Give Templar's Mobility/Stronger Defense.

zornyan

contact.opiumb16_ESO wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

What you don't have CC on pc? Jesus you guys got it hard, I mean it's impossible to imagine using something like javelin to knockback someone, and then quickly animation cancel to a dark flare for a strong initial attack....

Noo nope no can't do that, just sit there and QQ that you get owned.

I'm not self praising, I openly say I'm an averaged skilled player, and that there are far better players around, yet some of those players I know are templars, and do incredibly well, as in unkillable hard hitting and can take on groups of 4 players by themselves incredibly well.

Hardly a broken useless class ...think about DK s for a moment, their only self heal has become utterly uselsss.

So, please dude, you are really think you are better in PVP than people who play templar SINCE BETA !? Better than top 10 templars EU ranked 50 !? clap clap clap !

Your inability to read what I've written is astounding, have a L2P.

contact.opiumb16_ESO

zornyan wrote: »

contact.opiumb16_ESO wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

What you don't have CC on pc? Jesus you guys got it hard, I mean it's impossible to imagine using something like javelin to knockback someone, and then quickly animation cancel to a dark flare for a strong initial attack....

Noo nope no can't do that, just sit there and QQ that you get owned.

I'm not self praising, I openly say I'm an averaged skilled player, and that there are far better players around, yet some of those players I know are templars, and do incredibly well, as in unkillable hard hitting and can take on groups of 4 players by themselves incredibly well.

Hardly a broken useless class ...think about DK s for a moment, their only self heal has become utterly uselsss.

So, please dude, you are really think you are better in PVP than people who play templar SINCE BETA !? Better than top 10 templars EU ranked 50 !? clap clap clap !

Your inability to read what I've written is astounding, have a L2P.

Yeah sure u 2 strong for me bra'.

Please guys don't feed and come back to our thread : lack of mobility/aoe CC/efficient shield for templars.

Ps : do you guys know how to block a guy like him on forums ?

SneaK

Fix Elusive Mist
Make Blazing Shield bust Snares

I'd be happy with one of those.

zornyan

contact.opiumb16_ESO wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

contact.opiumb16_ESO wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

What you don't have CC on pc? Jesus you guys got it hard, I mean it's impossible to imagine using something like javelin to knockback someone, and then quickly animation cancel to a dark flare for a strong initial attack....

Noo nope no can't do that, just sit there and QQ that you get owned.

I'm not self praising, I openly say I'm an averaged skilled player, and that there are far better players around, yet some of those players I know are templars, and do incredibly well, as in unkillable hard hitting and can take on groups of 4 players by themselves incredibly well.

Hardly a broken useless class ...think about DK s for a moment, their only self heal has become utterly uselsss.

So, please dude, you are really think you are better in PVP than people who play templar SINCE BETA !? Better than top 10 templars EU ranked 50 !? clap clap clap !

Your inability to read what I've written is astounding, have a L2P.

Yeah sure u 2 strong for me bra'.

Please guys don't feed and come back to our thread : lack of mobility/aoe CC/efficient shield for templars.

Ps : do you guys know how to block a guy like him on forums ?

Bro do you even English?

dodgehopper_ESO

zornyan wrote: »

What you don't have CC on pc? Jesus you guys got it hard, I mean it's impossible to imagine using something like javelin to knockback someone, and then quickly animation cancel to a dark flare for a strong initial attack....

Noo nope no can't do that, just sit there and QQ that you get owned.

I'm not self praising, I openly say I'm an averaged skilled player, and that there are far better players around, yet some of those players I know are templars, and do incredibly well, as in unkillable hard hitting and can take on groups of 4 players by themselves incredibly well.

Hardly a broken useless class ...think about DK s for a moment, their only self heal has become utterly uselsss.

I'm not sure it helps your argument that you're comparing to what many consider the weakest pvp class right now. The thing about Templars is that they've generally been #3 and #4 the whole history of the game. The only time people freaked out about them is when radiant destruction came out. This skill was fairly easy to counter though even when it was really good. The only time I really had a problem with defending against it was when I was out of resources, which means any other class could have taken advantage of the situation as well.

Dark flare would be a lot more enticing to players if it operated a bit like crystal fragments. The only problem with that is that it can hit multiple enemies. It would do wonders for Mag Templar dps though, and would have made radiant destruction unnecessary as well. I know a lot of players were asking for this. I'm not really sure that would have been the way to go, all I know is that as a Turtle-Templar I preferred my blinding flashes.

Templar has had its mitigation slowly eroded over time. I really think Blazing Shield needs a rework. It use to be a staple of Templar combat, but it is getting to the point that all of the out of class shields are way better. The real issue with Blazing Shield is that it is the classes rebound damage skill (compare to boundless storm <20 seconds> or Spike armor <20 seconds>). At one point it represented a real deterrent, and forced players to try and escape melee range, which is why its duration is so low compared to other classes. The long duration of shields that other classes use (For the same cost) means they can keep those shields up proactively instead of reactively, which is a huge advantage on magicka savings (I might add those classes also have better magicka regeneration innately).

All of this is supposedly because Templars have better healing than other classes. This might be the case, but I wouldn't say they have better self healing than other classes. My Argonian Nightblade's health almost never dips because of the ludicrous self regen I can get on him, when he's in his siphon build, and he's probably not even the best race to do this with (Nord, Orc, Imperial). My Sorcerer despite what people say seems to heal himself quite a lot from crits and dark abilities and (when I use them) pet death, finally I have dark exchange. I'm not sure how people don't consider that a heal. I agree you have to time it, and it can be interrupted, BUT SO CAN MANY TEMPLAR HEALS! Breath of Life is great, so much so I'm not sure anyone uses the single target morph. I'm not arguing that point, though I will say the class could use a Morph for guaranteed self healing (You do realize that Stamina Templars have inferior self heals to every other class right?). The strength of the Nightblade/Sorc self heals is that they are derived from aggressive activities. These two classes are hurting the enemy while they're receiving heals, which means the relative health differences between the two parties are not so different. A Templar spamming Breath of Life isn't doing much but delaying the inevitable. I'll agree this is an oversimplification, but I think it needs to be said because I'm tired of Templar being treated as 'just the healer class'. The issues with dragonblood are a problem, but ultimately a separate issue. Additionally a Stamina DK can get superior self healing to a Templar all day long between battle roar, coagulating blood, obsidian shield (health boosting morph), vigor and rally.

The biggest problem with Templars is broken and wonky skills, which has been stated and restated since the beginning. The class has huge problems with respect to CC: We've lost our best cc (blinding flashes), Blazing Spear is a very weak/slow single target cc, binding javelin is fine, and jabs/eclipse are treated as cc. The Jabs/Eclipse problem is really the biggest part of the equation. The Loss of an AoE cc is a huge problem for tanks, whose job it is to be the controller in most situations. This is why in dungeon/raid scenarios people favor the DK. I use to be able to handle spamming Caltrops/Hunter in the dungeon situation for this purpose, but with the block nerf it killed Templar CC in raiding. You just can't afford to use that much stamina even in a stamina heavy build, and still tank things. I'm of the opinion that the best players in the game are Templars who are top ranked, because they are fighting with the deck stacked against them. Everything a Templar does is telegraphed and slow; if you get beaten by a templar it is because you're either undergeared/Cp'd or your timing is no where near as good as that Templar player.

AfkNinja

It makes no sense that Stamina Templar is in last place for self healing options.

zornyan

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

What you don't have CC on pc? Jesus you guys got it hard, I mean it's impossible to imagine using something like javelin to knockback someone, and then quickly animation cancel to a dark flare for a strong initial attack....

Noo nope no can't do that, just sit there and QQ that you get owned.

I'm not self praising, I openly say I'm an averaged skilled player, and that there are far better players around, yet some of those players I know are templars, and do incredibly well, as in unkillable hard hitting and can take on groups of 4 players by themselves incredibly well.

Hardly a broken useless class ...think about DK s for a moment, their only self heal has become utterly uselsss.

I'm not sure it helps your argument that you're comparing to what many consider the weakest pvp class right now. The thing about Templars is that they've generally been #3 and #4 the whole history of the game. The only time people freaked out about them is when radiant destruction came out. This skill was fairly easy to counter though even when it was really good. The only time I really had a problem with defending against it was when I was out of resources, which means any other class could have taken advantage of the situation as well.

Dark flare would be a lot more enticing to players if it operated a bit like crystal fragments. The only problem with that is that it can hit multiple enemies. It would do wonders for Mag Templar dps though, and would have made radiant destruction unnecessary as well. I know a lot of players were asking for this. I'm not really sure that would have been the way to go, all I know is that as a Turtle-Templar I preferred my blinding flashes.

Templar has had its mitigation slowly eroded over time. I really think Blazing Shield needs a rework. It use to be a staple of Templar combat, but it is getting to the point that all of the out of class shields are way better. The real issue with Blazing Shield is that it is the classes rebound damage skill (compare to boundless storm <20 seconds> or Spike armor <20 seconds>). At one point it represented a real deterrent, and forced players to try and escape melee range, which is why its duration is so low compared to other classes. The long duration of shields that other classes use (For the same cost) means they can keep those shields up proactively instead of reactively, which is a huge advantage on magicka savings (I might add those classes also have better magicka regeneration innately).

All of this is supposedly because Templars have better healing than other classes. This might be the case, but I wouldn't say they have better self healing than other classes. My Argonian Nightblade's health almost never dips because of the ludicrous self regen I can get on him, when he's in his siphon build, and he's probably not even the best race to do this with (Nord, Orc, Imperial). My Sorcerer despite what people say seems to heal himself quite a lot from crits and dark abilities and (when I use them) pet death, finally I have dark exchange. I'm not sure how people don't consider that a heal. I agree you have to time it, and it can be interrupted, BUT SO CAN MANY TEMPLAR HEALS! Breath of Life is great, so much so I'm not sure anyone uses the single target morph. I'm not arguing that point, though I will say the class could use a Morph for guaranteed self healing (You do realize that Stamina Templars have inferior self heals to every other class right?). The strength of the Nightblade/Sorc self heals is that they are derived from aggressive activities. These two classes are hurting the enemy while they're receiving heals, which means the relative health differences between the two parties are not so different. A Templar spamming Breath of Life isn't doing much but delaying the inevitable. I'll agree this is an oversimplification, but I think it needs to be said because I'm tired of Templar being treated as 'just the healer class'. The issues with dragonblood are a problem, but ultimately a separate issue. Additionally a Stamina DK can get superior self healing to a Templar all day long between battle roar, coagulating blood, obsidian shield (health boosting morph), vigor and rally.

The biggest problem with Templars is broken and wonky skills, which has been stated and restated since the beginning. The class has huge problems with respect to CC: We've lost our best cc (blinding flashes), Blazing Spear is a very weak/slow single target cc, binding javelin is fine, and jabs/eclipse are treated as cc. The Jabs/Eclipse problem is really the biggest part of the equation. The Loss of an AoE cc is a huge problem for tanks, whose job it is to be the controller in most situations. This is why in dungeon/raid scenarios people favor the DK. I use to be able to handle spamming Caltrops/Hunter in the dungeon situation for this purpose, but with the block nerf it killed Templar CC in raiding. You just can't afford to use that much stamina even in a stamina heavy build, and still tank things. I'm of the opinion that the best players in the game are Templars who are top ranked, because they are fighting with the deck stacked against them. Everything a Templar does is telegraphed and slow; if you get beaten by a templar it is because you're either undergeared/Cp'd or your timing is no where near as good as that Templar player.

I think the thing people forget the most is the side buffs/debuffs we can maintain.

Take dark flare, it hits fairly hard, I agree the frags treatment is wrong for it, it's often an opener for me if I time my cc right, as the 35% heal debuff is just too good, it renders enemy heals useless, yes they can purge but it puts them on the immediate defense.

I do think blazing needs a bit of reworking, I have seen a couple people that stacked health as a joke and just spammed blazing, and it was quite hilarious as it was hitting enemies for 9k+ damage even after the 50% damage reduction.

Templar hang IS top notch imo, breath of life heals for insane numbers for an insta cast spammable ability that hits 3 targets, even in pvp as long as I keep purifying light up it literally heals me for my entire health bar, so although we haven't got a 10k shield, we only need to cast a single skill to regenerate our health instantly, which is near enough the same ?

Far as I think, all they could do is remove the CC from jabs, maybe allow a 20% heal for stam users from damage, and maybe a stam heal for the stam builds, although in fairness, jabs is the hardest hitting stam skill available, add to that they can use purifying as a cheap purge, and rune focus for a cheap armor buff, it's not the worst place to be in.

But that's the same issue most stam builds have, DK and even sorcs, as although they have only a couple skills, they are both very ineffective compared to their magicka builds, but I think that's more of a magicka vs stamina state that needs reworking entirely.

Ultimately if they merely fixed actual issues, like jabs not applying damage to shields, elusive mist mitigation, toppling charge sometimes glitching oh and radiant keeping me stuck in the animation when it's been cancelled.

I.e I cast radiant destruction, enemy rolls, yet my hand is still pointing towards them, yet no more beams and no more damage until I hit block.

I think just these basic fixes will make people alot happier, maybe remove jabs cc at the same time to see how it goes.

AfkNinja

zornyan wrote: »

"maybe allow a 20% heal for stam users from damage, and maybe a stam heal for the stam builds"

Honestly I don't think we even need a stamina heal or 20% of our dmg converted to healing. Just allow our restoring light passives to work on ALL heals (Like DK passives). This would make Rally and Vigor as good as a Dragon Knights Rally/Vigor and would at least give us back our identity as the healing class, mostly.

zornyan

AfkNinja wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

"maybe allow a 20% heal for stam users from damage, and maybe a stam heal for the stam builds"

Honestly I don't think we even need a stamina heal or 20% of our dmg converted to healing. Just allow our restoring light passives to work on ALL heals (Like DK passives). This would make Rally and Vigor as good as a Dragon Knights Rally/Vigor and would at least give us back our identity as the healing class, mostly.

I thought that the passives do? Such as lay down purifying/rune focus and the 30% buff applies to all heals? Including stamina?

dodgehopper_ESO

zornyan wrote: »

AfkNinja wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

"maybe allow a 20% heal for stam users from damage, and maybe a stam heal for the stam builds"

Honestly I don't think we even need a stamina heal or 20% of our dmg converted to healing. Just allow our restoring light passives to work on ALL heals (Like DK passives). This would make Rally and Vigor as good as a Dragon Knights Rally/Vigor and would at least give us back our identity as the healing class, mostly.

I thought that the passives do? Such as lay down purifying/rune focus and the 30% buff applies to all heals? Including stamina?

It use to. If you pick the morph of rune focus that buffs healing received, you lose out on the most important form of magicka regen that Templars receive. It is ironic since other classes received their passive regen buff (Nightblade) in recent updates. Given the cost/duration of Templar abilities this actually is an issue, and doesn't change the fact that you're stuck standing there in Restoring Focus to get bonus to your stamina HoT's. Purifying ritual is more about purging ill effects, and a magicka heal, so I'm not sure where you're going with this one. A Stamina Nb can fire funnel health/sap essence too, which simultaneously boosts his healing received because its a siphon skill on the bar (passive effect). This is a pretty huge qualitative difference, being stuck to stand in a tiny circle or being 100% mobile and speedy. An effect coming off a passive is far more favorable than an effect coming from a click, which is one reason Nightblade has become so powerful.

Templar once had bonus to healing as a part of its passives. When they pulled that, it really hurt the class, in part because everything a Templar has relies upon them being rooted to a location. The problem with the rooted to location issue is that those abilities don't have greater strength than the alternatives (and should) because lack of mobility is an important balance concern. If you lose something, you should get something to make up for it. Additionally, I don't know of any other class that has to choose between their magicka regen buff, and healing received buff. Most Templar players I have seen talk about the issue agree the magicka regen buff is way more useful and necessary. I'd be more apt to accept the Rune Focus issue if it actually followed the player. Other classes get their major/minor armor/sr buff much easier along with other cool secondary effects.

Within the confines of a stamina build it is an issue.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

CrowsDescend wrote: »

If you check my video here, look at that perfect timing on Healing Ward.... that saved me there, for a few extra seconds...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBytE-7HrR4

But saying that, because Healing Ward seems to be my only defensive (along with spamming BoL when I can) then I have to time it right, for the 300%(?) stronger shield at low health. When I get low, I usually, instantly die (because of execute abilities of course...)

Remembrance on your back bar. Take that *** off there if your not running dungeons. Also Shards on your backbar needs to go if your soloing. Put Rune Focus in it's place and run Empowering Sweeps as your Ultimate for the crit bonus and you could of reduced their damage by 27%.

Your also missing potions on your quickslot. There is room for improvement there and the video isn't a good indication of Templar issues. You made quite a few mistakes.

Molag_Crow

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

If you check my video here, look at that perfect timing on Healing Ward.... that saved me there, for a few extra seconds...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBytE-7HrR4

But saying that, because Healing Ward seems to be my only defensive (along with spamming BoL when I can) then I have to time it right, for the 300%(?) stronger shield at low health. When I get low, I usually, instantly die (because of execute abilities of course...)

Remembrance on your back bar. Take that *** off there if your not running dungeons. Also Shards on your backbar needs to go if your soloing. Put Rune Focus in it's place and run Empowering Sweeps as your Ultimate for the crit bonus and you could of reduced their damage by 27%.

Your also missing potions on your quickslot. There is room for improvement there and the video isn't a good indication of Templar issues. You made quite a few mistakes.

@Enraged_Tiki_Torch I appreciate the tips and all (especially about the ultimate) but I change abilities around so often, because I'm always experimenting or changing them when I'm aware of an upcoming fight, like Eclipse for Sorcs, etc.

The reason Repentance is on my main bar is for the recovery, but when I really think about it, you're right.. I'd be better using that recovery advantage with my heals.

I actually forgot to quickslot potions in that fight because it was unexpected. I was on the cliff, setting up a ballista to aim down at the players fighting (weren't sure if they were all friendly or not until they got close) so it was one of those f up moments anyway...

I didn't make the video to show Templar issues it was actually a video from my Wrecking Blow topic, a kind of.. 'jab at wrecking blow spammers' if you will, in an amusing-ish kind of way.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

I don't think the Restoring passive that gave 30% buff to healing has ever worked on anything outside of abilities in that line. This has been an issue for as long as I can remember, mostly pointed out with the Restoration Staff abilities not working with Templar passives.

Molag_Crow

Oh and my drinks ran out on the video too, as you can tell by my slow Stamina regen before I died.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

CrowsDescend wrote: »

I didn't make the video to show Templar issues it was actually a video from my Wrecking Blow topic, a kind of.. 'jab at wrecking blow spammers' if you will, in an amusing-ish kind of way.

K understood.

Molag_Crow

@Enraged_Tiki_Torch I honestly never payed attention to Empowering Sweep before, so it's great that you pointed it out... from my last skill point reset, I haven't spent any points in it to see that morph, so thanks! I'll definitely give it a shot now

Molag_Crow

Oh and excuse my other comment, I got mixed up with Repentance and Remembrance... only just realized after reading your comment again

How come you don't like remembrance ultimate on your back bar? I find it comes in handy at times, like when you bump into others in a sticky situation, hmmm

dodgehopper_ESO

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Oh and excuse my other comment, I got mixed up with Repentance and Remembrance... only just realized after reading your comment again

How come you don't like remembrance ultimate on your back bar? I find it comes in handy at times, like when you bump into others in a sticky situation, hmmm

Probably because Nova (dawn wrath ultimate & morphs) can do things like damage + snare + 30% damage reduction, and empowering sweep can help you tank large amounts of damage for short duration. I do think having someone using Remembrance in a group setting is not a bad idea, particularly when combined with other players using War Horn, Nova, Eclipse, Standard, etc. Its nice for a capture the flag scenario, potentially, but not so optimal to have all Templars on a team using it.

Molag_Crow

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Oh and excuse my other comment, I got mixed up with Repentance and Remembrance... only just realized after reading your comment again

How come you don't like remembrance ultimate on your back bar? I find it comes in handy at times, like when you bump into others in a sticky situation, hmmm

Probably because Nova (dawn wrath ultimate & morphs) can do things like damage + snare + 30% damage reduction, and empowering sweep can help you tank large amounts of damage for short duration. I do think having someone using Remembrance in a group setting is not a bad idea, particularly when combined with other players using War Horn, Nova, Eclipse, Standard, etc. Its nice for a capture the flag scenario, potentially, but not so optimal to have all Templars on a team using it.

Yeah, I suppose so.. Nova costs quite a lot of ultimate, but so did Bat Swarm, damn... I miss having Bat Swarm tbh, but Vampires are in a bad spot at the moment... although that's another story lol.

dodgehopper_ESO

CrowsDescend wrote: »

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Oh and excuse my other comment, I got mixed up with Repentance and Remembrance... only just realized after reading your comment again

How come you don't like remembrance ultimate on your back bar? I find it comes in handy at times, like when you bump into others in a sticky situation, hmmm

Probably because Nova (dawn wrath ultimate & morphs) can do things like damage + snare + 30% damage reduction, and empowering sweep can help you tank large amounts of damage for short duration. I do think having someone using Remembrance in a group setting is not a bad idea, particularly when combined with other players using War Horn, Nova, Eclipse, Standard, etc. Its nice for a capture the flag scenario, potentially, but not so optimal to have all Templars on a team using it.

Yeah, I suppose so.. Nova costs quite a lot of ultimate, but so did Bat Swarm, damn... I miss having Bat Swarm tbh, but Vampires are in a bad spot at the moment... although that's another story lol.

I like vampires, but I'm hoping the sneak speed bonus will be available in other ways. I just don't like feeling forced into being a vampire while thieving. A comparable Sneak Speed bonus would be awesome as something to be earned by Thieves Guild skills in the future (really hopeful they do something like this), otherwise my Argonian's awesome green scales will always be chalk white. I'd actually like to see something like this in the thief line that would let us hop higher too (acrobatics skill?) like Oblivion and earlier. A blinding powder effect might be nice as well (for thieves escaping guards, both npc and player).

Back to topic though, the big advantage there of Remembrance is that it gives you time to regenerate resources while still laying down heals/protection for the team. Its a good 'catch your breath' mechanic for a healer that is being overwhelmed by the need to heal his team mates. Beyond that there are active skills with equal benefit.

Molag_Crow

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Oh and excuse my other comment, I got mixed up with Repentance and Remembrance... only just realized after reading your comment again

How come you don't like remembrance ultimate on your back bar? I find it comes in handy at times, like when you bump into others in a sticky situation, hmmm

Probably because Nova (dawn wrath ultimate & morphs) can do things like damage + snare + 30% damage reduction, and empowering sweep can help you tank large amounts of damage for short duration. I do think having someone using Remembrance in a group setting is not a bad idea, particularly when combined with other players using War Horn, Nova, Eclipse, Standard, etc. Its nice for a capture the flag scenario, potentially, but not so optimal to have all Templars on a team using it.

Yeah, I suppose so.. Nova costs quite a lot of ultimate, but so did Bat Swarm, damn... I miss having Bat Swarm tbh, but Vampires are in a bad spot at the moment... although that's another story lol.

I like vampires, but I'm hoping the sneak speed bonus will be available in other ways. I just don't like feeling forced into being a vampire while thieving. A comparable Sneak Speed bonus would be awesome as something to be earned by Thieves Guild skills in the future (really hopeful they do something like this), otherwise my Argonian's awesome green scales will always be chalk white. I'd actually like to see something like this in the thief line that would let us hop higher too (acrobatics skill?) like Oblivion and earlier. A blinding powder effect might be nice as well (for thieves escaping guards, both npc and player).

Back to topic though, the big advantage there of Remembrance is that it gives you time to regenerate resources while still laying down heals/protection for the team. Its a good 'catch your breath' mechanic for a healer that is being overwhelmed by the need to heal his team mates. Beyond that there are active skills with equal benefit.

Hope they do add some nice passives to the Thieves Guild similar to what you've said, and ability like a smoke bomb or something to cause a distraction... maybe even a dummy? like, you place a holographic dummy of yourself that lasts for a short time, I don't know but yeah, that's one of the main reasons to why I use Remembrance... love the animation of it too, when spell effects don't bug out (console)

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

CrowsDescend wrote: »

How come you don't like remembrance ultimate on your back bar? I find it comes in handy at times, like when you bump into others in a sticky situation, hmmm

It's not that I don't like it. Soloing, it just doesn't do enough for the cost. Remembrance is good for group play in dungeons mostly. In PvP, it only has a 20m radius and people tend to get spread out cause your rooted, and it puts a HUGE target on your back. Sure, you will likely survive the 4 seconds your channeled but you'll have everyone on your butt afterwards. Sweeps is 8 seconds so it costs almost half as much and lasts twice as long which gives you more options, whether you need to survive a barrage of players or you just need extra time to try to kill someone before you need to heal up again. BoL does enough healing for you or your group in 90% of the cases, so Remembrance becomes redundant.

Molag_Crow

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

How come you don't like remembrance ultimate on your back bar? I find it comes in handy at times, like when you bump into others in a sticky situation, hmmm

It's not that I don't like it. Soloing, it just doesn't do enough for the cost. Remembrance is good for group play in dungeons mostly. In PvP, it only has a 20m radius and people tend to get spread out cause your rooted, and it puts a HUGE target on your back. Sure, you will likely survive the 4 seconds your channeled but you'll have everyone on your butt afterwards. Sweeps is 8 seconds so it costs almost half as much and lasts twice as long which gives you more options, whether you need to survive a barrage of players or you just need extra time to try to kill someone before you need to heal up again. BoL does enough healing for you or your group in 90% of the cases, so Remembrance becomes redundant.

@Enraged_Tiki_Torch

Very valid points right there. Thanks. You recommended Empowering Sweeps on the main bar, or back bar? and what other Ultimate do you recommend, or do you mean Empowering on both bars?

zornyan

I sometimes use remembersnce
on my resto bar as an anti gank device, there's been a few times I've been grinding in IC solo, to have a gankers wait for me to fight large groups and drain resources, and it's saved me a couple times as the 4 seconds or so of return whilst using a pot gives me back valuable magicka/stamina etc and in those first few seconds the gankers are usually going full force blowing through their resources.

Generally my ultimates in IC when solo grinding are

Rememberance resto bar

Dawn beaker of smiting main bar for the dps to daedra, it's also fairly handy in pvp as its un-dodgeable and does a decent amount of damage.

When strictly PvPing I use

Nova on my back bar for the mitigation, needs setting up with something like javelin/toppling charge or any other cc to get the initial drop on them, then the snare keeps the ticks hitting them.

On my front bar I like meteor, purely for the straight up damage, although it poses a big risk against anyone using a reflect, and it's blockable/purge able so easily broken.

My current favourite is soul assault, it's cheap, and hits insanely hard if you time it right, but you have to know your target, no good opening on an nb that's going to roll dodge out of it, needs to be used just as your target is running low on resources/has roll dodged too many times etc to get any decent damage out of it.

But use it at that perfect moment and it's a guaranteed kill, I also like to use it when shield stackers are on the defence, second you've CC'd them a few times and they start to go full shield stack defence, pop it as a cheap way of blasting some shields down, yes they'll recast a few times but that's costing them precious magicka and allowing you to continue the assault.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

@CrowsDescend

Back bar. Depends, I like Ice Comet but you can go Dawnbreaker of Smiting, etc. I use Combat Prayer on my healing bar which is very particular to my build. So the 8% damage increase is great cause it's the hardest hitting ULTI in game, so the combo Combat Prayer > Ice Comet wrecks people. It also snares for 85% so you can land a jab afterwards if needed. Wait for them to dodgeroll out of the snare and hit em with Radiant Oppression. Against a skilled player 1v1, Id go with Dawnbreaker cause of the cost and it being undodgeable. Really depends on what your doing or better how you want to kill them.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

zornyan wrote: »

Nova on my back bar for the mitigation, needs setting up with something like javelin/toppling charge or any other cc to get the initial drop on them, then the snare keeps the ticks hitting them.

On my front bar I like meteor, purely for the straight up damage, although it poses a big risk against anyone using a reflect, and it's blockable/purge able so easily broken.

My current favourite is soul assault, it's cheap, and hits insanely hard if you time it right, but you have to know your target, no good opening on an nb that's going to roll dodge out of it, needs to be used just as your target is running low on resources/has roll dodged too many times etc to get any decent damage out of it.

Yeah I like Soul Assault too. Should of added that as it definitely has it's place. /agree

Nova to me seems outclassed by Ice Comet in every way, people generally want to get out of it instead of attacking you so the Mitigation is wasted. Sweeps has more spike damage too. In a group, it's great though.

You can setup Meteor the same way with a CC. Best way imo being Reverberating Bash since the disorient is unaffected by CC immunity (a.k.a the pointless knockback Jabs has).

zornyan

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

Nova on my back bar for the mitigation, needs setting up with something like javelin/toppling charge or any other cc to get the initial drop on them, then the snare keeps the ticks hitting them.

On my front bar I like meteor, purely for the straight up damage, although it poses a big risk against anyone using a reflect, and it's blockable/purge able so easily broken.

My current favourite is soul assault, it's cheap, and hits insanely hard if you time it right, but you have to know your target, no good opening on an nb that's going to roll dodge out of it, needs to be used just as your target is running low on resources/has roll dodged too many times etc to get any decent damage out of it.

Yeah I like Soul Assault too. Should of added that as it definitely has it's place. /agree

Nova to me seems outclassed by Ice Comet in every way, people generally want to get out of it instead of attacking you so the Mitigation is wasted. Sweeps has more spike damage too. In a group, it's great though.

You can setup Meteor the same way with a CC. Best way imo being Reverberating Bash since the disorient is unaffected by CC immunity (a.k.a the pointless knockback Jabs has).

My only worry with meteor is its useless against anyone with a sword and board or a reflect, so essentially templars, DK's or any tanks, as most of them will run a reflect which means it can be easily turned against you. In the right setting it's devaststing, I use it when say, a zerg is camping our spawn, as more often than not it nets me a few easy kills, but I don't use it much 1v1 anymore due to being negated too much.

Hence why I'm moving to soul assault alot lately, or dawnbraker, may not hit as hit, but it's a guaranteed hit, and with the cheap cost it's use able quite alot.

contact.opiumb16_ESO

zornyan wrote: »

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

Nova on my back bar for the mitigation, needs setting up with something like javelin/toppling charge or any other cc to get the initial drop on them, then the snare keeps the ticks hitting them.

On my front bar I like meteor, purely for the straight up damage, although it poses a big risk against anyone using a reflect, and it's blockable/purge able so easily broken.

My current favourite is soul assault, it's cheap, and hits insanely hard if you time it right, but you have to know your target, no good opening on an nb that's going to roll dodge out of it, needs to be used just as your target is running low on resources/has roll dodged too many times etc to get any decent damage out of it.

Yeah I like Soul Assault too. Should of added that as it definitely has it's place. /agree

Nova to me seems outclassed by Ice Comet in every way, people generally want to get out of it instead of attacking you so the Mitigation is wasted. Sweeps has more spike damage too. In a group, it's great though.

You can setup Meteor the same way with a CC. Best way imo being Reverberating Bash since the disorient is unaffected by CC immunity (a.k.a the pointless knockback Jabs has).

My only worry with nova is its useless against anyone with a sword and board or a reflect, so essentially templars, DK's or any tanks, as most of them will run a reflect which means it can be easily turned against you. In the right setting it's devaststing, I use it when say, a zerg is camping our spawn, as more often than not it nets me a few easy kills, but I don't use it much 1v1 anymore due to being negated too much.

Hence why I'm moving to soul assault alot lately, or dawnbraker, may not hit as hit, but it's a guaranteed hit, and with the cheap cost it's use able quite alot.

reflecting a nova ? We really don't play the same game...

zornyan

Meant meteor.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO

jhharvest wrote: »

.

zornyan wrote: »

What you don't have CC on pc? Jesus you guys got it hard, I mean it's impossible to imagine using something like javelin to knockback someone, and then quickly animation cancel to a dark flare for a strong initial attack....

Cannot animation cancel from spell (Javelin) to spell (Dark Flare). Dark Flare cast point is 1.1s. Projectile flight is 0.3s. Enemy will dodge. Unless you run the stam morph of Javelin on your magicka Templar and the enemy doesn't CC break.

I'm missing your point Snipe has a 1 case time with up to a full 1 second in the air and people don't dodge all of those.