ESO_player123 wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

Not inclusive. Where is the RPG players, the solo runners, the base new players in all these grand plans to appease the power happy? When was the last time you heard the development team promise new delves, public dungeons, or story based material. I didn't purchase the new chapter because all I heard promised was two dungeons and a trial. Group play.

The "chapter" this year includes the same 6 delves and 2 public dungeons. 3 delves and 1 public dungeon are available right now (been there, done them). The rest will be accessible when the wall that divides the island is destroyed (quarter 4 update I think). At least that is what I heard. The zone is definitely much smaller (which is very sad), but it does have all the side quests and the main story.

shadoza wrote: »

I think the people who complain about needing more difficulty are the same players that farm in newb zones like Bal Foyen. I saw two there this day each were over 2800 CP. They were not doing a quest, they were racing from one resource node to another, completing with low levels and each other. One of the two worked the same area for more than 20 minutes so it wasn't a casual find.

Farming is a traditional part of MMOs. Nothing is wrong with that. Those 2800 CP also bought the game and have the right to all the zones. If you were seeing bots then that would warrant a complaint for sure. For context: I just created my first toon on PCEU a couple of days ago. Very slow at everything (drives me nuts), but I did not have any issues with finding resources/competing with someone (and at this stage with an empty craft bag I collect everything that is not nailed down).

So you dismiss my experience and use your own to support your claim? Is that what you are doing here.

My recent experience was included to highlight that I'm talking not only from the perspective of a high CP player but also as a kind of a "new" one. I put new in quotation marks because it's new in a sense that I have an empty craft bag, no movement speed, no CP, and no money, but I do have experience and knowledge where to get those. But you also have it since you've been playing longer than I do if I remember correctly from your posts.

My experience does not change the fact that farming is a part of any MMO, and 2800 CP player have a right to be in starter zones. If they are collecting staff without purposefully targeting you (as in swiping a node directly from under you or grabbing a chest near which you've been fighting mobs) then they are playing the game just like you. If they are doing what I described in () then it has nothing to with them being high CP, it's just their personal trait.

And what's even more ridiculous about this point is that it seems to act as if farmers are terrorizing these zones. As if they're all over the place and it's some farming nightmare wherever you go. Farming is a very specific activity and if you're going to be farming, you're almost certainly going to be in specific areas that are kind of built for it. You're going to have an idea of where to go and what to do. Farming is employed by people who want power fast, and those are the kind of people who will look up a guide which tells them where to be when doing it. This is a non-issue.

shadoza wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

Not inclusive. Where is the RPG players, the solo runners, the base new players in all these grand plans to appease the power happy? When was the last time you heard the development team promise new delves, public dungeons, or story based material. I didn't purchase the new chapter because all I heard promised was two dungeons and a trial. Group play.

The "chapter" this year includes the same 6 delves and 2 public dungeons. 3 delves and 1 public dungeon are available right now (been there, done them). The rest will be accessible when the wall that divides the island is destroyed (quarter 4 update I think). At least that is what I heard. The zone is definitely much smaller (which is very sad), but it does have all the side quests and the main story.

shadoza wrote: »

I think the people who complain about needing more difficulty are the same players that farm in newb zones like Bal Foyen. I saw two there this day each were over 2800 CP. They were not doing a quest, they were racing from one resource node to another, completing with low levels and each other. One of the two worked the same area for more than 20 minutes so it wasn't a casual find.

Farming is a traditional part of MMOs. Nothing is wrong with that. Those 2800 CP also bought the game and have the right to all the zones. If you were seeing bots then that would warrant a complaint for sure. For context: I just created my first toon on PCEU a couple of days ago. Very slow at everything (drives me nuts), but I did not have any issues with finding resources/competing with someone (and at this stage with an empty craft bag I collect everything that is not nailed down).

So you dismiss my experience and use your own to support your claim? Is that what you are doing here.

My recent experience was included to highlight that I'm talking not only from the perspective of a high CP player but also as a kind of a "new" one. I put new in quotation marks because it's new in a sense that I have an empty craft bag, no movement speed, no CP, and no money, but I do have experience and knowledge where to get those. But you also have it since you've been playing longer than I do if I remember correctly from your posts.

My experience does not change the fact that farming is a part of any MMO, and 2800 CP player have a right to be in starter zones. If they are collecting staff without purposefully targeting you (as in swiping a node directly from under you or grabbing a chest near which you've been fighting mobs) then they are playing the game just like you. If they are doing what I described in () then it has nothing to with them being high CP, it's just their personal trait.

disky wrote: »

And again, I fully intend to leave it on all the time, so I'm not debating this on my own behalf. It just feels incredibly silly to act like we need to have some additional dissuasion in play. It's just not necessary.

I've been playing Oblivion remasterd. The difficulty setting that is 'right' for 95% of the content is too hard for the remaining 5%, some of which is mandatory to progress. If I had to commit to one setting, I'd have to tune it to the 5%, and 95% would be too easy.

SilverBride wrote: »

disky wrote: »

And again, I fully intend to leave it on all the time, so I'm not debating this on my own behalf. It just feels incredibly silly to act like we need to have some additional dissuasion in play. It's just not necessary.

I feel it is very necessary because the potential for manipulating the system is just too high otherwise. I can only imagine the amount of conflict it could cause among the playerbase.

I’d be okay if the cooldown is for a few mins. But I do NOT want to have to spend real money and buy a token just to switch difficulties.

I also do NOT want this to be account wide. That would be too restricting. There are days where I want higher difficulties for immersion and there are days where I just want to chill and farm leads. This should not be black and white.

How are you going to do this without separating players?

If I play on hardest setting and struggle with a fight, and then some other player cames in and one shots everything, because he plays on normal settings, how would that make me feel?
If the player engaging in my fight will suddenly feel that mobs are longer to kill he wouldnt like that either. I really can't imagine a way to do it without separating players.

IMHO current overland difficulty is so trivial that it is immersion breaking. This topic is already 4 years old, before it was pined here, complaints about no difficulty option were appearing on the forums very often.
Please finally do it and do it right.

I love this game and really want it to be around in couple of years, but I really feel like its the last call for change.
If the new leadership policy is true and not just words, please try to adress all those still unresolved problems that pop up on the forums every month for years now, Vet overland is just one of them
(Other examples: dungeon ques - fake healers/fake tanks; rushing through dungeons when someone wants to finish quest or enjoy the story; ball groups in cyrodill; too much grind/low drops and bad RNG; rewards system, crossplay and so on just ask Kevin, he will know what we usually grumble about)

It was nice to see more communication and some questions being answered.

Tannus15 wrote: »

This is a crazy statement



Firstly on consumables and hybridization.

I don't even know what to say to this.
The spreadsheet and "balance" are arbitrary rules you guys have just made up.

I don't know any other way to read the comments on consumables other than that you have a bunch of values for "balance" that you're trying to adhere to, but potions and food don't currently fit those values, so if you change them at all you'll be "forced" to nerf them which would suck for everyone, so you've decided to NOT change them at all.



I don't understand this statement. You've been building content around the level of power available according to your standards, but part of that is consumables which have been unchanged for years, but you haven't been building content around them so they should be nerfed? have you been building content around the power level in the game or the power level in the spreadsheet which doesn't match the game?

What are you doing?
If your "rules" are making the game less fun, CHANGE THE RULES.
If changing something means it should be nerfed, keeping it the same is ALSO A CHOICE.
Using "well it's old balance so we don't need to balance it now, but if we did it would need to be nerfed, so we're instead choosing to not change it" is the wildest, weirdest justification i've ever seen.

Let me put it another way, from a player perspective:

You can take every instance of "major brutality" and "major sorcerery" and combine them.
You can take every instance of "major savagery" and "major prophecy" and combine them.
This will have no negative effects on the game. It doesn't need to be balanced, it just needs to be done.
If the reason you're not doing that is because "Unstoppable" potions are unbalanced then that's INSANE.

Secondly, regarding gear, yes, some of it's subjective. But other things are objective. Pillar of nirn and flame blossom are subjective. they are both good in different circumstances.

Poisonous Serpent isn't subjectively bad, it's just garbage.
Mothers Sorrow isn't subjectively weaker than Highland Sentinal, it's objectively worse. It's not like you'd go into some other situations and be like "you' know what this calls for? worse stats. I just want worse numbers."

This, specifically this kind of communication is where you lose me. It's just wrong. And I don't mean "subjectively wrong". I mean, what on earth are you talking about, 2 is less than 5.

My interpretation was ZOS has several options regarding consumables:

ZOS can spend resources to nerf consumables which will make the people using them upset but make things more balanced.

ZOS can spend resources to buff consumables to match the overpowered consumables which will make the people using them happier but will make things less balanced in an overall sense and annoy people that aren't fans of the existing consumables power level.

ZOS can do nothing and spend no resources doing so.

All of those options will lead to people being upset but, only two of the three cost resources.

With regards to sets, ESO has hundreds of them. If you are aiming for everything to be usable in a totally optimized build the odds are quite good you'll just end up with endless power creep as some of your attempts to balance things will miss the mark and make things more powerful than you intend and every time you try to bring the other items up to the best stuff you'll end up missing on some.

I would argue that for older sets you'd want to aim for sets to be at a point where to the eye of someone that isn't parsing the set looks like it might work out in situations that favored them that could reasonably occur.

To me, the issue would be less stuff like Mother's Sorrow vs Highland Sentinel where you could plausibly hit a situation where you move enough that Highland Sentinel's five piece is a downgrade vs Mother's Sorrow and more like Brands of Imperium, Vampire Lord, or Salvation where the sets do a thing that has a very narrow use case with the way other things in the game behave at the present time.

Brands of Imperium five piece hits the issue that with Scribing people can toss comparable or superior damage shields with a high frequency so getting one every 12 seconds when you take damage isn't all that special on it's own at this point.

Salvation's five piece hits the issue that it does nothing at all for players that are not WW's which can feel a bit bad as it's an Overland set. For people that are WW the set provides a rather minor buff for when you are in WW form so that the people that spend most of their time in WW form would likely rather run something else. As the transformation to WW just provides a Fear and comes at a relatively high Ultimate cost the set really isn't delivering that much effective power for a five piece.

The Vampire Lord set hits the same issue as Salvation when it comes to being an Overland set that has a five piece bonus that just applies to a tiny section of diseased players. At lower Vampire stages the set offers small enough benefits that other cost reduction sets are potentially more effective than running the Vampire set. For people at higher stages, the set does offer better cost reduction for Vampire abilities than other sets but, not by enough to necessarily justify the costs. Part of this is because the Vampire Ultimate is both ridiculously expensive and somewhat conflicting with the Vampire abilities. Your spammable for instance does damage based on the amount of HP you are missing but, since your Ultimate heals you to full health it's not going to be doing extra. Vampiric Drain isn't going to be healing you for much while it's active because it heals based on your missing health and the Ultimate heals you to full health. Since Ultimate gain is blocked during the Vampire ultimate Exhilarating Drain isn't going to be providing you with Ultimate. Even with subcalssing potentially bringing the Perfect Scion cost down to 106 it still is an awkward and ineffective build.

SilverBride wrote: »

As I stated above, I feel being able to turn difficulty on and off multiple times a day at will could lead to manipulating the system for advantage. This was the example I gave for what I could see happening:

"I can imagine a player seeing others fighting a world boss, so they crank up their difficulty and jump in to get the better rewards. Then they see another player gathering mats and they want to also gather mats, so they turn down their difficulty and start gathering mats faster. That is manipulating the system for advantages in my opinion and should be prevented."

This also negates the whole reason for wanting more difficulty in the first place, which was often stated as immersion and feeling the bosses were really a threat, and overland mobs weren't a threat, etc., so why turn it off?

@ZOS_GinaBruno Are there going to be any restrictions to how often players can change their difficulty, such as cooldowns, to prevent this type of action?

I don't understand why you seem to be ignoring the fact that when these players increase challenge, the challenge is increased. The game is harder for them to play. That is the consequence. It also happens to be something they want to do, but it is a consequence. They don't need to be burdened by further limitations.

And again, I fully intend to leave it on all the time, so I'm not debating this on my own behalf. It just feels incredibly silly to act like we need to have some additional dissuasion in play. It's just not necessary.

SilverBride wrote: »

It's not vindictive to not want players to have a free reign to change their difficulty choices multiple times a day to gain advantages. I suggested a token being required to change difficulty but a once a day cooldown would also help.

I can imagine a player seeing others fighting a world boss, so they crank up their difficulty and jump in to get the better rewards. Then they see another player gathering mats and they want to also gather mats, so they turn down their difficulty and start gathering mats faster. That is manipulating the system for advantages in my opinion and should be prevented.

If they treat the level difficult choice like they do the character delete process, perhaps it would be more balanced. Make the level difficulty account wide because wanting challenging content isn't just an end-game thing. Make the choice limited with a cooldown period of more than 24 hours. This would remove some of the opportunity for abuse.