Give Templar's Mobility/Stronger Defense.

BalticBlues

Zornyan, we are not talking about the best players of the world here.
We are talking about regular Templar players who find themselves not competitive in PvP 1vs 1.
Sypher probaby could "wreck face" (why such poor language?) 1v1 with only one skill bar.
But this does not say something about the overall balance at all.

Hiero_Glyph

There are some very good Templar players in ESO. Some of them include Blabafat, Essa, Deltia, Divine Cross, Benzyboy and Ebonheart Templar; SypherPK is not (by his own admission) an experienced Templar player.

Akinos

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

There are some very good Templar players in ESO. Some of them include Blabafat, Essa, Deltia, Divine Cross, Benzyboy and Ebonheart Templar; SypherPK is not (by his own admission) an experienced Templar player.

lol....Essa is stam with over 1k CP, Divine barely plays anymore, Benzy plays, but rarely on his templar, Jack is stamina, and I imagine most people wouldn't count Sypher as a templar. Deltia barely plays his templar from what I tell. And you forgot the most important templar of all....AKINOS!

But the good templar list pales in comparison to the sheer amount of nightblades and sorcs that are considered good.

Joy_Division

BalticBlues wrote: »

Zornyan, we are not talking about the best players of the world here.
We are talking about regular Templar players who find themselves not competitive in PvP 1vs 1.
Sypher probaby could "wreck face" (why such poor language?) 1v1 with only one skill bar.
But this does not say something about the overall balance at all.

I'd agree with this. The templar has a lot of clunky mechanics and skills that are not easy to use that makes playing them well difficult.

A new templar player who thinks dark flare is its default range skill and sun shield it its main defensive skill is going to get Rekt.

Molag_Crow

zornyan wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

As magicka, sure you can spam heals, but that is really all the defensive capabilities magicka templars have that's explicit to the class.

What? No class is this game is completely self-sustaining just off of Class Abilities. If your asking for such a thing, than this isn't about class balance; this is about please Zenimax give us Templars a GODMODE ability in our class tree so we can have another 1 button spamfest while we vegetate cause thinking is just too hard. If it's mobility you want, Zenimax please make us the King of Running Away from every fight we encounter. This is absolutely absurd logic.

Zinaroth wrote: »

And even then, you end up standing in your Rune Focus, spamming Breath of Life, because if you stop, you die. A well played and build sorc or NB can even out damage it through use of healing debuff and insane burst capability.

Yeah because we don't have this ability called Purifying Ritual that clears debuffs while everyone else has to rely of Purge. And honestly if your character has to rely on spamming BoL just to survive when you have Puncturing Sweeps, then honestly you shouldn't be PvPing on that build. Fix your build so this isn't such a PROBLEM!!!!! Hint: Maybe those 5, 6, 7 pieces of cloth isn't such a great idea.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Throw in a CC during a moment of the templar not holding block or capitalizing on CC immunity and rekt.

This can kill any class, so not really a Templar problem. You run out of Stam and get CC'd, you die regardless of your class. I assume I am reading this correctly.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Who uses 2 medium armor AND uses CP points on stamina cost reduction if you play as magicka?

If it works, it works.

Here's my final statement: If you want Mobility, go play a class that has it. Templars don't fit your playstyle and that should be fine, you stated other people have left it: follow them. Stop asking for nonsense cause you refuse to understand what makes a class unique and beg for the ruining of what the MAJORITY of the community already likes and enjoys.

Congratulations. You just took my entire post, dismantled it, and answered each part as if the rest didn't exist. Completely out of context. No class is self-sustaining off class abilities. I never said that. But the templar has the worst survivability of all of them, outside spamming Breath of Life. The problem being that all the other classes have abilities that help them survive, that doesn't need to be spammed, to get the job done. Templar's don't. A cloak gets you out of focus in one use. A sorc shield is double a Breath of Life heal, meaning more time not spamming shield, plus they also have Bolt AND LIghtning Form. DKs are a bit worse off but still have a really nice self buff and lots of inherent tankiness in their awesome regens.

I even mentioned Purify in my comment, but you took something out of context and made it sound like I hadn't already considered it. Congratulations on manipulating what I wrote. Purify is nice, but again, you need to spam it. It cannot be used pre-emptively, so yet more to spam. Good luck hitting with Puncturing Sweep when you are running around in snail mode with the only channeled melee ability in the game. If you're lucky you will get 2/4 hits in. If you even bothered to read my entire comment you'd know I am running as stamina, so belittling me for using 7 pieces of light armor when in truth I don't even play magicka right now is just a joke on you.

Sure a well timed CC can kill any class. But this comes back to the templars defense being reactive and not pre-emptive. You can't spam BoL when CCed. Unless you get CCed inside your Rune Focus or within 5 seconds of leaving it you don't have that defense ability either. And even if you survive the CC you're demoted to spamming BoL trying to catch up in the fight again when the CC is over. Every other class has a better way of taking pressure off them. And before you mention that we can just CC them; remember you were advocating for Puncturing Sweep, this renders them CC immunity after just a 0.5 second knockback. Yet another courtesy from ZOS for being the underdog in PvP.

Sure if it works, it works. But it will reduce your capability of playing your role in any other regard.

Here's MY final statement: Don't tell me to go play another class. I played mine since launch. I have more experience on Templar than you will probably ever accumulate. I played Templar back when it was STILL the underdog in PvP. But because the meta wasn't about hitting and running so much, it was bearable, and I could carry my own. The game has changed in so many aspects and templars have been left in the gutter as a result of it (somewhat DKs aswell but this is not the topic for that discussion). I do not refuse to understand anything, because I already know EVERYTHING there is to know about my class and have 1½ year experience of playing it. Furthermore I find it absolutely ridiculous that you only quoted the parts of my comment that you could dismantle and left out every single obvious thing I said like templars hardly being present in 1v1 dueling tournaments or dueling sessions at all. Because that is irrefutable proof that Templars are dead last and every proper PvPer knows it. So only a few brave souls are maining a Templar nowadays.

Sypher, Fengrush, Lefty Lucy and King Richard. All of them considered good PvPers who stream. What do they have in common? None of them play a Templar, ever. Feel free to point me in the direction of ANY high profile streamer that mains a Templar or generally plays one. And if you say JarJarMerks, I reserve the right to laugh.

Erm both deltia and sypher use magicka templars, and stamina. So you completly owned yourself there.

In fact sypher has said several times how great the magicka templar is. Just because you played a class for a year doesn't make you good.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]

Lmao Sypher's Templar video is from PTS and it's a highlighted scene of a few minutes which any Templar can achieve, that doesn't mean just because Sypher said they're great, means they're great. Wow, just play one for a few weeks in Cyrodiil then you'll see, oh and I mean solo, not with groups.

You're most likely trying to prove points based off of group PvP or something.

zornyan

CrowsDescend wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

As magicka, sure you can spam heals, but that is really all the defensive capabilities magicka templars have that's explicit to the class.

What? No class is this game is completely self-sustaining just off of Class Abilities. If your asking for such a thing, than this isn't about class balance; this is about please Zenimax give us Templars a GODMODE ability in our class tree so we can have another 1 button spamfest while we vegetate cause thinking is just too hard. If it's mobility you want, Zenimax please make us the King of Running Away from every fight we encounter. This is absolutely absurd logic.

Zinaroth wrote: »

And even then, you end up standing in your Rune Focus, spamming Breath of Life, because if you stop, you die. A well played and build sorc or NB can even out damage it through use of healing debuff and insane burst capability.

Yeah because we don't have this ability called Purifying Ritual that clears debuffs while everyone else has to rely of Purge. And honestly if your character has to rely on spamming BoL just to survive when you have Puncturing Sweeps, then honestly you shouldn't be PvPing on that build. Fix your build so this isn't such a PROBLEM!!!!! Hint: Maybe those 5, 6, 7 pieces of cloth isn't such a great idea.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Throw in a CC during a moment of the templar not holding block or capitalizing on CC immunity and rekt.

This can kill any class, so not really a Templar problem. You run out of Stam and get CC'd, you die regardless of your class. I assume I am reading this correctly.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Who uses 2 medium armor AND uses CP points on stamina cost reduction if you play as magicka?

If it works, it works.

Here's my final statement: If you want Mobility, go play a class that has it. Templars don't fit your playstyle and that should be fine, you stated other people have left it: follow them. Stop asking for nonsense cause you refuse to understand what makes a class unique and beg for the ruining of what the MAJORITY of the community already likes and enjoys.

Congratulations. You just took my entire post, dismantled it, and answered each part as if the rest didn't exist. Completely out of context. No class is self-sustaining off class abilities. I never said that. But the templar has the worst survivability of all of them, outside spamming Breath of Life. The problem being that all the other classes have abilities that help them survive, that doesn't need to be spammed, to get the job done. Templar's don't. A cloak gets you out of focus in one use. A sorc shield is double a Breath of Life heal, meaning more time not spamming shield, plus they also have Bolt AND LIghtning Form. DKs are a bit worse off but still have a really nice self buff and lots of inherent tankiness in their awesome regens.

I even mentioned Purify in my comment, but you took something out of context and made it sound like I hadn't already considered it. Congratulations on manipulating what I wrote. Purify is nice, but again, you need to spam it. It cannot be used pre-emptively, so yet more to spam. Good luck hitting with Puncturing Sweep when you are running around in snail mode with the only channeled melee ability in the game. If you're lucky you will get 2/4 hits in. If you even bothered to read my entire comment you'd know I am running as stamina, so belittling me for using 7 pieces of light armor when in truth I don't even play magicka right now is just a joke on you.

Sure a well timed CC can kill any class. But this comes back to the templars defense being reactive and not pre-emptive. You can't spam BoL when CCed. Unless you get CCed inside your Rune Focus or within 5 seconds of leaving it you don't have that defense ability either. And even if you survive the CC you're demoted to spamming BoL trying to catch up in the fight again when the CC is over. Every other class has a better way of taking pressure off them. And before you mention that we can just CC them; remember you were advocating for Puncturing Sweep, this renders them CC immunity after just a 0.5 second knockback. Yet another courtesy from ZOS for being the underdog in PvP.

Sure if it works, it works. But it will reduce your capability of playing your role in any other regard.

Here's MY final statement: Don't tell me to go play another class. I played mine since launch. I have more experience on Templar than you will probably ever accumulate. I played Templar back when it was STILL the underdog in PvP. But because the meta wasn't about hitting and running so much, it was bearable, and I could carry my own. The game has changed in so many aspects and templars have been left in the gutter as a result of it (somewhat DKs aswell but this is not the topic for that discussion). I do not refuse to understand anything, because I already know EVERYTHING there is to know about my class and have 1½ year experience of playing it. Furthermore I find it absolutely ridiculous that you only quoted the parts of my comment that you could dismantle and left out every single obvious thing I said like templars hardly being present in 1v1 dueling tournaments or dueling sessions at all. Because that is irrefutable proof that Templars are dead last and every proper PvPer knows it. So only a few brave souls are maining a Templar nowadays.

Sypher, Fengrush, Lefty Lucy and King Richard. All of them considered good PvPers who stream. What do they have in common? None of them play a Templar, ever. Feel free to point me in the direction of ANY high profile streamer that mains a Templar or generally plays one. And if you say JarJarMerks, I reserve the right to laugh.

Erm both deltia and sypher use magicka templars, and stamina. So you completly owned yourself there.

In fact sypher has said several times how great the magicka templar is. Just because you played a class for a year doesn't make you good.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]

Lmao Sypher's Templar video is from PTS and it's a highlighted scene of a few minutes which any Templar can achieve, that doesn't mean just because Sypher said they're great, means they're great. Wow, just play one for a few weeks in Cyrodiil then you'll see, oh and I mean solo, not with groups.

You're most likely trying to prove points based off of group PvP or something.

80% of my gameplay in cyro is solo, normally 1vx in sewers as I like to grind solo, then the odd time I'll take 1 or 2 people with me to fight zergs.

I enjoy 1v1 and 1vx, I try to attend plenty of dueling nights setup to practise me skills, the only class I currently have issues with is shield stackers due to my sweeps doing nearly zero damage, but they don't kill me either, it just goes on until we give up.

In fact the only people I wasn't able to beat in a whole day in arena district was a dk teamed up with another magicka templar, we're just too strong atm

Molag_Crow

zornyan wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

As magicka, sure you can spam heals, but that is really all the defensive capabilities magicka templars have that's explicit to the class.

What? No class is this game is completely self-sustaining just off of Class Abilities. If your asking for such a thing, than this isn't about class balance; this is about please Zenimax give us Templars a GODMODE ability in our class tree so we can have another 1 button spamfest while we vegetate cause thinking is just too hard. If it's mobility you want, Zenimax please make us the King of Running Away from every fight we encounter. This is absolutely absurd logic.

Zinaroth wrote: »

And even then, you end up standing in your Rune Focus, spamming Breath of Life, because if you stop, you die. A well played and build sorc or NB can even out damage it through use of healing debuff and insane burst capability.

Yeah because we don't have this ability called Purifying Ritual that clears debuffs while everyone else has to rely of Purge. And honestly if your character has to rely on spamming BoL just to survive when you have Puncturing Sweeps, then honestly you shouldn't be PvPing on that build. Fix your build so this isn't such a PROBLEM!!!!! Hint: Maybe those 5, 6, 7 pieces of cloth isn't such a great idea.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Throw in a CC during a moment of the templar not holding block or capitalizing on CC immunity and rekt.

This can kill any class, so not really a Templar problem. You run out of Stam and get CC'd, you die regardless of your class. I assume I am reading this correctly.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Who uses 2 medium armor AND uses CP points on stamina cost reduction if you play as magicka?

If it works, it works.

Here's my final statement: If you want Mobility, go play a class that has it. Templars don't fit your playstyle and that should be fine, you stated other people have left it: follow them. Stop asking for nonsense cause you refuse to understand what makes a class unique and beg for the ruining of what the MAJORITY of the community already likes and enjoys.

Congratulations. You just took my entire post, dismantled it, and answered each part as if the rest didn't exist. Completely out of context. No class is self-sustaining off class abilities. I never said that. But the templar has the worst survivability of all of them, outside spamming Breath of Life. The problem being that all the other classes have abilities that help them survive, that doesn't need to be spammed, to get the job done. Templar's don't. A cloak gets you out of focus in one use. A sorc shield is double a Breath of Life heal, meaning more time not spamming shield, plus they also have Bolt AND LIghtning Form. DKs are a bit worse off but still have a really nice self buff and lots of inherent tankiness in their awesome regens.

I even mentioned Purify in my comment, but you took something out of context and made it sound like I hadn't already considered it. Congratulations on manipulating what I wrote. Purify is nice, but again, you need to spam it. It cannot be used pre-emptively, so yet more to spam. Good luck hitting with Puncturing Sweep when you are running around in snail mode with the only channeled melee ability in the game. If you're lucky you will get 2/4 hits in. If you even bothered to read my entire comment you'd know I am running as stamina, so belittling me for using 7 pieces of light armor when in truth I don't even play magicka right now is just a joke on you.

Sure a well timed CC can kill any class. But this comes back to the templars defense being reactive and not pre-emptive. You can't spam BoL when CCed. Unless you get CCed inside your Rune Focus or within 5 seconds of leaving it you don't have that defense ability either. And even if you survive the CC you're demoted to spamming BoL trying to catch up in the fight again when the CC is over. Every other class has a better way of taking pressure off them. And before you mention that we can just CC them; remember you were advocating for Puncturing Sweep, this renders them CC immunity after just a 0.5 second knockback. Yet another courtesy from ZOS for being the underdog in PvP.

Sure if it works, it works. But it will reduce your capability of playing your role in any other regard.

Here's MY final statement: Don't tell me to go play another class. I played mine since launch. I have more experience on Templar than you will probably ever accumulate. I played Templar back when it was STILL the underdog in PvP. But because the meta wasn't about hitting and running so much, it was bearable, and I could carry my own. The game has changed in so many aspects and templars have been left in the gutter as a result of it (somewhat DKs aswell but this is not the topic for that discussion). I do not refuse to understand anything, because I already know EVERYTHING there is to know about my class and have 1½ year experience of playing it. Furthermore I find it absolutely ridiculous that you only quoted the parts of my comment that you could dismantle and left out every single obvious thing I said like templars hardly being present in 1v1 dueling tournaments or dueling sessions at all. Because that is irrefutable proof that Templars are dead last and every proper PvPer knows it. So only a few brave souls are maining a Templar nowadays.

Sypher, Fengrush, Lefty Lucy and King Richard. All of them considered good PvPers who stream. What do they have in common? None of them play a Templar, ever. Feel free to point me in the direction of ANY high profile streamer that mains a Templar or generally plays one. And if you say JarJarMerks, I reserve the right to laugh.

Erm both deltia and sypher use magicka templars, and stamina. So you completly owned yourself there.

In fact sypher has said several times how great the magicka templar is. Just because you played a class for a year doesn't make you good.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]

Lmao Sypher's Templar video is from PTS and it's a highlighted scene of a few minutes which any Templar can achieve, that doesn't mean just because Sypher said they're great, means they're great. Wow, just play one for a few weeks in Cyrodiil then you'll see, oh and I mean solo, not with groups.

You're most likely trying to prove points based off of group PvP or something.

80% of my gameplay in cyro is solo, normally 1vx in sewers as I like to grind solo, then the odd time I'll take 1 or 2 people with me to fight zergs.

I enjoy 1v1 and 1vx, I try to attend plenty of dueling nights setup to practise me skills, the only class I currently have issues with is shield stackers due to my sweeps doing nearly zero damage, but they don't kill me either, it just goes on until we give up.

In fact the only people I wasn't able to beat in a whole day in arena district was a dk teamed up with another magicka templar, we're just too strong atm

Well that's great and I'm not gonna lie, I do well as solo too, even against 5 other players sometimes when I kite & LoS correctly, but as soon as soon as I fail to hug objects and I can't dodge roll no more, boom! still.. this isn't about our individual play, I'm more concerned about the class as a whole ever since Blazing Shield got nerfed...

Sometimes I'm tempted to go for the Bombplar build where you stack health and blow people up with blazing shield lol.

Soris

ZOS_RiedL wrote: »

Hello,

We have moved this thread to the correct category.

Thanks for your understanding.

OMG. I was soo excited when I see Z mark on the thread until I see this post.

Mumyo

ZOS_RiedL wrote: »

Hello,

We have moved this thread to the correct category.

Thanks for your understanding.

hahahahaha. i read this thread because i thought that zos somehow responded.... well AHAHAHAHhaha

Molag_Crow

Mumyo wrote: »

ZOS_RiedL wrote: »

Hello,

We have moved this thread to the correct category.

Thanks for your understanding.

hahahahaha. i read this thread because i thought that zos somehow responded.... well AHAHAHAHhaha

Lettigall

ZOS_RiedL wrote: »

Hello,

We have moved this thread to the correct category.

Thanks for your understanding.

Forum mods are such trolls.... I wonder if you can report them for trolling!?

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

Zinaroth wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

As magicka, sure you can spam heals, but that is really all the defensive capabilities magicka templars have that's explicit to the class.

What? No class is this game is completely self-sustaining just off of Class Abilities. If your asking for such a thing, than this isn't about class balance; this is about please Zenimax give us Templars a GODMODE ability in our class tree so we can have another 1 button spamfest while we vegetate cause thinking is just too hard. If it's mobility you want, Zenimax please make us the King of Running Away from every fight we encounter. This is absolutely absurd logic.

Zinaroth wrote: »

And even then, you end up standing in your Rune Focus, spamming Breath of Life, because if you stop, you die. A well played and build sorc or NB can even out damage it through use of healing debuff and insane burst capability.

Yeah because we don't have this ability called Purifying Ritual that clears debuffs while everyone else has to rely of Purge. And honestly if your character has to rely on spamming BoL just to survive when you have Puncturing Sweeps, then honestly you shouldn't be PvPing on that build. Fix your build so this isn't such a PROBLEM!!!!! Hint: Maybe those 5, 6, 7 pieces of cloth isn't such a great idea.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Throw in a CC during a moment of the templar not holding block or capitalizing on CC immunity and rekt.

This can kill any class, so not really a Templar problem. You run out of Stam and get CC'd, you die regardless of your class. I assume I am reading this correctly.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Who uses 2 medium armor AND uses CP points on stamina cost reduction if you play as magicka?

If it works, it works.

Here's my final statement: If you want Mobility, go play a class that has it. Templars don't fit your playstyle and that should be fine, you stated other people have left it: follow them. Stop asking for nonsense cause you refuse to understand what makes a class unique and beg for the ruining of what the MAJORITY of the community already likes and enjoys.

Congratulations. You just took my entire post, dismantled it, and answered each part as if the rest didn't exist. Completely out of context. No class is self-sustaining off class abilities. I never said that. But the templar has the worst survivability of all of them, outside spamming Breath of Life. The problem being that all the other classes have abilities that help them survive, that doesn't need to be spammed, to get the job done. Templar's don't. A cloak gets you out of focus in one use. A sorc shield is double a Breath of Life heal, meaning more time not spamming shield, plus they also have Bolt AND LIghtning Form. DKs are a bit worse off but still have a really nice self buff and lots of inherent tankiness in their awesome regens.

I even mentioned Purify in my comment, but you took something out of context and made it sound like I hadn't already considered it. Congratulations on manipulating what I wrote. Purify is nice, but again, you need to spam it. It cannot be used pre-emptively, so yet more to spam. Good luck hitting with Puncturing Sweep when you are running around in snail mode with the only channeled melee ability in the game. If you're lucky you will get 2/4 hits in. If you even bothered to read my entire comment you'd know I am running as stamina, so belittling me for using 7 pieces of light armor when in truth I don't even play magicka right now is just a joke on you.

Sure a well timed CC can kill any class. But this comes back to the templars defense being reactive and not pre-emptive. You can't spam BoL when CCed. Unless you get CCed inside your Rune Focus or within 5 seconds of leaving it you don't have that defense ability either. And even if you survive the CC you're demoted to spamming BoL trying to catch up in the fight again when the CC is over. Every other class has a better way of taking pressure off them. And before you mention that we can just CC them; remember you were advocating for Puncturing Sweep, this renders them CC immunity after just a 0.5 second knockback. Yet another courtesy from ZOS for being the underdog in PvP.

Sure if it works, it works. But it will reduce your capability of playing your role in any other regard.

Here's MY final statement: Don't tell me to go play another class. I played mine since launch. I have more experience on Templar than you will probably ever accumulate. I played Templar back when it was STILL the underdog in PvP. But because the meta wasn't about hitting and running so much, it was bearable, and I could carry my own. The game has changed in so many aspects and templars have been left in the gutter as a result of it (somewhat DKs aswell but this is not the topic for that discussion). I do not refuse to understand anything, because I already know EVERYTHING there is to know about my class and have 1½ year experience of playing it. Furthermore I find it absolutely ridiculous that you only quoted the parts of my comment that you could dismantle and left out every single obvious thing I said like templars hardly being present in 1v1 dueling tournaments or dueling sessions at all. Because that is irrefutable proof that Templars are dead last and every proper PvPer knows it. So only a few brave souls are maining a Templar nowadays.

Sypher, Fengrush, Lefty Lucy and King Richard. All of them considered good PvPers who stream. What do they have in common? None of them play a Templar, ever. Feel free to point me in the direction of ANY high profile streamer that mains a Templar or generally plays one. And if you say JarJarMerks, I reserve the right to laugh.

Zinaroth wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

Erm both deltia and sypher use magicka templars, and stamina. So you completly owned yourself there.

In fact sypher has said several times how great the magicka templar is. Just because you played a class for a year doesn't make you good, a monkey using a keyboard for a year is still just a monkey.

Deltia is not a PvPer. KingRichard says he used to play a Templar in PvP back when the cap was VR10. Hardly qualifies him to comment on the current state of the class. Sypher is currently leveling a templar. Has been leveling it for over two months. He NEVER played a templar, EVER, on stream.

Why are you lying? To further your point? Pitiful...

I know they are all saying how good magicka templars are. Funny how they all talk about how good a class is they have no experience with and that none of them play. It's like 4 guys sitting around agreeing that ESO sucks, but none of them have tried it. It's ridiculous and unqualified.

Nice, comparing me to a monkey. Ran out of arguments?

If you have to lie and result to personal insults just because you don't agree with me then you're better off not coming on these forums.

Feel free to come back when you want to be constructive.

I take it you watched their podcast and that is where these statements come from. You need to watch it again though cause they said both templars and dks are fine in 1v1. It is when it come to 1vX that they lack the mobility to be as successful as the other classes. That is a far cry from what your saying. Like I said if your having issues in 1v1, fix your build cause every scenerio your claiming I dont seem to have the same problem.

Zinaroth

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

I take it you watched their podcast and that is where these statements come from. You need to watch it again though cause they said both templars and dks are fine in 1v1. It is when it come to 1vX that they lack the mobility to be as successful as the other classes. That is a far cry from what your saying. Like I said if your having issues in 1v1, fix your build cause every scenerio your claiming I dont seem to have the same problem.

I watched both podcast. None of them have much templar experience. I wouldn't listen to them when it comes to the Templar class in particular.

I am not going to keep beating this dead horse though.

If people insist on believing the garbage they spew on their podcast when it comes to the Templar class there is nothing I can do about it.

zornyan

Again, myself and multiple other good players are saying templars are fine, we kill many many players, and belive this is the best templars have been, I have never felt as powerful as I do now, are templars perfect? No

But neither are dk's, neither are sorcerers that although have one good ability, are gimped in stamina builds.

Look at some of the magicka templar builds pulling 32k dps and upwards, that's hardly a broken class is it?

If I can win 1 v1 against players of equal skill, that hardly means the class is the bottom of the pit in pvp?

If I can fight and win against multiple opponents at a time, the class is hardly broken either.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

Zinaroth wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

I take it you watched their podcast and that is where these statements come from. You need to watch it again though cause they said both templars and dks are fine in 1v1. It is when it come to 1vX that they lack the mobility to be as successful as the other classes. That is a far cry from what your saying. Like I said if your having issues in 1v1, fix your build cause every scenerio your claiming I dont seem to have the same problem.

I watched both podcast. None of them have much templar experience. I wouldn't listen to them when it comes to the Templar class in particular.

I am not going to keep beating this dead horse though.

If people insist on believing the garbage they spew on their podcast when it comes to the Templar class there is nothing I can do about it.

It sounds like your listening to them and they said they had fought templars. So they can speak on their own experiences. On top of that people who have been playing them since the beginning have said they are fine. The only thing that needs to be looked at is whether jabs is getting full damage on shields and if this is intended. However, that has nothing to do with mobility or better defense.

The folks who keep asking this should at least clarify what exactly this will solve. Every post just sounds like a bunch of QQ because your templar got beat up so it MUST be the class. Then the solution is something they heard from a youtube video or stream, of which they take conpletely out of context.

No class is perfect and shouldnt be. Weaknesses and Strenghts, learn to adjust instead of asking the devs for some fix that you dont even completely understand. Saying that I would gladly hop on the bandwagon here if some logical point was made and not a bunch of "I (I mean the class) sucks, gimme gimme gimme.

zornyan

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

I take it you watched their podcast and that is where these statements come from. You need to watch it again though cause they said both templars and dks are fine in 1v1. It is when it come to 1vX that they lack the mobility to be as successful as the other classes. That is a far cry from what your saying. Like I said if your having issues in 1v1, fix your build cause every scenerio your claiming I dont seem to have the same problem.

I watched both podcast. None of them have much templar experience. I wouldn't listen to them when it comes to the Templar class in particular.

I am not going to keep beating this dead horse though.

If people insist on believing the garbage they spew on their podcast when it comes to the Templar class there is nothing I can do about it.

It sounds like your listening to them and they said they had fought templars. So they can speak on their own experiences. On top of that people who have been playing them since the beginning have said they are fine. The only thing that needs to be looked at is whether jabs is getting full damage on shields and if this is intended. However, that has nothing to do with mobility or better defense.

The folks who keep asking this should at least clarify what exactly this will solve. Every post just sounds like a bunch of QQ because your templar got beat up so it MUST be the class. Then the solution is something they heard from a youtube video or stream, of which they take conpletely out of context.

No class is perfect and shouldnt be. Weaknesses and Strenghts, learn to adjust instead of asking the devs for some fix that you dont even completely understand. Saying that I would gladly hop on the bandwagon here if some logical point was made and not a bunch of "I (I mean the class) sucks, gimme gimme gimme.

Just to add, the bug isn't intended for jabs, I read it was a bug previously found earlier in the year, and then fixed, but has somehow found its way back in, probably due to them messing with shields in the pvp patch when IC launched. I've tested it myself, and jabs is literally like throwing a paper towel at the shield.

Joy_Division

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

I take it you watched their podcast and that is where these statements come from. You need to watch it again though cause they said both templars and dks are fine in 1v1. It is when it come to 1vX that they lack the mobility to be as successful as the other classes. That is a far cry from what your saying. Like I said if your having issues in 1v1, fix your build cause every scenerio your claiming I dont seem to have the same problem.

I watched both podcast. None of them have much templar experience. I wouldn't listen to them when it comes to the Templar class in particular.

I am not going to keep beating this dead horse though.

If people insist on believing the garbage they spew on their podcast when it comes to the Templar class there is nothing I can do about it.

It sounds like your listening to them and they said they had fought templars. So they can speak on their own experiences. On top of that people who have been playing them since the beginning have said they are fine. The only thing that needs to be looked at is whether jabs is getting full damage on shields and if this is intended. However, that has nothing to do with mobility or better defense.

The folks who keep asking this should at least clarify what exactly this will solve. Every post just sounds like a bunch of QQ because your templar got beat up so it MUST be the class. Then the solution is something they heard from a youtube video or stream, of which they take conpletely out of context.

No class is perfect and shouldnt be. Weaknesses and Strenghts, learn to adjust instead of asking the devs for some fix that you dont even completely understand. Saying that I would gladly hop on the bandwagon here if some logical point was made and not a bunch of "I (I mean the class) sucks, gimme gimme gimme.

Not entirely. Considering the perspective of the "enemy" is important, but the problem is that it is only half the story, which leads to inaccurate assessments. It is why people who have lacked the scientific understand of natural phenomenon often attributed it to magic or divine agency.

I - and others - have played templars from the beginning and I don't think they are fine. There are a host of issues that need to be looked at besides biting jabs and shields. Eclipse is currently unsuitable for the AvAvA format, the class shield is worthless, radiant destruction fails in its purpose as an execute, the healing ultimate underperforms badly, etc, etc.

What people have said, which you claim they have not, is the templar currently has a weakness (no mobility) and does *not* have the proper strength (ability to hold ground). Hence, the title of the thread. It's not just gimme, gimme, gimme. It's make the class competent at one or the other.

Van_0S

So,

Lettigall wrote: »

ZOS_RiedL wrote: »

Hello,

We have moved this thread to the correct category.

Thanks for your understanding.

Forum mods are such trolls.... I wonder if you can report them for trolling!?

Mumyo

Akinos wrote: »

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

There are some very good Templar players in ESO. Some of them include Blabafat, Essa, Deltia, Divine Cross, Benzyboy and Ebonheart Templar; SypherPK is not (by his own admission) an experienced Templar player.

lol....Essa is stam with over 1k CP, Divine barely plays anymore, Benzy plays, but rarely on his templar, Jack is stamina, and I imagine most people wouldn't count Sypher as a templar. Deltia barely plays his templar from what I tell. And you forgot the most important templar of all....AKINOS!

But the good templar list pales in comparison to the sheer amount of nightblades and sorcs that are considered good.

Well spoken.
So "the strongest" templars actually have tons of cp.
I mean i do kill people and win 1v1 but against the really good players i dont stand a chance as stamplar.
We lack in many things. My interest in dueling is quite low atm, i enjoy groupplay alot but even there my group complains about me making enemies cc immune xD (thx jabs) and i cant heal staminawise except for vigor but thats not what u expect from a templar.

On the other hand i dont wanna cry as much as dk but we might need an eye on some of our abilities.... i really dislike backlash and the restoring light tree, a shame there is no use in it for me...

i didnt go magicka templar yet btw but it seems strong but also difficult in timing against good opponents. What i hate the most is the lack of burst and

JABS IS NOT BURST
IT IS DPS! just sayin because people allways argue in that way.

the sweep dmg morph is also very bad... actually its absolute crap.
I know many love repentance but they could put some more regg on it.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO

Zinaroth wrote: »

Sorcerers have Surge, Bolt Escape and Lightning Form, all really good even as stamina. Stuff to use your magicka on. They are pretty bread and butter even, I am sure @FENGRUSH could agree here as I see him running using those exact three abilities to reach godlike mobility and defense/survivability. But it doesn't stop there...

Using superior mobility Sorcerers do that. That's one the main strengths.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Sorcerer summoning tree you say? Okay sure let's go into more details with yet another class, here we go:
Bound Armaments give armor, max stamina and increased heavy attack damage
Greater Storm Atronach ulti is still a nice ulti, albeit you could argue there are better for damage.
A passive that grants 15% ulti cost reduction
A passive that gives 20% increased health and stamina regen with a summoning skill slotted
The last passive alone makes the atronach worth having slotted on your front bar, as we can also see @FENGRUSH doing on his countless streams.

Yes just like the Siphon Ultimate is good and the passive 8% more magic and 3% more healing received per power is not bad.

Zinaroth wrote: »

I don't think anyone here can dismiss his knowledge and capability or experience with PvP. Does that mean sorcs are perfect? No I am sure they would like a class stamina damage ability. But this topic is about templars. You just brought it up.

Maybe he likes his class at any rate I don't huffed classes or power based on what other people like.

Zinaroth wrote: »

You cannot play a templar to outlast anyone, since every class in this game has better rescource management than templars. As stamina you have to kill or be killed, except we have less ways to outplay our opponent, since not a whole lot of our arsenal, and only a couple of passives, help us.
As magicka, sure you can spam heals, but that is really all the defensive capabilities magicka templars have that's explicit to the class. And even then, you end up standing in your Rune Focus, spamming Breath of Life, because if you stop, you die. A well played and build sorc or NB can even out damage it through use of healing debuff and insane burst capability. Throw in a CC during a moment of the templar not holding block or capitalizing on CC immunity and rekt.

Again dueled a Magic Templar that outlasted chain CCs. I can 1v3 abd win so him being able to keep HoTs down while cleansing my mark and healing debuff back to back.


DKs CAN outlast, as magicka and stamina, because they have an awesome arrange of tools to keep them alive. Want me to go into details on why that is aswell?

Stamina templars are far worse off than magicka templars though, doesn't mean both of them don't need help, 'cause they do.

Now, throw a magicka templar into a group and we have a completely different story. But I would still like to be able to pull my own weight. I am sure a lot of PvPers don't always have buddies waiting around to carry them around in Cyrodiil.

I realize DKs also have problems carrying their own weight atm, and I don't mean to undertone their issues. But again this is a thread about templars, and I do think DKs are still better off right now than we are.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Actually, every single class has been better off than the templar since launch day.

This is true if we don't count the fact that half the Nightblade powers don't work or had the wrong info in the tool tip but sure.

Go to any dueling tournament or just a normal dueling session with 1v1 fights and you will get the picture; a LOT (and I mean A TON) of NBs and Sorcs, a handful of DKS and maybe 1-2 Templars. It all speaks for itself. Most people who love PvP and who rolled Templar in the beginning quickly realized how subpar they were if they wanted to do anything outside of healing their group mates and rerolled. Up until 1.6 they played DK and some Sorc. And until now Sorcs or NB.

But feel free to get back to me if there's anything else you would like me to go into depth with. I don't mind comparing the templar to other classes, because when you boil it down to what you get from the class skill line passives, and what tools each class has at it's disposal, Templars are dead last, at every point, except if you only look at it through the eyes of a group leader who needs a healer.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

My Magic Dragon Knight uses Chains so yea I single you out or I get pulled to you both suit me. You will never convince me that you can't use Quick Cloak it's 3k last for 15 seconds 2 medium (6% stamina cost reduction and regen) and plus CP stamina cost reduction no way you can't use that power.

Zinaroth wrote: »

Who uses 2 medium armor AND uses CP points on stamina cost reduction if you play as magicka? Or do you just have a ton of excess CPs?
At max you would use 1h1M5L for the 6% undaunted bonus.
But sure you could use Quick Cloak if (and that's a big IF) you run dual wield as a magicka templar. But wouldn't it be nice if you didn't have to just to have access to it? Kind of like the Sorc or NB?

I

I made this point earlier you my Stamina Nightblade runs two light and use CP cost reduction to cloak more for my Shadow Walker five piece. I can't complain about the cost of Magic if I do nothing to reduce it. However my Magic builds are 5h 2l or 5l 2m to take more damage as a battle Mage or to CC break more. If you want to have more stamina using the armor that helps with that is what you need to do. The 5X 2Y will still give you 4% more resources. 3% more regeneration and cost reduction is better then 2% more.

zornyan

Joy_Division wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

I take it you watched their podcast and that is where these statements come from. You need to watch it again though cause they said both templars and dks are fine in 1v1. It is when it come to 1vX that they lack the mobility to be as successful as the other classes. That is a far cry from what your saying. Like I said if your having issues in 1v1, fix your build cause every scenerio your claiming I dont seem to have the same problem.

I watched both podcast. None of them have much templar experience. I wouldn't listen to them when it comes to the Templar class in particular.

I am not going to keep beating this dead horse though.

If people insist on believing the garbage they spew on their podcast when it comes to the Templar class there is nothing I can do about it.

It sounds like your listening to them and they said they had fought templars. So they can speak on their own experiences. On top of that people who have been playing them since the beginning have said they are fine. The only thing that needs to be looked at is whether jabs is getting full damage on shields and if this is intended. However, that has nothing to do with mobility or better defense.

The folks who keep asking this should at least clarify what exactly this will solve. Every post just sounds like a bunch of QQ because your templar got beat up so it MUST be the class. Then the solution is something they heard from a youtube video or stream, of which they take conpletely out of context.

No class is perfect and shouldnt be. Weaknesses and Strenghts, learn to adjust instead of asking the devs for some fix that you dont even completely understand. Saying that I would gladly hop on the bandwagon here if some logical point was made and not a bunch of "I (I mean the class) sucks, gimme gimme gimme.

Not entirely. Considering the perspective of the "enemy" is important, but the problem is that it is only half the story, which leads to inaccurate assessments. It is why people who have lacked the scientific understand of natural phenomenon often attributed it to magic or divine agency.

I - and others - have played templars from the beginning and I don't think they are fine. There are a host of issues that need to be looked at besides biting jabs and shields. Eclipse is currently unsuitable for the AvAvA format, the class shield is worthless, radiant destruction fails in its purpose as an execute, the healing ultimate underperforms badly, etc, etc.

What people have said, which you claim they have not, is the templar currently has a weakness (no mobility) and does *not* have the proper strength (ability to hold ground). Hence, the title of the thread. It's not just gimme, gimme, gimme. It's make the class competent at one or the other.

Radiant destruction is now working as intended, previously it was overpowered, but now if I use it on anyone below 25% I am guaranteed a kill, it still does huge damage as an execute

And remembrance is a brilliant ultimate heal imo, mine is currently a 36k heal, without crits, along side giving me 16500 armor, (so capping me) and 23% reduction to everyone in the area.

I can literally run into a group of enemies, pop it and become invincible, in fact it's one of my best trolling skills as often enough AD and EP are always camping our spawn in IC, often there's no less than 40 of them, so when I'm on my own I'll aggro a banner man, jump right into the enemy, pop remembrance which keeps me alive long enough for the banner man to do an aoe and therefore aggro the enemy players. Them watch the carnage.

It's quite funny

eliisra

zornyan wrote: »

I can literally run into a group of enemies, pop it and become invincible, in fact it's one of my best trolling skills as often enough AD and EP are always camping our spawn in IC, often there's no less than 40 of them, so when I'm on my own I'll aggro a banner man, jump right into the enemy, pop remembrance which keeps me alive long enough for the banner man to do an aoe and therefore aggro the enemy players. Them watch the carnage.

It's quite funny

Yeah it's funny over here to. PC master race, we laugh at lonely templars, randomly channelling Remembrance in the middle of enemies, like it's going to save them from anything, kill anything or make a difference. You know you can interrupt it with Deep Breath right?

It's nice in groups of course, especially now when many DK's have quit or re-rolled stamina so you rarely get shut down when using heal ulti. But that's not the point of this thread. I mean, we all know templars are great group healers.

I'm just going to quote this guy, because the verbalizes the issue really well.

Joy_Division wrote: »

What people have said, which you claim they have not, is the templar currently has a weakness (no mobility) and does *not* have the proper strength (ability to hold ground). Hence, the title of the thread. It's not just gimme, gimme, gimme. It's make the class competent at one or the other.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

Joy_Division wrote: »

Not entirely. Considering the perspective of the "enemy" is important, but the problem is that it is only half the story, which leads to inaccurate assessments. It is why people who have lacked the scientific understand of natural phenomenon often attributed it to magic or divine agency.

Interesting philosophical idea. I don't consider anyone to be my enemy because they have a different opinion than me. Mostly I welcome it, my point is that Templar are not suck, do not need mobility, and have probably the best defense in the game. I simply do not share Zinaroth's and many others opinion of the class.

Joy_Division wrote: »

I - and others - have played templars from the beginning and I don't think they are fine.

Why are you still playing one? It's defined as insanity to keep doing something and expecting a different result. If the class does not fit you and you think something else would, go that direction.

Joy_Division wrote: »

Eclipse is currently unsuitable for the AvAvA format,

Yes, but 1v1 it's pretty darn good.

Joy_Division wrote: »

the class shield is worthless

Really it always has been for a Magicka Templar. Harness Magicka and Healing Ward have always been superior.

Joy_Division wrote: »

, radiant destruction fails in its purpose as an execute,

Disagree.

Joy_Division wrote: »

the healing ultimate underperforms badly, etc, etc.

In solo PvP yes. Even in group, yeah definitely not good. For 4-man dungeon groups, it's great. Switch Ultimates for what your doing.

Joy_Division wrote: »

What people have said, which you claim they have not, is the templar currently has a weakness (no mobility) and does *not* have the proper strength (ability to hold ground). Hence, the title of the thread. It's not just gimme, gimme, gimme. It's make the class competent at one or the other.

Sure, mobility can be considered a weakness if your forced to take a death cause you cant get away from a Zerg or your getting beat by a better player. As far as the ability to stand your ground, Templars do that very well. Like I said, if you plan on running low mitigation and spamming BoL to stay alive. This is not the fault of the class, it's your build.

If you want to PvP and don't want to get rekt, make the necessary changes and you wont.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

In all fairness, the Templar does need some work. Understand this though, people asked for an Execute and we lost Blinding Flashes and got Radiant Destruction. So if we get Mobility or some really AWESOME Defense ability, we have to lose something. And because that would be nice, we will have to lose something nice for it. What exactly is that? And would you give up say Jabs just so you can streak around the Battlefield? They are not just going to give us a 6th ability in our class tree.

Joy_Division

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

Interesting philosophical idea. I don't consider anyone to be my enemy because they have a different opinion than me. Mostly I welcome it, my point is that Templar are not suck, do not need mobility, and have probably the best defense in the game. I simply do not share Zinaroth's and many others opinion of the class.

Sure, mobility can be considered a weakness if your forced to take a death cause you cant get away from a Zerg or your getting beat by a better player. As far as the ability to stand your ground, Templars do that very well. Like I said, if you plan on running low mitigation and spamming BoL to stay alive. This is not the fault of the class, it's your build.

If you want to PvP and don't want to get rekt, make the necessary changes and you wont.

Enemy = figurative term for an opponent. NBs, DKS, and Sorcs perspective of templars is from fighting them, not necessarily playing them. It's not someone who disagrees with you.

I play a templar because I like healing and none of the other classes are particularly good at it in PvP and since I am aware of its flaws and quirky mechanics, I can compete in just about any situation I am in. Just because I think a class has issues and needs reform doesn't mean I'm insane for playing one and doesn't mean I don't have fun playing it.

Why are you telling my that in narrow situations sometimes the templars skills I listed do their job? That's what I said. A Templar has a great ultimate for 4 man daily pledges that I can complete with my eyes closed? Gee, that sounds like fun. Why does my ultimate have to suck in actual competitive environments?

If you think I get rekt and need a better build, switch your campaign to Azura's and see for yourself.

zornyan

eliisra wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

I can literally run into a group of enemies, pop it and become invincible, in fact it's one of my best trolling skills as often enough AD and EP are always camping our spawn in IC, often there's no less than 40 of them, so when I'm on my own I'll aggro a banner man, jump right into the enemy, pop remembrance which keeps me alive long enough for the banner man to do an aoe and therefore aggro the enemy players. Them watch the carnage.

It's quite funny

Yeah it's funny over here to. PC master race, we laugh at lonely templars, randomly channelling Remembrance in the middle of enemies, like it's going to save them from anything, kill anything or make a difference. You know you can interrupt it with Deep Breath right?

It's nice in groups of course, especially now when many DK's have quit or re-rolled stamina so you rarely get shut down when using heal ulti. But that's not the point of this thread. I mean, we all know templars are great group healers.

I'm just going to quote this guy, because the verbalizes the issue really well.

Joy_Division wrote: »

What people have said, which you claim they have not, is the templar currently has a weakness (no mobility) and does *not* have the proper strength (ability to hold ground). Hence, the title of the thread. It's not just gimme, gimme, gimme. It's make the class competent at one or the other.

Maybe that's a pc related bug? I've had all sorts cast on me and never had it intereupted, as obviously you are immune to everything whilst channeling the skill.

I find it useful when being ganked in the sewers, for instance the other day I was killing mobs, and after finishing off the banelord I had a nightblade gank me, my resources were pretty Damm low, so i quickly popped channel focus, and then rememberance.

I was back up to full health, I had regened a chunk of magicka, and the nightblade had done his little burst routine, I turned round, knocked him down and jabbed him to death, of course proceeded by a teabag as it also netted me 8k stones

Molag_Crow

Oh trust me, Remembrance can be interrupted... happened to me many times, last night too. :S

Zinaroth

zornyan wrote: »

Maybe that's a pc related bug?

Ah so you play on console? That explains a lot.

The meta game on console is a completely different thing.
People's ability to react isn't as high as on PC.
This creates a battlefield at a way slower pace.

When everything happens at a slower pace some of the issues with templars become less appearent because their problem is that they can't keep up with the other classes because of long cast times and channels, spell animations etc.

TBH I didn't expect a console player to even take part in this discussion since they can't have much experience given it released what, 4 months ago, on console.

EDIT: This is not meant as an offense, people can play on whatever platform they're on. I'm sure console has some areas where content is harder than on PC because lack of addons and reaction time and worse controls.

Molag_Crow

And you know what? I'd completely drop this whole topic (if I could) if ZOS, instead listened to "We Are ESO" Podcast and actually made PvP better as a whole, rather than us debating one class; Templar.

contact.opiumb16_ESO

templars were good before 1.6, then nerf to oblivion, and it's not because a 10ish good templars with 1K+ cp and full very end game stuff can compete that temps are "fine", they don't. Tons of proofs have been given on this forum, with pages and pages of highly detailed threads explaining the broken mecanics, useless passives, lake of ressource management etc.

The biggest issue for templars is their lack of good CC (like blinding flash was) and mobility. I can deal with mobility, DK and temps are supposed to be tough (but slow movement), actually templars are not, just slow with no control. Give us back our blinding flash, radiant oppression is almost nerf to oblivion (long cast but can be dodged, before the undodgeable aspect was the only reason to use it, because with a classic crushing shok-light attack-reflective light i have a better dps WITHOU channeling a beam).

I don't even speak about useless eclipse etc etc etc...