Make sure you WoWify the game

tripiseanb14_ESO

Uhg! So frustrating. They finally go in and make the game harder and cave in to all the qqing the next day and roll back the changes. Why do MMOs have to be easy mode?! Why can't they be hard?!

Instead of making the game easy, why not make the game harder and maybe slightly increase the rewards, so people have an incentive to play the harder content. So that people in small groups of 2 or 3 have something they can do?

Why do you have to copy WoW and make the game easy?

MMOs used to be hard. EQ1 and UO used to be hard, I was so excited when I read that content got harder, but, alas, this morning we go back to pandering to the World of Warcraft generation, free kills for everyone.

Sigh. See ya out there y'all.

tordr86b16_ESO

wildstar

phairdon

Thing is though; the increase in damage by veteran level mobs was unintentional. Getting 2 shot killed does not make the game fun just makes questing impossible.
Increased difficulty would be fine if players could rely on finding groups to roam with. Then again do we want all veteran content to be playable by groups only?

ZiRM

I used the LOL as a negative.

jy82988ub17_ESO

Rofl, if you want hard go try to solo some WBs tell me how that goes. Leveling in UO was never difficult, people were just trash. Get off your high horse, leveling shouldn't be a frustrating process for most.

rawne1980b16_ESO

If you want difficult go play Darkfall.

I'll see you back here when someone slaughters you and skips off merrily with all your gear.

david271749

NiRN wrote: »

I used the LOL as a negative.

Lol

Korah_Eaglecry

Not everyone plays this game for its 'difficulty'....Which is debatable considering the methods they used to make it 'difficult'.

This game is a endless time consuming hole. Unlike most Single Player games that have a beginning, a middle and an end. People tend to steer towards MMOs because theres always something to do. Not because they want their time and effort wasted smashing against an unbreakable wall.

tripiseanb14_ESO

Uhg, I guess here in lies the problem. WoW broke MMOs.
I miss EQ1, EQ1 before WoW came out and SOE decided they needed to make it easy mode to compete with WoW.

tylarthb16_ESO

Bottom line is hard doesn't make money. Wow taught the games industry that catering to the masses really pays off.

SilverWF

tripiseanb14_ESO wrote: »

Uhg! So frustrating. They finally go in and make the game harder and cave in to all the qqing the next day and roll back the changes. Why do MMOs have to be easy mode?! Why can't they be hard?!

Instead of making the game easy, why not make the game harder and maybe slightly increase the rewards, so people have an incentive to play the harder content. So that people in small groups of 2 or 3 have something they can do?

Why do you have to copy WoW and make the game easy?

MMOs used to be hard. EQ1 and UO used to be hard, I was so excited when I read that content got harder, but, alas, this morning we go back to pandering to the World of Warcraft generation, free kills for everyone.

Sigh. See ya out there y'all.

Make your personal game hard: unwear all of your gear, unlearn all skills and go-go!

Swordguy

elder scrolls games have never been truly that hard without difficulty mods. just wear broken armour, or run around in your undies if you want a extreme challenge. or better yet, go play outside

Mykah

Level a NB if your DK and Sorc are too easy.

Prettiboi

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

SeinSchatten

Prettiboi wrote: »

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

Why don't YOU leave to your elite game? Afterall, people like you pay only a tiny part of the bill.

Maulkin

Prettiboi wrote: »

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

Never read such nonsense in my life. If 50% of the population can't complete the game, they'll quit and that's money lost. Games are made to make money and so they are made for the majority not minority.

The "hardcore" 10% that want VR impossibly hard cannot on their own pay for the development of a game of this size. If you want "hardcore", find like-minded people and tell a company you'll be willing to pay $150pm for a few years for them to develop a "hardcore" game for you and your friends.

Prettiboi

SeinSchatten wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

Why don't YOU leave to your elite game? Afterall, people like you pay only a tiny part of the bill.

Elitists are the ones holding the torch, leading the way. First ones in, leading the charge to down the bosses, figure out the mechanics, and post them online so everybody else will be able to do it too. They are the ones who write the guides, give the tips that YOU ALL USE to your benefit. Without these elitists, you wouldn't be where you are today in-game. It is the elitists who SHAPE the game, give feedback to the devs, etc. Not the casuals. Remember this next time you think elitists are "but a tiny part".

HandofBane

Prettiboi wrote: »

SeinSchatten wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

Why don't YOU leave to your elite game? Afterall, people like you pay only a tiny part of the bill.

Elitists are the ones holding the torch, leading the way. First ones in, leading the charge to down the bosses, figure out the mechanics, and post them online so everybody else will be able to do it too. They are the ones who write the guides, give the tips that YOU ALL USE to your benefit. Without these elitists, you wouldn't be where you are today in-game. It is the elitists who SHAPE the game, give feedback to the devs, etc. Not the casuals. Remember this next time you think elitists are "but a tiny part".

Elitists are the ones rolling with multiple players on PTS looking for ways to abuse broken mechanics and failing to report bugs and exploits to the devs so they can get through content all the faster once it goes live. They are the ones responsible for things like the guild bank dupe making it live and failing to be stopped for several weeks. They are the ones responsible for Dark Talons/Bat Swarm abuse becoming so rampant some campaigns never saw a change of Emperor for a week or more at a time.

So yeah, get back to us when the elitists stop looking out for themselves first and actually give a *** about the game, balance, and what the devs actually do the improve the game for all players.

SeinSchatten

What has that to do with your post that 90% of the games populace should stop playing the game at a certain stage?
Do you think 10% of the games populace form the game or maybe the Account Manager(s)[If such a company has Account Managers] while waiding through peoples unsub comments and discuss steps to stop the exodus in meetings?

Drazticulous

Prettiboi wrote: »

SeinSchatten wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

Why don't YOU leave to your elite game? Afterall, people like you pay only a tiny part of the bill.

Elitists are the ones holding the torch, leading the way. First ones in, leading the charge to down the bosses, figure out the mechanics, and post them online so everybody else will be able to do it too. They are the ones who write the guides, give the tips that YOU ALL USE to your benefit. Without these elitists, you wouldn't be where you are today in-game. It is the elitists who SHAPE the game, give feedback to the devs, etc. Not the casuals. Remember this next time you think elitists are "but a tiny part".

elitists now a days is nothing compared to years ago..... now they think they are elitists cause they play 14 hours a day..... oh wait that's me! so I'm an elitist at VR3 and I chose not to exploit crag.... I'll even add more time playing so I can be the elite of the elite.... maybe they'll even message me in game and everything about how my day went.... wait a GM does that already!

Thus ends my "elitist" rant

Prettiboi

HandofBane wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

SeinSchatten wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

Why don't YOU leave to your elite game? Afterall, people like you pay only a tiny part of the bill.

Elitists are the ones holding the torch, leading the way. First ones in, leading the charge to down the bosses, figure out the mechanics, and post them online so everybody else will be able to do it too. They are the ones who write the guides, give the tips that YOU ALL USE to your benefit. Without these elitists, you wouldn't be where you are today in-game. It is the elitists who SHAPE the game, give feedback to the devs, etc. Not the casuals. Remember this next time you think elitists are "but a tiny part".

Elitists are the ones rolling with multiple players on PTS looking for ways to abuse broken mechanics and failing to report bugs and exploits to the devs so they can get through content all the faster once it goes live. They are the ones responsible for things like the guild bank dupe making it live and failing to be stopped for several weeks. They are the ones responsible for Dark Talons/Bat Swarm abuse becoming so rampant some campaigns never saw a change of Emperor for a week or more at a time.

So yeah, get back to us when the elitists stop looking out for themselves first and actually give a *** about the game, balance, and what the devs actually do the improve the game for all players.

Those are called exploiters, not elitists. Elitists have pride and honor in what they do, and they do it well, thus why they're elitists in the first place.

Prettiboi

HandofBane wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

SeinSchatten wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

Why don't YOU leave to your elite game? Afterall, people like you pay only a tiny part of the bill.

Elitists are the ones holding the torch, leading the way. First ones in, leading the charge to down the bosses, figure out the mechanics, and post them online so everybody else will be able to do it too. They are the ones who write the guides, give the tips that YOU ALL USE to your benefit. Without these elitists, you wouldn't be where you are today in-game. It is the elitists who SHAPE the game, give feedback to the devs, etc. Not the casuals. Remember this next time you think elitists are "but a tiny part".

Elitists are the ones rolling with multiple players on PTS looking for ways to abuse broken mechanics and failing to report bugs and exploits to the devs so they can get through content all the faster once it goes live. They are the ones responsible for things like the guild bank dupe making it live and failing to be stopped for several weeks. They are the ones responsible for Dark Talons/Bat Swarm abuse becoming so rampant some campaigns never saw a change of Emperor for a week or more at a time.

So yeah, get back to us when the elitists stop looking out for themselves first and actually give a *** about the game, balance, and what the devs actually do the improve the game for all players.

Those are called exploiters, not elitists. Elitists have pride and honor in what they do, and they do it well, thus why they're called elitists in the first place.

And who says people who can't complete content will quit? They will keep trying until one day, complete it. MMO gamers do not quit that easily. Are you guys all quitting because you cannot down Aetherian Archives' Celestial Mage? No. Clearly, many of you are constantly still trying. If do you quit that easily, you'd have probably quit the game pretty soon anyway.

temjiu

Prettiboi wrote: »

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

Lol that was so funny!

oh man....+1 for troll.

Your right of course. the 5-10% of the population that enjoy getting kicked in the jimmy and call it a challenge are the "true" players. they carry the game. The rest of the players ( 90% of the paying populace of the game ) are just there to pay the bills so the elite of the elite can have their game, drink their mead, and sing songs to the lamenting of their enemies women!

They rest of the playerbase should really just consider themselves lucky that the elitist even let them in their game...and pay the 15$ a month just for the honor of being in their presence.

Because THAT's what makes MMO's survive these days....

Prettiboi

temjiu wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

Leveling should be fairly hard, only about 50% of population should be able to complete to max 50

VR content should be extremely hard, where only about 10% of the population should be able to complete it. Rewards for VR content should be the best gear possible to gear up all the elites who can complete it.

This should be the way. Making it this hard with great rewards will really make the Elitists and Pros in the game stand out. After all, they are the ones carrying the game and moving it forward.

Cater to the elitists, not to the casuals. There are tons of causal MMOs out there, GW2 being a great example. Paid subscription-based MMOs should cater to the elitsts.

Lol that was so funny!

oh man....+1 for troll.

Your right of course. the 5-10% of the population that enjoy getting kicked in the jimmy and call it a challenge are the "true" players. they carry the game. The rest of the players ( 90% of the paying populace of the game ) are just there to pay the bills so the elite of the elite can have their game, drink their mead, and sing songs to the lamenting of their enemies women!

They rest of the playerbase should really just consider themselves lucky that the elitist even let them in their game...and pay the 15$ a month just for the honor of being in their presence.

Because THAT's what makes MMO's survive these days....

Isn't this how it works in real life? You got your 10% elitists carrying the world, the rest 90% should just be glad to live on the same planet as them.

HandofBane

Prettiboi wrote: »

And who says people who can't complete content will quit? They will keep trying until one day, complete it. MMO gamers do not quit that easily. Are you guys all quitting because you cannot down Aetherian Archives' Celestial Mage? No. Clearly, many of you are constantly still trying. If do you quit that easily, you'd have probably quit the game pretty soon anyway.

I am likely quitting (giving til after the holiday weekend for a real response) because I cannot complete content due to a broken class. Being told "hey you can only succeed in progressing through content by playing these three specific builds" because I roll as a nightblade is not something I have any desire to pay for. This combined with many other bugs, issues with things reported on PTS that still made it live, and some of the worst customer service in the industry... yeah, it keeps adding up to being something not worth putting up with, especially not when it gets added with egocentric *** heads who demand other players shut up and keep paying for the game so they can blitz through content they want other players to not ever even get to see.

Lox

tripiseanb14_ESO wrote: »

Uhg! So frustrating. They finally go in and make the game harder and cave in to all the qqing the next day and roll back the changes. Why do MMOs have to be easy mode?! Why can't they be hard?!

Instead of making the game easy, why not make the game harder and maybe slightly increase the rewards, so people have an incentive to play the harder content. So that people in small groups of 2 or 3 have something they can do?

Why do you have to copy WoW and make the game easy?

MMOs used to be hard. EQ1 and UO used to be hard, I was so excited when I read that content got harder, but, alas, this morning we go back to pandering to the World of Warcraft generation, free kills for everyone.

Sigh. See ya out there y'all.

Agreed. Unfortunately it goes against the 'entitlement mentality' of so many today. Everything must be accessible to everyone regardless, therefore it has to be dumbed down. The downside of this is that anyone with above average ability will inevitably find it easy.

Other games have tried putting difficulty levels into the dungeons, with better gear for the higher difficulty levels. Unfortunately people just moan that that better gear is 'unatainable' by the average player, if they make all the gear the same across difficulty levels then there is no incentive to do the harder ones other than bragging rights, which makes the better players complain.

Its a loose loose situation, some element will always complain.

Prettiboi

HandofBane wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

And who says people who can't complete content will quit? They will keep trying until one day, complete it. MMO gamers do not quit that easily. Are you guys all quitting because you cannot down Aetherian Archives' Celestial Mage? No. Clearly, many of you are constantly still trying. If do you quit that easily, you'd have probably quit the game pretty soon anyway.

I am likely quitting (giving til after the holiday weekend for a real response) because I cannot complete content due to a broken class. Being told "hey you can only succeed in progressing through content by playing these three specific builds" because I roll as a nightblade is not something I have any desire to pay for. This combined with many other bugs, issues with things reported on PTS that still made it live, and some of the worst customer service in the industry... yeah, it keeps adding up to being something not worth putting up with, especially not when it gets added with egocentric *** heads who demand other players shut up and keep paying for the game so they can blitz through content they want other players to not ever even get to see.

My Nightblade friend, Gabe (actual in-game name) VR12, has the highest single-target DPS I've ever seen in any player. He regularly pulls 800-1K DPS single-target with his bow. I can only get to 850 DPS tops single target with my sorc in full VR12 legendary. Nightblades have, easily, the highest single target DPS I've ever seen in-game.

How is your class broken or unplayable? You must be joking. Everybody in Volundreung NA server knows about Gabe and his OP Nightblade class. I am so mad jealous of him that I actually made a Nightblade alt a week ago.

You need some lessons from Gabe. Try messaging him in-game, I'm sure he wouldn't mind helping a fellow Nightblade out.

wrlifeboil

tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »

wildstar

...will be a niche mmo if the end game is as difficult as they hyping it to be.

HandofBane

Prettiboi wrote: »

HandofBane wrote: »

Prettiboi wrote: »

And who says people who can't complete content will quit? They will keep trying until one day, complete it. MMO gamers do not quit that easily. Are you guys all quitting because you cannot down Aetherian Archives' Celestial Mage? No. Clearly, many of you are constantly still trying. If do you quit that easily, you'd have probably quit the game pretty soon anyway.

I am likely quitting (giving til after the holiday weekend for a real response) because I cannot complete content due to a broken class. Being told "hey you can only succeed in progressing through content by playing these three specific builds" because I roll as a nightblade is not something I have any desire to pay for. This combined with many other bugs, issues with things reported on PTS that still made it live, and some of the worst customer service in the industry... yeah, it keeps adding up to being something not worth putting up with, especially not when it gets added with egocentric *** heads who demand other players shut up and keep paying for the game so they can blitz through content they want other players to not ever even get to see.

My Nightblade friend, Gabe (actual in-game name) VR12, has the highest single-target DPS I've ever seen in any player. He regularly pulls 800-1K DPS single-target with his bow. I can only get to 850 DPS tops single target with my sorc in full VR12 legendary. Nightblades have, easily, the highest single target DPS I've ever seen in-game.

How is your class broken or unplayable? You must be joking. Everybody in Volundreung NA server knows about Gabe and his OP Nightblade class. I am so mad jealous of him that I actually made a Nightblade alt a week ago.

You need some lessons from Gabe. Try messaging him in-game, I'm sure he wouldn't mind helping a fellow Nightblade out.

Not a bow build, and no desire to use a bow at all. As far as what is broken with the class, maybe you should go back to the main page and scroll up to the stickied thread with over 450 comments on it about all the skills and passives that either don't work properly, or don't work at all with the class. Single target dps is great, and one of my better things to handle, the problem is 60-70% of fights I have to deal with are multiple targets at once, with only one CC ability that has a 2 second cast timer (which conveniently breaks stealth to cast so no crit bonus on the first strike).

As I said, there are about three builds that are capable of working right now - none of those are anything I find entertaining to play, nor can I afford to waste thousands of gold respeccing constantly to find a build that both works and is fun.

Catflinger

Funny. If they truly "Wowified" this game, they'd have a big variety of things to do at level 50. Some of those things would be geared towards solo players and some would be geared towards groups. Some would be daily quest content. Some of it would be extremely challenging raid content for the best, most elite players to obtain the best rewards in the game -gear, titles, mounts. That's just on the PvE side of things.

I see no "Wowification" happening. This dev team appears to be stubbornly resisting any temptation to "Wowify".

Millitum

@prettiboi Here's where you're wrong dear sir, when you state in real life only 5-10% carry the rest of us.

I'm a middle class, blue collar, career firefighter and part time RN who fills in for vacant spots due to vacation, sick leave, mat leave and whatnot.

So let's break this down, you're telling me only 5-10% of the population carries my ass around, and I should pander to them? That they support me? This elite 5-10%? Bullcrap sir, bullcrap.

Middle class individuals (i.e. Blue collar, or casuals) support both the lower bracket and the higher bracket, through taxes.

It's the same for this MMO. Casual players, such as myself, carry the elitists by providing a steady stream of income for ZOS to make content for the Elitists to helicopter their ePeen around.