PS4 Extremely Frustrating Bugs After Today's Patch

Hawco10

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

Rinlan_Darius wrote: »

What a mockery of the players, as much as possible, no matter how much the update, so surely something breaks in the game. Maybe it's time to start firing employees for such a disgusting attitude to work?

Honestly, that attitude is disgusting. You want people to lose their jobs over a game. So sorry you can't feed your families because a player thinks you should be fired. Really?

Hate to break it to you, but it’s not a game. It’s a business. It’s product is a game. Any business who sells a product has to have accountability and expectations. Both internally to its employees and externally to its customers.
One goes with the other. If one of the two breakdown (such as we have here) then the issue needs to be addressed. Is it a training issue, is it an operational
Issue? Is it a leadership issue ? Is it a performance issue ? Cultural/organizational issue ? Then a plan is put in place to implement improvement. If that means a process improvement followed by a personnel change then that’s what happens.
It’s nothing controversial. Happens globally on a daily business.

Riptide

The logic presented here though, is that they want certain problems fixed, but they want the people who will fix these problems to lose their job...but if they aren't there anymore, who is going to fix these problems? I never understand that line of logic myself.

I think that is the distraction right there. The only folks that are seemingly focusing on end line personnel with razor focus seem to be ZOS’s defenders. It is as fallacious, leading, and manufactures disagreement.

It is the decision makers that are under the spotlight here, and rightfully so. It is not that the drinks are under poured and calls coming to release the bartenders to a life of destitution.

It is the need for either a very substantive change in policy, or the need for a new general manager. That is entirely logical, ethical, and reasonable.

etchedpixels

Goregrinder wrote: »

They're already most likely working 60 hour weeks. That's a lot of time away from their lives and families, but the truth is that will never be enough in the eyes of some consumers. Even if they worked 24 hours a day, 7 days a week straight, some consumers would still have something to complain about. The logic presented here though, is that they want certain problems fixed, but they want the people who will fix these problems to lose their job...but if they aren't there anymore, who is going to fix these problems? I never understand that line of logic myself.

The people who need to get fired are usually not the ones who do. QA people can only do so much when the programming team don't have time to fix the bugs and the new features have been promised by a deadline to customers. These problems usually start at the top.

If the programmers are working 60 hour weeks then the game will suck. Lots of studies show that beyond 40 hours a week productivity crashes, error rates go through the roof. For creative work the number is a chunk lower. Doesn't matter how good they are or how much they care. It's one reason that people writing serious software and properly managed don't get stupid hours.

Elsonso

Raegwyr wrote: »

And what ppl like ZOS_GinaBruno or ZOS_JessicaFolsom are doing during these 60 hours? One post on facebook and twitter account per day, one small post on forum per two-three days... Truly, how hard it is to be a community manager that is not talking with the community.

Hey, those patch notes ain't gonna write themselves!

Actually, I have nothing constructive to add. I have met both of them, which I am sure they regret , and have no idea what they do all day. Whatever it is, it keeps them busy. They seem to have a lot of people that are very busy doing whatever that is. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

As for firing people, experience suggests that most players have no idea what people do at a game studio. If they think they spend the day watching cat videos, I am fine with that, I guess. It isn't like the studio is gonna get right on that request.

Mahabahabtha

Could it be, that it is related to an internal conversion of CITIES to INSTANCES?
I mean, you can ride in to Vivec, into Summerset,
into Rimmen, WITHOUT loading screen. With Greymoor they introduced a special loading screen for cities, ergo, you are entering a new instance. In some cases, craft stations are hidden BEHIND other instances, i.e. an instance within an instance within in an instance (area)....
I mostly experience crashes when I
a: go out of the Graymoor tailor shop
b: go out of the Markath craft area ....
thous crashe are somehow repeatable, but not ever...saying if i go 2 out of 5

Is this a coincidence that I crash 2 of 5 Times when I leave the Tailor-Shop in Solitude ?
Could itbe, that you are only using a standar number in your cross sum chek thats crashing the people ?

COULD IT BE that you hope, someone would comes up with an idea how to resolve your publicity error ?

DawnsLight65

logan_ESO wrote: »

As former PS4 player I feel you pain mates. I've left PS4 2 years ago, and it was a mess already.

@ZOS_GinaBruno your company need to think about a HUGE gift for my friends, like 6 months free sub, free new chapter, refound pre-purchase etc. etc.

Free apex mount and pet or houseguest

Goregrinder

Goregrinder wrote: »

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

Rinlan_Darius wrote: »

What a mockery of the players, as much as possible, no matter how much the update, so surely something breaks in the game. Maybe it's time to start firing employees for such a disgusting attitude to work?

Honestly, that attitude is disgusting. You want people to lose their jobs over a game. So sorry you can't feed your families because a player thinks you should be fired. Really?

They're already most likely working 60 hour weeks. That's a lot of time away from their lives and families, but the truth is that will never be enough in the eyes of some consumers. Even if they worked 24 hours a day, 7 days a week straight, some consumers would still have something to complain about. The logic presented here though, is that they want certain problems fixed, but they want the people who will fix these problems to lose their job...but if they aren't there anymore, who is going to fix these problems? I never understand that line of logic myself.

[Quoted Post Removed]

Those people aren't developers, so they wouldn't be able to spend any of their time fixing any of the games bugs. Their job isn't to answer every person's individual request. They have already made an official announcement on what their plan is, why it's happening, and when to expect a fix. There really isn't anything more to communicate about that issue. We don't really get to determine if someone is or isn't doing their job "properly", since none of us know what their employment contract actually says. ZOS determines that. Clearly, they are doing their jobs properly in the eyes of ZOS.

But community managers have nothing to do with fixing bugs.

Wolfpaw

Goregrinder wrote: »

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

Rinlan_Darius wrote: »

What a mockery of the players, as much as possible, no matter how much the update, so surely something breaks in the game. Maybe it's time to start firing employees for such a disgusting attitude to work?

Honestly, that attitude is disgusting. You want people to lose their jobs over a game. So sorry you can't feed your families because a player thinks you should be fired. Really?

They're already most likely working 60 hour weeks. That's a lot of time away from their lives and families, but the truth is that will never be enough in the eyes of some consumers. Even if they worked 24 hours a day, 7 days a week straight, some consumers would still have something to complain about. The logic presented here though, is that they want certain problems fixed, but they want the people who will fix these problems to lose their job...but if they aren't there anymore, who is going to fix these problems? I never understand that line of logic myself.

A different perspective.

Employment is not forced but a choice, their personal lives is not my problem or care. I would not expect, or want, my clients to concern themselves with my personal life or my employees.

Working 60hours a week is a failure in management, period. I could do the same with my employees, and my clients would recieve the same failed customer service we find here.

Burnout, lack of private & work life balance always has the same result: miserable employees, unsatisfied customers, poor delivery of product, & a loss in growth/profit/reputation.

Instead of burning out my four employees I hire a 5th. I also don't take on larger projects that would stretch or pull my employees from my loyal maintenance clients.

I don't believe in demands for employees to be fired, that should be a company side decision. I have fired employees for service that didn't meet the expectations of my clients and company standards with a dozen qualified applicants ready to start the next day.

I obviously don't work in the gaming or tech industry, but twenty plus years in the service industry has given me insight and experience to provide the best possible service for my clients. Do I hit that mark on every job? No. Will I strive to correct and create safeguards to prevent, always.

Please also remember today's problems are not some one-off blown out by the community, but almost two years of poor service.

Ingenon

Wolfpaw wrote: »

To help reestablish the mutual appreciation and respect between ZOS, Sony, & their customers please share your respectful feedback on the value and importance of this relationship.

Sony Support 1-800-345-7669

https://www.playstation.com/en-us/support/contact-us/

https://www.wikihow.com/Contact-PlayStation

https://mobile.twitter.com/AskPlayStation/

https://mobile.twitter.com/playstation

Since this problem is affecting both Xbox and PS servers, does anyone know the contact information for Xbox Microsoft? I think it would be appropriate for PS players to contact Sony and Xbox players to contact Xbox Microsoft.

Mefromnorway

This company is big million business, if they not do their job its normal they get fired, for people pay for pluss and only get error and bugs it would be better give money to homeless people. If 1 mill sub 1 months they get only about 13 million dollar each months and how much they sell in marked shop ? In psn it stand join game with 16 million user, relly ?.... if so this company should be so rich that server was made of gold insted of a tierd hamster running in wheel for keep server working, this is how it feel with lag.

And who can people write here how much they working ?... this company ESO company only care about get more and more money out of your pocket and with so bad service and ignorering customer they would been bankrupt long time ago if this was company out in the real world like phone company.

Only thing they good at is deleting messeges and ignoring people.

Goregrinder

Wolfpaw wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

Rinlan_Darius wrote: »

What a mockery of the players, as much as possible, no matter how much the update, so surely something breaks in the game. Maybe it's time to start firing employees for such a disgusting attitude to work?

Honestly, that attitude is disgusting. You want people to lose their jobs over a game. So sorry you can't feed your families because a player thinks you should be fired. Really?

They're already most likely working 60 hour weeks. That's a lot of time away from their lives and families, but the truth is that will never be enough in the eyes of some consumers. Even if they worked 24 hours a day, 7 days a week straight, some consumers would still have something to complain about. The logic presented here though, is that they want certain problems fixed, but they want the people who will fix these problems to lose their job...but if they aren't there anymore, who is going to fix these problems? I never understand that line of logic myself.

A different perspective.

Employment is not forced but a choice, their personal lives is not my problem or care. I would not expect, or want, my clients to concern themselves with my personal life or my employees.

Working 60hours a week is a failure in management, period. I could do the same with my employees, and my clients would recieve the same failed customer service we find here.

Burnout, lack of private & work life balance always has the same result: miserable employees, unsatisfied customers, poor delivery of product, & a loss in growth/profit/reputation.

Instead of burning out my four employees I hire a 5th. I also don't take on larger projects that would stretch or pull my employees from my loyal maintenance clients.

I don't believe in demands for employees to be fired, that should be a company side decision. I have fired employees for service that didn't meet the expectations of my clients and company standards with a dozen qualified applicants ready to start the next day.

I obviously don't work in the gaming or tech industry, but twenty plus years in the service industry has given me insight and experience to provide the best possible service for my clients. Do I hit that mark on every job? No. Will I strive to correct and create safeguards to prevent, always.

Please also remember today's problems are not some one-off blown out by the community, but almost two years of poor service.

I know you don't, none of us do. Well, most of us don't. The issue at hand is a certification window issue, and they gave the date the patch will be submitted. Anyone here care to shine a light on the certification process software patches must go through, and any ways a software company can expedite or increase how many patches they can get certified in a year? Is it a problem that throwing more money at it will simply solve?

Mahabahabtha

a million Dollar Company
Core income is dedicated People who sub, buy occassional on Crown shop

or

Core income is, random people , buying a lot in crown store for 3 Months, never seen again after that...

think about from where the core income of ZOS came from...

Elsonso

Mahabahabtha wrote: »

Core income is dedicated People who sub, buy occassional on Crown shop
or
Core income is, random people , buying a lot in crown store for 3 Months, never seen again after that...

think about from where the core income of ZOS came from...

ESO Plus is quite popular, outside of the people in this thread.

So, figure ESO Plus subscribers, Crown Store, and Crown Crate addicted people. This will include "vacationers" who leave, but always return.

Nomads probably make up the largest segment of the millions who have played ESO, but are probably a minority when it comes to revenue.

Just a SWAG.

Riptide

As for firing people, experience suggests that most players have no idea what people do at a game studio. If they think they spend the day watching cat videos, I am fine with that, I guess. It isn't like the studio is gonna get right on that request.

I presume you sense differently about some of us, if you have eyes to see. And as you have no doubt experienced an acquisition and inevitable reorg a quarter or so later, you can understand outright termination isn’t the only way to skin a cat. Shifting portfolios of responsibility, narrowing them over time until they are almost nothing, and then trimming. I’ve seen it countless times in several industries, everyone thinks themselves immune but ultimately none are.

Right now there isn’t much competition for players in the MMO space on consoles. FFXIV and ESO about it. That is going to shift soon - and the timing is going to roughly coincide with the sunsetting of the grace period attendant to any large acquisition. If a shift isn’t done from within, you can well expect it will be done by increments from the parent company when market share bleeds. The quicker the bleeds the speedier the increments. And on this track it will bleed and bleed fast around the end of the summer.

Winter/reorgs are coming.

Elsonso

NVM

Riptide

You mistake who I’m actually talking to and why - but anyhow. Happy Friday, enough of this

joerginger

rafaelcsmaia wrote: »

[snip] In a separate note, you guys need a console PTS asap.

[edited for bashing]

What for? PTS comments are completely ignored and all PTS bugs make it to the live version anyway. So there would be absolutely no difference to the utterly horrid status quo.

Goregrinder

Riptide wrote: »

As for firing people, experience suggests that most players have no idea what people do at a game studio. If they think they spend the day watching cat videos, I am fine with that, I guess. It isn't like the studio is gonna get right on that request.

I presume you sense differently about some of us, if you have eyes to see. And as you have no doubt experienced an acquisition and inevitable reorg a quarter or so later, you can understand outright termination isn’t the only way to skin a cat. Shifting portfolios of responsibility, narrowing them over time until they are almost nothing, and then trimming. I’ve seen it countless times in several industries, everyone thinks themselves immune but ultimately none are.

Right now there isn’t much competition for players in the MMO space on consoles. FFXIV and ESO about it. That is going to shift soon - and the timing is going to roughly coincide with the sunsetting of the grace period attendant to any large acquisition. If a shift isn’t done from within, you can well expect it will be done by increments from the parent company when market share bleeds. The quicker the bleeds the speedier the increments. And on this track it will bleed and bleed fast around the end of the summer.

Winter/reorgs are coming.

STO is on consoles too, have no idea what console player base numbers look like compared to ESO though.

AuraStorm43

mobicera wrote: »

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

mobicera wrote: »

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

Rinlan_Darius wrote: »

What a mockery of the players, as much as possible, no matter how much the update, so surely something breaks in the game. Maybe it's time to start firing employees for such a disgusting attitude to work?

Honestly, that attitude is disgusting. You want people to lose their jobs over a game. So sorry you can't feed your families because a player thinks you should be fired. Really?

Holding people accountable isn't disgusting.
The video game industry is one of the few industries that seems to get away with this kind of stuff.
I assure you if I fail to do my job I will be held accountable, I will be disciplined and if I continue to fail at my job I will be let go, this is life for almost everyone else in the world...
I actually want worse than 1 or 2 people to lose their jobs, I want companies that continue to fail to provide what is advertised to be held accountable.
If this means hitting them financially and hard then so be it, let it serve as a lesson for the future companies.

That is total BS. Telling ZOS to fire people is disgusting. If you don't like the product, don't play it, don't subscribe to it. Talk with your wallet but to ask that ZOS fire people over something so minute is just ridiculous. It's a game, go do something else if you get so uptight over game bugs.

This attitude is why this ongoing state of affairs continues.
ZoS should be held accountable, I have a feeling this is more upper level focus distribution rather than the dev's themselves.
Just note if the dev's aren't given the time or resources to properly do their job it's not their jobs that should be on the line.
If all resources are being pushed into new content and the reapings of the crown crates are not being put back into the game this isn't the dev's fault either.
But it is someone's fault isn't it?
I'm not being unreasonable or uptight to expect accountability and a product working as advertised.
Shall I turn your argument to medicine and see the outcome?

Lets not forget Rich Lambert admitted publicly they rushed content last year despite covid

Devs are on record saying they will continue to shovel out content whether its ready or not

darkelf0311

Zos just said F U to us all no fix intell update 30 at which point tons more stuff will get broken 😢

Stahlor

joerginger wrote: »

rafaelcsmaia wrote: »

[snip] In a separate note, you guys need a console PTS asap.

[edited for bashing]

What for? PTS comments are completely ignored and all PTS bugs make it to the live version anyway. So there would be absolutely no difference to the utterly horrid status quo.

Beside that, they can't even test a simple bug fix before they release it and rather cause a complete mess.

LalMirchi

I'm following this thread with great trepidation. I just got mail that my pre-ordered PS 5 delivery has been pushed back 7 weeks. I was looking forward to making a new ESO+ account and doing things the hard way, no addons and starting afresh.

Well if you get lemons make lemonade so I really hope that in 7 weeks the game might be playable on the PS5.

ceiron

I noticed pc get a patch. We get nothing as usual. Just server tweaks to make the bugs bug out faster lol

mobicera

Has anyone heard anything from Sony or Microsoft about refunds for a non functional product?
Particularly ESO plus...
Just noticed PC gets a patch this week and I almost deleted eso from my system...

MarioMario

Yellow_Monolith

logan_ESO wrote: »

Awesome, I hope others follow suit.

Mefromnorway

Buddy_Cactus wrote: »

logan_ESO wrote: »

Awesome, I hope others follow suit.

Did in 3 accounts 4 days ago,

Destai

Hawco10 wrote: »

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

Rinlan_Darius wrote: »

What a mockery of the players, as much as possible, no matter how much the update, so surely something breaks in the game. Maybe it's time to start firing employees for such a disgusting attitude to work?

Honestly, that attitude is disgusting. You want people to lose their jobs over a game. So sorry you can't feed your families because a player thinks you should be fired. Really?

Hate to break it to you, but it’s not a game. It’s a business. It’s product is a game. Any business who sells a product has to have accountability and expectations. Both internally to its employees and externally to its customers.
One goes with the other. If one of the two breakdown (such as we have here) then the issue needs to be addressed. Is it a training issue, is it an operational
Issue? Is it a leadership issue ? Is it a performance issue ? Cultural/organizational issue ? Then a plan is put in place to implement improvement. If that means a process improvement followed by a personnel change then that’s what happens.
It’s nothing controversial. Happens globally on a daily business.

It's all three and whatever plans they've communicated as improvement efforts have been seemingly discontinued. I believe this because they've communicated no further plans.

Looking back - leadership admitted that they need to address performance and dedicated 2020 to fixing things. They then shifted to WFH, kept the release pace they had before pre-covid while trying to address the technical debt and years-worth of performance complaints. That's some major overextending.

I think they do see the issues, despite their ability to communicate it, else they wouldn't have done a performance year. They had committed to monthly performance updates and it finally felt like things were getting addressed. That was discontinued. Looking at this from a professional lens, there's some personnel and policy changes that need to happen. Personnel wise - I think a leadership change is appropriate from a culture perspective. And process improvement's needed too - how these forums are managed for one, and get a better PTS feedback loop going. There's too many instances of feedback being ignored and major bugs making it into the game, particularly from 2020 onwards.

Elsonso wrote: »

Raegwyr wrote: »

And what ppl like ZOS_GinaBruno or ZOS_JessicaFolsom are doing during these 60 hours? One post on facebook and twitter account per day, one small post on forum per two-three days... Truly, how hard it is to be a community manager that is not talking with the community.

Hey, those patch notes ain't gonna write themselves!

Actually, I have nothing constructive to add. I have met both of them, which I am sure they regret , and have no idea what they do all day. Whatever it is, it keeps them busy. They seem to have a lot of people that are very busy doing whatever that is. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

As for firing people, experience suggests that most players have no idea what people do at a game studio. If they think they spend the day watching cat videos, I am fine with that, I guess. It isn't like the studio is gonna get right on that request.

That's what blows my mind. I've asked this of the CMs so many - what are you guys actually up to? Not in a rude way, but I think maybe the community has misaligned expectations of them - which they could easily clear up. If their job is patch notes and social media management, then just say it right? Most MMO games I've played have really good CMs with a visible presence - most notably in the Guild Wars series. Again, I think it comes down to leadership, they're either not setting the right priorities for the CMs or haven't given them the right training/coaching. So again, perhaps its time for some personnel or policy changes - or both. Either way, too many notice and complain about it for it not to be considered a problem.

This storm will hopefully blow over and the game will improve, but I can't justify having ESO plus until U30 hopefully fixes the issues.

VictarionDayne

ESO never been great but it was a good game once, which is suffering under bad management for years and nearly on the edge of players patience. There is no need to write about what is good or not, what they suppose to do or not. ESO didn’t become the game what it is today in a single day, it took years to build also took years to turned into its current “mind blowing”state for PS4 players.Everthing what ZOS needs to know or do already written many times. There are many reasons to play ESO also much more reasons to not...

Elsonso

Destai wrote: »

This storm will hopefully blow over and the game will improve, but I can't justify having ESO plus until U30 hopefully fixes the issues.

From what I can tell, the "storm" is not about the UI issues, or even the delay in the patch that fixes it. The bug itself is not that world-shattering. Inconvenient, yes, but once you know about it, it isn't like the world has ended. The delay in the patch is easily understandable. We've all faced delays in things simply because too much is happening at the same time. These things are the pebble in your shoe. Irritating, but not the problem.

As I see it, the storm is really about the accumulated weight of all of the issues that have come and gone where ZOS has thumb-fingered the response, or simply not done anything. This little issue will abate, but the next time ZOS messes up, and there will be a next time, it will fire back up right where it left off.