To be honest, no one can really say if there are no plans of adding a class change token or not considering even if there were.... Zenimax wouldn't tell us until it was about ready to be added to the game (just like they do everything else). And a quote from over a year ago stating that they "do not have any plans on implementing class changes tokens at this time" kind of proves that even more. And things like the addition of class leveling achievements could even be one of the first steps to adding one for all we know.You can say whatever you want, but the fact remains, but the fact remains that ZOS has no plans to introduce this feature, no matter how much you get outraged about it and try to prove otherwise.
To be honest, I'm tired of telling everyone the same thing.
And either way, it doesn't change the fact that players are very much able and allowed to voice what kind of things they would like to see added to the game to make their time spent in it more enjoyable. Your own opinion on the requested feature doesn't change that.
Yep, people who are that concerned about playing what's meta already have alts of every class anyway so I don't see how that argument has any weight. I mean, seriously.... where in any of these threads about class change tokens have you seen someone say "I want class change tokens so I can change to the meta one every update"? I know I haven't seen it. Because again, the people that worry about what's meta already have 20+ characters or whatever the maximum is now of every single class and their magicka/stamina/hybrid versions.FelisCatus wrote: »changing your class every time there's a new meta, or you get nerfed, isn't the answer. Now I'm not saying that they didn't break necro, or that they're not going to nerf arcanist(because they probably will, that's just the pattern), but feeling compelled to change and being given the opportunity to regardless of what the cost is is likely something they want to avoid.
People switch to their levelled alts every new meta a class change would not make a difference because it would likely be barred behind a high price. So flavour of the month meta alts are "worse for the community" than a class change token would ever be.
That.... was exactly my point. Since you claimed:No one knows the plans of ZOS, only they themselves.
As if you do in fact know the plans of ZOS. And then I just followed it up with information that can further serve as little hints or the beginnings of a class change token, just to strengthen my point that there is indeed no factual proof that they have no plans to introduce the feature.... again, as you claimed.You can say whatever you want, but the fact remains, but the fact remains that ZOS has no plans to introduce this feature, no matter how much you get outraged about it and try to prove otherwise.
To be honest, I'm tired of telling everyone the same thing.
That.... was exactly my point. Since you claimed:No one knows the plans of ZOS, only they themselves.As if you do in fact know the plans of ZOS. And then I just followed it up with information that can further serve as little hints or the beginnings of a class change token, just to strengthen my point that there is indeed no factual proof that they have no plans to introduce the feature.... again, as you claimed.You can say whatever you want, but the fact remains, but the fact remains that ZOS has no plans to introduce this feature, no matter how much you get outraged about it and try to prove otherwise.
To be honest, I'm tired of telling everyone the same thing.
Yep, people who are that concerned about playing what's meta already have alts of every class anyway so I don't see how that argument has any weight. I mean, seriously.... where in any of these threads about class change tokens have you seen someone say "I want class change tokens so I can change to the meta one every update"? I know I haven't seen it. Because again, the people that worry about what's meta already have 20+ characters or whatever the maximum is now of every single class and their magicka/stamina/hybrid versions.FelisCatus wrote: »changing your class every time there's a new meta, or you get nerfed, isn't the answer. Now I'm not saying that they didn't break necro, or that they're not going to nerf arcanist(because they probably will, that's just the pattern), but feeling compelled to change and being given the opportunity to regardless of what the cost is is likely something they want to avoid.
People switch to their levelled alts every new meta a class change would not make a difference because it would likely be barred behind a high price. So flavour of the month meta alts are "worse for the community" than a class change token would ever be.
@the1andonlyskwex
But they're not saying that because of nerfs or because those classes are no longer meta, and definitely not because they desire the ability to swap to the meta at will at any time.... they're saying it because the classes had terrible reworks to fundamental skills that Zenimax chose to ignore feedback about and put live anyway. GLS, templar jabs, and there's even people who seriously abandoned their nightblades because of the Grim Focus permaglow, some who I know now wish for class change tokens because of that fact. And templars are still one of the best healers (I have never seen one being the bottom of anything, actually) and nightblades are still the best gank class around.... they are both very far from being irrelevant to the meta (I won't even bring necromancer into this fully because that class is actually a hot mess and has a whole nother level of problems and I'll be here all day if I do).
And again, those actual meta chasers that you are so worried about.... well, they already have maxed versions of every class. I assure you, those are the last people desiring/in need of class change tokens.
FelisCatus wrote: »FelisCatus wrote: »This is basically how I feel about my main character and trying to explain it to people who are happy having a bunch of characters is pointless, I've learned. But yeah.... I want to do the content on him and build him up, not an alt just because I don't enjoy his class anymore after Zenimax changed it and/or the way combat works.FelisCatus wrote: »I don't want to play on my alts. It's not a matter of lazy as they're all levelled and good to go. It's a matter of connection. I don't care for them and there seems to be no way to make me have the same level of connection to them when my whole ESO journey has been done with my main. All those years, hours, moments, experiencing zones, dungeons, quests, PVP, guilds, housing, etc for the first time. Good or bad have all been with my main. You can't replicate that sort of emotional attachment. So don't try force me to, I will never have the same connection to an alt that I have with my main.They could easily prevent this kind of behavior by having a limit on how often someone can purchase a class change token. And you could, you know, always just play with people who are there to progress within the game AND have fun without stressing everyone out about tiny percentage differences in DPS/healing.And if they ever do, I hope they're more expensive than crown houses, because I, for one, do not want compelled to change class to fit a meta.
When ZOS arbitrarily changes how a class fundamentally works (looking at you necromancer, with the mega thread that's been on the top of the forums for weeks now) when no one asked because they "know better" it really drives home the need for a class change token. I reckon it won't belong before they do something to Arcanist.
Ironically, you just stated why they're not likely to ever do it.
changing your class every time there's a new meta, or you get nerfed, isn't the answer. Now I'm not saying that they didn't break necro, or that they're not going to nerf arcanist(because they probably will, that's just the pattern), but feeling compelled to change and being given the opportunity to regardless of what the cost is is likely something they want to avoid.
That said, at least you're not in my boat. I'm a magsorc. No one wants a fricking magsorc. At least EC cro is still a thing.
People switch to their levelled alts every new meta a class change would not make a difference because it would likely be barred behind a high price. So flavour of the month meta alts are "worse for the community" than a class change token would ever be.
Although I don't think players should volunteer themselves as judge, jury and executioner for what is "good" or "bad" for the community when your take is completely subjective. It also comes across as domineering and condescending to a lot of people who don't follow the meta or don't care about it. Some people just care about roleplaying (shock - in an mmorpg).
FelisCatus wrote: »People switch to their levelled alts every new meta a class change would not make a difference because it would likely be barred behind a high price. So flavour of the month meta alts are "worse for the community" than a class change token would ever be.
Although I don't think players should volunteer themselves as judge, jury and executioner for what is "good" or "bad" for the community when your take is completely subjective. It also comes across as domineering and condescending to a lot of people who don't follow the meta or don't care about it. Some people just care about roleplaying (shock - in an mmorpg).
People concerned about role play don't give two craps about what their character actually is. I've role played with vampires and demons in games that have neither, and it doesn't matter, it's thst character's story.
I'm not rationalizing anything, I'm simply sharing the actual stance the majority of players I know and speak to personally have. Now, I'm not saying no one would use a class change token to swap to a class that's not entirely garbage and hasn't had fundamental skills butchered by Zenimax.... but I am saying that the majority asking for them would not in fact use class change tokens regularly to do so, and I think that's the part you and another person missed. A reminder of what I said and the way I phrased it:the1andonlyskwex wrote: »You can rationalize it all you want. I can virtually guarantee that at least half of the people complaining are more concerned about their favorite abilities getting nerfed than they are about whatever cosmetic change they're also complaining about..
And there's plenty of ways to limit the class change token so that it wouldn't be abused, but still allow players the option to bring life back into their ESO experience. I've said it many times on this site, but I do think there should be a limit on how often one can buy a token. I think it should only allow a player to change to classes they have in fact leveled to 50. I think the class change should set the class skill lines to 1, just like a new character would. But using meta chasers as an excuse to not add such a thing will never be reasoning I can agree with. I'll always be on the side of players who have simply had their love for the game negatively impacted by questionable changes to animations, visuals, and the feel of the bread+butter skills of their class.... and I definitely won't be stressing about the part of the playerbase that are going to meta chase with or without a class change token and say other players should go without because of them.I mean, seriously.... where in any of these threads about class change tokens have you seen someone say "I want class change tokens so I can change to the meta one every update"?
…still allow players the option to bring life back into their ESO experience. I've said it many times on this site, but I do think there should be a limit on how often one can buy a token. I think it should only allow a player to change to classes they have in fact leveled to 50. I think the class change should set the class skill lines to 1, just like a new character would. But using meta chasers as an excuse to not add such a thing will never be reasoning I can agree with. I'll always be on the side of players who have simply had their love for the game negatively impacted by questionable changes to animations, visuals, and the feel of the bread+butter skills of their class.... and I definitely won't be stressing about the part of the playerbase that are going to meta chase with or without a class change token and say other players should go without because of them.
I'll be ignoring this thread from now on though, it's getting a bit too repetitive.
…still allow players the option to bring life back into their ESO experience. I've said it many times on this site, but I do think there should be a limit on how often one can buy a token. I think it should only allow a player to change to classes they have in fact leveled to 50. I think the class change should set the class skill lines to 1, just like a new character would. But using meta chasers as an excuse to not add such a thing will never be reasoning I can agree with. I'll always be on the side of players who have simply had their love for the game negatively impacted by questionable changes to animations, visuals, and the feel of the bread+butter skills of their class.... and I definitely won't be stressing about the part of the playerbase that are going to meta chase with or without a class change token and say other players should go without because of them.
I'll be ignoring this thread from now on though, it's getting a bit too repetitive.
I totally agree. I quit playing the game because I hated my character from launch and they added the class I wanted after. But I’m not playing 24/24 ESO, so rediscovering the map, doing all quests again, re-do all my crafting… It’s a big no no for me. Yes I could just create an alt and rush everything, but where is the fun?
I don’t care about Meta skills. I just want to enjoy the Elder Scrolls Universe.
Obviously, the people who wish to have a class change token are the ones who don't want to run alts. So saying that class change tokens would harm the revenue generated from people creating alts is meaningless.
There are also players who would love class tokens who would otherwise be spending nothing.I disagree. There are players who at present create alts and buy upgrades like skyshards, skill points, guild skill lines, and mount training etc but who would in future just buy class change tokens.
xylena_lazarow wrote: »There are also players who would love class tokens who would otherwise be spending nothing.I disagree. There are players who at present create alts and buy upgrades like skyshards, skill points, guild skill lines, and mount training etc but who would in future just buy class change tokens.
xylena_lazarow wrote: »There are also players who would love class tokens who would otherwise be spending nothing.I disagree. There are players who at present create alts and buy upgrades like skyshards, skill points, guild skill lines, and mount training etc but who would in future just buy class change tokens.
That may well be true, but it doesn't negate my rejection of the claim that "saying that class change tokens would harm the revenue generated from people creating alts is meaningless". Whatever that particular financial implication is, it's far from meaningless.
Ultimately, ZOS have to do a cost-benefit analysis of making such a change, and my hunch is that the number of players who they think would take advantage of such tokens at a price that made it worthwhile for ZOS when set against the overall revenue implications of the change means that the design, development, testing, and subsequent customer support costs aren't considered sufficient to justify the benefits, which would explain why they haven't done it, and currently have no plans to do it. If you think it's a financial win/win for them then why do you think they haven't done it?
LatentBuzzard wrote: »xylena_lazarow wrote: »There are also players who would love class tokens who would otherwise be spending nothing.I disagree. There are players who at present create alts and buy upgrades like skyshards, skill points, guild skill lines, and mount training etc but who would in future just buy class change tokens.
That may well be true, but it doesn't negate my rejection of the claim that "saying that class change tokens would harm the revenue generated from people creating alts is meaningless". Whatever that particular financial implication is, it's far from meaningless.
Ultimately, ZOS have to do a cost-benefit analysis of making such a change, and my hunch is that the number of players who they think would take advantage of such tokens at a price that made it worthwhile for ZOS when set against the overall revenue implications of the change means that the design, development, testing, and subsequent customer support costs aren't considered sufficient to justify the benefits, which would explain why they haven't done it, and currently have no plans to do it. If you think it's a financial win/win for them then why do you think they haven't done it?
Your position is provably wrong.
Prior to alliance change tokens if a player wanted to fight with a different alliance then they would have to create a new character in that desired alliance. According to you that means that people would have created alts and then bought skyshards, guild levels etc. and by creating alliance change tokens ZOS gave up those sales in exchange for sales of alliance change tokens. So if ZOS believes that it's worth selling alliance change tokens rather than forcing players to create alts, then there's no argument for saying that it wouldn't be worth them doing the same for a class change token.
…still allow players the option to bring life back into their ESO experience. I've said it many times on this site, but I do think there should be a limit on how often one can buy a token. I think it should only allow a player to change to classes they have in fact leveled to 50. I think the class change should set the class skill lines to 1, just like a new character would. But using meta chasers as an excuse to not add such a thing will never be reasoning I can agree with. I'll always be on the side of players who have simply had their love for the game negatively impacted by questionable changes to animations, visuals, and the feel of the bread+butter skills of their class.... and I definitely won't be stressing about the part of the playerbase that are going to meta chase with or without a class change token and say other players should go without because of them.
I'll be ignoring this thread from now on though, it's getting a bit too repetitive.
I totally agree. I quit playing the game because I hated my character from launch and they added the class I wanted after. But I’m not playing 24/24 ESO, so rediscovering the map, doing all quests again, re-do all my crafting… It’s a big no no for me. Yes I could just create an alt and rush everything, but where is the fun?
I don’t care about Meta skills. I just want to enjoy the Elder Scrolls Universe.
Then why would you rush anyway? Just start over with a new character, play through the game in order to do what you want to do, namely enjoy the Elder Scrolls Universe.
OtarTheMad wrote: »This thread needs to stay dead lol. (...)
Solid_Metal wrote: »another yearly login to the forum just to complain about class change token, will back to the game if theres class change token
thats it, see ya guys again next year
Solid_Metal wrote: »another yearly login to the forum just to complain about class change token, will back to the game if theres class change token
thats it, see ya guys again next year
Now this is real commitment! Hats off!