone going to visit over 200 locations to buy up enough of one item that they will be able to control price?

The same way they're going to spend all day buying up one item from the entire player base listing it in a central auction house. Controlling the price of rare items in the current guild trader system we have now is actually easier than in a central auction house where you have infinitely more eyes on what's being listed for sale.

TaSheen · September 3

Twohothardware wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

xilfxlegion wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

The guild trader system we have now is nothing more than a large gold sink and it’s the same handful of guilds that control the prime trader locations.

A central auction house would work much better for the general player base. It would eliminate the running around searching dozens of traders to locate an item or compare prices, everything would be priced more competitively, your items would sell much faster, and no more weekly guild fees.

show us any sort of proof that the market is controlled by a handful of guilds.

even in the prime trading spots guilds lose their bids often and other guilds are in place.

and a central auction house would have the opposite effect - there would be no competition because central auction houses are easy to control if you have enough gold.

On PlayStation it's the same handful of guilds every week that take the trader locations in Deshaan which is the #1 spot followed by Grahtwood and Stormhaven. Those guilds do not lose their bids often. That's why those guilds are able to charge weekly dues of like 25,000 gold.

And what are you talking about no competition in a central auction house? If someone with a bunch of gold wants to buy up an item to list it for a higher price they can do that right now.

How is someone going to visit over 200 locations to buy up enough of one item that they will be able to control price?

The same way they're going to spend all day buying up one item from the entire player base listing it in a central auction house. Controlling the price of rare items in the current guild trader system we have now is actually easier than in a central auction house where you have infinitely more eyes on what's being listed for sale.

Yeah, this was my experience in both WoW and RIFT. This was over a decade ago.... so things might be different now (okay, almost TWO decades for WoW....) But generally, back then, those who tried to corner the market on a given server might accomplish it for a week.... but then it all fell down around their ankles.

It COULD be done in those games - for a while. Here, it might be less than easy, I don't know, because I actually don't interact with the trader system much.

kargen27 · September 3

Twohothardware wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

xilfxlegion wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

The guild trader system we have now is nothing more than a large gold sink and it’s the same handful of guilds that control the prime trader locations.

A central auction house would work much better for the general player base. It would eliminate the running around searching dozens of traders to locate an item or compare prices, everything would be priced more competitively, your items would sell much faster, and no more weekly guild fees.

show us any sort of proof that the market is controlled by a handful of guilds.

even in the prime trading spots guilds lose their bids often and other guilds are in place.

and a central auction house would have the opposite effect - there would be no competition because central auction houses are easy to control if you have enough gold.

On PlayStation it's the same handful of guilds every week that take the trader locations in Deshaan which is the #1 spot followed by Grahtwood and Stormhaven. Those guilds do not lose their bids often. That's why those guilds are able to charge weekly dues of like 25,000 gold.

And what are you talking about no competition in a central auction house? If someone with a bunch of gold wants to buy up an item to list it for a higher price they can do that right now.

How is someone going to visit over 200 locations to buy up enough of one item that they will be able to control price?

The same way they're going to spend all day buying up one item from the entire player base listing it in a central auction house. Controlling the price of rare items in the current guild trader system we have now is actually easier than in a central auction house where you have infinitely more eyes on what's being listed for sale.

Okay explain how having to visit 200 different locations is easier than visiting one. You can't just visit them all once and be done. You have to monitor all 200 locations to catch any new item posted. With one location two or three people can sit on the market 24/7 and as soon as an item is listed grab it. If they aren't first to get it that is okay it is still gone. After several days of grabbing everything they can they list two or three at an extremely high price. If those sell great but that isn't really expected of the first items posted.
The idea is post three or so at the really high price then post one or two say 10% less than that really high price. Players only have the really high price to compare to so they see what they think is a bargain. When those sell list two more while still looking for anybody listing something that undercuts your price. Easy to do in one location and has been done many times.

Can't happen with over 200 locations to visit. No way a few people can monitor that many traders around the clock.

Pevey · September 3

Lots of traders spend their eso time trying to corner the market on relatively rare items, and they openly talk about it. A YouTube content creator who goes by Arttea talked about exactly how she does it in a video, down to having TTC tabs open for each item she’s trading and refreshing them to find the newest listings. If the price for a new listing is market average or below, she buys it and marks it up. This is not a conspiracy theory or some kind of secret. This is the trading game for lots of players, at least on PC.

I’m not saying I’m in favor of a single auction house, but let’s not pretend the guild trader system somehow magically prevents this kind of market manipulation.