@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌
You are doing a good job as community manager.
You probably dont give a *** what i think, i just wanted to tell you.

More posts like yours, and the communication efforts you mention would go a long way for customer retention.

Thank you.

infraction2008b16_ESO wrote: »

xaraan wrote: »

Well, I wouldn't say ER alone gets special access, but many large serious guilds speak directly to the developers yes. This does suck for the handful of people that are not in those types guilds and might have good ideas, but tbh many of the suggestions random players make aren't very good.

But many the suggestions these guilds make aren't that good either for the majority of the community. Just because someone games at a more professional level doesn't mean changes should be made/balanced around them. In fact there's a whole ton of reasons why developers shouldn't bow to people like these especially for competitive reasons.

How do you know what suggestions these guilds make during their feedback sessions? or if they are good for the majority of the community? What evidence is there that devs bow to these guilds?

Again I point to the two biggest things ER lobbied for - less restrictive API and removal of the AoE cap. They got exactly 0% of what they wanted on both issues

dcam86b14_ESO wrote: »

I've hated ER from the very start of beta, most of their members are ego driven and are very negative when they aren't streaming. In no way would I ever let that guild represent me as a gamer EVER! This issue has gone on long enough and ZoS ignoring a huge array of guilds that could give input other than ER. ER only takes this info and gives out a little and of course they are the ones exploiting mechanics and finding the "way around" things until someone else does and they report it bc it no longer is theirs to control. Its total BS. I don't support anything they do including FTC.

Well you sound very impartial

Phantorang wrote: »

So this is why Templar wont ever get any boost, cuz of some stupid guild with a hotline to the devs. The members of Entropy Raising probably knew from the get go that Templar was going to be shafted, they need 25% of the community to eat dust...

Even if ER did have some special way to get their wishes implemented (which they couldn't do for the API nerfs or AoE caps), why on earth would you think that they don't want Templars to be on equal footing with the other classes?

Mystborn wrote: »

Catches_the_Sun wrote: »

I don't have an issue with it as long as ER isn't influencing the development of the game to suit their Guild's own PvP tactics.

Like when they spoke out strongly (and publicly) against AoE caps...

ZoS didn't change their stance.

"Mortosk wrote: »

Would you mind throwing templars a bone next time you talk to them. They obviously listened to some of your nightblade suggestions and plan to buff the class soon according to the road ahead post. But, in that same post, they said nothing about templars being under powered and only apologized for what could have possibly been the dumbest nerf ever, next to restoring spirit, the stealth nerf to Puncturing strikes.

I can assure you that ER are communicating their feelings that Templars need help and that ZoS understands that Templars need help. Unfortunately I think that Templars, as a class have been less rowdy than Nightblades have about their issues.

Well, I'm trying. I check the forums everyday hoping they post something to let us know we aren't forgotten, and I'll keep posting. This news from you and @ZOS_JessicaFolsom in this thread is the first we've heard that they even know we still exist as a class. Suppose that's something.

Mystborn wrote: »

Phantorang wrote: »

So this is why Templar wont ever get any boost, cuz of some stupid guild with a hotline to the devs. The members of Entropy Raising probably knew from the get go that Templar was going to be shafted, they need 25% of the community to eat dust...

Even if ER did have some special way to get their wishes implemented (which they couldn't do for the API nerfs or AoE caps), why on earth would you think that they don't want Templars to be on equal footing with the other classes?

Agreed, I edited my post some time ago to also include:

Sorry, its NOT the guild ERs fault, any of it, they are just doing what everyone else would do, we are to blame ZoS if we want to blame anyone at all.

The issue is that a select few got access to important game mechanics, while it should be available to everyone.

So there it is. Issue isnt ER talking, its the Devs not sharing game mechanics with everyone.

Was meant partly as a joke, but I realized not everyone would see it that way, so while I didnt change the original post, I added some text that free ER from all responsibility

Phantorang wrote: »

So there it is. Issue isnt ER talking, its the Devs not sharing game mechanics with everyone.

And to be even more fair, you should also include that a lot of the inner workings of game mechanics were discovered not through email correspondence, but through hours upon hours of dedicated, grueling testing with a ridiculously restricted API in a limited environment that provides no support for controlled testing.

I'm just glad to hear that they're listening to someone. I guess we just have to hope that the feedback they're getting is good and represents a wide section of the player base.

On the other hand, while most of the hate against PTS testers is entirely unfounded, I can confirm with near certainty that some of the guilds ZOS communicates with regularly are intentionally hiding things from the dev team (like exploits.)

I know because a member of one of these guilds quit for that very reason and informed me of the reason he quit.

Anyway, glad to hear that they are working on better communication with the community at large as well. Thanks for taking the time to reply Jessica.

amlewis292nub19_ESO wrote: »

Phantorang wrote: »

So there it is. Issue isnt ER talking, its the Devs not sharing game mechanics with everyone.

And to be even more fair, you should also include that a lot of the inner workings of game mechanics were discovered not through email correspondence, but through hours upon hours of dedicated, grueling testing with a ridiculously restricted API in a limited environment that provides no support for controlled testing.

Probably should, its great that players like the members of ER are actually sharing stuff, its sad though that the Devs are not.

murklor007neb18_ESO wrote: »

Maverick827 wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ can only do so much. These forums desperately need the attention of developers - the attention of people who have the knowledge and authority to reply to topics regarding the design and philosophy of the game - but it seems like Tamriel Foundry, a fan site, is getting all of that while we are getting none on the game's official website.

Did you expect anything else considering the sorry state these forums are in while the Tamriel Foundry forums have everything we want such as critically important class forums? Not to mention far superior layout. You can actually find stuff without making your eyes bleed due to mixed languages. Hell, they even got a roleplaying forum!

I'm going to Tamriel Foundry instead. Not even the devs want to post here, that's how bad the forum is.

Hate to break the news to you but that's how it's always been done. It's like in the real world where business lobbyists write the laws and regulations for the government agencies which oversee their companies. The lobbyists get benefits by knowing what is in the regulations while the government agencies get access to the business experts.

Tamriel Foundry and the EU equivalent are to eso as MMO-Champion and Elitist Jerks (long time ago) are/were to WoW. The participants there know much more than the typical gamer and they often leverage that expertise into special access or at least preferred access to devs. Do they have influence on the devs' design decisions? Around the edges, probably. You can't blame the elites for lobbying the devs to shape the game into something that would benefit their playstyle.

At the end of the day, it's the devs' call. If the devs make use of 'advice' which makes the game less fun for the 90% in the non-elites, it's on the devs.

wrlifeboil wrote: »

murklor007neb18_ESO wrote: »

Maverick827 wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ can only do so much. These forums desperately need the attention of developers - the attention of people who have the knowledge and authority to reply to topics regarding the design and philosophy of the game - but it seems like Tamriel Foundry, a fan site, is getting all of that while we are getting none on the game's official website.

Did you expect anything else considering the sorry state these forums are in while the Tamriel Foundry forums have everything we want such as critically important class forums? Not to mention far superior layout. You can actually find stuff without making your eyes bleed due to mixed languages. Hell, they even got a roleplaying forum!

I'm going to Tamriel Foundry instead. Not even the devs want to post here, that's how bad the forum is.

Hate to break the news to you but that's how it's always been done. It's like in the real world where business lobbyists write the laws and regulations for the government agencies which oversee their companies. The lobbyists get benefits by knowing what is in the regulations while the government agencies get access to the business experts.

Tamriel Foundry and the EU equivalent are to eso as MMO-Champion and Elitist Jerks (long time ago) are/were to WoW. The participants there know much more than the typical gamer and they often leverage that expertise into special access or at least preferred access to devs. Do they have influence on the devs' design decisions? Around the edges, probably. You can't blame the elites for lobbying the devs to shape the game into something that would benefit their playstyle.

At the end of the day, it's the devs' call. If the devs make use of 'advice' which makes the game less fun for the 90% in the non-elites, it's on the devs.

You got brown elbows or need to see a doctor. They only know more about exploits then the typical gamer. And they are some of the biggest exploiters in eso.

esoone wrote: »

You got brown elbows or need to see a doctor. They only know more about exploits then the typical gamer. And they are some of the biggest exploiters in eso.

Yay for baseless accusations!

Darlgon wrote: »

Just to clarify for those not a member of TF, you ARE a member of Entropy Rising, correct? So don't be snide here.. some of us read both forums.

As far the topic at hand.. know what.. No.. as Mystborn and others have pointed out, ZoS may hear what they have to say, but they sure are not letting these multiple guilds, with the list INCLUDING Entropy Rising, determine the direction of the game, or Atroposs would not have had to re-write his add-on due to the API changes.

One thing tho, @ZoS_JessicaFolsom, Jess,, I like you but,, can you clarify? You are NOT a dev, you are a Community Manager, who has access to the devs. So all the people up in arms with a ER talking to a dev, meaning you, are mistaken on that point. And geez.. do what you want with your free time, even if it is talking to those guys....

Woah, woah, woah... Just because I'm a member of ER I can't be snide? That's not fair and not something I agreed to when I joined!

I agree 100% with the rest of your comment though

Look, No one guild or 5 guilds, whatever, should have exclusive access to developers after launch. Yes it is a common practice during alpha and beta testing.

I have been privy to such guilds in Warhammer and SWtoR and look how those turned out. While I did not speak directly to developers during the alphas and betas I was part of, we did have an avenue in which we as a guild would discuss things and then our 'spokesman' would relay that back to the developer. Guilds generally have very strict rules in regard to this behind the scenes contact.

With that said, it is wrong. We definitely took advantage of the situation by talking about things that affected our play style and builds. We definitely did not look at the development process and how that affects a greater population of gamers outside of the finite amount in our guild.

The impact these exclusive, elitist, guilds have is phenomenal. The developers see it as 'being in touch' with the community when it is actually so far from the truth. Think back to games where developers have been active on forums, answering questions for all to see and partake in. That kind of 2 way forum is what makes a game a success. Not what is happening here in this thread or over at Tamriel Foundry.

This type of exclusivity is what eventually kills the game. The nerfs coming for classes, the 'balancing', the sudden change to fixing NBs-all suggestions from these guilds who 'know' the game.

Even if they say templars are not fine its not like ZENIMAX will magically fix them over night...

rophez_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi folks,

Wanted to pop in here and offer some clarification. The Community Team does indeed participate in regular voice chats with some of our most active guilds. The guilds we're currently in regular talks with are a good mix of PvP, PvE, and casual. In addition to reading the forums and fansites, this helps us to better understand what the main issues are and their severity, where the best opportunities for improvement are, and identify what everyone wants more details on. More often than not, we hear the same things over and over (such as Templars, weapons skills/stamina builds, and heavy armor needing improvements and in some case fixes, changes needed to make PvP more rewarding, etc.)

These talks do not replace or hold more value to us than what we read here on our official forums, and are often done in the late evening on our own time. It adds another layer of valuable insight, and gives us the opportunity to ask about things in-person that we need clarification or more details on.

All that said, we are doing what we can, when we can, to get in here and answer your questions more often.

So, Jessica, you have these talks and hear about hot issues. Are any words spoken back? Maybe the devs say something like, "Yeah that's something we're working on." If so, even something that simple would be very nice for the rest of your community to hear. I've seen countless posts about stamina build problems, and not one official response acknowledging the issue. That's just one topic. We need more communication from actual devs. No offense, Jessica, you're great. Maybe even if they could officially communicate to you and you could pass it on. He can do it himself but that means using both weapon sets and a high level of talent... missing a step will result in a much lower dps.

What else is being worked on? The road ahead letters from Firor are too vague and way too infrequent!

Stamina builds are weaker but not as weak as some make them look like... if a caster(except NB) starts to go full on dps he will be out of magicka fast... really fast. Without siphon or any other spells they won`t sustain that for long. The dps a caster does when sustaining himself is about the same as the melee dps. The caster can just do more when he has a group debuffing and placing the right spells on the boss.

I`m all for melee getting more, but if at any point their light/heavy attacks get buffed above the DPS a caster can do without the boss debuffs it will destroy balance in favor of the melee builds who by nature have more armor and survivability.(if they use no stamina to sustain that damage it translates into full magicka AND stamina bars ready to use defensive abilities or CC... also odds are a melee dps will also have stamina regen overcharged so he will be able to Sprint(he sprints faster anyway), block, dodge(lower dodge cost too) and so on a lot more compared to a caster who has to use all his magicka to do damage....

Please keep that in mind when balancing... light/heavy attacks should not do a lot more dps than they do now. Buffing their abilities would work as then they would have to both use skill slots to equip them and use one resource(stamina in this case) to activate them.

I`ll add that the maximum dps a caster can do should never be used for balancing as most will never reach those numbers... there are threads on Tamriel Foundry where most people can`t even get close to the dps numbers the best players are getting, for obvious reasons i can`t name here or i`ll get flamed for being an elitist something.

Melee dps should be able to reach the same numbers as caster dps, but make it equally hard so only a small number of people can actually get there... if all there is to it is holding a button down to do Heavy Attacks then it should not be as high.

Well, what is a typical gamer?
I am for example a very good healer and a noob while playing dps, as a tank I play to defensive and are not using my full potential, in each and every game xD

I tend to do more PVE, hardcore PVE if possible, but I am to lazy to search for a good guild normally, so if nobody asks me, I won't get a grp.
I am more or less a pvp noob, I played a lot, but with the organized zergs out there, I don't play at all atm, I just can't shut up in TS xD
I help new players and players in my guilds, I help them with all their problems, people are calling me dumb for giving away truckloads of materials for free and lending money to people for respeccing all the time.
On the other hand I am quite impatient if a person is not performing good in a endgame thing, especially if they haven't written they are not that used to it. No problem then.
I play alts, I farm materials, I listen to story if it is interesting for me, but I can also grind for days if I have to.

Am I a typicall gamer?
And now a somehow more philosophic question:
Are female players typicall players? They are rare, very rare, so they can't be typical, am I right?
And if you mean gamer neutral, ignore the female/male part, what is a typicall player/gamer then? Will the influence of the females give another definition?
Or are you just assuming, player xyz is typicall?
Is roleplaying part of beeing a typicall gamer? is theorycrafting? will the typicall player farm, or buy his stuff of farmers? will he care if he can rename his horse?

TL,DR
There is no such thing like an average or typicall gamer, we are all individuals, at least in my opinion.

Phantorang wrote: »

wrlifeboil wrote: »

Phantorang wrote: »

Their participants know much more than the typical gamer, how? And who is this game made for, if it isnt the typical gamer?

Go to MMO-Champion. They datamined the WoD alpha weeks ago. Are you telling me the typical gamer does that? And I did say, it's on the devs to decide what sort of advice they should take.

If the Typical Gamer also got access to alpha, hell yeah!

But the typical gamer cant do that, because the typical gamer dont get access to it.

Give me alpha access to every new content patch for ESO, and I will demonstrate for you how a typical gamer also can "datamine an alpha"!

<laughing hysterically>

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi folks,

Wanted to pop in here and offer some clarification. The Community Team does indeed participate in regular voice chats with some of our most active guilds. The guilds we're currently in regular talks with are a good mix of PvP, PvE, and casual. In addition to reading the forums and fansites, this helps us to better understand what the main issues are and their severity, where the best opportunities for improvement are, and identify what everyone wants more details on. More often than not, we hear the same things over and over (such as Templars, weapons skills/stamina builds, and heavy armor needing improvements and in some case fixes, changes needed to make PvP more rewarding, etc.)

These talks do not replace or hold more value to us than what we read here on our official forums, and are often done in the late evening on our own time. It adds another layer of valuable insight, and gives us the opportunity to ask about things in-person that we need clarification or more details on.

All that said, we are doing what we can, when we can, to get in here and answer your questions more often.

This is PR propaganda. The fish is out of the bag and outside of beta testing there is absolutely no reason to take a select fews advice over the communities. None.

How does speaking to a select few translate into everyone?

How does talking to those select few NOT hold more value when you obviously have dialogue with them yet do not have that same interaction with the community on these forums?