1.6 one of a kind update for mmo's history

KerinKor · February 2015

Khivas_Carrick wrote: »

I'm almost certain WoW has done this before, as well as other games. I mean it's a bit silly, but I don't think it's as bad as you make it out to be

I've played WOW since 2004, FFXI since 2004, Rift since launch, LOTRO since launch, GW2 since a month after launch, SW:TOR since launch, FFXIV since launch of the ill-fated 1.0 ...

... never seen such a cynical view taken by developers of their customers ... in spite of what you may think has happened none of those games has ever had a content update, let alone a full expansion, that has nerfed characters to the ground simply to force players to play for months to get back to where they were.

If you don't think it's a bad as many (most?) are saying here tell us, what class/build are you using that's not been hugely negatively affected by the gear and skill nerfbats?

Robbmrp · February 2015

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

At almost every WOW expansion, our stuff is just garbage and we have to renew it.

In WoW Expansions your gear was only obsolete because you could go up another 5 levels. You also received new zones to explore and level up your character. This update doesn't increase your level OR provide new zones. It basically resets you down to Level 50 again and have to use Champion Points to get back to the same place you WERE at V14. If you don't have enough Champion points to get back there?! Go earn some in the EXACT same area's you've been doing V1-V14 tedious grinds in.

ZOS clearly KNOWS they nerfed our characters with this update. That's why they are giving people Champion points for those with Vet Levels to absorb SOME of the burden of having to grind back to get to the exact same spot you were at.

Not happy with the level reset? You can go get a shiny new costume in the Crown Store.

Lost 50 items of your inventory due to the new baggage changes involving horses! I seriously doubt they will fix this issue before they go live....

The shineys in the Crown store will make that all better as well..... NOT!

Just my opinion.

McDoogs · February 2015

3rdwardhobocub18_ESO wrote: »

Avatar1109 wrote: »

Galalin wrote: »

Im not

Avatar1109 wrote: »

OP is competly wrong. Troll alert. If you truly believe your progress has been set back a year then delete your toon. Your game play is based on exploiting systems that are evolving. To be honest I don't know how people are even having fun playing the way the hardcore max/min players are doing things, its not in the spirit of the Elder Scrolls games and frankly makes playing the game for people who are true Elder Scrolls alot less fun. Can't wait for the ps4 version to come out so the real fans of this game can start playing together. Again, if you agree with the OP delete your toons and go back to Wow or whatever lame game you came from.

Maturity speaks for itself... so does rationale.... and furthermore reasoning skills.

You don't see me whining. I'm playing this game the way it is intended to be played "as you want". I'm a level 37 NB Khajiit and know that the game mechanics have been stacked against my personal preferences but I still stuck to it because I have faith this game will end up the way it should be, an Elder Scrolls game first and and MMO second. Not some cookie cutter MMO.

So you have been here less than a month and don't have a vet character much less a VR14?

I bought the game Jan 3rd and have a VR14. Granted I did have 2 VR12s back in May/June so I knew how to level fast, but still, you can know a lot about the game in a month ;P

Seraphyel · February 2015

Khivas_Carrick wrote: »

I'm almost certain WoW has done this before, as well as other games. I mean it's a bit silly, but I don't think it's as bad as you make it out to be

WoW is maybe a 10, 100 times "bigger" MMORPG when it comes to revenue and playerbase. That's a difference.

They could do literally everything and they would maintain millions of subs, Zenimax can't do that. And Zenimax didn't proved their qualities in the last patches, so yeah... kinda silly.

Khivas_Carrick · February 2015

Joejudas wrote: »

It's not equal...because a level 1-50 didn't spend months farming the best end game gear i have that they just made useless in 1.6 PTS with nerfs. It's not the same.

You're right, they leveled 1-90 first.

Khivas_Carrick · February 2015

KerinKor wrote: »

Khivas_Carrick wrote: »

I'm almost certain WoW has done this before, as well as other games. I mean it's a bit silly, but I don't think it's as bad as you make it out to be

I've played WOW since 2004, FFXI since 2004, Rift since launch, LOTRO since launch, GW2 since a month after launch, SW:TOR since launch, FFXIV since launch of the ill-fated 1.0 ...

... never seen such a cynical view taken by developers of their customers ... in spite of what you may think has happened none of those games has ever had a content update, let alone a full expansion, that has nerfed characters to the ground simply to force players to play for months to get back to where they were.

If you don't think it's a bad as many (most?) are saying here tell us, what class/build are you using that's not been hugely negatively affected by the gear and skill nerfbats?

I play a Templar who has been in a shitpacked pigeonhole since day one, so yea, you could say that I'm not as pissy or as upset as some chump who got to easily faceroll all forms of content as whatever he wanted (minus healer) while he would regularly get regulated to one role within a trial, maybe two.

In fact I played what you might see as hardmode by playing as a Stamina 2H DPS Templar no less, and even healed from time to time regularly getting my ass kicked. But hey, I still enjoyed the game and a surprising number of things I advised is now in the game via 1.6. ***, I might apply for a job with ZoS at this rate.

Other than that, I've spoken to people directly in game and literally out of 12 people I spoke to, only two of them felt truly nerfed into the ground, and this was in both PvP and PvE.

The only class that gets to genuinely complain about not being made useless and having to use maybe 1 or 2 class skills for a rotation/loadout NOT built by ZoS for a pigeonholed role is a Sorcerer.

Anybody else needs to stop thinking this is a direct and insulting nerf to them and realize that this game just got a giant meta shift, and everybody is feeling it, some more and differently than others.

Avatar1109 · February 2015

@Galalin Can you clairify two things for us so we can get a better understanding on where you are coming from.

1) What TES/Ultima games you have played in the past plus the hours put into them.

2) What MMO games you have played in the past and the hours put into them?

Thank you.

joshisanonymous · February 2015

Joejudas wrote: »

Some folks on here don't get it....we paid 10 months of subs and spent hundreds of hours playing a game...then 1.6 PTS nerfed everything including end game PvE gear...and expect us to put in another 10 months into a new leveling system by grinding mobs cause that content from the last 10 months was unrepeatable.

So what you're saying is you had fun playing a game for 10 months and now you're no longer going to have fun playing a game. That's rough man. I completely expect to start an MMO and just play it, like, forever, because it's an investment. I even put it in my will that my characters will go to my future children. Hopefully the government gets rid of the death tax, because I'd hate for my kids to lose out on some of my massive in game gold collection.

Besides, you're being given 70 CPs. From what people are saying, you won't get nearly that from 1-VR14 on a new character. And this happens with expansions in basically every MMO. Your gear becomes subpar compared to the new gear. The only difference is they're not releasing new dungeons or zones with 1.6, but they will be doing that with later updates, soo. Hell, some games have literally shut down and started over. FFXIV? Darkfall? Talk about losing everything.

Avatar1109 · February 2015

@joshisanonymous I 100% agree with you on this one.

Galalin · February 2015

Avatar1109 wrote: »

@Galalin Can you clairify two things for us so we can get a better understanding on where you are coming from.

1) What TES/Ultima games you have played in the past plus the hours put into them.

2) What MMO games you have played in the past and the hours put into them?

Thank you.

1) i have not played many TES games... single player games are not my thing... im playing ESO strictly for the fact it is an mmo.

2) ultima online, everquest, lineage 1&2, shadowbane, DaoC, WoW, Warhammer, guild wars 1&2, 4 story, Darkfall are the ones i can think of.... other than lineage i have played each more than 2yrs.

Im not a casual but i dont have the time to be hardcore either. Although i ised to play hardcore years ago i do still try to put in as much time as my careers allow.

Galalin · February 2015

joshisanonymous wrote: »

Joejudas wrote: »

Some folks on here don't get it....we paid 10 months of subs and spent hundreds of hours playing a game...then 1.6 PTS nerfed everything including end game PvE gear...and expect us to put in another 10 months into a new leveling system by grinding mobs cause that content from the last 10 months was unrepeatable.

So what you're saying is you had fun playing a game for 10 months and now you're no longer going to have fun playing a game. That's rough man. I completely expect to start an MMO and just play it, like, forever, because it's an investment. I even put it in my will that my characters will go to my future children. Hopefully the government gets rid of the death tax, because I'd hate for my kids to lose out on some of my massive in game gold collection.

Besides, you're being given 70 CPs. From what people are saying, you won't get nearly that from 1-VR14 on a new character. And this happens with expansions in basically every MMO. Your gear becomes subpar compared to the new gear. The only difference is they're not releasing new dungeons or zones with 1.6, but they will be doing that with later updates, soo. Hell, some games have literally shut down and started over. FFXIV? Darkfall? Talk about losing everything.

I get your point but i dont play games for the fact there are worst games... im not saying im quitting or giving up. What im saying is that if it goes live in this state i will be moving on. I hope this doesn't happen as i have lots of time invested but it will be hard to invest more time and interest in something that i dislike.

If i dont put it out there how i feel about 1.6 then how is anything supposed to change?

liquid_wolf · February 2015

I don't respect your opinion because you don't really back it up with concrete evidence and facts.

You have a lot of speculation, and worry... a lot of outrage.

But nothing solid.

It seems many people like the changes, and some dislike them... but you are just spouting without much explanation.

Gyudan · February 2015

1.6 is one of a kind indeed ...

Joejudas · February 2015

.

Panda244 · February 2015

Gyudan wrote: »

1.6 is one of a kind indeed ...

/Done

Berinima · February 2015

There are some things that can never been unseen...

Galalin · February 2015

This is true ^^^

Galalin · February 2015

liquid_wolf wrote: »

I don't respect your opinion because you don't really back it up with concrete evidence and facts.

You have a lot of speculation, and worry... a lot of outrage.

But nothing solid.

It seems many people like the changes, and some dislike them... but you are just spouting without much explanation.

You mean kinda like your post?

Khivas_Carrick · February 2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMbIDe_6GYM

Avatar1109 · February 2015

Galalin wrote: »

Avatar1109 wrote: »

@Galalin Can you clairify two things for us so we can get a better understanding on where you are coming from.

1) What TES/Ultima games you have played in the past plus the hours put into them.

2) What MMO games you have played in the past and the hours put into them?

Thank you.

1) i have not played many TES games... single player games are not my thing... im playing ESO strictly for the fact it is an mmo.

2) ultima online, everquest, lineage 1&2, shadowbane, DaoC, WoW, Warhammer, guild wars 1&2, 4 story, Darkfall are the ones i can think of.... other than lineage i have played each more than 2yrs.

Im not a casual but i dont have the time to be hardcore either. Although i ised to play hardcore years ago i do still try to put in as much time as my careers allow.

I think I get it. You have to understand the history of TES games to see where these updates being implemented in 1.6 and future updates are trying to bridge the gap between a MMO and what players of TES who have never played an MMO before are expecting when the put the disc in the ps4 / Xbox one on launch date. If a consol gamer pops this game in as it stands right now they won't be playing it for very long because other then some quest styles being the same and the lore it's not the same experience, not even close.

Digiman · February 2015

Would rather rebuild in a working balanced system then continue stacking crap in a broken one.

Tonnopesce · February 2015

WE HAVE THE GUAR MOUNT!!!!!

Idc about the rest i can ride a guar!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Edit
ops i forgot....
/sarcasm
Btw i really like the guars and all the other "store stuff" till they are cosmetic,
The rest... i really dont care i've quite all the boss heads , all the dsa drops and two full dungeon sets but is not for this that i play

Perphection · February 2015

Galalin wrote: »

If there were added content or new gear sets to get like undaunted... i would have no problem. If its progression based np... but this is nothing more than leaving us to play the same content we have to earn back what they are essentially just taking away.

I guess some ppl get it and some don't. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and this is just mine.

If some new content came out of this np... but to regrind the all the same crap for 8 months to get to the same point... i just don't have the patience

Well said, and I agree with almost everything you've said here. However, the only hope I have is that going B2P brings back some of the PvPers this game lost.

I'm not as concerned about the Champion Point system, or really the unbalanced skills as I am with the severe population decline since this games launch.

I got this game for epic large scale PvP, and it's become ..."meh" and small scale because the servers can't handle a real fight.

GaldorP · February 2015

Galalin wrote: »

This is the first expansion/update i have seen in my mmo gaming history (starting back from ultima online days) that takes away half the stuff you have earned since launch so you can spend close to another year juat to get it back.

That's true. I've seen complete redesigns in other MMOGs that have made all the previous content obsolete and irrelevant in comparison to the new content added (for example the Goddess of Destruction Update in Lineage II, or when 3rd classes were introduced in Ragnarok Online), but I can't think of an example where a global nerf suddenly made everyone weaker in completing all of the existing content.

Not sure yet, if that's the case in ESO's update 1.6. though, as I haven't had the chance yet to directly compare my characters in version 1.5.x. and 1.6.x. but once my they get copied from the EU server to the PTS later today I will be interested in seeing how strong the nerf is (or if there is a noticeable nerf for me at all) and if couldn't fix it with a respec and getting new gear for my characters.

Darklord_Tiberius · February 2015

I think it is funny how 1.6 has been out on PTS for a week and everyone "knows for certain" that this will kill the game, people will leave because you took my awesome face smashing away, QQ much? I am not surprised to see OP to be the one to complain, after all he does complain a lot in game.

Dont be lazy and theory craft. Its simple. My PvP build is relatively the same, I added a skill and changed morphs on two others. My gear and weapon sets are the same and work very well if not slightly better than on live.

If you truly understand how your class works and are a good player, you would look at 1.6 as an opportunity to become better, not wallow in your tears and cry about it. Grow up already.

1.6 will bring back many old players and get new ones into the game, so if 50-100 people rage quit and the game gets 5k-10k back, ill take that trade all day long.

Galalin · February 2015

Darklord_Tiberius wrote: »

I think it is funny how 1.6 has been out on PTS for a week and everyone "knows for certain" that this will kill the game, people will leave because you took my awesome face smashing away, QQ much? I am not surprised to see OP to be the one to complain, after all he does complain a lot in game.

Dont be lazy and theory craft. Its simple. My PvP build is relatively the same, I added a skill and changed morphs on two others. My gear and weapon sets are the same and work very well if not slightly better than on live.

If you truly understand how your class works and are a good player, you would look at 1.6 as an opportunity to become better, not wallow in your tears and cry about it. Grow up already.

1.6 will bring back many old players and get new ones into the game, so if 50-100 people rage quit and the game gets 5k-10k back, ill take that trade all day long.

I think you need to read again. I stated if it goes live the way it sits now i will not be...i also said if some things change i would probably stay. Why dont ppl reaf an entire post befor they ramble on?

Everything is QQing to kids no matter how objective or fair your statement. Idc if you think its qq'ing that your opinion. But let me ask you this... you like everything about the new 1.6? Every last little thing? I am curious to the answer here @Darklord_Tiberius‌.

And please point me to where i complain alot Dark... we had issues in the past with you calliing our guild crap in zone... so im not surpised to see you jump on the opportunity on here.... classy. Just answer my question ty

ADDED: Also if you read you would understand my main issue is chump points, the time it take to get them and the amount we have been given. On top of that no new content to grind them on

Darklord_Tiberius · February 2015

Galalin wrote: »

This is the first expansion/update i have seen in my mmo gaming history (starting back from ultima online days) that takes away half the stuff you have earned since launch so you can spend close to another year juat to get it back.

This is a huge slap in the face to the community.

A big smoke screen of number changes to confuse ppl as to how much you have taken away.

Changing all of the class and weapon abilities at ONE time when you could not even balance them in the previous 8 months.

The changes made to ultimate are ridiculous. You don't get the buff if you hit anyone with a shield. And with this new system thats everyone but the dead guys.

Chump points (as i will call them) are unrealistic in the time it takes to earn them.

I could go on forever but the fact is if this goes live it will go dead shortly after.

I for one am not grinding for another year just to earn back what i have accomplished. I could handle this if it was further progression but all you have done it take it away amd say here with this new chump system you can earn it back

Added: who wants to bet the cash shop sells enlightenment pots?

^ Nowhere in your post do you mention:

"I stated if it goes live the way it sits now i will not be...i also said if some things change i would probably stay. Why dont ppl reaf an entire post befor they ramble on?"

I think you need to reread your own post. All you stated was that the game will go dead, which is the attitude I pointed out of people like you that have this 100% certainty; when it is on the PTS. I find that amusing.

Your post is far from objective. Your use of "Chump points" nullifies that which you claim it is. If you want your post to be "objective" than critic the system and give feedback on what should be change or made to be better. Rambling on about how unfair it is, really does not help anyone.

As to your question, yes I love every aspect about 1.6. I know I have played the PTS much more than you and though it is rough only being on PTS for a week; it will be healthy for this game. I tested the Champion Point gain and from my experience it really isn't that bad. The problems lie with issues that already plague the game, such as xp gains in PvP and questing are a joke compared to what someone can do pulling 50 mobs a minute and killing them. If they increased XP across the board for everything to equal that of grinding, than things would even out. Again, this is an issue already on live servers. Justice system in phenomenal, the possibilities are endless. PvP is not bad, only thing people need to do is make new builds and find what works. Shield stacking is going to be the new Meta, which is fine with me, but as other people have pointed out it needs adjusted to make up for the fact they removed diminishing returns on stats.

1.6 is on the PTS for a reason. We give feedback and they make it work. Simple.

Like I have already told you, when you disrespect someone from our community and act as you and your fellow two guild members did in /z chat, you get treated as such. We are classy people, just not to people who disrespect us.

Galalin · February 2015

First where did i disrespect you second read the whole post again im not even going to quote where i said if they change i may stay.. funny you read one post on a thread and make accusations. .. it shows your attention span.
the fact i don't like 1.6 is my opinion and also feedback. Not sure how your opinion and feedback matters more than mine. Kind of arrogant don't you think.

If you want to hold me accountable for what others say then that just shows your level of maturity. The fact you take the time to come to my thread to stir up crap says it all.

Like i said i welcome all feedback good or bad. Personal attacks are nothing more than childish epeen contests and i would prefer if we stick to the subject please.

My post is directed to to show my feedback of how i dislike 1.6 and for me it is deal breaker. Thats my opinion and sorry sir but yes i am entitled to it.

Nobody cares about ppl who have disrespected you community in this thread as its not the topic thank you

Added: so those aspects of the game your nothappy with i guess by your standards is nothing more than qq'ing? Or is it that your opinion is the only one that matters again?

Bouvin · February 2015

Wolfenbelle wrote: »

In before the ZOS 'yes' people to say I agree with you completely.

You beat them in barely.

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

I disagree, this is a great update, and they aren't taking anything away from you.

Avatar1109 · February 2015

Galalin wrote: »

First where did i disrespect you / it shows your attention span.

@Galalin I think it is you who is the one on the path of disrespecting people with endless comments like the above. You have made similar ones to me calling me childish and making other obviously ignorant comments about people's intelligence.