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Racial Disparity with Full List:
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Dekkameron✭✭✭✭✭PlagueMonk wrote: »Here is what I think the Argonian passives should look like:
Guerrilla Warfare Expertise (3 ranks) – Increases movement speed while stealthed by (7/14/21)% and increases non magicka based attacks while stealthed by (3/6/9)%
Amphibian Physiology (3 ranks) – Increases swimming speed by 50% and health regen (7/14/21)%
Argonian Hardiness (3 ranks) – Increases maximum Health by (3/6/9)% and Increases Poison/Disease resistance by 1440. Disease resistance should apply directly to disease abilities, lessening their effect by a flat amount (including meatbag catapults)
This is completely in line with other races.
Nah.. they should be..
Tail Whip: 10% Chance on melee weapon attacks to whip enemy with tail knocking them down for 3 seconds.
Cold Blooded: Movement and attack speed reduced by 20% in warm weather conditions. Movement and attack speed increase by 20% in cold weather conditions.
Amphibious: Can swim at 25% faster rate and use melee attacks whilst swimming.- Veteran Combat Librarian -4 -
Darlgon✭✭✭✭✭
✭ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »Night-claw wrote: »Argonain 50% inceased swim speed is the most useless racial i ever seen i only put points in it because of extra passive.
It's definitely the most "fluff" passive in the game, but I actually enjoy it. I swim whenever possible, and often find lots of chests tucked away in places you normally wouldn't see if you stuck to land.
Very true. Just a heads up on that.. on Bleakrock now on the PTS, the Slaughter Fish are WAY closer to land and eat a lot faster than they used to be. My VR14 Argonian with 66 CP passives barely made it back to land.Power level to CP160 in a week:
Where is the end game? You just played it.
Why don't I have 300+ skill points? Because you skipped content along the way.
Where is new content? Sigh.0 -
AlnilamE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Night-claw wrote: »Argonain 50% inceased swim speed is the most useless racial i ever seen i only put points in it because of extra passive.
Do. Not. Touch. My. Swim. Speed.
You have been warned.The Moot Councillor5 -
Night-claw✭✭✭ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »Night-claw wrote: »Argonain 50% inceased swim speed is the most useless racial i ever seen i only put points in it because of extra passive.
It's definitely the most "fluff" passive in the game, but I actually enjoy it. I swim whenever possible, and often find lots of chests tucked away in places you normally wouldn't see if you stuck to land.
i really like the Argonain race hmm maybe because i pvp alot i don't find the passive useful there isn't really any need to swim in tamriel i understand the passive there due to lure.
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Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I'm waiting to see what other changes to racials there will be before judging, but so far there do seem to be imbalances - redguard stamina regen 9%, wood elf 21% - it does not make sense for two races to have the same specialization, but one of them being more than twice as good.
In an ideal system the wood elf would also have lower strength so would do less melee damage. Of course in Bethesda's wisdom they got rid of those tried-and-true staples of RPGs and ZOS is stuck with the results.2 -
MorHawk✭✭✭✭✭I can deal with just about anything else (though I never noticed that Bosmer get more stam regen than Redguards), but those Imperial passives need to go, and fast, if ZOS is to reclaim any shred of credibility.I can count to potato.
WWJLHD?Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »another topic that cant see past its own farts.3 -
RDMyers65b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭I can deal with just about anything else (though I never noticed that Bosmer get more stam regen than Redguards), but those Imperial passives need to go, and fast, if ZOS is to reclaim any shred of credibility.
Leave my Imperials alone. The passives are fine as they are. It's simple, if you want the same passives, then buy the Imperial edition and roll up an Imperial.10 -
Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Do NOT touch my imperial passives. Orc, redguard and argonian need the biggest changes but leave imperial alone.4 -
MorHawk✭✭✭✭✭Holycannoli wrote: »Do NOT touch my imperial passives. Orc, redguard and argonian need the biggest changes but leave imperial alone.
Please, do tell us why 12% and 10%, so 22% total, is in any way balanced with the others (3-10% to one stat, only Orcs/Dunmer come close with 12% total) in a game without softcaps. Don't make me bust out the popcorn gif.
As an aside, what changes to you propose to those other three races?I can count to potato.
WWJLHD?Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »another topic that cant see past its own farts.5 -
Tamanous✭✭✭✭✭Holycannoli wrote: »Do NOT touch my imperial passives. Orc, redguard and argonian need the biggest changes but leave imperial alone.
Don't care about your selfish attitude that is completely disconnected from reality. I care about the greater balance of the game as should you.
Imperial passives are god-mode for anyone who melees. Everyone knows it and they indeed need to be brought in line with the other racials which continuously are being nerfed.
My prediction: They WILL be nerfed and you WILL cry.Edited by Tamanous on 17 February 2015 17:484 -
ArconSeptim✭✭✭✭ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »Night-claw wrote: »Argonain 50% inceased swim speed is the most useless racial i ever seen i only put points in it because of extra passive.
It's definitely the most "fluff" passive in the game, but I actually enjoy it. I swim whenever possible, and often find lots of chests tucked away in places you normally wouldn't see if you stuck to land.
It will be cool when imperial city comes out
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onlinegamer1✭✭✭✭✭
✭Holycannoli wrote: »Do NOT touch my imperial passives. Orc, redguard and argonian need the biggest changes but leave imperial alone.
Please, do tell us why 12% and 10%, so 22% total, is in any way balanced with the others (3-10% to one stat, only Orcs/Dunmer come close with 12% total) in a game without softcaps.
Because we paid RL money for that race.6 -
Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Think what you will but imperial edition won't be nerfed by much.
I want orc to lose the sprint bonus and gain a melee damage bonus. Call it savagery or whatever.0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭onlinegamer1 wrote: »Holycannoli wrote: »Do NOT touch my imperial passives. Orc, redguard and argonian need the biggest changes but leave imperial alone.
Please, do tell us why 12% and 10%, so 22% total, is in any way balanced with the others (3-10% to one stat, only Orcs/Dunmer come close with 12% total) in a game without softcaps.
Because we paid RL money for that race.
That's not a good reason. This game really does not need any more 'pay to win' accusations right now.
Better reason would be 'because ZOS is making ~20% total the new standard for racials, look at the bosmer! '
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onlinegamer1✭✭✭✭✭
✭onlinegamer1 wrote: »Holycannoli wrote: »Do NOT touch my imperial passives. Orc, redguard and argonian need the biggest changes but leave imperial alone.
Please, do tell us why 12% and 10%, so 22% total, is in any way balanced with the others (3-10% to one stat, only Orcs/Dunmer come close with 12% total) in a game without softcaps.
Because we paid RL money for that race.
That's not a good reason. This game really does not need any more 'pay to win' accusations right now.
Better reason would be 'because ZOS is making ~20% total the new standard for racials, look at the bosmer! '
No, I prefer "Because I paid RL money for that race."7 -
xylena✭✭✭✭✭as a nord, i will gladly trade "resist frost" for literally anything... swim speed, increased potato level, anything would be better than that waste of screen space... ideally it would simply provide at least 8% or so max healthRetired until we break the Tank Meta0 -
Verdwhisper✭✭✭Imperial? Really? Take away health buff, i dont care, buff red diamond, it is ridiculously useless! 10% proc. U cannot count on that.0
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MorHawk✭✭✭✭✭RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »I can deal with just about anything else (though I never noticed that Bosmer get more stam regen than Redguards), but those Imperial passives need to go, and fast, if ZOS is to reclaim any shred of credibility.
Leave my Imperials alone. The passives are fine as they are. It's simple, if you want the same passives, then buy the Imperial edition and roll up an Imperial.
I can't believe I missed this one. So you're actually trying to argue that the solution is for everyone to change to Imps? Even setting aside the time to reroll, even if race change were an option, you think that having every single player in this game rolling the same race in order to balance it is anywhere near the horizon of being a good idea?I can count to potato.
WWJLHD?Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »another topic that cant see past its own farts.3 -
MorHawk✭✭✭✭✭onlinegamer1 wrote: »onlinegamer1 wrote: »Holycannoli wrote: »Do NOT touch my imperial passives. Orc, redguard and argonian need the biggest changes but leave imperial alone.
Please, do tell us why 12% and 10%, so 22% total, is in any way balanced with the others (3-10% to one stat, only Orcs/Dunmer come close with 12% total) in a game without softcaps.
Because we paid RL money for that race.
That's not a good reason. This game really does not need any more 'pay to win' accusations right now.
Better reason would be 'because ZOS is making ~20% total the new standard for racials, look at the bosmer! '
No, I prefer "Because I paid RL money for that race."
I don't care how you spin it, that is textbook P2W, and that is not only all kinds of bad, but it directly contravenes the stated vision for this game.I can count to potato.
WWJLHD?Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »another topic that cant see past its own farts.5 -
onlinegamer1✭✭✭✭✭
✭onlinegamer1 wrote: »onlinegamer1 wrote: »Holycannoli wrote: »Do NOT touch my imperial passives. Orc, redguard and argonian need the biggest changes but leave imperial alone.
Please, do tell us why 12% and 10%, so 22% total, is in any way balanced with the others (3-10% to one stat, only Orcs/Dunmer come close with 12% total) in a game without softcaps.
Because we paid RL money for that race.
That's not a good reason. This game really does not need any more 'pay to win' accusations right now.
Better reason would be 'because ZOS is making ~20% total the new standard for racials, look at the bosmer! '
No, I prefer "Because I paid RL money for that race."
I don't care how you spin it, that is textbook P2W, and that is not only all kinds of bad, but it directly contravenes the stated vision for this game.
And I don't care. If they never add another P2W thing, I'm Ok with that. But there is 1 P2W thing in this game: Imperial Edition. And I already paid for it.5 -
MorHawk✭✭✭✭✭onlinegamer1 wrote: »And I don't care. If they never add another P2W thing, I'm Ok with that. But there is 1 P2W thing in this game: Imperial Edition. And I already paid for it.
Nice attitude. You paid for an extra race, not a competitive advantage. I paid for it too, but I would rather play another race right now. Should I be competitively penalized for my choice?
Anyhoo, as I usually do, I've made a poll. Let the people decide:
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/152183/should-imperials-be-nerfed-before-tu-goes-live
This has after all worked to make changes happen before. Let's see how this goes.I can count to potato.
WWJLHD?Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »another topic that cant see past its own farts.2 -
MrGhosty✭✭✭✭✭I don't think we can actually know how much impact these things will have on the game until they've hit live and seen a proper testing and the theorycrafters have had a chance to squeeze every ounce of performance out of things. I was disappointed by the change to my argonian as I was leveling a healer and had a NB build in mind on a second one but it is what it is.
For those who say the imp racials grant god mode, do you actually play one? If so do tell how these racials are god mode with build/kit/etc because I've had one since launch and while he has a bit of extra health I would hardly call him god mode. I can't imagine 1.6 will change these racials so much that to be the case but I would truly love to understand why they are considered so.
Some of the other racials could use some love but I wouldn't be able to say what that love should be. No matter what changes the racials should only be buffed to be brought in line. If we buff racials, no one gets upset the racials that are good remain so and the lesser racials get brought in line.
"It is a time of strife and unrest. Armies of revenants and dark spirits manifest in every corner of Tamriel. Winters grow colder and crops fail. Mystics are plagued by nightmares and portents of doom."2 -
AshTal✭✭✭✭I hope they rebalance the racials and don't put a racial change in. I want to play an Argonian but right now we suck. Yeah PvE I don't care much but in PvP a few points make a huge difference especially with the removal of the soft cap. Please ZOS rebalance the weaker races and bring them inline.
It must be obvious by the numbers of people who play each race which are the more powerful ones and which ones suck.0 -
Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I don't care how you spin it, that is textbook P2W, and that is not only all kinds of bad, but it directly contravenes the stated vision for this game.
That's been the accusation since the imperial edition was announced. That and people pissed that there was "gated" content.Edited by Holycannoli on 17 February 2015 18:400 -
MorHawk✭✭✭✭✭
I have, but I really don't see why it needs to be tested, as the level of relative materiality is largely irrelevant. 12% to max health and 10% to stamina. Other races get at most 10% to one, and Orcs/Dunmer get 6% to health/stam, so 12% overall. So essentially double the bonuses of any other race. In a game that no longer has softcaps, meaning these percentages hold full force at endgame. It is unambiguously unbalanced.For those who say the imp racials grant god mode, do you actually play one? If so do tell how these racials are god mode with build/kit/etc because I've had one since launch and while he has a bit of extra health I would hardly call him god mode. I can't imagine 1.6 will change these racials so much that to be the case but I would truly love to understand why they are considered so.Edited by MorHawk on 17 February 2015 18:39I can count to potato.
WWJLHD?Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »another topic that cant see past its own farts.3 -
Zabernat✭✭✭ArconSeptim wrote: »ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »Quality info, great job. If we could get a comparative chart would be awesome, I'm trying to put one together but I don't have all the info from current (1.5) racials.
There is a thread I made asking for a free race change when 1.6 hits live, if you guys could add your contribution would be great for the community.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/148698/1-6-free-race-change-1-6-x-major-changes-latest-dark-elf-fire-resistance-nerf
I don't want a race change though, I just want the passives to be balanced in utility and percentages.
Yeah races should stay as they are now, as Races are races and if someone would change them from time to time it would be really stupid, at least they should have constant stats.
I'm never a huge fan of changing base classes but if they change once I don't want them to change again so I hope ZOS will find a way to balance the class bases fully and leave them there.Kahjit main in the Aldmeri Dominion.
Templar of the Knightly Orders
Herald of Justice to all of Tamriel1 -
Zabernat✭✭✭Dekkameron wrote: »PlagueMonk wrote: »Here is what I think the Argonian passives should look like:
Guerrilla Warfare Expertise (3 ranks) – Increases movement speed while stealthed by (7/14/21)% and increases non magicka based attacks while stealthed by (3/6/9)%
Amphibian Physiology (3 ranks) – Increases swimming speed by 50% and health regen (7/14/21)%
Argonian Hardiness (3 ranks) – Increases maximum Health by (3/6/9)% and Increases Poison/Disease resistance by 1440. Disease resistance should apply directly to disease abilities, lessening their effect by a flat amount (including meatbag catapults)
This is completely in line with other races.
Nah.. they should be..
Tail Whip: 10% Chance on melee weapon attacks to whip enemy with tail knocking them down for 3 seconds.
Cold Blooded: Movement and attack speed reduced by 20% in warm weather conditions. Movement and attack speed increase by 20% in cold weather conditions.
Amphibious: Can swim at 25% faster rate and use melee attacks whilst swimming.
Lol! That cold blooded passive needs to be flipped. Reptiles are faster in warm climates and slower in the cold. "Cold Blooded" means they have to rely on an external heat source for warmth because their body can't do it naturallyKahjit main in the Aldmeri Dominion.
Templar of the Knightly Orders
Herald of Justice to all of Tamriel3 -
Stalwart385✭✭✭✭What I gather from this, is you are better off not buying the imperial edition. Otherwise you might corner yourself into one race.Edited by Stalwart385 on 17 February 2015 19:271
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MorHawk✭✭✭✭✭
Yeah, better not buy that ladder, or you might be tempted to climb it. Hurdle well jumped there.Stalwart385 wrote: »What I gather from this, is you are better off not buying the imperial edition. Otherwise you might corner yourself into one race.I can count to potato.
WWJLHD?Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »another topic that cant see past its own farts.0