Why is it that only people who have never played magsorc say that magsorc is op?

hassubhai

Explain, because when i see someone say *** like that i just get confused.

Turelus

Everyone says everything is OP, broken, needs nerfing, needs buffing etc.

Just ignore them, focus on what you can do with your class with the abilities and changes give, when a patch comes around provide constructive feedback which will help Wrobel and his team bring your class more in line.

DannyLV702

I main a magic sorc and I've always found them pretty op

Horowonnoe

Magic sorcs are amazing : )

visionality

1st half of the answer: Many people who die to another character class can't imagine that their gameplay is just not very good (maybe just concerning that one class). So the other class must be OP. Typically human, I think.

2nd half of the answer: Magsorc was very popular and easy to play when shields lasted for 20 seconds. A lot of average players (no insult intended) enjoyed playing them due to their high survivability. When shields were nerfed and survivability took a dive, many of them switched to other classes. Those who remained were "hardcore magsorcs" and people who like challenges, and they learned to deal with the reduced shield duration. Ofc many players came back later and new players joined, but generally speaking, the player base for magsorc is indeed a bit OP.

thankyourat

Magicka sorcs are definitely a top tier PvP class. They have been a threat in PvP for over 2 years now. What I think the problem is, is that alot of players have only played one class so when they lose they blame the class and say it's weak and that other classes are over powered, instead of realizing that they lost because they aren't as skilled as they think. It goes both ways as well alot of sorc only players don't realize how good their class is and will say it's weak when in reality it's such a good class

Reefo

visionality wrote: »

1st half of the answer: Many people who die to another character class can't imagine that their gameplay is just not very good (maybe just concerning that one class). So the other class must be OP. Typically human, I think.

2nd half of the answer: Magsorc was very popular and easy to play when shields lasted for 20 seconds. A lot of average players (no insult intended) enjoyed playing them due to their high survivability. When shields were nerfed and survivability took a dive, many of them switched to other classes. Those who remained were "hardcore magsorcs" and people who like challenges, and they learned to deal with the reduced shield duration. Ofc many players came back later and new players joined, but generally speaking, the player base for magsorc is indeed a bit OP.

Shields were never really nerfed for PVP, as it has always been something you had to reapply.

Jitterbug

nerf cloak

Beardimus

Its true man, I say this a lot. Sorcs are OP for easy PvE content, and when people are struggling learning their build etc and Sorc mates burn everything they think they are OP.

I'm stormproof, been told i'm OP a lot, yet I pull 15-18k on the skeleton dummy. I have big burst, and easy stuff melts - but not harder stuff

Mayrael

I main a mag sorc, its powerful class that can kill in few seconds weakest target and flee from rest of the pursuit. Its one of the strongest class but absolutely its not OP. All it requires to be countered is a bit of knowledge about sorcs. Most of the people thinks that sorcs are OP because when you fight with them, most of the time their hp bars wont even move because of shields, so it seems pointless to fight against them. You couldnt be wrong more. With good presure and constant CCs its easy to push them into defensive style of fighting and get them low. The tricky part is to not let them runaway but any stamina toon with bow (like my stamblade) can catch them without problems

pkb16_ESO2

I play a sorc... they are OP especially in 1v1 situations. In 1vX not, there are better class options (stam NB / DK).
But 1v1 mag sorc is king.

Strider_Roshin

I have a magsorc, and I know they're OP. Highest burst with insane survivability, and mobility. There's nothing to sacrifice as a magsorc, and that's what makes them OP.

Jitterbug

I think some of it might be that the basic sorc play hasn't changed much since launch and people who have been playing sorcs for that long are just really, really good at it - so when they solo 4-5 guys in Cyro using LOS (nerf trees!) it's easy to think they are OP when in fact they are just skilled AF.

Morgul667

I main a mag sorcerer and think they are in a good place right now (while i think, they were not before homestead update).

Few sorcerers hit very hard in videos, maybe people take it for granted that everybody hits that hard ?

mag dk is pretty good, stam sorc is amazing, stam dk as well

Many classes are fun to play. I main a mag sorc because it is a style i know better.

thankyourat

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

I have a magsorc, and I know they're OP. Highest burst with insane survivability, and mobility. There's nothing to sacrifice as a magsorc, and that's what makes them OP.

You do have to sacrifice quite a bit of damage to sustain your shields or you are forced to sacrifice a damage set for a sustain set. I wouldn't call the survivability insane it's basically just as survivable as stamblade in open world PvP. I actually think stamblade is more survivable open world fighting outnumbered, with magsorc being more survivable in a 1v1. So they do have to sacrifice quite a bit. Overall I think they are one of the top 3 PvP classes overall with stam dk and stam sorc which are actually 2 classes that don't have to sacrifice anything and then I'll throw magsorc in there because of the destro ultimate, and then stamblade would be just under them the only reason I put magsorc over stamblade is because of the destro ultimate.

Izaki

I main a sorc and they are OP. In PvE and PvP.

SodanTok

For same reason most magscors complain about gankers and procsets.
Shields are so OP if you lack damage and so no problem if you can take them down in what it takes to CC break.

psychotic13

I wouldn't say they are OP, as I feel all classes in the right hands are just as strong if not stronger.

The magsorc is very forgiving though due to shields, you can afford to make mistakes and it's a lot easier to play than say a mDK imo

CatchMeTrolling

That's for almost every class.

TheBonesXXX

hassubhai wrote: »

Explain, because when i see someone say *** like that i just get confused.

People like to play the most complex builds in the game from the start, so when they go against the "standard" of any class, they can see the lack of a toolkit in a specific playstyle.

The reality is that ward stacking is an immensely strong toolkit, I remember when Templars used to be the damage shield kings and had healing + an ability that mad the opposition miss 50% of the time.

People need to stop playing deviants of standard builds until they get good with standard skill sets and toolkits of the classes then they would know how to beat any class.

The template for success in PvP as it is in any game, resource management and how to get your opponent to fumble their resources, you can beat anyone once they don't have any resources left.

Father_X_Zombie

All classes can be OP in the right hands, mag sorc just takes more skill to counter

Minalan

I think a lot of players got used to weaker sorcs and far fewer of them during Dark Brotherhood and Hist. For almost a year, sorcs were basically 'free AP piñatas' at an all stamina party.

One Tam and Homestead brought sorcs back to a top tier PVP class, and lets be honest. No player that mains another class wants to see someone else's class become equally viable and successful. That's human nature.

I think the loudest complainers were used to crit rush 'macro slice' one-combo easy sorc kills, and now they find out that they aren't nearly as good at playing stamina as they thought they were.

danno8

Can't remember, maybe it was @Teargrants or the long gone @Ezareth, but when IC came out they just stopped playing their magicka Sorcerer because they found it to simply be too OP and easy against other players.

HoloYoitsu

danno8 wrote: »

Can't remember, maybe it was @Teargrants or the long gone @Ezareth, but when IC came out they just stopped playing their magicka Sorcerer because they found it to simply be too OP and easy against other players.

That would be neither. Ezareth quit playing sorc when 1.6 hit and he demonstrated how stam blade could do infinite dodge roll. He rolled a stamblade and played that till he quit when IC came out.

Teargrants quit for 6 months to play Overwatch from DB till One Stamriel brought more viable gearing options for sorc.

Thelon

this thread has potential

HoloYoitsu

In response to OP, the whiners are mostly NBs who QQ about Curse pulling them out of stealth. (DKs and Templars can both neutralize half of the Sorc dps kit)

These NBs have the mentality that they should be able to dip out of any fight with the press of a button. With the Haunting Curse change hey find it increasingly hard to do that the way they're used to vs other classes. A big part of that boils down to a L2P issue. For stamblades you just count to 3 after Curse is applied and dodge the Frags that will be coming at you 90% of the time, then you sprint. Any properly specced stamblade will be able to run a sorc OOM of they try chasing it, period. People who don't understand this have never played sorc.

For mageblades Purge and Mist Form pretty much hard counter a sorc's ability to kill you. But skilled mageblades are very few and far between.

thankyourat

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

In response to OP, the whiners are mostly NBs who QQ about Curse pulling them out of stealth. (DKs and Templars can both neutralize half of the Sorc dps kit)

These NBs have the mentality that they should be able to dip out of any fight with the press of a button. With the Haunting Curse change hey find it increasingly hard to do that the way they're used to vs other classes. A big part of that boils down to a L2P issue. For stamblades you just count to 3 after Curse is applied and dodge the Frags that will be coming at you 90% of the time, then you sprint. Any properly specced stamblade will be able to run a sorc OOM of they try chasing it, period. People who don't understand this have never played sorc.

For mageblades Purge and Mist Form pretty much hard counter a sorc's ability to kill you. But skilled mageblades are very few and far between.

Stamblades and magsorcs go back and forth crying at each other. It seems like if you see someone complaining about a stamblade it's a magsorc and if you see someone complaining about a magsorc is a stamblade. I think they just do a good job at countering each other

Lord-Otto

Magsorcs are just a very polarized class.


It's easy to call their strong ranged burst OP when it hits you unprepared. But when you actually pay attention to the Curse and Frag glows, it becomes laughably easy to counter. Just block or dodge once. That's four seconds of preparation wasted.

Same goes for shields. You're not dps'ing them down easily, when sorc goes full defense. But once you realize you get an opening every time the sorc prepares the burst for four seconds, you can just CC when the burst is about to land. This will make the shields expire and then the sorc has only paper armor and the lowest of all HP bars left. Or you can just go full defense yourself until your buddy arrives. Shields don't scale and two halfway competent players are enough to dps them down, annihilating the sorc.

Mobility also looks fantastic on paper. But once a sorc engaged, the mobility drops to zero. Sorcs typically have no snares. They can only gapclose seven meters. They can't sprint and roll easily, and don't always have Major Expedition. Mines force you to stay in place. And Streak is easily countered and burns your magicka. If a sorc has to re-position from an approaching group, he's done for.


So, in summary, the magsorc brings a lot of power to specific circumstances. But when you are witting and exploit his weaknesses, rather than just trying to brute through him, he crumbles. This is why magsorcs are polarized and balanced. They are good, they are strong, they have weaknesses. Without severely overhauling mechanics, you can't nerf them, or magsorc is back to Dark Brotherhood extinction level.
Just leave magsorc alone, now. Focus on other classes.

Ashamray

Well, as a sorc you have to learn2shield. It's not easy to manage all you glowing things and think about curse'n'frags at the same time. But when you finally learned, sorc becomes pretty OP.

Derra

Shieldstacking + minecamping is OP 1v1.
Multicurse is OP Xv1.
Sorc is in a good spot pve wise (the petbuff was insane).

Sorcs have niche scenarios where they excell at - but so does every class. Except for DKs ofc. They only excell at dying slow.

Overall i´d say sorcs are not OP when looking at the class in general. They overperform in certain scenarios due to crutch mechanics. Take away harness + hardened stack / rework healing ward. Take away the self reapplying curse (and replace it with a daedric prey proper dot pve morph).
Suddenly the class will seem much different.

Baconlad

I think templar can be pretty OP against magsorc. Most magplars jump into melee combat and proc the mines. When fighting a magsorc, drop charge and javs and slot:

Eclipse or backlash, darkflare, javelin, and radiant. You can keep you heavy armor on. A sorc in battle spirit has to either dodge roll, reshield, or go full offense to break a flare spam, very OP against them.

The problem against sorcs that i have is when i run against them in open world and dont have my anti sorc set up on. I normally lose to one in that case. Jabs is incredibly weak against shields.