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Please update the base game motifs
aspergalas4
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I think it's about time that the base game motifs all received an update to match them up graphically to the newer motifs released in recent years. It is difficult to use them in the outfit station due to the jarring difference in quality. Comparing the base game motifs to new motifs and outfit styles released makes them look like they are from a different game.
I think many in the community want this and it would also be a step towards updating the base game zones as all the NPCs will have the updated armour designs also. Which would synergise well with some of the newer costumes and such being added into vanilla zone NPCs in recent years.
I am not advocating for a retexture only either, I think some remodelling would be necessary for certain styles that are simply outdated when it comes to aesthetic and proportions. Good example being the Dark Elf Motif. I hope ZOS eventually gets round to this, it would be great to hear if this is in the works.
I think many in the community want this and it would also be a step towards updating the base game zones as all the NPCs will have the updated armour designs also. Which would synergise well with some of the newer costumes and such being added into vanilla zone NPCs in recent years.
I am not advocating for a retexture only either, I think some remodelling would be necessary for certain styles that are simply outdated when it comes to aesthetic and proportions. Good example being the Dark Elf Motif. I hope ZOS eventually gets round to this, it would be great to hear if this is in the works.
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Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Agreed.
So many of the older motifs just look terrible compared to newer motifs, so bad I see no reason to use them.
The other day I was wishing we had an option to "hide" styles we have learned that we personally will not use. Often I will click on every piece to find the one that fits my vision, but when I preview older motifs their old looking textures alone keep me from using them. If I could "hide" them, it would save a lot of time when I am searching for that right piece.
Or, let us sort motifs/outfit styles by number/date so we can see the newer stuff first if we'd like to.
Sadly, I doubt ZOS is going to spend resources on motifs they have already sold through the crown store (as some players would complain) and or because it will not inherently generate revenue (although I think updating old textures would be a long term investment/revenue gain because it would keep the game feelign relevant/fresh).
Edited by Pixiepumpkin on February 3, 2024 1:33PM"Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes9 -
Chaos2088✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭YES PLEASE UPDATE THE BASE GAME ! (scream noise)@Chaos2088 PC EU Server | AD-PvP8 -
AnduinTryggva✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I agree. The style itself is awesome but the textures could well receive an update to modern standards.3 -
EF321✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No, thanks. No one wants to be forced to change their looks. Use newer motifs, if you like newer motifs. Don't use old motifs, if you don't like them.
I want to look like this.
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Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
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And the game would be better off (especially to new customers) if the old skins were updated like this.I want to look like this.
Edited by Pixiepumpkin on February 3, 2024 2:30PM"Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes7 -
Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Pixiepumpkin wrote: »
No.
Why? It's objectively better in every way (contrary to popular belief, there are rules in art...its not as subjective as people assume. If it were, art/design school would not be necessary)."Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes5 -
Fata1moose✭✭✭✭✭The whole base game needs a graphical update not just the motifs. Zones should upgrade textures, models and detail density to be in line with newer zones and they should do continuity changes to zones like Rift and Winterhold to look more like the mainline game.4 -
Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Fata1moose wrote: »The whole base game needs a graphical update not just the motifs. Zones should upgrade textures, models and detail density to be in line with newer zones and they should do continuity changes to zones like Rift and Winterhold to look more like the mainline game.
Yep.
My wife and I were talkiing the other day how we hate going to old zones to do antiquities, treasure maps, or anything that takes us to old zones. They just look so bad compared to the new stuff. It's really hard to like the old base game due to graphics alone. Its jarring.
"Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes1 -
EF321✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Pixiepumpkin wrote: »Pixiepumpkin wrote: »
No.
Why? It's objectively better in every way (contrary to popular belief, there are rules in art...its not as subjective as people assume. If it were, art/design school would not be necessary).
It is VERY different. I don't want to look like this. I want to look how I look, regardless of what anyone else thinks about my characters.
Don't use motifs that you don't like, simple as that.16 -
Maitsukas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The change made to the Redguard motif wasn't very well received, so altering all of the really old motifs now would receive even worse criticism.
Old Redguard styles:
Redguard style today:
PC-EU @maitsukas
Posting the Infinite Archive and Imperial City Weekly Vendor updates.
Also trying out new Main Quests, Companions, ToT decks, Events and Styles on PTS.13 -
moo_2021✭✭✭✭✭Can we have more of non gothic armor styles? E.g. modern clothing, aztecs or rajput?0 -
Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Pixiepumpkin wrote: »Pixiepumpkin wrote: »
No.
Why? It's objectively better in every way (contrary to popular belief, there are rules in art...its not as subjective as people assume. If it were, art/design school would not be necessary).
It is VERY different. I don't want to look like this. I want to look how I look, regardless of what anyone else thinks about my characters.
Don't use motifs that you don't like, simple as that.
I never said use the style I like. This thread is about increased texture resolution. The same outfit you wear would look better with a higher resolution. I used mine as an example becasuse of its higher resoultion newer textures.
You would benefit from the change, not lose out."Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes5 -
Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The change made to the Redguard motif wasn't very well received, so altering all of the really old motifs now would receive even worse criticism.
Old Redguard styles:
Redguard style today:
Apples and oranges.
All that needs to be done is make the same style as before, but in higher resolution. The examples you linked are not even the same outfits, regardless of whether they were the replacements or not.
"Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes4 -
sharffffff✭✭✭I also agree with update in at the very least of the textures and models. Even if you keep it looking the exact same, just update the models and textures so they look more in line with newer styles and aren't just flat plastic-looking styles even when they're supposed to be fabric or metal.
And my own pet peeve is female Dark Elf style, why does it have boob window. The only difference it has from male style is boob window that feels completely unnecessary, I just wish it wasn't there, otherwise I might've used even old version on my character.5 -
aspergalas4✭✭✭✭Yeah at the very least a texture update is needed, but it would be great if they added some bulk to some of the heavier styles so it isn't just flat on our character. The motifs have a come a long way and players like EF321 are very much outliers (no offence). If they could be updated in a way that doesn't disrupt the aesthetic of existing outfits, so basically just enhances the detail, then I don't think ZOS will face much criticism. But then again they don't care for the criticism they receive anyway given how much stuff in this game is neglected because their focus is on what can be monetised. So have at it and update them please.
Also the Redguard motif was absolutely fine before (at least the lower tiers as shown in this thread) so I don't actually get why it was updated haha, don't do that kind of update please just do what is asked. I want to use the Wood Elf and Primal motifs in outfits badly but the textures just suck.Edited by aspergalas4 on February 3, 2024 7:53PM2 -
tincanman✭✭✭✭✭
✭Pixiepumpkin wrote: »... art/design school would not be necessary).
At the risk of appearing controversial and speaking as a scientist.....
/s
But, no thanks - I'm pretty sure Matt Firor commented many years ago about problems of updating older game assets: some love the idea and many more loathe it so it's better to just leave well enough alone.
I like the older stuff. I like the newer stuff, too.
Something for everyone.
Also, I'd prefer the designers spent their time and my money working on completely new stuff rather than trashing 'reimagining' their predecessors work.16 -
EF321✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭aspergalas4 wrote: »Yeah at the very least a texture update is needed, but it would be great if they added some bulk to some of the heavier styles so it isn't just flat on our character. The motifs have a come a long way and players like EF321 are very much outliers (no offence). If they could be updated in a way that doesn't disrupt the aesthetic of existing outfits, so basically just enhances the detail, then I don't think ZOS will face much criticism. But then again they don't care for the criticism they receive anyway given how much stuff in this game is neglected because their focus is on what can be monetised. So have at it and update them please.
Also the Redguard motif was absolutely fine before (at least the lower tiers as shown in this thread) so I don't actually get why it was updated haha, don't do that kind of update please just do what is asked. I want to use the Wood Elf and Primal motifs in outfits badly but the textures just suck.
Oh come on, Wood Elf is one of the best base game motifs there is.
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Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Pixiepumpkin wrote: »... art/design school would not be necessary).
At the risk of appearing controversial and speaking as a scientist.....
/s
But, no thanks - I'm pretty sure Matt Firor commented many years ago about problems of updating older game assets: some love the idea and many more loathe it so it's better to just leave well enough alone.
I like the older stuff. I like the newer stuff, too.
Something for everyone.
Also, I'd prefer the designers spent their time and my money working on completely new stuff rather than trashing 'reimagining' their predecessors work.
Its not about trashing/reimaging older work, its about the realiztion that the game looks old to new players, especially becasue the game starts you out now in the most current zone.
Every MMORPG that has lasted a decade or more has refreshed the game, its not a matter of opinon, its a necessity for sustained growth, and these are not my words, they are the actions of games that make far far far more money than ESO could ever dream of.
Also, they have the resources to hire artists to remake the older assets, there is no need to take from one area of the game to work on another."Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes1 -
tsaescishoeshiner✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭We got Ancestral versions of the basegame motifs, probably because of how they said that they won't change older assets that would change people's look. Imagine you log on and suddenly your shoulders clip with your robes. : P
That said, they should update the basegame NPCs to have the fancy new motif styles--that would be a big undertaking, though. I'm looking forward to maybe getting Ancestral Khajiit/Argonian/Bosmer one day.PC-NA
in-game: @tsaescishoeshiner4 -
aspergalas4✭✭✭✭aspergalas4 wrote: »Yeah at the very least a texture update is needed, but it would be great if they added some bulk to some of the heavier styles so it isn't just flat on our character. The motifs have a come a long way and players like EF321 are very much outliers (no offence). If they could be updated in a way that doesn't disrupt the aesthetic of existing outfits, so basically just enhances the detail, then I don't think ZOS will face much criticism. But then again they don't care for the criticism they receive anyway given how much stuff in this game is neglected because their focus is on what can be monetised. So have at it and update them please.
Also the Redguard motif was absolutely fine before (at least the lower tiers as shown in this thread) so I don't actually get why it was updated haha, don't do that kind of update please just do what is asked. I want to use the Wood Elf and Primal motifs in outfits badly but the textures just suck.
Oh come on, Wood Elf is one of the best base game motifs there is.
I don't disagree, it's why I want it in HD. I want it to go with the newer motifs so I can use it in more of my outfits. Your image, imagine better textures and the bones actually protruding from the chest piece, wouldn't take a lot of work and wouldn't change the actual look. Would just improve it.Edited by aspergalas4 on February 3, 2024 10:25PM2 -
EF321✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭aspergalas4 wrote: »aspergalas4 wrote: »Yeah at the very least a texture update is needed, but it would be great if they added some bulk to some of the heavier styles so it isn't just flat on our character. The motifs have a come a long way and players like EF321 are very much outliers (no offence). If they could be updated in a way that doesn't disrupt the aesthetic of existing outfits, so basically just enhances the detail, then I don't think ZOS will face much criticism. But then again they don't care for the criticism they receive anyway given how much stuff in this game is neglected because their focus is on what can be monetised. So have at it and update them please.
Also the Redguard motif was absolutely fine before (at least the lower tiers as shown in this thread) so I don't actually get why it was updated haha, don't do that kind of update please just do what is asked. I want to use the Wood Elf and Primal motifs in outfits badly but the textures just suck.
Oh come on, Wood Elf is one of the best base game motifs there is.
I don't disagree, it's why I want it in HD. I want it to go with the newer motifs so I can use it in more of my outfits. Your image, imagine better textures and the bones actually protruding from the chest piece, wouldn't take a lot of work and wouldn't change the actual look. Would just improve it.
It could be new motif, no need to alter existing ones.2 -
FelisCatus✭✭✭✭✭Please just update all old graphics in general, they are quite literally a decade old now and it's noticeable. Not just motifs but terrain too and building textures in older zones. It's really jarring when you visit older zones right after you come out of a new zone.3
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Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭FelisCatus wrote: »It's really jarring when you visit older zones right after you come out of a new zone.
That is exactly how my wife and I feel about going to old zones, especially after visting a new zone. It feels like a different game.
We both LOVE High Isle and spend a lot of time there, but when I am asked to go to Glenumbra for a TOT match or Rivenspire (god I hate that Shornhelm) or man...as I think of it, any of the old zones...I just feel like I am playing an old donkey slang game."Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes2 -
Tyrant_Tim✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭What I never understood was why key NPCs haven’t received any motif updates at all to help differentiate them from regular ones.
I’ll use Darien Gautier as my example… he is one of the most important NPCs yet wears regular Breton heavy, and has a regular base game hair style.
I see no reason why they couldn’t give NPCs like him, Raz, Naryu, etc… their own special appearances, there are more than enough new options from when the game launched.
They could even tease important plot developments, like giving Darien something Meridia related, I know that would have me asking questions.Edited by Tyrant_Tim on February 4, 2024 7:49AM4 -
LunaFlora✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Tyrant_Tim wrote: »What I never understood was why key NPCs haven’t received any motif updates at all to help differentiate them from regular ones.
I’ll use Darien Gautier as my example… he is one of the most important NPCs yet wears regular Breton heavy, and has a regular base game hair style.
I see no reason why they couldn’t give NPCs like him, Raz, Naryu, etc… their own special appearances, there are more than enough new options from when the game launched.
They could even tease important plot developments, like giving Darien something Meridia related, I know that would have me asking questions.
it would be cool if more important characters had a special outfit style like Queen Ayrenn.
though i like how they all look in the base game and they got special costumes in dlc.
if they were to get different appearances in the base game i think this would be best
- Darien in Ancestral Breton heavy
- Gabrielle in the Mages Guild robes that Valessea wears in High isle
- Naryu in either the Morag Tong motif or her assassin costume
- Raz in his spymaster costume
- Holgunn in Ancestral Nord heavy
but i think it's nice that they wear base game outfits. like Raz and the other Eyes of the Queen just wear a black version of the high elf style which regular soldiers wear too.
and the base game race motifs have 4 different versions for each weight so there's way more variation in what base game characters wear than if they wore Ancestral styles(really wish Ancestral styles had all those 4 versions instead of just the 4th).
plus them wearing a different outfit in dlc makes me feel like there's time between the questlines.
also Darien's journal in Camlorn is enough to make you ask questions.
https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Online:The_Journal_of_Darien_Gautier
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LunaFloraBlossom on pc.2 -
amig186✭✭✭✭✭
✭Agreed, the problem with the ancestral motifs is that they're more like reimagined versions of the basegame ones, looking a lot different and not having the 4 different styles per weight. Just giving the old racial and alliance motifs higher res textures should be enough, if you've modded Skyrim for example, then you know that a new texture can do wonders for an ugly suit of armour even without altering the mesh. Later on the same could be done with furniture and buildings. I don't think bloating the already huge list of motifs with new ones that are just updated old ones is a good idea, it'd make browsing through them much more tedious.PC EU2 -
AnduinTryggva✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Pixiepumpkin wrote: »Pixiepumpkin wrote: »
No.
Why? It's objectively better in every way (contrary to popular belief, there are rules in art...its not as subjective as people assume. If it were, art/design school would not be necessary).
I disagree that these rules should be imposed on clients if they wish for something else. We are not talking about traffic rules here.1 -
AnduinTryggva✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Agreed, the problem with the ancestral motifs is that they're more like reimagined versions of the basegame ones, looking a lot different and not having the 4 different styles per weight. Just giving the old racial and alliance motifs higher res textures should be enough, if you've modded Skyrim for example, then you know that a new texture can do wonders for an ugly suit of armour even without altering the mesh. Later on the same could be done with furniture and buildings. I don't think bloating the already huge list of motifs with new ones that are just updated old ones is a good idea, it'd make browsing through them much more tedious.
Absolutely! Just update the textures to higher resolutions and it's fine.
BTW the old styles look really nice. I sometimes prefer them to the newer ones as the newer ones often look too sleek.1