"Nerf cloak" ... But it's stamblade damage that is op ... (explanation)

revonine

Stamblade damage is on par with other stamina builds it's just easier to pull off, much easier. Make stamblades harder to play and the good players will adapt and someone will be back here complaining again.

robkrush

revonine wrote: »

Stamblade damage is on par with other stamina builds it's just easier to pull off, much easier. Make stamblades harder to play and the good players will adapt and someone will be back here complaining again.

Easier to get the first hit, a crit hit.

leepalmer95

robkrush wrote: »

revonine wrote: »

Stamblade damage is on par with other stamina builds it's just easier to pull off, much easier. Make stamblades harder to play and the good players will adapt and someone will be back here complaining again.

Easier to get the first hit, a crit hit.

This thread is 2 months old.

Did none of these guys ever see a properly played magblade this patch, there speed when cloaked is insane.

KundaliniHero

leepalmer95 wrote: »

robkrush wrote: »

revonine wrote: »

Stamblade damage is on par with other stamina builds it's just easier to pull off, much easier. Make stamblades harder to play and the good players will adapt and someone will be back here complaining again.

Easier to get the first hit, a crit hit.

This thread is 2 months old.

Did none of these guys ever see a properly played magblade this patch, there speed when cloaked is insane.

Vampire + Concealed Weapon + Retreating Maneuvers, it's insane how fast you can move. It's fun weaving in and out of enemies, even if they detect you they are going to have a really hard time trying to catch you lol, its certainly great for trolling. I however dont even run that setup anymore on my magblade, let alone vampire. I find my current setup is much better, especially against magika sorcs and 1vx, I can pretty much stand and fight and outlast my opponent.

People who run those kind's of setups are generally pure gank builds, that kind of build is a one trick pony until you have level 10 in Assault, then you can pretty much spam the vampire ultimate over and over again, but you'll have to choose your fights.

I think the nerf train died down on this topic along with IC in general.

Aunatar

Every time I read a post like this, I just remember ONE thing: the only build that gives me issues in PvP is a Stamina NB, either if I'm playing DK, sorc, templar, or even NB.
Why? Takes only 2-3 CHEAP CLASS skills/ultimate (that costs 50) to trigger all the buff/debuff you need, except for one, while doing the highest dmg of the 4 classes, either stamina or magicka

Rylana

Stam nightblade in a nutshell:


Step 1. Chill out somewhere nice and hidden. Wait for prey.
Step 2. Observe prey, find good stalk angle, approach, buff up on approach
Step 3. Unleash 40-50k damage in 2 seconds, collect AP
Step 4. Press dark cloak to go back into stealth.
Step 5. Look for next prey.

Unless someone catches you coming out of stealth on them (hearing you, somehow sensing it? i guess, detect potion, had a friend right next to them to heal them, have supernatural reflexes to pop a healward or something crazy, etc) they are dead. Period.

Its why I rarely play my stamblade anymore, I got bored of it in gank configuration. In the span of one hour last week, I got 52 solo kills, 20 more assisted kills (72 kills in one hour) for 49k or so AP, and died exactly once when i came out on what was actually a group of five with one guy not stealthed. (oops). This was all just running along the Sej/BRK corridor while AD held Sej and EP was trying to take it. Many EP died running there.

To address the 3-4 cloaks thing - yeah, but one or two is all you really need usually, maybe a purge in between if someone keeps cursing or something like that. LOS/Speed/Cloak/roll and with rally running makes a stamblade very very hard to single down quickly, and a blob will usually lose track of it juking and jiving between rocks, going back through them, or other mayhem.

Is cloak op? Not even close. Is stam OP? Absolutely.

Derra

Master_Kas wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

The only thing killing me on my magica NB is mark target or if i *** up because no shadow image hurr durr.

It´s hilarious.

The working counter against cloak is class specific and absolutely overpowered.

No need to nerf cloak. They just need to revisit every counter... Ah well we all know whats going to happen.

Fite meh. I'll only use the useless radiant magelight or detect pot. No mark

I don´t use cloak 1v1. There is no need for it.

Lol okay maybe you don't, but thats your misstake. That is like a sorcerer not using his damageshields in a 1v1. Not exactly but close enough ^^

It´s a non offensive gcd which just does not make sense in a build entirely focused around overpowering an opponent with pure pressure..

Ofc i might need to use it if my opponent has a similar playstyle but if i have to use it i´m in the defensive which i basically don´t want to be in the first place.

Lava_Croft

Just nerf Nightblades to *** so that I can fight something else than Nightblades.

Thanks!

Aunatar

NB just need a tweak: fix ambush (put a minimum distance and/or remove the stun), adjust the tooltip of surprise attack and soul harvest a bit toward similar instant weapon skills like puncture/low slash, or maybe remove Major Fracture from it (NB already have mark target, like stamina DK have burning breath etc and SA already triggers enough buffs like major ward/resolve imho)
As already stated, even if stamblades can pull 20-29 seconds of permacloak with the help of a single potion and 1 magicka regen bonus (stop lying it' not 3/4 cloaks only), cloak is not the problem: the problem is with stamblade's damage and burst.
Nerf cloak too hard and you will literally destroy magicka nightblades, which already aren't in the best spot.
My 2 cents, as a gamer who plays frequently as stamina DK, magicka sorc, magicka/stamina NB, magicka templar (and even magicka DK but sshhh don' tell anybody, I am playing fotm, nerf meh!)

P.S. I want a FLAME NOT PHYSICAL DMG stamina lava whip for my stamina DK!!!

Lucky28

I think the only "Nerf" cloak needs is undoing the change they made in 2.1 where nightblades could no longer be hit and taken out of cloak by single target abilities. that change is what made Cloak op and took alot of skill out of using and countering it's use

Lava_Croft

You mean unfixing Cloak? No thanks. Better fix it some more.

Barlthump

Once again dumping on a class that is supposed to be a stealth burst class. Think of it in real life. Do you expect to survive a fight with someone, when someone stabs a knife through your back? I mean think about it he spends a great deal of time in stealth. Puts himself in an better position to kill you and properly buffs up to kill you cause you have like 16k hp. And you coke here are start saying that ther burst is insane. Did you know that all the stam morphs of the nightblade tree does magic damage and are hence mitigated by CP? Or are you putting 100 points into bastion right away and running into battle with 8k physical damage reduction.OH MY V16 SORC I'M MAKING YOU V16 ASAP

IxskullzxI

KenaPKK wrote: »

Isbilen wrote: »

Sorry but somewhere between the ability to go completely invisible at will with sprint speed, perma-block in light armour, jump off keeps or cliffs and teleport right back up, an unblockable area CC effect, and just in general being better than the other classes at pretty much everything in PvP other than healing, the class just becomes a laughable easy mode.

You exaggerated these, but you can state just the positives of any class and make them sound op.

And your last statement is just hyperbole and logical fallacy. In fact, your whole post is a joke. L2p son.

Except the magicka dk

SemiD4rkness

Barlthump wrote: »

Once again dumping on a class that is supposed to be a stealth burst class. Think of it in real life. Do you expect to survive a fight with someone, when someone stabs a knife through your back? I mean think about it he spends a great deal of time in stealth. Puts himself in an better position to kill you and properly buffs up to kill you cause you have like 16k hp. And you coke here are start saying that ther burst is insane. Did you know that all the stam morphs of the nightblade tree does magic damage and are hence mitigated by CP? Or are you putting 100 points into bastion right away and running into battle with 8k physical damage reduction.OH MY V16 SORC I'M MAKING YOU V16 ASAP

LOL. Stamblades don't even need stealth/cloak to screw any class. 8k ambush 8k surprise attack unblockable fear cheap high insta dmg ultimate and you are debuffed with 100000000000 different effects.

nordickittyhawk

KenaPKK wrote: »

People are complaining that nightblades are OP. They call for cloak nerfs, but their death recap screenshots all show Ambush and Surprise Attack spam...

They are getting rekt by STAMINA damage, which is favored by the game:

• % bonus weapon dmg from medium armor and Flawless DB passives
• weapon dmg glyphs on weapons
• mass availability of weapon crit in itemization
• Hardy CP cutting magic damage with no comparable CP for physical damage

The course of events leading to this irrational witch hunting goes as follows:

• pug gets rekt by stamblade's high damage, is mad
• pug fights a mageblade, who he is able to survive against and even gets low
• pug fails to counter mageblade's cloak, so mageblade is able to escape, accepting that he has lost the fight
• pug wants the kill because GRRRR I GOT REKT BY THAT OTHER NB
• pug writes forum post about op cloak, failing to remember that the stamblade's damage is what caused him to be upset in the first place

People are NOT getting rekt by magicka nightblades' cloak spam or damage.

Magicka nightblades will take the brunt of a cloak nerf, but they are already struggling in PvP right now. Stamina damage is the problem, NOT CLOAK.

A nerf to cloak will NOT change nightblades' dominance in PvP because STAMINA nightblades are the problem, NOT magicka ones.

L2p everyone.

I agree but problem with nbs doing so much dmg is maces and major breach. if you actual nerf the skill. they will be useless in both pve n pvp. i mean do u want more wrecking blowers?

MrGigglypants

KenaPKK wrote: »

SleepyTroll wrote: »

If this is true just lol this is as bad as that guy saying WB was an aoe when really his friend got hit with destructive reach lol people call for nerfs and they don't even know wtf is really going on.

Right??? >.<

tennant94 wrote: »

Preach it brother

rokrdt05 wrote: »

#counterplay
I hope they reconsider any future nerfs to cloak.

Thank you all for the positive responses. This really is a problem with balance... The vocal majority is being irrational. We cannot let their whining influence the game in a detrimental way.

Stamina damage needs to be brought in line (as it always has). Don't let magicka NB die as a casualty.

No stam melee dmg is fine it's high risk high reward. Every class has a dme ability that makes someone else scratch their head at some point. The problem is really people get rest by NB so then they try to do the same thing they think was done to them. Then they run around with 18k health and wonder why they die in 3 seconds.

Sharakor

Sigh, L2P EVERYONE.
Noob #1: NERFZ CLOAK NOW OR I IS QUITZ, refuses to use magelight, detect pots or aoe.
Noob #2: NERFZ WB NOW IS SO OP I WILL QUITZ AND SUE ZENIMAX, wears all light armor, doesn't use block and doesn't even realize that WB is the easiest skill to counter by dancing around or right through the caster.


NERF NERF NERF

Lucky28

Sharakor wrote: »

Sigh, L2P EVERYONE.
Noob #1: NERFZ CLOAK NOW OR I IS QUITZ, refuses to use magelight, detect pots or aoe.
Noob #2: NERFZ WB NOW IS SO OP I WILL QUITZ AND SUE ZENIMAX, wears all light armor, doesn't use block and doesn't even realize that WB is the easiest skill to counter by dancing around or right through the caster.


NERF NERF NERF

The problem with nightblades is ZOS nerfed streak so now you cannot keep the pressure on Nightblades by countering speed with speed. which sucks in itself, they should have never listened to complains of that nature. used to be the counter for one mobility class was the other mobility class which was an actual legitimate counter, detect pots and magelight are cheesy.

the other issue is there are too many nightblades and it gets far too expensive to counter them.

KundaliniHero

Lucky28 wrote: »

Sharakor wrote: »

Sigh, L2P EVERYONE.
Noob #1: NERFZ CLOAK NOW OR I IS QUITZ, refuses to use magelight, detect pots or aoe.
Noob #2: NERFZ WB NOW IS SO OP I WILL QUITZ AND SUE ZENIMAX, wears all light armor, doesn't use block and doesn't even realize that WB is the easiest skill to counter by dancing around or right through the caster.


NERF NERF NERF

The problem with nightblades is ZOS nerfed streak so now you cannot keep the pressure on Nightblades by countering speed with speed. which sucks in itself, they should have never listened to complains of that nature. used to be the counter for one mobility class was the other mobility class which was an actual legitimate counter, detect pots and magelight are cheesy.

the other issue is there are too many nightblades and it gets far too expensive to counter them.

GTFO. Sorc shouldn't have any problems with a nightblade.

Lucky28

KundaliniHero wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

Sharakor wrote: »

Sigh, L2P EVERYONE.
Noob #1: NERFZ CLOAK NOW OR I IS QUITZ, refuses to use magelight, detect pots or aoe.
Noob #2: NERFZ WB NOW IS SO OP I WILL QUITZ AND SUE ZENIMAX, wears all light armor, doesn't use block and doesn't even realize that WB is the easiest skill to counter by dancing around or right through the caster.


NERF NERF NERF

The problem with nightblades is ZOS nerfed streak so now you cannot keep the pressure on Nightblades by countering speed with speed. which sucks in itself, they should have never listened to complains of that nature. used to be the counter for one mobility class was the other mobility class which was an actual legitimate counter, detect pots and magelight are cheesy.

the other issue is there are too many nightblades and it gets far too expensive to counter them.

GTFO. Sorc shouldn't have any problems with a nightblade.

i have a much easier time countering Nighblades on my nightblade or even my DK, then on my sorc.

I can still use Streak to bolt into the sunset and leave enemies in the dust. but the stacking cost increase kills it for use in combat.

SupremeTravie

All the qq from the NB haters is annoying. There was a time pre 1.6 where we were the most underpowered class in the game by far and now that most of our abilites are working as attended we are apparently OP. Leave the class alone its fine. Work on balancing the classes so that they are on par with NB's. Nothing needs nerfing just buff other classes so thats even across the board. Every class in the game has a broken skill/skills so it wouldn't be fair to just nerf the ability to stealth.. I mean it is a NIGHTBLADE. Their class is based on stealth and mobility. Taking that away from the class will just put us back to where we were before. A broken stealth OR one that isn't as useful as it is right now will bring us back to pre 1.6 with almost no mobility to get away. There are many counters already to getting someone out of stealth. Inlcuding a pot that totally negates our core ability.

CP5

SupremeTravie wrote: »

All the qq from the NB haters is annoying. There was a time pre 1.6 where we were the most underpowered class in the game by far and now that most of our abilites are working as attended we are apparently OP. Leave the class alone its fine. Work on balancing the classes so that they are on par with NB's. Nothing needs nerfing just buff other classes so thats even across the board. Every class in the game has a broken skill/skills so it wouldn't be fair to just nerf the ability to stealth.. I mean it is a NIGHTBLADE. Their class is based on stealth and mobility. Taking that away from the class will just put us back to where we were before. A broken stealth OR one that isn't as useful as it is right now will bring us back to pre 1.6 with almost no mobility to get away. There are many counters already to getting someone out of stealth. Inlcuding a pot that totally negates our core ability.

DK's didn't use scales for a while because it drained resources per reflect like mad, given the unlimited projectile limit. When ZOS fixed that it became rather apparent that having a class have a skill that could not only negate 100% of single target range skills damage, but also deal 100-135% of that damage back to targets was a bit extreme. Just because something was broken in the past does not mean it is not overpowered when working properly.

Jade1986

rokrdt05 wrote: »

I also think what a lot of people are feeling with magicka nightblades is the "perma" cloak.

I see many people complain that they just run if it gets to tough or they are outnumbered. However there are so many counters to cloak right now.

Some of the more popular counters:

• Any type of AoE's (I.E. Steel Tornado)
• Sorc Streak
• Radiant Magelight
• Detect pots
• NB Mark

This works for any NB stamina or magicka, but ZoS is most likely going to put a magicka regen nerf while in cloak because of all the QQ'ing going on in the forums currently.

I've been playing a magicka nightblade for some time now and I mostly use cloak as a purge rather than something I use to fight. Sure there are times when I see that the fight is not in my favor and I try to bounce... sometimes I get rekt by the counters other times I can escape. It just comes down to how you use your counters.

I hope they reconsider any future nerfs to cloak.

The purge is also another reason it needs to have a nerf, because Magicka DKs rely a lot on dots, and having a class be able to constantly, with no punishment, be able to purge their dots is not ok by any means. Every other class had mass nerfs to their abilities / mechanics, NBs are the only ones that have been spared so far, so either undo the nerfs other classes / mechanics got, or expect nbs to finally get nerfed, its overdo.

Jade1986

Force-Siphon wrote: »

Yeah nerfing cloak is not the answer to the issues that people have been having. Nerfing cloak will continue putting magicka play styles in the trash bin outside of Sorc when in fact stamina play styles should be brought in line. One change I could see is make stam heals break cloak like mag heals do if cloak is such an issue from stamblades...but the reality is that surprise attack needs to be tuned clearly....I have seen higher numbers from SA than WB in fights at times. I don't think it's an issue exclusive to NBs tho, clearly stamina in a lot of ways is king play style now. I think across the board it should be tuned down to balance with magicka. I'm not for blanket knee-jerk nerfs, but tuning needs to happen. What I see happening though is that like Sorc and dk, nb is going to get the Nerfs next and we will have new balance issues.

And 1 shot builds are not exclusive to NB these days... Seen quite a few bow using DKs trying to do this too lately...name a mag class that can create a 1 shot build it's not gonna happen...and the sad part is that zenimax tried to do away with 1 shotting with damage reduction lol. Yes magicka has more utility, but ppl who play mag also need to kill people and not be 1 shot.

Yes, because our dodge roll totally wasnt destroyed recently.

americansteel

Eejit1331 wrote: »

Is this post for real or is th OP just a troll? Either way I got a good laugh out of the BS he wrote up. Haha.

spot on.

KenaPKK

laced wrote: »

Force-Siphon wrote: »

Yeah nerfing cloak is not the answer to the issues that people have been having. Nerfing cloak will continue putting magicka play styles in the trash bin outside of Sorc when in fact stamina play styles should be brought in line. One change I could see is make stam heals break cloak like mag heals do if cloak is such an issue from stamblades...but the reality is that surprise attack needs to be tuned clearly....I have seen higher numbers from SA than WB in fights at times. I don't think it's an issue exclusive to NBs tho, clearly stamina in a lot of ways is king play style now. I think across the board it should be tuned down to balance with magicka. I'm not for blanket knee-jerk nerfs, but tuning needs to happen. What I see happening though is that like Sorc and dk, nb is going to get the Nerfs next and we will have new balance issues.

And 1 shot builds are not exclusive to NB these days... Seen quite a few bow using DKs trying to do this too lately...name a mag class that can create a 1 shot build it's not gonna happen...and the sad part is that zenimax tried to do away with 1 shotting with damage reduction lol. Yes magicka has more utility, but ppl who play mag also need to kill people and not be 1 shot.

Yes, because our dodge roll totally wasnt destroyed recently.

Roll dodge is fine considering how strong it is. If you're having problems with it, you're rolling too often.

laced wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

I also think what a lot of people are feeling with magicka nightblades is the "perma" cloak.

I see many people complain that they just run if it gets to tough or they are outnumbered. However there are so many counters to cloak right now.

Some of the more popular counters:

• Any type of AoE's (I.E. Steel Tornado)
• Sorc Streak
• Radiant Magelight
• Detect pots
• NB Mark

This works for any NB stamina or magicka, but ZoS is most likely going to put a magicka regen nerf while in cloak because of all the QQ'ing going on in the forums currently.

I've been playing a magicka nightblade for some time now and I mostly use cloak as a purge rather than something I use to fight. Sure there are times when I see that the fight is not in my favor and I try to bounce... sometimes I get rekt by the counters other times I can escape. It just comes down to how you use your counters.

I hope they reconsider any future nerfs to cloak.

The purge is also another reason it needs to have a nerf, because Magicka DKs rely a lot on dots, and having a class be able to constantly, with no punishment, be able to purge their dots is not ok by any means. Every other class had mass nerfs to their abilities / mechanics, NBs are the only ones that have been spared so far, so either undo the nerfs other classes / mechanics got, or expect nbs to finally get nerfed, its overdo.

The purge is strong, but also very important considering damage-specced Nightblades have low max health and no shields or burst heals.

Jade1986

KenaPKK wrote: »

laced wrote: »

Force-Siphon wrote: »

Yeah nerfing cloak is not the answer to the issues that people have been having. Nerfing cloak will continue putting magicka play styles in the trash bin outside of Sorc when in fact stamina play styles should be brought in line. One change I could see is make stam heals break cloak like mag heals do if cloak is such an issue from stamblades...but the reality is that surprise attack needs to be tuned clearly....I have seen higher numbers from SA than WB in fights at times. I don't think it's an issue exclusive to NBs tho, clearly stamina in a lot of ways is king play style now. I think across the board it should be tuned down to balance with magicka. I'm not for blanket knee-jerk nerfs, but tuning needs to happen. What I see happening though is that like Sorc and dk, nb is going to get the Nerfs next and we will have new balance issues.

And 1 shot builds are not exclusive to NB these days... Seen quite a few bow using DKs trying to do this too lately...name a mag class that can create a 1 shot build it's not gonna happen...and the sad part is that zenimax tried to do away with 1 shotting with damage reduction lol. Yes magicka has more utility, but ppl who play mag also need to kill people and not be 1 shot.

Yes, because our dodge roll totally wasnt destroyed recently.

Roll dodge is fine considering how strong it is. If you're having problems with it, you're rolling too often.

laced wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

I also think what a lot of people are feeling with magicka nightblades is the "perma" cloak.

I see many people complain that they just run if it gets to tough or they are outnumbered. However there are so many counters to cloak right now.

Some of the more popular counters:

• Any type of AoE's (I.E. Steel Tornado)
• Sorc Streak
• Radiant Magelight
• Detect pots
• NB Mark

This works for any NB stamina or magicka, but ZoS is most likely going to put a magicka regen nerf while in cloak because of all the QQ'ing going on in the forums currently.

I've been playing a magicka nightblade for some time now and I mostly use cloak as a purge rather than something I use to fight. Sure there are times when I see that the fight is not in my favor and I try to bounce... sometimes I get rekt by the counters other times I can escape. It just comes down to how you use your counters.

I hope they reconsider any future nerfs to cloak.

The purge is also another reason it needs to have a nerf, because Magicka DKs rely a lot on dots, and having a class be able to constantly, with no punishment, be able to purge their dots is not ok by any means. Every other class had mass nerfs to their abilities / mechanics, NBs are the only ones that have been spared so far, so either undo the nerfs other classes / mechanics got, or expect nbs to finally get nerfed, its overdo.

The purge is strong, but also very important considering damage-specced Nightblades have low max health and no shields or burst heals.

Thats fine, and they should keep the purge, but it should have a limit. Being able to constantly purge is too much and just ridiculous. they should not be able to go in and out of stealth with impunity while being bombarded with dots constantly.

Jade1986

KenaPKK wrote: »

laced wrote: »

Force-Siphon wrote: »

Yeah nerfing cloak is not the answer to the issues that people have been having. Nerfing cloak will continue putting magicka play styles in the trash bin outside of Sorc when in fact stamina play styles should be brought in line. One change I could see is make stam heals break cloak like mag heals do if cloak is such an issue from stamblades...but the reality is that surprise attack needs to be tuned clearly....I have seen higher numbers from SA than WB in fights at times. I don't think it's an issue exclusive to NBs tho, clearly stamina in a lot of ways is king play style now. I think across the board it should be tuned down to balance with magicka. I'm not for blanket knee-jerk nerfs, but tuning needs to happen. What I see happening though is that like Sorc and dk, nb is going to get the Nerfs next and we will have new balance issues.

And 1 shot builds are not exclusive to NB these days... Seen quite a few bow using DKs trying to do this too lately...name a mag class that can create a 1 shot build it's not gonna happen...and the sad part is that zenimax tried to do away with 1 shotting with damage reduction lol. Yes magicka has more utility, but ppl who play mag also need to kill people and not be 1 shot.

Yes, because our dodge roll totally wasnt destroyed recently.

Roll dodge is fine considering how strong it is. If you're having problems with it, you're rolling too often.

laced wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

I also think what a lot of people are feeling with magicka nightblades is the "perma" cloak.

I see many people complain that they just run if it gets to tough or they are outnumbered. However there are so many counters to cloak right now.

Some of the more popular counters:

• Any type of AoE's (I.E. Steel Tornado)
• Sorc Streak
• Radiant Magelight
• Detect pots
• NB Mark

This works for any NB stamina or magicka, but ZoS is most likely going to put a magicka regen nerf while in cloak because of all the QQ'ing going on in the forums currently.

I've been playing a magicka nightblade for some time now and I mostly use cloak as a purge rather than something I use to fight. Sure there are times when I see that the fight is not in my favor and I try to bounce... sometimes I get rekt by the counters other times I can escape. It just comes down to how you use your counters.

I hope they reconsider any future nerfs to cloak.

The purge is also another reason it needs to have a nerf, because Magicka DKs rely a lot on dots, and having a class be able to constantly, with no punishment, be able to purge their dots is not ok by any means. Every other class had mass nerfs to their abilities / mechanics, NBs are the only ones that have been spared so far, so either undo the nerfs other classes / mechanics got, or expect nbs to finally get nerfed, its overdo.

The purge is strong, but also very important considering damage-specced Nightblades have low max health and no shields or burst heals.

That roll IS ok, but the point I was making is that it was nerfed HARD and is still ok, so if the cloak and other utilities were toned down to be on paar with other classes and specs, they would still be fine, they just wouldnt be so ridiculous anymore.

KenaPKK

The purge is strong, but it's very important

laced wrote: »

KenaPKK wrote: »

laced wrote: »

Force-Siphon wrote: »

Yeah nerfing cloak is not the answer to the issues that people have been having. Nerfing cloak will continue putting magicka play styles in the trash bin outside of Sorc when in fact stamina play styles should be brought in line. One change I could see is make stam heals break cloak like mag heals do if cloak is such an issue from stamblades...but the reality is that surprise attack needs to be tuned clearly....I have seen higher numbers from SA than WB in fights at times. I don't think it's an issue exclusive to NBs tho, clearly stamina in a lot of ways is king play style now. I think across the board it should be tuned down to balance with magicka. I'm not for blanket knee-jerk nerfs, but tuning needs to happen. What I see happening though is that like Sorc and dk, nb is going to get the Nerfs next and we will have new balance issues.

And 1 shot builds are not exclusive to NB these days... Seen quite a few bow using DKs trying to do this too lately...name a mag class that can create a 1 shot build it's not gonna happen...and the sad part is that zenimax tried to do away with 1 shotting with damage reduction lol. Yes magicka has more utility, but ppl who play mag also need to kill people and not be 1 shot.

Yes, because our dodge roll totally wasnt destroyed recently.

Roll dodge is fine considering how strong it is. If you're having problems with it, you're rolling too often.

laced wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

I also think what a lot of people are feeling with magicka nightblades is the "perma" cloak.

I see many people complain that they just run if it gets to tough or they are outnumbered. However there are so many counters to cloak right now.

Some of the more popular counters:

• Any type of AoE's (I.E. Steel Tornado)
• Sorc Streak
• Radiant Magelight
• Detect pots
• NB Mark

This works for any NB stamina or magicka, but ZoS is most likely going to put a magicka regen nerf while in cloak because of all the QQ'ing going on in the forums currently.

I've been playing a magicka nightblade for some time now and I mostly use cloak as a purge rather than something I use to fight. Sure there are times when I see that the fight is not in my favor and I try to bounce... sometimes I get rekt by the counters other times I can escape. It just comes down to how you use your counters.

I hope they reconsider any future nerfs to cloak.

The purge is also another reason it needs to have a nerf, because Magicka DKs rely a lot on dots, and having a class be able to constantly, with no punishment, be able to purge their dots is not ok by any means. Every other class had mass nerfs to their abilities / mechanics, NBs are the only ones that have been spared so far, so either undo the nerfs other classes / mechanics got, or expect nbs to finally get nerfed, its overdo.

The purge is strong, but also very important considering damage-specced Nightblades have low max health and no shields or burst heals.

That roll IS ok, but the point I was making is that it was nerfed HARD and is still ok, so if the cloak and other utilities were toned down to be on paar with other classes and specs, they would still be fine, they just wouldnt be so ridiculous anymore.

That is a logical fallacy that assumes that both are equally OP to start with. This thread is debating that premise. Don't bypass it please.

Igawotch

laced wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

I also think what a lot of people are feeling with magicka nightblades is the "perma" cloak.

I see many people complain that they just run if it gets to tough or they are outnumbered. However there are so many counters to cloak right now.

Some of the more popular counters:

• Any type of AoE's (I.E. Steel Tornado)
• Sorc Streak
• Radiant Magelight
• Detect pots
• NB Mark

This works for any NB stamina or magicka, but ZoS is most likely going to put a magicka regen nerf while in cloak because of all the QQ'ing going on in the forums currently.

I've been playing a magicka nightblade for some time now and I mostly use cloak as a purge rather than something I use to fight. Sure there are times when I see that the fight is not in my favor and I try to bounce... sometimes I get rekt by the counters other times I can escape. It just comes down to how you use your counters.

I hope they reconsider any future nerfs to cloak.

The purge is also another reason it needs to have a nerf, because Magicka DKs rely a lot on dots, and having a class be able to constantly, with no punishment, be able to purge their dots is not ok by any means. Every other class had mass nerfs to their abilities / mechanics, NBs are the only ones that have been spared so far, so either undo the nerfs other classes / mechanics got, or expect nbs to finally get nerfed, its overdo.

Because cloak WAS broken and very unreliable even our own dots would break it.