I prefer a carrot to a stick approach! I bought the Apocrypha year dungeons because they came with an awesome guar mount and I liked the themes and design from what I’d seen. Last year, they weren’t really Mirrormoor related beyond the enemies in one and didn’t feel new…

Anyway, I’m interested in Solstice and enjoy dungeons so that I consider buying them in addition to ESO+, but I’m not digging the “content pass” approach.

Pretty sure this is just a bug, since it wouldn't be the first time something like this had happened.

Rittings wrote: »

Okay, so I've had several guildies test this, and had my wife test it also. Not having the Botanist achievement on a character is seemingly the factor between getting 6 and 12 pulls on alchemy nodes.

100% of all pulls without that achievement have come back as only getting 4 or 8 from an alchemy survey node... whilst having the trait on a character has resulted in lots of 6 and 12s. For sure, go test for yourself and come back and show me the results

You can't have the Botanist achievement on a character. It's account wide, so your whole account has it or is missing it. You proved this achievement was not a factor when you noted that you had two different characters on the same account experience different things with 4 vs 6. The testing on the PTS confirmed that.

Trait knowledge is also not a factor, as shown in the screenshots I posted above from the PTS.

In further testing, the issue is reproducible on the PTS, but not with either of the parameters you identified.

On a fresh template character without any alchemy trait knowledge (and without Botanist on the account, as shown), I got 6s and 12s no problem. That character by nature has level 50 in alchemy and came with all the alchemy passives filled. I tested it as such.

When I passed alchemy surveys to my level 6 character, who had never unlocked Alchemy at all, they only got 4s for 3 surveys in a row.

So there is something that seems to unlock the ability impact the chance to get 6, but trait knowledge and Botanist are not it.

I will continue to test to see if I can figure out what the unlock is.

Update: Back on the template character I used to test, on whom I got 6x and 12x no problem in my previous post, I removed all the alchemy passives (except 1/8 in proficiency, which cannot be removed).

Three surveys, all 4x and 8x.

Something in the alchemy skill point passives seems to be affecting the drop rate for 6x/12x.

Update 2: Maxing all the passives except the first (Proficiency), I still got only 4x and 8x from three surveys.

Update 3: At 7/8 Proficiency, I was able to draw 6x and 12x, but the rate may well be lower than at 8/8 Proficiency. Three surveys resulted in only 3 of 18 nodes producing 6x or 12x.

Based on this, I'm thinking that the drop chance of 6x/12x may increase with skill points invested in Solvent Proficiency, until it reaches the equal chances between 4x/8x and 6x/12x at 8/8 in Proficiency. It will take further testing to know better.

At 60 nodes (10 surveys) with 7/8 Proficiency, I have gotten 6x or 12x on only 12 of those pulls (20%). (ETA: 22 of 102 nodes now, or 21.6%.) That's too low a number to know for sure what the actual drop chance is, but it does at least seem it's lower than the 50% chance at 8/8 Proficiency.

1) Re the proc rate of Plentiful Harvest supposedly not being 50%:

In 8061 pulls of blacksmithing, clothing, jewelrycrafting, and woodworking that I've recorded since they fixed Plentiful Harvest (which, yes, used to be capped at 40% due to a bug, but has been fixed), outside of resource events, I have the following rate of drops for the base mats:

3x: 3406 (42.25%)
4x: 620 (7.69%)
6x: 2907 (36.06%)
7x: 1046 (12.98%)
8x: 82 (1.02%)

Since 3x and 4x represent no PH proc, while 6x, 7x, and 8x represent a PH proc, these are the rates for the proc from those pulls:

No PH proc: 49.94%
PH proc: 50.06%

For alchemy nodes, I have fewer pulls but the following info:

1x: 186 (49.87%)
2x: 187 (50.13%)

I'm not sure how much closer to 50% it's reasonable to expect it to get. If you have data that doesn't seem to align with this, I would very interested to see the numbers.

Note, though, that Plentiful Harvest doesn't double the whole yield of the node. It procs on a per-mat basis on eligible mats from eligible sources. It only procs when you draw one of those mats to begin with, so on average over time it doubles the amount you get, but it doesn't change the chance of getting anything in the first place.

2) Plentiful Harvest doesn't work the same way on all the things it procs on, again probably due to bugs:

Number of base mats: For BCJW non-survey nodes, you can get 3 or 4 without a PH proc, and then 6, 7, or 8 when it procs. For surveys you can get 18 or 20 without PH, and then 36, 38, or 40 when it procs.

The distribution matches what we'd expect if the game is rerolling the number again when PH procs.

But for alchemy, PH always doubles the number. That's why you can only get 4, 6, 8, or 12 (4 or 6 being no PH, as you noted, and 8 and 12 being the PH procs for those numbers, respectively). Unlike BCJW surveys, you will never get a mix and match of the two base rolls, so no 10s. Just 4 x 2 or 8 x 2, never 4 + 6 or 6 + 4.

Other things it works irregularly on:

Pulverized Titanium: PH dramatically increases - at least about doubles, according to my numbers - the normal chance of getting Pulverized Titanium x1 from a jewelry seam. It also provides a tiny chance of getting x2 from the same node, which doesn't appear to be possible without it. I believe it may be providing another independent roll at this mat rather than rolling only when it's drawn initially, as is the case for other mats.

Bait: PH works (in an unexpected way, akin to Pulverized Titanium) on bait from clothing surveys, enabling 4x bait from a single clothing node, but PH doesn't work on bait from alchemy nodes (survey or otherwise) and doesn't work on bait from non-survey clothing nodes.

No, none of this noted in PH's tooltip, which is incorrect anyhow. That's unfortunately consistent with the way many, many things in this game are not adequately explained in the game. It's also quite possible these exceptions in #2 are bugs, in which case they wouldn't be explained because they wouldn't be intended.

3) Whether Botanist achievement/trait knowledge is a factor in getting the 6x from alchemy surveys is testable on the PTS, since template characters get surveys but do not come pre-formatted with trait knowledge. The PTS is an EU copy right now, and I don't have the Botanist achievement on that server.

On my first survey I got 4x, 4x, 6x, 4x, 4x, and 6x. It's not exactly the 50%-50% split I expect over time, but it's only 6 nodes. On the PTS it's possible to get 6x without Botanist or knowing any traits on any of these reagents:

If you did indeed get only 4x and 8x for 240 pulls, then something is going on, but unless it's a bug that is coincidentally getting fixed next patch, it isn't this achievement or trait knowledge causing the issue.

ETA: I'll test if it's a bad interaction between Plentiful Harvest and Botanist/trait knowledge, but it definitely isn't the latter on its own.

Nope, got 6x and 12x with Plentiful Harvest maxed.

As long as the new Weapons exist, I don't care how they do it.

*cough-an Unarmed Skill tree doesn't need any new models-cough*

WTB: Classic jabs skill style

I'm not sure ZOS understands what weapons are supposed to look like due to their making the jabs animation a night hollow stave that moves in a jerky shoveling motion.

Everyone is everything now anyway, just define a character fantasy and play it...
I have a paladin, a druid, a templar, an assassin, a elementalist, a summoner, a ranger etc etc

I would recommend to you the add on personality designer which allows to create custom idle animations that play randomly based on emotes and mementos (Which is also great to make use of them) and greatly enhances a character fantasy