What does it matter what other people get? Do the players who are doing overland as is actually care what other people get? Would someone who only casually plays ESO (which no one on the forums is a casual player, being here is an act of commitment to the game much higher than many players will ever strive for) even care about what their own character has?
What does it matter what other people get? Do the players who are doing overland as is actually care what other people get? Would someone who only casually plays ESO (which no one on the forums is a casual player, being here is an act of commitment to the game much higher than many players will ever strive for) even care about what their own character has?
Discussing this in a circle doesn't accomplish much, but these points are likely things ZOS is mulling over, and I can imagine that some of them are like you in expressing these concerns, but please elaborate on why you feel that if this sort of reward was given, how would it negatively impact people who wouldn't use the harder difficulty?
SilverBride wrote: »
It has been the same for Public Dungeons. The group event boss in the Silorn Public Dungeon is so difficult that players are having a hard time finding anyone who will group for it.
Every World Boss and Story Boss and and now Public Dungeon group event Boss has gotten progressively more difficult, starting with High Isle. Unless we tell them that this is NOT what anyone wants I'm afraid this trend will keep going.
spartaxoxo wrote: »Increased EXP and Gold would be both be necessary at the very least, so that players aren't punished for using any vet option.
For example (and these numbers are made up to illustrate the point) in 1 minutes on normal I can kill 2 wolves for a total of 10 coin and 20 exp. But on vet I can only kill 1. Then in that 1 minute I would get 5 coin and 10 exp. But if they were under a modifier then I could get the same 10 coin and 20 exp.
SilverBride wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »Increased EXP and Gold would be both be necessary at the very least, so that players aren't punished for using any vet option.
For example (and these numbers are made up to illustrate the point) in 1 minutes on normal I can kill 2 wolves for a total of 10 coin and 20 exp. But on vet I can only kill 1. Then in that 1 minute I would get 5 coin and 10 exp. But if they were under a modifier then I could get the same 10 coin and 20 exp.
How can they be punished for using something they asked for?
There is very little chance of a veteran overland anyway, so it's a moot point.
spartaxoxo wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »How can they be punished for using something they asked for?
By placing unnecessary penalties for using it.
If a player wants to do more difficult content, should they be rewarded less gold and exp because fights took longer?
Also, "It is wrong however to reward players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for." They still need to actually do the content. Sort of like asking ZOS to make changes to an upcoming set on PTS, the set getting changes (a good joke, I know) and claiming the set was given to them, when in reality they still need to actually do the content.
Please elaborate on your thoughts that, if a player is doing overland content at a higher difficulty, why they should then fall behind other players who are doing the same content on normal because combat encounters take longer and thus increase the time between combat rewards?
Eh, I do care what others who aren't happy get - because those who aren't happy, and have no belief they'll ever BE happy in the game if overland doesn't get a difficulty boost of some sort, won't stay in the game (and I'm aware a lot have left already) and so the game itself will have a shorter life.
SilverBride wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »How can they be punished for using something they asked for?
By placing unnecessary penalties for using it.
It's not a penalty to get something a player asked for... increased difficulty. It is wrong however to reward those players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for.
And there's no factual evidence of that. Or the opposite.
SilverBride wrote: »I seriously doubt that players would go back and just kill trash mobs once the story has been completed. These zones would be dead.
SilverBride wrote: »If a player wants to do more difficult content, should they be rewarded less gold and exp because fights took longer?
Also, "It is wrong however to reward players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for." They still need to actually do the content. Sort of like asking ZOS to make changes to an upcoming set on PTS, the set getting changes (a good joke, I know) and claiming the set was given to them, when in reality they still need to actually do the content.
Please elaborate on your thoughts that, if a player is doing overland content at a higher difficulty, why they should then fall behind other players who are doing the same content on normal because combat encounters take longer and thus increase the time between combat rewards?
I do not support any difficulty options if there are increased rewards for it. That's being doubly rewarded and is not fair to the rest of the playerbase.
SilverBride wrote: »If a player wants to do more difficult content, should they be rewarded less gold and exp because fights took longer?
Also, "It is wrong however to reward players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for." They still need to actually do the content. Sort of like asking ZOS to make changes to an upcoming set on PTS, the set getting changes (a good joke, I know) and claiming the set was given to them, when in reality they still need to actually do the content.
Please elaborate on your thoughts that, if a player is doing overland content at a higher difficulty, why they should then fall behind other players who are doing the same content on normal because combat encounters take longer and thus increase the time between combat rewards?
I do not support any difficulty options if there are increased rewards for it. That's being doubly rewarded and is not fair to the rest of the playerbase.
I don't care about rewards, I simply want to have fun. However, I truly don't think it's that big of a deal if players get Epic-quality gear instead of Rare, because it's so easy to upgrade anyway. Same with gold - no one has ever had their mind blown by overland gold gains. I think it's probably best to let people feel like they're getting something for turning things up a notch rather than shutting them down and tanking the feature altogether.
colossalvoids wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »If a player wants to do more difficult content, should they be rewarded less gold and exp because fights took longer?
Also, "It is wrong however to reward players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for." They still need to actually do the content. Sort of like asking ZOS to make changes to an upcoming set on PTS, the set getting changes (a good joke, I know) and claiming the set was given to them, when in reality they still need to actually do the content.
Please elaborate on your thoughts that, if a player is doing overland content at a higher difficulty, why they should then fall behind other players who are doing the same content on normal because combat encounters take longer and thus increase the time between combat rewards?
I do not support any difficulty options if there are increased rewards for it. That's being doubly rewarded and is not fair to the rest of the playerbase.
I don't care about rewards, I simply want to have fun. However, I truly don't think it's that big of a deal if players get Epic-quality gear instead of Rare, because it's so easy to upgrade anyway. Same with gold - no one has ever had their mind blown by overland gold gains. I think it's probably best to let people feel like they're getting something for turning things up a notch rather than shutting them down and tanking the feature altogether.
This thinking is probably based on a notion that it's what players are asking for here, being immersed etc. so an ask for a reward for the effort spent looks iffy. This ignores game design and how rewards are structured to reward time and effort depending on difficulty levels. As previously said by another user it's at the very least as simple as two times more exp and gold for 2 times the "time to kill" we're getting potentially or simply following a pattern we already have with difficulty and rewards to it like blue-green to purple drops.
The thing ignored also is that difficult overland option isn't made for a bunch of forum users to stop complaining, if it was to be implemented it would be a game system which would obey the game's ruleset and overall design structure. There should be incentives for new players, existing ones and for ones who they potentially want to return. They would also want existing non vet players to at least try it out same as with dungeons, pvp and trials, as a lot of people aren't even aware it's something they might potentially like - me being perfect example of it as a single player andy who bought eso to read new lore books and got baited into pvp and pve "endgame" by events, skins to hide vamp etc. and I loved it, thanks to that structure.
colossalvoids wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »If a player wants to do more difficult content, should they be rewarded less gold and exp because fights took longer?
Also, "It is wrong however to reward players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for." They still need to actually do the content. Sort of like asking ZOS to make changes to an upcoming set on PTS, the set getting changes (a good joke, I know) and claiming the set was given to them, when in reality they still need to actually do the content.
Please elaborate on your thoughts that, if a player is doing overland content at a higher difficulty, why they should then fall behind other players who are doing the same content on normal because combat encounters take longer and thus increase the time between combat rewards?
I do not support any difficulty options if there are increased rewards for it. That's being doubly rewarded and is not fair to the rest of the playerbase.
I don't care about rewards, I simply want to have fun. However, I truly don't think it's that big of a deal if players get Epic-quality gear instead of Rare, because it's so easy to upgrade anyway. Same with gold - no one has ever had their mind blown by overland gold gains. I think it's probably best to let people feel like they're getting something for turning things up a notch rather than shutting them down and tanking the feature altogether.
This thinking is probably based on a notion that it's what players are asking for here, being immersed etc. so an ask for a reward for the effort spent looks iffy. This ignores game design and how rewards are structured to reward time and effort depending on difficulty levels. As previously said by another user it's at the very least as simple as two times more exp and gold for 2 times the "time to kill" we're getting potentially or simply following a pattern we already have with difficulty and rewards to it like blue-green to purple drops.
The thing ignored also is that difficult overland option isn't made for a bunch of forum users to stop complaining, if it was to be implemented it would be a game system which would obey the game's ruleset and overall design structure. There should be incentives for new players, existing ones and for ones who they potentially want to return. They would also want existing non vet players to at least try it out same as with dungeons, pvp and trials, as a lot of people aren't even aware it's something they might potentially like - me being perfect example of it as a single player andy who bought eso to read new lore books and got baited into pvp and pve "endgame" by events, skins to hide vamp etc. and I loved it, thanks to that structure.
Understandable, and if you looked back far enough, you would see that I campaigned against rewards for increased challenge. However, do we honestly believe that it's really that big of a deal to get a slightly better bit of gear, slightly more gold and/or slightly more experience? I don't think that it is. But I do think that some people will have a problem with it and that could act as a speedbump to getting the feature implemented.
Possibly the best idea would be to start with no rewards, keep the feature in live, public testing for some time, and then when people are comfortable with it, add some minor reward. Again, it makes no difference to me whatsoever but obviously there are people who expect this sort of thing.
spartaxoxo wrote: »colossalvoids wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »If a player wants to do more difficult content, should they be rewarded less gold and exp because fights took longer?
Also, "It is wrong however to reward players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for." They still need to actually do the content. Sort of like asking ZOS to make changes to an upcoming set on PTS, the set getting changes (a good joke, I know) and claiming the set was given to them, when in reality they still need to actually do the content.
Please elaborate on your thoughts that, if a player is doing overland content at a higher difficulty, why they should then fall behind other players who are doing the same content on normal because combat encounters take longer and thus increase the time between combat rewards?
I do not support any difficulty options if there are increased rewards for it. That's being doubly rewarded and is not fair to the rest of the playerbase.
I don't care about rewards, I simply want to have fun. However, I truly don't think it's that big of a deal if players get Epic-quality gear instead of Rare, because it's so easy to upgrade anyway. Same with gold - no one has ever had their mind blown by overland gold gains. I think it's probably best to let people feel like they're getting something for turning things up a notch rather than shutting them down and tanking the feature altogether.
This thinking is probably based on a notion that it's what players are asking for here, being immersed etc. so an ask for a reward for the effort spent looks iffy. This ignores game design and how rewards are structured to reward time and effort depending on difficulty levels. As previously said by another user it's at the very least as simple as two times more exp and gold for 2 times the "time to kill" we're getting potentially or simply following a pattern we already have with difficulty and rewards to it like blue-green to purple drops.
The thing ignored also is that difficult overland option isn't made for a bunch of forum users to stop complaining, if it was to be implemented it would be a game system which would obey the game's ruleset and overall design structure. There should be incentives for new players, existing ones and for ones who they potentially want to return. They would also want existing non vet players to at least try it out same as with dungeons, pvp and trials, as a lot of people aren't even aware it's something they might potentially like - me being perfect example of it as a single player andy who bought eso to read new lore books and got baited into pvp and pve "endgame" by events, skins to hide vamp etc. and I loved it, thanks to that structure.
Understandable, and if you looked back far enough, you would see that I campaigned against rewards for increased challenge. However, do we honestly believe that it's really that big of a deal to get a slightly better bit of gear, slightly more gold and/or slightly more experience? I don't think that it is. But I do think that some people will have a problem with it and that could act as a speedbump to getting the feature implemented.
Possibly the best idea would be to start with no rewards, keep the feature in live, public testing for some time, and then when people are comfortable with it, add some minor reward. Again, it makes no difference to me whatsoever but obviously there are people who expect this sort of thing.
I mean if it went live without increased exp and gold gain, it would be a punishment to use it. Because enemies would take longer to kill but give the same exp. I really don't think it should matter if some people have an issue with vet players get the same rewards as they do.
spartaxoxo wrote: »colossalvoids wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »If a player wants to do more difficult content, should they be rewarded less gold and exp because fights took longer?
Also, "It is wrong however to reward players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for." They still need to actually do the content. Sort of like asking ZOS to make changes to an upcoming set on PTS, the set getting changes (a good joke, I know) and claiming the set was given to them, when in reality they still need to actually do the content.
Please elaborate on your thoughts that, if a player is doing overland content at a higher difficulty, why they should then fall behind other players who are doing the same content on normal because combat encounters take longer and thus increase the time between combat rewards?
I do not support any difficulty options if there are increased rewards for it. That's being doubly rewarded and is not fair to the rest of the playerbase.
I don't care about rewards, I simply want to have fun. However, I truly don't think it's that big of a deal if players get Epic-quality gear instead of Rare, because it's so easy to upgrade anyway. Same with gold - no one has ever had their mind blown by overland gold gains. I think it's probably best to let people feel like they're getting something for turning things up a notch rather than shutting them down and tanking the feature altogether.
This thinking is probably based on a notion that it's what players are asking for here, being immersed etc. so an ask for a reward for the effort spent looks iffy. This ignores game design and how rewards are structured to reward time and effort depending on difficulty levels. As previously said by another user it's at the very least as simple as two times more exp and gold for 2 times the "time to kill" we're getting potentially or simply following a pattern we already have with difficulty and rewards to it like blue-green to purple drops.
The thing ignored also is that difficult overland option isn't made for a bunch of forum users to stop complaining, if it was to be implemented it would be a game system which would obey the game's ruleset and overall design structure. There should be incentives for new players, existing ones and for ones who they potentially want to return. They would also want existing non vet players to at least try it out same as with dungeons, pvp and trials, as a lot of people aren't even aware it's something they might potentially like - me being perfect example of it as a single player andy who bought eso to read new lore books and got baited into pvp and pve "endgame" by events, skins to hide vamp etc. and I loved it, thanks to that structure.
Understandable, and if you looked back far enough, you would see that I campaigned against rewards for increased challenge. However, do we honestly believe that it's really that big of a deal to get a slightly better bit of gear, slightly more gold and/or slightly more experience? I don't think that it is. But I do think that some people will have a problem with it and that could act as a speedbump to getting the feature implemented.
Possibly the best idea would be to start with no rewards, keep the feature in live, public testing for some time, and then when people are comfortable with it, add some minor reward. Again, it makes no difference to me whatsoever but obviously there are people who expect this sort of thing.
I mean if it went live without increased exp and gold gain, it would be a punishment to use it. Because enemies would take longer to kill but give the same exp. I really don't think it should matter if some people have an issue with vet players get the same rewards as they do.
I don't think it could be considered a punishment if it's deliberately enabled by the player, but I do think that many people would avoid it if there were no compensation involved
Alternatively, put it up on PTS for a while and let people get used to the idea over there before going live.
colossalvoids wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »If a player wants to do more difficult content, should they be rewarded less gold and exp because fights took longer?
Also, "It is wrong however to reward players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for." They still need to actually do the content. Sort of like asking ZOS to make changes to an upcoming set on PTS, the set getting changes (a good joke, I know) and claiming the set was given to them, when in reality they still need to actually do the content.
Please elaborate on your thoughts that, if a player is doing overland content at a higher difficulty, why they should then fall behind other players who are doing the same content on normal because combat encounters take longer and thus increase the time between combat rewards?
I do not support any difficulty options if there are increased rewards for it. That's being doubly rewarded and is not fair to the rest of the playerbase.
I don't care about rewards, I simply want to have fun. However, I truly don't think it's that big of a deal if players get Epic-quality gear instead of Rare, because it's so easy to upgrade anyway. Same with gold - no one has ever had their mind blown by overland gold gains. I think it's probably best to let people feel like they're getting something for turning things up a notch rather than shutting them down and tanking the feature altogether.
This thinking is probably based on a notion that it's what players are asking for here, being immersed etc. so an ask for a reward for the effort spent looks iffy. This ignores game design and how rewards are structured to reward time and effort depending on difficulty levels. As previously said by another user it's at the very least as simple as two times more exp and gold for 2 times the "time to kill" we're getting potentially or simply following a pattern we already have with difficulty and rewards to it like blue-green to purple drops.
The thing ignored also is that difficult overland option isn't made for a bunch of forum users to stop complaining, if it was to be implemented it would be a game system which would obey the game's ruleset and overall design structure. There should be incentives for new players, existing ones and for ones who they potentially want to return. They would also want existing non vet players to at least try it out same as with dungeons, pvp and trials, as a lot of people aren't even aware it's something they might potentially like - me being perfect example of it as a single player andy who bought eso to read new lore books and got baited into pvp and pve "endgame" by events, skins to hide vamp etc. and I loved it, thanks to that structure.
Understandable, and if you looked back far enough, you would see that I campaigned against rewards for increased challenge. However, do we honestly believe that it's really that big of a deal to get a slightly better bit of gear, slightly more gold and/or slightly more experience? I don't think that it is. But I do think that some people will have a problem with it and that could act as a speedbump to getting the feature implemented.
Possibly the best idea would be to start with no rewards, keep the feature in live, public testing for some time, and then when people are comfortable with it, add some minor reward. Again, it makes no difference to me whatsoever but obviously there are people who expect this sort of thing.
spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »colossalvoids wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »If a player wants to do more difficult content, should they be rewarded less gold and exp because fights took longer?
Also, "It is wrong however to reward players with better rewards just for getting something they asked for." They still need to actually do the content. Sort of like asking ZOS to make changes to an upcoming set on PTS, the set getting changes (a good joke, I know) and claiming the set was given to them, when in reality they still need to actually do the content.
Please elaborate on your thoughts that, if a player is doing overland content at a higher difficulty, why they should then fall behind other players who are doing the same content on normal because combat encounters take longer and thus increase the time between combat rewards?
I do not support any difficulty options if there are increased rewards for it. That's being doubly rewarded and is not fair to the rest of the playerbase.
I don't care about rewards, I simply want to have fun. However, I truly don't think it's that big of a deal if players get Epic-quality gear instead of Rare, because it's so easy to upgrade anyway. Same with gold - no one has ever had their mind blown by overland gold gains. I think it's probably best to let people feel like they're getting something for turning things up a notch rather than shutting them down and tanking the feature altogether.
This thinking is probably based on a notion that it's what players are asking for here, being immersed etc. so an ask for a reward for the effort spent looks iffy. This ignores game design and how rewards are structured to reward time and effort depending on difficulty levels. As previously said by another user it's at the very least as simple as two times more exp and gold for 2 times the "time to kill" we're getting potentially or simply following a pattern we already have with difficulty and rewards to it like blue-green to purple drops.
The thing ignored also is that difficult overland option isn't made for a bunch of forum users to stop complaining, if it was to be implemented it would be a game system which would obey the game's ruleset and overall design structure. There should be incentives for new players, existing ones and for ones who they potentially want to return. They would also want existing non vet players to at least try it out same as with dungeons, pvp and trials, as a lot of people aren't even aware it's something they might potentially like - me being perfect example of it as a single player andy who bought eso to read new lore books and got baited into pvp and pve "endgame" by events, skins to hide vamp etc. and I loved it, thanks to that structure.
Understandable, and if you looked back far enough, you would see that I campaigned against rewards for increased challenge. However, do we honestly believe that it's really that big of a deal to get a slightly better bit of gear, slightly more gold and/or slightly more experience? I don't think that it is. But I do think that some people will have a problem with it and that could act as a speedbump to getting the feature implemented.
Possibly the best idea would be to start with no rewards, keep the feature in live, public testing for some time, and then when people are comfortable with it, add some minor reward. Again, it makes no difference to me whatsoever but obviously there are people who expect this sort of thing.
I mean if it went live without increased exp and gold gain, it would be a punishment to use it. Because enemies would take longer to kill but give the same exp. I really don't think it should matter if some people have an issue with vet players get the same rewards as they do.
I don't think it could be considered a punishment if it's deliberately enabled by the player, but I do think that many people would avoid it if there were no compensation involved
Yeah, it can. How else would someone be punished for using a feature?