So ICE will never have that ‘dragon knight’ class? :(

ESO_Nightingale · August 2025

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Alharion wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Alharion wrote: »

Hi, I've always loved being able to play ‘ICE’ spells, but unfortunately (and yes, it's always this, but) MMORPGs very rarely offer a class as specific to this element, or when they do, it's very often ice = tank , but I don't understand why fire always has the privilege of being a class?

So yes, I can see you coming, to tell me ‘you have an ice branch with the guardian’ and ‘you have the mages guild branch’, yes, I agree, but if we look at DK the 3 branches of the dragon knight are all 100% fire thinking all maximizes fire, which is not the case with the guardian or only one branch is dedicated to ice and mainly think to be tank.

So my question is this for the devs, would it be possible to have the same fair equivalence to the DK class, but for ice elemental magic, this is what I expect more than anything now in TESO, I hope this dream will come true one day.

I think the demand is legitimate here, given that there are already some good examples out there. Will TESO finally be able to “break” this sad MMORPG tradition?

You already have an Ice class with subclassing. It's Winter's Embrace, Grave Lord, Herald of the Tome.

This complemented with scribing and weapon skills you can have every skill be ice.

ESO is now essentially a classless game with some relics of better years of class identity left behind.

Except that the problem, this branch is generally designed for a tank orientation.

If we look even more closely, Fire has its own class and the mages guild adapts to this element regarding the choice of weapon, so if it works well for fire, this should logically also work well for an Ice class.

The ice branch on the goalkeeper should (in my opinion) clearly have been associated with something like bramble/leaf.

Now, I don’t know if it could be considered, but I really hope that this class can see the light of day, it’s really something I’m waiting for the most in TESO now to have more fun coming back on the game. It’s really a shame that in the entirety of MMORPGs only a fire class has the right to exist, but not an ice cream...

The goal is to play the way you want not 'be competitive the way you want'.

Can you play a 'Full Ice build' - Yes.

This doesn't mean it has to be optimal.

While true, this doesn't mean that we shouldn't hope for changes and reworks to make it far more competitive than it currently is.

Why should Ice specifically be changed / reworked over other things? ZOS Pivoted Ice to be a 'tanking' style a long time ago so it makes sense that this 'tanking style' would not also output so much damage. You can still play pure Ice and complete almost all content in the game, same as any other builds. You only 'need' to be somewhat optimal for trifecta content.

Because frost damage builds are a core power fantasy in fantasy rpg games.

tomofhyrule · August 2025

I have to say, I absolutely hate the people who are like "I hate how ice is in ESO and you should change it because the people who do like how it is are completely irrelevant"

I'm still salty about that one patch that changed Piercing Cold to increase damage specifically if you were holding a frost staff - it was essentially ZOS saying "fine, we know that a lot of people want to DPS with a tanking weapon, so we're just going to make it so if you play a Warden who isn't a frost mage, you just get a massive damage nerf."
At least that got reverted, but still...

Yes, ice is a tanking weapon in ESO... and pretty well every other MMO. Heck, most RPGs with elemental powers put ice on the defensive side to oppose an offensive fire. To me, this is a lot like people who want to make a Sword-and-board DPS a thing - worse actually, since most of the people who want "frost DPS" are not satisfied with frost being a capable DPS, but they want frost as the best DPS and to remove it from tanking completely.

As for Warden itself, I have no problem with the theme. It is a bit mixed around, but my Warden is a Skaal: a nature themed Nord from the frozen northern regions of Tamriel who is really in touch with animals. I actually can't think of a better Class to fit that character.

YandereGirlfriend · August 2025

tomofhyrule wrote: »

I have to say, I absolutely hate the people who are like "I hate how ice is in ESO and you should change it because the people who do like how it is are completely irrelevant"

I'm still salty about that one patch that changed Piercing Cold to increase damage specifically if you were holding a frost staff - it was essentially ZOS saying "fine, we know that a lot of people want to DPS with a tanking weapon, so we're just going to make it so if you play a Warden who isn't a frost mage, you just get a massive damage nerf."
At least that got reverted, but still...

Yes, ice is a tanking weapon in ESO... and pretty well every other MMO. Heck, most RPGs with elemental powers put ice on the defensive side to oppose an offensive fire. To me, this is a lot like people who want to make a Sword-and-board DPS a thing - worse actually, since most of the people who want "frost DPS" are not satisfied with frost being a capable DPS, but they want frost as the best DPS and to remove it from tanking completely.

As for Warden itself, I have no problem with the theme. It is a bit mixed around, but my Warden is a Skaal: a nature themed Nord from the frozen northern regions of Tamriel who is really in touch with animals. I actually can't think of a better Class to fit that character.

Except that the entire history of the Elder Scrolls franchise would contradict you. Frost is a valid DESTRUCTION element.

tomofhyrule · August 2025

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

I have to say, I absolutely hate the people who are like "I hate how ice is in ESO and you should change it because the people who do like how it is are completely irrelevant"

I'm still salty about that one patch that changed Piercing Cold to increase damage specifically if you were holding a frost staff - it was essentially ZOS saying "fine, we know that a lot of people want to DPS with a tanking weapon, so we're just going to make it so if you play a Warden who isn't a frost mage, you just get a massive damage nerf."
At least that got reverted, but still...

Yes, ice is a tanking weapon in ESO... and pretty well every other MMO. Heck, most RPGs with elemental powers put ice on the defensive side to oppose an offensive fire. To me, this is a lot like people who want to make a Sword-and-board DPS a thing - worse actually, since most of the people who want "frost DPS" are not satisfied with frost being a capable DPS, but they want frost as the best DPS and to remove it from tanking completely.

As for Warden itself, I have no problem with the theme. It is a bit mixed around, but my Warden is a Skaal: a nature themed Nord from the frozen northern regions of Tamriel who is really in touch with animals. I actually can't think of a better Class to fit that character.

Except that the entire history of the Elder Scrolls franchise would contradict you. Frost is a valid DESTRUCTION element.

This may come as an absolute shock to people, but...
an MMO does need to have some different rules than single-player games in a lot of things.

But I also really hate the concept of people who are like "you don't hate that this thing had to change since the format changed to allow other people in so therefore you don't know anything about the series!"
So let's play your game then.
ARENA and DAGGERFALL
Not much difference here, since TES was still in its "D&D spinoff" days. Still, the available spells in both Arena and Daggerfall are seriously weighted towards having more fire offensively and only two or three frost spells. Oddly, frost is the only element in Daggerfall that has a non-destruction spell, and it's in the school of Thaumaturgy (aka NOT destruction).
MORROWIND:
Fire damage projectiles travel at a faster speed than frost damage projectiles, meaning that you can get higher DPS with fire. The major issue is resistances, as Dunmer resist fire (but undead are weak to it) and Nords are immune to frost. Shock damage has way fewer enemies that resist it, but it does cost more.
OBLIVION:
The spell damage types change the projectile, meaning that frost can be a larger projectile and do more damage as it travels, but only at close range, while fire can make an explosion at a placeable area and shock travels much faster in a bolt.
SKYRIM:
Skyrim was really the one where it was making the difference between fire as a DoT and frost as a CC. Frost spells in Skyrim will snare enemies and can be upgraded to paralyze them. Let's also look at Dragon Shouts - frost had a version that allowed you to immobilize enemies.

Again, the fact that TES games are single player and ESO is an MMO means there are some concessions that need to be made when converting to an MMO format. So yes, they leaned much harder into Skyrim's version of "fire = more damage" and "frost = crowd control," and in many MMOs CC is a support job. That's also why in most RPGs, frots does tend to lean harder into the defensive/CC realm and fire into the DoT realm (and shock into the direct damage realm).
The other part of this is trying to make each element unique. The ESO Tri-focus passive shows the point of making different elements feel more different from each other, such that a 'fire mage' and a 'frost mage' and a 'storm mage' all feel different. ESO's gone down the route of "Fire = higher damage, frost = CC, shock = AoE" for that passive. We can also see the ESO enemies since basegame, as most of the frost mage types we've seen as mobs have that attack that spawns a wall and gives a damage shield (so, a defensive move). ESO has really leaned into frost as a defensive tool.

Also, "destruction" doesn't specifically need to mean "does high damage." After all, tanks who use a sword-and-board do use a sword, which is a damaging weapon. Are you implying that a tank should dual-wield shields to make sure there's no damaging component? (not to mention that shield attacks are still possible). In fact, Destruction magic in the TES series does also include Vulnerability spells (e.g. "Weakness to Fire"), which are more like moves that apply debuffs rather than spells that do damage directly.

It is totally possible to make a viable frost mage in ESO. It's always been. It just isn't super meta, but it can do a lot of damage. And now, with Subclassing, you can make a few different versions of a frost mage (then again, now nothing is meta except the Arcbladeplar).
But what doesn't need to happen is to rip something away from people because you don't like the way they act with it.

ESO_Nightingale · August 2025

I feel like this discussion is getting away from us. While i personally think frost tanking isn't the direction i wanted frost magic to go in eso, the suggestions I've been pushing lately don't remotely negatively impact tanks at all and they also specifically don't compound tanking and dpsing power together because i don't want to disrupt frost tanking while making frost dps uber defensive and offensive. Specific examples i can list are:
I think there should be a mythic that adds power for frost dps builds but disables ancient knowledge, or a direct line on ancient knowledge that uses a condition to give you more damage or the blocking bonuses.

Additionally, i think that many morphs of winters embrace could be combined together and the now open morph reworked into a damage skill (frost cloak and frozen gate) so that the choice becomes based on role like how it is with impaling shards and arctic wind. I think that morph choice design is incredibly impactful.

While I can't talk about other people's ideas i can say that as the primary person raising my voice about this subject, i don't think theres any reason to be fighting amongst ourselves like this. There are ways we can have our cake and eat it too. I'm not trying to remove frost tanking. I'm just trying to make my power fantasy feel really impactful and competitive in this game. I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

Alharion · August 2025

I will never understand those who want to prevent a new class using as a pretext that the lore would not allow for this class, while quite the opposite allows it x)

Are you forgetting about the mage guild? just that it makes those who want to refuse an Ice class wrong;)

and as if well said, by some an MMORPG must make concessions with the lore, but here nothing would be violated in any case in this lore.

Alharion · June 30

Good Lord, that’s terrible. I absolutely can’t wait for the arrival of such a class anymore. I really wish I could find the fun of such a class on TESO, it’s horrible that it couldn’t happen faster to have new classes...

And no thanks, I don’t want to see more ice spells sent out on the right and left in x other classes or spell panels in I don’t know what other content is being sent out!

It’s terrible that such a class isn’t already available on TESO, no I don’t want to count the goalkeeper, but it’s still such a basic class in the MMORPG...

Moreover, I may be wrong, but there are many people who seek this. When I see the builds that try to build from this magnificent element, there would be so much to do around this element!

When will it be available on TESO? Please devs, do it!

The Uninvited · June 30

I have a feeling you're going to get what you want in the nearby future with the Warden rework.

tomofhyrule · June 30

The Uninvited wrote: »

I have a feeling you're going to get what you want in the nearby future with the Warden rework.

I hope to God not.

New Frostmage class? Sure. Go for it. More Classes would be fun.

Telling everyone who prefers their Wardens as Beastmasters that the character they played for 9+ years is no longer applicable because they have to be frostmages now? Horrendous. What, are they gonna remake the OG Warden trailer so the dude with the Bear becomes the dude with… nothing?

DON’T INVALIDATE YOUR PLAYERS AFTER THAT LONG. ADD, DON’T SUBTRACT

Luneca · June 30

I don't know. I originally used an ice stave long before Warden even existed and I can say that "ice" has come a long way from what it used to be. Do I think there needs to be a DK-like class that uses ice? Not really.

I'd rather the devs expand scribing instead of wasting time on another unbalanced class right now.

spartaxoxo · June 30

tomofhyrule wrote: »

DON’T INVALIDATE YOUR PLAYERS AFTER THAT LONG. ADD, DON’T SUBTRACT

I mean, they can also make Frostden DPS more competitive and keep Animal Companions. It ain't gotta be one or the other.

tomofhyrule · June 30

spartaxoxo wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

DON’T INVALIDATE YOUR PLAYERS AFTER THAT LONG. ADD, DON’T SUBTRACT

I mean, they can also make Frostden DPS more competitive and keep Animal Companions. It ain't gotta be one or the other.

They absolutely should mix the lines up. That’s about the one thing we know the goal is is to avoid stacking all the power for any specific role in one single line.

We should see Winter’s get some more DPS skills, we should see Green Balance get some DPS skills, and Animals should get some support. We should have the passives spread evenly. That would be cool. Some skills may get traded out (like Frozen Gate has very niche uses and would be better for a frost damage skill, and then the ‘teleport enemies’ idea could be moved to Green Balance) or rethemed, but the lines could stay.
(I’m also excited to see Warden’s version of a Fatecarver-expy. While ‘Ice Beam’ is the obvious choice, I do have a funny mental image of turning Fetcher into the beam so you just unleash a 5s swarm of fleas).

The only question is why they haven’t said anything. Like… nobody wants it to be bad, so we’d accept “hey, we had to delay U51 because Warden needs more polish.” I can even imagine they’re not even hinting at like a single skill or showing concepts because they don’t want feedback (even though feedback is a good thing - look at the first pass of the Werewolf model versus the way cooler one we got because we had a chance for feedback).

But we can’t even get a “Wardens will have the same three skill lines, but we are making sure each line gets skills for each role.”?!?! Why not?!?!

Alharion · June 30

I’m tired of these new systems that force people to mix everything and anything so that classes no longer look like anything in this horrible desire to erase them in the long run, or spells sent anywhere, with liabilities that are everything and anything, I much prefer the usual classes. This mixing system is also far from being unanimous here, nothing will be worth a class with its super effect on top of that.

The warden is frankly an extremely failed class, a catch-all. I would prefer it to be a Wyrd guardian class rather than what it is. I would see much more about the nature of forests, brambles, animals, all that, but not ice. Even if I understand what they tried to do with this class, a bit like we find this style of class in other MMORPGs, but here it’s really bad.

AzuraFan · June 30

tomofhyrule wrote: »

New Frostmage class? Sure. Go for it. More Classes would be fun.

Telling everyone who prefers their Wardens as Beastmasters that the character they played for 9+ years is no longer applicable because they have to be frostmages now? Horrendous. What, are they gonna remake the OG Warden trailer so the dude with the Bear becomes the dude with… nothing?

DON’T INVALIDATE YOUR PLAYERS AFTER THAT LONG. ADD, DON’T SUBTRACT

1000%!!

And I'd be happy if the warden was split into two classes. It's a hodge podge right now. I'm concerned that we haven't heard anything yet. We already had an idea of what the reworked Dragonknight would look like this far along. I'm hoping they're not staying quiet because they know they'll upset either those who prefer ice or those who prefer animal companions.

Palumtra · June 30

moderatelyfatman wrote: »

Just subclass your DK with the Warden's frost skill line.

This is what I did + bought all the "blue" skill styles. No ice DK? FINE, I'LL DO IT MYSELF!

Scribing can also provid extra ice skills that even synergize with the theme (ie immobilize)

Ordinator199 · June 30

moderatelyfatman wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

I wish we had more ice skills. Winter's Embrace isn't enough — Dragonknight has three skill lines dedicated to fire, with uses for tanking, healing, and damage dealing. Winter's Embrace is only one skill line that is trying to be both a damage dealing and a tanking skill line.

I'd like to see a genuine Cyromancer class be added at some point.

I would like to see the Warden split into two classes and expanded. One class has 3 skill lines dedicated to Animals dps, Plant based healing and maybe a tanking one based around shapeshifting.
The other should be an Ice mage. All three skill lines based around ice with an Ice Elemental as a companion.

All the more a pity that subclassing will mean no new classes. So how about new skill lines that are not class specific (Elemental Fire, Ice, Air and Earth).

Cool make your own game then

tomofhyrule · June 30

AzuraFan wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

New Frostmage class? Sure. Go for it. More Classes would be fun.

Telling everyone who prefers their Wardens as Beastmasters that the character they played for 9+ years is no longer applicable because they have to be frostmages now? Horrendous. What, are they gonna remake the OG Warden trailer so the dude with the Bear becomes the dude with… nothing?

DON’T INVALIDATE YOUR PLAYERS AFTER THAT LONG. ADD, DON’T SUBTRACT

1000%!!

And I'd be happy if the warden was split into two classes. It's a hodge podge right now. I'm concerned that we haven't heard anything yet. We already had an idea of what the reworked Dragonknight would look like this far along. I'm hoping they're not staying quiet because they know they'll upset either those who prefer ice or those who prefer animal companions.

Yeah, if Warden had started life as two separate Classes, then this wouldn't be an issue. But it started life as this mixture, so now there are people who like it as it is.

I get that it's a muddle right now... at least for people who came to ESO saying "I want to make a frostmage, what's a good Class?" or "I want to make a Ranger, what's a good class?" Thematically, the Warden is all over the place.
...but if you said "I want to write a character that fits Warden as-is," then it does work, and quite well.

My Warden is a Skaal, so the themes of ice, nature, and animals are perfect. I wrote him to fit with all of the lines. Now some are better than others - he's a barbarian, so the animals are much more along his line and the plants and ice are more just incidentals, but they do still fit with his Skaal barbarian themeing.

It's also the branding. The Warden from the OG trailer (his name is Boldekh) is clearly shown with two things: Bear and Frost magic. The Morrowind Collector's edition even involves the bear as its own character in Naryu's journals. And Bear got the first-ever Skill Style in the game, 7 years before Skill Styles were a thing. Warden's symbol is a bear paw. Like... if Warden were condensed to a single thing... it wouldn't be ice. It'd be bear.

I am really hoping for a Warden with the same three skill lines, but definitely skills and passives for DD/Heal/Tank in all three lines. But as has been mentioned, the complete silence could mean anything from "hey, one of the animations borked and we need to rerecord it" all the way up to "we're officially splitting Warden and invalidating the Morrowind trailer, but we finally figured out Class Change tokens so you can choose which Warden split you want."

It would be nice to have an idea of things though. Like, we got a Werewolf concept art a decent time out (and then they improved it based on player feedback). We got a couple screenshots of new DK skills before the full patch notes came out. Why are we getting a mystery box here?
...and with the Q4 patch always coming early, does this mean U52 - and by extension Sorc - will hit a delay too?

Orbital78 · July 1

Maybe when we get druids.

Techwolf_Lupindo · July 1

Please don't give ICE any more power. We have enough issues with mass deportation of Kijits and argonians.

Wolfshade · July 1

The overall problem, that elements were mixed over the classes with wired Skillinecombinations.

DK -> Fire / Mage -> Shock / Warden -> Frost

I like to play my frosty Nord and it is not needed to subclassed cause you dont benefit from other classlines, cause none supports frost. In combination with skills from other skilllines it is very good possible, but you a little bit bound to a destruction staff.

So, playing a frost class is possible, but it is not deeper relevant in gameplay. Chill, as a statuseffect, hast to combined with gameplay and mechanicts to raise your statuseffects. Here the Dk, with fire and burned as status is so in front, cause of Skills and passives that apply the effect. Passives: Even the new DK passive slows down movementspeed what should be frost-specific. As warden you have to find some creative ways to apply chilled. The announced rework of warden class should be look deeper right in that point cause actually there is just one specific nishe Setup on frost possible that can be usefull in Group-/Endgamecontent.

Is it possibel to play Frostbased Warden, yes.
Is it fun, yes.
Is it needed / relevant/ competetiv in groupcontent or endgame? No! (Edith: ...and that is even one point where fire/shock as dps-status effect is even by far more importat and more. Its is super important and nesessary.)

IZZEFlameLash · July 1

You can have the Temu Frost Knight with blue skill styles now.

Alharion · July 1

I’m tired of these new systems that force people to mix everything and anything so that classes no longer look like anything in this horrible desire to erase them in the long run, or spells sent anywhere, with liabilities that are everything and anything, I much prefer the usual classes. This mixing system is also far from being unanimous here, nothing will be worth a class with its super effect on top of that.

The warden is frankly an extremely failed class, a catch-all. I would prefer it to be a Wyrd guardian class rather than what it is. I would see much more about the nature of forests, brambles, animals, all that, but not ice. Even if I understand what they tried to do with this class, a bit like we find this style of class in other MMORPGs, but here it’s really bad.

tomofhyrule wrote: »

I have to say, I absolutely hate the people who are like "I hate how ice is in ESO and you should change it because the people who do like how it is are completely irrelevant"

I'm still salty about that one patch that changed Piercing Cold to increase damage specifically if you were holding a frost staff - it was essentially ZOS saying "fine, we know that a lot of people want to DPS with a tanking weapon, so we're just going to make it so if you play a Warden who isn't a frost mage, you just get a massive damage nerf."
At least that got reverted, but still...

Yes, ice is a tanking weapon in ESO... and pretty well every other MMO. Heck, most RPGs with elemental powers put ice on the defensive side to oppose an offensive fire. To me, this is a lot like people who want to make a Sword-and-board DPS a thing - worse actually, since most of the people who want "frost DPS" are not satisfied with frost being a capable DPS, but they want frost as the best DPS and to remove it from tanking completely.

As for Warden itself, I have no problem with the theme. It is a bit mixed around, but my Warden is a Skaal: a nature themed Nord from the frozen northern regions of Tamriel who is really in touch with animals. I actually can't think of a better Class to fit that character.

Except that in DCUO a class can play all three roles, so Ice is not limited to a role like a certain DC Universe Online for example. On TESO, classes can be played with the role you want and that’s a point of honor, because there are many less than this in recent MMORPGs...

The Uninvited · July 1

tomofhyrule wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

I have a feeling you're going to get what you want in the nearby future with the Warden rework.

I hope to God not.

New Frostmage class? Sure. Go for it. More Classes would be fun.

Telling everyone who prefers their Wardens as Beastmasters that the character they played for 9+ years is no longer applicable because they have to be frostmages now? Horrendous. What, are they gonna remake the OG Warden trailer so the dude with the Bear becomes the dude with… nothing?

DON’T INVALIDATE YOUR PLAYERS AFTER THAT LONG. ADD, DON’T SUBTRACT

What I'm saying, is that there's a high probability that they change the damage skills that now do magic damage (for example) to frost damage. So, for instance the bear will do frost damage instead of magic damage.

Why do I think that? Because they removed all poison damage from DK and changed it all into fire damage.

Gabriel_H · July 1

Alharion wrote: »

Hi, I've always loved being able to play ‘ICE’ spells, but unfortunately (and yes, it's always this, but) MMORPGs very rarely offer a class as specific to this element, or when they do, it's very often ice = tank , but I don't understand why fire always has the privilege of being a class?

So yes, I can see you coming, to tell me ‘you have an ice branch with the guardian’ and ‘you have the mages guild branch’, yes, I agree, but if we look at DK the 3 branches of the dragon knight are all 100% fire thinking all maximizes fire, which is not the case with the guardian or only one branch is dedicated to ice and mainly think to be tank.

So my question is this for the devs, would it be possible to have the same fair equivalence to the DK class, but for ice elemental magic, this is what I expect more than anything now in TESO, I hope this dream will come true one day.

I think the demand is legitimate here, given that there are already some good examples out there. Will TESO finally be able to “break” this sad MMORPG tradition?

ZOS said a while back that they wanted to improve ice as a dps component. The natural fit for that would be Warden, which just so happens to be coming up for a rework.

Alharion · July 1

Gabriel_H wrote: »

Alharion wrote: »

Hi, I've always loved being able to play ‘ICE’ spells, but unfortunately (and yes, it's always this, but) MMORPGs very rarely offer a class as specific to this element, or when they do, it's very often ice = tank , but I don't understand why fire always has the privilege of being a class?

So yes, I can see you coming, to tell me ‘you have an ice branch with the guardian’ and ‘you have the mages guild branch’, yes, I agree, but if we look at DK the 3 branches of the dragon knight are all 100% fire thinking all maximizes fire, which is not the case with the guardian or only one branch is dedicated to ice and mainly think to be tank.

So my question is this for the devs, would it be possible to have the same fair equivalence to the DK class, but for ice elemental magic, this is what I expect more than anything now in TESO, I hope this dream will come true one day.

I think the demand is legitimate here, given that there are already some good examples out there. Will TESO finally be able to “break” this sad MMORPG tradition?

ZOS said a while back that they wanted to improve ice as a dps component. The natural fit for that would be Warden, which just so happens to be coming up for a rework.

I’m honestly not reassured that this is being cleaned up by the caretaker, it will always remain an incoherent class, a whole lot of things...

It should be an ice cream of nature and not linked to the ice, so that we can make a coherent ICe class later!

ESO_Nightingale · July 1

I see this thread got necroed.

Yeah i just cannot see them removing frost as a theme from the class. I can see them better thematically incorporating it into the class's visual effects and other skills with damage type conversions though.

Radiate77 · July 1

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

I see this thread got necroed.

Yeah i just cannot see them removing frost as a theme from the class. I can see them better thematically incorporating it into the class's visual effects and other skills with damage type conversions though.

Winter’s Embrace is the only skill line that directly mentions the Season theme that Warden is heading towards, so yeah I wouldn’t expect it to go anywhere.